FarmMom: any help is appreciated!

[FarmMom]

@brassmonkey

Thank you, I do not plan to increase anymore, for I feel it has worsened me.  I suppose now the question is, do I stay where I am at or lower some? I am miserable. I haven't had an appetite since January. I feel if I could get hungry and have cravings, that would boost my mood. I have no interest in anything and it is devastating. I don't even want to get in my pool and float around. 

 

What would your expertise recommend on dosing? Stay here or drop? Will I eventually stabilize?

 

Am I in a protracted withdrawal, even though I'm not off the drug?

 

[brassmonkey]

You need to stay put and not change doses any more until you've stabilized, which will probably take some time. I found it helpful to keep doing things even if I didn't find joy in them. Need to keep busy and and let small bits of joy will creep in and surprise you.

[FarmMom]

Thank you,I had told myself I was staying put before and when you get so low you just want a touch of relief. So even though I felt better (if you can call it that) on a lower dose, stay put I'm?

I'm in therapy and she even said "you were doing everything right. I'm so sorry". It just sucks. 

So you had the loss of any interest, flat, depression too and regained it? 

What sucks the most is I have a rescue farm and they are my life. I go through the motions but the joy just isn't there. They were always my stress relief

[Rusty1]

Emotional blunting is extremely common. There is no reason it should be permanent. It is a sign that your body is disorganized and needs to settle down. As Brassmonkey said the best thing you can do is not make changes and let things settle in. And if you decide to get off the medication do it slowly. 

Jumping around is enticing because we are looking for relief, but it usually only brings more destabilization and suffering.

 

Personally I would be very cautious with any info your doctor or therapist give you regarding increasing, decreasing or adding medications. The overwhelming majority do not understand withdrawal from these medications and typically move people up and down too quickly on medications and misinterpret withdrawal symptoms as new symptoms that need to be addressed with other medications.

 

That isnt to say doctors and therapists dont have their place and for certain things we desperately need them. But in the case of your medication I would consult with the moderators here prior to making any changes. You may not agree with everything or feel their advice best fits your life, but I certainly think they have a comprehensive of withdrawal and how to get you back on track you cannot find elsewhere.

 

I am sorry you are not feeling well. The day you will feel like yourself will come, just be patient as signs of improvement happen gradually and not all at once.

[FarmMom]

@Rusty1

Thank you for your encouraging wisdom. You are correct with it being enticing when you feel so bad and I learned my lesson, for i am worse. I feel in a deep depression, which I have never experienced. Exhausted, yet can't sleep. Toss and turn all night. Benadryl and Hydroxyzine don't work and I don't want to take anything more potent. It amazes me how tired and exhausted one can be, yet can't sleep. 

I am struggling to get up and go to work, but I just work (as I'm sure most do). I wish I could take back alot of things that got me to this point. I go to therapy, but do you think it is still worthwhile, when my symptoms are related to WD? 

It's been almost 2 weeks since the last updose, so I'm sure things are still adjusting. When do you suppose some relief would come? I know it's different for everyone. 

Also, I noticed on your timeline you're free of med. Congrats! 

When you say you had a 2 year wave, what were you experiencing?

 

[Rusty1]

3 hours ago, FarmMom said:

@Rusty1

Thank you for your encouraging wisdom. You are correct with it being enticing when you feel so bad and I learned my lesson, for i am worse. I feel in a deep depression, which I have never experienced. Exhausted, yet can't sleep. Toss and turn all night. Benadryl and Hydroxyzine don't work and I don't want to take anything more potent. It amazes me how tired and exhausted one can be, yet can't sleep. 

I am struggling to get up and go to work, but I just work (as I'm sure most do). I wish I could take back alot of things that got me to this point. I go to therapy, but do you think it is still worthwhile, when my symptoms are related to WD? 

It's been almost 2 weeks since the last updose, so I'm sure things are still adjusting. When do you suppose some relief would come? I know it's different for everyone. 

Also, I noticed on your timeline you're free of med. Congrats! 

When you say you had a 2 year wave, what were you experiencing?

 

You are welcome. You will get through this even if the path seems unclear right now.

 

Sometimes when people updose their bodies do not tolerate it well. I was one of those. When I accidentally updosed by a small fraction I was presented symptoms far worse than any I experienced from reducing the medication.  That is what sent me in my wave.

