Temporary1286: Clomipramine took away who I am

[Temporary1286]

Could a moderator provide me with assistance as how to delete my introduction?

 

Thanks in advance.

[ChessieCat]

If you wish to close or delete your account

[Temporary1286]

@ChessieCat Is there a way for you to actually get rid of it? I am not sure if I would like it to remain here.

[ChessieCat]

Part of SA's mission is to educate medical professionals.  Information gained from SA members has been used for research papers.

 

Please read:

 

 

[Temporary1286]

Unfortunately I am reaching a point where I don’t think I will be able to go on for too much longer. I should be honest and transparent if you are documenting these things for medical professionals or MDs, so I will update you completely as to my situation.

 

The Clomipramine has stolen everything from me. The best way to describe it would be dead without being dead. My brain died and all of its emotion, feeling, cognition, ability to feel things like arousal or attraction and more died with it but my body remained alive.

 

Before I am told to go to a hospital or see a therapist, I will inform you that I have. The hospital was evidently of no use as they offered more drugs and even told me it might be somatic, and the therapist dismissed me almost instantly. I am not psychotic, not mentally ill, nor am I delusional. I simply report the way I feel and have felt for months now. It’s all very unfortunate.

 

My heart goes out to the people who have had their lives stolen by this, some even resorting to having to end their lives. That is all I can think about at this time. I think websites like Rxisk and others do the opposite of provide assistance, but even have the potential of driving others to suicide. A “Dr. Healy” scowls the internet proclaiming that those afflicted are doomed, and even talks about assisted suicide and more in his posts and articles. The same can be said for r/PSSD and other related forums. It is heartbreaking to stumble across someone who had their life affected so greatly that they felt the need to end their life.
 

To those people, I am incredibly sorry.

 

It has been about 4.4 months since I last took Clomipramine.

I had some hope in the beginning of this month which is completely extinguished.

Not much but blackness on the horizon.

[Altostrata]

3 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

The best way to describe it would be dead without being dead. My brain died and all of its emotion, feeling, cognition, ability to feel things like arousal or attraction and more died with it but my body remained alive.

 

As explained earlier, we have seen that this gradually fades. Many members of this site have been very disturbed by this sensation. We've seen thousands of people gone through this post-drug phase. Many don't believe it will happen until it does.

 

See

 

"Is it always going to be like this?"

 

The importance of recognizing you're feeling good

 

Protracted Withdrawal or PAWS (post-acute withdrawal syndrome)

 

Progress! What withdrawal symptoms have gone away for you? 

 

Withdrawal dialogues & encouragement

[Temporary1286]

In no way am I trying to be rude or aggressive, but can it really be considered withdrawal when there are those who don’t recover? That “Dr. Healy” seems to think it isn’t withdrawal but something like “Tardive Dyserotica” (Tardive Dyskinesia). 

 

I have often thought about that. Thank you for your message.

[Faure]

I’m so sorry you are suffering and that this has happened to you. The mods see people suffering from numerous withdrawal effects all the time, they also see people improving. Their advice is always very sound so please do listen to what they are saying.
 

I would caution against constantly researching your symptoms. The internet and especially Facebook and other social media is designed to capture people’s attention and it has been proven that negative content creates more engagement from users so the more you look for that, the more the algorithms will push your way.   I’m sure it would help you to get your mind off this, go outside, move and distract yourself.  Even if you don’t feel like it. Try to get a few routines going. 4.5 months is only a very short time to be in withdrawal. Over time improvements happen for many people and I think you’ve already said you have seen some small improvements. 
 

Have you tried meditating as a way to calm yourself down?  I find Jon Kabat Zin’s body scan very helpful. It helped me identify that my thoughts were a problem!  I gradually became aware of my thoughts and was able to notice, challenge them and even get to the point where I said “there I go again”.  Alto wrote about “changing the channel” as a strategy to deal with withdrawal effects.  I wonder if this might help you.
 

I’m really sorry the counsellor you went to was no help, that must have been such a disappointment for you. It might be worth trying to find one that understands anti depressant withdrawal and can support you better - check with them first whether they know about this.  With online consultations you aren’t limited to your own area anymore. 

[getofflex]

21 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

In no way am I trying to be rude or aggressive, but can it really be considered withdrawal when there are those who don’t recover?

It takes months to years to recover from psych drug withdrawal.  You've only been off your drugs for a little over a month.  I agree with advice from Faure - try to distract yourself, and get your mind off of your symptoms and how you feel. In early recovery, I would do stuff with my hands like sewing, knitting, cleaning, yard work, walking, etc.  It helped to get my mind off of how badly I felt.  I know how bad this deal sucks, believe me, I do.  But that doesn't mean it is permanent.  

