Pollyjay: need support

[Ninabird]

@Pollyjay Good morning! How have you been doing? 🌺🙏🏻❤️
 

[Chlo]

Hello sweetheart @Pollyjay How are you doing? You were on my mind and in my prayers. Please don't get overheated being outside with all your little babies. How is your son?

love you ❤

[Ninabird]

Hi Pollyjay! I hope that you are in a blissful window and enjoying your time with your husband and fur babies. I think of you often. Wishing you love, peace and lots of belly laughs while making your wooden spoons.

 

Big hugs to you.

[Ariel]

@Pollyjay

So cool you're an artist with drawing and painting skills! 

Your recent comment in Shep's success story thread inspired me to share something, so I'm replying here in your topic. 

 

2 hours ago, Pollyjay said:

I sure wish this anhedonia would lift and I could get that "spark" again. Things are coming back slowly so I know there's hope but the drawing or painting isn't there yet. It's so strange because that's always been who I am and my go to during rough times. I know it'll resurface at some point. Maybe if I force myself, it'll trigger something - in a good way, that is.

 

Reading this I felt curious whether you are waiting for the anhedonia to lift first before you start drawing and painting again? 

Are you holding yourself back from this activity because you're not feeling it? 

 

I am finding that when I engage in doing things I love and used to enjoy it does something really good. Even though I still feel somewhat emotionally blunted -- doing these things doesn't feel the way it once felt, and I don't get the same conscious "rewards" feelings -- it's clear to me that there is real benefit to be gained. Not only does it feel good in a logical, distanced kind of way (hey, I'll take what i can get!), but I sincerely believe it is helping "reconnect" my brain and encouraging neurogenesis. Anything to facilitate healing! 

 

I have also read elsewhere on the site (will have to check to see if I can dig up the original comments) from numerous members that the engaging in activities may precede the feelings, but then one day the feelings begin to return "appropriately" during the activity. Hearing these reports has been inspirational and influential in my "fake it till you make it" campaign. 

 

All this to say your intuition that maybe if you do it anyway, despite the anhedonia, it may eventually trigger something in a good way -- that sounds right to me. That's what I'm banking on in my case, anyway, and it's starting to pay off. It's basically an Acknowledge - Accept - Float approach to anhedonia (and the anxiety we may have in reaction to anhedonia), I guess. So you don't have to force yourself (that sounds a bit violent and unpleasant), but maybe it's okay to let the anhedonia just hang out in the background, and you ignore it and just go ahead and do your thing, get your art supplies out and play around. Even if only for 10 minutes. See what happens... and let us know how it goes, I'm curious!

 

Hugs to you <3

[Ariel]

Found it! 

 

Excerpt from Nadia's comment (for full post see link below):

 

I think what is important here is something Alto suggested: even if we're not feeling the good effects of doing "pleasurable things" it could be having beneficial, soothing effects on a subconscious level... I'm normally a really mischievous, laughing person, always joking around. Now I don't even find things funny anymore. But I think Punarbhava is onto something. I think I might watch some Seinfeld reruns regularly or something. I don't want to think of it as forcing, because that has never worked for me, but somehow exercising? The same way I exercise the meditation even though it feels like it's going nowhere. And certainly I know I'm going to feel better if I take a shower than if I don't, even if I have no feeling of accomplishment or pleasure at the moment. Maybe we have to think of things like sipping tea, sitting in sunshine, petting animals, getting hugs, etc. as putting pennies in a bank, and eventually it will fill up. Or how they move paralyzed people's limbs around so they don't atrophy. It could be very important.

 

The challenge is finding the self-discipline to do it in the face of the lack of the usual feelings of reward we get from these things. And not beating ourselves up about not feeling the gratitude or pleasure or love we "should" be feeling.

 

[Ariel]

On 4/18/2012 at 4:25 AM, Altostrata said:

All you can do is calm yourself and find what pleasure you can, however dilute. Slowing down your mind to be in the moment helps a lot. Your ability to enjoy will come back, slowly.

 

If you've got a camera, take pictures of things that strike you as interesting, lovely, or funny, and look at them later. They will remind you it's not all dull and gray, there are glimmers of pleasure here and there.

 

[Pollyjay]

On 6/1/2022 at 1:21 PM, Ariel said:

 

 

Ariel, coming here and finding one of your lovely and articulate posts is like walking through the back door and finding a present sitting on the kitchen table.  

