Auroragirl: my intro

[ChessieCat]

akathisia-vs-restlessness-anxiety-agitation

 

[Auroragirl]

I am feeling concerned about my use of prescribed Adderall. I've been trying to give it up because it's a drug that causes such rapid and extreme swings and I don't know how I'm ever supposed to stabilize or return to homeostasis on it. However, it helps reduce akathisia for me, so whenever this gets really bad in the early morning, I always cave and take the Adderall again.

[ChessieCat]

January 2020 reinstated 15mg Adderall XR

 

Q:  Are you taking 15mg Adderall every day?

 

If not, please tell us what dose you are taking and when you, ie how often, you take it.

 

If you have been taking Adderall on and off since January this year, this may be contributing to your issues.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 16, 2020 by ChessieCat

[Auroragirl]

@ChessieCat

I used to take 15mg Adderall XR sporadically before I knew I was going through withdrawal. For about 2 months, I have been taking 15mg Adderall XR daily, although I'm trying to quit it. 

[ChessieCat]

January 2020 reinstated 15mg Adderall XR

 

Please update the above information in your drug signature.  We need to know exactly what you have been taking and when.  We are trying to help you but if we don't have all the information it makes it difficult for the mods to work out what is going on.  This wastes a lot of moderator time and causes a lot of frustration.  And it might be harmful for you if we give you wrong suggestions because it has been based on the partial information you have provided.

[ChessieCat]

14 minutes ago, Auroragirl said:

For about 2 months, I have been taking 15mg Adderall XR daily, although I'm trying to quit it. 

 

When you say you are trying to quit, are you currently reducing your Adderall doses, or skipping days, or do you mean that you want to quit it later?

[Auroragirl]

Just now, ChessieCat said:

 

When you say you are trying to quit, are you currently reducing your Adderall doses, or skipping days, or do you mean that you want to quit it later?

Every morning I try to resist taking it but I give in because it helps morning akathisia. So I am currently taking it every day

 

4 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

January 2020 reinstated 15mg Adderall XR

 

Please update the above information in your drug signature.  We need to know exactly what you have been taking and when.  We are trying to help you but if we don't have all the information it makes it difficult for the mods to work out what is going on.  This wastes a lot of moderator time and causes a lot of frustration.  And it might be harmful for you if we give you wrong suggestions because it has been based on the partial information you have provided.

I'm sorry, I don't understand what needs to be updated. I really did reinstate Adderall in January 2020.

[ChessieCat]

Your drug signature states:

 

January 2020 reinstated 15mg Adderall XR

 

The mods read this as:  you have been taking 15mg Adderall XR every day since January 2020.

 

Then you post the following:

 

20 minutes ago, Auroragirl said:

I used to take 15mg Adderall XR sporadically before I knew I was going through withdrawal. For about 2 months, I have been taking 15mg Adderall XR daily, although I'm trying to quit it. 

 

We need to know when you were taking it sporadically.  And what do you mean by sporadically?  Every 2nd day, every 3rd day, once or twice a week.  You say you have been taking it every day for about 2 months.  We need this information in your drug signature.

[Auroragirl]

11 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

Your drug signature states:

 

January 2020 reinstated 15mg Adderall XR

 

The mods read this as:  you have been taking 15mg Adderall XR every day since January 2020.

 

Then you post the following:

 

 

We need to know when you were taking it sporadically.  And what do you mean by sporadically?  Every 2nd day, every 3rd day, once or twice a week.  You say you have been taking it every day for about 2 months.  We need this information in your drug

Ok, I updated my signature. I was taking it as needed, so about 3 times a week, no set schedule. 

[ChessieCat]

45 minutes ago, Auroragirl said:

 

For about 2 months, I have been taking 15mg Adderall XR daily, although I'm trying to quit it. 

 

 

When you say you are trying to quit, do you mean that you want to quit it now or later?

[Auroragirl]

Now

[ChessieCat]

When providing information for drugs in 2020 in your signature please add dates.  If you don't know the exact date please state early, mid or late.  The more precise the information we get the better.

 

As I said we need you to provide accurate information so that we can help you and offer suggestions.  We are not mind readers.  Dates are very important.

