Apathy, anhedonia, emotional numbness, emotional anesthesia

[Hellbutrin]

3 hours ago, SunderedStar said:

Hello Hellbutrin,

 

The Anhedonia is usually the last of the symptoms of DPDR that leave. Recovery from DPDR can take a very long time. You're looking at months of years of recovery.

I'm okay with it taking a while to leave. My main concern is with it becoming permanent, I can't live in this state forever. Thanks for your reassurance. 

[Callie]

Sorry for my ignorance, but can someone tell me what DPDR is?

 

Thanks,

 

Callie

 

[Hellbutrin]

4 hours ago, Callie said:

Sorry for my ignorance, but can someone tell me what DPDR is?

 

Thanks,

 

Callie

 

Dp/DR is an alteration in the perception or experience of the external world so that it seems unreal. Other symptoms include feeling as though one's environment is lacking in spontaneity, emotional colouring, and depth. It is a dissociative symptom of many conditions.

[Callie]

Thank you very much for the explanation, Hellbutrin.

 

Callie

[Terry4949]

Now I am 10 months of all meds I have hit the anhendonia stage and the apathy is worse than the depression I feel it in my stomach I can’t find any enjoyment no interest in anything from things I love to do to even going and seeing my beloved dad , it’s so awfull it makes me want to give up when it’s at it’s worse as it comes in strong waves I really would rather be dead than feel this apathy this feeling is worse than the depression , how do we live does it lift and how long does it last , I spoke to my doctor and he wanted to put me on lithium to help alleviate this feeling as he is worried that suicidal thoughts need addressing, he said to me that more people take their own lives because of the feeling of emptiness than depression and I can see why . But I refused the med , I think I need some reassurance has anyone had this and beat it 

 

[Petunia]

Yes, I have been through this stage and it passed. I agree it can feel like the worst experience imaginable. Mine came in waves too, so it wasn't constant 24/7. Like everything else, its impossible to predict how long it will last for you, but it will pass. Knowing that it was temporary is what helped me get through it. If you google 'survivingantidepressants.org' and the topic you are interested in, you will often find we already have a thread with lots of comments and discussion, please post in existing topics, it helps keep all the information together in one easily searchable place.

[Offforgood]

On 9/19/2017 at 10:04 AM, Offforgood said:

I think my anhedonia which I have had for the last few years while on meds.. Zoloft 200 mg, olanzipine 5mg and effexor X-rays 450 mg and continue unchanged since I stopped taking all meds in July... I guess I was taken off Zoloft and olanzipine too fast Zoloft in a month taper and olanzipine in a few days.. on psychiatric advice..did I thought slow taper of effexor X-rays over 6 months 50% decrease each month..now am experiencing withdrawals two months later but predominant lack of motivation still persists.  

I think this anhedonia is a result of taking antidepressants for 28 years.. I believe the meds created this symptom when I read this article....

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989833/

 

 

I thought I was getting better but think I stopped am going backwards ..

[Gridley]

Anhedonia and lack of motivation can also be symptoms of withdrawal.

[Hellbutrin]

On 1/10/2018 at 2:57 PM, Petunia said:

Yes, I have been through this stage and it passed. I agree it can feel like the worst experience imaginable. Mine came in waves too, so it wasn't constant 24/7. Like everything else, its impossible to predict how long it will last for you, but it will pass. Knowing that it was temporary is what helped me get through it. If you google 'survivingantidepressants.org' and the topic you are interested in, you will often find we already have a thread with lots of comments and discussion, please post in existing topics, it helps keep all the information together in one easily searchable place.

I would be so encouraged if I saw even a slight bit of my emotion returning. But I am either in the pits of hell depression or not able to feel anything at all with no in between. I'm so scared that I'm stuck this way. I certainly can't live like this forever, and I'm not even sure that I can see going on like this for another year without any change. If I saw a glimpse of return then I might be able to power through, but if I'm stuck like this then I don't see the point. 

Edited July 23, 2019 by Altostrata
delete outdated link

[Offforgood]

I so agree with you.. I could have written this post myself.  What is the point? Maybe I just don’t want to deal with life anymore.  I just need a sign a glimpse of joy in life.

[Hellbutrin]

2 minutes ago, Offforgood said:

I so agree with you.. I could have written this post myself.  What is the point? Maybe I just don’t want to deal with life anymore.  I just need a sign a glimpse of joy in life.

Yeah, I agree completely. Feeling like there's no reason to go through this suffering makes it hard to climb out of the depressive states for sure. 

[Petunia]

6 minutes ago, Hellbutrin said:

I'm so scared that I'm stuck this way. I certainly can't live like this forever, and I'm not even sure that I can see going on like this for another year without any change. If I saw a glimpse of return then I might be able to power through, but if I'm stuck like this then I don't see the point. 

 

I think we have all had similar feelings when going through the worst of it. For me, the thought I would never get better and that I would be stuck like this was one of those things I had to get very good at ignoring. The added anxiety it caused wasn't helpful and I knew, from everything I read that it wasn't true anyway.  I was going to get better, even if it didn't feel like it at the time.

 

I remember the first time I heard myself laugh, after having not found anything funny for a very long time. It was a shock actually and such a relief. I thought I had lost my sense of humor for ever. You just need to hang in there and know your normal emotions are going to return when they are ready. This is temporary. Don't think in terms of the next year, that's too overwhelming. You don't know what's going to happen in a year. Focus on getting through each day. Each day you get through is one step closer to being healed.

[Offforgood]

1 hour ago, Petunia said:

 

I think we have all had similar feelings when going through the worst of it. For me, the thought I would never get better and that I would be stuck like this was one of those things I had to get very good at ignoring. The added anxiety it caused wasn't helpful and I knew, from everything I read that it wasn't true anyway.  I was going to get better, even if it didn't feel like it at the time.

