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Tips for tapering off Effexor and Effexor XR (venlafaxine)

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Altostrata
On 10/4/2019 at 8:19 AM, maxfly said:

Hi Nelly,

 

What brand of Venlafaxine are you using?  I use Teva.  There are ~450 tiny beads in a 150 mg capsule so it's easier to taper slowly.  Other brands of Venlafaxine are Apo, Ran, PMS, Auro.  I've only used Teva.

 

I discussed tapering with my doctor and proposed bead counting.  He recommended using a compounding pharmacy instead.  The compounding pharmacy essentially does the same thing as bead counting but they use an accurate scale.  More importantly, using a pharmacy stops you from thinking about your taper and getting preoccupied with dosages.  It's one less thing to think about so you can focus on other aspects of your health and daily life.

 

For now I asked the compounding pharmacy to make me 200 10mg capsules so I can control my taper from 150mg.  I'm down to 132.5 mg after about 8 weeks of tapering.  My plan is to drop 10mg every 5 weeks for the time being.

 

If you do find a compounding pharmacy make sure you discuss brand and only use one brand.  I suspect there are slight differences between brands and you want to eliminate as many variables as possible.  For me, compounding was covered under my employers health plan.

 

Hope this helps,

Maxfly

 

 

 

It's a good idea to have a compounding pharmacy make up a large number of small-dose capsules at one time. Often the cost of 200 capsules is not much more than 30 capsules.

 

A decrease of 10mg per month or so stays within the 10% guideline until your daily dosage is less than 100mg. At that point, you might request a batch of 5mg compounded capsules, which will enable you to taper at 10% until you get to lower than 50mg per day.

 

On 10/6/2019 at 4:54 PM, Superwoman said:

Venlafaxine is metabolized to its active metabolite, O-desmethylvenlafaxine (ODV). After administration of extended-release capsules, the peak plasma concentrations of venlafaxine and ODV are attained within 5.5 and 9 hours, respectively.[1] The absorption rate of capsule venlafaxine is slowerthan its rate of elimination. Thus, the elimination half-life of venlafaxine after administration of the extended-release capsule (15 ± 6 hours) is the absorption half-life instead of the true disposition half-life (5 ± 2) hours observed after administration of an immediate-release tablet.

 

I don’t understand the part about the half life. Is the half life of the extended release Effexor (15 + or - 6 hrs.) or is it (5 + or - 2 hrs?). Does anyone know?

 

According to that paragraph, due to slower absorption, the extended-release venlafaxine has a half-life of 15 ± 6 hours, compared to immediate-release half-life of 5 ± 2 hours.

 

On 10/9/2019 at 7:53 PM, Superwoman said:

Maxfly,

Do you know how many beads are in the 75 mg and the 37.5 capsules?  Are they all the same size?

 

 

 

The exact number of beads in a capsule varies from batch to batch and manufacturer to manufacturer. Each manufacturer will have a different way of forming the beads, some brands vary more in size than others.

 

3 minutes ago, Superwoman said:

Recently I had a real scare. The pharmacy called and told me that my Effexor XR of the manufacturer that I use was out of stock.  Fortunately they did get it back in stock. Anyway, I think it would be a great idea if people would post information about their brand of Effexor. This way if someone has to switch manufacturers of their medication they will know what their options are so they can make the best choice.  I will post some questions shortly. 

 

Great! You can post in this topic, so all venlafaxine information is in one place.

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Nelly
7 hours ago, Superwoman said:

Nelly,

 

Sorry I’m not sure the answer to your question.  That would seem harder to taper then a capsule with a bunch of beads. Are they beads or tablets inside the capsule?  