 

I would continue to communicate with the moderators and keep track of your symptoms. They may recommend staying put and trying to let your body stabilize, or if that doesnt help they may suggest decreasing again.

 

Trigger warning:

When I had my 2 year wave I am referring to my worst symptoms that were different than my normal withdrawal symptoms I already had. During that period I had constant severe derealization, thoughts of dying, uncontrollable anxiety, cortisol spikes, head pressure, sensitivities to supplements and medications, my gut health felt poor and I suffered from IBS, and doing anything other than laying in bed felt mentally exhausting and triggered my already debilitating symptoms to somehow be worse. I could come up with a list of other symptoms but those were the worst. It felt like I was fighting to live second by second and life was intolerable.

 

I dont mean to tell you that to scare you, but rather show you that at that point I couldn't imagine feeling worse. I realized I accidentally was taking too much medication. As I slowly reduced my dose my symptoms never went away, however their intensity slowly started reducing. After roughly 2 year I felt a lot of improvement, I was still battling crippling anxiety, but the derealization and thoughts of dying had mostly faded away. Now 4 to 4.5 years out from when that all started I recently became med free, have minimal symptoms and for the majority of time feel like myself prior to withdrawal and am able to participate in life activities I had done prior to this journey. I still do have a few symptoms, but they have been in the background so far - sleep is still a struggle (sometimes I do really well) and still some unchartered waters (sensitivities to some supplements and medications).

 

I dont like to directly compare myself to others in withdrawal because our own definition of symptoms, severity, and tolerance of them varies to our own individual experience. I would say I believe my time during those 2 years to be on the severe end with how I tolerated it and certainly the worst portion of my overall withdrawal experience.

To give you hope, physically that mostly feels as part of the past and I currently am experiencing the least amount of symptoms throughout this entire journey. So no you are not ruined and yes with a little patience and practice to learn how to monitor your body and know how the medication is affecting it you should have confidence you will come out the other side with the ability to resume your life as you knew it.

I always hesitate to tell the depth of my story because your situation does not mean you will have a 2 year wave like I did.  Hopefully yours will stabilize to be more manageable over the next few months.

 

Like I said do not hesitate to ask the mods questions prior to updosing, dropping, adding medications or supplements, or just to report symptoms and get feedback. They are very experienced in how these medications affect us and in my experience provided me with more insight than any doctor or therapist I visited.

 

There are benefits to therapy as you asked in your post. For me I felt the need to have an outlet outside of my family. It helped to have another person to talk to who was on my side and work on techniques to try and notice patterns of my anxiety.

They weren't able to help with guidance on withdrawal, but I was okay with that.

 

Thank you for checking in. Keep at it, you will get through this!

[FarmMom]

@brassmonkey

Can you tell me what to look for if stabilized? I've never been unstable, always felt like myself until my world flipped upside down. Is it a decrease in symptoms, return to baseline? 

I wish I hadn't increased, I caved thinking it make me feel better. i have only worsened and scared I will continue to worsen. I now have no joy, i was at least finding it relaxing to soak in an epsom salt bath. Tried last night and just wanted to get out because I was so restless. 

 

Thank you

[brassmonkey]

Stability is different for each individual because of their symptom load. In general it is a return to baseline with no big swings either direction. Feeling the same level of blah day to day.

[Altostrata]

On 6/23/2021 at 10:18 AM, FarmMom said:

I'm now at 50mg and suffering.

 

What are the symptoms you call "suffering"? How has your sleep pattern changed since you increased to 50mg? How have your other symptoms changed since you increased to 50mg? 

 

How often have you used alprazolam in the last 2 weeks?

 

Did you read this?

 

On 5/30/2021 at 5:16 PM, Altostrata said:

That emotional flatness is a common effect of antidepressants that may have been unmasked by your reduction or emerged as a withdrawal symptom. If it is an adverse effect of the drug, you will continue to have it as long as you're taking it. If it's a withdrawal symptom, it will very gradually go away, like other withdrawal symptoms.

 

[FarmMom]

12 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

What are the symptoms you call "suffering"? How has your sleep pattern changed since you increased to 50mg? How have your other symptoms changed since you increased to 50mg? 

 

How often have you used alprazolam in the last 2 weeks?

 

Did you read this?

