Emma86: Trying to heal after heavy withdrawal Lorazepam

[Emma86]

@Altostrata hey I’m taking 

quetiapine at night 100mg with mirtazipine 30mg at the same time 22/23pm 

 

I take the Ativan .25 in the morning 11am 

.25 5pm 

 

yes very good point, was very very unstable was critical.. untill I reinstated the benzo .. since then tapering the quetiapine. The taper produces a whole host of symptoms, last drop basically a month ago but feels like I’m getting waves, and I had a very over stimulating week last week where I had stress, where on the last day Friday I had tremors and surges of anxiety, I’m taking a step back now and had a day in bed with low stimulation 🙏🏻🙏🏻 I have not been able to do normal things like work for a good while I think I put a lot of pressure on myself, worried to comit to work then have to cancel due to symptoms. But I guess the best thing is to just let this worry go ..

@ChessieCat thank you so much for the links will look x 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata @Frogie hey guys, this last few days I started to get burning under my skin, burning stomache and anxiety coming through, I have not changed anything, last drop a month ago. I stabilised 3 months ago on the .5 Ativan it took away 1000s of symptoms, Iv been waiting for my CNS to stabilise to carry on the quetiapine taper, however I feel some very bad symptoms coming on, my only thought is it’s the benzo reaching tolerance as it was the benzo that stopped crisis. 
 

my last drop was a month ago, 2 weeks after the drop I had symptoms you guys were like it’s the quetiapine so I waited, now coming to 4 weeks im suddenly getting more, waking up earlier with burning, my diet in the night isn’t the best I also end up eating wheat or pasta my mums left out, appart from that I eat very healthy, I seem

to get midnight munchies, worried my system cant take the wheat and bad food late at night! Trying to stop this:

 

if the benzo is reaching its tolerance I still have a huge way to go with the quetiapine. I remember this happened to me before when I took Ativan after a few months it basically stopped working. This is what got me into the mess.

 

do I taper the benzo leaving the others? I see a few people have done this because of the benzo not holding. 
 

thank you 

emma 

 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata @Frogie also to add sorry to keep asking and the tapering the quetiapine could defintly be giving me weird sensations there’s no definite knowing. Iv just came from such crisis so when I get symptoms it’s hard, but training the brain! I felt great last week for most of it. I need to get my fear of benzo tolerance away. I’m just aware of it as it happened to me so severely before but could be different this time 🙏🏻 I pray it gives me time to get off this quetiapine will It hold all that time hopefully x also living with a family member who is very mean making the journey rather lonely hence probably messaging more  x

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

You might try to not eat wheat and see if that helps. It's hard to do, but you eat it in the middle of the night.

 

You might keep notes for a few days and post them and we can see what is going on.

 

Keep Notes on Paper

 

When did you last taper the Quetiapine, 4 weeks ago? You could try a small taper of that and see if that helps also.

[Emma86]

@Frogie Yeah thank you ..il see it could be the late eating it’s like I’m doing it in my sleep! Iv been keeping notes before and after eating No more I’m removing wheat. Eating fish at times no sugar and lots of vedge. 4 weeks ago dropped on the quetiapine.. I need to change half the dosage to instants from a different brand in order to cut. I was waiting for my system to calm a bit more untill I drop .. nervous about taking these instant release. Will need to see if that does much as well Before I cut as it’s taking a whole new pill wish I could just cut the XR I really do!  🙏🏻❤️

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

I completely understand not wanting to taper quite yet because you loose the XR and go to the immediate release. Are you on the 50 mg XR now? You can go down to 50 mg on the XR before you have to go to the regular tablets.

 

Just keep track on the notes for a few days. I'm glad you are staying away from sugar and trying to eat better. Maybe try some magnesium or omega. That might help.

[Emma86]

@Frogie so I’m taking 100mg XR to cut the plan was 50 XR and then 2 25s in instant 

 

I hadn’t thought of that cutting the XR untill I get down to the 50mg and switch to instant 

 

Iv had so many differing opinions about cutting the XR if it’s ok or not. I havnt found too many people to get their experience .. 

 

many have said cutting the XR is more dangerous than taking instants for me I feel taking a new tablet feels worse. Wish there was a clear this is the way with these pills really want to carry on cutting x 

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

I can give you some information to read about it and then you can see what route you want to take.

