Bestill: mirtazapine and being free

[Gigi68]

Hi Bestill, you’re making progress and you seem to have a great attitude! I dropped to 2.7mg four days ago. I’m doing well overall. The mental anguish I experienced on 7.5 and as I tapered totally disappeared at 3.1mg. It is such a relief! I hope that feeling never comes back. The side effects I am still experiencing are sedation, tinnitus, palpitations and dry eyes and mouth. WD symptoms are constipation, insomnia and nausea. I am able to do so much more and am feeling more like myself now than a year ago. Keep going! 

[slowphie]

@Bestill@Gigi68

 

You’re both doing so well! Gigi, how amazing it must be to get to such a low dose. I’m envious. 😅

 

Do your dry eyes cause any vision problems? I think mine might be dry too, because my tears sting when I cry now. 🥲

 

I’ll be dropping down to 12.96mg today. So far, nothing much to report. I had some small waves of anxiety on Friday, but nothing too intense and it didn’t last for long. 

I started playing ping-pong everyday this week, in the hopes that the movement is good for my recovery, as well as my vision. Unfortunately, that’s still very problematic and the lack of ability to work is really starting to stress me out, for financial reasons. ☹️
 

If it has improved, the improvements are so gradual, that I can’t really tell. I have noticed lately though, that I’m able to use my phone without *constantly* squinting, which definitely wasn’t the case two months ago. 
 

Anyway, still such a long way to go with the Mirt taper… but every step counts towards zero. Wishing everyone a nice week.

[Bestill]

@Gigi68 you have to keep a positive attitude when going through something like this. Your body listens and your energy feels it.  
 

@slowphie you are getting there too.  A little bit at a time.  Good signs that I am reading with the vision.  Not 100% but little improvements.  I am seeing that with the air hunger so I have all the faith for you.

 

enjoy your week ladies.  I’m here for support as well but you guys seem to be kicking mirt to the curb.  Well done!

[Bestill]

I ended up getting a head cold.  Still waiting for my period to start and getting over this bug.  Holding until I am better.

 

I’m bummed because I have been taking such good care of myself.  Eating clean, minimal stress, good sleep and I still got sick.  I know that your immune system can be suppressed after ovulation but can it be suppressed by tapering medication as well!?  5 days in with the cold so hoping to fully recover in the next few days.  It wasn’t Covid either.

[Bestill]

I was able to decrease 5% in total over the last two weeks.  Despite the cold and my cycle.  Felt it more this time around but figured with my body going through what it did.  Cold kind of knocked me off my feet.

 

The past two weeks I have been lifting again.  Has been a hot second since I have done that.  I find that I can’t workout everyday to that extent or I feel like crud.  Trying the every other day and on my off days, yin/restorative yoga.

 

I find I feel my lowest in the evenings still.  Air hunger is better but still present.  Anxiety is pretty much gone, maybe feel it a little if I do too much.  Dry mouth is making an appearance lately and I’m noticing the blurred vision.  I just wear my reading glasses and I’m fine.  Sleep and appetite are still great.  Still getting muscle soreness and is now worse with lifting but the hurt between the shoulder blades has gone down a lot.  Oh, I also feel like I’m retaining water lately.  That’s kind of obnoxious.  🥴 (this can come with sore muscles). But it seems a bit more intense.

 

if I compare myself to Dec.  i have truly made leaps.  I can go shopping and eat out with no issues.  I have increased my time at work.  My kids can’t even tell I don’t feel well.  Probably less complaining on my end. Back to cleaning my house and not having to sit down every 5 mins.  I just don’t feel exhausted and have more motivation and don’t want to sit still.  

 

I just gotta keep pushing forward.  My plan is to hold for a couple of weeks and let things settle down a bit.  Almost done with the 9’s y’all!!

[Gigi68]

Way to go! Glad you are feeling so much better!

[Bestill]

It’s the week before the week.  I feel like I’m in a wave.  Something interesting.  Last month a week before my period I got a cold.  Woke up this morning with another sore throat but no congestion.  Body hurts and I just feel like I have the flu.  Little spurts of anxiety have been hitting the last few days.  Nothing crazy but just like oh wow, that just happened.  I’m really not surprised by anything and happy to have a day off, so resting it is!  
 