 

 

@Altostrata unfortunately the emotional flatness worsened. Sleeping has worsened (which was easing some). I journaled that at 37.5 I felt numb, had never felt that. Unfortunately I thought I went into a depression. Now it's worse. Lack of energy, this hadn't been a problem. Difficulty focusing and concentrating (making work hard), anxiety, hands shaky and intermittent leg tremors. Had hopes appetite would improve, it hasn't. I feel so stupid for increasing and listening to doctors (thankfully I didn't go to 75 like instructed to do). Wish I had stayed at 31mg. Where I had what I now realize was a lovely window then into a wave. I had never experienced windows and waves, for I hadn't had withdraws. I took it that "oh, the increase helped, but not enough"  terrible lesson learned . 

[FarmMom]

15 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

What are the symptoms you call "suffering"? How has your sleep pattern changed since you increased to 50mg? How have your other symptoms changed since you increased to 50mg? 

 

How often have you used alprazolam in the last 2 weeks?

 

Did you read this?

 

@Altostrata I have used alprazolam I believe twice in a week, maybe just once. I know I took one Tuesday but can't remember before that(I journal and document that, but I am not home right now). 

Also, with sleep, I typically fall asleep but can't stay asleep. 

Benadryl and Hydroxyzine don't do much for sleep. Melatonin helps some, but I've heard you shouldn't take it often or you will have to taper off of it. 

 

[Altostrata]

No, you can take melatonin every night. It will not incur dependency. If you use alprazolam every day, though, you might get physiologically dependent on it, which will cause big problems for you. It can also cause anxiety or sleeplessness when it wears off.

 

Your symptoms are those of an adverse drug effect or withdrawal. Please try not to be shocked by them. Be patient. Most likely, if you stop changing drugs, your nervous system will settle down over a few weeks. Nervous systems can be sensitized by going up and down and changing drugs. It is possible that 50mg is now too stimulating for you.

 

Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show what the 50mg is doing.

 

What is your sleep pattern? Please read these to help strengthen your sleep.

 

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing the morning cortisol spike

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

White noise devices for sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

[FarmMom]

16 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

No, you can take melatonin every night. It will not incur dependency. If you use alprazolam every day, though, you might get physiologically dependent on it, which will cause big problems for you. It can also cause anxiety or sleeplessness when it wears off.

 

Your symptoms are those of an adverse drug effect or withdrawal. Please try not to be shocked by them. Be patient. Most likely, if you stop changing drugs, your nervous system will settle down over a few weeks. Nervous systems can be sensitized by going up and down and changing drugs. It is possible that 50mg is now too stimulating for you.

 

Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show what the 50mg is doing.

 

What is your sleep pattern? Please read these to help strengthen your sleep.

 

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing the morning cortisol spike

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

White noise devices for sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

Thank you @Altostrata

I haven't changed any drugs, just the dosage, which I will not do for a while. 

I will begin to track a 24 hour timeline. I truly appreciate your expertise and advice. 

My sleep pattern is about an hour before bedtime I take mag glycinate,  it tends to calm me. I lay down around 930-10pm and do a bedtime meditation. There are nights I have difficulty dozing off, but mostly I fall asleep while meditating. I just wake often, sometimes every hour, other nights maybe just 1 or 2 throughout the night. I also wake much earlier than I did before all this started. I wake before my alarm goes off, usually around 430am. 

Weekends I can sometimes manage to sleep until 630 am if I'm lucky. Would love to sleep in on the weekend. 

Something else I have found that it occurring is hard to do things I once enjoyed. I tried to float in the pool (was one of my favorite things before) to relax and I couldn't make myself stay in. Just couldn't enjoy it. 

[Altostrata]

13 minutes ago, FarmMom said:

Something else I have found that it occurring is hard to do things I once enjoyed. I tried to float in the pool (was one of my favorite things before) to relax and I couldn't make myself stay in. Just couldn't enjoy it. 

 

As explained, emotional anesthesia is common when people go on and off psychiatric drugs. Try not to let it bother you. You will need to cope with it until it goes away, which may not be soon. There is no instant fix for this, your nervous system needs to recover.

 

Be sure to get at least a half-hour gentle cardio every day, this will help.

[FarmMom]

31 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

As explained, emotional anesthesia is common when people go on and off psychiatric drugs. Try not to let it bother you. You will need to cope with it until it goes away, which may not be soon. There is no instant fix for this, your nervous system needs to recover.

