freeaway: adrenaline rush and withdrawal?

[Altostrata]

On 7/30/2021 at 11:37 AM, freeaway said:

One strange thing I can't seem to figure out is this morning cortisol I feel all day until like 2 to 3pm at work and around 5pm I start my usual WD sytomps peaking until I take my meds again. 

 

You're taking compounded Pristiq only once a day? The timing of these symptoms indicate you are getting interdose withdrawal symptoms ahead of your dose at 6 p.m. 

 

If you break or crush the Pristiq tablet, it more or less becomes immediate-release with a very short half-life. Holding is not going to fix this. It may be best for you to get it compounded in doses to take twice a day, or you might consider gradually converting to venlafaxine (Effexor), desvenlafaxine's sibling drug.

 

You can do this by getting the kind of Effexor XR in a capsule filled with tiny beads, or with venlafaxine IR tablets that you can take twice a day or even make a liquid from if you want to taper with a liquid.

[freeaway]

Thank you very much for your answer and advice @Altostrata.

But my apologies I am still confused with this part when you say interdose and I should consider taking a twice a day instead of once a day wouldn't that make me have same issue twice a day every time I have to take the medicine? So sorry for such stupid question.

 

Also can magnesium make things worst as in nerve pain? I have been using magnesium Magnesium Glycinate - 100% Pure Albion TRAACS Bisglycinate Chelate Supplement - 100 mg once in the morning and once at 4pm. I have been taking magnesium for a bit now but different brand. 

Suddenly I get these random body ache and nerve pain. 

 

[freeaway]

So to avoid interdose effect since I'm on 32.4mg of pristiq by compound ask them to make it split of 32.4mg = and take it twice a day 12 hours apart? 

[Altostrata]

4 hours ago, freeaway said:

So to avoid interdose effect since I'm on 32.4mg of pristiq by compound ask them to make it split of 32.4mg = and take it twice a day 12 hours apart? 

 

Yes, you would take 16.2mg Pristiq twice a day, 12 hours apart, for a total of 32.4mg per day.

 

After you get used to the split dosing schedule, if you are reducing by 10%, the next reduction would be to 14.6mg twice a day (29.16mg per day).

[freeaway]

@Altostrata ok I will try that and keep you posted! 

 

Thank you as always *** hugs ***

[Altostrata]

When you get the new compounded doses, please check in with us so we can talk about how you can make the transition from 32.4mg once a day to split doses.

[freeaway]

Ok ill be ordering my new split dosage this Friday and once I receive it I'll check back. 

 

😉😉

[ChessieCat]

9 hours ago, freeaway said:

But my apologies I am still confused with this part when you say interdose and I should consider taking a twice a day instead of once a day wouldn't that make me have same issue twice a day every time I have to take the medicine? So sorry for such stupid question.

 

I've recently tried explaining interdose withdrawal to another member.  See the posts below:

 

 

 

[freeaway]

@ChessieCat Thank you! 

I have a better understanding now.

Thank you for your help and advice again 🙏 

[freeaway]

I have been feeling this intense body pains with migraines so I did my blood work it shows my WBC is low.

 

Cut off was 3.8 

but it was 3.7 3 months ago 

now 3.6 

 

I'm going to see hematoloist in 3 weeks but wanted to know if this happens to others? 

[Kostas]

I had low wbc ,when taking 20 mg Celexa ,down to 3.7...

Whenever I was out of it ,within 6 months was up to 4.8!

I think I mention it my history ...

Regards

[freeaway]

@Kostas hey thank you for your reply.

I was freaking out a bit and saw some interesting information that the lab value is not so accurate for everyone.

If anything it is better to have low WBC rather than higher. 

Lot of vegan plant based or keto diet people tend to show low WBC.

 

 

I'm still going to see the hemotologist but this was interesting. 

Also this video the doctor quickly mentions hypertension medicine or ANTIDEPRESSANTS can cause low WBC! 

 

 

 

 

[Kostas]

Thanks for the video!

 Please note that wbc are important to be within range ,in order to fight viruses and infections. 

I also have seen haematologist, but he was clueless  ,instructed me to do a lot of tests...

I did nothing ,just reduced the drug and it worked ..

All the best.

[freeaway]

Thank you. 

I will follow up with the doctor and keep things posted.

 

Best luck to you as well with everything!

 

[freeaway]

@Altostrata @ChessieCat @Shep

@brassmonkey

 

Hey, quick question...

I developed new pattern of symptom which is this migrane kind of pain that seems to happen about 2 hours taking my usual dosage. It's pretty intense and it last about 2 to 3 hours.

Only thing that change is the pharmacy where i get my medication compounded. 

