Are We There Yet? How Long Is Withdrawal Going To Take?

[Moonpie]

Brassmonkey, thank you so much for this post,  I have just found it.  I am down to .001 in weight, started at .152, been doing it for 2 years on my Lexapro taper.  Going to take Altostrata's advice and stay on this dose a month before going off, then I have one more drug to do.  I really needed your post.  Things have gotten bad.  I had a window about 2 or 3 weeks ago that I felt great and had energy for about 3 days. I thought something was wrong with me LOL.  Then...... not sleeping, panic attacks in the night, depression, hopelessness, anxiety, hurting all over and exhaustion.  I work cleaning houses and offices and this has been very hard.  Sometimes I feel so bad with the working I get scared.  

Your post helped so much!!!!! Even though still struggle it has given me hope and tools to go on.  I can't thank you enough!!!! 

[brassmonkey]

Hi Melissa-- It took some thinking to recreate the details of what I did, it's been a while. The Gemini-20 scales can only weigh accurately to 4mg. This made it hard to divide the dose reduction into the small amounts required to continue the Brassmonkey Slide so I tried to reduce by 1mgpw every three weeks. This didn't work so I extended it to every four weeks. I did the 1mgpw reduction by visually dividing the 4mgpw of powder I could accurately weigh on the scale into 4 equal parts pf 1mgpw each. Each of those 1mgpw piles gave me 0.08mgai (active ingredient) in dose strength. By reducing one pile at a time I was able to reduce the dose by 0.08mgai every four weeks. Three piles, two piles, one pile.

 

When I got down to one pile of 1mgpw I visually divided that into four parts and repeated the process. Three piles, two piles, one pile. When I got to one pile the dose was sufficiently small I could make the jump to "0" with very little problem. My final dose would have been about 0.02mgai.

 

Hope that helps.

[Totallylost]

On 7/5/2020 at 8:44 PM, brassmonkey said:

Cold Turkey and Too-Fast Tapers

(8)

 

I will be blunt.  Unless there is a serious medical reason, Do Not Cold Turkey or Fast Taper.  Take your time tapering.  The pain and suffering are just not worth rushing it, and over time you will get off the drugs and recover much faster by doing a gradual taper.

 

For this discussion, a Cold Turkey (CT) is defined as stopping your drugs abruptly from a “normal” dosage. There is very little information about how many people do manage a CT successfully.  Doing a CT is a gamble. You won't know if you've lost until it's too late and develop severe withdrawal symptoms.

 

Don’t be in a rush to go off the drug with a too-fast taper, either.  A too-fast taper is one where you have withdrawal symptoms while you are tapering.  The 10% taper we recommend is intended to avoid withdrawal symptoms.  If you experience many withdrawal symptoms while tapering it means that your body is having a hard time.

 

However, like cold turkey, a fast taper may be justified by a serious medical reason, something like liver damage, severe allergic reaction, or other life-threatening conditions, but not just ordinary adverse effects.  In these situations, the risk of withdrawal symptoms may be equal to the problems being caused by the drug.

 

Psych drugs work by making physical changes to the body.  The body then requires the presence of those drugs to maintain stability and to keep functioning.  Remove the drug abruptly and often the body doesn’t know how to work.  It then starts to scramble to fix itself.  While that is happening the bodies systems cannot function correctly and we get WD symptoms.  Because the body is in such chaos after CT, those symptoms can be very acute and unpredictable.

 

Because the body is in such chaos those symptoms may last for a very long time. In the nervous system alone, there are hundreds of billions of electrical connections that have to be reviewed and repaired.  Throw on top of that the endocrine system, hormonal interactions and a lot of other things, the body doesn’t know what hit it.  Over many months the body takes inventory and starts making the changes it thinks will correct the situation. Then, it needs to adjust to those changes.  This is where the familiar pattern of “Waves and Windows” comes from.

