DebM: Intro - starting over and beginning titration from Lexapro

[DebM]

Hello,

I am new to this forum. I am married with two wonderful adult daughters. I have attempted titration twice previous and experienced two episodes of discontinuation syndrome. As terrifying and hellish as the withdrawal was I am determined to remain positive as I desire and to be off my medication. So much so when my husband asked me what I wanted for Christmas, I said a miracle. I want to be free from all medication. The only psychiatrist I can find to write tapering scripts told me I was "N of one." Meaning he had NEVER had anyone experience withdrawal. I am no longer giving energy to the flaws in the medical community but rather seeking to heal. My last crash I was almost there. I was down to .7mg of Lexapro. I believe the effect of potentiating supplements such as 5HTP, Skullcap, Passionflower and the CBD oil my psychiatrist recommended contributed to interfere with my successful completion of titration. I was on a higher dose of Lexapro on the days I used a sleep patch due to potentiating of the ingredients and the CBD oil and when I did not use the supplements, I was lower. I am sad about starting all over again. I grieve all the work I did, yet I tell myself I am courageous and strong. I have been stable, albeit with side effects of sedation, tinnitus, and dizziness for over a month. I began titrating of the Lexapro and I am now at 4mg of Lexapro from a dose of 5mg. I am staying with the 15mg of Remeron at night. I am titrating down 10% for the next month starting tomorrow. I am considering staying stable at that dose of Lexapro and shifting to titrate of the Remeron which I have only taken for a month due to significant side effects! My thought is to go down 10% on the Remeron every 30 days? Thoughts? Keep the Lexapro at the 3.8mg dose until 30 days after I made it completely off the Remeron. After I am a month or two stable off the Remeron start with 10% titration down on the Lexapro every 30 days. I am trying to find all information on how to create my own compounding liquid. I do have an appointment with my psychiatrist at the end of January, I spend my time trying to educate him on the realities of antidepressant discontinuation. I also want all knowledge to be armed to help myself.  I do not know any of you, yet, I pray all people coping with the challenges of getting off antidepressants are healed and supported in this universe. May we all be well. May we all feel peace.

 

Deb

20 years Pamelor 20mg

2017 began titration / 2019 off Pamelor

2017 due to discontinuation syndrome -Lexapro 5mg added

2019 Began titration Lexapro

2021 Lexapro .7mg discontinuation syndrome

2021 Lexapro 10/5/21 5mg

2021 Remeron 15mg 10/11/21

2021 Lexapro 11/15/21 4mg Lexapro; 15 mg Remeron

 

[Kiasofia]

Welcome @DebM

I'm so sorry your tapering got set back. Normally we advise doing a slight increase when withdrawal gets bad, but not back to original dose. Not necessarily even up to the last dose that was tapered from. Just slightly higher. Sometimes it's best to just hold and let the body adjust. So for this round of tapering, bare that in mind. It is also extremely important to take the same dose every day.

 

About tapering:

NEVER SKIP DOSES TO TAPER

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

Tips for tapering off escitalopram (Lexapro)

Tips for tapering off mirtazapine (Remeron)

 

How did you feel when you went from .7mg back to 5mg? How have you felt lowering to 4mg?

 

Ideally Remeron would be tapered last, but if it is causing bad side effects and you have been on it a short time, you can consider tapering it first. Or tapering it to a low dose and keeping it there while you finish tapering lexapro.

Taking multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first?

 

I found this post helpful to understand how these drugs actually work, why a slow taper is important and why healing takes time:

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

Some information about withdrawal and talking to doctors:

What is withdrawal syndrome?

 

Dr. Joseph Glenmullen's withdrawal symptom checklist

 

How to talk to a doctor about tapering and withdrawal? What to expect?

 

When we recover, there are times of feeling OK mixed in with times of feeling bad.  This is called windows and waves.

