Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 20, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 20, 2021 Hey @marta92, Your average weight is actually 0.138 You need to add all those values and then divide the product by 10 I will help you to get the right dosage - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
marta92 Posted February 20, 2021 Author Share Posted February 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Yesyes123 said: Hey @marta92, Your average weight is actually 0.138 You need to add all those values and then divide the product by 10 I will help you to get the right dosage So the dose should be' 0.007 as brassmonkey said (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 20, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 20, 2021 Hey @marta92 sorry for the delay, I'll be back here to help you with the dosage soon I'm a bit busy. So are you planning to reinstate today? How have you been, any difference? - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 20, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 20, 2021 You're right, the powder should weight 0.007g on the scale. - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 20, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 20, 2021 Here is an explanation sent to me by one of the mods: "Escitalopram is not time-release and can be safely crushed to powder. I used two spoons and crushed the tablet very fine between them. Give the powder a good stir to make sure the active ingredient is well mixed with the filler. I used a powder measuring spoon for this (Google "powder measuring spoon"). Weigh the powder, adding or subtracting powder with the spoon (or you can use tweezers) until you get the weight you want. Pour the powder into a size 0 gelatin capsule. You can do this with a bent post-it. I used 3" square LabExact weighing paper. Save leftover powder in a capsule for future use." - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted February 20, 2021 Moderator Share Posted February 20, 2021 It looks like you only got nine of the numbers added together and then didn't do the final division by 10. I got 1.379 for the total addition and .138 for the average weight. This corresponds with with the calculations we did earlier so your target dose is still 0.007g on the readout of the scales. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
marta92 Posted February 20, 2021 Author Share Posted February 20, 2021 2 hours ago, brassmonkey said: It looks like you only got nine of the numbers added together and then didn't do the final division by 10. I got 1.379 for the total addition and .138 for the average weight. This corresponds with with the calculations we did earlier so your target dose is still 0.007g on the readout of the scales. I managed to make 4 capsules. Honestly the scale was really sensitive and I pray for it to be correct. Also, I've wasted some powder on the table. I don't know if that is a problem. I don't have any other better way to do it. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 21, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 21, 2021 How are you feeling now? Any different? - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
marta92 Posted February 21, 2021 Author Share Posted February 21, 2021 Just now, Yesyes123 said: How are you feeling now? Any different? I'm feeling extremely bad. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 21, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 21, 2021 Did you take one of the pills you made already? Did you crush the pills with the spoon? - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
marta92 Posted February 21, 2021 Author Share Posted February 21, 2021 Just now, Yesyes123 said: Did you take one of the pills you made already? Did you crush the pills with the spoon? I haven't taken a pill yet. I will tomorrow morning. But I think the scale is not extremely accurate. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 21, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 21, 2021 56 minutes ago, marta92 said: I haven't taken a pill yet. I will tomorrow morning. But I think the scale is not extremely accurate. Why do you think that? There might be very small variations in values but it shouldn't be enough to make a difference. - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 21, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 21, 2021 17 hours ago, marta92 said: I've wasted some powder on the table. That is not a problem at all. The important thing is that you take the right dosage. If there are very small variations as you say, that is not a problem either. If the variations are after the third decimal that we can't see on the scale (like 0.0071, 0.0075, etc...) that's ok. Right, @brassmonkey? - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted February 21, 2021 Moderator Share Posted February 21, 2021 In calculations that is where rounding would play a part. Anything after the third decimal place would be rounded up. @Yesyes123 do a site search on AIC for more explanations you might find interesting, let's not hijack this thread but can discuss it more on your intro thread. The bigger concern is usually with the inconsistent readouts of the scales. Even with the same pile of powder on the same slip pf paper the readings on the scale will vary by just a little bit. Especially at the very low doses like the one we are working with. One way around this is to put some extra weigh on the scale and TARE it out before making the measurements. Usually