LiferButOK: Effexor for 24yrs! and Recent Tries w Abilify, Pristiq

[LiferButOK]

Hi group, may I introduce myself?  I have had social anxiety and energy depression since childhood.  I’ve been on Effexor since 1996 (24yrs!). This last month, I braved a medication review and the psych Nurse Practitioner added 2mg Abilify to boost my mood.  The first pill took away all my body pains in an amazing wave...  in a couple days I had more energy and less procrastination... but on day 11, I had shooting head and chest pains, scary blood pressure of 155/86 and heart rate of 100.  My vision had zigzags in it.  Of course I stopped taking it and called the Psych NP office.  She told me that there was No Way a baby dose of 2mg could have caused the cardiac issue, and I should see primary care physician.  I knew that Abilify has a long 4 day half-life (6day for some people) so I decided to wait and flush it out for 2 weeks.  I drank hibiscus tea and went off caffeine and took some blood pressure meds as needed.  The pains largely persisted.  The psych NP then suggested I switch to Effexor’s potent daughter, desvenlafaxine (Pristiq).  There would be a reduction in milligrams from 150 to 50mg but the overall effectiveness was supposed to be equivalent with less side effects (possibly not as likely to raise blood pressure).  Since brand Effexor has become SO expensive and generic doesn’t work well for me - I agreed to try the des-venlafaxine.  On the 3rd day I took a day nap and cried a little.  On the 4th day I was wild with anxiety about my chest pains and sobbed when my physician let me come in for an EKG.  The MD encouraged me to keep going on the Pristiq for 2 weeks, and keep working with the psych NP.  The MD also made me feel more secure since the EKG and her other checks were OK.  I was just freaking out, basically.  

So... The baby dose of Abilify caused a strong seratonin reaction in me, and dropping Effexor for its daughter caused a strong withdrawal reaction in me.  I didn’t know what to think until I found this site, SA.org.  What a giant help to get real information for once!  Yes, SSRI and SSNRI’s have very, very strong effects on the body.  I think I’m going to hold steady for a while, scared from these 2 bad experiences (btw I am being referred to a cardiologist).  But I know now about NMT 10% dose tapering and that it is OK to remove the beads in Effexor, and OK to repackage in gelatin capsules...for when I am ready to try tapering.  But is it worth trying Pristiq?  Is it worth the hard shaky effort and strain to my relationship to go off Effexor???  My memory is shot and my blood pressure is high.  But will they get better?  

[Gridley]

Welcome to SA, LiferButOK.

 

It sounds as if you had an adverse reaction to the Abilify, which means the drug (regardless of dosage) is basically poison to your system.  The damage is not permanent and you will heal from this.  Are you still having symptoms from the Abilify?  If so, what are they?

 

Regarding the Pristiq, it sounds like you also had a bad reaction to it, whether an adverse reaction or withdrawal from the Effexor.  I'd hold steady on the Effexor.  When you've stabilized and are ready to taper it, we recommend tapering by no more than 10% of your current dose every four weeks.

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

This link is specifically about tapering Effexor.

 

Tips for tapering off Effexor (venlafaxine)

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and  omega 3 (fish oil). Your krill oil is fine.  Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system. 

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker 

 

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

 

Add in one at a time and at a low dose in case you do experience problems.

 

I see from your signature you're taking a B-complex. While it is often a first response to stress to take a B-Complex, in withdrawal it can be overstimulating.

 

Hypersensitive to B Vitamin or B-Complex  

 

This is your Introduction topic, where you can ask questions and connect with other members.  We're glad you found your way here.

 

 

 

 

 

[FindRest]

22 hours ago, LiferButOK said:

Effexor has become SO expensive and generic doesn’t work well for me - I agreed to try the des-venlafaxine.

You can go to the Effexor site and sign up for the savings card. Give this to the pharmacist. My name-brand Effexor now costs only $4.00! (It is NOT based on income levels).

https://www.effexorxr.com/savings-card?source=google&HBX_PK=s_effexor+coupon&skwid=43700038726353434

 

I was in a similar boat. I am so glad I went off the Pristiq and went back to Effexor to taper. Pristiq was not good for my heart and gave me a lot of muscle pain, plus tinnitus.  It also sounds like Pristiq is a lot harder to taper.