 

Steps for Managing WD Symptoms

 

Letting Go of Control

[Temporary1286]

I have been off of them for four months now. Almost 4.5. I do appreciate your message.

[Altostrata]

When we say symptoms resolve very slowly over months or years, we're saying you're in an early phase of recovery. Four or five months would be  a quick recovery. We don't expect that. You will need to manage your health anxiety to get through this. 

 

Health anxiety, hypochondria, and obsession with symptoms

 

 

Ways to cope with daily anxiety

 

Dealing With Emotional Spirals 

Shame, guilt, regret, and self-criticism

 

[Temporary1286]

My most recent psychiatrist who gave me the medication told me today that he doesn’t believe “PSSD” or that iatrogenic damage is real, and that there is a different cause as to why I am feeling the way I do. He dismissed me when I asked him why he didn’t warn me of something like this in the first place. He likens it to belief and mental illness, essentially proclaiming that I have made it all up and come to believe my own lies.

 

I don’t think I have ever been more hurt in my life. First to have my life ruined by this guy, and then for him to tell me it’s all jarbled nonsense.

 

I feel it’s now my duty to warn people of him and his practices, and if someone could direct me to a place in which I would be able to do that either online or through another modem that would be very much appreciated.

[getofflex]

23 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

My most recent psychiatrist who gave me the medication told me today that he doesn’t believe “PSSD” or that iatrogenic damage is real, and that there is a different cause as to why I am feeling the way I do. He dismissed me when I asked him why he didn’t warn me of something like this in the first place. He likens it to belief and mental illness, essentially proclaiming that I have made it all up and come to believe my own lies.

 

Uggh.  He sounds rather arrogant, and I'm afraid I've heard variations on this story many times on this forum.  I'm sorry he was this way.  I can certainly understand your anger, as she/he has treated you quite unfairly.  

 

This forum has various threads on taking action, and how to file a complaint about your doctor.  

 

Events, Actions, Controversies

 

 

[Temporary1286]

@getofflex Thank you very much. It was definitely difficult to hear. I had to just end the conversation immediately and sever contact.

 

I guess the last real question I have for anyone who can answer it for a while would be if the amount of time that passes still feeling the way you did/do when it all began indicates a lower percent or chance to recover/heal. Not sure what to think about this. I have made a decision to avoid the dark places of the web and all but this thread for now to try and harness more hope.

[Altostrata]

12 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

if the amount of time that passes still feeling the way you did/do when it all began indicates a lower percent or chance to recover/heal.

 

When we say recovery is very slow, what we mean is it's so slow, you might not notice it until you look back 6 months ago. When we urge people to be patient, we mean to be patient while very slow, almost imperceptible, recovery proceeds.

[getofflex]

To be frank with you, recovery from this can take many months, to years.  However, this does not mean it will be severe and acute symptoms all this time, because there tends to be windows, and even the waves do get milder and milder.  

[ChessieCat]

On 5/6/2022 at 9:34 AM, Temporary1286 said:

I have made a decision to avoid the dark places of the web and all but this thread for now to try and harness more hope.

 

Many members find encouragement in the Success Stories:

 

success-stories-recovery-from-psychiatric-drug-withdrawal

[Temporary1286]

@getofflex I guess those who don’t have windows and waves are just out of luck?

[Temporary1286]

I genuinely don’t think I can do this anymore. Five months of nothing but pure suffering. It’s like looking for a needle in a haystack to try and find a recovery story, and when I do I am bombarded by suicides, people suffering 20 or so years, those who have seen no improvement or difference in 3-5 years, etc.

 

I’m incredibly sorry to anyone who ever had to go through this misery. There is absolutely nothing worse. The worst part about it is we trusted with our lives and most important faculty those who never informed us of this horrific possibility.

 

Going to try to make a donation to this website in a few days. I don’t know what comes next from here on.

[Fairsome]

On 4/30/2022 at 5:28 PM, Temporary1286 said:

I think websites like Rxisk and others do the opposite of provide assistance, but even have the potential of driving others to suicide. A “Dr. Healy” scowls the internet proclaiming that those afflicted are doomed, and even talks about assisted suicide and more in his posts and articles. The same can be said for r/PSSD and other related forums. It is heartbreaking to stumble across someone who had their life affected so greatly that they felt the need to end their life.