 

June 2020 reinstated 5 mg Prozac 

June 2020 increased to 20mg Prozac, back down to 5mg, then increased to 10mg

August 2020 decreased Prozac to 5mg

 

Q:  What dates did you make the dose changes to Prozac.

 

You've only just recently reduced from 10mg Prozac to 5mg Prozac.

 

It would not be a good idea to start reducing your Adderall at this time.

 

[Auroragirl]

@ChessieCat

I updated approximate dates with my changes to Prozac. I wish I kept better track at the time. 

[manymoretodays]

Hi Auroragirl,

 

Please do not suddenly stop taking your Adderall XR. 

We take a harm reduction approach to getting off psychoactive drugs here.

*Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

(especially the very first post ^)

And......this does apply to Adderall!

 

How psychiatric drugs remodel your brain

(again, especially the very first post ^)

And yes, AdderallXR IS a psychiatric drug, which in your case, was started when you were just a teen.  You are not an addict and do not let anyone treat you as such. 

 

Take your AdderallXR, at the same time every morning.

When do you take your Prozac 5 mg dose?

 

Tips for tapering off Adderall

(this one ^ will come in handy later, and if I were you, I'd start to get familiar with now)

 

Would you also please put your current 2 drugs in here:  Drugs.com interaction checker

And then link us to the results or copy and paste them right here.

Do your best to abstain from alcoholic beverages of any kind and minimize or abstain from caffeinated drinks.  That will help you to stabilize as well.

 

On 8/16/2020 at 3:53 AM, Auroragirl said:

How am I supposed to handle akathisia? This is just awful. I can't take it anymore. I need coping mechanisms or some way to take the edge off of it. 

 

Quite likely that your erratic dosing(changing doses, skipping doses, adding in benzos) has added to your current distress.  The only way out of that is to HOLD real steady for a bit.
 

Your poor nervous system has taken a beating and is craving some consistency right now.   This is all going to take some time.

You may start to feel some relief of your current symptoms in a couple of weeks, with just consistency and no further changes.

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and omega 3 (fish oil). Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system.  

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker 

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

 

Can you get out for some gentle walks or other exercise? 

Emotions and feelings can feel really amplified at times too.  You might find this interesting and take some comfort from it:

Neuroemotions

 

Oh sweetie, hang in there.  Some stabilization is right around the corner. 

 

Love, peace, healing, and growth,

manymoretodays

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2020 by manymoretodays
elaboration

[Altostrata]

We need to determine if your symptoms follow any daily pattern to see if you're having adverse effects from Adderall.  Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

Taken regularly, Adderall needs to be tapered like any other psychiatric drug.

[ChessieCat]

8 hours ago, Auroragirl said:

I updated approximate dates with my changes to Prozac.

 

Thank you.  That makes it easier for us. ☺️

[Auroragirl]

8/17

8:00pm - Took 5mg paxil Prozac (see this post auroragirl)

 

8/18

12:30am - Woke up and took 3mg melatonin
Slept 1 hour
2:00am - woke up and felt akathisia (2/10)
2:30am - took 10mg marijuana gummy to help escalating akathisia (4/10)
Slept 3 hours
7:00am - woke up and felt akathisia (3/10)
7:15am - took 15mg Adderall XR, reduced akathisia (2/10)
7:30am - took 200mg magnesium glycinate 
7:45am - no akathisia (0/10)
No symptoms the rest of the day 

 

I know it's bad for me to use marijuana, but the akathisia is so severe, I really do not know how else to cope with it. A few nights ago I had akathisia so bad I was screaming for an hour and the police came. 

 

Edited August 19, 2020 by ChessieCat
bolded for clarity/corrected paxil to prozac

[ChessieCat]

On 8/18/2020 at 4:53 AM, Altostrata said:

Post 24 hours of notes at a time

 

[Auroragirl]

@ChessieCat

Yes this all occured within 24 hours.

[ChessieCat]

I was looking at the times.  I missed the last of your notes.  I've bolded it so that it is obvious.

[manymoretodays]

12 hours ago, Auroragirl said:

8:00pm - Took 5mg paxil 

 

Hi Auroragirl,

Did you switch from 5 mg Prozac to 5 mg Prozac?

 

Looks like you get into trouble when the morning dose of AdderallXR wears off.

Give a description of your akathisia, when you can.