Hi Superwoman

Thank you so much for your message. Sorry I may not have explained properly. I have been thinking about this a lot and how best to take my next step when I’m ready.  I am currently taking 5 tablets out of a capsule of 12 XR. The whole dose is 150mg. I have reduced half tablet since my last message, so I am now on 5 tablets. I had a bad day yesterday, but it passed and today has been good. I won’t reduce again until I have stabilised more.

i am seeing the doctor on Friday. I am not sure what to ask for

option 1 - 75mg XR capsule of 6 tablets, and cut one during my next tapers. My concern with this option is the inaccuracy in the size of the cut bead, and as I am cutting it causing it be be IR, which may result in varying symptoms/withdrawal effects 

option 2 - ask for liquid form and use a measuring syringe. I believe this is only available in IR, so I am thinking I could split the dose over 3 times per day?

option 3 - ask for capsules with beads XR and weigh the beads. 

The name of the AD is VENSIR. Would it cause me more problems, if my next prescription was a different brand name? I am trying to be prepared for when I see the doctor. 

It seems so complicated, but as you know, any slight change could cause more horrible effects. I really would appreciate your thoughts on this. Many thanks for your help x

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Nelly
2 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

Nelly, your calculations regarding the mini-tablets are correct. A reduction by a half--tablet, or 6.75mg, from 68.75mg venlafaxine XL is still within the 10% guideline.

 

Since you've been cutting the mini-tablets in half, they may be releasing the drug faster than the intact XL mini-tablets. Have you noticed any symptoms when you're taking a dose that includes a partial mini-tablet?

 

After you reduce another 6.75mg, your dosage will be 5 mini-tablets, or 62.5mg. Reductions of 10% would be smaller than cutting a mini-tablet in half. How about cutting off a third of a mini-tablet, or about 4.17mg, next time? You could continue reducing by a third of a mini-tablet until you get to about 40mg. Then you would want to reduce by a quarter of a mini-tablet for a while.

Hi Altostrata

Thank you for your message. Since my last message I have reduced to 5 mini tablets. I had a bad evening yesterday, I took some ibobrufin and I felt better, and today I feel better. I hadn’t noticed any immediate effect from cutting the tablet  But I do think that by the early evening I am flaked out and feeling unwell. 

I will go with what you suggest, I’m sure I can deal with that. I will take it easy.

Thank you so much I can’t tell you how valuable the guidance is from everyone. I don’t think this would be possible without it x

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Superwoman

Please take a minute to answer the questions below about the brand of Effexor that you use. This will serve as a reference. If people need to switch manufacturers they can refer to this reference to choose a different manufacturer that best meets their needs. For example, they can choose a brand that is similar to their previous drug. (I.e. similar number of beads).  This will help people plan ahead and reduce anxiety.  You can copy and paste the questions.  If anything in your meditation changes update please. 
 

1. What country do you live? (Different countries have different brands available?)

 

2. Manufacturer name:

 

3.  Immediate release Effexor or extended release (XR):

 

4. Description: tablet, capsule with beads or capsule with tablets inside:

 

5. Number of beads or tablets and/or weight (list dosage I.e. 37.5 mg. capsule has 50 beads, or 75= 110 beads)(count the beads of several capsules and take the average #).

 

6. Uniformity: Are all the beads the same size?

* How much variation is there between individual pills? (Ex. Count or weigh 3 pills, if capsule 1= 102 beads, capsule 2= 99 beads and capsule 3= 95 beads, then the pills vary by 7 beads, 102-95).

 

6a. Is the capsule easy to open?

 

Optional Questions:

 

7. What country is the medication made?


8. Customer Service: If you communicated with the company how was the customer service experience?  Note: if you were lucky enough to find a particular person who was helpful please provide the person’s name and contact information here so that others can request to speak with this person.

 

9. Any other information you want to add.  Have there been any quality problems or recalls with this company?  Other Pertinent information.  
 

(Ideally we want a brand that has beads all the same size, little variability in bead numbers or weight between individual pills, good customer service and good quality).  I know, that’s a tall order, but some companies might be better than others.) 


Thank You!

Edited by Altostrata
added question to list

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Superwoman

One more question.....

 

Is the capsule easy to open?