 

[LiferButOK]

Hi Gridley, thank-you for the welcome 🙂 and all the references.  I hadn’t read the one about B-complex yet, but I will with interest.  Also I plan to try Mg in a lotion - I bought Mg capsules and salt previously but had not found a way to use them routinely.  I think I am recovered from the Abilify but it took more than 2 weeks to eliminate it, after taking only 2mg for only 11 days (I know because the Abilify gave me rabbit poops!)  The chest pains were very scary but those have mostly subsided.  The worst part is my psych practitioner situation - there are very few in the area, and only ONE in my physician’s network.  She denied that 2mg Abilify could have had such a strong affect on me.  Well, it did!  I also appreciate your confirmation that I need to taper the Effexor.  The psych practitioner believed it would be a straight-forward switch, and gave me no Plan B in case of reaction.  Just a 2wk followup appointment.  I actually like the practitioner but she is spread too thin to be thorough and careful.  Medical care was not like this 20 years ago, why should it have gotten so lame now???

 

Hi FindRest, thank-you for coming forward to share your experiences with Effexor and Pristiq with me.  The $4 thing is great but I am on Medicare so don’t quailfy unfortunately!!!   But thanks for the link.  I’ve been getting a script for 3 x 75mg/day but only taking 2, so I can get by on 3 fills a year instead of 4 of the brand.  I still have to pay a lot out of pocket.  It’s not right that the Insurance companies take brand off the formulary...

I am curious to learn more about your muscle pains and heart issues on Pristiq, if you’d like to share more.  Also Effexor and Synthroid experience.  

[LiferButOK]

Effexor, venlafaxine and the little pellets inside.

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Lifer.

 

19 hours ago, LiferButOK said:

I’ve been getting a script for 3 x 75mg/day but only taking 2, so I can get by on 3 fills a year instead of 4 of the brand.

 

Are you taking any other drugs? What is your daily drug schedule?

 

To see what might have been going on between Effexor, Abilify and your other drugs, use the Drug Interactions Checker https://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php
and copy and paste the results or a link to them in this topic.

 

What is the reason you'd switch to Pristiq? Pristiq is made of Effexor's active metabolite, desvenlafaxine. As it comes in a solid tablet with only a few dosages, Pristiq is even more difficult to taper than Effexor.

 

If you want to taper, any doctor can prescribe psychiatric drugs, it doesn't have to be a psychiatrist. They usually don't know anything about tapering, anyway.

[LiferButOK]

Hi Altostrata, Thank-you for answering. I am really glad to have found this site, it’s excellent!

 

I take only venlafaxine, Effexor brand, 75mg at breakfast and 75mg at lunch.  That keeps me smoothest during the day with the least vivid dreams at night.  

 

The reason I sometimes try different things is because I have a poor memory since age 45 and elevated blood pressure.  The memory failure ended my career as a chemist early.  I couldn’t even succeed at Dunkin Donuts!  Also, Effexor helps but still does not bring my anxiety and mood within normal range (subjective and neuropsych assesments).  I checked endocrinology for slight hypothyroid at the insistance of my physician. But those meds either torqued me up with cramps or gave me a very foul mood.  Plus the endocrinologist said my T4, other levels would be WAY off if I had a real issue.

 

I did check the drug interaction checker today, but nothing jumped out at me.  No mention of raised cardiac activity or seratonin syndrome.  I had asked my physician about serotonin syndrome from Abilify, but she thought Not - since my BP and pulse were jumping around instead of being consistently high.  She’s sending me to a cardiologist to narrow down the source of the chest pains.  

 

Your question about why switch to Pristiq is my current quandary.  The psych practitioner said it has a better side effect profile and I’d like it better.  But I have not read anything to support that!  The practical other reason is about money and quality control.  It is now quite expensive to get brand Effexor, since generics are available.  The $4 card is not for people on Medicare.  I have had relapse problems on several brands of the generic venlafaxine.   Since Pristiq brand is still new with no generics, it is still covered on the Excellus formulary = affordable.  A crappy reason, but there it is.  Brand Pristiq is covered by insurance better than brand Effexor.  
 

You have helped me come to decision which is NO to Pristiq.  A sliver of hope and a lower price are not good enough reasons to go through Effexor withdrawal, which was fierce at only 4 days.  I will instead taper my Effexor down to what I can tolerate and see if my blood pressure drops with it.  Also take more magnesium and be more diligent with my krill oil.  I am still very curious if others on Effexor have experienced memory loss.  Mine started after chemo and menopause so the cause is not clear.  But I really want to preserve memory so I can live safely.

 

Thank-you again for this scientific and helpful resource!

 

 

[LiferButOK]

Interactions between your drugs

Moderate

venlafaxine  ARIPiprazole

Applies to: Effexor XR (venlafaxine), Abilify (aripiprazole)

Using venlafaxine together with ARIPiprazole may increase side effects such as dizziness, drowsiness, confusion, and difficulty concentrating. Some people, especially the elderly, may also experience impairment in thinking, judgment, and motor coordination.