On the positive side.  I am seeing more good days than bad.  Still feel it more in the evenings until I take Mirtazapine.  Probably from winding down from my day? I seem to hit my worse around my cycle.  
 

If I was going by my schedule of tapering, I am ahead of schedule, but I go by how I feel mostly.  I will be holding until I feel better.

 

If anyone else has had weird withdrawals like a sore throat, water retention or anything else they just want to share.  Chime in!  🫶🏻

bestill

[ChessieCat]

5 hours ago, Bestill said:

water retention

 

I think this is common due to:

 

5 hours ago, Bestill said:

It’s the week before the week.

 

[marie123]

Hi Bestill. Nicely done getting so low. Sometimes I notice in the evening I can feel a bit worse and I think it means my body is craving more Mirt. This is the brain noticing the cut. The lower doses can be tricky. You can be moving along making cuts because you don't feel so bad, but they accumulate and hits you. Try to avoid that maybe and let the cuts catch up a bit. You'll have smooth sailing at the end this way. I hope things settle for you soon. Marie.

[Bestill]

@marie123 everything you said is correct.  The body wanting mirt and my cuts catching up to me.  My hope was to get to 7.5 and then take a nice break.  I may need the break sooner.  Feeling better than yesterday but just so achy and just not myself.  I learn as I go.  Thanks so much for hopping on overs. I definitely keep up with your journey and you are one strong woman.  ❤️❤️

[Bestill]

I believe I got sick again last week.  It seems to be going around.  This sore throat and body aches.  I have gotten sick twice now since tapering.  Does anyone know if that’s a thing when tapering medication.  The last time I was sick was Covid back in 2019.  Anyway, got over that, cut another 3% on Wednesday and period just started.  Gonna hold for two weeks here to see if that does the body good.

 

I have added more sugar this week and that’s a no no.  Cutting that out now.  My son and husband both had birthdays and I wanted to enjoy myself.  I did in the moment and then felt it later.  Had to test it out twice to make sure.  😉

 

Still trying to figure out my limits with exercise and being busy.  I think I’m just so eager to be my normal self.  Some day soon, I will figure it out.

 

Withdrawals are the same.  Seeing some windows at night.  Maybe like an hour or so.  Weather change has been crazy.  Last week it was snowing and today it was 80.  These fluctuations are not helping either.

 

I just keep going…..🙂

[Warrior]

Hello everybody! I read your reports and I identify a lot with what you are going through. I wanted some help, support, something like that, I'm going through a really tough wave right now. I was not aware of such a gradual withdrawal when I asked the medical doctor to stop the medication, I thought it would go back to normal without sequelae, that's what he told me, but that's not what happened. My reduction was very sudden and many negative symptoms have appeared since then. I currently have extreme insomnia, an unbearable headache, burning ears and pain in my eardrums. No hunger at all. Sore throat, I think it's inflamed. Some help? Anything. It's been very difficult, 9 months without the measurement and I still have terrible waves.

[Bestill]

@Warrior  I think like everyone says, it just takes time for your body to heal.  There is the choice of reinstating but I am not the pro when it comes to that. 
 

Just to be on the same page.  You have been completely off mirt for 9 months.  Have you been in a wave this whole time or waves and windows? If you are getting the windows, this is a good sign that your body is sorting things out and in fact healing.  I believe the greater the wave the better the healing.

 

waves are awful.  I feel like I have been in one for the past few weeks with a few good days.  I believe a 100% you will get through this.

 

@marie123 I feel like you have great experience with waves and advice to give.  Thoughts?

[Warrior]

@Bestill, I appreciate your help. Thank you so much! I definitely don't think about taking Mirtazapine back, terrible from the first day I was forced to take it. I believe the first 5 months were just waves, I didn't feel any improvement. Severe insomnia all this time, having accumulated about 3 - 4 weeks of regular sleep. Windows became more noticeable in the last 2 months, when a few weeks of sleep came in, but mostly waves. And emphasizing that the windows were not from sensational days, but better days in relation to the waves.

The symptoms I already reported in my topic, but I will summarize the main ones: severe insomnia (months without sleeping properly), disconnection from reality, mood instability, sexual problems, loss of sense of time, depersonalization, feeling of heavy brain, as well as slow and confused thinking.