It kind got me scared all of sudden thinking what if this pain doesn't stop and even if I go to hospital no doctor will be able to help.

I also read antidepressants can mimic lupus like symptoms. Pretty crazy huh.

 

[Altostrata]

How often does this happen?

 

What time o'clock do you take Pristiq? Do you ingest anything else at the same time? Are you still taking compounded Pristiq once a day?

[freeaway]

Hi Alto, I'm still taking compound pristiq but this pattern of pain never happened before even with compound pristiq for months.

 

I'm still waiting for my medication to come with divided dosages so I can try to take it twice a day to avoid interdose withdrawal.

 

Meantime, I'm currently taking it once a day 6pm. And the burning nerve migrane pain start to kick in 7 to 8pm. It usually last 2 hours. This happens almost every night now for about 3 weeks. 

 

I do take magnesium around the same time as well either before 6pm or after 7pm.

[freeaway]

Last night I felt my bed was shaking and woke me up but obviously it wasn't my bed. I must had severe tremors or my brain had a shock.

 

Anyone had this experience? 

I had this few months back when I cut down 50%. But it happened again even though I'm on hold. We just never know what is going on now.

 

 

[Altostrata]

23 hours ago, freeaway said:

Meantime, I'm currently taking it once a day 6pm. And the burning nerve migrane pain start to kick in 7 to 8pm. It usually last 2 hours. This happens almost every night now for about 3 weeks. 

 

This sounds like dose dumping from Pristiq -- the drug in the capsule is being released too quickly. When will you get your divided doses? That may help.

[freeaway]

I should be arriving sometime this week. Once I receive it I'll reach back.

Yea, this compounding is not like the original tablet so every capsule must be different.

Today my burning migraine was mild so I got a break. 

I even called Pfzer to complain and to seek help with more dosages but of course no such thing.

Prayers is all I can do at this point.

 

 

 

[freeaway]

Hey @Altostrata!

my 2 dosages is being delivered in two days.

I take single dose of Pristiq at 6pm every day.

What is the recommended schedule if I am taking 16.2mg Pristiq twice a day, 12 hours apart, for a total of 32.4mg per day?

I usually wake up 6:30 to 7AM everyday.

 

I must be having side effect from Pristiq. I still have jittery sensation middle of sleep or evening after taking Pristiq and ups and down moods throughout the day. Or maybe it's the tapering I made since last year from 100mg to 32.4mg? 

One thing I can say for sure is Pristiq never made my life any better switching from celexa. Both of them never worked for my anxiety if anything added more problems. 

[Altostrata]

If I were you, I'd take Pristiq a little earlier in the day, perhaps at 4 p.m., so those symptoms will disrupt your sleep less.

 

When you get your divided doses, perhaps you could take them at 7 a.m. and 7 p.m.?

 

On 8/31/2021 at 6:20 PM, freeaway said:

Yea, this compounding is not like the original tablet so every capsule must be different.

 

I don't understand this. It seems to me a month's supply would be 60 identical capsules of 16.2mg each?

[freeaway]

What I'm trying to say is compounded capsules doesn't dissolve equally.

As the pharmacist said they can't make it 100% as the original pristiq and it only has 70% to 80% efficacy maybe explains why I am having difficult withdrawal starting 4pm until I take it at 6pm. 

 

If you don't mind me asking, how are you @Altostrata? 

After all these years of completely coming off and living though this how are you coping with all these scars that can't be reversed? 

If it wasn't my kids I would of gave up on this life long time ago. They are the only reason why I am fighting through this hell.

It's not fair for them to have damaged mother or no mother. Am I just playing too much of a victim?  

 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

48 minutes ago, freeaway said:

What I'm trying to say is compounded capsules doesn't dissolve equally.

 

 

I would not worry about this.

 

I am okay, it's hard losing those years to medical error, but a new chapter in our lives goes on.

[freeaway]

Back to tapering Pristiq

 

Hey @ChessieCat!!! How are you? Congratulations on your completing tapering from Pristiq! You are my inspiration. 

I don't know if you still remember me but I'm here to update and hear how everyone is doing?

 

I paused my tapering last year due to family sickness and now I am back to continue my tapering.

During the holding period of many months my nervous system really settled and I found peace in a way.

Now I understand when you mentioned or the others mentioning importance of slow tapering.

 

I am using the 10% reduction and was hoping if my charts looks reasonable? 

Maybe doing 5% reduction every 2 weeks could be better since change in over all percentage seems to cause more withdrawals. 

 

Also I have made change to my signature. 

 

Thank you for your time and hope to hear from you soon! 

 

05/14/2021	32.40
06/22/2022	29.16
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Edited June 23, 2022 by ChessieCat
added topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

1 hour ago, freeaway said:

I am using the 10% reduction and was hoping if my charts looks reasonable? 

