jutland86 Posted December 11, 2022 Author Share Posted December 11, 2022 Sounds like withdrawal, @jozeff. This might sound silly, but do you clench a lot? And how is your posture? I used to be tired all the time, had poor sleep and a weird feeling of head pressure. Due to another issue I found a source that said these things may be connected. Since I started focusing on not clenching my muscles, having good posture and doing some exercises these things have gotten progressively better. I don’t know if it’s against the rulles here to post links to it, but I cand DM you want. Take care 2010/2011-?: Citaloprapm 40mg, 30 and 20 mg, and 10 mg the last couple of years. Beginning may 2021: After advice from GP skipped doses (10 mg) Mid may 2021: Went to 10 mg on one day and 5 the other day due to withdrawal End may 2021: ~7,5 mg (Started cutting 10 mg in quarters to keep track of when to take what) Beginning of june 2021: 7,5 mg (started on homemade liquid) 2021: Jul 7,5 mg 2022: 26th july 7,25 mg, 26th aug 6,75 mg, 24th sep 6,5 mg, 30th oct 6,25 mg Suppl AM: Fish oil, NAC, Vit B Complex, multivitamin, vit D, ashwagandha Suppl PM: Magnesium 200 mg, L-theanine 400 mg https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/24975-jutland86-advice-for-a-guy-from-denmark-wanting-to-taper/ Link to comment
jozeff Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Hi @jutland86 Yes, I do clench a lot. Poor posture en bend neck. Sometimes my neck is so stiff that I want to cry and I feel completely exhausted and even sick. I tend to shrug my shoulders intensely. I woul love to receive some tips or linksbif you want! I amdk crack my neck a lot and that gives me some relief but only a couple of minutes... Cheers! Jozeff Sep- 2016 - Okt 2017 citalopram some months 15 mg some months 20 mg Nov 2017- Apr 2018 citalopram 25 mg Apr 2018 - Jun 2018 citalopram 3 month TAPER too fast from 25mg to 16.5 mg (0.1 mg per day decrease, felt horrible and crashed) Jun 2018 - Aug13th 2018 citalopram trying to stabilize at 16.5 mg for 5 wks - August 14th 2018 - April 29th 2019 citalopram 18 mg (1.5 mg updose). 2019 apr 27 : START taper citalopram @ 18 mg: 29Jun 16.4 mg / 19aug 15.4 mg / 25aug 15.2 mg / 30sep 14.0 mg / 4dec 13.1 mg 2020 03Jan 12.75 mg / 28Jan 12.29 mg / 18Feb 11.83 mg, 25Feb 11.68 mg hold.. / 7May 11.33 mg hold...., 4Aug 10.98 mg / 5Dec 10.0 mg 4 month hold... 2021 30mar 9.8 mg / 06apr 9.5 mg / 13apr 9.4 mg / 14may 8,5 mg / 04jun 8,0 mg / 11jun 7.75 mg, 02jul 7.35 mg / 09jul 7.2 mg hold 3 weeks during holiday /31jul 7 mg/ 8aug 6.8 mg / 15aug 6.63mg / 22aug 6.5mg / 1sep 6.3 mg / 8sep 6.15 mg / 15sep 6.0 mg / 22sep 5.9 mg / 29sep 5.8 mg / 04 oct 5.65 mg / 10oct 5.55 mg / 17oct 5.45 mg / 24oct 5.35mg / 30oct 5.25 mg hold 3 wks / 22nov 5.15 mg / 01dec 5.1mg / 12dec 5.0mg / 20dec 4.85mg / 30dec 4.70mg 2022 08jan 4.5 mg / 16jan 4.4 mg / 23jan 4.3 mg / 27jan 4.2 mg / 18feb 4.1 mg / 25feb 4.0 mg / 04mar 3.9 mg / 11mar 3.75 mg / 18Mar 3.65 mg / 09apr 3.55 mg / 16apr 3.45 mg / 23apr 3.35 mg / 01may 3.25 mg / 8may 3.15 mg / 17may 3.10 mg / 28 may 3.0 mg / 7jun 2.94 mg / 18 Jun 2.88 mg / 27 jun 2.84 mg / 05 jul 2.80 mg / 16 jul 2.75 mg / 23 jul 2.70 mg / 01aug 2.65 mg / 09aug 2.60 mg hold 5wks / 18sep 2.55 mg / 25sep 2.5 mg /02oct 2.45 mg / 10oct 2.40 mg / 19oct 2.35 mg / 27oct 2.30 mg / 05nov 2.27 mg / 14nov 2.25 mg / 22nov 2.20 mg / 29nov 2.10mg / 09dec 2.05 mg / 15dec 2.0 mg 2023 hold 2.0 mg for 5 months / 05may 1.95 mg / 14may 1.90 mg / 24may 1.87 mg / 02jun 1.85 mg / 17jun 1.82 mg / 27jun 1.79 mg / 07jul 1.75 mg / 31jul 1.72 mg / 12aug 1.69mg / 27aug 1.67 mg / 04sep 1.65 mg / 09sep 1.63 mg / 22sep 1.61 mg / 27sep 1.60 mg / 12oct 1.58 mg / 18oct 1.56 mg / 31oct 1.54 mg / 06nov 1.52 mg / 18nov 1.50 mg / 04dec 1.48 mg / 11dec 1.46 mg / 22dec 1.45 mg / 28dec 1.44 mg 2024 01jan 1.43 mg / 06jan 1.42 mg/ 10jan 1.40 mg hold / 08apr 1.38 mg / 15apr 1.36 mg / 20apr 1.34 mg Link to comment