[FindRest]

On 5/24/2020 at 6:52 PM, LiferButOK said:

am curious to learn more about your muscle pains and heart issues on Pristiq, if you’d like to share more.  Also Effexor and Synthroid experience.  

Looks like you’ve decided to go the Effexor route of tapering, which I think is a very good decision. Pristiq (or perhaps wd from my initial ct off Effexor) caused intense pain in my arms, hands, neck, shoulders, and back. This improved a lot once I went back on Effexor, but I still have some issues with tight muscles in my head and neck. Sometimes it feels as if my neck cannot support my head, if that makes sense. 
 

Years ago, higher doses of Effexor (75-150mg) caused my blood pressure to increase high enough to require BP medication. I eventually lowered my Effexor to 37.5 and noticed a big difference in BP (lower). Pristiq, even on the lowest dose of 25mg, caused my BP to increase dramatically. So, I guess what I’m saying is that you should notice your BP decreasing as you lower your dose. 

 

I’ve been on Synthroid for many years with no problem. 
 

Regarding memory ... without a doubt, Effexor has compromised my memory for many years. It’s also hard to recall important events in my life. At times, I feel like an idiot when family members are reminiscing and I have no clue what they are talking about. Since reinstating at a lower dose (9+mg) one of the first things I noticed was that my mind seemed so much “clearer”. Not sure if that’s a good word for it, but my mind just seems brighter. I’m not sure if old memories will come back, but I’m confident that the new memories I am building will be a lot more clear.

 

Regarding the $4 savings card and Medicare: Have you talked to your pharmacy about NOT using your Medicare card at all when filling the Effexor? I’ve re-read the requirements from the Pfizer card and it appears to me that one can qualify for the card if you just don’t run the prescription through Medicare. I may have missed something though. I learned about the benefits of NOT using Medicare on some scripts when I was helping my dad. We saved a lot of money by paying the non-insured/non-Medicare price on many of his prescriptions. Talk to your pharmacist if you haven’t already.

[LiferButOK]

FindRest, Thank-you SO MUCH!  You are a treasure to me!

 

Regarding symptoms:  I am constantly “cricking” my neck.  Sometimes I wonder if I could accidentally break my own neck and die, while trying to get comfortable. 🤪.  I also often have right arm pain that is not positional.  And I definitely know what you mean by a clear mind, since mine changes from clear to cloudy at any time.  Many times my head feels pressurized too.

 

My memory is so bad that I am already mixing up what symptom happened when, earlier this month.  I usually feel like an idiot when talking because I cannot recall all the parts of the idea or I fumble on the exact word.  Often, two words meld together so instead of saying “cabinet” or “cupboard“ it will come out as “cupboardnet.”  I am not stupid and my logic remains, but the memory defects sure make me look like an idiot. I am sure my last two bosses discounted me when I had good thoughts to share.  (I was a chemist in several fields).  Perhaps I do have early-onset dementia, but I have to at least check what Effexor is doing.

 

Also I worry about ministrokes from spikes in Blood pressure.  I am VERY glad to hear that you think my pressure will likely drop with a lowering of Effexor mg.  Also it is GOLD information to hear that Pristiq did not lower your pressure but in fact spiked it at only 25mg.  Even though ‘my mileage may vary,’ my 4d trial of direct switch from venlafaxine to O-desvenlafaxine certainly was not good!  And certainly not what my psych & med practitioners expected based on the drug literature.  This site is so important for giving real user experiences.  Every drug needs at least some info on what happens to a body when it is withdrawn!

 

But I am concerned.  We ALL went on antidepressants because we felt life was too heavy and we couldn’t function / didn’t want to keep struggling so * hard.  Something has to have changed for us so we can now  live well off of the drugs.  For me, both external expectations/demands and internal beliefs have greatly changed over 24 years.  Is that all it takes???  Have my nerves recovered so now they can work in positive mode? What about when a stressful event arises?  I have always needed the norepinephrine effects that come in at dosages over 150mg.  So cutting below 150mg is a significant change.  I guess no one can tell except by trying...  Also, daily walks would definitely help but I fail at consistent daily effort.  

 

I will apply for the $4 card and see what happens.  Thank-you for sharing your father’s success at buying drugs outside of Medicare.  Such valuable and hopeful news!  Finally, I am keen to find out more about your experience with Synthroid.  Maybe we could discuss that over on that thread?  Or with messaging?

Meanwhile I’ve got to organize myself for a daily diary if I’m going to start doing things logically.   I’ll have to print out what you wrote so I can post it and keep it in the front of my mind.  I appreciate your input, it’s so helpful.