 

Be sure to get at least a half-hour gentle cardio every day, this will help.

Ok, thank you. I'm assuming you're referring to the emotional anesthesia as in the no enjoyment? 

 

I do my best to stay active, plus I have 70 plus farm rescue animals to care for before and after work. 

[Altostrata]

22 minutes ago, FarmMom said:

Ok, thank you. I'm assuming you're referring to the emotional anesthesia as in the no enjoyment? 

 

 

Correct. Enjoy whatever you can enjoy, the feeling will very slowly come back.

[Orbet]

On 4/15/2021 at 6:15 AM, FarmMom said:

The Pfizer COVID 

Me, too.  My psychiatrist told me today that the vaccine could well have caused the aggravated symptoms I’ve experienced since April.  

[FarmMom]

@Altostrata @brassmonkey @Rusty1

I wanted to reach out to see of it is normal to experience "waves" during stabilization. I had over 3 weeks of feeling amazing, beginning June 27th. It was so nice and enjoyable, thought I had leveled out. Last Wed evening I felt mild anxiety creeping in, but did my techniques and was hoping was just an isolated event. Thursday morning I felt a little worse and have continued to decline. Just feel blah, fatigued, appetite went away again. 

 My last increase was to 50mg on June 12th. So over 6 weeks now. 

[Rusty1]

2 hours ago, FarmMom said:

@Altostrata @brassmonkey @Rusty1

I wanted to reach out to see of it is normal to experience "waves" during stabilization. I had over 3 weeks of feeling amazing, beginning June 27th. It was so nice and enjoyable, thought I had leveled out. Last Wed evening I felt mild anxiety creeping in, but did my techniques and was hoping was just an isolated event. Thursday morning I felt a little worse and have continued to decline. Just feel blah, fatigued, appetite went away again. 

 My last increase was to 50mg on June 12th. So over 6 weeks now. 

That is very common in withdrawal. 

Good to hear you had 3 excellent weeks. Definitely something to be happy about!

Watch this wave and hopefully it will be shorter and less intense than previous ones. That is a great marker to show you are making improvements.

[FarmMom]

3 minutes ago, Rusty1 said:

That is very common in withdrawal. 

Good to hear you had 3 excellent weeks. Definitely something to be happy about!

Watch this wave and hopefully it will be shorter and less intense than previous ones. That is a great marker to show you are making improvements.

@Rusty1 you say common in withdrawal but I increased dose (potentially to get out of withdrawal induced by the vaccine in January). I plan to hold here but didn't know if it was common with an upodse as still part of a "stabilization" or if something else is going on. 

I made the last increase June 12th. June 27th I started feeling better. Lasted all the way until last Wednesday night when in bed I felt adrenaline rushes and Thursday morning woke with the return of symptoms.  Loss of appetite, dizzy, fatigue. 

[Rusty1]

11 minutes ago, FarmMom said:

@Rusty1 you say common in withdrawal but I increased dose (potentially to get out of withdrawal induced by the vaccine in January). I plan to hold here but didn't know if it was common with an upodse as still part of a "stabilization" or if something else is going on. 

I made the last increase June 12th. June 27th I started feeling better. Lasted all the way until last Wednesday night when in bed I felt adrenaline rushes and Thursday morning woke with the return of symptoms.  Loss of appetite, dizzy, fatigue. 

Stabilization is never a straight line (whether from an updose or decrease). The goal is to move in the right direction and eventually the windows get bigger and the waves get smaller. 

It sounds like you have been keeping some sort of records of when you feel good and poorly, along with symptoms. 

Keep watching it and see if your trend is to have more better days than before. 

Unfortunately it is common to think you have turned a corner only to have some more setbacks. 

[FarmMom]

On 6/28/2021 at 5:47 PM, Orbet said:

Me, too.  My psychiatrist told me today that the vaccine could well have caused the aggravated symptoms I’ve experienced since April.  

@Orbet what symptoms are you experiencing?

[Rusty1]

1 minute ago, FarmMom said:

@Orbet what symptoms are you experiencing?

Also remember that an updose isnt a magic bullet. Just like drops which can unsettle us, an updose isnt a guarantee to feel better. 

You need to keep track of your symptoms and watch where the trend goes.

[FarmMom]

1 minute ago, Rusty1 said:

Stabilization is never a straight line (whether from an updose or decrease). The goal is to move in the right direction and eventually the windows get bigger and the waves get smaller. 