 

And another day of notes will be really helpful to us.  You did a good job with the first.

 

 

[Auroragirl]

14 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

Did you switch from 5 mg Prozac to 5 mg Prozac?

Oops, yes I meant Prozac 

 

14 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

Give a description of your akathisia, when you can.

I thought about doing this, as it's such a hard one to describe and feels different for everyone. In it's most mild form it feels like electricity running through my body and anxiety. More severe is mentally feeling really awful and hopeless, and feeling very physically agitated. It makes me have restless legs, or have to constantly shift position. my forearms feel like they're burning.  The worst version is a feeling of complete doom and despair washes over me. I have to pace back and forth for an hour or 2 and I moan, grunt, cry, and scream from the emotional torment. 

[manymoretodays]

Oh thank you Auroragirl.  And thank goodness!

 

Good description and thank you for that as well.  Pacing can help.......definitely minimize the screaming.  I think it,......... the inner turmoil, restless, agitation, and gloom intensity, will stay more manageable with continued consistent dosing and some magnesium.

I know it's not ideal, but it's a start. 

 

If you would continue with notes now and really consistent dosing, that will really help.  Just post the next 24 hours, in one post from where you left off. 

And then, the next several days as well.

 

((((((Auroragirl))))))  L, P, H, and G,  mmt

 

Edited August 19, 2020 by manymoretodays
grammar.....

[Auroragirl]

2 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

If you would continue with notes now and really consistent dosing, that will really help. 

Yes I will. Thank you!

[Altostrata]

14 hours ago, Auroragirl said:

8/17

8:00pm - Took 5mg paxil Prozac (see this post auroragirl)

 

8/18

12:30am - Woke up and took 3mg melatonin
Slept 1 hour
2:00am - woke up and felt akathisia (2/10)
2:30am - took 10mg marijuana gummy to help escalating akathisia (4/10)
Slept 3 hours
7:00am - woke up and felt akathisia (3/10)
7:15am - took 15mg Adderall XR, reduced akathisia (2/10)
7:30am - took 200mg magnesium glycinate 
7:45am - no akathisia (0/10)
No symptoms the rest of the day 

 

I know it's bad for me to use marijuana, but the akathisia is so severe, I really do not know how else to cope with it. A few nights ago I had akathisia so bad I was screaming for an hour and the police came. 

 

 

How often have you taken Adderall in the last month? What times of day? How do you determine you need it?

[Auroragirl]

11 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

How often have you taken Adderall in the last month? What times of day? How do you determine you need it?

I have taken it every day in the past month in the morning. Daily use started in June when I reinstated Prozac. I gave in to the idea that I was unable to function without meds and would rather take them forever than go through years if withdrawal. Back in January - June, I used to take it randomly, a few times a week, if I had tasks I needed to complete during the day or just in days when I wanted an extra boost. I didn't really WANT to start taking it again but was also desperate for the relief it brang. It improved my mood and helped me get motivated to do stuff. Now, I have to take it every day because morning akathisia will turn into a full blown ordeal if I don't take it. I had 0 problems quitting adderall cold turkey  a year ago, before I started tapering Prozac, otherwise I wouldn't have messed with it. I started taking it again to deal with withdrawal symptoms. Now it seems I've developed some dependence on it I never had before because my nervous system has gone haywire. 

[Altostrata]

I think you have guessed correctly. My guess is the morning symptoms are withdrawal symptoms from the Adderall you took the prior day.

 

Since you're taking 15mg Adderall XR, I would ask for your prescription to be filled with 3 5mg capsules, to be taken in split doses (morning, mid-day, and night). The split doses should reduce the withdrawal symptoms you get overnight. Then I would taper from the noon 5mg capsule by counting beads. See

 

After you have eliminated the mid-day 5mg capsule (you'd be down to 10mg per day), you could start taking beads out of both morning and night capsules until you're off Adderall.

 

You need to stop all alcohol, it's probably upsetting your nervous system even more.

[Auroragirl]

@Altostrata ok I will divide my Adderall up and see how I feel. Gosh what a disaster I've created for myself by changing too much at once. I was just desperately trying to fix things. Should I continue the daily symptom logs? 

[manymoretodays]

10 minutes ago, Auroragirl said:

Should I continue the daily symptom logs? 