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to leave such an encouraging message. Yes, I think I am holding back from creating art, waiting for the inspiration to come back. One day a couple of weeks ago there was a little glimmer of something. I rooted out my Wacom tablet and spent about an hour "painting" in the art program that's on my computer. It was just that short time and then the curtain closed. 

 

On 6/1/2022 at 1:12 PM, Ariel said:

All this to say your intuition that maybe if you do it anyway, despite the anhedonia, it may eventually trigger something in a good way -- that sounds right to me. That's what I'm banking on in my case, anyway, and it's starting to pay off. It's basically an Acknowledge - Accept - Float approach to anhedonia (and the anxiety we may have in reaction to anhedonia), I guess. So you don't have to force yourself (that sounds a bit violent and unpleasant), but maybe it's okay to let the anhedonia just hang out in the background, and you ignore it and just go ahead and do your thing, get your art supplies out and play around. Even if only for 10 minutes. See what happens... and let us know how it goes, I'm curious!

 

Hugs to you ❤️

 

I'm so happy to read that this approach is helping you. I'm going to give it a try and see what happens. I can't blame it on WD because it began way back in December when my Dad died. Before I took any meds. So I think it's all tied in to the loss and grief and then the ongoing worry about our son. I feel like I can't "relax" . Waiting for the next shoe to drop. I think my brain is just tied up with other things.

 

Thank you for looking up those links it gives me hope that this wont last forever.I had anhedonia when I was tapering Paxil in 2011. Looking back at the diaries I kept I can tell that I was getting better. every page of the second diary is nicely written and embellished with little birds and flowers    I look at the ones I've been keeping during this episode and I can hardly decipher half of what I've written. Anyway,  I'll do as you suggest and post updates on how it goes. 

 

I hope and pray that you continue to feel better!!! You are always such an inspiration.

 

Thank you so much for your kind words.

 

Pollyjay

[Ariel]

@Pollyjay

 

7 hours ago, Pollyjay said:

I'm so happy to read that this approach is helping you. I'm going to give it a try and see what happens. I can't blame it on WD because it began way back in December when my Dad died. Before I took any meds. So I think it's all tied in to the loss and grief and then the ongoing worry about our son. I feel like I can't "relax" . Waiting for the next shoe to drop. I think my brain is just tied up with other things.

 

My heart goes out to you in your grief. 

I'm sorry for your loss. 

I hear that there has been a lot on your plate for a while! It makes sense that there's a lot of hurt and accumulated tension to sort through. You've been going through a lot.  

 

I so often forget that engaging in creative activities is not only a way to express myself when I'm feeling good/inspired; it's also a way to process  when I'm not feeling great. And I wonder sometimes whether, in these times when I'm least motivated and feeling at my worst, whether these are the times I actually need creative practice the most. Art can be so healing. The process of engaging with it -- from wherever one is at in the moment -- can be transformative. Creative practice can help us work through stuff, consciously or subconsciously. 

 

I think I often feel like, I'm going to make this thing for someone (else). Having a regular practice/routine helps, e.g. if you always write/paint/compose/dance/play at a set time every day, but I haven't had that for a while. So now it can feel artificial to approach something without a specific purpose, e.g. a recipient or the pursuit of pleasure. It never occurs to me, oh maybe this is a pathway towards something that might connect farther down the line. I guess my mind is more or less set on "accomplishment", i.e. producing something, and or "instant gratification", i.e. expressing my feeling right now. But I think that may actually in and of itself be a symptom of a stressed/exhausted/struggling brain. Because a happy brain affords a more open, curious, exploratory, process-oriented approach. Like: Why not? Let's see what happens! 

 

So when I read your sentences, "I feel like I can't 'relax'," and "I think my brain is just tied up with other things," something clicked.

 

I thought: Poor busy overworked brains, maybe they could use a hand. Maybe we need to reach out and help remind them how to relax. 

 

And I thought: Maybe this is something we can do to offer our brains a little gift. No expectations, no pressure, just a no-strings-attached invitation to our brains to take a little break and come hang out with us over here for a while.

 

You know? And maybe if we keep extending that gentle invitation to out brains, maybe one day they will come bearing gifts in return. 

