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Using an oral syringe and other tapering techniques


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The smaller oral syringes will have ticks at smaller amounts, e.g. tenths or hundredths of milligrams.

 

The top of the gasket is the part that's touching the liquid.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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1mL  oral syringe:        

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That's funny because I had the same question in my mind too! I just decided that it doesn't matter though, as long as I stay consistent with which to choose. So I chose the edge of the rubber part as marker instead of the tip of the rubber part in the middle. As long as I'm consistent, my drops in dosage will be right.

Taper from Cymbalta, Paxil, Prozac & Antipsychotics finished June 2012.

Xanax 5% Taper - (8/12 - .5 mg) - (9/12 - .45) - (10/12 - .43) - (11/12 - .41) - (12/12 - .38)

My Paxil Website

My Intro

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Yes, consistency is the key.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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  • 2 months later...
alexjuice

I need to get a 0.5 ml oral syringe to measure out my liquid Mirtazapine which only comes on the UK in 66ml/15 mg size. Hence my starting dose of 7.5mg = 0.49 ml.

 

I have tried every supplier but the smallest dosing syringe they do is 1ml which is no good for me at the lower doses.

 

I think I read a thread of Alto's which said you can buy this size in the USA.

 

I don't know how to get hold of one and wondered if any kind US person could get me a couple and mail them to me. Obviously I would reimburse. Unless anyone has any other suggestions?

 

Thanks anyway.

 

Angel

 

Hi Angel,

 

I'm a tad confused, pardon me, but the dose is 15mg per 66ml of liquid?

 

Or ... maybe something gets lost across the Atlantic via conversion but it seems to me that a 1ml syringe would be effective. What am I missing?

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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I hope I'm not misunderstanding your concern, but hope this might be helpful:

 

I'm on a w/d group for another type of med that does extremely small cuts microtapering, although I'm on a steady dose and can't start actually tapering yet.

 

When diluting the med into a liquid form, they dilute it was much as necessary so that they can use a 1 ml syringe to make cuts as low as thousandths of a mg. The key is diluting the liquid to the degree that you can accurately measure a volume of liquid containing such low doses of the active ingredient in a measurable amount of liquid (i.e., change the ratio).

 

I have no experience with mirtazepine so I leave it to the others here to help you with this and to make sure what I posted is relevant to your needs.

I was "TryingToGetWell" (aka TTGW) on paxilprogress. I also was one of the original members here on Surviving Antidepressants

 

I had horrific and protracted withdrawal from paxil, but now am back to enjoying life with enthusiasm to the max, some residual physical symptoms continued but largely improve. The horror, severe derealization, anhedonia, akathisia, and so much more, are long over.

 

My signature is a temporary scribble from year 2013. I'll rewrite it when I can.

 

If you want to read it, click on http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/209-brandy-anyone/?p=110343

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Altostrata

You can use a 1mL syringe, Angel. It measures as accurately as a .5mL syringe.

 

For more info, read the above topic.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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  • Administrator
Altostrata

I've got an oral syringe. Now how do I get the liquid out of the bottle?

 

If you're medication is in a bottle, you have 2 choices:

 

1) From the pharmacy, get a special cap for the bottle that has a hole in it. The syringe fits in this hole; you tip the bottle upside down to draw from it. See

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-using-an-oral-syringe-and-other-tapering-techniques/page__view__findpost__p__2284

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-using-an-oral-syringe-and-other-tapering-techniques/page__view__findpost__p__24470

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-using-an-oral-syringe-and-other-tapering-techniques/page__view__findpost__p__21391

 

2) Pour your liquid into a small container with a wide mouth, into which you may stick your syringe and draw from the middle of the liquid, see http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-using-an-oral-syringe-and-other-tapering-techniques/page__view__findpost__p__21156

 

This is sloppier, harder to measure, and you probably will get bubbles in the syringe. To get them out, see http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-using-an-oral-syringe-and-other-tapering-techniques/page__view__findpost__p__23049

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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  • 1 month later...

The most precise oral syringe?

 

The best oral syringes I've found, with the clearest markings, are from the Danish company Baxa. They are called ExactaMed oral syringes (with a non Luer tip).

