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lex1989: escitalopram / Cipralex and clonazepam / Rivotril / Klonopin


lex1989

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Hello all,

 

My name is Alex and I was prescribed 1/2 x 10mg Escitalopram (Cipralex), 0.5 x Clonazepam (Rivotril aka Klonopin) for about 5 months now, for mostly anxiety.

 

After already 2 months I hit tolerance / dependence with Clonazepam and from that point, for the little I knew, I should have give up on it, but my psychiatrist pushed it even more from 3/4 to 1 (0.5 Clonazepam). Clonazepam is the "horror" benzo of them all, but I did not knew back then and would have been fantastic if I removed it since month 2, instead of keep it in 3 more months.

 

Escitalopram did not help me either, as if it had did, I would not been feeling worse after 5 months, than I was in the first place before taking the medicine.

 

I really I very sad of my decision to actually go to the psychiatrist in the first place, but I did now knew much then. As I know now, the symptoms that I had then where really easy compared to the ones I have now (after 5 months of "treatment"). But that is what usually people do, driven by fear, instead of actually be a little realist and powerful and first, at least, document yourself of what you are doing in the first place.

I have found At last a life book, by Paul David and I can say it's a life saver for the anxiety suffering people out there, but I just found it 3 weeks ago, after that I decided to start tapper the benzo. 

 

All this being said I am now on this schedule of benzo withdrawal attached in the picture.

benzo.JPG

Unfortunately I got to 0.3 from 0.5 in 3 weeks instead of 8 and I feel quite a lot of withdrawal symptoms ( mild depression, mild / intermediate anxiety (but much longer than before), mild headaches, dizziness, mild blurred vision. I thought as I was just 5 months on these 2 drugs would make it to a fast withdrawal, now I know it is not the case and I need to listen to my body.

Will hold benzo for now at 0.3 to stabilize.

 

The big question is :

Should I start the Escitalopram taper as well ?

I read a lot already on the forum and I see usually people take it 1 by 1. Of course I asked a psychiatrist of tapering both at the same time and she said if I do it slow it's ok as I did not took them for long time and the doze is quite small.

But I know you guys know better and would be much appreciated if you give me a hint here.

So a small taper from the 1/2 x 10 mg Escitalopram , like 10-20% each month at the same time with the benzo taper would make sense ? Of course I will try to listen to my body / brain response, but I am unsure how much time will be needed to feel the withdrawal from Escitalopram, from Clonazepam is easy, in 2-3 days you feel the "response" of the cut, because of the 18-50 hours lifetime of it.

 

Cheers !

 

 

 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator

Hello, and welcome to SA.  We are a peer owned and run forum of people who have been or are getting off of psychiatric drugs.  You have come to the right place.  Congratulations for starting to come off of psychiatric drugs.  

 

4 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Escitalopram did not help me either, as if it had did, I would not been feeling worse after 5 months, than I was in the first place before taking the medicine.

What side effects did you have while you were on the escitalopram?  Did you take it every day, or did you skip or miss doses? 

 

4 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Should I start the Escitalopram taper as well ?

Not yet.  I suggest that you hold on your current doses of your drugs for a while, at least a couple of months or more, to allow your nervous system to heal, and allow your symptoms to subside.  

 

Our brains become dependent on these drugs after only being on them for 1 month, unfortunately.  If it were me, I wait until I was stable, and then start a taper of the escitalopram, while holding on my current dose of Klonopin.  How is your sleep?  

 

Can you please give us specific information about your drug history for all drugs you are on and have been on, especially for the past 18-24 months?  It would be especially helpful to have the details of your drugs in a concise list (no symptoms), only drug names, specific dates (as best you can say for example early March if you don't recall the day) and dosages of each medication decrease or increase.  Please read the link below for instructions.  This will allow us to give you the best guidance.  

 

How to List Drug History in Signature

 

Here is some information about how these drugs actually work.  This helps you understand why you have the withdrawal symptoms.  

 

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

 

This helps you understand what withdrawal syndrome is: 

 

 Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

What is Happening in Your Brain

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

 

Also, as we are recovering, we suggest keeping things slow, simple, and stable. 

 

Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

 

We don't suggest many supplements, but 2 that many of us find helpful are magnesium and omega-3 fish oil. Here are the links for info about those. It is suggested to add one at a time, and start with a low dose to see how it affects you. 


Magnesium

 

Omega 3 Fish Oil

 

I've given you quite a bit of information here.  Please feel free to ask any questions, and take you time to digest it all.  You will get better, as long as you avoid psychiatrists and their drugs.  Hang in there, and we look forward to hearing from you again. 

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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Thank you for the reply getofflex.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

What side effects did you have while you were on the escitalopram?  Did you take it every day, or did you skip or miss doses? 

I had just the first day very increased anxiety and big sleep disturbance, but this is normal for every AD, until the body get's used to.

After that it stabilized. I did take it every day, never skipped a dose, but did not seem to help in my anxiety either.

Probably after I will taper out Clonazepam completely I can tell if Escitalopram help or not. Anyway I'm looking forward to tap down that as well.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

Not yet.  I suggest that you hold on your current doses of your drugs for a while, at least a couple of months or more, to allow your nervous system to heal, and allow your symptoms to subside.  

Ok. Will do that. So tapper off the Clonazepam (aka Klonopin, Rivotril) first, then Escitalopram ? That means about ~ 2 months until I get rid of the Clonazepam for good.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

Our brains become dependent on these drugs after only being on them for 1 month, unfortunately.  If it were me, I wait until I was stable, and then start a taper of the escitalopram, while holding on my current dose of Klonopin.  How is your sleep?  