jutland86 Posted December 13, 2022 Author Share Posted December 13, 2022 Hi @jozeff Sounds just like me. I have found relief following the advice from this resource: https://mskneurology.com/chronic-muscle-clencher-woe-to-you/ , https://mskneurology.com/multifactorial-causes-solutions-chronic-neck-pain/ . There is also a youtube-page with the guy with specefic exercises. It can be boiled down to: Stop clenching, have good posture (Stop swayback posture, have a "long neck" and raise the shoulders a bit (implement this gradually), and do some exercises to strenghten weak muscles (and you probably have weak muscles in the neck and elsewhere). Oh, and stop cracking your neck! It stretches the muscles in the neck, and they are more than likely two be weak, so it will gradually make it worse. The muscles needs gentle strenghtening. If you start to strenghten your muscles it is key to slow (it's better to do less than more!!). Especially with the scalenes! With the scalenes you really, really have to go slow. Maybe start with doing only two reps (the head going up and down x 2) for these muscles only two times once or twice per week for a month before doing it three reps once or twice per week. And then do this for a month. You can make yourself worse if you try to train the scalenes to hard. (I did this myself). I do the following excercises (can be found on the youtube channel). And remember to have good posture, while you do them: I hope it makes sense. Monsday Vægt/noter Thursday Neck/arms Scalener-anterior 2 REST Scalener-medius 2 REST Trapezius 10 Light band 10 Levator 5 Light band 5 SCM Will do these later Will do these later Subopcippital 4 4 splenius capitis Will do these later Will do these later Longus colli & capitus 3 4 longus capitus 3 4 Neck extensors 3 4 Underarm supination 10 3 kg 10 Underam pronation 10 3 kg 10 Medical triceps Light band Lower back/groin Piriformis (each side) 10 10 Psoas (each side) 10 10 Clamshell (each side) 10 10 Pectinius Sholders Teres minor 10 2 kg 10 Supraspinatus 10 2 kg 10 Subscapularis 10 2 kg 10 infraspinatus 10 2 kg 10 Diverse Biceps 30 3 kg xxx xxx Kind regards 2010/2011-?: Citaloprapm 40mg, 30 and 20 mg, and 10 mg the last couple of years. Beginning may 2021: After advice from GP skipped doses (10 mg) Mid may 2021: Went to 10 mg on one day and 5 the other day due to withdrawal End may 2021: ~7,5 mg (Started cutting 10 mg in quarters to keep track of when to take what) Beginning of june 2021: 7,5 mg (started on homemade liquid) 2021: Jul 7,5 mg 2022: 26th july 7,25 mg, 26th aug 6,75 mg, 24th sep 6,5 mg, 30th oct 6,25 mg Suppl AM: Fish oil, NAC, Vit B Complex, multivitamin, vit D, ashwagandha Suppl PM: Magnesium 200 mg, L-theanine 400 mg https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/24975-jutland86-advice-for-a-guy-from-denmark-wanting-to-taper/ Link to comment