[*]If your compounding pharmacy does not carry them, you might be able to write Baxa and ask where they can be found http://www.baxa.com/exactamed/

[*]Baxa offers free samples here http://www.baxa.com/exactamed/downloads.html You might be able to get your pharmacist (or doctor or nurse) to request 5mL, 3mL, 1mL, and .5mL oral syringes for you.

You do not need a prescription to get oral syringes, although pharmacy supply sites may require that you be a business to make an order.

 

Links no longer valid. New link is http://www.baxa.com/pharmacy-workflow/oralentertal.html

Didn't see any info about free samples though.

This one seems like it would be just as good, and probably available at any drugstore.

http://www.amazon.com/Ezy-Dose-Syringes-Dosage-Korcs/dp/B000VCF6FG/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_3?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1371523733&sr=1-3-fkmr0&keywords=exactamed+oral+syringe+5mL

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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  • 1 month later...

If there are only 5 ticks between each marking, how exactly do you measure .05 ml?

 

Here's a nice large picture of a 1 ml syringe:

 

http://www.healthaccessories.com/products/1-ml-oral-syringe

 

Oh I just figured it out! Duh! .05 ml is half of .1 ml

But what if you then have to measure out something like 2.46?  or 2.07? It seems it would just be simpler to either round it off or get a .05 syringe.

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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  • Administrator

Correct.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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I'm having trouble working out the figures for my liquid taper. 

 

My capsules are 75mg and they average 400 beads. I am on 4 beads so that's 1/100 of a capsule. 

 

Liquid is 10ml per 75mg. I have 1ml syringes. I think I'm going to have to dilute it, 

My head is aching with trying to work it out, I can't find a mark on the syringe for a small enough dose on 4 beads, 

how on earth will I manage when I get to less than 1?  What would I dilute with? any suggestions?

 

Hi, I can help you figure it out since I just figured it out with the help of my pharmacist.  

Ok, so you are only taking 4 beads of Effexor now and just now switching to liquid?

 

FYI - I strongly recommend to have your pharmacist DYE your liquid Effexor solution to red, it makes it so much easier to measure accurately.

And now, the numbers.  So, if

400 beads =10 ml (divided by 10, you get:)

40 beads =1 ml  (divided by 10 again, and you get:)

4 beads = .1 ml  (.1 ml is marked on the 1 ml syringe)

Then, divide by 4 and you get:

1 bead = .025 ml (which is slightly more than each tick on the syringe)

 

.1 ml is made up of 5 ticks each equivalent to .02 ml (.02, .04, .06, .08)

The 1 ml syringe is too large to measure out .025 ml, you can position the syringe plunger in between the ticks to add or subtract .01 ml or to get .01, .03, .05., .07, or .09. 

 

If you  need to make even smaller adjustments, you'll have to get a .5 ml syringe.  You can probably ask your pharmacist to order you one.

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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It's really hard to find a site on the web that sells .5 ml oral syringe and just one to boot. But I found one:

http://www.bug-de-lite.com/Products%20Page.html

 

I still think, the simplest way to obtain a .5 ml/cc oral syringe is to just ask your pharmacist to get one for you.  Insulin syringes are typically .5, so the pharmacist can just take out the needle from one of those.  Or stop by any pet clinic and ask for one there.

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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Thank you Lilu, that is very helpful, my poor brain just couldn't work that out! 

It seems ludicrous that we need to go to such tiny doses but even at those levels

it makes a huge difference to withdrawal.  I was going to wait till my next drop before

starting the liquid but have decided to start on the .1 ml for a while to get used to it

before dropping and get some .5ml syringes .

It is a good idea to switch to liquid to have your body adjust.  I just completed my first week on liquid Lexapro, and definitely noticed some symptoms that were not there before.  I don't know if it was just the switch or the reduction or both. But I went into the taper right away, and it would have been a good a idea to just try out the same dose as the tablets for at least a week.  

 

Also, I'm wondering if it's possible that the liquid is actually stronger than the pills? I've read numerous times people reporting feeling a difference when switching from a brand to a generic or from one generic to another.  Either way, it's definitely an adjustment period.

 

Oh and a question for you - does Effexor now come in a liquid or did you have it made at a compounding pharmacy?

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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  • Administrator

The liquid is absorbed faster than tablets.

