Alex3: total insomnia after 6 months reinstatement

[Yesyes123]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

Thanks for the suggestion, @Yesyes123 For some reason, each item on the list appears on a different page in Google Docs! It's very hard to read. Can you fix this?

 

Hey @AltostrataI will look into this soon!

[Yesyes123]

(accidental double post, check post below)

[Yesyes123]

@AltostrataI just updated the document, it should be all in one piece now.

 

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ivuuAb5wIEKw-dC6qlzMhcYwbJklWLC72TRzoricHI0/edit?usp=sharing

 

I can't recall their username, but some other member in here recommended me this diet and said it made a huge difference in their healing. I think it's worth looking into.

 

Important to note there is quite a bit of controversy around it and Dr. Gundry also sells supplements and such.

[Altostrata]

I don't know much about it, but eating fresh leafy greens and other fresh food is good for everyone.

[Yesyes123]

On 2/14/2022 at 8:02 PM, Altostrata said:

I don't know much about it, but eating fresh leafy greens and other fresh food is good for everyone.

 

I don't know much about this either, but I have a deep interest in it.

 

I'm very interested especially in the effects that different types of foods have on people with psychiatric drug withdrawal syndrome; it seems some changes in diet can greatly alleviate WD symptoms, and this seems worthy of further investigation.

 

The foods we eat make us what we are, and it is extremely important to eat the right things for your specific lifestyle.

 

Basically Dr. Gundry claims some plant foods we are so used to eating daily and consider so healthy actually contain a substance named Lectin that can be harmful to our bodies.

 

According to webmd.com:

 

"A lectin, also known as the “antinutrient” is a type of protein that binds to certain carbohydrates."

 

What I have found in my studies in nutrition and am very confident about is that no one should ever consume these oils:

• Partially hydrogenated Canola Oil

• Corn Oil

• Partially hydrogenated Vegetable Oil

• Cottonseed Oil

• Peanut Oil 

• Grapeseed Oil

• Sunflower Oil

• Safflower Oil

• Soy Oil 

Instead, use butter and olive oil. Coconut oil is also amazing but quite expensive.

 

peace + healing

[Altostrata]

Some people are sensitive to lectin, some not. It's like gluten intolerance. Not everybody has it.

 

You can assume our foraging ancestors ate anything that didn't make them vomit, and we're mostly omnivores.

[Alex3]

Hello, just checking in and catching up

 

I'm on the EV Organic Olive Oil, incredible stuff, plus I consume butter. All in moderation of course. Leafy greens in the form of spinach is like kryptonite for myself due to the oxalate-preventing-absorption theory

 

Hope you're all well. Status still the same here in that every night still consists of exhausting, frenetic dreams/nightamares. I've spoken to my Dr who says I should leave it to him to worry about tapering off, which at first is reassuring, but then I've trusted people thus far and been mis-led. This brings myself onto my next question...

 

Has anyone ever had any experience with the orodispersible Mirtazapine? Much cheaper than the 5-week liquid bottle and offers to ability to syringe and taper accordingly it would seem....

[Altostrata]

See Tips for tapering off mirtazapine (Remeron)

[Alex3]

How is it taking so long to help people hooked on their prescription medicines? | Daily Mail Online

[Shep]

12 minutes ago, Alex3 said:

How is it taking so long to help people hooked on their prescription medicines? | Daily Mail Online

 

You may want to add this to the In the Media section.  You're more likely to have a discussion because that's the section where we look for new media articles. If you feel like it, please also post your own thoughts about the article and anything that stands out to you. 

[Alex3]

@ShepThanks Shep, can I ask where specifically in the Media section you'd think it best to post that link and open a discussion?

 

The timing of NICE guideline changes **could** potentially be a bit of a gamechanger and may well coincide at attempt 2 at tapering.

[Shep]

9 hours ago, Alex3 said:

@ShepThanks Shep, can I ask where specifically in the Media section you'd think it best to post that link and open a discussion?

 

The timing of NICE guideline changes **could** potentially be a bit of a gamechanger and may well coincide at attempt 2 at tapering.

 

When you get to the In the Media section, click on the Start New Topic button over on the right side of the screen. 

 

Sounds like you're doing some research in the guidelines and we'd all benefit from your take on that article. 

 

How are you feeling? How is your sleep? 

[Alex3]

@ShepThanks Shep, shall head over there later

 

I haven't specifically looked at the NICE NHS guidelines, but your comment has given me a nudge to think it would be a sensible idea. The link to the DM article states something along the lines of impending changes to the guidelines so things are at least ostensibly changing and being brought to the forefront rather than us being left as an afterthought.

 

This hell is compounded when your symptoms are invalidated. Helps to communicate/convey/articulate with family and colleagues too.

 

I'm still in the same state. Getting some sleep, but filled with horrendous dreams/nightmares. Otherwise functioning

[Shep]

21 hours ago, Alex3 said:

I'm still in the same state. Getting some sleep, but filled with horrendous dreams/nightmares. Otherwise functioning

 

Glad you're functioning even with the poor sleep. This will get better in time. 

[Altostrata]

Joanna Moncrieff, Mark Horowitz, and I commented extensively on the NICE guidelines, on behalf of Critical Psychiatry Network.

[Alex3]

Exploratory question to consider, with much in the way of caution...

 

As a male, could TRT help in the withdrawal process? Subject to micro dosing and being professionally managed, I'm wondering if it could help. At first glance, I'm very much of the motto "less is more" and completely against introducing other pharma drugs such as statins etc. However, with TRT I think there's a lot of growing evidence to suggest that it can be very beneficial to men and their wellbeing (irrelevant of withdrawal). There's supplements to consider too

 

If you're in the midst of withdrawal AND you pile on low testosterone in to the mix too...