we use the calibration weights that came with the scale but the 50g weight may be too much. Using a midsize coin should work well in its place. Put the coin on the scale, turn it on and it should automatically TARE it out and set to 0.000. Then make your measurements as usual. Adding the coin will throw the scale into the middle of it's range where it is the most accurate. Small inconsistencies in the dose weight from day to day will not make any real difference. What we need is a dose that is nearly the same day in and day out. You could look at it as the dose being wood that you add to a fire. You add wood and the fire burns a bit stronger for a short while and then settles into a steady glow before slowly starting to die out, at which point you add some more wood to maintain the steady glow. This is similar to how the blood serum concentration of the drug works. That is the steady state amount of drug in the blood at any one time. That steady state is what we are aiming for, we want to keep it as "steady" as possible, but there will be some small fluctuations over time. There are a lot of different factors involved in this with the dose weight being a rather small one. So the important thing is to keep the doses as consistent as possible without making yourself crazy trying to be exact. If the scale says the dose weight is 0.007 when you make it up that is close enough. If you try to reweigh it the position on the scale, vibration from the table, a slight breeze, any number of things could make the weight seem to be just a little different. But over time all the different doses that you measure at 0.007 will average out to 0.007 and the blood serum level will stay constant. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 21, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 21, 2021 Thank you @brassmonkey I have so much respect for you and all you do for us... @marta92 hope you do great with reinstatement. I'm anxious to hear how it goes. Wish you peace and healing. - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
marta92 Posted February 23, 2021 Author Share Posted February 23, 2021 On 2/21/2021 at 10:17 PM, brassmonkey said: In calculations that is where rounding would play a part. Anything after the third decimal place would be rounded up. @Yesyes123 do a site search on AIC for more explanations you might find interesting, let's not hijack this thread but can discuss it more on your intro thread. The bigger concern is usually with the inconsistent readouts of the scales. Even with the same pile of powder on the same slip pf paper the readings on the scale will vary by just a little bit. Especially at the very low doses like the one we are working with. One way around this is to put some extra weigh on the scale and TARE it out before making the measurements. Usually we use the calibration weights that came with the scale but the 50g weight may be too much. Using a midsize coin should work well in its place. Put the coin on the scale, turn it on and it should automatically TARE it out and set to 0.000. Then make your measurements as usual. Adding the coin will throw the scale into the middle of it's range where it is the most accurate. Small inconsistencies in the dose weight from day to day will not make any real difference. What we need is a dose that is nearly the same day in and day out. You could look at it as the dose being wood that you add to a fire. You add wood and the fire burns a bit stronger for a short while and then settles into a steady glow before slowly starting to die out, at which point you add some more wood to maintain the steady glow. This is similar to how the blood serum concentration of the drug works. That is the steady state amount of drug in the blood at any one time. That steady state is what we are aiming for, we want to keep it as "steady" as possible, but there will be some small fluctuations over time. There are a lot of different factors involved in this with the dose weight being a rather small one. So the important thing is to keep the doses as consistent as possible without making yourself crazy trying to be exact. If the scale says the dose weight is 0.007 when you make it up that is close enough. If you try to reweigh it the position on the scale, vibration from the table, a slight breeze, any number of things could make the weight seem to be just a little different. But over time all the different doses that you measure at 0.007 will average out to 0.007 and the blood serum level will stay constant. Thank you. I am worried because if i weigh some powder it can be 0.007 one second and 0.008 after three seconds. So it's not a big deal? I haven't reinstated yet, I'm scared. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 23, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 23, 2021 As brassmonkey said, if you keep taking it daily with a very small variation, the levels in your blood will remain constant. Its not a big deal. Let us know how reinstatement goes! I have a feeling you'll be just fine in no time. - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted February 23, 2021 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2021 No, it's not a big deal. Switching to a homemade liquid could be a little more accurate but it won't buy you much. You would need a whole different set of equipment and, in my mind, it's much more of a bother to work with. For right now just do the best you can and try not to over think things. There will always be another "variable" to worry about, but in the end they all make very little difference. 