 

7 hours ago, Pollyjay said:

I hope and pray that you continue to feel better!!! You are always such an inspiration.

 

Thank you so much for your kind words.

 

Thank you, dear Pollyjay, and same to you. <3

Edited June 3, 2022 by Ariel

[Ariel]

P.S.

Some of the most meaningful/powerful/transformative creative experiences I've had have not necessarily been joy-driven, at least not from the outset. Sometimes (more often than not, perhaps) I have started in a very dark place and fumbled my way through and somehow, something shifted along the way. And by the time I got to the other end of it I felt differently. Not necessarily fantastic or perfect but just in a different place than when I started. And that's all I could ever ask for, really. Just that there's some movement to things, some motion. Process in process. 

 

Actually, I think I just saw this quote in another member's signature today: It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you do not stand still. 

(attributed to Confucius)

 

That's one of my guiding principles these days. Trying to just keep things moving, even if only the teeniest tiniest little bit, slowly slowly infinitesimally but surely. 

[Pollyjay]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:32 AM, Ariel said:

@Pollyjay

 

 

My heart goes out to you in your grief. 

I'm sorry for your loss. 

I hear that there has been a lot on your plate for a while! It makes sense that there's a lot of hurt and accumulated tension to sort through. You've been going through a lot.  

 

I so often forget that engaging in creative activities is not only a way to express myself when I'm feeling good/inspired; it's also a way to process  when I'm not feeling great. And I wonder sometimes whether, in these times when I'm least motivated and feeling at my worst, whether these are the times I actually need creative practice the most. Art can be so healing. The process of engaging with it -- from wherever one is at in the moment -- can be transformative. Creative practice can help us work through stuff, consciously or subconsciously. 

 

I think I often feel like, I'm going to make this thing for someone (else). Having a regular practice/routine helps, e.g. if you always write/paint/compose/dance/play at a set time every day, but I haven't had that for a while. So now it can feel artificial to approach something without a specific purpose, e.g. a recipient or the pursuit of pleasure. It never occurs to me, oh maybe this is a pathway towards something that might connect farther down the line. I guess my mind is more or less set on "accomplishment", i.e. producing something, and or "instant gratification", i.e. expressing my feeling right now. But I think that may actually in and of itself be a symptom of a stressed/exhausted/struggling brain. Because a happy brain affords a more open, curious, exploratory, process-oriented approach. Like: Why not? Let's see what happens! 

 

So when I read your sentences, "I feel like I can't 'relax'," and "I think my brain is just tied up with other things," something clicked.

 

I thought: Poor busy overworked brains, maybe they could use a hand. Maybe we need to reach out and help remind them how to relax. 

 

And I thought: Maybe this is something we can do to offer our brains a little gift. No expectations, no pressure, just a no-strings-attached invitation to our brains to take a little break and come hang out with us over here for a while.

 

You know? And maybe if we keep extending that gentle invitation to out brains, maybe one day they will come bearing gifts in return. 

 

 

Thank you, dear Pollyjay, and same to you. ❤️

 

Thank you Ariel, so much food for thought! 

[ChessieCat]

I had to keep remembering how far I had come, not how much further I had to go.  I have to do the same thing when I'm trying to get the dish washing caught up.  I always find myself looking at how much left there is to do, and it makes me feel down, when I should be encouraging myself by thinking of how much I have achieved.

[Pollyjay]

31 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

I had to keep remembering how far I had come, not how much further I had to go.  I have to do the same thing when I'm trying to get the dish washing caught up.  I always find myself looking at how much left there is to do, and it makes me feel down, when I should be encouraging myself by thinking of how much I have achieved.

 

Hi ChessieCat! How are you? I hope you are doing ok. I know what you mean! It's so easy to get caught up in negative thoughts and all the time wishing and hoping to be "normal". Counting the months. When I look back at how I was over the winter, when I could barely function at all, and even just a couple of months ago, I've made a lot of headway.. The anxiety has come down ,-  well, it's down to a low roar. During the day I still feel like I'm going for a job interview. Scared, jittery and shaky, I find it hard to push through it. The heat outside doesn't help. I keep coming in to lay on the bed to try to calm down. 