 

Like everything else WD there are no statistics on how long recovery from CT will take.  But we have a lot of case histories that give us some indication. I frequently post about several of my taper buddies that CTed 40mgai of Paxil at the same time I started my taper. Currently it has been six years, I’m off all my meds and living life at about 95% plus of normal.  They, on the other hand, are still suffering waves that rival their initial acute period.  On the positive side they are also experiencing very nice Windows.  But they are still struggling on a daily basis

 

Many members have indicated that their doctor refuses to renew their prescription as a reason for a CT.  There are just too many resources available to get a renewed prescription for this to be a valid reason.  Any doctor can prescribe these medications. They can be obtained through Urgent Care, the ER/A&E, online prescription services, to name a few of the sources available. Sometimes they are available directly from the manufacturer. There will be some hunting and footwork involved, but it is best to do what needs to be done to maintain your supply, so you can keep control over your situation.  No one is going to do this for you.

 

So, I will conclude by restating my second sentence.  Unless there is a medical reason, Do Not CT.  If you cold turkey or taper too fast and you get withdrawal symptoms, if you are at all able to resume taking your meds, please look into our threads on Reinstatement. You can find more information about reinstatement here:

 

about-reinstating-and-stabilizing-to-reduce-withdrawal-symptoms

 

 

 

 

 

[Totallylost]

On 7/5/2020 at 8:42 PM, brassmonkey said:

But I only took it for a Week

(6)

 

I think that some of the most unfortunate members we have are the ones who only took the drug for a short time and had a severe Adverse Reaction. Over the years I’ve seen a number of members join who have taken their drugs for one day to a week and then stopped.  They suffer acute symptoms that hit immediately and hard.  Some people’s chemical makeup just isn’t compatible with psych drugs and their body immediately tries to reject them, but in doing so throws itself into chaos.

 

The good news is that their body will sort itself out and they will return to normal.  While this is recovery from a severe adverse reaction and not withdrawal syndrome, the bad news is the post-discontinuation symptoms are a lot like post- acute withdrawal syndrome (PAWS), and it’s going to take a long time and there is nothing that will speed up the process.  There are some coping strategies and tools that will help you endure the experience, but time is the only thing that will cure it, and it will take months rather than weeks.

 

These people tend to have a more linear recovery than those with true withdrawal syndrome. The first several months may be more intense.  Then, like PAWS, things start to improve very slowly. Eventually, normal life resumes and get back on track.  All the members I have known with this immediate Adverse Reaction have made full recoveries and gone on to normal lives and careers.

 

There is a variation to this theme and that is the ones who have taken the drug for a month or two.  They didn’t have the immediate Adverse Reaction, but the drug is not treating them well and they decide to stop taking it because of the way it makes them feel. Because they have only been on the drug for a short time and with their doctor’s encouragement, they stop the drug cold turkey.  This might throw them into a more typical withdrawal syndrome and a whole carousel of doctor’s visits and new drugs.

 

For those people who find themselves in this situation, it’s sometimes possible to do a quick taper over a few months.  This is an iffy proposition, as their nervous system may have become adapted to the drug during that short period.  Sometimes a fast taper works in their situation and sometimes it doesn’t.  Unfortunately, if you get withdrawal symptoms, you’ll know it was too fast.

 

Psych drugs work by making physical changes to the body, affecting every system and every cell.  They start to make these changes from the first dose and by the end of the first month they may have been quite successful. Studies show that people on the drug for only a month are at risk of withdrawal symptoms. The upshot being that even after only one or two months a proper, slow 10% taper is required. Yes, that means that you will be tapering the drug for longer than you took them originally.  But those changes, that were quick to happen, require a lot of time to sort out and undo without causing undue symptoms.