[Alex3]

“I’ve Stopped My Antidepressants Doc” - How TRT is Changing Men’s Lives - The Men's Health Clinic (themenshealthclinic.co.uk)

 

Remember the part of my story where I went for a blood test and then changed my diet that seemingly led to the absorption-oxalate issues?

 

Well the link above is the place (based in Dorset, headed by a former GP) where I went for the blood test. The article above even mentions withdrawal.

 

Worth a read and perhaps to be posted in the media thread as well

[Altostrata]

We've been running this site for more than 10 years now. Every remedy you can think up has been proposed. Please use search in the Symptoms and Self-Care forum for discussions about this.

 

I have never seen any good come out of taking testosterone for withdrawal symptoms. You can do this if you want, but if it goes bad, we don't have any way to fix it.

[Alex3]

@AltostrataIt is something I wondered as a long term lifestyle change that could be of overall benefit and as a by-product, aid in withdrawal.

 

Will shelve

[Altostrata]

In general, fooling around with hormones causes a lot of problems.

[Alex3]

Another random find.

 

Somebody advocating tapering to the Mirt 15mg mark and then stopping the tapering.

 

Not jumping to any conclusions, just was an interesting take and wondering if there's any potential justified reasoning behind it... or just misinformation

 

Mirt is seemingly quite unique, certainly in the lower the dose the more sedating it is/can be

 

[Altostrata]

Depends on the effect mirtazapine has on you. Effects are individual. There is no definite rule about these things.

 

What about that random post on the Web do you find convincing?

[Alex3]

@Altostrata Hi Alto and everyone, just checking in. Same state of racing dreams/terrors etc. otherwise functioning

 

However, I am gearing up to find a way of getting off these. For one, anti depressants deeply impact my libido

 

As for your question @Altostrata, I just found it curious that particular Dr proposed tapering to 15mg, but then not tapering beyond that. Just gathering as much info and understanding as much as possible before eventually starting the processing of getting off this stuff.

[Altostrata]

4 hours ago, Alex3 said:

I just found it curious that particular Dr proposed tapering to 15mg, but then not tapering beyond that

 

It's because that doctor knows nothing about tapering or withdrawal syndrome. This is not unusual.

[Alex3]

https://news.sky.com/story/long-term-use-of-antidepressants-could-cause-permanent-damage-doctors-warn-11688430

[Alex3]

@AltostrataQuestion...

 

Is there any discussion about serotonin syndrome? Possibly from having too much tryptophan (from foods, not as a supplement)

[ChessieCat]

There are many existing topics on SA.  You can use the site search function or an internet search engine and add site:survivingantidepressants.org to the search term:

 

5-htp-5-hydroxytryptophan-and-l-tryptophan

 

Alto's comment here

[ChessieCat]

Drug.com Interactions Checker
 

Use this drug interaction checker and you will see that there is a major interaction for tryptophan (supplement) and mirtazapine.

 

If you are concerned about food, you could try eliminating foods high in tryptophan and see if it makes a difference.

[Altostrata]

Very unlikely one could get serotonin syndrome from foods.

[Alex3]

Hello, thank you both for responding as always.

 

Well, there is some kind of interaction between what I eat (sometimes when I eat) and the Mirtazapine. Absorption is one possible direction and another is tryptophan (which is proxy serotonin) is another area.

 

I'm not taking any supplements and I don't intend on taking any as I think my body is too sensitised to anything to take anything in addition.

 

This may change once I'm completely off the Mirt, but not before.

 

 

[Alex3]

@ChessieCat QQ please. I read elsewhere that you had success with a compounding pharmacy?

 

I think I'm inclined to go down that route when the tapering begins

 

Specialist Pharmacy – No.1 Compounding Pharmacy in the UK (specialist-pharmacy.com)

 

The liquid is expensive, in-precise at the really low doses

 

The Netherlands tapering strips is the other consideration

[Alex3]

Hello all, hope you're doing well

 

Yesterday I finally decided to make an appointment to start the process of getting off Mirtazapine

 

Today, there's been a major possible major breakthrough news-wise:

[ChessieCat]

Wow, that's fantastic.

 

Please post about it here:

 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/forum/15-in-the-media/

[Shep]

1 hour ago, Alex3 said:

Today, there's been a major possible major breakthrough news-wise:

 

Great finds, Alex. You may also want to add them to the collection here:

 

Again, chemical imbalance is a myth. Stop the lies, please.

 

 

[Ariel]

Hi @Alex3

Thank you for sharing the news. 

Great minds think alike -- @Erimus started a related topic today, too! 

 

[Alex3]

@ChessieCat hello, I had a conversation with my Dr last Wednesday, getting a bit apathetic. Usual cycle... assurances that they'll get me off, but then only offering 50-100% drops with the Mirtazapine... says they're the only options even though I've been on the liquid previously (that taper only seemingly failed due to food sensitivities, which still exist)

 

I was assertive in that I refused to go down that route, particularly as I now feel pretty sensitised and frazzled

 

These options don't seem on the table:

 

- cold turkey

- 50% drops, alternating days/doses

- liquid is too expensive, imprecise at the lowest doses and I don't trust its delivery method. It also expires between 5-6 weeks.

- Utrecht University tapering strips (I feel in a similar position to James Moore) won't likely be signed off

 

That leaves two remaining options as far as I can gather:

 

- Compounding pharmacy Specialist Pharmacy – No.1 Compounding Pharmacy in the UK (specialist-pharmacy.com)

- Making my own tablets

 

Now if I can trust this Compound Pharmacy then how about I assert and propose a Brass Monkey slow, but steady taper?