LegoLisa: Pristiq and Buspar

[LegoLisa]

Hi 

I'm brand new.  I was on 40mg Celexa for years and years.  Summer of 2020 it started losing effectiveness.  In 2021 my GP tapered me off it in about an 8 month taper. After I went off it I had a nervous breakdown in November.  Couldn't work or function.  Went on disability and into intensive outpatient therapy for 3 months and was in psychiatric hospital for 3 days.  Separated from my husband for 6 months.  

 

When I started IOP right away they wanted to put me on SSRIs again.  I went thru Lexapro and Effexor with bad side effects.  After I got out of IOP I was desperate for relief because I was depressed, anxious and trying to get back with my husband.  My current Dr started me on Pristiq and Buspar around March.  After getting to 150 mg I thought I was going to get better. 3 weeks ago I had a meltdown. I woke up and couldn't get out of bed because I was in extreme physical pain.  Mentally I was a wreck.  Racked with guilt.  My husband and I reunited in June and we moved to be closer to my family which I know was a tough move for him because it's 3 hours from his dad and he retired from his job.  The guilt over separating from him and him moving for me debilitated me.  Even though I know rationally that I shouldn't feel bad.  I started researching Pristiq and then I found this group thru a Facebook group.  

 

I immediately asked my Dr to taper me and I've been going down 25 mg every 5 days. I'm at 50 now and I feel like I'm losing my mind. I'm in physical pain in the morning.  Anxiety is up and down all day. Everything seems to trigger panic.  I feel like I'm garbage.  I feel like my husband would be better off if he left me.  Scary thing is this is exactly how I felt when I tapered off the Celexa in November 2021.  I'm going in circles.  I want off this merry go round.

 

My Dr slowed my taper today and I'll be on 50mg for 3 more weeks and I'm changing psychiatrists.

 

But I'm trying to make it thru the irrational thoughts, constant panic and physical pain.  My husband is worried about me.  My family is worried.  Life is good but I'm miserable.  And it's hard to explain to people who don't understand.  So I'm also trying to get it under control so I can enjoy life and so I don't worry my loved ones.

 

The only relief I get is evenings when I have a window and thankfully can sleep.  But I feel like my brain is betraying me.  I'll get quick glimpses of feeling better during the day and I get smacked down by panic and crazy thoughts.  

 

Please help 😞

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @LegoLisa

 

What is IOP?

 

While we unravel this, please stop tapering Pristiq, you've been tapering too fast and you have severe withdrawal symptoms.

 

To help us out, follow these instructions Please summarize your drug and withdrawal history in your signature You may need to use a computer to do thi

[LegoLisa]

Hi thanks for answering.  IOP is Intensive Outpatient Program at the hospital.  I started seeing a new Dr who slowed my taper down and stopped the Prozac.

[Altostrata]

150mg Pristiq is an excessive dose. You might have had serotonin toxicity at that dose.

 

As you're under a doctor's care, how may we assist you?

 

This is important:

 

On 9/26/2022 at 4:47 PM, Altostrata said:

Please summarize your drug and withdrawal history in your signature You may need to use a computer to do this

 

[LegoLisa]

How do I get thru the tapering process?  I'm a wreck. I'm up and down and I can't function.  It's affecting my husband and he's sinking into a depression.  I try to tell myself it's the meds and do all the coping skills my therapist gives me but some days I can't get out of bed.  I can't eat.  I cry a lot.  I'm in physical pain. I feel like my mind is not my own. I don't see an end to this and I'm really scared 

[Altostrata]

@LegoLisa how long have you been taking 50mg this time around?

 

Before further discussion, Please summarize your drug and withdrawal history in your signature

[LegoLisa]

I started 50 mg about 2 weeks ago.  Continuing on it until my next check in with my psychiatrist.

[FindRest]

That is a huge dose of Pristiq. Clinical studies have shown that doses above 50mg were no more effective than the 50mg dose. 
 

https://www.drugs.com/dosage/pristiq.html

 

The problems you’ve been having since your quick taper off Celexa, remind me of what I went through when doctors took me off Effexor too fast. Trying to stabilize me by adding a new AD only backfired, as my body was too sensitized and every new med they tried only created additional terrible symptoms. I see your doctor tapered the Celexa for 7-8 months. That may seem like a slow taper, but a safe taper takes much longer than that.

 

I’m glad you realize that what you are going through is drug related and not a result of some underlying mental disorder. Your doctors should be ashamed of themselves. 

 

You will get through this. The hardest part for me was worrying that I will always feel this way or that the terrible thoughts would never go away. They do. The key for me was to follow the advice given here and to give it time. A lot of time. Keeping a daily list of symptoms and the time of day I was having them, helped me to pinpoint problems and to also see progress. 
 