 

 

 

 

 

What if I was only on it less than 2 weeks?, tried 2 others lasted less than a week on each, now 6 weeks off and really ill

[brassmonkey]

One week, two weeks there isn't a lot of difference. Four different drugs in three weeks can really compound things. Luckily you didn't take any of then all that long. But it is still going to take a while for your brain to figure out what happened to it, stabilize and recover. It will pretty much follow the pattern I described in the article chapter 6. Some people get lucky and it clears up in a matter of a few months, while for others it can drag on quite a bit longer.

[Totallylost]

6 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

One week, two weeks there isn't a lot of difference. Four different drugs in three weeks can really compound things. Luckily you didn't take any of then all that long. But it is still going to take a while for your brain to figure out what happened to it, stabilize and recover. It will pretty much follow the pattern I described in the article chapter 6. Some people get lucky and it clears up in a matter of a few months, while for others it can drag on quite a bit longer.

Now I’ve been given sleeping pills, a drug for my stomach and diazepam which I’ve tried to resist but symptoms really too much not too take something 

[runningthestreets]

Hello, I skipped doses and did a fast taper but never went to Zero. Im now in 18.75 mg and im holding until i recover from withdrawal. I was in 75mg. This situation is better than CT or went to zero too fast? Now i feel like WDnormal most the time, anhedonia and sleep problems is the major problem.

[brassmonkey]

Yes, this is a much better situation than doing a FT/CT. It my take a little while but you should be able to stabilize on the 18.75 and then start a slow taper. Feeling like you are at WDnromal is a very good sigh or stabilizing.

[Yesyes123]

On 7/5/2020 at 4:41 PM, brassmonkey said:

Stability

 

Here's a little thing I wrote about "Stability":

 

[Sebas]

@brassmonkey i'm currently on 11.2 mg of paxil and seem not able to stabilise after a long period of time (11-2019). My heartrate is up, i'm feeling dizzy, have got less energy but it hasn't been like a normal withdrawal. It feels like stabilisation is just not happening. Could this be a tolerance issue after >15 years? 

 

If so, is there a possibility to supplement with another ssri (small amount) and in the near future taper down the paxil further? This other ssri might catch up for the loss of effectiveness of paxil. Or is this a risk? Doing a quick cross over (paxil to zero) is not something that i would prefer given the short halflife of paxil. When i'm feeling drowsy like this i'm not able to do my work so i need something to provide a certain stabilisation. What is your opinion on this?

[brassmonkey]

@Sebas -- This will be better discussed over on your intro thread. That way you can have all the information in one place. I posted a question there for you.

[gdsequoia]

Hi @brassmonkey,

Thank you for the rational explanation of all these topics. Works well with my computer programmer's mind

 

I have a question. You say:

Quote

When a person makes a drop in dose, there may be a corresponding increase in the WD symptoms over the next few days. 

 

And somewhere else in SA, I had read that "if you get any increase in WD symptoms after a dose reduction, you're tapering too fast". Unfortunately I can't find the topic I read that in now.

 

Maybe my memory is lying to me, so I want to make sure I understand:

Is it "okay" to get an increase in WD symptoms after a dose reduction? Or is it a red flag?

 

EDIT: Found it:

Quote

However, if you get withdrawal symptoms, your nervous system is telling you that you are tapering too fast

 

[brassmonkey]

We are taking the combined experiences of a lot of people over a vey long time and sometimes things will change as we evolve. Also it is very hard to make blanket statements about what an individual will experience. Feeling no WD symptoms with a reduction is a target we would all like to reach, but in most cases it is not possible.

 

Blanket statement: There are going to be some WD symptoms associated with any dose change event, be it a reduction, increase or change in delivery system. How bad those symptoms are is an individual thing. Our aim is to keep them at a minimum so they do not disrupt a persons life more than necessary. During the bulk of a taper it is practically impossible to not experience symptoms with a reduction. However, when a person reaches the end of a taper their body should have adjusted and healed to the point that the symptoms should be quite mild. At this point we look to have no symptoms with each reduction.