1 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted February 26, 2021 Mentor Share Posted February 26, 2021 Hi @marta92how are you - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted March 1, 2021 Mentor Share Posted March 1, 2021 Hey @marta92, I've been thinking about you, wondering if you reinstated already, if it helped... hope you are doing well! - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 Hi everyone. So, an update after a long time. My family did not believe that I was going through withdrawal and took me to a psychiatrist that diagnosed me as bipolar (not true, never had mania in my life) prescribed me Lithium. I've been on it for a month and a half, more or less. Let's say I'm "stabilised" - at least as much as stabilised as I can be. I mean, I can sleep at night (even if it is not a restorative sleep and I wake up wide awake) and the akathisia is gone. I still feel really numb, brain fog and I have digestive issues, while the first couple of hours in the morning are the worst ones. I'm still very sad because of this situation, so I stay home all day and honestly I have very dark thoughts. I feel trapped. Today my dad showed up home with Olanzapine since "I'm not getting better" and the psychiatrist wants me to take that as well. So I'm left with three options: 1. Staying on lithium and accept this abuse (impossible for me) 2. Committing s... 3. Leave home and force myself to start working again and start tapering lithium. So I was looking for guidance to taper lithium. Considerations about my situation: 1. I am on two capsules of 83 mg extended release and I've been on it for one month and a half 2. I was going through Cipralex withdrawal when put on lithium 3. I've been on various psych meds throughout 10 years I saw that @JanCarol tapered off lithium. I was mainly wondering if I can make a liquid solution and how long should I taper. Any other suggestions or kind words of hope would be very much appreciated. thank you Martina (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Nomansland Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 Hello @marta92, iam sorry youre going trough tough times. Maybe this official leaflet by the UK Royal College of Psychiatrist can help convicing your family (and the psychiatrist) its withdrawal? See here: Two professors (one of them was the president of this professional association) contributed to create this leaflet. Greetings Nomansland 2022 IMPORTANT WITHDRAWAL SURVEY, PLEASE PARTICIPATE: https://uelpsych.eu.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_0AR9IsQ61jsiXBk non-native speaker of english 2020: 3-March -> started Mirtazapine 15mg; 3-March to 6-April -> approx. cutting to 0 mg; 6-April to 20-April -> ~ 7,5 mg; 21-April to 31-April -> 15 mg; 1-May to 13-May -> ~ 10 mg (approx.); 15-May to 19-July -> 15 mg (psychosomatic clinic) 19-July -> started taper (scale and file) 14 mg (-6,6%); 08-August -> 12 mg (-14,3 %); 27-August -> 10 mg (-16,6 %); 15-September -> 8 mg (-20 %, bad idea, heavy WD); 23-September -> 10.2 mg (+20 %, 102 mgpw) 2021: 12-April to 12-May -> crossover from solid pill to DIY liquid (water only), 10.2 mg, not stable; 10-September -> back to crushing and weighing, still 10.2 mg (102 mgpw) 2022: 13-March -> changed to DIY liquid with suspension vehicle, 10.2 mg Supplements: 1 x ~125 mg magnesiumbiglycinate before bed, low histamine diet Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 Hi @Nomansland Thank you for your reply. Believe me, there is no way I can convince them that I have withdrawal. God knows I tried. First of all I'm from Italy and they can't understand English. Secondly, my dad is on meds too and he feels good on them and everyone agree that they are good and that I was fine while I was on my meds. They say they believe what doctors say because they are professionals. Believe me when I say that it's impossible to convince them. The last chance that I have is to try (and I say try because I don't know if I can - if withdrawal hits bad again and I can't work I'm done) is to find a room and force me to work. I feel very alone honestly. 1 (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 Also I feel detached from everything but I don't know how much it's for the meds and how much it's this whole trauma and the fear of what may be ahead of me. I really spent the last 2 months thinking EVERY SECOND that suicide would be the only solution. And yet I love life SO MUCH. But I read my friends texting on our WhatsApp groups about life and projects and I find it hard to join them giving I'm in this life or death situation. Now the first two things I have to do is to find a cheap room and start working again - it feels difficult because I really feel super sad. Anyway, I'll wait for advice about he Lithium thing. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 I was thinking of a 10% reduction every month, but was wondering if I can make my own liquid solution with extended release capsule. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 4 hours ago, marta92 said: I was thinking of a 10% reduction every month, but was wondering if I can make my own liquid solution with extended release capsule. Also, how long will it take to taper with a 10% reduction? (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 22, 2021 Author Share Posted April 22, 2021 ...anyone? (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