You are right. I am somehow stable now, I did hold Clonazepam for for 0.3 for a while, because I got from 0.5 to 0.3 to quick.

My sleep right now is "so so", sometimes I sleep ok, sometimes a struggle a bit, but in most of the cases with occasionally sleep anxiety and disturbance I usually manage to sleep 7-8 h / night. Of course it's not the resting sleep I had before anxiety.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

Can you please give us specific information about your drug history for all drugs you are on and have been on, especially for the past 18-24 months?  It would be especially helpful to have the details of your drugs in a concise list (no symptoms), only drug names, specific dates (as best you can say for example early March if you don't recall the day) and dosages of each medication decrease or increase.  Please read the link below for instructions.  This will allow us to give you the best guidance.  

I did complete my signature, hope it's detailed now. 

Prescribed Clonazepam (Rivotril aka Klonopin) + Escitalopram  (Cipralex) for anxiety

27/04/2021 Escitalopram x 1/4 Clonazepam x 0.75 

14/05/2021 Escitalopram x 1/2 Clonazepam x 0.5 

30/05/2021 Escitalopram x 3/4 Clonazepam x 0.375 

14/06/2021 Escitalopram x 1 (10mg) Clonazepam x 0.25 (started to feel anxious again, and gaining sleep disturbance)

27/08/2021  Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.5 (tolerance / physicals dependence reached anxiety going way up, sleep disturbance persisted)

28/08/2021 Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.475 (tapering started, more / longer anxiety)

14/09/2021 Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.3 (started to fell awful, long / all day mild / medium anxiety, mild depression, head aches, dizziness, blurred vision, problems concentrating, going way to fast , hold)

22/09/2021  Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.3(started to feel much better still having anxiety, added l-Theanine x 200mg -> working well)

Note: Until 27/08/2021 I respected each of the psychiatrics advice, started to document myself and seen that the benzodiazepine got me even worse than I was before the treatment (maybe the AD as well), started to tapper.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

Here is some information about how these drugs actually work.  This helps you understand why you have the withdrawal symptoms.  

 

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

 

This helps you understand what withdrawal syndrome is: 

 

 Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

What is Happening in Your Brain

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

 

Also, as we are recovering, we suggest keeping things slow, simple, and stable. 

 

Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

Thank you for the hints, I have pretty much seem them all.

I just can't believe so much harm can be done taking psychiatrics drugs just for 5 months (in my case), I mean when the point that Clonazepam hit tolerance / physicals dependency I started to feel more anxiety then before I took the medicine in the first place...

As well, after I start tapering down this poison of Clonazepam, I started to feel even worse: all day mild / moderate anxiety, mild depression, head aches, dizziness, blurred vision, etc. I stabilized now. Will continue slowly.

 

One important here thing, coping with anxiety. I will try to post these more often on any forum / place I'm in:

"At last a life" by Paul David. The best idea of anxiety relief and recovery out there.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

We don't suggest many supplements, but 2 that many of us find helpful are magnesium and omega-3 fish oil. Here are the links for info about those. It is suggested to add one at a time, and start with a low dose to see how it affects you. 


Magnesium

 

Omega 3 Fish Oil

Thank you for this hint as well.

I have to mention here I am taking some supplements : Magnesium, Mega 3 Fish Oil, Stress Management, Rhodiolin, Vitamin D drops.

Also I noticed 100-200 mg of L-Theanine is alleviating some of my anxiety and that is actually great, some people said it can help anxiety, specially during withdrawal.

As well I have been told that CBD oil can help anxiety as well, would give it a try.

Do you think there are to many supplements ? Usually they should not do harm, at least not this ones.

 

On 9/19/2021 at 1:13 AM, getofflex said:

 

I've given you quite a bit of information here.  Please feel free to ask any questions, and take you time to digest it all.  You will get better, as long as you avoid psychiatrists and their drugs.  Hang in there, and we look forward to hearing from you again. 

Any information is very well welcomed. I understood it all. 

I really I pissed of on myself that I took psychiatrists drugs in the first place, but I did not knew better back than and I got scared.

It seem that I don't have GAD. I started with some kind of panic disorder, but panic attacks are pretty much history for me.

I just have some "ordinary" anxiety disorder that remained and it's increased by the withdrawal symptoms as well (mild / medium fear,

mild worries, restlessness). 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

So tapper off the Clonazepam (aka Klonopin, Rivotril) first, then Escitalopram ?

No, we generally suggest you taper off the most activating drug first, which is the escitalopram.  That way, it will help to preserve your sleep, and make WD easier.  Here is a link about that:   

 

Which drug to taper first?

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

I usually manage to sleep 7-8 h / night. Of course it's not the resting sleep I had before anxiety.

I'm very glad to hear this.  Major insomnia during a WD is extremely challenging.  

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

27/08/2021  Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.5 (tolerance / physicals dependence reached anxiety going way up, sleep disturbance persisted)

28/08/2021 Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.475 (tapering started, more / longer anxiety)

14/09/2021 Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.3 (started to fell awful, long / all day mild / medium anxiety, mild depression, head aches, dizziness, blurred vision, problems concentrating, going way to fast , hold)

22/09/2021  Escitalopram x 0.5 Clonazepam x 0.3(s

Instead of saying escitalopram x 0.5, please list the strength in milligrams.  So, if you are taking 1/2 of a 10 mg tablet, say 5 mg.  This way the staff will know how exactly how much you are on and can better advise you.  Please do the same for the clonazepam.  Thank you.  Also, please delete the symptoms from your drug sig.  

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

As well, after I start tapering down this poison of Clonazepam, I started to feel even worse: all day mild / moderate anxiety, mild depression, head aches, dizziness, blurred vision, etc. I stabilized now. Will continue slowly.