Dr. Healy should really be more cautious with his speech and things he has said in the past because I am sure words like these could drive many people into suicide. It's not 'Tardive Dyserotica' because sexual function is extremely complex and it's not affected just by the levels of serotonin and neurotransmitters. Autonomic instability could lead to sexual dysfunction itself.

 

We are in similar situation, my doctor also doesn't believe me... She couldn't understand me a bit and was asking me how I know I have zero libido and sexuality when I don't have a partner... It made me sick and ashamed of myself that I trusted this idiot. It is a ******* crime that we have to go through this because of the idiot doctors that were somehow supposed to help us mentally. I can't understand how these drugs are still being prescribed like candy with no one informing you how dangerous they are.

[getofflex]

18 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

@getofflex I guess those who don’t have windows and waves are just out of luck?

I'm truly sorry to hear about this, temporary.  Unfortunately, there are some who experience a long bout of suffering without windows.  But that does not mean it is permanent.  Altostrata took 11 years to heal from Paxil C/T, but she did recover.  Try reading this link:  

 

Steps for Managing WD Symptoms

[Onmyway]

On 5/7/2022 at 10:01 PM, Temporary1286 said:

I genuinely don’t think I can do this anymore. Five months of nothing but pure suffering. It’s like looking for a needle in a haystack to try and find a recovery story, and when I do I am bombarded by suicides, people suffering 20 or so years, those who have seen no improvement or difference in 3-5 years, etc.

 

I’m incredibly sorry to anyone who ever had to go through this misery. There is absolutely nothing worse. The worst part about it is we trusted with our lives and most important faculty those who never informed us of this horrific possibility.

 

Going to try to make a donation to this website in a few days. I don’t know what comes next from here on.

Hi @Temporary1286, 

when we are distressed either by withdrawal or depression our minds see negative stories much more frequently than they see the positive ones. I can guarantee you that there are many success stories with people for whom it takes much less time to heal than 20 years. I can think of a handful where WD went for a long time and those people were on many more medicines than you. I don't know where you are findings those 20 year WDs. Suicides are also incredibly rare. Even people on drugs for many decades and with complicated cocktails recover. 

 

I understand how miserable this feels and in the middle of it pretty much everyone wonders if it will ever get better. IT WILL. There is absolutely no question about that. 

 

In the meantime you need to accept that this is happening and that your job in the forsee-able future is to get through the next minute, hour, day, month. It is important not to be scared of the various symptoms. They are your body's way of manifesting healing. 
Have you seen this post? It is one I often reread. It reminds me of the work the body is doing. 

What is happening in your brain? - Symptoms and self-care - Surviving Antidepressants

 

What are your symptoms now? What symptoms have improved? 

OMW

 

[ChessieCat]

Thank you for letting us know that you will be taking a break from the site.

 

Because part of SA's mission is to educate the medical profession, it would be really helpful if you would update your drug signature to show the details of any other psychiatric drugs you have taken prior to these:

 

Clomipramine (Anafranil): Oct 1st, 2021 - Dec 22nd, 2021.

Clonazepam: January 1st 2021 - March 21st 2022 - Sporadic/Off and On.

[Fairsome]

@Temporary1286, please don't do anything to hurt yourself... there are a lot of recovery stories on the net and while I know that these 4-5 months might have seemed like an eternity, many people recover after that. 

[Jakob66]

On 5/3/2022 at 10:50 PM, Temporary1286 said:

My most recent psychiatrist who gave me the medication told me today that he doesn’t believe “PSSD” or that iatrogenic damage is real, and that there is a different cause as to why I am feeling the way I do. He dismissed me when I asked him why he didn’t warn me of something like this in the first place. He likens it to belief and mental illness, essentially proclaiming that I have made it all up and come to believe my own lies.

 

I don’t think I have ever been more hurt in my life. First to have my life ruined by this guy, and then for him to tell me it’s all jarbled nonsense.

 

I feel it’s now my duty to warn people of him and his practices, and if someone could direct me to a place in which I would be able to do that either online or through another modem that would be very much appreciated.

Yes same here mate. I was also fooled and now they don't believe me and say I make it all upp. Just send a report of what happened to you to the fda in your country. It won't help with one report ofcourse, but if we all do it there might be a difference.

[Ariel]

Dear @Temporary1286

 

I feel very sad to read that you are applying for medical assistance in dying. My heart goes out to you in your suffering. 

 

I don't know what it's like to be you. I just know that healing does happen, it takes time but it does happen. I say this based on my own experience and also the experience of many others whose struggles and recoveries are documented here on SA and elsewhere. 

 

You matter. Your story is important. Thank you for sharing with such candor. Your honesty is valuable and brave.  