 

Effexor XR cannot be made into a liquid.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Alto, in general, is the rate of absorption highly dependent on the particular diluent, or is there little difference as long as it is a liquid... Lexi had a miserable time when she went to liquid Ativan from tablets as mixed by her compounding pharmacist.  If she mixes tablets with water herself, might she have an easier time?  I'll ask Lexi what her pharmacist used but I can't locate the name of the particular diluent on the moment.

 

As it stands now, Lexi had to go back to Ativan tablets, and now her doc is proposing she switch to klonopin tabs, which of course need a liquid taper as well, though with milk as a diluent.  It all seems to be between the Devil and the Deep Blue.

 

Thanks!

 

Edit.. PS, Lexi, when you read this would you respond with the name of the diluent the pharmacist used?

As always, LISTEN TO YOUR BODY! A proud supporter of the 10% (or slower) rule.

 

Requip - 3/16 ZERO  Total time on 25 years.

 

Lyrica: 8/15 ZERO Total time on 7 or 8 yrs.

BENZO FREE 10/13 (started tapering 7/10)  Total time on 25 years.

 

Read my intro thread here, and check the about me section.  "No matter how cynical you get, it's almost impossible to keep up." Lily Tomlin

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

 

Thank you Lilu, that is very helpful, my poor brain just couldn't work that out! 

It seems ludicrous that we need to go to such tiny doses but even at those levels

it makes a huge difference to withdrawal.  I was going to wait till my next drop before

starting the liquid but have decided to start on the .1 ml for a while to get used to it

before dropping and get some .5ml syringes .

It is a good idea to switch to liquid to have your body adjust.  I just completed my first week on liquid Lexapro, and definitely noticed some symptoms that were not there before.  I don't know if it was just the switch or the reduction or both. But I went into the taper right away, and it would have been a good a idea to just try out the same dose as the tablets for at least a week.  

 

Also, I'm wondering if it's possible that the liquid is actually stronger than the pills? I've read numerous times people reporting feeling a difference when switching from a brand to a generic or from one generic to another.  Either way, it's definitely an adjustment period.

 

Oh and a question for you - does Effexor now come in a liquid or did you have it made at a compounding pharmacy?

 

Effexor is available in a liquid, my doctor gave me the prescription. I just remembered that I am supposed to take it 4 times a day.

I've ordered .5 syringes so will wait for those so I can divide the dose.  

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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Effexor XR cannot be made into a liquid.

The liquid version of Effexor is just generic venlafaxine, which is probably why  MammaP said that she has to take it 4 times per day. It looks like it's not available in the US. Mamma P is in the UK, I guess it's available there.  

http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cder/ndc/results.cfm?searchfield=venlafaxine&searchtype=ActiveIngredient&OrderBy=SubstanceName

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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The liquid is absorbed faster than tablets.

This really sucks. I had not anticipated that just switching from tablet to liquid would produce withdrawal side effects. It almost seems that the liquid is not as potent as the tablets? 

 

 

Lilu... do you know if the pharmacist is using the same generic or brand name you were previously?  If not, you may be experiencing WD from a differing dosage strength in addition to the effect Alto commented on.

 

 

It was all generic Lexapro, and each dose was from a different manufacturer. 10mg from one, 5 mg from another, and liquid from  yet a third.

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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  • Administrator

The variations in manufacturer may be the reason for the apparent variation in strength.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Hi Sky, the Compounding Pharmacy used Sorbitol,

and Propylene Glycol.

It completely messed me up, it stopped my brain from being able to form words,

or be able to write words. Everything was scrambled..

Also, I had blurry eyes, to where I could not see a thing, and overall it exacerbated my symptoms.

Truly a frightening time!!

Hello,
I am tapering Lorazepam, and my daily dose is 1.125 mgs.

I followed a long hold for 5 months, ( Nov-March 2019) hoping to find some stability, 

but it did not work. So I resumed my taper and hold pattern.
For the last 3 years, I have been using a daily microtaper, cutting .001mgs per day, with holds as needed.
Symptoms are head pressure, labored breathing, palpitations, abrupt surges of dizziness, this being my worst symptom for now, internal tremors, my latest nemesis, unsteadiness, anxiety, plus many other symptoms that cycle in, and cycle out consistently. Not a day passes, without grief :(

I take no other meds.

January 2013 - 15 day quick taper off 10 mgs of Lexapro, and 25 mgs of Sertraline,

at a detox clinic.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I started my liquid this morning and this is how I am doing it. 