Maybe doing 5% reduction every 2 weeks could be better since change in over all percentage seems to cause more withdrawals. 

 

Q:  What method are you using to get your doses?

 

If a 10% reduction is too much then you can do a smaller %, eg 7.5% or 8%.

 

I don't know if reducing 5% every 2 weeks would be a good idea because it won't give you any leeway to see if you are stable before the next reduction.  And withdrawal symptoms may end up catching up with you down the track.

 

I don't have time to study your reduction plan at this time (off to work) but I think some of your drops may be too large and 0.08mg is too high a dose to jump off from.  The suggested maximum jump off would be 0.025mg.  I went lower, 0.0025mg but I was doing shorter holds, because I had changed my diet at the end of my taper and wanted to reduce the confusion in interpreting any issues.

 

When to end the taper and jump to zero?

 

Here's the link to my full taper.  My full tapering program    I have provided an explanation in that post.  You can see that I went slowly at the end.  Many members find that the lower their dose gets the slower they need to go, reducing less and/or holding longer.  See the links in Post #1 of this topic

 

Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

You might consider doing a 10% Brass Monkey slide taper, which adds in an extra 2 weeks' hold (which is actually 3 weeks on a dose after the last reduction in the cycle):

 

Brass Monkey Slide

[freeaway]

Thank you for your reply.

 

My method is, I get it compounded at the compounding pharmacy and they make it into capsule.

I need to ask them once dosage gets lower how I can get it.

 

The last number you see isn't the jump. I didn't want to drag the whole list lol

But I'm definitely going low as much as possible by following your chart

I just wanted give you an basic idea what dosages I was planning.

 

I will continue to update and let you know how I'm doing.

 

I already have checked out your website and that great YouTube video you recommend. It was quite helpful. 

Thank you 😊 

 

[ChessieCat]

8 hours ago, freeaway said:

My method is, I get it compounded at the compounding pharmacy and they make it into capsule.

 

Q:  If you are taking all capsule/s do you take it twice a day?  I didn't start taking it twice a day until I got under 10mg but in hindsight I should have been dose splitting once I was taking all capsules, which for me was under 50mg because I couldn't get 25mg in Australia.

[ChessieCat]

I've just checked you taper doses and they are correct.  When I glanced at it this morning I wasn't sure that they were 10% or under and wanted to double check it when I had a bit more time.

 

Please don't be in a hurry to get off.  If there are times when you are unwell or there is extra stress in your life, I suggest that you hold on a dose for longer.

 

Think about how much you have reduced your drug by, not how much further you still need to go.  Getting off the drug has nothing to do with how strong or determined you are as a person.  The time it takes to get off is up to how your brain handles the reductions.

 

I have seen quite a few members who have gone too fast and their taper has ended up taking longer than if they had stuck to a 10%/4 week taper and they have had times of discomfort and misery.

[freeaway]

6 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Q:  If you are taking all capsule/s do you take it twice a day?  I didn't start taking it twice a day until I got under 10mg but in hindsight I should have been dose splitting once I was taking all capsules, which for me was under 50mg because I couldn't get 25mg in Australia.

 

I take it once a day at exactly same time which is 6PM.

I start to get these withdrawal symptoms as I get closer to my 6pm medication time. 

Basically I get these brain fog, dizziness, fatigue and even nervousness starting like 4pm and the intensity varies depending on stress, PMS and etc.. and after taking my medication the symptoms disappear gradually but or becomes milder. But it is somewhat tolerable than before when I first started tapering.

I almost feel like I'm an addict who needs the medication just to be stable.

My thought is if the medication is not in the system to begin with I wouldn't need to be feening for my next dose so I need and must come off this drug.

 

I did try splitting the dosages and it was a terrible failure. I had such horrible withdrawal.

Ever since then I just take it once a day.

 

If anyone is reading this I truly want to share a tip which helped me through my taper. As Alto mentioned and others have recommended:

1. Magnesium

 

2. Learning through books by: (This was a life saver)

• David Hanscom M.D. 

He also has a wonderful affordable program called DOCJOURNEY.

He also suffered from panic attacks, anxiety, depression and all kinds of mental health related issues and has amazing methods and tips for others.

• John Ernest Sarno Jr. (The Mindbody Prescription: Healing the Body)

 

He also has a wonderful affordable program called DOCJOURNEY.

He also suffered from panic attacks, anxiety, depression and all kinds of mental health related issues and has amazing methods and tips for others.

 

I am a true believer that my panic disorder started after coming off the meds and I hope people are more aware of this horrific circumstances of coming off antidepressants.