Jonathan93: tapering Effexor XR, mirtazapine and sertraline

[Jonathan93]

Its been a week since my last taper, Im feeling okay. Just a bit of eyemovement pain and a little bit less energy, but nothing super dramatic so far.

[DataGuy]

That is great to hear, @Jonathan93. 

 

To tag someone, you just need to write the @ sign followed by their screen name. Then an option should come up for you to click on with your mouse.

 

Glad you are finding the right level of cuts so that you can taper comfortably. Important to find that ideal pace where you feel you are making progress, but you aren't tapering so fast so as to exacerbate your condition. 

 

I have been taking some Wim Hof showers, but I haven't yet tried any of the breathing. Suggestions for starting out are welcome, Jonathan : )

[Matheus]

Hi @Jonathan93!! Are u doing liquid titration?

[Jonathan93]

@MatheusNo, Im still taking beads out. Ive actually counted the hundreds of  tiny beads once, so I can calculate better. So my way is a bit weird ... I'll try to explain. My psychiatrist gave me effexor xr 150 mg back when I was on higher doses. Usually the capsules contained 15 beads. So it was  about 12,5 mg per bead. But this one time I received 150 mg xr with hundreds of tiny beads. At first I wanted to throw them in the trash because preparing the meds for a week would take forever.. (I prepare my meds for a week every sunday). But then I thought why dont you just count the tiny beads for this one time and calculate how much mg is one tiny bead and add them to the bigger beads which is 12,5 mg. So actually took the time and counted all the tiny beads. I came to the conclusion that for this brand (TAD Pharma) the meds include 575 tiny beads, so 1 bead contains 0,261 mg so 1 mg is about 3,833 beads.

 

Since I could calculate this, I "mix" (its not really mixing since its the same medication... just different brands) the beads with 12,5 mg and the tiny beads 0,261 mg together in one retard capsule. This way I dont need a lot of time for preparing my meds, since most of the capsule contains the bigger beads.

 

Maybe there are easier ways, I dont know... but this seems fair enough. Ive once read about using a microgram scale, but my mg scale is just not accurate enough.

 

@DataGuy

At first, thank you for the tip! Seems to work 🙂

 

 

I think learning about some background of the man who invented this method is important!

I think this small documentary shows some importand  background information about the method. Even though its Vice, its still a good documentary 😀

 

 

 

 

 

This is the guided mediation I always use: Its 11 minutes and does not take up that much time.

If youve done this for a few weeks to months you can maybe improve to the advanced videos, which you all can find on youtube!

 

 

 

 

[DataGuy]

Thanks @Jonathan93, will add those to my playlist : )

[Jonathan93]

Tapering this friday again, on the 30th July from 41,7 (i wrote 40,8 but that was a mistake...)  to 40,11 mg Effexor XR. Close to the lowest available dose of Effexor XR. (37,5 mg= Its going to take a lot more time, but this is an importand mark for me, since I started out on 150 mg Effexor XR about a year and 3 months ago!

Edited July 26, 2021 by Jonathan93

[Jonathan93]

So i tapered last friday. I feel withdrawal symptomps, yet their are not intense. I feel slightly anhedonic, feeling a bit less energy and I have brain fog. I'll keep u guys updated.

[Jonathan93]

Update: 1 week and 1 day since tapering. "Just" feeling a bit blue and still have some concentration problems. Energy is back to normal.

[DataGuy]

Thanks for the update @Jonathan93. Glad to see you are mostly in control of your taper and documenting things carefully.

 

I was watching the Wim Hof documentary and I was amazed to see the interviewer do so well slipping into the canal water in December! I think I have a more pronounced reaction wading into cold river water around summer time lol. Very interesting stuff : )

[Jonathan93]

Tapering just one mg from tomorrow. I did my hold for about 5 weeks. Im doing just one mg because I am in a stressfull environment right now.

[DataGuy]

Good idea, @Jonathan93. Could even taper smaller amounts more often to smooth things out. May be a bit easier on your system. Hope you are able to relax a bit soon : )

[Jonathan93]

Hello again, I dont have to say a lot actually which should be a good sign i guess. I feel pretty good and did not had any tapering symptoms since my tapering is going really slowly. I finally arrived at 37,5 mg Effexor XR and WOW that took a long time from 150 mg to 37,5 mg! But its a huge success for me and it did not come without some dark moments. I feel really stable at the moment and I still have a long way to go for tapering my three meds but Im glad that I made such a great tapering process. ( I startet out in the beginning from 150 mg Effexor XR, Sertraline 50 mg and Mirtazapine 15 mg).