 

.1ml is such a tiny amount to divide into 4 doses per day so I experimented a bit.

I settled on this......draw up .1 ml into a 1ml syringe, then draw up water to .8ml.

I then tapped and shook the syringe until it was mixed ( blue food colouring 

helps to see properly)  I then squirted .2ml onto a spoon and left the rest in the

syringe for later as it is prescribed to be taken 4x daily. I feel this is probably

the best way for me, having the full days dose in the syringe means I won't

forget whether I've had it or not, and I can put it in an old thermometer tube I have

and take it with me when I go out. Hopefully this method will work well for me.

Can anyone see if it might be a problem?  

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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cymbaltawithdrawal5600

To me, this sounds absolutely brilliant! I often read 'tapering' comments and the thought often occurred to me that 'why not add more diluent and then measure THAT out smaller' would work. 'Out of the box' thinking.......

 

The only problem I can see with 'micro' doses is not being able to reclaim that which is left on the spoon. Is there any way to skip the spoon step? (my brain is mushy right now and I have no 'tapering' experience).

What happened and how I arrived here: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4243-cymbaltawithdrawal5600-introduction/#entry50878

 

July 2016 I have decided to leave my story here at SA unfinished. I have left my contact information in my profile for anyone who wishes to talk to me. I have a posting history spanning nearly 4 years and 3000+ posts all over the site.

 

Thank you to all who participated in my recovery. I'll miss talking to you but know that I'll be cheering you on from the sidelines, suffering and rejoicing with you in spirit, as you go on in your journey.

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The way I'm doing it needs the spoon really, but at least I lick it to make sure I have it all.

I tried decanting into a little container before diluting but reckoned that too much would be lost

as you say, that is why I chose the spoon. 

It's 3 hours since I took my first dose and now I have that awful feeling behind the eyes that 

usually comes with withdrawal and feel quite nauseous too but it can't be withdrawal already

and must be side effects. I felt fine before taking it! 

Not sure when to take the next, it's probably best to take it every 6 hours to keep it steady.

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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  • 6 months later...

These look exactly like 1mL Baxa syringes http://www.amazon.com/Sklar-Luer-Slip-tip-Syringe-10-pack/dp/B00EFYQ830/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1383097047&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=sklar+syringe (Thanks to our member Lilu.) After a bit of hunting, I found the Basik / Sklar syringes are made in Denmark, and pet nurturers like them for their accuracy and durability. Here they are even cheaper http://www.henryspets.com/sklar-o-ring-syringe-1-cc/ http://store.birdiebitsnbites.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=284   The Danish company Baxa was purchased by Baxter, which still calls the Baxa-type syringes Exactamed syringes. http://www.baxterbiopharmasolutions.com/oral-dosing-devices-accessories/oral-dosing-devices.html   You may be able to get oral syringes locally from a compounding pharmacy, veterinarian, or medical supply store. Ask for a syringe WITHOUT the needle. Tuberculin or insulin syringe with a non-luer tip (aka luer-slip or plain tip) come in the 1mL size.   I've bought these in packs of 10 from a medical supply store. They were very inexpensive. Phone the medical supply store first to see what they have.   In the US, in  most places you are not required to have a prescription to purchase a syringe.   The Becton Dickinson syringes are okay but not as precise as the Exactamed syringes.   Here is a source in the UK http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BD-Syringe-Dispenser-For-Oral-Drug-Use-With-Tap-Cap-Like-Baxa-1ml-3ml-5ml-10ml-/151114428586   It's not clear whether these are Baxa or Becton Dickinson. The photo looks like Becton Dickinson.

 

You know, I did buy these, and I can't use them. The tip is too narrow and doesn't fit the adapter.  Also, because the gradations are at .01 ml, it's really hard to measure accurately - they're just too closer together. Maybe I'll invest in a  syringe magnifier.  But I also don't like that the gradations are marked as 0.X instead of just .X. Because of this you can only see EITHER the gradation or the number. Since when the syringe is turned toward the gradations you see a big 0 instead of the number next to it.

This has been such a pain... the free syringes that the pharmacy gives me don't fit snuggly into the bottle adaptor, and if I don't press the syringe tight against the bottle, I wind up with spills. It really is a maneuvering challenge, especially when you're trying to read the damn tiny lines.  Uggggghhhhhh!  And I have a year more of this bs to go through. Rats!