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Aside from a high quality fish oil and magnesium, be careful with supplements. Your central nervous system (CNS) has become sensitized from psychiatric drug use and can react unpredictably. Alcohol, caffeine, nicotine and other mind altering substances can make the condition worse.

Important topics about tests, supplements, treatments, diet

 

Here is our symptoms and self care section, you may find some useful ideas to help manage.

Symptoms and self care topics

 

We suggest keeping things slow, simple, and stable. This is extremely important. 

Keep it simple, slow and stable

 

I highly recommend reading  Anatomy of an Epidemic by Robert Whitaker as well as A straight talking introduction to psychiatric drugs by Joanna Moncrieff to better understand these drugs and their effects. The Council for Evidence based Psychiatry also has a lot of good information.

 

This is your Introductory topic, where you can ask questions and connect with other members.  We're glad you found your way here.

Edited November 22, 2021 by Kiasofia

[DebM]

Thank you Chessie Cat for your response.! I appreciate the information you shared to read! Given my last dose was .7mg of Lexapro I feel very sedated and sleepy on both of these drugs. I have thought of getting off Lexapro first and then Remeron. I like the idea of trying to get the Remeron dose lower and stay stable and get off Lexapro. I will take some time to read all the information. 

 

Peace to you,

Deb

[DebM]

Wow!!I ordered Whitaker's book Anatomy of an Epidemic. Looks excellent! I reviewed my blood work and my thyroid  peroxidase antibody is a 2, mot a zero. Hmm...  I am on HRT and I had break-through bleeding and waiting to stabilize so I was told to not take fish oil due to blood thinning properties. As soon as this is turned around I will add back in. I am eating an AIP diet with no gluten, diary, and whole foods. It is all a bit daunting and scary, yet I am comforted to have a map. I also am comforted that many of the things I am doing are in line. 

 

To answer your question on 4mg I feel better. The Remeron side effects of sedation, tinnitus, and a weird feeling in my head I dislike. I am going to wait 20 more days to stabilize and begin to titrate Remeron. 

 

THANK YOU!

Deb

[Kiasofia]

10 hours ago, DebM said:

I am going to wait 20 more days to stabilize and begin to titrate Remeron. 

Sounds like a good plan.

 

10 hours ago, DebM said:

ordered Whitaker's book Anatomy of an Epidemic. Looks excellent!

It can be upsetting to read about the effects of these drugs and how most of us should never have been prescribed them, but I spent a long time being bewildered and confused so I find it helpful to have knowledge all the same. And it really helps to have read it for whenever a well meaning friend or medical professional wants to tell you that "some people need these drugs due to a chemical imbalance and there is no shame in that". No, "Some people need these drugs due to dependency created by the drugs and it is possible to be free although some need to taper extremely slowly for that to happen."

 

I hope you find the knowledge empowering and find comfort in being part of this community.

 

Please stay in touch and let us know how you are doing.

[DebM]

Kiasofia,

 

Thank you! Yes, I also can be disturbed and frightened with the truth of antidepressant drugs. I suspect this is a common occurrence for all of us. The isolation and need to be your own medical advocate, pharmacist, cheer leader is tough. I am lucky as I have a therapist who is supportive, yet, I educate her all the time. My husband helps me with the scale and titrating. Our version of Breaking Bad scenes, probably more prevalent in homes all over the world, except we are not criminals.  That is a bit more scary. I tell my sister a television series documenting the truth needs to be made. 

 

Peace,

Deb

11 hours ago, Kiasofia said:

Sounds like a good plan.

 

It can be upsetting to read about the effects of these drugs and how most of us should never have been prescribed them, but I spent a long time being bewildered and confused so I find it helpful to have knowledge all the same. And it really helps to have read it for whenever a well meaning friend or medical professional wants to tell you that "some people need these drugs due to a chemical imbalance and there is no shame in that". No, "Some people need these drugs due to dependency created by the drugs and it is possible to be free although some need to taper extremely slowly for that to happen."

 

I hope you find the knowledge empowering and find comfort in being part of this community.