[DataGuy]

That is great that you are feeling stable after such a large dose reduction, @Jonathan93. That was the goal throughout the entire taper and will continue to be the goal: reduce the drugs and remain stable, keep a lid and symptoms and don't let them flare up for too long. You are in a great spot, and if you continue to be prudent and show discipline in your taper you will be back to your pre-drug self before you know it. Congrats : )

[Jonathan93]

Not a lot to tell, everything is going pretty smoth so far. Reducing this thursday Effexor XR from 37,5 mg to 36,48 mg.

[DataGuy]

That is great news @Jonathan93. The ideal update is that withdrawal is very uneventful!

[Jonathan93]

After my last tapers I never had any symptoms. But this time when I reduced just 0.76 mg from 35,43 --> 34, 65 mg Effexor XR I have symptoms again. At least I think they are withdrawal symptoms.

My anxiety is a bit up and I feel really aggressive like Id quit smoking or something like that. Its really not pleasant and I try not to lash out the aggresiveness on to other people.

 

Besides I wish everyone one here some nice christmas holidays. 🙂 May the year 2022 be a blessing for everyone on the forum and your loved ones.

[DataGuy]

Thanks for the update @Jonathan93! And merry Christmas to you, too : )

 

The anger and aggression are likely withdrawal symptoms, if it's not something you normally experience and you've ruled out other causes. Not unusual at all. You will just have to keep an eye on them and hope they fade like other symptoms tend to if you are doing reasonable cuts. 

 

Happy new year and look forward to hearing from you in 2022!

[Jonathan93]

Little Update, my tapering symptoms are gone and I am about to do a tiny taper on thursday (just 0,261 mg) and will taper 0,76 mg more on upcoming monday. So about just one gram. I know my taper is really slow, but I just cant afford any heavier symptoms because of college. Never thought all the tapering will take so long, but its probably the best for my body. Overall, even though I have some taper symptoms here and then, I feel really stable so far looking at the last 6 months.

[DataGuy]

Thanks @Jonathan93. You have made great progress! 150mg of Effexor down to 33mg. Is everything is going well outside of the tapering? Are you keeping journal entries when you have very good or bad days? 

 

Great to hear about the long term stability. That is the goal. Hope you continue to feel better and better as you get further down : )

[Jonathan93]

No, I dont journal. I would not even know how to start.. Do you have any recommendations? Besides tapering everything is pretty good.  Do you have any recommendations? Thank you for the kind words 🙂

[DataGuy]

I am not much of an expert on journaling, but it can be useful to write down when you are either having a very good day, or a very bad day. That way this gives you some idea of where you were at that point in time, and you can look back to see if you have made progress. Generally the extreme lows will get less extreme as you go along. It can also give you an idea of what led to you feeling that way. And when you feel good, of course, you may end up discovering something you didn't expect helped you out.

 

You may also want to journal when you try something new. A new meditation technique, a new Wim Hof technique, a new sport or activity, or food, or a larger or smaller cut to the medication. It can just be helpful. Our memories are not perfect, so it gives you a guide for the future, whenever you feel a bit unsure. It can also improve your writing skills, although that is not the main goal : )

 

I'm glad you're doing well, @Jonathan93. Hope things continue to improve!

[Jonathan93]

Im having tapering symptoms. I feel anhedonic, tired and feel anxious and have brain fog, so far it still is managable. I also feel some little shivering.  planed to taper today, but I canceled the taper so I can stabilize. This is really frustrating for me .. I know I've come a long way, but it seems I'm getting in a really sensitive area of tapering.. Really thinking about starting supplementing fish oil because I really think my brain needs the nutrition on my tapering journey now.

[Jonathan93]

Im feeling a bit better today. Im having weird face tingling, but I also had this before. My anhedonia and anxiety are a bit better now. I guess Ill just wait it out.

[DataGuy]

Good plan @Jonathan93. No sense forcing things. Always a good strategy to wait it out if you are unsure. Hope the symptoms clear up soon and you are feeling better. 