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maxfly

Hi All,

 

1. What country do you live? (Different countries have different brands available?) Canada

2. Manufacturer name: Teva

3.  Immediate release Effexor or extended release (XR): XR

4. Description: tablet, capsule with beads or capsule with tablets inside: Capsule with beads

5. Number of beads or tablets and/or weight (list dosage I.e. 37.5 mg. capsule has 50 beads, or 75= 110 beads)(count the beads of several capsules and take the average #). 150 mg = 450 beads, 75 mg = 225 beads, 37.5 = 112 beads.  It's pretty much 3 beads = 1 mg.

6. Uniformity: Are all the beads the same size?  Bead sizes vary slightly but I think if your tapering several beads at a time the size will average out.  I like to let a compounding pharmacy do the counting and weighing to be sure.

* How much variation is there between individual pills? (Ex. Count or weigh 3 pills, if capsule 1= 102 beads, capsule 2= 99 beads and capsule 3= 95 beads, then the pills vary by 7 beads, 102-95).

6a. Is the capsule easy to open? Very easy to open.

 

Beads look like image at this link: https://withdrawal.theinnercompass.org/taper/counting-beads-beaded-capsule

 

I've been told that brand of Effexor shouldn't matter significantly but I've never tried switching brands.

 

Hope this helps,

Maxfly

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Superwoman
On 10/20/2019 at 11:40 AM, Superwoman said:

Please take a minute to answer the questions below about the brand of Effexor that you use. This will serve as a reference. If people need to switch manufacturers they can refer to this reference to choose a different manufacturer that best meets their needs. For example, they can choose a brand that is similar to their previous drug. (I.e. similar number of beads).  This will help people plan ahead and reduce anxiety.  You can copy and paste the questions.  If anything in your meditation changes update please. 
 

1. What country do you live? (Different countries have different brands available?) USA

 

2. Manufacturer name: Aurobindo

 

3.  Immediate release Effexor or extended release (XR): XR

 

4. Description: tablet, capsule with beads or capsule with tablets inside:

Capsule with beads

5. Number of beads or tablets and/or weight (list dosage I.e. 37.5 mg. capsule has 50 beads, or 75= 110 beads)(count the beads of several capsules and take the average #).

37.5 mg.= 99 beads, 75 mg.= 194 beads. Don’t have 150 mg pill

6. Uniformity: Are all the beads the same size? No, there are maybe 3 sizes

* How much variation is there between individual pills? (Ex. Count or weigh 3 pills, if capsule 1= 102 beads, capsule 2= 99 beads and capsule 3= 95 beads, then the pills vary by 7 beads, 102-95).
7% variation, 37.5mg varies by 7 beads, 75 mg. Varies by 15 beads

 

6a. Is the capsule easy to open?

37.5 is hard to open, 75 mg is easy to open 

On 10/20/2019 at 11:40 AM, Superwoman said:

Optional Questions:

 

7. What country is the medication made? India


8. Customer Service: If you communicated with the company how was the customer service experience?  Note: if you were lucky enough to find a particular person who was helpful please provide the person’s name and contact information here so that others can request to speak with this person.

Customer experience was bad. I emailed the company to ask why the Med was on back order and when it would be back in stock. They responded that they only give out stock information to pharmacies. However, they also did not provide the pharmacy with any information. 

9. Any other information you want to add.  Have there been any quality problems or recalls with this company?  Other Pertinent information.  Yes, the company has been cited for quality problems at their India facility.
 

(Ideally we want a brand that has beads all the same size, little variability in bead numbers or weight between individual pills, good customer service and good quality).  I know, that’s a tall order, but some companies might be better than others.) 


Thank You!

 

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Rosabell

Hello,

 

Just wondering at what dose most will consider their taper over and stop taking any?

As well, i have recently had to re-instate due to withdrawal symptoms two months off due to a too fast taper and stopping at too high of a dose. I have been instructed to take 5 tiny beads each day, so this is what i am doing. Does it matter that i just swallow the beads and they are not in a capsule? I thought that it was the actual beads that were time released, not the outer capsule that i pull apart to get the beads out.