 

Please stay in touch and let us know how you are doing.

 

[ChessieCat]

9 minutes ago, DebM said:

I also can be disturbed and frightened with the truth of antidepressant drugs. I suspect this is a common occurrence for all of us. The isolation and need to be your own medical advocate, pharmacist, cheer leader is tough.

 

Yes and yes.

 

10 minutes ago, DebM said:

I am lucky as I have a therapist who is supportive, yet, I educate her all the time.

 

Some for me with my doctor.

 

10 minutes ago, DebM said:

Our version of Breaking Bad scenes, probably more prevalent in homes all over the world, except we are not criminals. 

 

At the end of I needed to break open my compounded capsules which pharma company says not to break tablets!, to make a liquid.  So I was "breaking" 2 rules.  I bought syringes and graduated cylinders but never went so far as to buy myself a lab coat. 🤣  And it can feel like you are a "junkie" or "dealer" making your concoction yourself because there is no other way to do it.  Some members have had to cut lines of their crushed tablets to get their tiny doses once they couldn't be weighed on the scales.  I would often find myself shaking my head when I thought about how stupid it seemed to be having to do what I was doing and also knowing that I wasn't the only one because I know that there are many SA members and others having to do the same thing.

 

Absolutely crazy.

 

BUT it is worth it.  After a 6 year taper my last dose was 12 November 2021.

[Greatful]

@DebM Hi, Welcome to SA.  You sound strong and ready to take on the fight to get off your meds.  Kiasofia  has given you a lot of information to look over, books to read.  The more you can educate yourself the more control you will have making decisions in taking care of your health.

 

24 minutes ago, DebM said:

I am lucky as I have a therapist who is supportive, yet, I educate her all the time.

  I have a therapist too and she is supporting me and she gets a real ear full on some of our visits.  She told me the other day that she has another patient who tried to switch to a Lexapro and it was not going well, the Physician assistance, PA want to increase the dose instead of looking at it that maybe the drug was not a good fit for her.  Well this PA is at the same clinic, my therapist was going to try and address this with her, but knew that she had to be careful on how to do it as to not over step her self.  My therapist said she is learning from me and some of her other clients.   She does agree that they hand them like candy.  I told her to read The Antidepressant Solution by Joseph Glenmullen M.D.  I also told her that she should educate herself more since she works with, I am sure, many clients that are on something. 

I guess we need to keep pushing the information as much as we can.  There is no excuse how the doc's can stick their heads in the sand when there are so many books written by their peers, social media, support groups, journals, studies done.  My goodness you tube has so much.  

 

Post and ask as many questions as you want, we are here to help and support in anyway we can. 

 

 

 

[Kiasofia]

13 hours ago, DebM said:

Our version of Breaking Bad scenes

This made me laugh, even though it is of course tragic!

 

There are attempts to alert people. One is the documentary Medicating Normal which was released in 2020:

https://medicatingnormal.com/

[DebM]

Thank you for the documentary information. I can't quite watch it yet. I did watch the trailer. Disturbing.

[DebM]

On 11/24/2021 at 7:03 PM, Greatful said:

@DebM Hi, Welcome to SA.  You sound strong and ready to take on the fight to get off your meds.  Kiasofia  has given you a lot of information to look over, books to read.  The more you can educate yourself the more control you will have making decisions in taking care of your health.

 

  I have a therapist too and she is supporting me and she gets a real ear full on some of our visits.  She told me the other day that she has another patient who tried to switch to a Lexapro and it was not going well, the Physician assistance, PA want to increase the dose instead of looking at it that maybe the drug was not a good fit for her.  Well this PA is at the same clinic, my therapist was going to try and address this with her, but knew that she had to be careful on how to do it as to not over step her self.  My therapist said she is learning from me and some of her other clients.   She does agree that they hand them like candy.  I told her to read The Antidepressant Solution by Joseph Glenmullen M.D.  I also told her that she should educate herself more since she works with, I am sure, many clients that are on something. 