[Jonathan93]

Little update: Everything is pretty good. I decided to microtaper one bead, every week so thats 0,261 mg so I have about 10,66 mg in 40 weeks. So far Its great, since the taper is really small and I dont feel any symptons each time I'm reducing. Its really slow, but It feels right.

[Jonathan93]

Update: Im ok so far, I tapered last Monday about 0,52 mg Effexor XR, so I'm at 32, 83 mg Effexor XR. First days were tough and I had a little anhedonic phase with less drive and motivation. But this does not neccesarily has to be the taper. I injured my ankle joint really badly last week, so i cant do a lot of activy which makes me kind of sad. Because the swelling on my ankle is really bad, I got cortisone for about 14-20 days as a pain med, to reduce the swelling. I did not find any interactions with my AD-Med.

 

[DataGuy]

Thanks for the update, @Jonathan93. Sorry to hear about your ankle. I also hurt my ankle area (achilles) and it's been very frustrating not being able to run. 

 

Sounds like you are doing well with the taper. Considering you were on 150mg Effexor a couple years ago, your progress has been excellent : ). No doubt it is one of the tougher meds to taper. If you can get through this in a state of relative stability, you'll be in great shape!

[Jonathan93]

Update: Im feeling really bad 😕 I have some heavy Depersonalization/ Derealization since friday evening. A feeling I did not had in a long time. Its scary and my anxiety went through the roof. Now in the evening its tolarable..

[Jonathan93]

In the evening everything was ok, In the morning after I woke up dp/dr is strong. Hope it fades in the evening.

[Blossom71]

Hi @Jonathan93

I just wanted to stop in to say Hello and to say that I've just read your thread, and have found your patience inspiring.

I'm sorry you've not been feeling great over the last few days, and I hope it resolves soon.  

[Jonathan93]

Thank you for the kind words Blossom! I hope it revolves soon, too. This feeling is really scary. I feel so detached from reality. It feels like I drank to much beer and can't get sober... except I did not drink anything. 

 

[Jonathan93]

Update: Feeling like sh*. I just had some intense crying spells. I did not cry since like half a year. I feel dizzy. I have no appetite. I cant think clearly. Feeling agitated and restlessness. 
Hope it fades soon :l

[DataGuy]

Thanks for the updates @Jonathan93, and sorry you are feeling so bad. Good to write this down so that we can have a clear record of what led up to it. 

 

It looks like you had some pretty intense symptoms at the beginning of January too and paused for a bit before resuming the taper. But since around Jan 22nd you have tapered close to 2mg (6.7%). It may not be too quick of a pace for you, but it's possible that your system was destabilized a bit in early January and did not quite have time to recover before the resumption of tapering. It's also possible the ankle injury could be contributing. Have you been able to do any exercise in place of what you were doing before? Getting less exercise can definitely result in a buildup of stress and nervous system overstimulation. 

 

It is ok to slow down a bit and wait for your system to settle down, then resume once things are stable for a significant period. It is all trial and error. By pushing yourself and developing symptoms, you'll know how fast you can go without destabilizing. You'll also figure out how long you need to wait after experiencing the destabilization before it is safe to resume the normal pace of tapering. In that way you can figure out exactly how quickly you can taper while avoiding destabilization entirely (at least that is the hope). You are really going to benefit from your diligent tapering records. It may also help to record other sources of stress, exercise levels, sleep. Knowing how you react with varying levels of these can give you an idea of what exactly you need to do to maintain stability in the future. Wouldn't wish those symptoms on anyone   Hope you are feeling better soon!

[Jonathan93]

Hello @DataGuy, thank you for the kind words. The ankle injury is definitely contributing to my misery, since exercise plays a major role for me. I am definitely going to hold on this dosage for longer till I stabilize and recover. I do have a withdrawal symptoms, I think that's undeniable. Stil having symptoms of Dizziness, brain fog, symptoms of DP/DR and feeling anxious. It is probably a mix of withdrawal symptoms and my "real" underlying depression. But I don't want to mask my symptoms with pills anymore. I think its the healthiest way to cope is to accept the feelings for now and listen to my body. 

[Jonathan93]

I feel terrible today. I had to leave work early today, because my thinking is extremely clouded. I feel heavy dp / dr. I had to cancel work tomorrow. I really hope this goes away soon
 

 

[Jonathan93]

I have no clue why, but my mood lifted alot this evening.