If you have any further questions, please ask. Keep in touch, it helps a lot! Thank you!

[Warrior]

I don't feel well enough to describe everything I'm going through. This wave is really tough. When it improves, I will give more details.

[Bestill]

@warrior from what you have said, it really sounds like you are headed in the right direction.  I know sometimes it feels like we are going backwards.  I feel that a lot but if you can look back even 3 months from now and see improvement, that’s something to celebrate.

 

Not having enough sleep I feel would cause some of your other symptoms.  Have you tried sleep meditation? You can buy headbands with speakers so you can lay on your side.  Even like a talk down meditation. I have also heard that if you cannot sleep to get up and read or something to keep you busy instead of fighting to sleep.

 

I’m sure you have tried many things.  As I have been learning myself, healing takes a long time but some day it will be just a memory.  
 

Your body just needs to rest.

 

Hugs ❤️

[Warrior]

@BestillTruth! Looking back and observing improvement is very important, the pain makes me forget about it! Thank you very much!

 

I suspected that some symptoms are due to not sleeping well, this takes us off the axis. Where I live it's not so easy to find these tiaras, but I'll try some meditation in a nice sound to relax. If I have insomnia, I try to forget, as you said, to occupy myself.

 

Once again, I thank you for the support. Just talking to someone who understands the process helps lessen the worry. Thank you very much.❤

 

 

[Chlo]

@Warrior

Hello sweetheart, just wondering if you've tried melatonin or Magnesium Glycinate? I haven't started my taper of Mirt yet, but I've read where some have taken melatonin. Also try a organic lavender epsum salt bath and meditation. Magnesium Glycinate will help calm the CNS. 

Hugs!!

[Warrior]

@Chlo Hello! I tried melatonin for a while but it didn't improve sleep, my withdrawal was too abrupt. I didn't know about magnesium glycinate or epsum bath salt, I'll buy them to try.

 

Thank you so much! I really appreciate your support! ❤

[Faure]

Hey Bestill, so happy to read you are feeling better and able to do more. The same thing has happened to me! I just started a new BrassMonkey slide cycle yesterday and am at 7.1☺️ I noticed a big change suddenly happened a couple of weeks ago.
 

In hindsight I think perhaps it was tricky getting from 8-7 but now I’m almost there things are definitely better. I’m not pushing myself, I think I may be able to do more than I’m doing but I’m waiting till I’m sure! I got very bored on Sunday which was a rest day; I could definitely have gone and done something! I’m going to finish this cycle on 6.5 and am hopeful that things will slowly but surely continue to improve. I really want to start exercising more but last time I tried (25 lengths in the pool in November) I was shattered for a week and I was not much out of breath at the time as I’m a good swimmer….maybe l’ll have another go once a work thing is out the way next week.

 

About the cleaning - I did both bathrooms at the weekend! Not long ago just doing one was a huge effort ☺️

[Bestill]

@Faure

 

it is a good feeling to do more but sometimes it comes with feeling like crap later.  I just never know.  It’s like a gamble and can be frustrating at times.  I feel like my last cut I’m feeling it more.  Again it’s not knocking me down 100% but definitely need more breaks and trying to get myself in the right mind set of this will pass.  
 

Today, I’m just not in the right mind set and frustrated on how long this will take. However,  I regret nothing.  I understand some people find these medications to be poison but mine helped me sleep and eat while I worked on many changes.   

Anywho, I am better than I was 3 months ago and I focus on more healing over the next 3.  ❤️
 

 

[Pollyjay]

Hi Bestill!, I hope you start to feel better soon. You've made remarkable progress! 

 

Can you tell me more about the Calm five magnesium cream. Does it really help calm you? The naturopath had me on a high dose of magnesium back when I first got hit with the panic attacks - and before any meds- but it didn't seem to do a thing for me. 

[Faure]

Sorry you weren’t feeling great yesterday.  I totally under your frustration with how long this will take. I’m with you 🙁 I console myself that at the end of year 3 I’ll be on 1mg and less, so by then I should barely feel any adverse effects for the last 3 years (at least I hope I won’t).  
 