It's probably because you were tapering too fast.  The symptoms were caused by the drug being removed from your system faster than your brain was able to adjust to the lower dose.  Tapering is best done extremely slowly, and we generally taper by 10% of the current dose no more than once every 4 weeks, so that the taper becomes exponentially smaller.

 

 Why Taper by 10% of my Dosage  

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

As well I have been told that CBD oil can help anxiety as well, would give it a try.

I think I would stay away from that, if I were you.  We generally don't suggest using marijuana or related products to deal with WD.  Please read and heed the first post in this link: 

 

Cannabis, Marijuana, CBD, ect.

 

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

Do you think there are to many supplements ? Usually they should not do harm, at least not this ones.

There are a huge amount of supplements out there, because they are money makers.  The only ones we recommend are omega 3, magnesium, and in some cases, melatonin for sleep issues.  

 

About Tests, Supplements, Treatments, Diet

 

On 9/22/2021 at 12:04 PM, lex1989 said:

really I pissed of on myself that I took psychiatrists drugs in the first place, but I did not knew better back than and I got scared.

Welcome to the club.  Most of us here have done the same thing.  We trusted out doctors and the health professionals.  Try not to beat up on yourself - you did the best you could at the time, which the rest of us did, too.  

 

Fortunately, there are many effective non drug ways to reduce anxiety.  Cognitive Behavioral therapy is just one way - there are many others.  Hang in there, eventually you will heal and be able to get off these drugs.  The 2 big keys are time and patience.

 

 

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
13 hours ago, getofflex said:

No, we generally suggest you taper off the most activating drug first, which is the escitalopram.  That way, it will help to preserve your sleep, and make WD easier.  Here is a link about that:   

 I've read the topic. Thank you for the hint, I really did not knew that. I am stable with 0.27 mg Clonazepam now and would need 1.5 months to get rid of it completely. I have also just 5 mg of Escitalopram. So you suggest still, in this condition to remain at 0.27 mg Clonazepam and start tapper the Escitalopram?

 I am unsure which medication was / is generating the anxious symptoms, I am not certain Escitalopram was helping anyway.

I've read all in the topics, I just don't want to extend another 3-4 months on being under benzo, but I guess that is the best approach still.

 

13 hours ago, getofflex said:

I'm very glad to hear this.  Major insomnia during a WD is extremely challenging.  

Indeed. I usually have a 9-10 hour gap where I can sleep 7-8 hours. For example I put myself to bed at 0:00 and have the clock set at 10 am. Because I wake up a lot during the night (depending on the day). This sleep disturbance has occurred when I increased first time the Escitalopram to 10 mg and decreased at the same time Clonazepam at 0.25, 3 months ago (at the psychiatrist suggestion), then I got to 5 mg Escitalopram and 0.5 Clonazepam in 2 weeks. I assume my sleep got disturbed back then, I am unsure which medication did it, maybe both.

13 hours ago, getofflex said:

Instead of saying escitalopram x 0.5, please list the strength in milligrams.  So, if you are taking 1/2 of a 10 mg tablet, say 5 mg.  This way the staff will know how exactly how much you are on and can better advise you.  Please do the same for the clonazepam.  Thank you.  Also, please delete the symptoms from your drug sig.  

Done.

 

13 hours ago, getofflex said:

It's probably because you were tapering too fast.  The symptoms were caused by the drug being removed from your system faster than your brain was able to adjust to the lower dose.  Tapering is best done extremely slowly, and we generally taper by 10% of the current dose no more than once every 4 weeks, so that the taper becomes exponentially smaller.

 Indeed I got to fast.

I stabilized now. At 0.27 mg Clonazepam. On BenzoBuddies their suggestion is 10% each 7-14 weeks, but listen to your symptoms.

 

13 hours ago, getofflex said:

I think I would stay away from that, if I were you.  We generally don't suggest using marijuana or related products to deal with WD.  Please read and heed the first post in this link: 

 

Cannabis, Marijuana, CBD, ect.

 This is very interesting, I saw a lot of controversial topics related to CBD oil and taking psychiatrics medicine at the same time.

So I guess the CBD oil can be good when you are clean. Many studies says that it helps anxiety and so on, but ofc CBD with no THC in it and with low doses. It has been prove being a very good "treatment" for many things, but again in low doses and with no other interactions (medicine or withdrawal from medicine).

 I did not took it, just thought about it, will stick with L-Theanine, 200 mg works very well.

 

13 hours ago, getofflex said:

Welcome to the club.  Most of us here have done the same thing.  We trusted out doctors and the health professionals.  Try not to beat up on yourself - you did the best you could at the time, which the rest of us did, too.  

 

Fortunately, there are many effective non drug ways to reduce anxiety.  Cognitive Behavioral therapy is just one way - there are many others.  Hang in there, eventually you will heal and be able to get off these drugs.  The 2 big keys are time and patience.

Yes, you are definitely right.

 

By the way. Of topic maybe.

Is the Clonazepam in the same situation as Escitalopram regarding the active solution inside the pill ?

I've saw a topic on the forum regarding this, saying that Escitalopram (and other AD's) should not be cut with tools as you reduce your % out from the pills , instead crush it and mix it, then take out the needed % from the pill, because of the active solution being spread in the pill.

 I hope you understood what I am asking :D.

 At the moment I was cutting the Clonazepam and scale the pill, calculating the % based on the scale.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
10 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I am stable with 0.27 mg Clonazepam now and would need 1.5 months to get rid of it completely.