jozeff Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Wow, amazing information! Thanks a bunch! Are the numbers in yellow repetitions or kilograms? Looked at the website and it has a lot of good information. Tried a couple of exercises today Appreciate it! Cheers Jozeff Sep- 2016 - Okt 2017 citalopram some months 15 mg some months 20 mg Nov 2017- Apr 2018 citalopram 25 mg Apr 2018 - Jun 2018 citalopram 3 month TAPER too fast from 25mg to 16.5 mg (0.1 mg per day decrease, felt horrible and crashed) Jun 2018 - Aug13th 2018 citalopram trying to stabilize at 16.5 mg for 5 wks - August 14th 2018 - April 29th 2019 citalopram 18 mg (1.5 mg updose). 2019 apr 27 : START taper citalopram @ 18 mg: 29Jun 16.4 mg / 19aug 15.4 mg / 25aug 15.2 mg / 30sep 14.0 mg / 4dec 13.1 mg 2020 03Jan 12.75 mg / 28Jan 12.29 mg / 18Feb 11.83 mg, 25Feb 11.68 mg hold.. / 7May 11.33 mg hold...., 4Aug 10.98 mg / 5Dec 10.0 mg 4 month hold... 2021 30mar 9.8 mg / 06apr 9.5 mg / 13apr 9.4 mg / 14may 8,5 mg / 04jun 8,0 mg / 11jun 7.75 mg, 02jul 7.35 mg / 09jul 7.2 mg hold 3 weeks during holiday /31jul 7 mg/ 8aug 6.8 mg / 15aug 6.63mg / 22aug 6.5mg / 1sep 6.3 mg / 8sep 6.15 mg / 15sep 6.0 mg / 22sep 5.9 mg / 29sep 5.8 mg / 04 oct 5.65 mg / 10oct 5.55 mg / 17oct 5.45 mg / 24oct 5.35mg / 30oct 5.25 mg hold 3 wks / 22nov 5.15 mg / 01dec 5.1mg / 12dec 5.0mg / 20dec 4.85mg / 30dec 4.70mg 2022 08jan 4.5 mg / 16jan 4.4 mg / 23jan 4.3 mg / 27jan 4.2 mg / 18feb 4.1 mg / 25feb 4.0 mg / 04mar 3.9 mg / 11mar 3.75 mg / 18Mar 3.65 mg / 09apr 3.55 mg / 16apr 3.45 mg / 23apr 3.35 mg / 01may 3.25 mg / 8may 3.15 mg / 17may 3.10 mg / 28 may 3.0 mg / 7jun 2.94 mg / 18 Jun 2.88 mg / 27 jun 2.84 mg / 05 jul 2.80 mg / 16 jul 2.75 mg / 23 jul 2.70 mg / 01aug 2.65 mg / 09aug 2.60 mg hold 5wks / 18sep 2.55 mg / 25sep 2.5 mg /02oct 2.45 mg / 10oct 2.40 mg / 19oct 2.35 mg / 27oct 2.30 mg / 05nov 2.27 mg / 14nov 2.25 mg / 22nov 2.20 mg / 29nov 2.10mg / 09dec 2.05 mg / 15dec 2.0 mg 2023 hold 2.0 mg for 5 months / 05may 1.95 mg / 14may 1.90 mg / 24may 1.87 mg / 02jun 1.85 mg / 17jun 1.82 mg / 27jun 1.79 mg / 07jul 1.75 mg / 31jul 1.72 mg / 12aug 1.69mg / 27aug 1.67 mg / 04sep 1.65 mg / 09sep 1.63 mg / 22sep 1.61 mg / 27sep 1.60 mg / 12oct 1.58 mg / 18oct 1.56 mg / 31oct 1.54 mg / 06nov 1.52 mg / 18nov 1.50 mg / 04dec 1.48 mg / 11dec 1.46 mg / 22dec 1.45 mg / 28dec 1.44 mg 2024 01jan 1.43 mg / 06jan 1.42 mg/ 10jan 1.40 mg hold / 08apr 1.38 mg / 15apr 1.36 mg / 20apr 1.34 mg Link to comment
jutland86 Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 Hi @jozeff You are more than welcome. It has helped me a lot! Both keeping my neck “long” and not clenching. The ones in yellow are the number of reps. It’s not a lot, but it helps. And again - if you do the scalenes go very, very slow. It can really cause some nasty side effects if you do to many!! 2010/2011-?: Citaloprapm 40mg, 30 and 20 mg, and 10 mg the last couple of years. Beginning may 2021: After advice from GP skipped doses (10 mg) Mid may 2021: Went to 10 mg on one day and 5 the other day due to withdrawal End may 2021: ~7,5 mg (Started cutting 10 mg in quarters to keep track of when to take what) Beginning of june 2021: 7,5 mg (started on homemade liquid) 2021: Jul 7,5 mg 2022: 26th july 7,25 mg, 26th aug 6,75 mg, 24th sep 6,5 mg, 30th oct 6,25 mg Suppl AM: Fish oil, NAC, Vit B Complex, multivitamin, vit D, ashwagandha Suppl PM: Magnesium 200 mg, L-theanine 400 mg https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/24975-jutland86-advice-for-a-guy-from-denmark-wanting-to-taper/ Link to comment