I guess we need to keep pushing the information as much as we can.  There is no excuse how the doc's can stick their heads in the sand when there are so many books written by their peers, social media, support groups, journals, studies done.  My goodness you tube has so much.  

 

Post and ask as many questions as you want, we are here to help and support in anyway we can. 

 

 

 

Thank you for your response! I will check out that book as well. I already have read about 100 pages of The Anatomy of an Epidemic. It is interesting and supportive, yet it is also disturbing as I am having such a hard time getting off. But I will ! One day!

[DebM]

On 11/25/2021 at 8:06 AM, Kiasofia said:

This made me laugh, even though it is of course tragic!

I agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There are attempts to alert people. One is the documentary Medicating Normal which was released in 2020:

https://medicatingnormal.com/

This made me laugh, even though it is of course tragic!

[DebM]

I am experiencing some challenges. I/We made an error with dosing ( my spouse has done all the work with weighing. I now have learned to do it myself to be a second eye. I also feel it was remiss of me not to know myself) and my dose of powder and weighing actually took me down to 3.6 mg of Lexapro for the last month not 4mg. I reweighed the amount to check as I was feeling poorly. I did not sleep well last night and I am very very nauseated. Nausea has never been a sign of withdrawal for me the last two times I have experienced significant withdrawal.

 

Now, it could be my hormones are out of whack. I am on HRT and waiting to get estrogen pellets placed in past my dose date as I experienced spotting with taking Remeron/Mirtazapine 15mg at night. I called and asked the pharmacist if my compounded progesterone could be taken at the same time. They said yes, however, I spotted/bled and looked up drug interactions and found that Mirtazapine decreases the efficacy of Progesterone. So, I spaced the hours of dosing by five hours which helped. (I wish for once I had an answer I could trust. )

 

It has now been a month on 3.6mg of Lexapro and the actual reduction is more than I think wise. I was nauseated and roofied on the 5mg Lexapro medication and had trouble functioning. Anyhow, I could have multiple reasons for feeling so poorly. I also walked 2 1/2 miles two days in a row which is not wise as my body was taxed. (I feel my best as I walk and right after my walk for several hours. I combat the roofied feeling with walking. My do or die spirit came one day when I willed myself out of bed and told my husband I am going to walk off this horrible druged state).

 

  I could also have a bug? However, out of caution I reweighed all my Lexapro doses to ensure they are at 4mg. I assume it will take 14 days or so with increasing my dose to feel better?  Do I need to go back up to 5mg? When I was on Pamelor and Lexapro I could easily decrease the Pamelor with the Lexapro baking it up. I was hoping the Remeron would hold the Lexapro reduction as I titrated. Maybe that was a one time lucky incident. Just a venting here. . . I am so exhausted with feeling poorly. I am so exhausted with having no one in the actual medical community who listens when I tell them I am titrating. I give them a printed handout of my medical records and medications, supplements, and my titrating schedule and withdrawal episodes. I asked one PA at urgent care if she documented my titrating or if she kept the dose at 5mg in my chart. She told me they are not allowed to document anything other than what is prescribed. UGH!! Yet as I close as frustrated as I am and as poorly as I feel I am aware I am grateful for this community!! 

May we all be at peace. May we all heal.

Deb

[ChessieCat]

Increasing your dose if/when there are other causes is not a good idea.  If you knew for certain that it was withdrawal then, and only if the symptoms were unbearable, would a small increase (not necessarily back to the previous dose) be worth considering.

 

The brain likes consistency and it does not like jumping around in doses and/or drugs.  And the effect is cumulative.  What you have done previously will not necessarily work the next time you do it.

 

We have members here who have thrown themselves into big waves of symptoms from overdoing physical activities.

 

Q:  Have you had a vaccination in the last couple of months?  If yes, then that is also something to take into consideration.

[Kiasofia]

If I understand correctly Nov 15 you actually went from 5mg to 3.6mg (not 4mg) and have been taking this for a month? And now you are taking 4mg? Since what date? Please update your signature to reflect this.