It looks like you just reduced your clonazepam today.  If I were you, I would not reduce the clonazepam.  I would go back to 0.3 mg clonazepam,  hold on your 5 mg ( I assume) of Lexapro for while, and stabilize before I would make any more dose changes.  If you reduce the Benzo first, you are likely to go into painful WD that may include high anxiety and sleeplessness, and you don't want this, trust me.  Did you read the link above about this "which drug to taper first"?  Please don't be in a hurry to get off any drugs.  This could very possibly cause severe WD and destabilization of your nervous system, which could necessitate you reinstating and taking a long time to stabilize.  In the long run, it will make it take longer to get off your drugs, and you could be miserable in the meantime.  

 

10 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I am unsure which medication was / is generating the anxious symptoms

I don't believe the medication itself is generating the anxious symptoms, I believe it is the too fast taper that is generating it.  You jumped from 0.5 to 0.3 of the Benzo in just 3 weeks.  That is why I suggested you not make any dose changes for a while, so your system can have time to adjust.  

 

10 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I just don't want to extend another 3-4 months on being under benzo, but I guess that is the best approach still.

We at SA have a harm reduction approach.  We suggest people do very gradual and cautious tapers, and not worry about rushing to get off the drugs, which causes more problems in the long run.  

 

10 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Is the Clonazepam in the same situation as Escitalopram regarding the active solution inside the pill ?

Not sure what you are asking.  The clonazepam is a completely different drug than the escitalopram.  When you are ready to taper escitalopram, after you stabilize, I suggest you make or buy the liquid.  It is easy to measure in any amount in precise doses.  Here is information about both of these drugs.  

 

Tips for Tapering Escitalopram

 

https://www.drugs.com/drug-class/benzodiazepines.html

 

https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-920-6006/klonopin-oral/clonazepam-oral/details

 

 

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
17 hours ago, getofflex said:

It looks like you just reduced your clonazepam today.  If I were you, I would not reduce the clonazepam.  I would go back to 0.3 mg clonazepam,  hold on your 5 mg ( I assume) of Lexapro for while, and stabilize before I would make any more dose changes.  If you reduce the Benzo first, you are likely to go into painful WD that may include high anxiety and sleeplessness, and you don't want this, trust me.  Did you read the link above about this "which drug to taper first"?  Please don't be in a hurry to get off any drugs.  This could very possibly cause severe WD and destabilization of your nervous system, which could necessitate you reinstating and taking a long time to stabilize.  In the long run, it will make it take longer to get off your drugs, and you could be miserable in the meantime.  

 

 I reduced Clonazepam 2 days ago, I seem to be okay. I also retained 14 days from the original 0.3 tapering. Indeed I was to fast from 0.5 to 0.3 that is for sure, but I will go much slowly now. I am not in a hurry, I was before, not anymore.

At this moment on I am stable, 200 mg of L-Theanine is working , or I am stable by myself :)

 I understand that this should not be hurried, thanks for all the hints, this slow approach I understood from benzo buddies as well.

 I did read it and I am confused, as from benzo buddies, they say the "poison" Clonazepam should be tapered first, specially if the A/D is not doing any harm (I am unsure if Escitalopram is good or bad) .As I always had Clonazepam paired with it (5 months) I cannot be sure about the A/D. That is why I was wondering if I should get Clonazepam first, at least to be sure if Escitalopram is good for something or not. 

 But I understand very well the theory of tapering first the A/D as well.

 I hope you understood something from above, lol :D.

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

I don't believe the medication itself is generating the anxious symptoms, I believe it is the too fast taper that is generating it.  You jumped from 0.5 to 0.3 of the Benzo in just 3 weeks.  That is why I suggested you not make any dose changes for a while, so your system can have time to adjust.  

Yes you are right. I stabilized now, after 14 days I feel very good, just the sleep is not very good, but I manage to get 6-8 hours from a range of 10 hours haha.

 

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

Not sure what you are asking.  The clonazepam is a completely different drug than the escitalopram.  When you are ready to taper escitalopram, after you stabilize, I suggest you make or buy the liquid.  It is easy to measure in any amount in precise doses.  Here is information about both of these drugs.  

image.thumb.png.f32410928412474a3242ecdbfd81ee68.png

 

From this post I found the active ingredient idea (same link you provided, page 5), I am crushing my pill now , use the powder in a empty vegi-cap and weight it on a micro scale.

Was wondering if I should do the same with Clonazepam regarding the active ingredient.

855749079_esticaloprampill.thumb.jpg.ff5a990ecc6b6ab655f543f6744f3645.jpg

 

Unfortunately in Romania I don't think we have liquid version of Escitalopram (Cipralex named here).


 

 

 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I reduced Clonazepam 2 days ago, I seem to be okay.

That's fine, but these things have a way of catching up with us later.  It's up to you whether you want to stay on your current dose, or go back to 3 mg. 

 

2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

from benzo buddies, they say the "poison" Clonazepam should be tapered first,

I don't know about Benzo Buddies.  I'm a mod for SA, and we suggest reducing activating drugs first, then sedating drugs.  

 

2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I manage to get 6-8 hours from a range of 10

That is very good sleep for someone in WD.  

 

2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Was wondering if I should do the same with Clonazepam regarding the active ingredient.

Assuming it's not extended release, the active ingredient should be evenly dispersed throughout the tablet.  It won't hurt to mix the powder if you want. 

 

You still need to edit your drug sig, as I requested in a previous post.  When you say "escitalopram x 0.5" we don't know if you are talking about a 5 mg tablet, a 10 mg, or 20 mg tablet.  We need to know how many mg you are taking, not the fraction of a tablet.  