 

 

[Altostrata]

On 2/14/2022 at 1:29 PM, Altostrata said:

....

As you go through this process, please keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata hey thank you I’m collecting this over a week  🙏🏻

[Altostrata]

24 hours at a time would be fine.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata 

 

 28th 

Woke up 8.30 burning body, woke earlier than usual … dozed after taking Ativan 10.30 .25

 

Got up felt fine

No really severe symptoms today

The usual blurry vision 

And occasional feeling that I’m moving inside 

Slight gagging feeling in throat comes and goes 

Tinnitus 

Buzzing head 

Worked drove 

 

18.00 took Ativan .25 

 

Dinner fish vedge lentils no reaction appart from a slight unease sickening feeling in stomache being full but passed quickly 

 

23.15 - snacked on vedge dish felt a bit sick after this again it passed 

I feel good about to go to bed 

Sensitivity to cold 

 

29th 

 

Woke up earlier than usual 8am but no burning 

 

Had kefir with berry’s 

 

I drive and picked up things felt ok abit weird sensations in body 

Pain in stomache when eating didnt each much for lunch gluten free vegan bun 

 

Dizzy slightly standing up slight feelings of worry and weird feeling of body not feeling like itself 

 

I did a lot today drive for 1.5 hours made me feel shakey. But still able . Will take it easy now 

 

Spoke to dr felt ok moving phyc to a better one 🙏🏻 all being well 

 

Body buzzing a bit of unease but nothing severe 

Circulation in body is weird leg goes dead easily get this on and off over the last couple of weeks 

Shakey a bit but might be from doing a lot today 

 

6pm take Ativan 

 

Having brown rice parsnip and carrot mash with salad lettuce 

 

Feeling slightly anxious like a restlessness surges of anxiety maybe feelings of overwhelm of having too much to do or committing to things in the future makes me feel worried 

Stomache pain

 

unease In body watching the news seemed to trigger something 

 

Feel shakey severe senstations like having a stroke, sensitive to cold jaw locks can’t speak have to lie down get rid of pressure cancelled something in the morning, very odd sensations, a sick feeling, restlessness and gagging in throat, ate something felt ok. Body feels weak loads of muscle spasms and jolty movements 

 

Once in bed low stimulation and less pressure felt better. 

 

Burning eyes weird feelings twitches 

22pm 

Midnight feeling more normal 

 

Had falling feelings in night 

 

Ate 3 small

Bits of choc at 1am  (argh) this is like sleep eating first bit of sugar in months 

 

Woke at 8.30 

a little burning .. tingling and anxiety 

 

After my last drop of quetiapine it was 2 weeks out I got symptoms then 4 weeks out I started getting more progressively 

 

Iv been waiting for symptoms to pass for my next drop 

 

these symptoms are they coming off quetiapine… you think? Want to drop my next bit.. need to take the new instants from different brand first to be able to cut or I cut the XR

 

🙏🏻❤️

 

Edited March 8, 2022 by ChessieCat
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[Emma86]

Oh and each night I took the quetiapine and mirt between 11 to midnight slight reactions of feelings of falling after taking and going to sleep 

[Altostrata]

You need to put the times you take ANY of your drugs in your daily notes. I need to see what happens after you take ANY of your drugs.

 

Are you taking Ativan on a consistent schedule? What is that schedule?

[Emma86]

@Altostrata yes I have put the times above 
 

I don’t feel any different before or after my Ativan dose this will be at 10.30/11am 

 

then 17.30/6pm 

 

the quetiapine and mirt is taken 22/23pm 

 

I do at times when sleeping wake up feeling like I’m falling 

 

I have taken notes on many days for the last couple of months, and have not noticed any difference before or after the Ativan in all that time. 
 

mirt and quetiapine.. I’m feeling it’s the quetiapine because as I reduced it it got better, after I’d take it I’d have weird bodily feelings when I was at 300mg like a restless body 

 

now at 100mg I get like I say falling feelings. 
 