 

It is probably best to hold steady now at the actual 4mg dose for a month and then see. Ideally after 5mg you would have lowered to no more than 4.5mg, but as ChessieCat pointed out, the brain doesn't like changes so updosing to correct the mistake has risks. Often it's best to just hold where one is, but I think the updose from 3.6mg to 4mg should be ok. Hopefully it can help with the nausea, which is a common withdrawal symptom.

 

Keep it simple, slow and stable

 

14 hours ago, DebM said:

not allowed to document anything other than what is prescribed

I understand your frustration! How is not having your actual dose registered considered documenting...

[DebM]

12 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Increasing your dose if/when there are other causes is not a good idea.  If you knew for certain that it was withdrawal then, and only if the symptoms were unbearable, would a small increase (not necessarily back to the previous dose) be worth considering.

 

The brain likes consistency and it does not like jumping around in doses and/or drugs.  And the effect is cumulative.  What you have done previously will not necessarily work the next time you do it.

 

We have members here who have thrown themselves into big waves of symptoms from overdoing physical activities.

 

Q:  Have you had a vaccination in the last couple of months?  If yes, then that is also something to take into consideration.

 

 

The brain likes consistency and it does not like jumping around in doses and/or drugs.

 

Thank you! I already feel much better today after only one day on the small increase. Congratulations on titrating off completely!!  

 

[DebM]

1 hour ago, Kiasofia said:

If I understand correctly Nov 15 you actually went from 5mg to 3.6mg (not 4mg) and have been taking this for a month? And now you are taking 4mg? Since what date? Please update your signature to reflect this.

 

It is probably best to hold steady now at the actual 4mg dose for a month and then see. Ideally after 5mg you would have lowered to no more than 4.5mg, but as ChessieCat pointed out, the brain doesn't like changes so updosing to correct the mistake has risks. Often it's best to just hold where one is, but I think the updose from 3.6mg to 4mg should be ok. Hopefully it can help with the nausea, which is a common withdrawal symptom.

 

Keep it simple, slow and stable

 

I understand your frustration! How is not having your actual dose registered considered documenting...

 

 

but I think the updose from 3.6mg to 4mg should be ok. Hopefully it can help with the nausea, which is a common withdrawal symptom.

 

Thank you for your response! Yes you are correct with my error and I will go back and fix my signature. I choose to believe in signs. I was completely panicked and afraid when I realized my error. So much so I thought I had to start all over again at 5mg. I prayed that God would give me signs to calm and find a way. I feel steady with staying at 4mg and allowing my brain time to heal. Thank you again!

[Kiasofia]

3 hours ago, DebM said:

I thought I had to start all over again at 5mg

 

It is usually a bad idea to go back to the original dose. The brain has been adjusting to the decrease and might not handle it well. A slight updose at most or hold. The ideal is to taper at a slow enough rate that there isn't a need to consider an updose. We now know that reducing from 5mg to 3.6 is too big a reduction for you (28%). Hopefully you will do better with a 10% reduction, once you have stabilized.

 

I'm glad your feeling better today❤️

[DebM]

1 hour ago, Kiasofia said:

 

It is usually a bad idea to go back to the original dose. The brain has been adjusting to the decrease and might not handle it well. A slight updose at most or hold. The ideal is to taper at a slow enough rate that there isn't a need to consider an updose. We now know that reducing from 5mg to 3.6 is too big a reduction for you (28%). Hopefully you will do better with a 10% reduction, once you have stabilized.

 

I'm glad your feeling better today❤️

 

 

 

The ideal is to taper at a slow enough rate that there isn't a need to consider an updose.

 

Yes, I can see that now!!

 

 

What I learned --I am astounded that only an increase from 3.6 to 4 mg of Lexapro has such a profound difference in my body after two days!! I'm noticing that I am more sedated and that seem unreal. My nausea is much less. Almost gone.

