Mountainsky: off multiple drugs

[Mountainsky]

Hello,

 

Wow where do I begin? I was polydrugged. I've been off and on ALL KINDS of psych meds the last 20 years, Paxil being the longest (about 10 years.) I tapered the Paxil back in late 2018. It was only a 6 week taper untill I was completely off (I know not good too quick!) I had 2 good months then stuff started to hit the fan in early 2019.

 

Other stressful factors were happening in my life too along with getting diagnosed with a chronic physical illness which we actually thought was the sole cause of my pain and mental state...still very could be but no treatment is working after 2.5 years. I had a friend tell me this could very well be Protracted Withdrawal Syndrome.

 

The symptoms only get worse, occasional flu like symptoms, body aches,  headaches , debilitating chronic fatigue, chills, sweats, burning skin, fast heart rate (tachy). My mental symptoms are their own kind if hell...OCD, bouts of extreme worry and fear, anxiety, rage, feels bipolar-like at times. Is this PWS?

 

My quality of life has diminished greatly in these 2.5 years.  I see no hope for a cure or a happy content life. I am so frightened and angry. Covid hasn't helped either obviously.

 

What gives? Who has been in this situation or knows someone similar?  Thanks guys.

Edited August 15, 2021 by arbor

[arbor]

Hello @Mountainsky,

Welcome to SA.

 

I'm very sorry to hear that you are dealing with these terrible, but typical withdrawal symptoms. 

To get you started, can you please give us specific information about your drug history for all drugs you are on and have been on, especially for the past 18-24 months?  It would be especially helpful to have the details of your drugs in a concise list (no symptoms), only drug names, specific dates (as best you can say for example early March if you don't recall the day) and dosages of each medication decrease or increase.  Please read the link below for instructions.  This will allow us to give you the best guidance.  

 

How to List Drug History in Signature

 

5 hours ago, Mountainsky said:

I had a friend tell me this could very well be Protracted Withdrawal Syndrome.

 

Yes, sadly, what you're experiencing sounds like PAWS, or Protracted AD Withdrawal Syndrome, also standing for Protracted Acute Withdrawal Syndrome.  (Hell, is my term for it.)  Since you are 2.5 years into recovery, it's not unusual to still be feeling the full brunt of it.  However people in our situation do--with incredible patience--heal.  Patience and time are our allies.  As you browse and get to know the site, I encourage you to read the Success stories: Recovery from psychiatric drug withdrawal.  We need whatever hope and encouragement we can get and give.  Most of us are still finding that the medical world, while getting us into this mess, has little to offer for how to get out of it.

 

Here is a video you might find interesting:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCPNC2a_oyg&t=193s

6 hours ago, Mountainsky said:

What gives? Who has been in this situation or knows someone similar?

Here are 2 links I recommend for a broad, knowledgeable, experienced assessment from Alto Strata, the founder of SA.

Surviving Antidepressants: An Interview with ****** Framer ...

What I have learnt from helping thousands of ... - 

I also want to make sure you have some of our recommendations for self care during withdrawal.

 

symptoms and self care   

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

We don't suggest many supplements, but 3 that many of us find helpful are magnesium and omega-3 fish oil. Here are the links for info about those. It is suggested to add one at a time, and start with a low dose to see how it affects you. 

 

Magnesium

 

Omega 3 Fish Oil

 

Melatonin 

This is your Introduction site where you can ask questions and connect with other members.

I'm glad you found us, and I look forward to your eventual recovery.

Arbor

 

 

[arbor]

Dear @Mountainsky--I've had to merge your comment on Broussellsprout's topic here as you weren't yet signed in when you posted it.  If you wish to repost it, you can after you respond with your signature.

Best wishes,

Arbor

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @Mountainsky

 

I moved your posts here to start your own Introductions topic, where you can get answers to your basic questions and track your progress.

 

As @arbor, please tell us more about your drug history in your signature.

 

How has your symptom pattern changed in the last 6 months?

[Mountainsky]

Only getting worse in the last 6 months.

[Altostrata]

8 hours ago, Mountainsky said:

The symptoms only get worse, occasional flu like symptoms, body aches,  headaches , debilitating chronic fatigue, chills, sweats, burning skin, fast heart rate (tachy). My mental symptoms are their own kind if hell...OCD, bouts of extreme worry and fear, anxiety, rage, feels bipolar-like at times. Is this PWS?

 

How did these symptoms get worse over the last 6 months? Are you currently taking any other drugs?

 

What is your sleep pattern?

[Mountainsky]

I sleep alot unfortunately, 10 hours a night. Usually I get up once or twice to use the bathroom. Im up most mornings at 4:45 for work. I notice on the workdays I'll get up at 3:00 with bad anxiety, constantly looking at the time until I know I need to be up.

 

2.5 years ago I was diagnosed with chronic Lyme disease and 2 other co-infections. Symptoms that started around the time I had anxiety,  in my early teens. Always was "dismissed", that's when the psych drugs began, all kinds of psych drugs not just anxiety ones. Awful physical symptoms that only got worse as I got older, along with anxiety, depression, OCD, intrusive thoughts and a suicide attempt in 2010 at the age of 25.

 

The meds for the Lyme aren't working, each treatment protocol for the Lyme and Co's the last 2.5 years seems to be making me sicker. Even my Lyme physician questions if I even have it now , or maybe I did but now this sickness could be something else....that's when I think is this Protracted Withdrawal Syndrome?  Been off and on Zoloft since last fall now. Currently on 100mg.

 

Sorry for delayed response!

Edited August 21, 2021 by Mountainsky
Adding more details

[Mountainsky]

*also* when I stopped the Paxil that's when I started Lyme treatment ( 2.5 years ago). So that fuels my frustration. This is the million dollar question...is it

Lyme or is this PWS?

[Acsr]

On 8/21/2021 at 1:31 PM, Mountainsky said:

*also* when I stopped the Paxil that's when I started Lyme treatment ( 2.5 years ago). So that fuels my frustration. This is the million dollar question...is it

Lyme or is this PWS?

Someone exactly like me but I haven’t stare lyme treatment yet …

[Mountainsky]

As you can see from my intro the longest psy drug I was on was Paxil. After 10 or so years on it I tapered and stopped, I went from 40mg to 0g in 6 weeks.... yea too quick.  I did this in late 2018 till early 2019. January 3rd 2019 was my very last Paxil pill. If this is infact PWS how do I cope?

 

Paxil is hell of a drug, My psych NP told me they do not even give this drug to new patients anymore.  I know reinstating the Paxil would be a big mistake but how else to do I deal with this PWS? I have been on Zoloft on and on for about 11 months now. I am currently on 100mg. I do not want to be on anything anymore, it is not helping I feel no different and it seems if anything my symptoms are increasing and giving me more harm than good. Sometimes I feel as though the Paxil did possible permanent damage esp where I only did a 6 week taper. I know now to get off the Zoloft It'll have to be much slower...the 10mg every 4 weeks at minimum.

 

Symptoms- Burning skin, night sweats, body pain like someone beat me up, debilitating fatigue, almost daily headaches, memory loss, brain fog.  Anxiety, OCD and paranoia that I've never seen in my life!  I told a friend the other day I truly feel like I'm slowly dying. I only have energy for my job and that's it. When I'm not working I am sleeping. In the last 3 months it seems I have hit rock bottom.

[getofflex]

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

[Mountainsky]

Oh ok no problem, sorry about that! 

[Mountainsky]

How do I taper doing the 10% /4 week?  I bought a scale but it was to measure a pill weight, ugh. How do you do a dosage cut? Currently on 100mg of Zoloft.  Thanks!

[brassmonkey]

The weight of the pill and the dose strength are in direct proportion to each other. So if you reduce the pill weight by 10% you automatically reduce the dose strength by 10%.

 

What is the average weight of one of your zoloft tablets?

[Greatful]

@Mountainsky  Welcome to SA.  I am sorry you are feeling so awful.....These drugs are a very powerful and really change the chemical make up of our brains.  You are a incredible strong woman,  you have endured so some much pain from these meds and you are still moving forward. 

Some how we have to find the strength from deep down inside and low and behold there it is......

 

Posting and reaching out to other member is very helpful for both you and the members.  We are all in this together and will do what we can to support and encourage each other.

 

Have you had a chance to  check through the site?  I know there is a lot to look at, but I would recommend the Symptoms & Self-Care forum.  This is where I found out the crazy symptoms I was having  were  typical wd symptoms.  Unexplained fear, ocd, etc.  Some really good advice from members on coping skills.

Meditation is a great skill to learn.

I am curious about your taper on the Zoloft.  Are you going to start soon? 

Hang in there❤️

[Mountainsky]

My psych NP told me to break up the 100mg pill, put it into 100ml of juice,  take a vile and pull out 1ml. Up it every few days. Anyone have experience with this ?

[Acsr]

21 hours ago, Mountainsky said:

My psych NP told me to break up the 100mg pill, put it into 100ml of juice,  take a vile and pull out 1ml. Up it every few days. Anyone have experience with this ?

Hi 👋. I can’t help you in that unfortunately I wish I could, I m so sorry you are going through this I’m in a similar situation but I’m a bit worse … I would like to ask you if you are thinking of Paxil reinstatement? I don’t know if should try but I’m too scared as well … wish you the best ❤️

[Greatful]

@Mountainsky

How are you doing?  I am wondering if you tapering and how it is going?

 

[Mountainsky]

I'm on liquid zoloft. I was on 100mg pill form, that equals to 20mg in liquid correct? The rational would be 5ml of liquid Zoloft I take into 4oz of water to dilute?

[Greatful]

@Mountainsky I can't answer your question but if you want someone, like a moderator to help you to tag them you need to 

@ and then type their name and click on the name and it will highlight like yours did.  This will notify them

 

 

Good luck on your taper. 

[brassmonkey]

The strength of both the liquid and the tablet should be the same. A 100mg tablet would be equal to 100mg of liquid. However, 100mg or liquid does not usually equal 100mL of liquid. You have to pay close attention to your units of measure.

 

It is important to know the Dilution Ratio of the liquid. This will be stated on the bottle as something like 1:1, 2:1, 5:1 20:1. This means that each one (1) mL of liquid will contain 1, 2, 5,  or 20mg of active ingredient. Divide 100mg by this number and it will give you the volume in mL of the equal dose. If the bottle says 2:1 you need 50mL to get 100mg of AI, 5:1 you need 20mL and 20:1 you need 5mL. That amount can then be added to any amount of water to make it easier to drink.

 

What is the dilution ration on the bottle?

What dose are you trying to take?

[Mountainsky]

Hi brassmonkey. Sorry for delay. I spoke to my Psych NP yesterday on a telehealth followup and she confirmed a 100mg Zoloft tablet is equal to 5ml of liquid Zoloft (20 mg per ml). Mixed in 4oz of water.

[brassmonkey]

"liquid Zoloft (20 mg per ml)."

 

That is the important part. It means you have a dilution ratio of 20:1.

Mixing it with the water is just to make it easier to drink. Unless you are only drinking part of the water, which is basically how you would do a liquid taper.

 

Are you planning to or have you already switched from tablet to liquid?

[Mountainsky]

The liquid Zoloft is now messing with my stomach. 5 minutes after taking I feel extremely nauseated with chills.  

[Mountainsky]

Probably gonna go back to pills, its too late to return my scale anyway so I can use it. The liquid Zoloft is horrible, messy and my stomach acts up everytime I take it regardless if I have a full or empty stomach.

