Erimus: my introduction and journal

[Erimus]

Is there any other reports and/or information I should go armed with? Should I be cautious in taking about how I’ve done my own research online? 

[Faure]

I think it depends on your doctor. Is this a doctor that you see regularly? I was lucky in that I developed a good relationship with my GP who I met when I first crashed from a poor taper back in 2019. He supported my 10% taper which meant a lot to me, even though he said it would “take ages”. I told him I saw it as an investment in the rest of my life. He subsequently left the surgery and I have stayed well away since then. I do my taper by myself and just get on with it. Fortunately all has been well for the last year.  You don’t want a gp who thinks tapering slowly is a bad idea and won’t support you. It’s very difficult because we need them to prescribe and we have to be careful what we say to make sure they continue to do this. Unfortunately they “learn” from the literature the drug companies give them whIch minimises WD effects. I think taking the leaflet from the RCP is essential, you may also want to refer to Prof Joanna Moncrieff who says 10% in her book too - the truth about psychiatric drugs. I think the NICE guidelines have also been updated to reflect the fact that WD can last for months for some people and be severe so you could look this up too. Unfortunately it doesn’t yet say years. 

 

To answer the question you put in my thread about food and mirtazepine, no I haven’t experienced any problems during my taper. When I started mirtazepine I hadn’t been eating properly for a few months and was very thin. Couldn’t believe the effect, within about 45 minutes I was straight into a jacket potato and the next day back to regular full meals. I’ve put on some weight since then but fortunately not too much, I’m hoping to lose it as the drug reduces and I have more energy to exercise. I can highly recommend the BrassMonkey slide when you’re ready to taper again. 

[Erimus]

Thanks for the lengthy response @Faure. I’m definitely erring on the side of caution about when I meet the GP. It’s one I haven’t interacted with before, I just need to update them and tell them how I want to be supported through this. Thankfully I know how to safely taper now so at least I’m not going in blind, and asking them for advice.

 

Regarding food and diet. A lot of people mention problems with histamine when tapering mirtazapine which is what I was asking in regards to. Are you okay with foods like: tomatoes, yoghurt, bananas, avocado, chocolate, spinach?

[Faure]

2 hours ago, Erimus said:

Regarding food and diet. A lot of people mention problems with histamine when tapering mirtazapine which is what I was asking in regards to. Are you okay with foods like: tomatoes, yoghurt, bananas, avocado, chocolate, spinach?

No problems with any food. Maybe because my nervous system started from a point of stability…..I don’t know ☺️

[Erimus]

Thanks @Faure. That’s good to know. There’s a lot of doom and gloom spread about so it’s good to see that there is people like you who can still function reasonably well whilst tapering a drug. 
 

Ah yes, stability, I’m not too familiar with that myself.. haha.

[Faure]

9 hours ago, Erimus said:

There’s a lot of doom and gloom spread about so it’s good to see that there is people like you who can still function reasonably well whilst tapering a drug. 

I’m not only functioning reasonably well, I’m doing better and better as time goes on and the dose reduces. So all is not lost - a slow, steady taper can work very well. Also I think you’re still pretty young so fingers crossed for you it goes well once you stabilise. Be sure to have felt stable for a long time before you start the taper. (I’ll leave it to others to say how long that should be!)

[Erimus]

June 15th

 

Im getting small windows where I feel ok interspersed with windows of mild akathisia. It’s not exactly pleasant going from being calm and still to the inability to sit still. It just kind of comes out of nowhere. 
 

Im very careful in using the term akathisia because I know how serious and dangerous that symptom is. But some of the feelings I’ve experienced over the last few months could only be described by this term.
 

I’ve got out for a decent walk the past 3 nights and am hoping this is something I continue to implement into my daily routine. Routine is so important when you’re going through this.

[Erimus]

Agitation has been pretty unpleasant today. The sun is shining though, so I’ve been soaking up some vitamin D this evening. Should help getting 20-30 minutes sunlight each day now I’ve stopped the D3 supplements.

[Erimus]

I was having a quick browse on the introductions page and counted that in the last week there has been 14 NEW topics created.
 

In the UK 17% of the adult population took antidepressants in 2017. Between January and March 2021 20.2million antidepressant drugs were prescribed in the UK, and, since the pandemic started, 803,000 more antidepressants were issued than expected based on historical trends.

This problem is only getting worse. When are things going to change and how can we help the cause?

 

Edited November 20, 2022 by ChessieCat
edited at request of member

[Faure]

Hi, have you seen the film Medicating Normal? Very good and it’s slowly raising awareness

[Erimus]

Hi @Faure. I have heard of the film but have not yet watched it. I try not to spend too much time engaging in content about psychiatric drugs as I feel it impacts me negatively. I will probably watch it when I’m more stable. Although, when I’m feeling better that will probably be the last thing on my mind.. haha!

[Erimus]

I get the most brutal tension headaches. Feels like my head is in a vice clamp. They come and go throughout the day, with some days noticeably more intense than others. I also have bad jaw tension and some pain, it’s not been this intense for around 2 months. All part of the process I guess.