I also understand the frustration with feeling exhausted and never knowing how much you’ll be able to do. I am becoming surprised by not feeling tired after things that would have tired me just a few months ago. So we are both making progress ☺️
 

Yesterday I was browsing the local leisure centre website and saw a body balance class. I did that about 15 years ago and had completely forgotten I like it. It’s one of the most gentle exercise classes I think there is. It’s available on demand online so I’ve signed up for the free trial.  Last night I did 13 mins of a 55 min class and really enjoyed it. I also felt pretty good after. So I think I’ll spend the next year or so building up the strength I’ve lost while on this drug for the last 3 years. There are more challenging classes for when I’m fitter. I feel really positive about it! 
 

I hope you have a better day today 

[Bestill]

@Faurei think one of my big problems is that I’m working out and lifting harder than I prob should.  So I’m going to back down a bit and see if that improves.  Your workout sounds nice.  I’m gonna look into that.  I’m a fitness trainer and I’m working with some ladies again, getting them back into shape while I do the workout too. I’m thinking it may just be too much for the time being.  I think that’s what frustrates me the most.  So this is where i change the mind set of this isn’t for ever.  I have also allowed for a little more sugar in my diet and I just have to get rid of it all.  I did better when it wasn’t in my diet.  I’m learning.
 

@Pollyjay  there are actually two different things.  Magnesium cream is for my sore muscles.  So great when they hurt from withdrawal.  The calm five is the liquid I take when anxiety is at the surface.  I will say that it takes the edge off but if your anxiety isn’t through the roof, I’m not sure how helpful it will be.  I remember taking it when I cut too much in the beginning and it wasn’t helpful.  I will do a combo of the magnesium cream and rub peppermint oil on my tummy.  The tingles and smell of the oil helps take my mind off the anxiety and I’m able to  feel relief.  Hope this helps a little.

[Faure]

2 hours ago, Bestill said:

think one of my big problems is that I’m working out and lifting harder than I prob should.  So I’m going to back down a bit and see if that improves.  Your workout sounds nice.  I’m gonna look into that.  I’m a fitness trainer and I’m working with some ladies again, getting them back into shape while I do the workout too. I’m thinking it may just be too much for the time being.  I think that’s what frustrates me the most.  So this is where i change the mind set of this isn’t for ever.  I have also allowed for a little more sugar in my diet and I just have to get rid of it all.  I did better when it wasn’t in my diet.  I’m learning.

It’s with Les Mills I love Body Pump too but that would be WAAAAY to much for me atm! 
 

I listened to this super podcast the other day about sugar. It might help you. Now when I see fat (crisps) and sugar (sweets) in the shops I think “that’s what food companies want me to buy, I don’t need that”! It helps 🤣🤣🤣

 

I have a very restless sort of energy today; I think I’m coming back to life / experiencing slight WD effects.

[Chlo]

5 hours ago, Bestill said:

@Faurei think one of my big problems is that I’m working out and lifting harder than I prob should.  So I’m going to back down a bit and see if that improves.  Your workout sounds nice.  I’m gonna look into that.  I’m a fitness trainer and I’m working with some ladies again, getting them back into shape while I do the workout too. I’m thinking it may just be too much for the time being.  I think that’s what frustrates me the most.  So this is where i change the mind set of this isn’t for ever.  I have also allowed for a little more sugar in my diet and I just have to get rid of it all.  I did better when it wasn’t in my diet.  I’m learning.
 

@Pollyjay  there are actually two different things.  Magnesium cream is for my sore muscles.  So great when they hurt from withdrawal.  The calm five is the liquid I take when anxiety is at the surface.  I will say that it takes the edge off but if your anxiety isn’t through the roof, I’m not sure how helpful it will be.  I remember taking it when I cut too much in the beginning and it wasn’t helpful.  I will do a combo of the magnesium cream and rub peppermint oil on my tummy.  The tingles and smell of the oil helps take my mind off the anxiety and I’m able to  feel relief.  Hope this helps a little.

@Bestillquestion: because the calm 5 is homeopathic, isn't it best to not use anything with mint in it? Including toothpaste, gum, essential oils? I take Gelsemium sempervirens 30c and was told not to take anything with mint. 

Even though the Gelsemium does not help my anxiety. 