It sounds like you have been keeping some sort of records of when you feel good and poorly, along with symptoms. 

Keep watching it and see if your trend is to have more better days than before. 

Unfortunately it is common to think you have turned a corner only to have some more setbacks. 

Thank you @Rusty1 

I do journal daily. 

It was amazing on June 27th the morning was the usual, anxiety, etc. Was actually in a wedding and had been dreading it. While getting ready for the wedding I felt "hungry" which I hadn't in over 6 weeks. Then the wedding came and I enjoyed it and danced alot at the reception. This started off the 3 week window which was oh so lovely. 

[FarmMom]

Just now, Rusty1 said:

Also remember that an updose isnt a magic bullet. Just like drops which can unsettle us, an updose isnt a guarantee to feel better. 

You need to keep track of your symptoms and watch where the trend goes.

@Rusty1 it has been 6 weeks and 3 days since the updose (June 12th). 

2 weeks after was my window.

[brassmonkey]

Rusty describes it pretty well. While one is trying to stabilize and once they are stable there are going to still be daily, even hourly swings in one's mood. These are quite normal. It's when the swings get extreme that we should become concerned. It sounds like you are settling in nicely on your new dose. I so glad you had a good time at the wedding.

[FarmMom]

1 minute ago, brassmonkey said:

Rusty describes it pretty well. While one is trying to stabilize and once they are stable there are going to still be daily, even hourly swings in one's mood. These are quite normal. It's when the swings get extreme that we should become concerned. It sounds like you are settling in nicely on your new dose. I so glad you had a good time at the wedding.

@brassmonkey

Thank you so much. As long as I know it's normal I can push myself through it to the next window! Just concerned me that had been 6 weeks since an increase and had 3 good weeks then regressed. 

I was unsure if waves and windows appeared in updoses. 

I pray I am stabilizing and my next window comes sooner and lasts even longer! 3 weeks was the longest I have had since January! Most have been 5-7 days then a month or month and half before another (took me a while to realize it was waves and windows, for I had never experienced them). 

 

[FarmMom]

48 minutes ago, getofflex said:

I would tend to agree.  At any rate during a reinstatement the original WD is still there so windows and waves can certainly happen.  Often an RI will reduce symptoms not eliminate them altogether.  

Would you mind to find my thread of my initial problems or answer briefly here? I was doing a slow taper for over 13 months. Never had any withdrawal symptoms AT ALL. I got the COVID vaccine and had a major panic attack. I haven't been the same since and that was the end of January.  Symptoms were anxiety, insomnia, loss of appetite, nausea, weight loss. My GP ran a  Multitude of tests and scans, all normal. I lost close to 30 pounds in 3 months. I was so miserable and listened to my doc as they were a return of symptoms and told me to go back to 75mg (was down to 21mg). I have made slow increases to 50mg, will have "waves and windows" but it confuses me because I never had withdrawals before. 

Here is a little of my timeline with super brief periods of relief, dates of dose increase are listed in my story:

 

1.27 vaccine
All symptoms started 
1.27-2.15 wave (18 days)
2. 15- 2.20 window (5 days)
2.20 3.14 wave (23 days) 
3.14 - 3.21 window (7 days)
3.21 - 5.5 wave  (40 days)
5.5 -5.13  window (8 days)
May 15th 37.5mg
June 6th 43.75mg
June 12th 50mg
5.13-6.27 wave (45 days)
6.27 -7.22 window (25 days) 
7.23 back in a wave 

 

[getofflex]

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

 

I'm sorry to hear that you got these WD symptoms after your COVID shot.  To me, it sounds as if your nervous system just couldn't handle the COVID shot after you had gotten off of the Effexor.  Believe it or not, it can take up to several months for WD symptoms to show up.  Is your intent to eventually get off of the Effexor?  

 

Can I ask why you did the frequent updoses over the past several months?  Was it to try and get rid of the symptoms of WD?  If you change your dose too many times or too frequently, it can have the opposite effect because the nervous system can't find homeostasis when the amount of the drug it receives keeps changing.  Please read the following: 

 

Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

 

Considerations About Stability Stop Jumping Around

 

We at SA suggest you wait a bare minimum of 4 weeks after you change a dose to give it chance to really settle in and work, unless you have an immediate and severe bad reaction.  