 

[Altostrata]

Please post daily notes in the requested simple format, including when you take your drugs, their dosages, and any funny feelings you get throughout the day.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata

 

Bed no bad feelings slight aches and pains

Less twitching today 

Less anxiety 

 

Take quetiapine 100mg 

30mg mirtazipine 

At 23.30 

 

 

 

New day 

4th 

Awoke 

With slight anxiety and tingling 

9.35

Dozed till 11

Slight heavier beating of heart 

Took Ativan .25 at 11am 

 

12pm had kefir cocanut

 

Did headshot job

 

Felt fine

 

Ate mackerel and beetroot 

16.00

 

Sensitivity to cold 

Feeling a bit sick after the mackerel slight pain in stomache after mackerel

 

Slight twitches in legs during the day 

And twitches in chest feeling heavy 

 

18.00 take Ativan .25 no adverse feelings before or after 

 

Thai meal out 

slight twitching and movement in body but goes when distracted in conversation 

 

12pm took quetiapine 100

Mirt 30 

slight falling feeling

 

Get up to snack a couple of times in night this usual habit since taking the meds 

 

 

New day 

 

Awoke 9.45 no tingling or sensations 

11.16 take Ativan dose.25

 

No weird stuff 

Some leg twitching 

Had nails done treated myself! 

Period hit very painful 

14.58

 

Twitchy a bit 

 

Took Ativan 18.00 dose.25 no feelings before or soon after 

 

Feel spaced out in afternoon twitchy legs 

 

Ate at 19.30 fish and vedge 

Drinking lots of water 

 Peanut butter 

 

Slight pains and tension in body  22.06 

 

Had quetiapine and mirt at 12pm midnight 

Slept well 

 

Got up a few times to snack 

 

New day 

Woke it’s 11.06 took Ativan .25

Slight Beaty heart and sweating when first awaking but goes once awake 

 

 

notes over the last few days I feel I’m ready to make a drop symptoms have lessened. 
 

I spoke to someone who has been cutting the XR 50mg and she’s fine, she’s also taking mirt and benzo .. I’m very tempted to make the cut over next 2 days last drop was 12.5 5 weeks ok, was thinking to go down by 12.5 so quarter the 50XR 

 

finally make the move .. taking instants from a different manufacturer feels like a larger change…and my phyc is very keen on this method however I feel its my decision at the end of the day, just hope there’s no awful affects in cutting XR but I guess gotta do something…  trying to minimise change as much as possible! 

🙏🏻

Edited March 6, 2022 by ChessieCat
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[Altostrata]

@Emma86 it's hard for me to follow your notes, the way you're posting them. Help me out: please post your notes in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

Are you taking Ativan at the same times each day? What times and what dose are you taking?

[Emma86]

@Altostrata

 

21pm - no bad feelings slight aches and pains, less twitching today, less anxiety

23.30 - 100 mg quetiapine, 30mg mirtazipine

01.00 - up eating snacks bed.

 

9.35- woke up slight tingling and anxiety

11am - dozed till now, take ativan dose 0.25

12 noon - had kefir drink 

13pm - did a headshot for an actor felt fine

16.00 - ate mackerel and beetroot, sensitivity to cold, feeling sick after mackerel, slight pain in stomache

17.00 - slight twitches in legs during the day and twitches in chest feeling heavy

18.00 - take ativan dose 0.25 

20.30 Thai meal out slight feelings of movement in body, and twitching, but goes away whilst having meal.

22pm - home feeling good

12pm - bed took quetiapine 100mg - 30mg mirtazapine, slight falling feelings going to sleep

01.00 get up to snack a couple of times. 

 

awake 

09.45- no tingling or sensations

11.00- take ativan dose 0.25

12.00 - went out walked felt slight pains in body

14.58- period hit very painful, twitchy a bit

18.00- took ativan 0.25 dose

19.30- fish and wedge, peanut butter

22pm - slight pains and tension in body

12pm - had quetiapine and mirtazipine 30 mg slept well

 

awake at 11am  - take ativan dose 0.25

slightly Beaty heart on awakening 

 

 

like I said thinking to now cut the 50 XR to carry on the tapering, as the next course of action. 

... phycs want me to take new instant tablets. 

 

 

[Altostrata]

You take 100 mg quetiapine and 30mg mirtazapine at about midnight every night, you take 0.25mg Ativan at 11 a.m. and 6 p.m.?

 

Why do you take quetiapine and mirtazapine together? Any one of the drugs you're taking is sufficient for sleep.

 

What are your most prominent drug-related symptoms now? How much are you able to work?

[Emma86]

@Altostrata I was told to take them together at night. Obviously by drs.. and have not seen a need to change this, I needed to sleep as my benzo withdrawal prior stopped me from sleeping completely. 
 

I was not advised on anything I’v been given. 
 

I was in a highly aroused manic state. Due to months of no sleep and withdrawal from benzo. 

 

yes I take all the pills at those times each day. 
 

I am tapering the quetiapine presently and would say the twitches and withdrawal symptoms are all from this. Iv had quite some strange symptoms since going from 300 to 100. 
 

I don’t know what the mirt does to me as I only stabilised to normal functioning when given the .5 Ativan I was not ok before that, however I was sleeping because of the mirt and quetia. 
 

I am now thinking of this next move to cut the 50 XR and make my night dose 90mg I know this makes it more instant.. I am thinking do I need to take a little of the dose when I wake up to spread it out like the extended release, I’m not sure if the XR must effect me in the day as well. 
 

thank you 

emma 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata I am able to do some bits of work but when I have tapering symptoms I struggle and have to take it easy. I feel quite traumatised by the horrifying benzo withdrawal I endured fir months. So I’m also working with looking forward and when working just getting on with that. 🙏🏻❤️

[Altostrata]

36 minutes ago, Emma86 said:

I am tapering the quetiapine presently and would say the twitches and withdrawal symptoms are all from this. Iv had quite some strange symptoms since going from 300 to 100. 

 

What are those symptoms?

 

What times of day are your symptoms worse? Please include this in your notes.

 

37 minutes ago, Emma86 said:

I only stabilised to normal functioning when given the .5 Ativan I was not ok before that,

 

This makes sense, because you were in withdrawal from a benzo.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata my symptoms are forever changing, and varied throughout the day there is no pattern for me, I have not seen any pattern. I have included much in my notes above. There is no times they are worse or better at the same time in the day.  
 

In a wave of symptoms I can wake with tingling and anxiety in the morning. And I wake up earlier than usual. But this then goes 
 

Yes I stabilised on the benzo, before this I was at crisis point for a long time, almost died, which lead to being pollydrugged, it was severe.

 

since stabilising in Ativan ..  I had all symptoms go and so I started tapering the quetiapine as at 300mg it was giving me intolerable feelings when I took it, I could really feel this drug was not ok at this dose, once stable and more in touch with normal functioning, as Iv lowered it to 150mg I was fine, when I lowered to 100mg I got a lot of withdrawal and since reinstated 12.5 and held this helped and then I dropped 12.5 I had symptoms 2 weeks out and 4 weeks out, and then I return to a baseline, where nothing unsettling is happening, in this tapering time .. I have had stroke like feelings, waves of anxiety, sensitivity to hot and cold, moving feeling in head like spinning, blurry vision, pains in body, tinnitus louder, burning through body, upset stomache, feeling low, then feeling good, twitchy body, Beaty heart palpitations, falling feelings, and odd sensations in body of tension, tension behind the eyes, and indescribable feelings of just very odd. But it has been in waves and windows since I started this taper. And the baseline can feel quite normal. 
 

there is no time they are worse or better in a regular pattern. 
 

im feeling very ready to do another drop  

[Altostrata]

I have lost the thread of your tapering question.

 

If you don't have a pattern of symptoms, it's likely your symptoms are from your prior withdrawal upset, not from the drugs you're presently taking.

 

Since you are taking 3 drugs that might bring about sleep, if I were you, I'd taper the quetiapine, because that's the drug that can do the most damage. 

 

Quote

Iv had quite some strange symptoms since going from 300 to 100

 

You've been taking 100mg since January? If the withdrawal symptoms you got from the prior decreases have gone away, I suggest you taper much, much slower, don't risk upsetting the apple cart.

 

Are you taking a single tablet of 100mg immediate-release quetiapine? If so, you might ask that your prescription be filled with 4 25mg tablets (split dosing, 25mg morning and 75mg night) BUT you'd take them all at night and taper by quartering one 25mg tablet (6.25mg per piece) until you get to 75mg, then you'd use tablet plus liquid to taper.

 

Your first reduction would be from 100mg to 93.75mg. Please let us know if you get any significant changes in your symptom pattern, the daily notes are not necessary.

 

You might want to see how @Freeby60 is tapering quetiapine, she's doing very well.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata thank you for this  I agree totally, so I’m taking 2 tablets of 50mg XR extended release, my next cut is 10% of last dose.. So I was thinking go down by 10mg .. to 90mg. 
 

cutting the XR was what I was torn with .. could result in a more instant result, I’d be cutting one tablet at first.. or my phyc has said I could take 2 tablets 25mg instants release.. these are from a different manufacturer.. and mixing brands is another risk.. I am thinking cutting the XR untill I get to 50mg could create less changes of mixing and taking different tablets… 

 

have you had many people cutting the XR tablets ? 
 

or taking instants might be ok.. this decision once I make it I feel I won’t have any more decisions like this as the other pills just come as they are.
 

thank you ❤️

[Altostrata]

If you cut up an XR tablet, it becomes immediate-release. Didn't we go over this before? How are you going to measure 10mg out of a 50mg tablet?

 

 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata yes it was just I was getting lots of differing opinions, my phyc says to take new instants and I guess just want to feel confident in cutting the pill, as phycs dont like you to do these things, so I have some scales that I have been shown how to use and to cut the pills like this to make it exact.  

[Altostrata]

@Emma86 we've been round and round about how when you cut up an XR tablet, it becomes instant-release, and you might have to take it twice a day.

 

Have you figured out how to adjust your drug schedule?

[Emma86]

@Altostrata Iv just had a lot of people saying to me not to cut it including the phycs so I was just looking for more people who had cut it or knew of people who had. Iv had people warn me off it. So I just wanted to be sure to make the right choice. As many people get a bit stuck with this on the XR. In this thread people have said to cut the XR but people have also said to switch to instants.  I take it all at night. So if I were to take any at a different time I was thinking in the morning. I have been waiting for symptoms to pass as well from my last drop. Some have said they have had awful effects from cutting the XR some havnt just wanted to feel confident in doing it. 

[Altostrata]

Let us know when the symptoms pass to decide on your next step.

[Emma86]

Thank you @Altostrata appreciate the help will do im aiming for monday coming all being well.  

[Emma86]

@Altostrata @Frogie hey guys I wrote something as was having symptoms but allowing them to pass will update later on. Only been 2 days since I dropped. Easy to freak when feeling odd. ❤️

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

Just update us when you feel like it. 

[Emma86]

@Frogie .. well it was that my last drop was quetiapine on 31st of Jan so 

2 months ago .. I had reiki attunement a week and a half ago and I weirdly got a wave from this that has eased. I waited for it to go. And I then tapered 4mg off the mirtazipine on the 22nd… this decision was my phyc and I thinking to get it lower in amount could be beneficial she said she felt it was giving my adverse affects late at night I was eating through the night. 
 

it has been a 2 month hold since changing my last drug. 
 

its 2 days in and I feel very weird today 

 

I just got thinking about how it’s not good to do one drug then the other… as after this I will go back to the quetiapine taper.. 

 

mirtazipine is said to be activating at higher dosage. 
 

however I’m also thinking tapering a different drug whilst also just having tapered the quetiapine might create more adverse affects? However I did wait… a while. 
 

on the tapering multiple meds topic it also says you can tapper the AD when the antischycotics is at a lower dosage.. and alternate each .. 

 

the phyc was like let’s aim to get to

 15mg .. then we carry on the quetiapine taper.. I guess if we do that I’d have to wait a while then taper the quetiapine..  slowing the taper down somewhat. 
 

it’s been 2 days into cutting the 4mg. Mirtazipine 

 

I guess I’m hoping this was the right decision. And any thoughts welcomed. 
 

also after 2 days I’m thinking I would not feel anything? As I am feeling really odd. 
 

I know it’s best to do one drug at a time as well.. but do people alternate and then leave long holds inbetween.. 

 

it’s just suddenly struck me that it’s tapering on top of withdrawing from quetiapine.. and when I get to 15 mirt I’d have to wait for that to settle.. mmm 🤔 I’m aware my system is very sensitive! And the argument was that leaving mirtazipine at 30mg for soo long could be affecting me negatively.. 

 

thoughts welcome x 

 

 

[Altostrata]

@Emma86 every time you make a drug change, you will need to let any resulting symptoms settle down before making another drug change.

 

If you want to make drug changes at the direction of your psychiatrist, please talk to the doctor about any adverse results. We cannot be backup for your doctor's directions.