I would love to try the Calm 5 as well.

[Bestill]

@chlo I have never heard that.  Peppermint is actually a good natural source of easing anxiety.  You can research yourself and find the benefits of it.  I would never give it up because I find it so helpful.  Every body is different.

[Chlo]

On 4/28/2022 at 1:18 PM, Bestill said:

@chlo I have never heard that.  Peppermint is actually a good natural source of easing anxiety.  You can research yourself and find the benefits of it.  I would never give it up because I find it so helpful.  Every body is different.

@BestillYou are right, I was just told from my daughter that yes, you can use mint with Holistic medicine, just to wait approx 30 minutes before or after consuming strong flavored foods (onion, garlic, etc)or using toothpaste. My daughter always sets me straight on stuff like that, lol. She's a "crunchy" mom and lactation consultant. What is the brand name of your calm 5? I want to get some.🤍

[Bestill]

@ChloI have become quite the crunchy myself in the past year.  I actually love it very much.  ☺️  

[Chlo]

1 minute ago, Bestill said:

@ChloI have become quite the crunchy myself in the past year.  I actually love it very much.  ☺️  

@BestillI've found a brand called Energetix on Amazon, is that the same that you use?

[Bestill]

If it says calm five underneath, yes! 🙂

[Pollyjay]

On 4/28/2022 at 6:53 AM, Bestill said:

@Faurei think one of my big problems is that I’m working out and lifting harder than I prob should.  So I’m going to back down a bit and see if that improves.  Your workout sounds nice.  I’m gonna look into that.  I’m a fitness trainer and I’m working with some ladies again, getting them back into shape while I do the workout too. I’m thinking it may just be too much for the time being.  I think that’s what frustrates me the most.  So this is where i change the mind set of this isn’t for ever.  I have also allowed for a little more sugar in my diet and I just have to get rid of it all.  I did better when it wasn’t in my diet.  I’m learning.
 

@Pollyjay  there are actually two different things.  Magnesium cream is for my sore muscles.  So great when they hurt from withdrawal.  The calm five is the liquid I take when anxiety is at the surface.  I will say that it takes the edge off but if your anxiety isn’t through the roof, I’m not sure how helpful it will be.  I remember taking it when I cut too much in the beginning and it wasn’t helpful.  I will do a combo of the magnesium cream and rub peppermint oil on my tummy.  The tingles and smell of the oil helps take my mind off the anxiety and I’m able to  feel relief.  Hope this helps a little.

 

Thanks Bestill! I might get some and give it a go.

[Bestill]

It has been almost 2 weeks since my last drop.  This one has been a challenge and it’s definitely making me think it’s been too much and I need to cool it for a bit.  
 

i have been dealing with chest pains and mild anxiety with a headache for the last 3 days.  Body has been achy and burning pain between the shoulder blades is back.  
 

A few things I’m trying not to do.  Think that I have gone backwards and be bummed that I need to take this break to settle my body and hoping it will settle.  I’m not couch bound and I continue on my day and no one notices.  It’s just weird but whatever.

 

I do believe the weather is playing a huge role in how I’m feeling too.  I had issues prior to being on mirt so perhaps this is just making it worse.  
 

Needles to say, I have taken a pause from any kind of exercise, when I’m home, I’m resting.  Just trying to get out of my head right now of the what if’s and trying to live like I did before this all started.  That is my biggest challenge.  I’m not the energizer rabbit anymore.
 

bestill

[marie123]

Hi Bestill. Sorry you hit a blip in your tapering. All of us taperers do. Stay where you are in dose and you will feel much better. I felt terrible after my last cut but I'm much better now. Just keep going and soon we will be off forever. And then it gets much, much better. Marie.

[Bestill]

@marie123 thank you for popping in.  Today was a struggle.  I actually left work early because I just feel exhausted and my body hurts.  I will keep holding until I feel better.  Such a bummer too because things were going smoothly and then it wasn’t.  Your words encourage me and I’m glad you feel better after your last cut.

 

bestill

[Faure]

Hi, sorry to hear you’ve hit a bump.  I hit one a few weeks ago, then it was over and I was ok again…you’ll start feeling better soon I’m sure 🤞rest and do the minimum you can get away with☺️