BTW, you refer to Prozac above. Did you mean Buspar? It’s important to include this in your signature along with any other medications or supplements you are taking.

 

I’m sorry you are going through this. 
 

 

Edited September 30, 2022 by FindRest

[LegoLisa]

Thanks for your post. I was on 10 mg of Prozac at the beginning of my Pristiq taper but my new Dr took me off.  I'll add the buspar. Thanks

[LegoLisa]

5 hours ago, FindRest said:

That is a huge dose of Pristiq. Clinical studies have shown that doses above 50mg were no more effective than the 50mg dose. 
 

https://www.drugs.com/dosage/pristiq.html

 

The problems you’ve been having since your quick taper off Celexa, remind me of what I went through when doctors took me off Effexor too fast. Trying to stabilize me by adding a new AD only backfired, as my body was too sensitized and every new med they tried only created additional terrible symptoms. I see your doctor tapered the Celexa for 7-8 months. That may seem like a slow taper, but a safe taper takes much longer than that.

 

I’m glad you realize that what you are going through is drug related and not a result of some underlying mental disorder. Your doctors should be ashamed of themselves. 

 

You will get through this. The hardest part for me was worrying that I will always feel this way or that the terrible thoughts would never go away. They do. The key for me was to follow the advice given here and to give it time. A lot of time. Keeping a daily list of symptoms and the time of day I was having them, helped me to pinpoint problems and to also see progress. 
 

BTW, you refer to Prozac above. Did you mean Buspar? It’s important to include this in your signature along with any other medications or supplements you are taking.

 

I’m sorry you are going through this. 
 

 

The worst part is doctors just want to keep putting you on different meds.  Everyone thinks it's a mental disorder not withdrawal.  I do have anxiety and depression but this is really bad.  

[ChessieCat]

10 hours ago, LegoLisa said:

Thanks for your post. I was on 10 mg of Prozac at the beginning of my Pristiq taper but my new Dr took me off.  I'll add the buspar. Thanks

 

Please add the Prozac with dates and doses to your drug signature.  We need to see your drug history at a glance, which means all drugs.  Thank you.

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

[LegoLisa]

Ok done

[ChessieCat]

Please add dates/date range for all of your drugs/doses where possible.  If you stopped a drug please add the date of the last dose and the last dose you took.  This is because there can be a huge difference between 1st of the month and last day of the month.  Thank you.

[LegoLisa]

I was reading that taking Pristiq and Buspar together is dangerous. My Dr has me on 15 mg buspar twice a day while I taper Pristiq.  Honestly I would forget a lot in the morning to take it because I take my meds at night.  Last night I didn't take my night dose. I know I shouldn't mess with it but I researched buspar and found that it doesn't need to be tapered. And I woke up today with reduced anxiety and the intrusive thoughts are reduced a lot and more manageable.  I don't know if it's coincidence or not. Probably.  I also don't work today so that could be part of it. I have an interview Tuesday.  Just wanted to update.  And get opinions. ❤️❤️❤️

[FindRest]

2 hours ago, LegoLisa said:

Last night I didn't take my night dose. I know I shouldn't mess with it but I researched buspar and found that it doesn't need to be tapered.

As you and I have previously discussed, suddenly stopping Buspar (or any psychiatric drug that has been taken for some time) is not a good idea. Doing things such as this often causes members much regret. Sometimes, there is a brief period where things seem to get better only to have it backfire in a big way days or weeks later. One thing I have learned on this journey is that it is extremely important to seek out answers here BEFORE making any drastic changes. 

 

I’m not sure where you saw that Buspar didn’t need to be tapered. It most definitely does. Here’s a link to SA’s info on how to taper it:

 

Another important reason for not changing your medication at this point (much less a CT), is that when symptoms arise or worsen within the next days, weeks, or months, there will be no way to know whether or not it’s coming from the Pristiq or the Buspar CT. This makes it much more difficult for the moderators to help you. 
 

It can be easy to want to make drastic decisions during this process when all we want to do is get some relief.  Unfortunately, such decisions often backfire.
 

I’d wait until you hear back from a moderator or @Altostrata as to what to do next. I’m thinking you may want to go back to taking the Buspar since you’ve only missed one or two doses. But, wait to hear from one of them before doing anything.

 

 

[ChessieCat]

3 hours ago, LegoLisa said:

I researched buspar and found that it doesn't need to be tapered.

 

It's a psychiatric drug and therefore the brain adapts to getting the drug and if reduced/stopped too quickly may cause withdrawal symptoms.  It can take as little as 4 weeks for the brain to fully adapt to getting a psychiatric drug:

 

tips-for-tapering-off-buspirone-buspar

 

 

[LegoLisa]

48 minutes ago, FindRest said:

As you and I have previously discussed, suddenly stopping Buspar (or any psychiatric drug that has been taken for some time) is not a good idea. Doing things such as this often causes members much regret. Sometimes, there is a brief period where things seem to get better only to have it backfire in a big way days or weeks later. One thing I have learned on this journey is that it is extremely important to seek out answers here BEFORE making any drastic changes. 