 

This evening when it cooled off a little I went out and tried to construct something. I got the wood, the drill and the screws but it was all I could do to concentrate and formulate a plan of action in my mind. It isn't much more than a simple shelf to set a rabbit cage on.  Normally I would have had it done in no time but I was going in circles . I'm going to have to finish it tomorrow. I found myself getting really down about it but just having the ambition to make a start is a major improvement really.

 

Another little improvement came about this week also. I was able to start reading a book that a friend in Arizona sent me months ago! I haven't been able to read a book since last October! It would send my nerves all of a jangle. But this week I've been able to read a whole chapter before falling asleep each night. It's an Ann Voskamp book, Waymaker.

[FeralCatman]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:43 AM, Ariel said:

Actually, I think I just saw this quote in another member's signature today: It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you do not stand still. 

(attributed to Confucius)

In the Navy my engineer had a saying he pounded into us because he hated rework and having to do a job twice.

 

"Slower Is Faster"

 

It's proven true many times over the course of my life and is proving itself again going through the WD process. Push too hard and you set yourself back and stretch out the timeline. Slow and gentle is the way to win this race.

[Ninabird]

@Pollyjay

Good morning! It was good to hear your voice last night. How was your Skype conversation with your son? How are you feeling today? 
 

Yesterday was a touch better day. This morning after taking my morning medicine I fell asleep for an extra hour. That is very rare for me to get an extra hour and I’ll take it. I feel that my body needs a year of extra sleep. Our poor brain/ body goes through so much trauma in WD I wish it could get all the sleep needed to fully recover. 
 

I will try calling you later today. I’m hoping your day goes well dear Pollyjay. 

[Ninabird]

@Pollyjay

Hi sweet lady! I’ll call you later today. 🌺❤️
Hope you are doing well today. 
 

[Believer]

Hi @Pollyjay,

Thinking of you this morning and hoping you and your family are doing well.

Believer❣️

[Ninabird]

@Pollyjay

Hi there. Just popping in to say hello. How are you doing? 
Ninabird 🌺

[Ninabird]

@Pollyjay How are you? Call me. I hope you are doing fantastic! 

[Ariel]

@Pollyjay

Thinking of you <3

[Pollyjay]

@Believer @Ariel @Ninabird thanks to all of you so much for thinking of me.  I haven't been doing that great and thought that maybe taking a break from the forum might help but it didn't. 

 

So a quick update.  I was doing much better a couple of weeks ago. My husband's construction job was on hold so he was home. The weather was cooler and we were out and about and going to town quite a lot. - I find that makes a huge difference in how I feel. All my interest and enthusiasm started to come back. I was carving spoons and talking about having a bushcraft themed stall at the farmer's market. Anxiety was down. Just felt SO much better.  But now he's back at work. He's gone from 8am until after dark some nights. The long days stuck at home alone are really getting to me. I'm trying to keep my enthusiasm up but it seems like every afternoon I end up  falling apart.  Crying and crying. Really distraught for hours on end. Feel lost and hopeless. It's scary and exhausting. A deep agony inside. My appetite is way down again. I'd managed to get up to 100lbs but  slipping back down. The only thing I'm tapering is the Lunesta and I'm almost off that. So I don't think it's withdrawal. I guess only time will heal the grief.  I having to keep telling myself that. I pray that I can find my purpose in life again. 

 

My vision has been a bit off. Last week I had a full eye exam and the doctor saw some white patches on my retina. Other than needing new reading glasses, everything else looked fine and he doesn't think it's anything to worry about but he set up an appointment for me to see a Retinologist. That's on the 5th, next Tuesday. Please pray that it isn't anything serious.  

 

 

 

 

[mstimc]

Hi Polly

its natural to feel some separation anxiety when things change and you're by yourself.  You're feelings are more intensified due to WD.  The thoughts and feelings will come, but if you can accept them and work on managing your reaction, you may be surprised how well you can handle them.  This is related to the CBT/ERP practice of "Doing what I came to do."  If you intend to create spoons for your craft booth, tell yourself "I'm going to spend the next two hours on my spoons.  I'm going to carve them, shape them and finish them.  The thoughts of loneliness and hopelessness won't affect what I came to do."  It won't work every time and how long it works will vary, but the more you practice it, the easier it will be.

And remember, always, to be kind and forgiving to yourself.  The idea that you have to "fight" or suppress your thoughts just adds to your anxious thinking pattern.  Accepting that the thoughts will come, then moving to more positive thought habits, is a much kinder strategy.