almuPA Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 Ciao, @marta92, I am so sorry to read about your situation. I am not a mod and I don't know about tappering(I quitted coldturkey and let me tell you It is not fun). I write to you because I understand you so well about family. My father is as well on antidepressants, he is still depressed and agoraphobic, he had a heart arrithmia last month when he updosed, and still nobody believe me when I try to explain about withdrawal! It is frustating. But you know is true, we are here for you, to help you in what you need. 19 hours ago, marta92 said: I was thinking of a 10% reduction every month Again, I not a mod, so I don't feel like giving any advice. For what I could read, 10% is the way to go. 10% and wait until you feel stabilize. You have been through a lot of changes in medication in the last years, so you need to give time to your nervious system. Did you make any changes in your diet? I found that I feel better eating low histamine. Do you have any copping strategies? I mean meditation, yoga, walking, watching tv, baths... Anything that can help you forget for a while how you are feeling. Please wait until somebody with more knowledge than me reply to you. 1 March 2019: 10mg Citalopram April 2019: 20mg Citalopram October/November 2019(sorry, I don't remember the exact date): 10mg of Citalopram without tapering, as suggested by my pharmacist. March 2020: Started "tapering", taking the 10mg of Citalopram every other day, again, following the recommendations of my pharmacist. April 2020: Stopped taking Citalopram. I haven't reinstall since then. I've tried taking Magnesium a couple of times, but I found out it makes me nervous. I only take Paracetemol when the headache becomes unbearable (2gr every couple of weeks or so). Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 22, 2021 Author Share Posted April 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, almuPA said: Ciao, @marta92, I am so sorry to read about your situation. I am not a mod and I don't know about tappering(I quitted coldturkey and let me tell you It is not fun). I write to you because I understand you so well about family. My father is as well on antidepressants, he is still depressed and agoraphobic, he had a heart arrithmia last month when he updosed, and still nobody believe me when I try to explain about withdrawal! It is frustating. But you know is true, we are here for you, to help you in what you need. Again, I not a mod, so I don't feel like giving any advice. For what I could read, 10% is the way to go. 10% and wait until you feel stabilize. You have been through a lot of changes in medication in the last years, so you need to give time to your nervious system. Did you make any changes in your diet? I found that I feel better eating low histamine. Do you have any copping strategies? I mean meditation, yoga, walking, watching tv, baths... Anything that can help you forget for a while how you are feeling. Please wait until somebody with more knowledge than me reply to you. Hi @almuPA Thank you for your reply. It's very kind of you. I was thinking about the coping mechanism you were saying. I don't know if I can explain myself well, but I feel so depressed about his whole situation that everything seems pointless. I mean, for instance I could go for a walk with my dog - what for? I don't feel any enjoyement about it as I'm trapped in this situation of emptiness and despair. Plus, I can't stand meeting people on the streets (let alone friends and family) - all dealing with their "normal" lives it makes me ache about where I'm now just crossing them . I don't know, I can't help but thinking this way. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
almuPA Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 I totally understand you. I had that feeling of "what for" and still have It from time to time. It is hard, but believe me that It will pass. I know now doesnt seem like It, but one day you will see yourself enjoying Life again. Feel free to message me if you need to talk to somedoby. 1 March 2019: 10mg Citalopram April 2019: 20mg Citalopram October/November 2019(sorry, I don't remember the exact date): 10mg of Citalopram without tapering, as suggested by my pharmacist. March 2020: Started "tapering", taking the 10mg of Citalopram every other day, again, following the recommendations of my pharmacist. April 2020: Stopped taking Citalopram. I haven't reinstall since then. I've tried taking Magnesium a couple of times, but I found out it makes me nervous. I only take Paracetemol when the headache becomes unbearable (2gr every couple of weeks or so). Link to comment
Willfinish Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 Hi Marta I come from Italy too. You’re a very strong girl. Don’t make others destroying your life or taking decisions by your side. It’s your life. Try to go away, be indipendent for a year, starting tapering slowly the medication (if you are ok on lithium, or reinstate escitalopram and then go off) ...i know it’s a very hellish journey and sometime it’s impossibile just functioning...you have been a psychiatry victim since the beginning after the first citalopram withdrawal...the risk of cocktails by doctors is so high, and it creates a hellish cage where it’s difficult to escape... fight and you’ll have your life back! Take care and hang in there i hope history and justice will save us 1 Cipralex 2 years treatment (January 2017 to March 2019, with a brief interruption). Cipralex 10 mg : January 2017 - July 2017. Cipralex 5 mg: August 2017 - March 2018. Start tapering 1 mg a month. Off the medication: August 2018. Too fast tapering, crashed, doctor reinstated considering relapse. Cipralex 5 mg: September 2018 - December 2018. Tired of emotional numbness, start tapering again, 1 mg a month (didn't know it was so fast, following my doctor advice). Off the medication: March 2019. PSSD and painful withdrawal symptoms: January 2020 until now. Some improvements but still struggling. Supplements: some Omega 3 and probiotics, a bit better. Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 23, 2021 Author Share Posted April 23, 2021 I was also wondering if the taper could be faster for a drug taken for 2/3 months. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 25, 2021 Author Share Posted April 25, 2021 Still waiting for some guidance... (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