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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If anyone wants tips on how to use pipettes instead of syringes, let me know. They're much bigger so it's easier to read the gradations I think, although I haven't tried the syringes. I use a 10 mL pipette and a 5 mL, marked in gradations of 1 mL and 0.1 mL. If you want smaller gradations of course you have to use a smaller pipette.

 

Basically it's the same as a syringe, just that instead of drawing up using a plunger type thing, you get a "pipettor" or "pipette filler" which draws the liquid up using suction.

 

Here, in case I don't get back here soon (I'm pretty frazzled in withdrawal right now), some links.

 

Picture of serological pipettes (that's the kind you want for this):http://www.truelinelab.com/sites/www.truelinelab.com/files/product-images/Pipettes2.jpg?slideshow=true&slideshowAuto=false&slideshowSpeed=4000&speed=350&transition=fade

 

Pipette filler, one kind: http://www.sciencelabsupplies.com/Pipette_Pipet_Pump_Green_10_ml.html

 

or another kind: http://www.sciencelabsupplies.com/Pipette_Filler_Black.html

 

Let me know if you want me to start a topic on pipettes, if there's enough interest.

 

Edit to add: It's easiest to shop websites designed for students, science fairs and that sort of thing. Stay away from the big sites that market to institutions, hospitals and the like, their stuff is too expensive and mostly only available in large quantities.

I like this site:

http://www.hometrainingtools.com/search.asp?ss=pipettes&x=0&y=0

and the one above with the photos of pipette fillers. Pretty much any site designed for science fair type consumers is good though. And I think you can get them on Amazon too.

 

Edit 2: It looks like they're calling those fillers "pipette pumps." Those are the easiest to learn to use.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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  • 2 months later...

 

These look exactly like 1mL Baxa syringes http://www.amazon.com/Sklar-Luer-Slip-tip-Syringe-10-pack/dp/B00EFYQ830/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1383097047&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=sklar+syringe (Thanks to our member Lilu.) After a bit of hunting, I found the Basik / Sklar syringes are made in Denmark, and pet nurturers like them for their accuracy and durability. Here they are even cheaper http://www.henryspets.com/sklar-o-ring-syringe-1-cc/ http://store.birdiebitsnbites.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=284   The Danish company Baxa was purchased by Baxter, which still calls the Baxa-type syringes Exactamed syringes. 

 

You know, I did buy these, and I can't use them. The tip is too narrow and doesn't fit the adapter.  Also, because the gradations are at .01 ml, it's really hard to measure accurately - they're just too closer together. Maybe I'll invest in a  syringe magnifier.  But I also don't like that the gradations are marked as 0.X instead of just .X. Because of this you can only see EITHER the gradation or the number. Since when the syringe is turned toward the gradations you see a big 0 instead of the number next to it.

This has been such a pain... the free syringes that the pharmacy gives me don't fit snuggly into the bottle adaptor, and if I don't press the syringe tight against the bottle, I wind up with spills. It really is a maneuvering challenge, especially when you're trying to read the damn tiny lines.  Uggggghhhhhh!  And I have a year more of this bs to go through. Rats!

 

 

I found a way to use the Danish made blue 1 ml syringes.  I bought a small empty travel bottle in Walmart; It has a flip top, and these Sklar syringes fit perfectly in the hole of the cap.  So I just poured some of the liquid medicine in there, and voila - no more spills!

 

PS I bought these from Henry Pets, and they came in a pack of 10 - each one is individually sealed.  If anyone needs one or two, I'd be happy to put them in the mail for you...if you are in the USA, it'll just be the price of a stamp for me, so no big deal.  I've only used one so far, and I'm down to .6 ml of my medication. So, I have 8 unused syringes, for anyone who wants them. Just message me here with your name/mailing address.  