 

I’m not sure where you saw that Buspar didn’t need to be tapered. It most definitely does. Here’s a link to SA’s info on how to taper it:

 

Another important reason for not changing your medication at this point (much less a CT), is that when symptoms arise or worsen within the next days, weeks, or months, there will be no way to know whether or not it’s coming from the Pristiq or the Buspar CT. This makes it much more difficult for the moderators to help you. 
 

It can be easy to want to make drastic decisions during this process when all we want to do is get some relief.  Unfortunately, such decisions often backfire.
 

I’d wait until you hear back from a moderator or @Altostrata as to what to do next. I’m thinking you may want to go back to taking the Buspar since you’ve only missed one or two doses. But, wait to hear from one of them before doing anything.

 

 

I'll take it tonight. I'm not going to mess with it. Hopefully my Dr will take me off it as well. Thanks for your guidance.❤️

[ChessieCat]

2 minutes ago, LegoLisa said:

Hopefully my Dr will take me off it as well.

 

You don't need your doctor's permission to come off it.  What you take does not affect them.  They are taught to prescribe, not get people off their drug/s.  It is up to you to advocate for yourself and do your own research about what a doctor suggests.  Remember they are human too and even though they know a lot of different things because they have done some study, just like anyone they cannot know everything and they get their information of psychiatric drugs from the pharmaceutical companies.

 

I suggest you have a read of this topic before you see your doctor.

 

how-to-talk-to-a-doctor-about-tapering-and-withdrawal-what-to-expect

 

I wrote this to another member so it is not tailored to your situation but much of it is relevant.

 

Please be careful about the way you talk with the doctor.  Remember that you need to keep a good relationship with him so that you can continue getting your prescription.  Use words like "I would prefer" not "I want to".  If he suggests a different drug you could say "I have thought about it but I would prefer to stay on the drug I am on" not "NO I want to stay on this drug".

 

I hope you can see the difference in how I have worded these comments.  It is very subtle but if you can talk to him in a way that doesn't make him think that you think you know everything it will make a big difference.  Talk with him calmly and respectfully but be assertive.  You can be assertive without being forceful.  You just need to be careful what words you use.

 

Another way of explaining it to him is instead of saying you want to get off your drug, say I would like to be on lowest dose.

[LegoLisa]

My Dr already understands I want to come off everything. I think she didn't want to shock my system by taking me off the buspar and Pristiq together.  But I got scared when I read how they interact.  She knows my goal is to be off everything.  Even she agreed my previous doctor made a huge mistake putting me on such a high dose of Pristiq.  She was actually annoyed.  So she's on my side and understands my feelings.  I plan to taper off the buspar too.  I'm done with meds all together.

[LegoLisa]

7 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

 

You don't need your doctor's permission to come off it.  What you take does not affect them.  They are taught to prescribe, not get people off their drug/s.  It is up to you to advocate for yourself and do your own research about what a doctor suggests.  Remember they are human too and even though they know a lot of different things because they have done some study, just like anyone they cannot know everything and they get their information of psychiatric drugs from the pharmaceutical companies.

 

I suggest you have a read of this topic before you see your doctor.

 

how-to-talk-to-a-doctor-about-tapering-and-withdrawal-what-to-expect

 

I wrote this to another member so it is not tailored to your situation but much of it is relevant.

 

Please be careful about the way you talk with the doctor.  Remember that you need to keep a good relationship with him so that you can continue getting your prescription.  Use words like "I would prefer" not "I want to".  If he suggests a different drug you could say "I have thought about it but I would prefer to stay on the drug I am on" not "NO I want to stay on this drug".

 

I hope you can see the difference in how I have worded these comments.  It is very subtle but if you can talk to him in a way that doesn't make him think that you think you know everything it will make a big difference.  Talk with him calmly and respectfully but be assertive.  You can be assertive without being forceful.  You just need to be careful what words you use.

 

Another way of explaining it to him is instead of saying you want to get off your drug, say I would like to be on lowest dose.

I also found an article written about people like us and the terms we use about withdrawal. I learned never to use words like "windows' or "waves" with doctors.  I'm watching what I say.  I really appreciate you and this forum.  I was losing hope til I was directed here. 💕

 

[Altostrata]

How do you feel since you stopped Prozac on September 23, @LegoLisa?

 

What exactly are you taking now, at what times o'clock and dosages?

[LegoLisa]

22 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

How do you feel since you stopped Prozac on September 23, @LegoLisa?

 

What exactly are you taking now, at what times o'clock and dosages?

Right now before bed time I take 50mg of Pristiq and 15 mg of buspar.  I was up and down after I stopped the Prozac. Yesterday I had a full day long window. Woke up with hardly any anxiety. Day was great. Got home from outing with my husband and my dad started with drama and today I'm back down low again.

[Altostrata]

Does Pristiq make you sleepy? Did you always take it at night? What is your sleep pattern?

[LegoLisa]

18 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

Does Pristiq make you sleepy? Did you always take it at night? What is your sleep pattern?

No sleepiness. I've always taken it at night.  My sleep pattern varies I guess.  I usually go to bed around 10 or 11.  Sometimes I fell asleep within a hour. Some nights it takes longer. I wake up at 745 for work and sleep later on weekends depending on plans.  I do have night terrors periodically.  My GP thinks I have sleep apnea and supposed to do a sleep study in November. She thinks that it's contributing to my morning anxiety.

[Altostrata]

It's possible the Pristiq you take at night is contributing to your morning anxiety, since it takes about 8 hours to reach peak plasma. You may be having an adverse reaction at this time.

 

Suggest you gradually move Pristiq earlier by an hour each day until you are taking it at noon. While you do this, pleas keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show if your symptoms are adverse effects from one of your drugs.

[LegoLisa]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

It's possible the Pristiq you take at night is contributing to your morning anxiety, since it takes about 8 hours to reach peak plasma. You may be having an adverse reaction at this time.

 

Suggest you gradually move Pristiq earlier by an hour each day until you are taking it at noon. While you do this, pleas keep daily notes of times o’clock you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need to know how you feel before and after taking each drug, and your symptoms in between. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time o’clock on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right. This can show if your symptoms are adverse effects from one of your drugs.

I will start the list.  How do you recommend I deal with outside stress?  My job is toxic and now I have family drama creeping in.  I had a great day yesterday but the family drama caused a crash today.  How do I heal with all this chaos around me?

[Altostrata]

We're just peer counselors and we cannot provide an answer or therapy for that.

 

Changing your job or job responsibilities might be what you want to do, but your family is another thing. You may want to ask in the Relationships and Social Life forum and see what the community might advise.

[LegoLisa]

Log

 

10/2/22 - 8pm 50mg Pristiq/15mg Buspar

10/3/22 woke up 745 am to pain in joints and tiredness.  Having trouble working. Can't concentrate. Eyesight blurry.  Some crying and panic around 100pm.

 

[ChessieCat]

Alto needs more details that you have provided.

 

What we need to see for every single day over several days is what symptoms you get before and after you take your drugs.

 

Example:

DATE:

 

6 a.m. Woke with anxiety
8 a.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
10 a.m. Stomach is upset
10:30 a.m. Ate breakfast
11:35 a.m. Got a headache, lasted one hour
12:35 p.m. Ate lunch
4 p.m. Feel a bit better
5 p.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
6 p.m. Ate dinner
9:20 p.m. Headache
10:00 p.m. Took 50mg Seroquel
10:20 p.m. Feeling dizzy
10:30 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. Woke, took 3mg Ambien (NOT "took 1/2 tablet Ambien")
2:45 a.m. Fell asleep
4:30 a.m. Woke but got back to sleep

 

Edited October 3, 2022 by ChessieCat

[LegoLisa]

Log

 

10/2/22 -

11am - woke up with anxiety

100pm - cried for an hour

500pm - crying again

800pm -  50mg Pristiq/15mg Buspar

 

10/3/22 

745am - woke to pain in joints and tiredness.  Having trouble working. Can't concentrate. Eyesight blurry.  

100pm - crying and panic.

 

Will update tonight

 

[LegoLisa]

10/3/22

7pm - 50mg Pristiq/15mg Buspar

740pm - watching tv and so far no symptoms

[ChessieCat]

On 10/3/2022 at 7:27 AM, Altostrata said:

Post 24 hours of notes at a time in

 

[LegoLisa]

10/2/22 -

11am - woke up with anxiety

100pm - cried for an hour

500pm - crying again

800pm -  50mg Pristiq/15mg Buspar

 

10/3/22 

745am - woke to pain in joints and tiredness.  Having trouble working. Can't concentrate. Eyesight blurry.  

100pm - crying and panic.

7pm - 50mg Pristiq/15mg Buspar

740pm - watching tv and so far no symptoms

[Altostrata]

How do you feel before and after taking 50mg Pristiq and 15mg Buspar at 8 p.m., @LegoLisa

 

Why are you taking these 2 drugs together at the same time? When did you stop taking Buspar twice a day?

[LegoLisa]

I felt about the same before and after.  I was prescribed by my Dr to take them that way. I stopped the buspar twice a day about a week ago.

[Altostrata]

3 minutes ago, LegoLisa said:

I stopped the buspar twice a day about a week ago.

 

How has your symptom pattern changed since you stopped one of your Buspar doses?