gciv: advice needed - Lexapro

[gciv]

Hello, 

 

First, I would like to say that I am consider to start lexapro journey due to my social anxiety which in most cases results in facial and neck blushing which makes me more anxious.  It's my main problem, mostly in new situations or public speaking. I take inderal (beta blocker) right now but only as needed - maybe should try taking it everyday? Psychiatrist told me to try lexapro for a while (2-3 years) 5 mg to 10 mg maximum but I am a bit scared to start this journey. I know you have been through this, please let me know is this even worth trying considering all possible side effects and withdrawal which for sure will be hell ? Is there any routine (diet, suplements, exercising, meditation you name it) you can implent while taking SSRI that will minimize negative symptoms while taking and during withdrawal? I am really confused but I would like to take a breath and see how it would be without my symptoms. I know this post is not about withdrawal but you are the one who know this drugs best from both good and bad side. 

 

Thanks for helping, 

 

[ChessieCat]

Hello and welcome to SA,

 

It's really good that you have decided to research about drugs before you start taking them.  We are not able to advise you an whether to take a drug or not or about which drug would be good/not good to take and the decision about whether you do is one only you can make.

 

However, here is some information which might help you to make an informed decision.

 

The website drugs.com is a good place to get information about drugs including drug interactions.

 

Q:  Have you seen a counsellor who can teach you skills to help overcome your anxiety?

 

SA strongly encourages our members to learn and to use Non-drug techniques.  Not many people are taught/learn life coping skills, self soothing techniques, self talk and CBT etc.  I'm 63 and have only learned most of these types of skills in the last 5 or so years.  I really wish that I had learned them when I was young.

 

This site has some excellent self help resources (scroll down for links to various topics) including the First Aid for Panic mp3s:

 

Audio:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes) Female voice - getselfhelp.co.uk
 

Audio:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes) Male voice - getselfhelp.co.uk

 

https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/selfhelp.htm

 

Dr Claire Weekes was an Australia doctor who suffered from and taught ways to cope with anxiety:

 

dr-claire-weekes-method

 

Audio:  How to Recover from Anxiety - Dr Claire Weekes

 

I suggest that you watch these videos.  Gwen Olsen was a pharmaceutical representative for 15 years:

 

Interview:  Confessions of an Rx Drug Pusher (51 minutes Gwen Olsen - ex pharmaceutical representative)
 

Video:  Ex-Big Pharma Rep:  We’re Trained To Misinform -The Drugs ARE Dangerous (6 minute video)
 

Video:  Ex-Big Pharma Rep:  Manipulating Doctors to Sell More Drugs (10 minute video)

 

Two very good books are:

• Anatomy of an Epidemic by Robert Whitaker - this book explains the history of psychiatric drugs
• Your Drug May Be Your Problem by Dr Peter Breggin

 

This information really surprised me:

 

Antidepressants and the Placebo Effect by Irving Kirsch (link to full article)

Abstract:

Antidepressants are supposed to work by fixing a chemical imbalance, specifically, a lack of serotonin in the brain.  Indeed, their supposed effectiveness is the primary evidence for the chemical imbalance theory.  But analyses of the published data and the unpublished data that were hidden by drug companies reveals that most (if not all) of the benefits are due to the placebo effect.  Some antidepressants increase serotonin levels, some decrease it, and some have no effect at all on serotonin.  Nevertheless, they all show the same therapeutic benefit.  Even the small statistical difference between antidepressants and placebos may be an enhanced placebo effect, due to the fact that most patients and doctors in clinical trials successfully break blind.  The serotonin theory is as close as any theory in the history of science to having been proved wrong.  Instead of curing depression, popular antidepressants may induce a biological vulnerability making people more likely to become depressed in the future.

Excerpt:

How Did These Drugs Get Approved?
....
The FDA requires two adequately conducted clinical trials showing a significant difference between drug and placebo.  But there is a loophole:  there is no limit to the number of trials that can be conducted in search of these two significant trials.  Trials showing negative results simply do not count.  Furthermore, the clinical significance of the findings is not considered.  All that matters is that the results are statistically significant.
....
(NB:  emphasis in abstract and excerpt are mine)

[gciv]

Huge thanks for the tons of the materials. I will check them for sure. I am aware that you won't decide for me whether it's worth to start AD or not but I want to make concious decision not only based on psychiatrist advice. Unfortunatelly, I have got an impression that ADs are only that they can offer but with no answer regarding real price for taking them. 

 

Is it possible to lessen bad influence of the ADs by diet, exercise etc.? 

 

Have a great day, 

[ChessieCat]

10 hours ago, gciv said:

Is it possible to lessen bad influence of the ADs by diet, exercise etc.?

 

I doubt it very much, due to how psychiatric drugs work.  When a psychiatric drug is stopped too quickly, a person can experience withdrawal symptoms and the only known way of easing the withdrawal symptoms is for the person to take a small amount of the drug to which their brain has adapted.  Here is a list of possible withdrawal symptoms.  Please note the vast number and the wide variety:

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

 

It might be better, instead of introducing a drug that you don't know how it will affect you, to at least start by working on diet, exercise, relaxation techniques and the skills I mentioned previously, instead of taking a psychiatric drug.