 

In general a person will experience an increase in symptoms a day or two after making a decrease. In a few cases they will hit immediately while in others they can be delayed several weeks. By doing smaller reduction and allowing them to stabilize the symptoms can be kept to a minimum as with the Brassmonkey Slide Method and other microtapers.

[Nivsch]

On 10/13/2020 at 9:26 PM, brassmonkey said:

Hanna's right. It is recommended that you don't drink any alcohol at all during withdrawal and even after reaching "0".  We have a number of members who were nicely into recovery/healing who had a few drinks 10 months after reaching "0" and it threw them right back into acute WD. It is also very common, especially around the holidays, for someone who is having a smooth taper to have a celebratory glass of wine and a day later start an extremely bad wave that lasts a very long time. Also for people who have regular drinks during the week who are having problems with their taper, when they stop drinking they stabilize and have a much smoother time of it.

 

That is not less than amazing. It shows how crucial is nutrition to the body's ability to adjust to reductions.

[Jayy]

I am desperate need of relief from an awful high pitched buzzing sound inside of my head. I got very desperate and decided to take a antidepressant Pristiq 50mg and could not handle the side effects. I have had tinnitus ever since taking pristiq and I have been walking every day and running a usual 10-20 miles per week. I eat very well. I do my best to be healthy and yet my body has been either acclimating to the changes that Pristiq caused in my brain. 3 months later from day 0 and I only took the drug for 4 weeks basically, and I STILL HAVE A HIGH PITCHED RINGING sound constantly in my head. For 2.5 months I was dizzy and having very uncomfortable headaches which have lightened up, but the ringing has not slightly dissipated, and I am very worried that I lack the mental faith and strength to keep going. I have stuggled with being positive and having faith my entire life, but I am worried and don't know what to do. I would like to take fish oil and magnesium, but I already eat fish 2-3 times a week. I just want the ringing to stop. I've always wanted to not feel depressed now I wish to be free of depression and now, also want to be tinnitus free. 

[Jayy]

So I'm not sure If I am going through withdrawal or have permanent damage. The first time I tried pristiq 50 mg for 11 days and stopped I felt fine. A few months later I was very depressed again and thought I should give it another try so I took 50mg of pristiq for 24 days and stopped because I felt terrible and my head was buzzing intensely which I found out is tinnitus. So i'm wondering if after 7 months off the drug why I still have tinnitus, I get headaches every now and then and my brain feels very strange with pressure and emptiness. The tinnitus is causing me to have extreme anxiety and depression, and my doctor doesn't help me, The ENTs dont help me, and I can't figure out if the tinnitus will ever go away, I've never had it and Its very worrisome after 7 months off and it was a low dose for 3 weeks. I don't know if I'll ever heal, and I dont know what pristq did to me to cause such long lasting loud tinnitus. Sorry for posting again, Im just having a break down.....again

[Sharkmouth]

To put into context what can destabilize someone… 

 

I’d been in a 7 week window. Riding 8 miles a day on my bike, boxing and light lifting.

 

I decided it was time to start lifting heavier weights and doing a more intense workout. I felt great and had that nice burn/soreness you want to achieve hypertrophy. 6 hours later as I was getting ready for bed and my body was healing, I crashed. Fully back to how I was originally at my worst. It’s now been 18 days. Don’t push yourself in ANY aspect. Having this crash always means I haven’t been feeling like I can work out at all yet. I’m upset as it was my fault, but I forgive myself as I was just trying to be better. ITT was a valuable lesson and I hope it can help someone else.

 

Best Regards,

[ChessieCat]

@Sharkmouth

 

You might like to post this here:

 

exercise-do-more-do-less-do-nothing-what-worked-for-you

 

[Sharkmouth]

@ChessieCatappreciate that. Some happy and sad stories in there. Overexertion, even intended, releases cortisol. A lot of people on these medications are hypersensitive to Cortisol already. Paired with WD… not the smartest move in retrospect. Hindsight is 20/20 though and now I’ve learned not to be overzealous with physical stress either. 