[Kaervin]

26 minutes ago, Erimus said:

I get the most brutal tension headaches. Feels like my head is in a vice clamp. They come and go throughout the day, with some days noticeably more intense than others. I also have bad jaw tension and some pain, it’s not been this intense for around 2 months. All part of the process I guess.

Hi Erimus, fellow sertralinian here. Are you still taking B supplements? Many people find them to be stimulating. And that can cause anxious tension which in turn can manifest physically. Not saying it is the cause, but have you tested out not taking the B supplements for a few days to see if there are any changes? It may not help but it's always worth a try.

 

I am also taking Magnesium Citrate, but that is my only supplement.  No adverse effects that I know of. 

 

I hope your taper goes well and that we both can achieve our freedom from these meds.

 

Take care

[Erimus]

Hello @Kaervin. Thanks for the response. You read my mind haha. I’m actually planning to start tapering the B-complex on the 1st of July, just to make sure none of my adverse affects are due to it. It’s next on my list of things to stop, it’s just I keep putting it off in hope of a little more stability. I’m very cautious about chopping and changing too many things at once, as I’m sure you can understand.

 

By the time I start tapering the sertraline I plan to only be taking magnesium, like yourself.

[Erimus]

Every time I think the restlessness/akathisia-like symptoms have gone they come back again. Drives me mad. Must be edging closer if they come and go.

[Erimus]

I feel like the mirtazapine is interfering with my nervous system as it adjusts to the lower dose of sertraline. Feels like every few days I’m kicked back a few steps after a little improvement. I’m wondering if this is the serotonin from the mirtazapine causing trouble for me. Unfortunately as I’ve taken it so long I can’t really avoid it. I guess I just have to wait it out and endure all the setbacks..

[Kaervin]

6 hours ago, Erimus said:

Every time I think the restlessness/akathisia-like symptoms have gone they come back again. Drives me mad. Must be edging closer if they come and go.

Does it come at random, is it ever present, or do you find it flairs up around the same time every day?

[Erimus]

@KaervinIt’s most common in the morning through til mid to late afternoon. I’m assuming it’s the combination of the previous nights mirtazapine and my body crying out for the next dose of sertraline, which I take at 1100 precisely each day. By late afternoon/early evening the sertraline kicks in somewhat and this often alleviates the inner restlessness I feel in my body and arms.

[Kaervin]

1 hour ago, Erimus said:

@KaervinIt’s most common in the morning through til mid to late afternoon. I’m assuming it’s the combination of the previous nights mirtazapine and my body crying out for the next dose of sertraline, which I take at 1100 precisely each day. By late afternoon/early evening the sertraline kicks in somewhat and this often alleviates the inner restlessness I feel in my body and arms.

I found some relief by splitting my sertraline dose in 2. While at 25 mgs, I took it at 7am and 7pm 12.5 mgs each. I guess it depends on if sertraline keeps you awake or not. A split dose is not for everyone but since your restlessness seems to be around the same time it sounds like it is from interdose or a post dose side effect. Or it could be from when your B supplement kicks in.

 

I also am not too familiar with ashwagandha but it seems to affect dopamine receptors from what I have read. 

 

There are a lot of potential factors at play. If you only take your magnesium at night you could also see if some helps you if you take some in the morning.

[Erimus]

Thanks for the suggestions @Kaervin. July I plan to taper off the B complex, and August I plan to taper off the Ashwagandha. So I’ll see where I’m at after that I guess.

[Erimus]

So today I met with a new doctor and discussed my experiences over the last 20 months. I showed him the document by the royal college of psychiatrists and explained all the symptoms I have experienced, and all the ones I still experience most days. He was relatively young and seems open to learning and agreed to assist me in getting off the drugs in a slow manner. Hopefully he doesn’t leave the surgery too quick, as all the young doctors seem to round here. 
 

I’ve had some blood drawn today just to make sure everything is good with sugars, iron, b12, liver etc. I’ll get them back next week and also plan to give him a print out of the Royal College document to keep and read. Even if it helps one other person it’s something. 
 

My jaw is really hurting which means I’ve been clenching overnight. Also have the head pressure and facial grimacing. I’m hoping I’m at the turning point of this cycle and soon I’ll jump onto the other side. I’ve been in this cycle for around 2.5 months. They used to happen every 10 days so that must mean progress!

 

Onwards and upwards.

[Heinz1903]

@Erimus Good to hear!

[Faure]

Glad to hear you had a positive experience with the doctor ☺️

[Erimus]

My mood had been a bit better the past few days and I thought maybe this was the end of it. Then this evening the horrible OCD obsessive rumination crept back in, followed by anxiety. I thought I was done with the OCD, it’s one of the worst symptoms.

 

These drugs are messing with the chemicals in my head and I don’t like it. I was an anxious wreck before them but I didn’t have any of these distressing thought patterns and behaviours.

[Erimus]

I’ve been sitting in the sun for around 30 mins every morning to help boost my vitamin D and try and help my mood. I’ve also been walking for 25-30 minutes every night for the past week. It’s a brisk walk and it’s good to have that back in my routine.