 

Here are some threads to help you determine when you are stable.

 

WD Normal

 

Stability

 

My suggestion would be to stay on the dose you are currently on for several months, even give yourself about 6 to 8 months on this current dose. Allow your nervous system to have some stability.  Please do not change your dose again for a while.  Try some non drug coping techniques.  Time and patience are the key to getting off these drugs and healing.  Please let us know how you are doing.  

Edited July 30, 2021 by getofflex

[getofflex]

On 6/23/2021 at 3:17 PM, brassmonkey said:

You need to stay put and not change doses any more until you've stabilized, which will probably take some time. I found it helpful to keep doing things even if I didn't find joy in them. Need to keep busy and and let small bits of joy will creep in and surprise you.

I fully agree with this.  

[Rusty1]

I am not sure this applies to your situation 100% because we are all unique. The first part of my tapering I had a consistent symptom pattern that I could recognize from when I dropped and how it would level off and I knew to do my next drop. I did have symptoms, but in comparison to the stories here I was on easy street. Some tiredness, nausea, feeling like you had the flu for a couple days amd then it would level out pretty good. I never felt 100%, but that symptom load would be desired by most.

 

Then one day I felt a lump on our cats leg, I immediately felt an anxiety I had never experienced before in my life. From then on my taper would never be the same.

 

I would come to find out (did not know at the time) that despite minimal symptoms in withdrawal that our CNS is still not as stable and this triggered major instability. Once you cross that line into severe instability it is hard to resume back to how you were. It takes a lot of time and getting back on a slow taper.

 

Fortunately things leveled out, but it took years. Could it have been he vaccine?, sure anything is possible. But it also could have been your anxiety upsetting your CNS.

The path forward is to make good decisions about withdrawing and doing it carefully and slowly.

[FarmMom]

11 minutes ago, Rusty1 said:

I am not sure this applies to your situation 100% because we are all unique. The first part of my tapering I had a consistent symptom pattern that I could recognize from when I dropped and how it would level off and I knew to do my next drop. I did have symptoms, but in comparison to the stories here I was on easy street. Some tiredness, nausea, feeling like you had the flu for a couple days amd then it would level out pretty good. I never felt 100%, but that symptom load would be desired by most.

 

Then one day I felt a lump on our cats leg, I immediately felt an anxiety I had never experienced before in my life. From then on my taper would never be the same.

 

I would come to find out (did not know at the time) that despite minimal symptoms in withdrawal that our CNS is still not as stable and this triggered major instability. Once you cross that line into severe instability it is hard to resume back to how you were. It takes a lot of time and getting back on a slow taper.

 

Fortunately things leveled out, but it took years. Could it have been he vaccine?, sure anything is possible. But it also could have been your anxiety upsetting your CNS.

The path forward is to make good decisions about withdrawing and doing it carefully and slowly.

Thank you @Rusty1

It very well could have been. I suppose even though I had no withdrawal during my taper I now realize my CNS was definitely sensitized. Now I don't know what to do. Do I stay where I am for a bit or do I decrease? Will the windows and waves subside and I eventually stabilize if I stay out where I am? I feel at this moment I can't handle stress at all when before, this was never an issue.

[FarmMom]

34 minutes ago, getofflex said:

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

 

I'm sorry to hear that you got these WD symptoms after your COVID shot.  To me, it sounds as if your nervous system just couldn't handle the COVID shot after you had gotten off of the Effexor.  Believe it or not, it can take up to several months for WD symptoms to show up.  Is your intent to eventually get off of the Effexor?  

 

Can I ask why you did the frequent updoses over the past several months?  Was it to try and get rid of the symptoms of WD?  If you change your dose too many times or too frequently, it can have the opposite effect because the nervous system can't find homeostasis when the amount of the drug it receives keeps changing.  Please read the following: 

 

Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

 

Considerations About Stability Stop Jumping Around

 

We at SA suggest you wait a bare minimum of 4 weeks after you change a dose to give it chance to really settle in and work, unless you have an immediate and severe bad reaction.  

 

Here are some threads to help you determine when you are stable.

 

WD Normal

 

Stability

 

My suggestion would be to stay on the dose you are currently on for several months, even give yourself about 6 to 8 months on this current dose. Allow your nervous system to have some stability.  Please do not change your dose again for a while.  Try some non drug coping techniques.  Time and patience are the key to getting off these drugs and healing.  Please let us know how you are doing.  