I look forward to hearing any feedback that anyone might have.

 

Thank You

Rosa

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Altostrata

As explained in the first post in this topic, the beads themselves are timed-release. You take them out of the capsule and swallow them down with a good amount of water, don't let them dissolve in your mouth or throat.

 

If you've just reinstated, it's too early to worry about how you're going to go off.

 

Please read this topic from the beginning.

 

 

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Rosabell

Hi Alto,

thanks for the quick reply, I did read all 8 pages!! That’s what got me confused!

I am glad I now have confirmation of what I thought was the case.

I am not worried about how I am going to go off, I am more than prepared to take as long as it takes, I would just like to know what the acceptable jump dose is for most. I know when I was tapering my clonazepam I went down to almost zero!!

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primekittycat

1. What country do you live? (Different countries have different brands available?) - United States

 

2. Manufacturer name: Aurobindo

 

3.  Immediate release Effexor or extended release (XR):  XR

 

4. Description: tablet, capsule with beads or capsule with tablets inside:   Capsule with small beads

 

5. Number of beads or tablets and/or weight (list dosage I.e. 37.5 mg. capsule has 50 beads, or 75= 110 beads)(count the beads of several capsules and take the average #).  37.5mg, weighs between 0.107g and 0.115g.  Depending on weight, there's roughly 0.41mg of Effexor XR dose per bead - easy to get down to low doses.  

 

6. Uniformity: Are all the beads the same size?  No, close but not exact. Have to take into account bead size when counting.

* How much variation is there between individual pills? (Ex. Count or weigh 3 pills, if capsule 1= 102 beads, capsule 2= 99 beads and capsule 3= 95 beads, then the pills vary by 7 beads, 102-95).

 

6a. Is the capsule easy to open? Have to be careful to not spill beads when opening

 

Optional Questions:

 

7. What country is the medication made?  Not sure


8. Customer Service: If you communicated with the company how was the customer service experience?  Note: if you were lucky enough to find a particular person who was helpful please provide the person’s name and contact information here so that others can request to speak with this person.    In the Detroit area, the Kroger in Canton on Ford Rd has this manufacturer and pill available.  Other manufacturers (Teva) have beads, but they are much larger so it isn't easy to cut once you get to very low doses.

 

9. Any other information you want to add.  Have there been any quality problems or recalls with this company?  Other Pertinent information.    No quality problems so far, no other pertinent info.

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primekittycat

Does anyone have any advice about getting into the super low doses of Effexor XR? I'm at about 3mg and am counting out beads which isn't bad, considering I only have to count 7 beads per day from my tablet. The AWS Gemini-20 scale is starting to become useless since it can't really measure at the low dose I'm on. I'm cutting one bead every 3 weeks.. which is more than a 10% drop but is the best I can do. I will hold longer when I need to. 

 

Any experiences to share? Did your withdrawal symptoms get worse at the end of the cut? Mine aren't, so I'm staying positive but I haven't found many members on such low doses or that came completely off Effexor. Thanks!

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Superwoman

@primekittycat,

 

When people get to such a low dose of Effexor I believe that they often switch to immediate release Effexor because it can be made into a liquid. You have to take it twice a day.  You might also be able to switch to Prozac which comes in a liquid.  It has a very long half life and is easier to taper. 

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Superwoman

I take one 75 mg Capsule and one 37.5mg capsule. This equals 112.5 mg Effexor XR. total.  I would like to taper by taking beads out of 37.5 mg capsule. Will I need to switch to three 37.5 mg capsules (also 112.5 mg total) when I taper.  
 

I am not sure how I would calculate the total number of beads from a 37.5 mg capsule and a 75 mg capsule because they are not equivalent. 

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Altostrata
On 10/25/2019 at 6:52 PM, Rosabell said:

I would just like to know what the acceptable jump dose is for most. I know when I was tapering my clonazepam I went down to almost zero!!