 

One thing that psychiatric drugs do in most instances is to numb your emotions.  And they can also affect your sex drive, and in some instances can cause sexual dysfunction.  For some people this may not be an issue, but for other people it is can be a major problem and can lead to them feeling very desperate. 

 

When we take a psychiatric drug, we are adding chemical/s to the brain.  The brain then has to change to adapt to getting the chemical/s.  It might have to change something to do with A and then once that change has been made it affects B so another change has to be made and so on down the line.  It is a chain reaction, a domino effect.  The same thing happens when we take the drug away.  That's why it's possible to experience such a vast array of withdrawal symptoms, and they can change, and be of different intensity.

 

Please note that I am not anti-psychiatric drugs.  However, I do think that it is better to try to find non drug alternatives and that psychiatric drugs be a last resort if all other avenues fail.  I've been on an AD for about half my life (I'm 63) and I believe that if I had received appropriate counselling, been taught non drug coping skills and been supported appropriately that I would not have become so desperate and ended up on a psychiatric drug.

 

And just in case you think that people need psychiatric drugs because of a chemical imbalance please see this topic.  The chemical imbalance is a myth and was disproven at least 20 years ago.

 

again-chemical-imbalance-is-a-myth-stop-the-lies-please

 

Oh, yes, and another thing.  Even if you do find a drug that helps with your issue, it doesn't necessarily mean that you can go merrily on your way taking the same drug/dose for the rest of your life.  In some cases a drug will reach tolerance, also known as poop out.  This happened to me after I had taken citalopram for many years.  It happens very gradually so you don't notice it.  Until I was doing okay and then bam I experienced several major life stressors in a short period of time (~6 months) and I ended up having a major breakdown.  At the time I couldn't understand why I wasn't able to cope, but found out about poop out after joining SA and realised that was what had happened to me.  When poop out happens the doctor might just increase the drug dose, but then that dose will no longer be enough and a higher dose will be given.  Or a switch will be made to a different drug.  Not many medical professionals know about drug withdrawal/side effects/adverse effects of psychiatric drugs.  I think that there would be even fewer who know the best way to switch/bridge a person from one drug to another.  When changing drugs you can end up experiencing withdrawal from the old drug (even if it is not longer working), start up/side effects/adverse reaction to the new drug.  It is difficult to work out what is what because of there being two different drugs involved.

 

The other thing that might happen if poop out occurs is that the doctor ends up adding in a new drug.  This may or may not be after increasing the dose of the first drug.  Not all doctors check the drug interaction when adding a new drug.  We have seen members here on very dangerous drug combinations which the doctors should never have given their patient. 

 

tolerance-or-poop-out-or-tachyphylaxis

 

I will tell you about my own experience with psychiatric drugs which might help you to understand why I am biased towards non drug methods.  I stopped citalopram (the drug that pooped out) cold turkey because I didn't know about withdrawal.  I felt great, and I mean really great for about 2-3 months afterwards.  Then I got hit with withdrawal (but didn't know it at the time) and was bedridden for 2.5 weeks, couldn't eat and lost 8kgs.  It was similar to the flu but was different and I now know it was withdrawal.  When I saw my counsellor she told me that I needed an AD like a diabetic needs insulin and would be on them for life.  My doctor wrote the script for Pristiq 50mg at her suggestion.  I was already on a low dose of blood pressure medication.  I told my counsellor that I still wasn't feeling good on the 50mg and the dose was increased to 100mg.  Shortly afterwards my diastolic blood pressure increased a lot (24 hour halti monitor) and my doctor doubled my blood pressure medication.  He failed to make the connection that the blood pressure increase was caused by the drug increase.  It was only several years later after having lots of different symptoms (but thinking they were related to menopause) that I started looking up side effects of the drug and realised that I probably had mild serotonin syndrome.  When I saw the doctor I told him that if I missed a dose that I would get brain zaps, so because Pristiq is only available in Australia in 50mg and 100mg doses he told me to alternate doses, 50mg one day, 100mg the next (which is not recommended because the brain likes consistency).  Because serotonin syndrome is dose related and I felt so rotten I decided to just reduce to 50mg every day.  For two weeks I experienced extreme cog fog/cotton wool (actually more like mud) brain.  And yes I mean extreme, I am not exaggerating - even walking took all my concentration.  After two weeks I was unable to type.  I've been a professional typist since I left high school so I knew that something was wrong.  I had joined SA a couple of days before and they had suggested that I increase my drug a bit (by cutting the tablet) but I had been trying to research about it, through the brain fog, so that I could make an informed decision.  When I couldn't type I took extra Pristiq.  After only about 4 hours (please note, that is hours, not days and no exaggeration) I was able to type again.  I was amazed at how quickly my head was clearing.  Because I had a benchmark I knew it was because of the drug.

 

Sadly we have generally be brought up to believe that doctors know what they are doing.  But this is not the case.  The drug companies are heavily involved in and that is usually were the doctors get then information about the drugs.  And of course a drug company is a business and has shareholders so they need to make money.

 

You might find it interested to read the experiences of some of the members have had with medical professionals:

 

the-worst-of-doctors-threadstatements-that-defy-belief

 

 

 

[ChessieCat]

@gciv

 

This new podcast has just been made available that you might find interesting:

 

INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder

[ChessieCat]

And this:

 

Video:  Simple Truths About Psychiatry - Series of 10 by Dr Peter Breggin