 

And prayers your eyes will be okay!

[Ariel]

@Pollyjay

Hi, it's good to hear from you <3

 

I'm sorry that you're in this isolated situation for days at a time. Being alone can be so hard in WD and exacerbate the effects of all those neuro-emotions and WD-brain thinking. It can be very comforting to be in safe company and have social distractions, and I'm glad you were able to benefit from that for a while. I get how it can feel destabilizing to then have that change for the worse. 

 

Do you have any friends who might come stay with you for a while to keep you company? From your descriptions of the animals I am imagining you live on a property where it might be possible to accommodate a guest or two, but of course I have no idea. Is there anyone you know and trust who might come visit? 

Another thought (again, dependent on what your living situation is like), have you considered maybe taking in a tenant/roommate? For a limited period of time, just while you're recovering from WD. I am spitballing here, but what if it would be possible to rent space to an artist or creative, handy person? Someone who'd work from home, so they'd be around during the days, even though they'd be occupied with their own life you would know you're not alone on the property. Or maybe a university student or someone who could help you around the property a little (maybe some laidback caregiving if you feel like you need it) in exchange for room (if not board)?

It's easy to get ideas on someone else's behalf. Please forgive my tiny brainstorm (or tiny-brain storm), feel free to ignore. 

I wish there were some way I could help -- I'd offer to come stay with you if I could (it sure might do me good to have company and hang out with animals and artists). 

 

Good luck with your eyes, Pollyjay. 

 

Hang in there, healing is happening. Healing is happening, even when we don't consciously feel it. 

Sending you a hug <3

 

[Believer]

Hi @Pollyjay,

I’m sorry to read that you had been struggling. But it’s a good sign that you had a nice long window. The back and forth is so very difficult. I hope things are back up for you.  

 

How did your eye appointment go? Please keep posting and  let us know how you’re doing, the good and the bad.

 

Praying for you.

 

Believer

[Ariel]

@Pollyjay

Thinking of you <3

[Ariel]

Thinking of you <3

[Chlo]

 @Pollyjay

[Moonpie]

So cute!!! Love it!!  Have prayed for you!!!  Hope you are doing better.  HUGS!

 

[Pollyjay]

Hi everyone!!

I really must thank all of you for thinking of me. - Chlo, I love the little sheep!!!- 

 

I'm sorry I've been gone for so long. Gosh, I was just feeling so horrible for such a long time and didn't even have the wherewithal to get on here. I even forgot my password.

 

I am pleased to report that I'm feeling much better! The constant anxiety I was having has dissipated a lot! Still have some cortisol spikes when I first wake up in the morning but it passes quickly.  I'm off the Lunesta and I'm way down on the Seroquel ( 0.07 g  scale weight) My appetite came back ( I'm up to 103 lbs!!! ) and I'm sleeping good. Also, the anhedonia has lifted, thank goodness!!  I still have some trouble following a project through to completion but that flat, brain dead feeling has gone.  So anyone suffering from anhedonia please take heart. When you're in the throes of it you just can't imagine ever feeling normal again. It didn't leave over night but very slowly it gave way to little sparks of interest and enthusiasm here and there. They were fleeting at first  but gradually began to last longer and longer. I'm able to read books again and listen to some music. A full enjoyment of music isn't quite there yet. 

 

In an effort to relieve the monotony of my now very lonely life, I decided to go way put of my comfort zone and join a racing pigeon club! The club is about a hundred miles away but there are other members in this area. I'm too late to race this year but it's given me something to plan for and work toward for the races starting in the spring.

 

I'm still having the crying/despondent spells but nothing like they have been the last few months.  The approach of winter and the long dark days bothers me a bit. I don't do well over the holidays even at the best of times. It's something I'm going to have to work on. I'd like to go visit our son in October. Trying to work up the confidence to fly down there alone. All this has left me feeling very fragile and unsure of myself. 

 

Anyway, that's my update for now. 

 

I so much appreciate all of the love and prayers of you all! Now I need to catch up on how everyone else is doing.

 

Hugs,

Pollyjay

 

 

 

 

[mstimc]

Wonderful news, Pollyjay--thanks for posting! Clearly you're well on the way to 100% healing.  Sending good vibes from the Left Coast!