 

At this time, I'm question whether I was experiencing withdrawal (some? Yes, maybe my feeling better is of course confirmation) or if drinking water with baking soda in it for two days exacerbated dizziness as well as nausea and frequent bowel movements. I ate an extreme amount of sugar over Thanksgiving holidays and also had one cup of coffee and experienced symptoms of interstitial (IC). Usually drinking baking soda with water neutralizes the pain. I may have ingested too much. What  I learned from this experience is not maintaining a very strict schedule to decrease titration will assist me in not becoming overly anxious or panicky about bodily symptoms. When that occurs and I haven't adhered to a very strict titration I rush to assume my symptoms are always withdrawal. I am then very anxious as well as unwell. I do know even one cup of coffee is not good, too much exercise is not good, and too much sugar (white death) is not good for me.

 

When I get in a regular routine of feeling well and stabilize on a medication it has been fairly easy for me to recognize withdrawal. I also can say each drug has its own presentation. Like a personality. In the past Lexapro has shown up as exhaustion, insomnia, headaches, weird feeling in my body that feels unwell, unlike any unwell feeling I’d ever had. A sick dizziness. It almost defies language. Currently my eyes are very dry, I have tinnitus (I’ve had this ever since starting Remeron- I hate it), I feel somewhat sedated, but better than yesterday.  I am maintaining the course. I may have overreacted in going up to 4 mg or I may not have. One thing I know I'm staying steady at 4 mg.

 

I want to thank each and all of you for any feedback you've given, if you read my post and sent any good vibes, prayers or well wishes I think you wholeheartedly. One thing that is my saving grace in this is I believe wholeheartedly in the power of the body's ability to eventually heal. I believe that collectively we all can help each other heal. I believe in the power of human connection; I believe in the power of prayer. I believe in the resiliency of the human spirit. It's interesting that I am also very frequently terrified, panicked and work very hard to keep coming back to my beliefs despite my struggle. Such a paradox, yes?

May you be at peace. May you be healed. May you pass on healing to one another.

Deb

[ChessieCat]

It is important not to taper again until you are stable:

 

Stability

 

WDnormal

 

Moderator brassmonkey has written more about WDnormal in his Success Story:

 

tao-of-the-brassmonkey

[DebM]

It is important not to taper again until you are stable

 

Yes, I agree. Thank you!!

[DebM]

3 hours ago, DebM said:

 

 

 

The ideal is to taper at a slow enough rate that there isn't a need to consider an updose.

 

Yes, I can see that now!!

 

 

What I learned --I am astounded that only an increase from 3.6 to 4 mg of Lexapro has such a profound difference in my body after two days!! I'm noticing that I am more sedated and that seem unreal. My nausea is much less. Almost gone.

 

At this time, I'm question whether I was experiencing withdrawal (some? Yes, maybe my feeling better is of course confirmation) or if drinking water with baking soda in it for two days exacerbated dizziness as well as nausea and frequent bowel movements. I ate an extreme amount of sugar over Thanksgiving holidays and also had one cup of coffee and experienced symptoms of interstitial (IC). Usually drinking baking soda with water neutralizes the pain. I may have ingested too much. What  I learned from this experience is not maintaining a very strict schedule to decrease titration will assist me in not becoming overly anxious or panicky about bodily symptoms. When that occurs and I haven't adhered to a very strict titration I rush to assume my symptoms are always withdrawal. I am then very anxious as well as unwell. I do know even one cup of coffee is not good, too much exercise is not good, and too much sugar (white death) is not good for me.

 

When I get in a regular routine of feeling well and stabilize on a medication it has been fairly easy for me to recognize withdrawal. I also can say each drug has its own presentation. Like a personality. In the past Lexapro has shown up as exhaustion, insomnia, headaches, weird feeling in my body that feels unwell, unlike any unwell feeling I’d ever had. A sick dizziness. It almost defies language. Currently my eyes are very dry, I have tinnitus (I’ve had this ever since starting Remeron- I hate it), I feel somewhat sedated, but better than yesterday.  I am maintaining the course. I may have overreacted in going up to 4 mg or I may not have. One thing I know I'm staying steady at 4 mg.