Moderator bunchesofoats Posted January 15, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 15, 2023 Hey @jutland86, how is your taper going? 2005 - 2016 on & off methylphenidate and bupropion; short terms trials of other medications; tried many supplements 2016 Nov - 2017 Mar citalopram ramp up 0-->30mg (4 months) 2017 Mar - 2018 Jan held at 30mg (11months); taking 1.5x 20mg tablets, cutting 20mg tablets in half. inconsistency in split tablet led to extreme side effects. 2018 Feb - 2018 May taper 30mg-->20mg (3months), ~2.5mg/month, cutting tablets; at 20mg side effects (vertigo, headache, etc) disappeared 2018 May - 2019 Apr held at 20mg (11months); attempted taper from 20mg; tried ~17.5mg cutting tablets but symptoms too strong 2019 Apr - 2021 Jun tapered 20mg-->10mg (26months); ~5%/month dissolving tablets in water and pipetting with syringe; min lorazepam 2-3x/mo to mitigate symptoms 2021 Jun - 2023 Nov held at 10mg (29months) 2023 Nov - Nov 7 10mg solid to liquid; Dec 7 liquid 10mg; Dec 14 9.9mg; Dec 21 9.8mg; Dec 28 9.75mg; Jan 27 9.65mg; Feb 3 9.53mg; Feb 18 9.45mg Link to comment
jutland86 Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 Hi @bunchesofoats Not much to report as I'm still holding on 6,25 mg at the moment, because the last few months have been busy. I think I'll stay at this dose for at while. How are things going for you? Take care 2010/2011-?: Citaloprapm 40mg, 30 and 20 mg, and 10 mg the last couple of years. Beginning may 2021: After advice from GP skipped doses (10 mg) Mid may 2021: Went to 10 mg on one day and 5 the other day due to withdrawal End may 2021: ~7,5 mg (Started cutting 10 mg in quarters to keep track of when to take what) Beginning of june 2021: 7,5 mg (started on homemade liquid) 2021: Jul 7,5 mg 2022: 26th july 7,25 mg, 26th aug 6,75 mg, 24th sep 6,5 mg, 30th oct 6,25 mg Suppl AM: Fish oil, NAC, Vit B Complex, multivitamin, vit D, ashwagandha Suppl PM: Magnesium 200 mg, L-theanine 400 mg https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/24975-jutland86-advice-for-a-guy-from-denmark-wanting-to-taper/ Link to comment
Moderator bunchesofoats Posted January 27, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 27, 2023 I'm holding as well - at 10mg. I want to start tapering again, but I'm waiting until after some planned travel in the spring. 2005 - 2016 on & off methylphenidate and bupropion; short terms trials of other medications; tried many supplements 2016 Nov - 2017 Mar citalopram ramp up 0-->30mg (4 months) 2017 Mar - 2018 Jan held at 30mg (11months); taking 1.5x 20mg tablets, cutting 20mg tablets in half. inconsistency in split tablet led to extreme side effects. 2018 Feb - 2018 May taper 30mg-->20mg (3months), ~2.5mg/month, cutting tablets; at 20mg side effects (vertigo, headache, etc) disappeared 2018 May - 2019 Apr held at 20mg (11months); attempted taper from 20mg; tried ~17.5mg cutting tablets but symptoms too strong 2019 Apr - 2021 Jun tapered 20mg-->10mg (26months); ~5%/month dissolving tablets in water and pipetting with syringe; min lorazepam 2-3x/mo to mitigate symptoms 2021 Jun - 2023 Nov held at 10mg (29months) 2023 Nov - Nov 7 10mg solid to liquid; Dec 7 liquid 10mg; Dec 14 9.9mg; Dec 21 9.8mg; Dec 28 9.75mg; Jan 27 9.65mg; Feb 3 9.53mg; Feb 18 9.45mg Link to comment
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