Edited by getofflex

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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  • Administrator

We're aware that the prevailing ideology on Benzobuddies is that benzos are the most evil drugs ever. They're not, they're just another psychiatric drug. (Antipsychotics are far more destructive.) If you are not getting severe adverse effects from the benzo, we advise leaving it in place to protect sleep while you taper the more activating drugs first.

 

We have many people here who went off their benzo first, then started tapering antidepressants, ran into awful withdrawal insomnia, then went back on a benzo -- which of course will require tapering after the antidepressant.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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17 hours ago, getofflex said:

That's fine, but these things have a way of catching up with us later.  It's up to you whether you want to stay on your current dose, or go back to 3 mg. 

Yes, you are right. Sleep got kind of bad, but I did a mistake as well. I did lower the Escitalopram to about 0.5-1 mg down from 5 to 4 - 4.5 mg as well, I thought I could do it (pushed to hard, as I was ok) , but I might be wrong, I'll see these couple of days and go back up to 0.3 mg, but will keep the Escitalopram as it is.

 

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

I don't know about Benzo Buddies.  I'm a mod for SA, and we suggest reducing activating drugs first, then sedating drugs.   

I will tapper Escitalopram from now on.

 

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

That is very good sleep for someone in WD.  

It was 2 days ago :)). Now I slept 4-5 hours last night. I did wake up 6 times at least.

Tried to catch up some in the afternoon, but I have anxiety when I try to get asleep and it's keeping me up. Will pass I hope :)

 

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

Assuming it's not extended release, the active ingredient should be evenly dispersed throughout the tablet.  It won't hurt to mix the powder if you want. 

Then I will cut it and scale it, it's much simpler. 

 

17 hours ago, getofflex said:

You still need to edit your drug sig, as I requested in a previous post.  When you say "escitalopram x 0.5" we don't know if you are talking about a 5 mg tablet, a 10 mg, or 20 mg tablet.  We need to know how many mg you are taking, not the fraction of a tablet.  

Done. hope it's ok now.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

Link to comment
17 hours ago, Altostrata said:

We're aware that the prevailing ideology on Benzobuddies is that benzos are the most evil drugs ever. They're not, they're just another psychiatric drug. (Antipsychotics are far more destructive.) If you are not getting severe adverse effects from the benzo, we advise leaving it in place to protect sleep while you taper the more activating drugs first.

 

We have many people here who went off their benzo first, then started tapering antidepressants, ran into awful withdrawal insomnia, then went back on a benzo -- which of course will require tapering after the antidepressant.

Thank you very much for the info Altostrata.

Will hold the benzo and start taping the A/D.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator

"24/09/2021  Escitalopram x 4.2 mg Clonazepam x 0.27 mg "  from your drug sig.  It looks like you reduced both escitalopram and clonazepam simultaneously just 2 days ago. We don't suggest tapering more than one drug at a time.  Not only that, your escitalopram reduction was 16%, which is over the 10% that SA suggests.  You are taking the risk of worsening your withdrawal situation with this.  As I said before, please wait to taper anything until you have stabilized from the previous fast taper of clonazepam.  I would suggest that you go back to your previous dose of 5 mg escitalopram, and stabilize on this for a while, maybe a month or two.  You may not feel the dose reduction now, but you could possibly be hit with worse symptoms in the weeks to come from this, which could take months to recover from.  I speak from experience, because I did this with Lexapro before I found this site, and I suffered from it.  

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
  • Moderator
2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I did lower the Escitalopram to about 0.5-1 mg down from 5 to 4 - 4.5 mg as well,

When you say 4 -4.5, it suggests that you may be taking an inconsistent amount each day.  It is important to take precisely the same dose at the same time each day.  

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
1 hour ago, getofflex said:

"24/09/2021  Escitalopram x 4.2 mg Clonazepam x 0.27 mg "  from your drug sig.  It looks like you reduced both escitalopram and clonazepam simultaneously just 2 days ago. We don't suggest tapering more than one drug at a time.  Not only that, your escitalopram reduction was 16%, which is over the 10% that SA suggests.  You are taking the risk of worsening your withdrawal situation with this.  As I said before, please wait to taper anything until you have stabilized from the previous fast taper of clonazepam.  I would suggest that you go back to your previous dose of 5 mg escitalopram, and stabilize on this for a while, maybe a month or two.  You may not feel the dose reduction now, but you could possibly be hit with worse symptoms in the weeks to come from this, which could take months to recover from.  I speak from experience, because I did this with Lexapro before I found this site, and I suffered from it.  

 Yes I made a mistake, felt good a couple of days and force the inevitable, as for today, I am not feeling good and the sleep was bad for 2-3 nights as well, gotten even more bad last night. I will go up again to 0.3 Clonazepam and 5mg Escitalopram as you mentioned. Thank you. (I see you are currently tapering  this as well)

 One thing I forgot to ask: As for Clonazepam, it's fairly easy to see a withdraw symptom after reduction after 2-3 days , as you mentioned I may not feel the dose reduction now related to escitalopram, a dose reduction would be felt in ~ how much time ? 

 I see you are taking 2.5 mg melatonin for sleep, also GABA 750 (works similar to the L-Theanine that I am taking) for sleep and anxiety, do you recommend them ? Seen some good reviews on Gaba 750.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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1 hour ago, getofflex said:

When you say 4 -4.5, it suggests that you may be taking an inconsistent amount each day.  It is important to take precisely the same dose at the same time each day.  

About this. I took couple of months (as prescribed) the Clonazepam and Escitalopram at night, before sleep.

But 2 days ago I also changed the Escitalopram in the morning, as I know from other people is better than taking it before sleep.