marta92 Posted April 25, 2021 Author Share Posted April 25, 2021 On 4/22/2021 at 3:21 PM, Willfinish said: Hi Marta I come from Italy too. You’re a very strong girl. Don’t make others destroying your life or taking decisions by your side. It’s your life. Try to go away, be indipendent for a year, starting tapering slowly the medication (if you are ok on lithium, or reinstate escitalopram and then go off) ...i know it’s a very hellish journey and sometime it’s impossibile just functioning...you have been a psychiatry victim since the beginning after the first citalopram withdrawal...the risk of cocktails by doctors is so high, and it creates a hellish cage where it’s difficult to escape... fight and you’ll have your life back! Take care and hang in there i hope history and justice will save us Thank you @Willfinish for your kind words. The thing is, if I move out and start feeling really bad again to the point that I can't function (and I'm struggling already), what do I do? I mean, I think one needs a support system to go through this. (19 years old) More or less 2011 Citalopram 20 mg one year for depression following stress by death of my mother quit cold Turkey 2012 rmore or less relapse depression after CT, new psychiatrist put me on Citalopram 20 mg, Depakin 300 mg, Efexxor 75 mg Don't remember between 2016-2017 tapered over a few months all the drugs with the assistance of my psychologist 2018 relapse (or withdrawal?) depression started Cipralex 20 mg until july 2020 when I tapered during a period of about 4 months until November 2020 February 2021 (29 years old): feeling depressed, can't sleep, anxiety, paranoia, agoraphobia, hardly functional Currently (since March 4 2021): Lithium Resilient 83mg extended release 2 capsules (forced to take it) Link to comment
Mentor Yesyes123 Posted April 25, 2021 Mentor Share Posted April 25, 2021 Hey Marta I messaged one of the mods who said they'll get here soon - Escitalopram 10mg from ages 15 - 21 - Severe crash after 4 month taper to 0 - Reinstated, stabilized, slowly tapering. "Although the world is full of suffering, it is also full of the overcoming of it." - Hellen Keller I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus JanCarol Posted April 29, 2021 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 29, 2021 Hey Marta I am travelling, and the laptop I am using tends to "lose" the keyboard. But I will try. You can come off lithium. It's actually one of the easier ones to taper. The time release just means that when you crush the tablet (like you were going to do with Cipralex) you have to take it 2x a day instead of 1x. Read here: Tips for Tapering off Lithium 10% per month is a good plan. You got your scales all set up, you can do this. I tapered off lithium with dry cutting, like you are about to do - it is actually harder than making a liquid, but - you can do it on your own without people interfering. Yes, you can. As for your family, yes, it would be good to get away from that influence - if you want to take control of your drugs, taking control of your life is important too. Your lithium is not a horribly high dose, so there is no harm in holding until you can get to a more suitable situation. This is also a good time to practice your Non-Drug techniques for coping with extreme states. Brassmonkey has written a great article, here: Dealing with Emotional Spirals and you might also benefit from this article, too: Change the Channel There are loads of non-drug options around the site, as I am away from home, I'm having trouble finding them all. Most importantly, learn to access and adjust your mood with breathing: Breathing for Well Being You are the best person to control your mood. Really, the bottom line is, only you can control your mood. Drugs can alter your mood, but that is not the same as gaining your own well-being through your own Practices. I hope you see the sun today! (I got lucky and was able to type all of this) "Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again. My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices. A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia. CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013. Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine). Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 - Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years on Lithium). Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made. The tedious thread (my intro): JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium The happy thread (my success story): JanCarol - Undiagnosed Off all bipolar drugs My own blog: https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/ I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016! Link to comment
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