[Mountainsky]

In absolute hell. My brain's going a mile a minute. I'm worried over everything. I'm having daily headaches, horrible body pain and fatigue. I don't know now of this is all caused by the anxiety/intrusive thoughts and obsessive worry. I'm really getting scared. I'm afraid I might have a psych breakdown at this point. I feel as though my brain and mind is shaking inside from all this.

[Altostrata]

Hello, @Mountainsky. You might put the liquid dose into a large gelatin capsule, if it's small enough, immediately before taking it, or put it in applesauce, which may insulate it from your stomach.

[ChessieCat]

There are many existing topics on SA.  SA likes to keep similar information in one place so it is easier for members to find.  Before creating a new topic, please check to see if one already exists.  Use the site search function or an internet search engine and add site:survivingantidepressants.org to the search term.

 

Your new topic has been moved here.  If you read through the topic you might find the answer to your question/s:

 

king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil

[Mountainsky]

Scale

 

I saw the Gemini 20 scale and another kind, much cheaper. Does it matter what scale to use? The Gemini 20 was $50 on Amazon, kind of pricey. 

 

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by ChessieCat
added topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

using-a-scale-to-weigh-and-measure-doses

 

There are other similar scales available.  Link to search for Gemini 20 in the above topic and there might be mention of what others use in some of those posts:

 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/search/?q=gemini

 

[Mountainsky]

I saw one on Amazon for $20,  it was a Gem 20,  000.1g

 

Is this still OK?

[LizzieTish]

Hi @Mountainsky, I'm also shopping for a scale. The GEMINI-20, which is $50 on Amazon, is on sale at Walmart for $32.48. I've read other comments on SA that the Gem 20 0.001g scale is also fine. Good luck with your taper! 💗🤗

[Mountainsky]

I finally started the process officially today weighing my Zoloft. Been on 100 mg for a year.

 

Bought Scale, mortar, veggie capsules etc on Amazon. I watched many times what thst gentleman did while using the scale to taper off his Klonopin (his youtube video was helpful!!).

 

I did what he did, crushed 7 pills  weighed them whole with a total of 2.161 ÷7 with .309 for 1 pill weight. 10% reduction would be .278

 

However, there's still a good amount of crushed pill powder left. I weighed 7 pills,  never forgot any when I transfer it crushed into my 7 veggie capsules. Why is that? The Zoloft tablet is a very light colored yellow, this looks like the outer "shell" of the Zoloft tablet and its hard to crush it completely. I don't want to under-dose at this point and run into trouble!

 

I'm so OCD about doing something wrong! Liquid Zoloft from the pharmacy or making my own liquid is off the table, I tried that and was even more frustrating, it really messes my stomach ( even when I did it on a full stomach)

[Mountainsky]

Dissolved Zoloft in water HORRIBLE

 

I crushed my zoloft pills, measured and put them in veg capsules. It got to be too messy and my hands shook too much. I don't think I had accurate measurements. Now I'm dissolving the pill in water and measuring with oral syringe like before.... It tastes horrible! Immediately my stomach is upset and I have the chills. My last option would be a compound pharmacy *IF* my doc agrees to it and *IF* my insurance covers it.  What gives?

 

Edited April 2, 2022 by ChessieCat
added topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

Q:  What concentration are you making?  You could make the solution weaker by using more water OR you could measure your dose and add it to more water or to fruit juice (but not grapefruit) to take.

 

how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules

 

Q:  Are you taking your liquid on an empty stomach?  If yes, then you could try taking it after you have eaten.

 

When changing form of a drug it is suggested to do a cross over because it is gentler on the system.

 

cross-over-changing-form-eg-tablet-to-liquid-of-drug-or-changing-brand-of-same-drug

[Mountainsky]

I do it on a full stomach, yes. Usually 4oz of water. I'll try ( once I do the measure with oral syringe) to add something into it thats tasteful, that's a good idea thank you. Yes I know about citrus but what about OJ  ?