[unblocktheplanet]

This document in its entirety is very valuable education & ammunition to use with your doc. None of them realize how serious is our predicament. 

 

CJ

Bangkok

Edited July 8, 2022 by brassmonkey
Removed offer for PDF/printed copies

[Superwoman]

It sounds like from what I have read a person is at risk for withdrawal after being on the drug for 1 month or longer.  What if someone has been on the drug for less then 1 month?  Can someone who has been on the drug for less then 1 month do a quick taper or cold turkey, to get off before they become dependent on the drug?  Or would someone who is on the drug less then 1 month still need to do a slow 10% per month taper?

[Altostrata]

The risk of withdrawal for someone who is taking a drug regularly for less than a month is lower than for longer exposure. Someone might still get withdrawal if they quit abruptly. We suggest a short taper over a few weeks or months in these situations.

[Elaine5]

Having made many drug changes recently, on top of protracted withdrawl from earlier, it had been my understanding that I had an adverse reaction to Buspar, but in retrospect, it could have been just a completely confused nervous system from multiple concomitant drug changes? What I thought was Akathisia from Buspar could have been activation from the combination…. 
 

And rapidly coming off of it over a couple weeks (after a month of being on it) could have made things worse…. 
 

So important lesson learned: there is a reason to slowly taper even when experiencing bad effects of a drug and that is because you don’t want to further destabilize things. 

 

Even in situations where adverse reactions have destabilized someone, so long as they don’t go continuing changing things and adding things, eventually things get better? 

[mpalas123]

When we say withdrawls we mean also some sexual dysfunction symptoms? Cause i see only emotional, cognitive and physical symptoms....

[Elaine5]

1 hour ago, mpalas123 said:

When we say withdrawls we mean also some sexual dysfunction symptoms? Cause i see only emotional, cognitive and physical symptoms....

Hi @mpalas123, sexual dysfunction can be a side effect of many psych meds or emerge during withdrawl. For me, yes, this has been a very upsetting problem in withdrawl, although libido could be considered an emotional symptom too. Others have experienced it as well. There are success stories which reference improvement in this dysfunction over time. 
 

There are threads about it specifically on here in the symptoms and self care section. I wouldn’t look into it or research it as doing so really messed me up and made me more upset. I’d recommend seeing if a physiotherapist might be an option for you, and simply waiting it out. 

[Nicolas45140]

On 7/5/2020 at 9:51 PM, brassmonkey said:

Limiting one’s exertion level is important for healing and recovery. Physical training places the body under a huge amount of stress both mentally and physically. For the time one will spend on healing and recovery it is best to put the strenuous training aside.  Instead of making a flat out run, take a leisurely walk, enjoy the fresh air, smell the roses, do some forest bathing. Instead of pumping iron, do some relaxing stretches, yoga, tai-chi. Making the change from pushing yourself to relaxing is part of Acceptance, and your body will thank you for it.

Some elliptical bike at the gym or a bike run outside wouldn’t be a good advice ? 
i would say weight lifting isn’t a good idea… but some cardio could be fine ? Don’t you think. 
‘Nicolas 

[brassmonkey]

Exercise in fine in moderation and at a low level. Short rides on the bike would be good, just not at top speed up hill. Keeping the body moving, but not stressing it.

[sandnit]

 

@brassmonkeyI have been on a way to fast taper and i'm holding on 5mg lexapro since 3,5 months. The last 1,5 months I was in a pretty good place and I felt really optimistic that I had stabilised and was planning to start tapering again using tapering strips but 2 weeks ago this big wave hit and a lots of symptoms are back with vengeance.   I'm a little bit in the mist if it is wise to start tapering again while still having waves or do i hold ?? I found these: 

 

On 7/5/2020 at 9:49 PM, brassmonkey said:

If you are recovering from withdrawal, WDnormal is the place you are when you're not feeling good, but you're not feeling bad, sort of a rolling average of the past couple of months of windows and waves.