Could this also affect things ?

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Administrator

@lex1989 we're not going to be able to rewind the video and see what was happening some time back.

 

You are now taking 5mg escitalopram and 0.3mg clonazepam. What times o'clock do you take these drugs, with their dosages?

 

What's important is that you take these drugs consistently for at least a week and see how your symptom pattern changes. Please let us know how you're doing.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Link to comment
1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

@lex1989 we're not going to be able to rewind the video and see what was happening some time back.

 

You are now taking 5mg escitalopram and 0.3mg clonazepam. What times o'clock do you take these drugs, with their dosages?

 

What's important is that you take these drugs consistently for at least a week and see how your symptom pattern changes. Please let us know how you're doing.

I am not doing good now, unfortunately.

I used to took them before bed, usually at 22:30, but sometimes later (I know it's important to keep the same hour, will keep it that way).

 

After the fast tapering (score 6.5 from 0-10, 0 being perfect, 10 being worse) I felt better and better, very good for 3 days even (score 2), took ~20 days to stabilize. 

After that I tapered 0.27mg Clonazepam, same time Escitalopram ~4.2mg (3 days ago) and switch Escitalopram in the morning instead of taking it in the evening with the Clonazepam (Now I feel 6.5 again with problems sleeping). Should I put it again with Clonazepam before bed ?

 

But now I see my mistakes and impatience led to this...

 

As I feel I am going thru, by far, the hardest part of my life. Thank you for your support, I really appreciate it !

 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Administrator

In what ways do you not feel good? Please keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show if your symptoms are adverse effects from one of your drugs.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator

If it were me, I would stop making any changes to my drugs for a while, including changing the time of day I take them, until advised otherwise.  Please do as Altostrata asks about keeping daily notes.  What you need now is time, consistency, and stability.  Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

Yes, many of us feel that withdrawal from psychiatric drugs is the hardest thing we have gone through.  You are not alone in this.  Take heart, this is not permanent.  Some day you will heal, as long as you take proper care of yourself.  

Edited by getofflex

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
21 hours ago, Altostrata said:

In what ways do you not feel good? Please keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show if your symptoms are adverse effects from one of your drugs.

 In the way that I am sleeping very poorly (2 awful nights) and I was getting scared that I got insomnia. like getofflex mentioned that happens for people that taper benzo first, instead of the A/D. 

 I got up last night, like hour by hour almost, because I felt I needed to pee and watched the cloak as well every time (mistake) and seen the repetitive stuff and got scared that I have insomnia and stuff. But I think I have just an urinary infection (I am waiting for results, have been today at the doctor).

I got like 6-7 hours of sleep, but like 1,2,1,1,1,0.5 hours and that is poor quality sleep, hope tonight will be better.

And today I got very scared during the day thinking of this stuff (high anxiety on some parts of the days), but when something new and bad happens I get scared, until I get used to it and start to not care (accept).

 

I don't reckon having insomnia have something to do with peeing frequently, I had disturbed sleep for a while, waking a lot, but nothing in common with this, at least I hope so.

 

I've been taking some daily symptoms in an excel, benzo buddies suggested this as well, I will post it tomorrow.

 

Thanks very much for the support.  

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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5 hours ago, getofflex said:

If it were me, I would stop making any changes to my drugs for a while, including changing the time of day I take them, until advised otherwise.  Please do as Altostrata asks about keeping daily notes.  What you need now is time, consistency, and stability.  Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

Yes, many of us feel that withdrawal from psychiatric drugs is the hardest thing we have gone through.  You are not alone in this.  Take heart, this is not permanent.  Some day you will heal, as long as you take proper care of yourself.  

I will keep as they are now, I made the changes, need to live with them now and stabilize. I will keep daily notes as well.

 

Thank you for the support !!

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

Link to comment

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1z6soHabsz6IRcfkVdjWTq-dO8GYtmwR0MSYc5mW1omM/edit?usp=sharing

 

Please advise if should I make it simpler, tried to add pretty much everything.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Administrator

Please provide access to that document.

 

You may have to cope with bumps for a while. Having a urinary tract infection might be causing your problems. 

 

Don't look at the clock when you can't sleep, it makes people more anxious. Listen to very soft music or do meditative breathing exercises. You may relax enough to sleep. See

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

White noise devices for sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Link to comment

I've provided access.

Indeed it most likely looks as a urinary tract infection, waking me up in the night and keeping me in a constant schedule to the toilet.

I don't think it has anything to do with the insomnia, just got scared about it. (I always do when new bad things come up, until I cope with them).

 

I've made a habit of looking at the cloak when I wake up in the night, lol, need to get of it, as sometimes it helps, but in this situations it definitely does not.

 

Thanks for the links, will check them.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator

@lex1989insomnia has been the worst part of WD for me.  Here is what I do to help.  

 

1) don't freak out about it.  Realize that eventually, your sleep will improve.  Insomnia won't kill you, although it can make you pretty dang miserable.  Anxiety about sleep just makes the problem worse.  I know, easier said than done. I don't always do this, but I try. 

 

2)listen to very soft relaxing music at a very low volume.  There is a wonderful 16 hour harp music playlist on Spotify that I listen to.  

 

3)don't worry about what time it is.  Don't look at the clock.  

 

4) I try to stay active during the first half of the day.  I take a walk (mine is one hour) after breakfast every day.  Then, as the day goes on, gradually slow down.  Several hours before bed, I only do very relaxing things, like read, or just sit and relax.  This helps to set our circadian rhythm.  Try to get outside and get some light exposure during the day, too. 

 

5) Avoid toxic, negative people.  Avoid stress when possible, although I know a lot of stressors are unavoidable.   For me, this can really help me to relax better.  