 

Yes. 

 

[Auroragirl]

8/18

10:00pm - took 5mg Prozac

8/19

worked late (information provided in this post)

12:30am - took 3mg melatonin and valerian 
Tossing and turning in bed, skin prickling 
2-3 hours of broken sleep, waking up in panic then dozing back off 
4:00am - woke up, akathisia (4/10)
4:15am - took 10mg marijuana gummy to stop akathisia
5:30am - fell asleep
6:40am - woke up, akathisia (4/10)
6:45am - took 15mg Adderall XR
7:15am - took 200mg magnesium glycinate, akathisia (1/10)
7:45am - no akathisia (0/10)
No symptoms the rest of the day (other than horribly depressed mood and 0 motivation,  which is normal every day)
 

Edited August 20, 2020 by ChessieCat
added info about working late

[ChessieCat]

26 minutes ago, Auroragirl said:

8/19

12:30am - took 3mg melatonin and valerian 

 

Did you go to sleep before this?

[Auroragirl]

5 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Did you go to sleep before this?

No, I worked late. 

[ChessieCat]

Please state the time when you go to bed so that the mods can have a clear picture of your day.  Thank you.

 

[Auroragirl]

17 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Since you're taking 15mg Adderall XR, I would ask for your prescription to be filled with 3 5mg capsules, to be taken in split doses (morning, mid-day, and night). The split doses should reduce the withdrawal symptoms you get overnight. Then I would taper from the noon 5mg capsule by counting beads.

So I've been thinking about this and wondering if I might be better off dividing it into 2, 7.5mg doses taken 8 hours apart. The reason being, since I am taking XR, I only get the effect of half the drug immediately. The other half of the beads in the capsule start working after 4 hours. Because of this, it is essentially as if I am taking 2 doses for each 1 pill I swallow. 

 

 If I were to take 3 times daily, for instance at 8am, 12pm, and 4pm, the 12pm dose would be getting the effect of the actual dose I take at 12, PLUS the addition of the delayed-release beads I took at 8am, causing an extra spike in dopamine. Then the same thing would happen when I take my 3rd dose at 4pm.

 

It seems my dopamine levels would be more stable through out the day if I took 7.5mg at 8am, half the beads would kick in at 12pm. Then I take the other 7.5mg at 4pm, and half the beads would kick in at 8pm. Essentially this would be like taking 4 doses throughout the day. 

 

I hope this makes sense. 

[Auroragirl]

8/19

8:00 pm - took 5 mg Prozac

9:00pm - took 1 gram phenibut

8/20

12:00 am fell asleep

4:00am - woke up, no symptoms

5:00am - fell back asleep 

8:00am - woke up, no symptoms

8:15am - took 7.5mg Adderall XR

5:00pm - took 7.5mg Adderall XR

Laid in bed all day. Very apathetic. 

[Altostrata]

Taking phenibut is a very bad idea. It is a benzo-like drug.

 

Please do not worry about balancing your neurotransmitters.

 

The smaller doses will overlap, that is true, but moving more of your dose later may reduce the interdose withdrawal overnight. I suggested getting 5mg capsules 3 times a day because that would be the easiest way to divide a 15mg per day dose. You might start with taking 10mg at the usual morning time but gradually move 5mg an hour later until you are taking it in the afternoon. You'd know when you're taking it too late when it prevents you from sleeping,

 

Taking 5mg a little bit later may forestall the interdose withdrawal overnight. Then you could taper the 10mg morning dose.

 

On the other hand, it could be that moving 5mg later in the day isn't enough to stop overnight interdose withdrawal. Then you'll want to move more Adderall, such as 5mg, later in the day.

 

You could take 7.5mg 12 hours apart. How would you measure 7.5mg? Switch to immediate-release Adderall?

 

The challenge is not to take any dose of Adderall too late in the day, when its effect may disrupt sleep. But there's no other way to avoid interdose withdrawal other than to take the last dose 12 hours before the next morning's dose. Read

 

If you took 15mg Adderall XR later in the day, at 3 p.m. for example, you may escape interdose withdrawal during the night but you'd probably have it after 3 a.m., becoming more intense as you get closer to 3 p.m.

 

No matter what you do, you'll have to take your doses on a consistent schedule from day to day.