 

 Brassmonkey's Tips and Tricks for Withdrawal

Quote

WDNormal

 

I see WDnormal as the overall baseline of where you are in general. The place you are when you're not feeling good, but you're not feeling bad. Sorta a rolling average of the past couple of months between the windows and waves.

 

Does this mean people still taper when they hit waves? Or do the waves need to be gone before starting the taper again?

The days between the waves are ok and are more or less the same except from a few bad days/ hour in between. Could this mean WDnormal?  The time in between the last waves has increased but the wave i'm in now is longer and feels hard / different from the last one.  

Due to the wave i'm more unsure about everything but i think i'm still stabilizing and need to wait longer but i would love to have your opinion on this.

 

[Nicolas45140]

12 minutes ago, sandnit said:

 

@brassmonkeyI have been on a way to fast taper and i'm holding on 5mg lexapro since 3,5 months. The last 1,5 months I was in a pretty good place and I felt really optimistic that I had stabilised and was planning to start tapering again using tapering strips but 2 weeks ago this big wave hit and a lots of symptoms are back with vengeance.   I'm a little bit in the mist if it is wise to start tapering again while still having waves or do i hold ?? I found these: 

 

 

 Brassmonkey's Tips and Tricks for Withdrawal

 

Does this mean people still taper when they hit waves? Or do the waves need to be gone before starting the taper again?

The days between the waves are ok and are more or less the same except from a few bad days/ hour in between. Could this mean WDnormal?  The time in between the last waves has increased but the wave i'm in now is longer and feels hard / different from the last one.  

Due to the wave i'm more unsure about everything but i think i'm still stabilizing and need to wait longer but i would love to have your opinion on this.

 

Sandnit, I asked kind of same question and when in the wave you are not WDnormal. 
Recommandation is to wait to be stable again. If you continue you might get worse.

 

[brassmonkey]

WDnormal is an overall feeling at the time. On an average day how do I feel? Each specific day is going to feel different, but in general I am feeling this way. It is used as a long-term measure of improvement. Do I feel better than I did six months ago, yes will show improvement, no means things need more time to improve.

 

Waves are rather unpredictable; each one will be different. Getting hit with a bad wave after several gentle ones is a good sign of healing.

 

It is best to let the wave run it's course before tapering further. 

[sandnit]

11 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

Waves are rather unpredictable; each one will be different. Getting hit with a bad wave after several gentle ones is a good sign of healing.

@brassmonkey, thanks so much for your reply and work on this site! I'm so grateful for this.

Yes they are unpredictable indeed. But knowing a big wave means good healing helps me put things in perspective. 

 

11 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

Do I feel better than I did six months ago, yes will show improvement, no means things need more time to improve.

Hmmm this is hard to say yet, less than 6 months ago I actually did some huge reductions, had corona and did EMDR therapy so you can imagine it has been a rollercoaster but I would say the days in between the waves are improving slightly, the days during this wave are as worse as ever, the wave is longer although it feels different from the last wave.  And the time in between the last waves increased significantly. Is this a good sign??

 

11 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

It is best to let the wave run it's course before tapering further. 

Getofflex also gave the same advise on my intro page.  She thinks my system is still sensitised from the fast taper and believes my system would benefit from continuing to hold.

 

So I would say I'm not at WDnormal yet and I'm going to hold for a while longer. 

 

Thanks again for your advise. All the best to you!

[paulk23]

I have dropped my dosage of veneflexine xr from 75 mg I've now dropped to 37.5 I've been dropping about every eight weeks by 15 percent,my question is since I've dropped to 37.5 roughly 10 days ago I have had crippling anxiety feel like iam gonna die every minute can't function at all , speaking to my doctor of course he said I should up my dosage not drop it and now iam totally confused as I don't know is this a result of my brain figuring out the new dosage or is this how I am without that amount of medication has anybody any advice on this or felt similar thanks.