 

I'm sorry you are going through such pain. 

 

With love and healing wishes,

A. 

 

 

[Temporary1286]

Am I the only one with an incredible amount of anger at the piece of **** that gave me this medication and said nothing? Am I the only one who feels like they could sue or ruin that persons life as they’ve ruined mine?

 

Its really beginning to hit me how horrific this is all is.

 

As someone who may very well lose their life because of this, I can’t help but feel this intense anger and feeling of having my life stolen.

[ChessieCat]

Yes there are other members who feel anger about what has happened to them.

 

I think this topic will help you to realise that you are not the only one:

 

lalochezia-the-cursing-thread

 

This is the Finding Meaning forum.  Check out the topic headings where others have posted about how they feel:

 

finding-meaning

 

 

[ChessieCat]

In a PM you asked about reinstating.

 

Please carefully read Post #1 of this topic:

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

[Temporary1286]

Genuinely believe I am on my last few legs here.

 

Another casualty of anti-depressants.

[Jakob66]

17 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

Am I the only one with an incredible amount of anger at the piece of **** that gave me this medication and said nothing? Am I the only one who feels like they could sue or ruin that persons life as they’ve ruined mine?

 

Its really beginning to hit me how horrific this is all is.

 

As someone who may very well lose their life because of this, I can’t help but feel this intense anger and feeling of having my life stolen.

I agree with you 100% something has to be done against this. This can't go on they can't keep destroying people's life's and getting away with it.

[Temporary1286]

I am unfortunately left with no other option.

 

My parents ridicule me, call me insane, call me “certifiable”, call me a “lunatic.”

 

Their solution and demand is that I get back on another anti-depressant (Wellbutrin) or they will throw me out on the street. They claim that everyone on this website is nuts, wrong, and has other issues that is causing them their suffering

 

This will be my last post.

 

Goodluck everyone.

[Onmyway]

Dear @Temporary1286, 

I am so sorry you are in such distress. I am so sorry that those close to you who are supposed to protect you don't know how to do it well. They are likely scared and take that on you. (I am not justifying their behavior in the least!) It is not fair on you. It must feel awful to be on the receiving end of such insults especially when you are feeling so vulnerable. My heart goes out to you. I understand how hopeless this must feel. I see your pain. I wish I could be there in person to help you, give you a hug and reassure you that this WILL GET better. 

 

I will try to do that virtually instead. 

This pain, this hole that seems to have slippery walls, this is temporary. This will get better. How do I know that? Because I have been in that despair as have many others here. And months and years down the road, it is even hard to remember how awful this felt. At the time though... at the time when this felt like utter hell... it was hard to even imagine a different future. 

 

I also know that you have the strength and the stamina to get through this, to grow through this and to emerge an even stronger person. I don't know you personally, it's true, but I know how much strength there is in the human spirit. You are here because so many of your ancestors have survived centuries of hardship and despair and haven't given up, instead they have gotten through it. This survival thing - it's in your DNA! You will get through this and will thrive one day! 

 

If you decide to hang in here with your fellow sufferers, we can fight this injustice together when we get better and get our strength back. You can use that anger to educate others about these drugs, to make change in society and stop their prescriptions. Don't let that anger destroy you. That won't do anything to those who perpetuate this cycle of addiction. Slowly, though, we can use this anger to make changes - through the work of many on these forums people are learning about withdrawal, the Royal College of Psychiatrists recognized withdrawal (you can show this to your parents), through our collective stories things are changing. Don't be a casualty, be a survivor and a fighter for change. You will not hurt the people who did this to you by giving up, you can stop them through preventing others from being hurt by these drugs by educating them. Don't be a drop in the ocean, become a wave of change with us! 

https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/news-and-features/latest-news/detail/2020/09/23/new-information-on-stopping-antidepressants

 

Your anger is justified. However, in withdrawal, it gets amplified and may find an outlet that hurts you instead of those responsible for your suffering. Don't let these drugs decide your future for you. Don't give them that power.

 

Sometimes, when we feel helpless we want to make a statement and make others suffer and see what they have done to us. Don't do that by hurting yourself. If you do that, you won't be able to even see the result. 

 

The symptoms you have are not unusual and people do recover from them. I am not a success story yet by any means but I am feeling many times better than when I first stopped the drugs. For the first five months the whole world looked "yuck" to me. Forget romantic attraction, the sight of anything or another human being made me want to throw up. I was constantly nauseous, couldn't sleep, didn't enjoy ANYTHING, was full of anger. Slowly, very slowly, that became much better. I still struggle with withdrawal while tapering after reinstatement and lots of situational challenges have made withdrawal so hard for me but I am much, much better than where I was 3 years ago. 