 

I want to thank each and all of you for any feedback you've given, if you read my post and sent any good vibes, prayers or well wishes I think you wholeheartedly. One thing that is my saving grace in this is I believe wholeheartedly in the power of the body's ability to eventually heal. I believe that collectively we all can help each other heal. I believe in the power of human connection; I believe in the power of prayer. I believe in the resiliency of the human spirit. It's interesting that I am also very frequently terrified, panicked and work very hard to keep coming back to my beliefs despite my struggle. Such a paradox, yes?

May you be at peace. May you be healed. May you pass on healing to one another.

Deb

 

 

I just realized how an exclamation point after agreeing to a comment can be viewed . I mean by the exclamation that I agree with you wholeheartedly and thank you for stressing the wisdom of your comment. Very much. I am afraid more than I speak of.

THANK YOU!

[ChessieCat]

2 minutes ago, DebM said:

I mean by the exclamation that I agree with you wholeheartedly and thank you for stressing the wisdom of your comment.

 

I find the "like" button can be misinterpreted, especially if the post contains comments about more than one thing.

[DebM]

50 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

 

I find the "like" button can be misinterpreted, especially if the post contains comments about more than one thing.

Oh Geez I just realized there is a like button. LOL I just used it. 

Yes, I can see how that can be misinterpreted. 

[DebM]

I am on now 4mg of Lexapro and 15mg of Remeron. The Remeron is new and was added when I went through antidepressant withdrawal most recently. I regret adding this drug (prior to finding this site) now as I have significant side-effects such as tinnitus, (very disturbing ), vision problems, urinary challenges, dizzy, sedated,  stomach aches that are constant. I started to titrate off Lexapro as I was familiar with how to do so with crushing and weighing the amount on a scale. I get it would make sense to titrate first of the sedating drug, Remeron. However, I am so miserable. The withdrawal from Lexapro I am familiar with and made it previously to .7mg and ruined it by taking supplements that potentiated the drug. When I did not take the supplements the difference caught up in a crash. I am thinking of getting stable on the lower Lexapro and switch to titrating Remeron. I'm having trouble working with the symptoms. As I write this I am very very dizzy, blurred vision, ringing in my ears, and easily distracted. Hard to concentrate. I recently updosed due to a tapering error and concern that I was experiencing withdrawal. After the updose my nausea stopped however all the symptoms I mentioned that were settling on the lower dose of Lexapro are now in full force. I am not sure how much each drug potentiates the other?  My psychiatrist is not knowledgeable about how to taper yet he was willing to call in a tapering script for the Lexapro. I cannot see him until the end of January. If you have any knowledge about how HRT may interact with medications or withdrawal I am on HRT for menapause. HRT seemed very helpful until until the whole thing crashed and it is a challenge to know what is contributing to what. 

Struggling . . . waiting for time to pass.

Deb

[Kiasofia]

On 12/2/2021 at 12:07 AM, DebM said:

I mean by the exclamation that I agree with you wholeheartedly

That's how I interpreted it😊 It can be easy to misinterpret when communicating this way, but if there's room for interpretation I try to assume that people are being nice!

[DebM]

3 minutes ago, Kiasofia said:

That's how I interpreted it😊 It can be easy to misinterpret when communicating this way, but if there's room for interpretation I try to assume that people are being nice!

 

Same!

[Altostrata]

@DebM A "what should I do?" post belongs here in your Intro topic.

 

You've been taking Remeron only since October 11? You updosed to 4mg Lexapro only 5 days ago?

 

What times o'clock do you take each of your drugs, with their dosages? Are the unpleasant symptoms more intense at any particular times of day?

[DebM]

What should I do?