[Altostrata]

As explained many times, too large a decrease can bring on withdrawal symptoms. You are experiencing antidepressant withdrawal symptoms.

[unblocktheplanet]

While Alto is completely correct for every single psych drug, Pfizer has designed a nearly taper-proof SNRI with Venlafaxine. Trade-named Efexor XR, the smallest dosage is 37.5mg; thus docs raise the doses to a 150mg standard. Higher than that, docs warn euphemistically of “side effects”. Those side effects happen to be serotonin syndrome, particularly if one is taking any other med which messes with your serotonin. You do not want this, Paul; your life would never be the same. Here is a long list of drug interactions and more side effects.

 

It is completely impossible to drop from 37.5mg to 0mg in one swell foop. That’s why there are so few Venlafaxine reports here on SA . [Aside: Any success stories from anyone? I sure hope so, somewhere.]

 

The XR stands for extended release which means once a day dosing is possible. The way Pfizer achieved this miracle is by filling each 37.5, 75, or 150mg capsule with tiny little beads of poison. The painful and frustrating method is to count however many of those damned little beads are in each capsule & follow SA’s reduction protocol of 10% of the previous dose.

 

Pfizer’s evil ‘geniuses’, in true Mengelean tradition, with full intention, designed Venlafaxine so it can never be dropped, whether it is ‘effective’ or not by doctor’s or patient’s criteria. NHS calls Venlafaxine the most addictive of all psych drugs and the hardest to wean, regardless of dosage, duration or use. Profits are all this company cares about. Would you expect less from a company which volunteered to make execution drugs for capital punishment when the EU forbade their manufacture?

 

Backgrounder: Most shrinks & some GPs start patients on 37.5mg. Some go as high as 225mg, a few to 300mg. A recent article, describing ‘normal’ Venlafaxine promoted ‘success’ with 600mg (!). Incidentally, the fact Efexor XR is impossible to taper means one cannot backtrack, either, from, say, 75mg to 37.5 without intense and painful withdrawal.

 

Paul, I feel for you. Bead-counting has to be purgatory. But that’s really your only choice if you wish to be free of this one. I’ve never heard of it being done but perhaps a microgram scale might help; the cheaper ones on Amazon may not be much use. Accuracy is not as important as standard for the beads.

 

I only hope somebody starts a class-action lawsuit of all the people crippled by this drug. Not that I think the people would win. Slaves to Pfizer (aka 'patients') are who pays for the best lawyers. I hope Pfizer's minions & their shareholders pay for this crime again humanity in some version of hell.

 

It's noteworthy that docs who prescribe psych drugs are never held to account. I do nopt for a minute believe any doc wants to harm his or her patients. However, they're taught DSM-5 is the holy bible; most follow it slavishly. In fact, there are really only six SSRIs (!), seven SNRIs, and 14 classes of ‘antipsychotics’ prescribed. If your car mechanic had only 27 tools in his toolbox, all variations on hammers or icepicks, would you trust him? Docs' rationale is, of course, that all headaches are not the same--pity about the serotonin syndrome, eh.  

 

Docs only know how to prescribe, rarely withdraw. Please keep us posted here, Paul. Very best of luck.

[unblocktheplanet]

Paul, I should also mention that folks seem to start getting those grueling withdrawal symptoms after a delay of only four hours. Chemical handcuffs...

[Altostrata]

No, that's not correct, @unblocktheplanet We have many people here successfully tapering Effexor XR. They usually taper by opening the capsule and counting beads. This is explained in Tips for tapering off venlafaxine (Effexor)

 

No psychiatric drugs come in a sufficient dosage range for gradual tapering, and patients have found ways to derive intermediary dosages for all of them. Though it can be a difficult drug to go off, many people find it quite easy to taper Effexor XR by counting beads.