@getofflexYou said after I had gotten off Effexor but I never did, I made it to 21mg doing a slow, 7% taper. I never had any withdrawal symptoms with ANY of the tapers. That's why this has been so confusing about what is going on. My goal was to get off effexor, hence tapering the correct way, but I have increased because I have been so miserable I was looking for relief. I feared being unable to work, which isn't an option. At this point, if I level out, not sure I will ever try again after this has been terrible. I would maybe try to get to a dose I don't have to count beads, such as 37.5mg. But I have felt ways I didn't know I could. I've never been depressed in my life and had no idea how it felt and I have gotten a big taste of that. No appetite, insomnia (which seems to be improving), anxiety, hard to focus, restless. 

Why would I have 3 straight weeks where I felt normal, like me, then regress back? June 27th to July 22nd was so pleasant. I cooked, baked, my husband and I did activities, we shopped, I wanted pics taken of us (which I have avoided avoided camera since January). Was that a window? Is that a sign of stabilization? Will I get another?

The unknown is so scary. 

[getofflex]

1 hour ago, FarmMom said:

You said after I had gotten off Effexor but I never did, I made it to 21mg doing a slow, 7% taper

I see.  I'm very sorry to hear that you had so much trouble even though you responsibly did a slow, careful taper.  

 

1 hour ago, FarmMom said:

But I have felt ways I didn't know I could.

I know what you mean.  I did, too.  

 

1 hour ago, FarmMom said:

Why would I have 3 straight weeks where I felt normal, like me, then regress back? June 27th to July 22nd was so pleasant. I cooked, baked, my husband and I did activities, we shopped, I wanted pics taken of us (which I have avoided avoided camera since January). Was that a window? Is that a sign of stabilization? Will I get another?

The windows and waves pattern.  I believe you will get more windows.   These links explain all this really well:  

 

Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

What is Withdrawal Syndrome?

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Yes, this WD is very scary.  It is a lot like a crazy and unpredictable roller coaster ride.  And feeling the very strange and bizarre symptoms, which come and go, and change and morph.  Take comfort in the fact that many people have been through this, and have recovered.  Try reading some of the success stories.  Just go to the home page, and about halfway down.  Hang in there, and eventually things will settle down.  I'm praying for you.  

 

 

[FarmMom]

1 hour ago, getofflex said:

I see.  I'm very sorry to hear that you had so much trouble even though you responsibly did a slow, careful taper.  

 

I know what you mean.  I did, too.  

 

The windows and waves pattern.  I believe you will get more windows.   These links explain all this really well:  

 

Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

What is Withdrawal Syndrome?

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Yes, this WD is very scary.  It is a lot like a crazy and unpredictable roller coaster ride.  And feeling the very strange and bizarre symptoms, which come and go, and change and morph.  Take comfort in the fact that many people have been through this, and have recovered.  Try reading some of the success stories.  Just go to the home page, and about halfway down.  Hang in there, and eventually things will settle down.  I'm praying for you.  

 

 

@getofflex

I'm in therapy now over all of this. The psychologist even felt sorry for me, for she said you were doing everything right. I am having to get over beating myself up over getting the vaccine and feeling like I got myself in this position. There is no way I could've known. I appreciate the prayers, I truly believe in the power 🙏

Thank you for your kind words. 

[Rusty1]

47 minutes ago, FarmMom said:

@getofflex

I'm in therapy now over all of this. The psychologist even felt sorry for me, for she said you were doing everything right. I am having to get over beating myself up over getting the vaccine and feeling like I got myself in this position. There is no way I could've known. I appreciate the prayers, I truly believe in the power 🙏

Thank you for your kind words. 

Try not to beat yourself up because you could have never predicted it would happen, same as the entire withdrawal process. It isnt your fault or because of any wrong decision you made. 

 

You made the right decision to get the vaccine because you thought it was best for you at the time. And we cant be 100% certain it caused your reaction. If it was the anxiety you experienced that triggered this, rather than the vaccine then the vaccine was just a tipping point for your CNS, it could have been anything that heightened your anxiety to a point.

 

It becomes a neverending path that leads to would have and could have.

The thing that will happen is you can choose to get back on a conservative hold and taper and you will feel better. It will happen through all the patience you put in.