 

Depends on how your taper goes. If you are tapering by bead-counting, it could be one bead. Otherwise, it could be a fraction of a milligram, or where you feel safe. Keep a dose at the ready in case you need a rescue dose.

 

On 11/7/2019 at 9:16 AM, primekittycat said:

Did your withdrawal symptoms get worse at the end of the cut? Mine aren't, so I'm staying positive but I haven't found many members on such low doses or that came completely off Effexor. Thanks!

 

If you don't have withdrawal symptoms with your method, reducing one bead at a time could be sufficiently slow for your nervous system. You might hold for longer than 3 weeks to be on the safe side.

 

10 minutes ago, Superwoman said:

I take one 75 mg Capsule and one 37.5mg capsule. This equals 112.5 mg Effexor XR. total.  I would like to taper by taking beads out of 37.5 mg capsule. Will I need to switch to three 37.5 mg capsules (also 112.5 mg total) when I taper.  
 

I am not sure how I would calculate the total number of beads from a 37.5 mg capsule and a 75 mg capsule because they are not equivalent. 

 

I would take reductions from the 37.5mg capsule only. With the bead-counting method, you will want to maintain a consistent prescription capsule dosage  throughout the taper, because capsules of various dosages will not be consistent in their bead count. When your daily dose is down to 75mg, you will be using 2 37.5mg capsules. You will be tapering from 37.5mg capsules throughout your taper.

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Superwoman

@Altostrata,

 

Yes, I will be tapering by removing beads from the 37.5 capsule.  So if I understand you correctly then I need to switch from a 37.5 plus 75 mg to three 37.5 mg capsules.  Is this correct?

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Altostrata

No, as long as you're taking a whole 75mg capsule, you can keep taking it. Taper from the 37.5mg capsule.

 

When you're down to 75mg PER DAY, you would change to 2 37.5mg capsules and taper from one of them.

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Miko789

one  of the most horrible a/d together with paxil. 

very difficult withdrawal  to taper off.the real struggle  is when you jump the last dose, first days are hell, 

i jumped from 75mg capsules, if im not mistaken  and weaned off. hope it goes smooth 4 you

 

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Superwoman
22 hours ago, Altostrata said:

No, as long as you're taking a whole 75mg capsule, you can keep taking it. Taper from the 37.5mg capsule.

 

When you're down to 75mg PER DAY, you would change to 2 37.5mg capsules and taper from one of them.

How would I count the number of beads in a 37.5 mg pill plus 75 mg pill?  I don’t think you would add up the total number of beads from the 75 mg and the 37.5 mg capsule because they are not equivalent. 

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Altostrata

You don't have to count the beads in the 75mg capsule, you know it contains 75mg active ingredient. Leave it alone.

 

All you need to do is count the beads in the 37.5mg capsule. Do your 10% calculations on 75mg plus whatever you intend to take from the 37.5mg capsule.

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Superwoman
On 11/12/2019 at 2:12 PM, Altostrata said:

You don't have to count the beads in the 75mg capsule, you know it contains 75mg active ingredient. Leave it alone.

 

All you need to do is count the beads in the 37.5mg capsule. Do your 10% calculations on 75mg plus whatever you intend to take from the 37.5mg capsule.

I understand that for the first reduction I would reduce 10% of 112.5mg.  So I would reduce by 11.25 mg. This would take me to 101.25 (112.5-11.25).  The second reduction would be 10.125mg.  This would take me down to 91.125mg. (101.25- 10.125) Correct?

 

Sorry, but I don’t understand how to calculate the number of beads to reduce by.  The average number of beads in a 37.5 mg capsule is 98 beads.  How do I do the 10% calculation of 75 mg. plus whatever I intend to take from the 37.5mg. capsule?  I don’t know how many beads to take from the 37.5 mg capsule. Thanks

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Altostrata

Do the calculation on the milligrams of active ingredient (mgai). @brassmonkey will explain this for you.

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brassmonkey

Hi Superwoman-- This is going to sound really complicated when you try to read through it, but if we take it step by step it's actually pretty easy.  When we're done you'll be able to calculate all the rest of your reductions.  For record keeping and other people who may be looking in I'm going to go through the long explanation of each step and then give you the basic calculations at the end. 

 

Before we start on the calculations we need to go through how you are doing the reduction.  Currently you are taking one (1)  75mgai capsule and one (1) 37.5mgai capsule for a total daily dose of 112.5mgai. Mgai stands for Milligrams Active Ingredient, which is the strength of the capsules according to the bottle and the strength of the dose according to your prescription.  To do the reduction you will still be taking one (1) 75mgai capsule, but only part of the 37.5mgai capsule, because of the beads you will remove.  After you have done about four reductions there will no longer be any beads in the 37.5mgai capsule which means that your dose will be 75mgai.  To get this you will now start taking two (2) 37.5mgai capsules.  From here on you will take one (1) whole 37.5 mgai capsule and one (1) 37.5mgai capsule that you will be taking beads out of.

 

Don't throw away the beads that you take out of the capsule, keep then in an old prescription bottle.  We are going to use then later on, but we will talk about that down the road.

 

How many beads will you need to take out of the capsule?  It's going to be different for each reduction cycle. For the first reduction cycle you will remove 29 beads from the 37.5mgai capsule.  For the second reduction you will remove an additional 26 for a total of 55 taken out.

 

Reduction cycle 1: one (1) 75mgai capsule and one (1) 37.5mgai capsule with 29 beads removed.

Reduction cycle 2: one (1) 75mgai capsule with one (1) 37.5mgai capsulw with 55 beads removed.

 

Now for the confusing math stuff.  It looks bad, but taking it one step at a time it's pretty easy.  I'll use the numbers from the first reduction to walk us through it.  Your initial dose is 112.5mgai and we want to do a reduction of 10%.

 

112.5mgai X .9 = 101.25mgai

 

So the strength of your first reduced dose would be 101.5mgai. But what does that mean in beads?  There are 98 beads in a capsule and that capsule has a strength of 37.5mgai.  If we divide 98 by 37.5 we get 2.6.  This means that 2.6 beads contain 1mgai of active ingredient.

 

We are reducing your dose from 112.5mgai to 101.25mgai which is a difference of 11.25mgai. With 1mgai being 2.6 beads then 11.25mgai X 2.6 = 29.25 beads.  So you remove 29 beads from one (1) capsule.  Take that capsule and one (1) 75mgai capsule and you get your full reduced dose of 101.25mgai. There is some rounding involved in the math so it's actually more like 101mgai, but the left out little bit isn't enough to cause any problems.

 

To calculate your second reduction you do the same thing, but start with 101.25mgai instead of 112.5mgai. BUT, you have to be sure to add together the number of beads you are reducing by.  That would be 29 + 26 = 55.

 

So here are the calculation you will need to do for each reduction.

 

Initial dose in mgai X .9 = reduced dose in mgai

Initial dose minus reduced dose = difference in mgai

Difference in mgai X 2.6 = number of beads to reduce by

Number of beads to reduce by + number of beads removed on the previous reduction = number of beads to take out of a whole 37.5mgai capsule

 

Take a whole 75mgai capsule and the reduced 37.5mgai capsule together for your daily dose.

 

Everything I've written above explains how those four steps work.  Following the four steps will calculate the dose you need to prepare.  This will get you started on your first several reduction cycles.  When you run out of beads in the 37.5mgai capsule let us know and we will move on the the next step.

 

 

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Superwoman

@brassmonkey,

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to explain this in such detail.  This stuff is definitely much easier to go on then it is to get off of.  I will need to re-read this and figure it out with pen and paper.  I think that I can figure it out though. 
 

For the first step you said (112.5mgai X .9 = 101.25mgai) did you mean to multiply it by 0.1?  
 

The 37.5mg capsules can vary by 7 beads.      The average number of beads in a 37.5 mg capsule is 98.7.  Can I just go with the average number of beads or do I have to count the beads for each and every capsule and do these calculations for every capsule?

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brassmonkey

You're very welcome, it was a fun twist on the calculations. Did I just say math was fun? What's happening to me?

 

I really did mean to multiply by .9.  If we multiply by .1 that would give us how much 10% of the number is and we would have to subtract that from the original number to get the weight of the what we want to keep.  Multiplying by .9 saves us a step.

 

Working with average numbers is so much easier we try to keep it that way. There are slight variations in the size of each bead so trying to get an exact number is really hard.   If a person ends up being very sensitive to the medication then counting each capsule would be helpful, or they could try to use scales and weigh things instead.

 

You could also come at it the other direction and count out how many beads you want to keep using 98 as a reference number for the calculations.  So instead of removing 55 beads from a full capsule you would add 44 beads to an empty capsule. The dosing would be more consistent and you could use up all those extra beads.  I was going to bring this up, but the post was getting really long and complex.  This would probably be the better way to go.

 

So step four would now read:

 

98 minus the number of beads to reduce by and the number of beads removed on the previous reduction = number of beads to take 

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Altostrata

Thanks, @brassmonkey!

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Superwoman

Thank you @ Brass Monkey. 

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primekittycat
On 11/11/2019 at 12:13 PM, Superwoman said:

@primekittycat,

 

When people get to such a low dose of Effexor I believe that they often switch to immediate release Effexor because it can be made into a liquid. You have to take it twice a day.  You might also be able to switch to Prozac which comes in a liquid.  It has a very long half life and is easier to taper. 

 

Just a note for others, I switched to immediate release Effexor a few years back to get my pills compounded to avoid having to weigh pills so much (XR cannot be compounded), and I didn't react well to it at all. I had horrible withdrawal symptoms, even taking it twice a day. I ended up switching back to XR. 

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Altostrata
5 hours ago, primekittycat said:

 

Just a note for others, I switched to immediate release Effexor a few years back to get my pills compounded to avoid having to weigh pills so much (XR cannot be compounded), and I didn't react well to it at all. I had horrible withdrawal symptoms, even taking it twice a day. I ended up switching back to XR. 

 

What dosage was that @primekittycat?

 

My comment above refers to tapering by bead-counting when you are down to fewer than 10 beads.

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Superwoman

@brassmonkey,

 

You are right that the calculations are not as complicated as it looks when you take it step by step.  I was able to figure it out, once I sat down with pencil and paper and calculator.

 

Do you round up at 0.5 or higher and down at under 0.5?  This is what what I remember from math class years ago.  There is an average of 98.7 beads in the 37.5 capsule.  Should I round up to 99?
 

Thank you again for explaining this step by step with so much detail.  This will help many people. 

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brassmonkey

I'm so glad that it is making sense to you, well done.

 

Many people say to always round up, but I find that the standard rounding rules work just fine.

 

I suspect, from my years in manufacturing, that the average number of beads in a 37.5mgai capsule is actually 100.  But I don't have the data to back it up, and it would only apply to that specific brand anyway.  Using either 98 or 99 would be fine, as that is the average you came up with and applies directly to your capsules.  Do you remember this paragraph from my previous post 

 

"You could also come at it the other direction and count out how many beads you want to keep using 98 as a reference number for the calculations.  So instead of removing 55 beads from a full capsule you would add 44 beads to an empty capsule. The dosing would be more consistent and you could use up all those extra beads.  I was going to bring this up, but the post was getting really long and complex.  This would probably be the better way to go."

 

If you were to follow this method then, after the initial calculations, the average number of beads in a capsule becomes irrelevant because the capsule becomes a stockpile to be drawn from not a fixed amount to be reduced.

 

Hope you're staying safe, we're in Cleveland right now and blowing off the map.

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