2005-2008: Effexor; 1/2008 Tapered 3 months, then quit. 7/2008-2009 Reinstated Effexor (crying spells at start of new job.)
2009-3/2013: Switched to Pristiq 50 mg then 100 mg
3/2013: Switched to Lexapro 10mg. Cut down to 5 mg. CT for 2 weeks then reinstated for 6 weeks
8/2013-8/2014: Tapering Lexapro (Lots of withdrawal symptoms)
11/2014 -8/2015: Developed severe insomnia and uncontrollable daily crying spells
12/2014-6/2015: Tried Ambien, Klonopin,Ativan, Lunesta, Sonata, Trazadone, Seroquel, Rameron, Gabapentin - Developed Anxiety disorder, PTSD, and Psychogenic Myoclonus
7/2015-1/2016: Reinstated Lexapro 2 mg (mild improvement, but crying spells still present)

1/2016-5/2017: Lexapro 5 mg ( helped a lot, but poor stress tolerance & depressive episodes)

5/20/2017 - Raised dose to Lexapro 10 mg due to lingering depression(Total of 2 failed tapers & severe PAWS)

9/11/2018 - Present: Still on 10 mg Lexapro and mostly recovered.(Extremely sensitive to stress which triggers Myoclonus.)

Intro page: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4149-lilu-depression-worsened-by-meds/

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Altostrata

Thank you so much, Lilu. Those are the best syringes I found.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • Administrator

Yes, using a precise amount of liquid to make your suspension is very important in titration. See How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 5 months later...

The pharmacy gave me a BD 5mL Syringe with Luer Lok tip today.  Pictured here

http://www.vitalitymedical.com/5-ml-syringes-without-needle.html?gclid=CMLasuHOqMICFdNj7AodRAMATA

 

I noticed on the back of the packaging that it says "not for oral use"

 

Does this matter? I will be using it for my liquid taper.

Prozac 1999-2009 quit semi cold turkey.

 

2012 Placed on Seroquel 25 mg, Tranxene (Clorezepate) 3.75 mg 3x a day, Remeron 30 mg for anxiety/akathesia.

 

Weaned off Seroquel and Tranxene .to Remeron 15 Mg.

In May 2014 tried quitting Remeron at its lowest dose. Had severe withdrawals.Reinstated Remeron at 30 mg by doctor. August 5 2014 entered hospital. Doctor pulled the Remeron and bridged it to Pamelor (Nortriptyline) 40mg and Zyprexa 2.5mg.After removing the Remeron all my bad symptoms went away and I am stable.

 

9/11/14 - 7.5 mg tranxene, 40mg Pamelor, Zyprexa 2.5mg

12/29/14 -  20mg Pamelor, 1/6/15,  7/31/15 3.5mg, 8/10/15 3.2 mg, 9/15/15 2.2mg, 10/15/15 1.8mg

(Feb 2016 - 1.4mg Pamelor only -  OFF OF TRANXENE AND ZYPREXA SINCE DEC 2014 BENZO FREE Since 2014. Nortrityline (Pamelor) .8mg Aug 2016

March 2017 DRUG FREE

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Hello, dear Chicken,

 

I will defer to other more scientific types for the definitive answer, but the syringe pictured looks a lot like the syringe I use to dose my solutions. I'm just using an old veterinarian syringe left over from when I had to give medicine to pet bunnies :0) . 

 

I can't say about the "not for oral use" disclaimer, but I wouldn't think it would matter to what you are doing.

 

If I recall correctly, I think one of the most important factors in making homemade solutions is to maintain consistency in the equipment used so that, even if (for instance) 5 ml on the syringe you are using is 5.05 ml on someone else's syringe, your own measurements will be consistent and true to the equipment you are using. 

 

But, let another more knowledgeable than I weigh in...

 

I'm pulling for ya... You're on the path to full recovery!

 

Oh, how I long for the day I can copy and paste the part of your signature that reads "After removing the Remeron all my bad symptoms went away and I am stable" and use it for my own. Here's hoping....!

04/2013 diagnoses: severe insomnia, major depressive disorder, anxiety disorder, agoraphobia. PTSD (my diagnosis)

Original scripts: 30 mg mirtazapine (Remeron) (1x day), 75 mg Bupropion HCL (Wellbutrin) (2x day), and 0.5 lorazepam (1x day or as needed)

05/05/14: Onset of acute Wellbutrin withdrawal symptoms after haphazard "taper" of 6-8 wks.

05/10/14: Joined this site.