 

6) I stay away from MSG and aspartame.  These are exitotoxins which overstimulate the nervous system.  They are in a lot of our modern processed foods.  I try to eat more whole and natural, and not as many processed foods.  

 

Hang in there, this process takes time, but gradually your nervous system will heal, and work all this out.  

Edited by getofflex

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

Link to comment
3 hours ago, getofflex said:

@lex1989insomnia has been the worst part of WD for me.  Here is what I do to help.  

 

1) don't freak out about it.  Realize that eventually, your sleep will improve.  Insomnia won't kill you, although it can make you pretty dang miserable.  Anxiety about sleep just makes the problem worse.  I know, easier said than done. I don't always do this, but I try. 

 

2)listen to very soft relaxing music at a very low volume.  There is a wonderful 16 hour harp music playlist on Spotify that I listen to.  

 

3)don't worry about what time it is.  Don't look at the clock.  

 

4) I try to stay active during the first half of the day.  I take a walk (mine is one hour) after breakfast every day.  Then, as the day goes on, gradually slow down.  Several hours before bed, I only do very relaxing things, like read, or just sit and relax.  This helps to set our circadian rhythm.  Try to get outside and get some light exposure during the day, too. 

 

5) Avoid toxic, negative people.  Avoid stress when possible, although I know a lot of stressors are unavoidable.   For me, this can really help me to relax better.  

 

6) I stay away from MSG and aspartame.  These are exitotoxins which overstimulate the nervous system.  They are in a lot of our modern processed foods.  I try to eat more whole and natural, and not as many processed foods.  

 

Hang in there, this process takes time, but gradually your nervous system will heal, and work all this out.  

Thank you for the tips.

I usually don't drink aspartame at all, I know it's toxic.

I try to do sports as well usually (soccer, gym, kickbox), now with Corona it's a little harder, but I will go run and walk.

 

I don't think frequently peeing is related to insomnia, never herd that it can be. I may got kidney cold couple of days ago and that is why (I am atm waiting for results at the doctor to be sure). I just freaked out related to it to be honest and increased anxiety, now I stay calm and wake up even 10 times / night to pee, it is what it is, we go forward.

 

Indeed I made a habit of watching the cloak, even during the day, because of the automated thinking related to anxiety, usually I am much better in the evening / night and "can't wait to be already 20 pm" so my anxiety goes down :)).

I know it's stupid, but that's some automatically stuff that my brain got used to. And from my small experience reading anxiety related theory (Paul David, At last a Life), it much better to accept anxiety, automated things / thoughts because of anxiety then fight with it, when you accept it, you start to "heal".

 

Thank you very much for the support.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I try to do sports as well usually (soccer, gym, kickbox), now with Corona it's a little harder, but I will go run and walk.

I have to say intense exercise can overstimulate us, and put us in a wave and/or increase our symptoms.  Intense exercise stimulates cortisol and adrenaline - for a CNS in withdrawal, this can overactive us and cause anxiety, insomnia, and other symptoms.  I did an intense hilly hike in early September, and went into a wave that lasted for 2-3 weeks.  I think the change in seasons also contributed to the wave.  I do fine with walks.  

 

Also, your system is probably still trying to stabilize from the recent reductions in your 2 psych meds.  Try to be very gentle on yourself, and I believe in a month or two things will settle down.  Make sure you keep your drug doses precisely the same and take them consistently from day to day at the same time each day.  This will help your system to find homeostasis and achieve some stability. 

 

2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

it much better to accept anxiety, automated things / thoughts because of anxiety then fight with it, when you accept it, you start to "heal".

Excellent coping tool.  Claire Weekes talks about this too.  

 

Claire Weekes Method

Edited by getofflex

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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  • Administrator
On 9/27/2021 at 10:58 AM, lex1989 said:

I got like 6-7 hours of sleep, but like 1,2,1,1,1,0.5 hours and that is poor quality sleep, hope tonight will be better.

 

 

This is better than no sleep.

 

You will have to learn how to manage those habits of mind that add unnecessary anxiety to a difficult time.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Link to comment
9 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

This is better than no sleep.

 

You will have to learn how to manage those habits of mind that add unnecessary anxiety to a difficult time.

Yes, easier said the done, but critical :)

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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14 hours ago, getofflex said:

I have to say intense exercise can overstimulate us, and put us in a wave and/or increase our symptoms.  Intense exercise stimulates cortisol and adrenaline - for a CNS in withdrawal, this can overactive us and cause anxiety, insomnia, and other symptoms.  I did an intense hilly hike in early September, and went into a wave that lasted for 2-3 weeks.  I think the change in seasons also contributed to the wave.  I do fine with walks.  

Interesting, did not knew or thought about this. I thought sport helps in anxiety, but in withdrawal did not knew about this. I will do just easy runs / jogging :).

What are your waves related too ? For me it's like almost always anxiety :D.

I think I did not ask you related why you took Escitalopram in the first place. Anxiety or depression ?

 

14 hours ago, getofflex said:

Excellent coping tool.  Claire Weekes talks about this too.  

 

Claire Weekes Method

Yes, Claire goes mostly with exposure and acceptance, very similar to David. I have both books :)

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
7 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I think I did not ask you related why you took Escitalopram in the first place. Anxiety or depression ?

Mostly anxiety, some depression too. 

 

My waves tend to be triggered by high stress, major sudden weather changes, of which there are a lot in my part of the world, eating foods with MSG, a sudden major change in routine.   If you see my name on the right, under it is a link to my intro topic.  🙂

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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On 9/29/2021 at 9:30 PM, getofflex said:

Mostly anxiety, some depression too. 