 

You will feel better too. 

OMW

 

 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Onmyway

[Roserdl]

I am so sorry this is happening to you.  Read the success stories.  People heal from this though it takes time.   I am only three months in and did everything wrong but the improvements are still coming. More than I expected.  I understand as I have very little positive feelings still but that does go away too in time. And you may heal quicker than you think.  I talked to many long time psych nurses who have seen this and they all stated people get better and many in months.  I know how long this feels.  I am here too but it is the expected outcome to get better.  Brains heal.  Your symptoms are not permanent. Much love

[Temporary1286]

@Onmyway@Roserdl

 

Apologies for the lack of reply. I have had quite a difficult past few days.

 

I must be frank and honest. I believe that “PSSD” while related to general anti-depressant withdrawal is essentially a whole different ball game. I think it is generally less understood than other aspects of withdrawal, but I may be wrong in this regard. I’ve decided to be completely impartial, and not discount anything or anyone who comes forward with an opinion.

 

I don’t believe recovery in PSSD is so straight forward or guaranteed like it is for other aspects of anti-depressant withdrawal. As Altostrata has said and many others have allotted to; sexual functioning and sexuality finds itself akin to an incredibly complex series of events and actions within the brain all occurring at once to procure these feelings. I think it will be many decades if not centuries before we have a clear understanding of this.

 

While I believe that more positive and impartial websites like this one can help improve or prevent things like suicide or hopelessness, I think it’s important to be as realistic as possible. Are there those who’ve recovered? Yes. Are there those who haven’t? Yes. You could say that the latter finds itself in the overwhelming majority. My own “research” seems to point to the latter being the most common outcome. I do wish that other websites and forums that mention these things would take more care in speaking about them, as I can completely understand why they may drive someone to suicide or self harm. They are very soul crushing, and very hope killing.

 

Personally I am completely broken. I thank you for your replies and comments on my thread, and have only now seen them as I barely even grasp for my phone or computer any more. It’s certainly taken it’s toll on family as-well as myself. I didn’t think at age 24 I would be applying for Medical Assistance in Dying. I do genuinely want to live, just not with this condition or this quality of life.

 

I do hope I get extremely lucky soon, or something happens that might inspire some hope in me.

 

Very surreal.

 

Thank you again for your messages. It means a lot.

 

I’m sure I am not the only one who feels this way, and I am sure I won’t be the last.

[cosmo86]

2 hours ago, Temporary1286 said:

@Onmyway@Roserdl

 

Apologies for the lack of reply. I have had quite a difficult past few days.

 

I must be frank and honest. I believe that “PSSD” while related to general anti-depressant withdrawal is essentially a whole different ball game. I think it is generally less understood than other aspects of withdrawal, but I may be wrong in this regard. I’ve decided to be completely impartial, and not discount anything or anyone who comes forward with an opinion.

 

I don’t believe recovery in PSSD is so straight forward or guaranteed like it is for other aspects of anti-depressant withdrawal. As Altostrata has said and many others have allotted to; sexual functioning and sexuality finds itself akin to an incredibly complex series of events and actions within the brain all occurring at once to procure these feelings. I think it will be many decades if not centuries before we have a clear understanding of this.

 

While I believe that more positive and impartial websites like this one can help improve or prevent things like suicide or hopelessness, I think it’s important to be as realistic as possible. Are there those who’ve recovered? Yes. Are there those who haven’t? Yes. You could say that the latter finds itself in the overwhelming majority. My own “research” seems to point to the latter being the most common outcome. I do wish that other websites and forums that mention these things would take more care in speaking about them, as I can completely understand why they may drive someone to suicide or self harm. They are very soul crushing, and very hope killing.

 

Personally I am completely broken. I thank you for your replies and comments on my thread, and have only now seen them as I barely even grasp for my phone or computer any more. It’s certainly taken it’s toll on family as-well as myself. I didn’t think at age 24 I would be applying for Medical Assistance in Dying. I do genuinely want to live, just not with this condition or this quality of life.

 

I do hope I get extremely lucky soon, or something happens that might inspire some hope in me.

 

Very surreal.

 

Thank you again for your messages. It means a lot.

 

I’m sure I am not the only one who feels this way, and I am sure I won’t be the last.

 

I’ve got PSSD from Clomipramine too, I totally understand you.

I’ve been through antidepressants withdrawals several time in my life but this is different.

After more than 7 months in this hell I’m convinced that PSSD is a iatrogenic disease.