 

@Alto - Thank you. Yes, I started taking Remeron 10/11/21. Yes, I updosed 4 days ago. 

 

I take Lexapro at 10am because I take the Remeron at 10pm and with the 12 hour spacing there is a bit less sedating impact. 

About a half hour after taking Remeron I have a horrible drugged feeling. I have to get to bed quickly as dizzy and physically 

hard to move. Feels unsteady. My head feels like cotton, fuzzy thinking. Like I've ben roofied. Fuzzy thinking is worse in the morning. I wake up several times in the night with painful hunger symptoms (not normal) and extremely dry mouth. Often I feel an odd restlessness for about a half hour after taking Remeron. I have stomach aches all day worse in the evening or around meal time.  I have tinnitus off and on all day and night. Tinnitus only started after Remeron. Tinnitus is high right now 8pm. It's high any time I think about it.

 

I feel fatigued all day. My joints really ache (new) and I started feeling what feels like nerve pain in my arms all day. I have an increase in interstitial cystitis pretty significant which could very well be hormone related. I have bloated abdomen. 

 

I dread taking each medication. I dread after I take Lexapro as I feel increased dizziness and as if my limbs are not cooperating. Like I'm walking of center. The morning is particularly bad. With some easing if I walk on some days. I just walk through it which is a bit scary. The afternoons by 2pm-4pm can increase symptoms of exhaustion and at times like a tight band is around my forehead with a headache. I take progesterone at 5pm to be dosed far from Remeron to prevent decreased drug levels of progesterone. I also dislike taking the progesterone so early but due to the Remeron effect I have no choice. So, my evenings I am then extra sleepy due to taking progesterone so early.

 

I have a headache fairly constant. The headache is low by 8-m. I rarely had headaches previous. Thinking back I did have headaches starting Lexapro and when I felt withdrawal at times with from Pamelor. 

 

It seems like a drug toss up with symptoms. With Remeron it seems the tinnitus, arm nerve pain feelings (Really concerning) , impacting when I take my progesterone,  stomach aches and abdominal discomfort. As best I can guess given my experience being on only Lexapro and comparing. 

 

With Lexapro the morning nausea after taking, increased feeling sedated, increased dizziness and uncoordinated.  Hard to think. Lexapro when I first started I feel horrible racy, but now sleepy. I have a general increase in all symptoms after taking Lexapro for several hours.

By 7pm some symptoms have eased. 

 

I understand that Lexapro (accelerator) is best to quit first. I understand that Remeron (brakes) can hold the impact of insomnia and agitation I think from Lexapro titration. I am just really pretty afraid of Remeron with the tinnitus, nerve pain, stomach aches which all feel overwhelming. These symptoms scare me that I'm really damaging my body?  My pharmacist warned that with these both the risk of serotonin syndrome is higher. I also am afraid of an increased risk of blood sugar challenges on Remeron given I am APOE4 positive. 

 

Thank you,

Deb

 

 

[DebM]

@alto just FYI I am not diabetic. Beyond my antidepressant side-effects and withdrawal my blood work and health are all noted to be very good. 

The arm pain extends to my hands and I feel some numbness in my fingers as well as joint pain.

I forgot to mention I have vision changes. Sometimes my vision is blurred. It is like my prescription for vision is not working.

Dry eyes.

[Altostrata]

18 hours ago, DebM said:

The headache is low by 8-m.

 

Do you mean 8 p.m.?

 

In your case, since you have clear adverse effects from Remeron, it makes sense to hold on the Lexapro dose and taper Remeron instead. I would try a 10% reduction first, see what that does.

 

Since you find 4mg Lexapro makes you sleepy, it's not clear what benefit Remeron might have.

 

Please keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. 

[DebM]

@Alto - Yes. 8pm.

 

Thank you! That makes sense. Yes, I can present future info in a simple list format. 

[Kiasofia]

When you use the tag function, write @ and then start typing a username. A drop down menu will appear. Click on their username and it will look like this if you do it right: @DebM