 

My waves tend to be triggered by high stress, major sudden weather changes, of which there are a lot in my part of the world, eating foods with MSG, a sudden major change in routine.   If you see my name on the right, under it is a link to my intro topic.  🙂

I've seen your intro, I am sorry for what you need to endure..

One more thing that I forgot to ask, after a taper of Escitalopram, how much time is needed to feel the "cut" itself ? I seen on an article from this forum (forgot the link) that it may require for an A/D ~ 2 weeks to get a feeling of the withdraw from your cute (if it's the case).

Of course each individual is different, but mainly there is some common time and you know for your experience for sure about this, as you taper the same medicine.

 

On benzo it "easier" as it's about 5-10 days to feel the full power of the cut :D.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator

It can be felt right away or it can take a couple of weeks. We are all different.  Some of us are fast metabolizers and others are not. If one makes a very small cut while one is stable they may not even feel it.  Some of the cuts I made in the past year I haven’t felt, others I felt in a a couple of weeks and some I felt right away. This process is unpredictable.  

Edited by getofflex

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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14 hours ago, getofflex said:

It can be felt right away or it can take a couple of weeks. We are all different.  Some of us are fast metabolizers and others are not. If one makes a very small cut while one is stable they may not even feel it.  Some of the cuts I made in the past year I haven’t felt, others I felt in a a couple of weeks and some I felt right away. This process is unpredictable.  

Thank you for the hint, for me, after I took some cuts to both Clonazepam and Escitalopram (when I did the mistake) I felt it afterwards, maybe I am a fast metabolizer.

Will test the cut from Escitalopram in a few weeks, as now I have very good 8 days already :).

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello there. I am back with some updates.

 

Unfortunately I have a big stress coming in my life that is probably inevitable, I will need to break up with my fiancée as she is asexual, found out in this couple of weeks, probably my frustration regarding this part of our life has been filled in the past 2 years along with other big stress from work => anxiety :).

 

The question basically is : Does big stress put you in a wave ? I have read about this on the forum and saw in most cases that it is.

For me definitely has been and I didn't even break up yet, just preparing mentally to do it got me "hearth burns" at night that does not let me sleep very well and in during the day some short / medium really high anxiety that I did not had before. I just cry and then I feel good almost the whole day, very strange.

 

One more thing to add, I know, don't over judge me about this. I did a 20% cut on the Escitalopram, but the thing is, this wave occurred from this stress occurred 1 day before I did the cut and that really tells me that the stress itself put me in this wave, maybe "helped" by the big cut as well.

 

I did this big cut because I never had major reactions from Escitalopram dose changing (except in the first week that my body got used to it), the 2 doctors I have been to changed a couple of times from 2.5 mg to 5.mg, from 5 mg to 7.5 mg, from 7.5 mg to 10 mg, then last was down from 10 mg to 5 mg. Did not have big problems with this. The only big issues I had with benzo changes / Clonazepam.

So that is why I risked it and yes I know, I am impatient, don't want to tapper longer than I took the medicine in the first place, please bare up with me and try to understand me. :(

 

Daily symptoms updates https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1z6soHabsz6IRcfkVdjWTq-dO8GYtmwR0MSYc5mW1omM/edit#gid=0

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg

 

Supplements:  Omega 3 , Magnesium Threonate

 

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  • Moderator
3 hours ago, lex1989 said:

The question basically is : Does big stress put you in a wave ? I have read about this on the forum and saw in most cases that it is.

Yes, stress can and often does this.  Major stress puts me in a wave, or at least ramps up my symptoms.  I'm sorry you have to deal with this.  To encourage you, often the anticipation of doing something is the most anxiety ridden time.  Once you break up, you may be immensely relieved.  It's a good think you are dealing with the problem now - it will save you the heartache of a divorce later.  

 

3 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I just cry and then I feel good almost the whole day, very strange.

Crying is very cathartic.  That is probably why you feel good after crying.  

 

3 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I did a 20% cut on the Escitalopram, but the thing is, this wave occurred from this stress occurred 1 day before I did the cut and that really tells me that the stress itself put me in this wave, maybe "helped" by the big cut as well.

The wave may very well be from the 20% cut, in addition to the stress.  Here is the thing: the more we go on and off drugs, and change dosages, the more sensitized our systems become.  So, while changes to the Lexapro may not have affected you in the past, they could very well be affecting you now.  When I was first put on Paxil 26 years ago for 11 months, I did a fast taper off it with no problem.  Now, getting off Lexapro has been a whole different story.  

 

3 hours ago, lex1989 said:

So that is why I risked it and yes I know, I am impatient, don't want to tapper longer than I took the medicine in the first place, please bare up with me and try to understand me. :(

Ok, well, I'll put away the whip this time.  😉   

 

On a more serious note, please try to be extra patient.  When we rush a taper, it will not necessarily get us off the drug faster, in the long run, it may actually slow it down, if our nervous system crashes, and then it could take months to years to recover.  No judgment here, just trying to give sound advice and information.  I've been guilty of this too, I rushed my taper in the early days.  Check out this link: 

 

Too Fast Tapers

Please do not tag me, unless it is an urgent question about tapering or reinstatement. 

 

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

 

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005,  Jul 8, 0.00.  Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!!  Woohoo!!!

Ibuprofen 800 mg, Tylenol 1000 mg, Benadryl 50 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, 3 PM, before bed

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc

suppl noon: calcium

suppl supper: calcium

suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2 mg

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  • ChessieCat changed the title to lex1989: escitalopram / Cipralex and clonazepam / Rivotril / Klonopin

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