[Ariel]

On 6/20/2022 at 4:27 PM, Erimus said:

So today I met with a new doctor and discussed my experiences over the last 20 months. I showed him the document by the royal college of psychiatrists and explained all the symptoms I have experienced, and all the ones I still experience most days. He was relatively young and seems open to learning and agreed to assist me in getting off the drugs in a slow manner.

 

Good on you, @Erimus

This is so brave of you. 

Glad it went well. 

You're doing such great work!

Healing is happening <3

[Erimus]

Last 3 days I’ve been waking at 6-7am with pretty uncomfortable agitation/restlessness, as well as feeling very hot. Wednesday and Thursday I felt pretty strong fatigue after the restless feelings subsided some at around 8-9am. Today and yesterday I’ve had some pretty intense hot flushes. Feeling a lot of tension in my jaw and forehead. I wish my body knew how to undo this drug in a way that wasn’t so extreme-natured. 
 

Im pretty tired of explaining myself to people about what’s happened. Usually greeted by a blank stare and confused look, as if I’m some sort of nutter that reads too much on the internet. If only these people could spend a day in my body with these feelings everyday. 

[Ariel]

@Erimus

55 minutes ago, Erimus said:

If only these people could spend a day in my body with these feelings everyday. 

 

I hear you. 

And if only I could spend a day in the body of someone well, just to know what that's like!

(although, I don't know, might be more than one could bear to subsequently be returned to WD body)

 

57 minutes ago, Erimus said:

Im pretty tired of explaining myself to people about what’s happened. Usually greeted by a blank stare and confused look, as if I’m some sort of nutter that reads too much on the internet.

 

For what it's worth, I maintain that it's a valiant effort on your part to try to explain/share at all! 

Regardless of what anyone may or may not understand in the moment, you are planting a seed.

The potential of that is not to be underestimated. 

 

[Erimus]

Thank you @Ariel. I do my best to put my brave face on and face the world. The strange thing is absolutely nobody knows how much we’re struggling. Sometimes this is bad, and sometimes it is a good thing.

 

The only reason I explain is because I need financial support; I need to be somewhat convincing when I make people aware of the suffering in order to obtain help. I wish I was rich, and this whole process would be so easy, so I could just float through this journey taking all the time I wanted. But unfortunately, like many of us on here, I need money to feed myself and keep a roof over my head. It’s cruel and unrelenting but we do what we must!

 

I am fortunate I was not forced to work through all the pain like many members on here do. I am not as strong as those individuals, but I do my best.

[Ariel]

1 minute ago, Erimus said:

The only reason I explain is because I need financial support; I need to be somewhat convincing when I make people aware of the suffering in order to obtain help.

 

Do you feel like you're getting better at delivering the pitch? 

 

[Erimus]

I find that I don’t have a filter anymore when I speak to people about my experience. Hitting them with brutal honesty seems to shock them @Ariel. I don’t take sh*t from anyone after what I’ve been through.. haha.

[Ariel]

35 minutes ago, Erimus said:

I find that I don’t have a filter anymore when I speak to people about my experience. Hitting them with brutal honesty seems to shock them @Ariel. I don’t take sh*t from anyone after what I’ve been through.. haha.

 

I feel your power @Erimus

<3

 

[Erimus]

Today is bad. I’ve had restless arms on and off since I woke up at around 7am (it’s still happening at 4pm). It’s basically restless leg syndrome but it’s in my arms, that’s the only way I can describe it. Now I’ve got depressive thoughts and doom and gloom, coupled with crushing tension headache. Like my head is in a vice. Jaw tension and pain there as well.

[Ariel]

@Erimus

I'm sorry to hear you're in a bad way right now. I wish I could send you some relief!

There's nothing I can say to take the pain away, but I'm thinking of you and I believe in you.

Remember this is temporary and it will pass. It gets better.

Hang in there, Erimus, you got this <3

 

[Erimus]

I’m starting to sound like a broken record, but I’m sick of shouting from the rooftops to people that there’s nothing wrong with me mentally. I’ve been harmed by the drugs. Nobody understands this, not even doctors.

 

I’ve actually been doing some digging into pharmacogenetics. I don’t know how reliable these tests are, but even if they prevented 50% of adverse reactions it’s better than nothing. I think everyone set to be prescribed psychotropic drugs should have to do a test.

 

I’ve gathered that I must have a variation in one of the genes responsible for the metabolism of sertraline, which is why it builds up to toxic levels in my plasma, causing all these unpleasant symptoms. 
 

In 2017 through to 2018/19 I was actually on amitriptyline for nerve pain (apparently), after a procedure. I think my max dose was 20mg. I noticed no start up effects or side effects, and had no withdrawal symptoms at all. It was like I wasn’t even taking it. I don’t know if anyone can explain why I tolerated this drug so well and have had such disastrous reactions to sertraline, but it must be something to do with variation in the enzymes that break the drug down.

[ChessieCat]

The effect of psychiatric drugs is cumulative.  There are SA members who have been on/off drugs and up/down in dose multiple times with no issues, then one day they do the same thing that worked before and their nervous system cannot cope with it.

 

Please add amitriptyline to your drug signature and state how you went off it and the last date and the dose you took before you stopped the drug.

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature