seventyseven: inspiration to get off of Abilify

[seventyseven]

Hi all!. So glad to have found this site. 

 

I was on abilify for 6 months but have tried to stop 4 times in the last 3 months and failed. 

 

I made a spreadsheet of it and my stopping was between two weeks and 1 week each time. Then I got hit bad, each time. I went from 2 mg. The last time I took 1 mg was 6 weeks ago. After that it was .5 mg or nothing for a number of the days. I couldn't bear to go back on 1 mg. It makes me dizzy and takes away all pleasure in life. 

 

I don't feel stabilized. Have panic, anxiety and depression, digestive symptoms. Had to cancel a trip and a medical procedure. 

 

Thinking now about making liquids or compounding pills. I don't feel comfortable splitting tiny pills into quarters when I feel this bad. I was thinking about going to .35 and then .15 but after reading some threads here I am not sure. 

 

Any wisdom is greatly appreciated. 

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @seventyseven

 

How long have you been taking 0.5mg? How do you feel before and after you take your daily dose? You're also taking gabapentin? How often?

[seventyseven]

Well I had 5 days on .5 mg but then quit for a week, and have had 28 days straight since then.

 

Gabapentin I used to take 100 mg but lately I take 2  100 mg pills per day. 

[Altostrata]

Do you feel better or worse now that you've been taking 0.5mg aripiprazole for 28 days? How has your symptom pattern changed in the last week?

 

When did you start taking 2 100mg gabapentin tablets per day? Are you taking them at the same times each day? What times o'clock do you take your drugs, with their dosages?

[seventyseven]

The panic attacks have subsided. I think I'm stabilizing somewhat. Stomach symptoms getting a little better. What a long time to wait for it though. 

 

I've been taking a second gabapentin for a few weeks now, one after dinner and one in the AM to fight cortisol rush. I wake up every 2 hours or so all night long. Been that way for years, at least since I was on benzos.

 

Looking forward to getting a liquid form of the abilify so I can reduce.

[Altostrata]

What times o'clock do you take each of your drugs, with their dosages? Do you feel any benefit from the increased gabapentin dosage?

 

It can take far longer than 28 days to stabilize after you get withdrawal symptoms. You will need to be patient and allow your system to settle down.

[seventyseven]

I take gabapentin after dinner and a few hours before I get up. Not fixed times.

[Altostrata]

Your inconsistent dosing schedule may be causing some of your symptoms via interdose withdrawal or paradoxical reactions.

 

Please settle on a consistent daily dosing schedule and keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show if your symptoms are adverse effects from one of your drugs.

[seventyseven]

I've always taken gabapentin as needed. It was first prescribed when I was reducing benzos. My symptoms are reducing but variable. I was  looking for any others who may have reduced abilify.  

[Altostrata]

What effect does gabapentin have on you when you take it as needed? How often have you taken it in the last month? Do you take it every day? More than once a day?

 

If you want further assistance tapering, we will need to see those daily notes.

[seventyseven]

Here is a log I made:

 

7:00 AM  Woke and took 100 mg Tylenol and 100 mg gabapentin. Had anxiety. (When I wake up I may feel sluggish and dizzy in the brain from abilify. At 2 and 1 mg it was profound. At .5 mg it's less so)

 

8:30 woke

 

9:45 woke

 

10:00 got up

 

10:20 breakfast. Took 100 mg fluoxetine .5 mg abilify

 Feel some energy with anxiety and depression.

 

12:40 drive to park to walk.

 

2:15 lunch take out

 

6:00 PM 35 minutes stretching and strengthening at home.

 

7:30 dinner

 

8:15 take gabapentin 100 mg and vitamins/suplements. Feel more relaxed afterwards

 

8:30 shower

 

8:45 tv

 

10:00 PM bed. Take 100 mg Tylenol, 1 benadryl tablet.

 

11:00 PM get up to eat something.

 

12:-12:30 fall asleep

 

[seventyseven]

My panic attacks were a week or two ago. Not that bad now. My digestive symptoms about the same. A lot of anxiety and depression.

 

I'm changing to liquid med now. Do you have to cross over gradually or just switch?

[Altostrata]

5 hours ago, seventyseven said:

7:00 AM  Woke and took 100 mg Tylenol and 100 mg gabapentin. Had anxiety. 

 

When did the anxiety start? Was it after you took Tylenol and gabapentin?

 

5 hours ago, seventyseven said:

10:20 breakfast. Took 100 mg fluoxetine .5 mg abilify

 

Why do you take these drugs together?

 

100mg fluoxetine is an extraordinarily high dose. Do you mean Zoloft? Please put ALL your drugs in this Interactions Checker and post the report or a link to it in this topic.

[seventyseven]

Sorry it's zoloft 100. I take them together after breakfast beginning of the day.

 

I have had cortisol rushes of anxiety on waking after the sun comes up over the last month. That's why I'm taking an extra gabapentin.  I wake up every 2 hours or so.

[seventyseven]

 

Drug Interaction Report

This report displays the potential drug interactions for the following 3 drugs:

• Zoloft (sertraline)
• gabapentin
• aripiprazole
• Add another drug

• Consumer
•  

 

Interactions between your drugs

Moderate

sertraline  gabapentin

Applies to: Zoloft (sertraline), gabapentin

Treatment with sertraline may occasionally cause blood sodium levels to get too low, a condition known as hyponatremia, and using it with some anticonvulsants can increase that risk. In addition, sertraline can cause seizures in susceptible patients, which may reduce the effectiveness of medications that are used to control seizures such as gabapentin. Talk to your doctor if you have any questions or concerns. Your doctor may be able to prescribe alternatives that do not interact, or you may need a dose adjustment or more frequent monitoring to safely use both medications. You should seek medical attention if you experience nausea, vomiting, headache, lethargy, irritability, difficulty concentrating, memory impairment, confusion, muscle spasm, weakness or unsteadiness, as these may be symptoms of hyponatremia. More severe cases may lead to hallucination, fainting, seizure, coma, and even death. Also let your doctor know if you develop seizures or experience an increase in seizures during treatment with sertraline. Additionally, because these medications may cause dizziness, drowsiness, and impairment in judgment, reaction speed and motor coordination, you should avoid driving or operating hazardous machinery until you know how they affect you. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

Switch to professional interaction data

Moderate

sertraline  ARIPiprazole

Applies to: Zoloft (sertraline), aripiprazole

Using ARIPiprazole together with sertraline can increase the risk of an irregular heart rhythm that may be serious and potentially life-threatening, although it is a relatively rare side effect. You may be more susceptible if you have a heart condition called congenital long QT syndrome, other cardiac diseases, conduction abnormalities, or electrolyte disturbances (for example, magnesium or potassium loss due to severe or prolonged diarrhea or vomiting). Talk to your doctor if you have any questions or concerns. Your doctor may already be aware of the risks, but has determined that this is the best course of treatment for you and has taken appropriate precautions and is monitoring you closely for any potential complications. You should seek immediate medical attention if you develop sudden dizziness, lightheadedness, fainting, shortness of breath, or heart palpitations during treatment with these medications, whether together or alone. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

Switch to professional interaction data

Moderate

gabapentin  ARIPiprazole

Applies to: gabapentin, aripiprazole

Using gabapentin together with ARIPiprazole may increase side effects such as dizziness, drowsiness, confusion, and difficulty concentrating. Some people, especially the elderly, may also experience impairment in thinking, judgment, and motor coordination. You should avoid or limit the use of alcohol while being treated with these medications. Also avoid activities requiring mental alertness such as driving or operating hazardous machinery until you know how the medications affect you. Talk to your doctor if you have any questions or concerns. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

Switch to professional interaction data

No other interactions were found between your selected drugs. However, this does not necessarily mean no other interactions exist. Always consult your healthcare provider.

[Altostrata]

Do you take at least 100mg gabapentin every day? How often do you take it in the morning? Have you recently been taking 200mg per day? How long have you consistently been taking 200mg per day?  

 

I need to know more about how often you take gabapentin. You may be causing your own problems with inconsistent dosing. This can cause interdose withdrawal -- such as morning anxiety when the prior evening dose wears off -- and paradoxical reactions.

 

What effect do you feel from aripiprazole in the morning? Did you always take it in the morning? How often do you take Benadryl at night?

 

5 hours ago, seventyseven said:

8:15 take gabapentin 100 mg and vitamins/suplements. Feel more relaxed afterwards

 

If you feel more relaxed afterwards, how do you feel before taking the evening gabapentin?

[seventyseven]

100 mg gaba every day since 2014. Second one as needed over the years. Steadily for the last month or so. It's a small dose.

 

What do you feel you don't know about it?

 

I don't feel aripiprazole in the morning best that i can tell. 

 

I feel stressed by the day and feel like gabapentin after dinner is relaxing relative to that. But there is a psychological aspect to it.   

[Altostrata]

Just now, seventyseven said:

Steadily for the last month or so. It's a small dose.

 

Do you mean you've been taking 2 doses of 100mg gabapentin every day for the last month? Do you take it at the same times each day?

 

Gabapentin has a half-life of only 5-7 hours, possibly shorter for you. Even if you like its effect, your use of it may be causing some of the symptoms you attribute to withdrawal. We cannot properly address withdrawal and tapering before controlling for potential adverse drug reactions.

[seventyseven]

I take it at the times I said, after dinner and in the morning. For the last month. 

 

What adverse reactions are you suspecting? Maybe a tolerance for gabapentin? 

 

I attribute a lot to the abilify since I tried to stop 4 times in 2 months. And since it had and has so many side effects.

 

You must have folks on here who are taking more than one med. They are all a little bit of a moving target. You have to deal with one first. 

[Altostrata]

That is correct. I have to consider confounders when more than one drug is being taken. That is why I request the daily notes, to isolate effects of each drug dose. This is a method I've developed over the last 10 years.

 

You could taper aripiprazole with these Tips for tapering off aripiprazole (Abilify) , but you might mistake adverse effects of your other drugs for withdrawal symptoms, which could cause you to misjudge the effect of your Abilify taper.

 

Taking gabapentin PRN is unusual, by the way. But we often see similar patterns in people taking benzos PRN. They like the effect of the benzo, but they get interdose withdrawal, so they start taking the benzo more often. If they take too much benzo, they can get paradoxical reactions, which they interpret as the need for more benzo. Rinse and repeat. This pattern can lead to true addiction as well as physiological dependence.

 

If you would like staff assistance, please continue to post daily notes.

[seventyseven]

Well I was on the same dose for 8 years so maybe I am feeling a pinch from the gabapentin. It is so small I never expected a problem. While I was in my panic attacks I talked about increasing the gaba to 300 or more. I can pick it up on Monday.

 

But there are unmistakeable effects of abilify: Digestive upset, dizziness, panic attacks which I never had before. It's likely everything I am taking plays into the whole picture. This abilify is so terrifying I might up my gaba dose just to get off, and then deal with the gaba later. 

[seventyseven]

What drugs have "Kindling"?

 

I know about benzos having a kindling effect. Is this an effect for any other medications? 

 

Edited June 18, 2022 by ChessieCat
added topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

9 minutes ago, seventyseven said:

Is this an effect for any other medications? 

 

Yes.  The effect of psychiatric drugs is cumulative.  There are SA members who have been on/off drugs and up/down in dose multiple times with no issues, then one day they do the same thing that worked before and their nervous system cannot cope with it.

 

Responses to other members:

  

On 4/20/2022 at 10:16 PM, Shep said:

You likely have kindled your nervous system, which is damage to the nervous system, caused by these abrupt additions and subtractions.

 

On 8/24/2021 at 7:44 PM, Shep said:

You may have kindled your nervous system. Kindling is trauma to the nervous system due to abrupt changes and cold turkeys. Many, perhaps most, of the people who come into these withdrawal forums are also dealing with kindling or some degree of nervous system destabilization.

 

 

[seventyseven]

13 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

 

Yes.  The effect of psychiatric drugs is cumulative.  There are SA members who have been on/off drugs and up/down in dose multiple times with no issues, then one day they do the same thing that worked before and their nervous system cannot cope with it.

 

Responses to other members:

  

 What do you mean by "cumulative"?

 

And is the effect not med-specific? Any meds? Is there any literature on it? 

 

 

 

[seventyseven]

I have picked up my liquid abilify. Is there an easy way or even a chart, to calculate 10% reductions recursively?

 

 

[Altostrata]

How to calculate dosages and dilutions? Spreadsheets and calculators

 

[seventyseven]

Thanks Altostrata

 

I'm starting .5 mg liquid today. I'm not going to go in steps for that. The problem with abilify is that any changes don't seem to take effect for between one and two weeks. It's very scary. But the only changes Ive made have been to jump off and get back on. I hope a gradual taper will be different. I may just go at .1 mg decrements. This drug is horrible and I can't imagine being on it for a year or more from now. 

 

 

[Altostrata]

If you are changing from a partial tablet to liquid, best to keep dosing consistent for a while to see how you tolerate the liquid. Please let us know how you're doing.

[seventyseven]

I'm on the third day of liquid and it seems pretty consistent. A few moments wondering if I have up or down dosed with the change. And whether that would be good or bad. I'm going to try .1 mg decrements. I think the effect of the med is bad and may be harder than the w/d effect. Hard to say. And it is complicated by the half life being so long. Its going to be hard to wait out two weeks of suspense. 

[Ariel]

@seventyseven

Stopping by to say hello and facilitate a notifications test ;-)

Good luck with the recent change to liquid. 

Best wishes for peace and healing,

A.

[Altostrata]

6 hours ago, seventyseven said:

And it is complicated by the half life being so long. Its going to be hard to wait out two weeks of suspense. 

 

Yes, you may not be feeling the full effects of the switch to liquid yet. Best to wait out 2 weeks. If it feels like it's ramping up, please let us know.

[seventyseven]

It felt pretty stable and I have been on the .5 for 40 days or more. So I dropped today to .4. I just felt I had to get on the road. Let's see how it goes. 

[seventyseven]

13 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

Yes, you may not be feeling the full effects of the switch to liquid yet. Best to wait out 2 weeks. If it feels like it's ramping up, please let us know.

Hm. Maybe I'll wait. I wish there were more liquid abilify taperers out there. 

[seventyseven]

I am getting on the road with this today after 6 days on liquid. I can't see how I'm going to be more stable while on the med itself. It's that the side effects are bugging me and I feel like I need to begin the process of addressing it. So I went from .5 mg to .4 today.  I don't know if I can tell the difference between side effects, w/d effects and my own states of mind.

[Altostrata]

On 6/17/2022 at 4:13 PM, Altostrata said:

If you would like staff assistance, please continue to post daily notes.

 

[seventyseven]

It's been 5 days. It was OK for a while. Digestive symptoms may be returning. I am looking at maybe a 3 week period before a drop. I'll have to see. 

 

I am "following" this thread but I don't think I get notices.