05/11/14: Reinstated approx. 25 mg Wellbutrin (1x day)

05/14/14: Switched to 12.5 mg Wellbutrin (2x day)

06/28/14: Changed lorazepam dosing to .25 mg 2x a day - seems to be reducing anxiety flare-ups

07/28/14: Dosing Wellbutrin in a (home made) solution form 12.5 mg (2x day) 08/15/14: Remeron 28 25.2 22.7 20.5 18.5 16.7 15.1 13.6 mg (home made) solution

05/16/15: Have been dosing lorazepam at .5 mg in the morning, .25 mg in the afternoon, and .25 mg at bedtime. Anxiety has increased somewhat, possibly due to tolerance.

 

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • Administrator

It probably says "not for oral use" because this syringe is intended to be fitted with a needle.

 

The plastic body is the same as an oral syringe. I wouldn't think using this syringe for oral liquids would be a problem.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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Thanks alto. I wanted to make sure before I used it. I found several others of different sizes at a compounding pharmacy.

 I plan to order these

http://www.henryspets.com/sklar-o-ring-syringe-1-cc/

http://www.healthaccessories.com/liquid-meds-tools-oral-syringes/1-ml-oral-syringe

 

You had them listed and I checked them out. They look great for micro tapers.

Prozac 1999-2009 quit semi cold turkey.

 

2012 Placed on Seroquel 25 mg, Tranxene (Clorezepate) 3.75 mg 3x a day, Remeron 30 mg for anxiety/akathesia.

 

Weaned off Seroquel and Tranxene .to Remeron 15 Mg.

In May 2014 tried quitting Remeron at its lowest dose. Had severe withdrawals.Reinstated Remeron at 30 mg by doctor. August 5 2014 entered hospital. Doctor pulled the Remeron and bridged it to Pamelor (Nortriptyline) 40mg and Zyprexa 2.5mg.After removing the Remeron all my bad symptoms went away and I am stable.

 

9/11/14 - 7.5 mg tranxene, 40mg Pamelor, Zyprexa 2.5mg

12/29/14 -  20mg Pamelor, 1/6/15,  7/31/15 3.5mg, 8/10/15 3.2 mg, 9/15/15 2.2mg, 10/15/15 1.8mg

(Feb 2016 - 1.4mg Pamelor only -  OFF OF TRANXENE AND ZYPREXA SINCE DEC 2014 BENZO FREE Since 2014. Nortrityline (Pamelor) .8mg Aug 2016

March 2017 DRUG FREE

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Both good choices, chicken. The ones with the blue marking (Baxa) are better, if you can get them.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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  • 1 month later...

I switched over from Prozac in caps to liquid prozac from the pharmacy.

At the time I switched I did not drop the dose but had a severe WD reaction anyway.

I don't think the math was wrong in switching from grams to  liquid mLs because I had a mathematician friend

figure it out and he calibrated the dose taking into account weight of the gelatin capsule etc.etc.

Now I'm wondering if the prozac liquid s the same strength as the powder. Is there any way I can find that out?

Also, since I'm doing micro-tapering, the one drop I have done since switching to liquid was just 0.1 mL but had a strong

WD reaction. It was sudden and faster arriving than any other drop. Because 0.01 is half way between two small lines

on the 1 mL syringe there is a tiny bit of guesswork. Could that miniscule amount of  possible error have an effect?

On 20 mg of Prozac for about ten years. Sept 2012 started reducing 10% a drop using gram scale, with average of one month holds.

When I'd reached the half way mark, taking 10 mg  powder out of the 20 mg capsules, I switched over to 10 mg capsules and cutting

down from those. Withdrawals got harder the lower I dropped.  May 2013 changed to 5% drops, holding until all withdrawal symptoms gone.

January 2015 changed to liquid prozac (concentration of 20MG per 5 mL) using a 1mL oral syringe.

Current dose of fluoxetine solution equivalent 3.4 mg. Any effort to drop below this has been disastrous so for the time being I'm staying at this level.
Adding 200 mg Tryptophan and 200 GABA a day has helped with anxiety.
Also take 1,300mg Omega- 3,  875mg  Magnesium, 1800mg Curcumin, 1000mg Vit C, 5000 Vit D.
 

 

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People do have reactions when switching to liquid, or switching between brands of drugs. We are sensitive to variations that it doesn't take much to upset things. I would have a long hold before making any more changes to give your body time to get used to the change to liquid. 

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Administrator

Insulin syringes are widely available at very little cost. In the US, you do not need a prescription for them. Remove the needles, as mammaP did, to use as oral syringes (dispose of the needles safely).

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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