 

I remember the first time I heard myself laugh, after having not found anything funny for a very long time. It was a shock actually and such a relief. I thought I had lost my sense of humor for ever. You just need to hang in there and know your normal emotions are going to return when they are ready. This is temporary. Don't think in terms of the next year, that's too overwhelming. You don't know what's going to happen in a year. Focus on getting through each day. Each day you get through is one step closer to being healed.

i have had one day of feeling great since i stopped taking meds on july 22, 2017--i know i was on meds for 28 years and in massive doses and i took EVERY med out there and to this day, i am angry that i followed my psych doc so blindly but i think that is one of my issues that i let a bad situation go on too long and i am struggling with that issue in therapy--i am at my 5 1/2 month point of ending all meds and i have read that sometimes at the 5.6.and or 7 month stretch the withdrawal symptoms get worse or come back or whatever-- and i have also read that they may reappear after a year off-- i just cant handle this prognosis--maybe i should stop reading the posts on these sites because i seem to get more discouraged-- i am back to total apathy and not caring about doing anything when i thought i was slowly coming out of it this past December--then bam!  i want to enjoy life again, i wan to look forward to things, i want to look forward but whatever is happening to me makes me stuck in this quagmire of negativity and past hurts, insults and betrayals-- i wonder since i lived so long this way whether i am just used to this way of thinking and i dont know how to think anything else-- i dont need to be deleriously happy but i would like to be content-- and go with the flow at least-- 

[Offforgood]

Just now, Offforgood said:

i have had one day of feeling great since i stopped taking meds on july 22, 2017--i know i was on meds for 28 years and in massive doses and i took EVERY med out there and to this day, i am angry that i followed my psych doc so blindly but i think that is one of my issues that i let a bad situation go on too long and i am struggling with that issue in therapy--i am at my 5 1/2 month point of ending all meds and i have read that sometimes at the 5.6.and or 7 month stretch the withdrawal symptoms get worse or come back or whatever-- and i have also read that they may reappear after a year off-- i just cant handle this prognosis--maybe i should stop reading the posts on these sites because i seem to get more discouraged-- i am back to total apathy and not caring about doing anything when i thought i was slowly coming out of it this past December--then bam!  i want to enjoy life again, i wan to look forward to things, i want to look forward but whatever is happening to me makes me stuck in this quagmire of negativity and past hurts, insults and betrayals-- i wonder since i lived so long this way whether i am just used to this way of thinking and i dont know how to think anything else-- i dont need to be deleriously happy but i would like to be content-- and go with the flow at least-- 

i admire the people who can not  just say get through each day but can actually do it--i guess i am doing it since i am still here but i feel confused unfocused and sometimes just plain scared of life 

[Terry4949]

12 hours ago, Offforgood said:

i admire the people who can not  just say get through each day but can actually do it--i guess i am doing it since i am still here but i feel confused unfocused and sometimes just plain scared of life 

Offforgood this is me to a tee , at 6 months I had such a bad wave of depression and again at 8 months now I have hit 10 months the wave is so bad some days severe depression but the apathy and anhendonia is the worst even on the less depressive days I feel so empty of life no joy no motivation this is when I am at my suicidel worst because I can’t even feel any hope of getting better , even if I read recovery stories try and do anything to distract my mind that awfull emptiness is there to me that’s why suicide is all ways prominent because who wants to live their life like that, it’s the end of life and trying to find a reason to keep going makes it worse as you feel like you have failed I don’t know how long this lasts I have read of people suffering for years there are no cures so it does begger the question is it all worth it , if I won a million pound tomorrow it would make me feel no different , I just wander through the days praying for a miracle that doesn’t come 

[Hellbutrin]

On 6/8/2011 at 10:35 AM, Druid said:

Great question NP...

 

I can strongly relate to everything You wrote Punar great post.. I'm so sorry to hear that You have to experience this horrible and inhumane condition too i send all hope to You that this will resolve for You very soon.

 

I guess our feelings are the essence of the human experience and most of life revolves around how we "feel" about something. So for me Anhedonia has a profound effect on my whole life on so many levels. Punar I struggle to interact with other people and life in general too because of this symptom. I often recluse and isolate because i struggle to relate. It's like a depression but not depression in that nothing i can do seems to impact it in any way. It's like the ultimate chemically induced depression.

 

It even seems to make any decision making almost impossible, from hundreds of small decisions that we make almost subconsciously every day to larger more obvious ones. It's like when we make a decision we imagine say two or more possible paths or choices we might take.. we think about each separate scenario of action and consequence and then try to imagine how we feel about each outcome and therefore decide based on this information.. but how are we supposed to differentiate without having our feelings to guide us?.. I know there are many other variables that we take into account in this process but for me personally it's my feelings that have always been the stronger and most prominent guide..

 

Anhedonia seems to effect my memory too. Because i feel numbed in real time/ present.. and can't access my feelings i also lose the clarity and vividness of memories, because i cant access my feelings from past experiences either, because it would seem that memories are not just pictures we recall but when we hear an old song or have a memory triggered etc and it takes us back to a certain time or place or person, there is such a strong feeling accompanying this experience to complete it.. this feeling is often missing and i can only glance that distant memory for a fleeting moment unable to hold onto that moment and memory that is rightfully mine.. As a consequence to this I feel like a lot of my life and experiences even before these drugs has been stolen from me.

 

I feel like an observer of my own life rather than participating and living in the moment as i once did.

In a cruel irony negative emotions seem to be intensified. I do have very brief respite from time to time when i am able to glimpse my former passion and self for one beautiful bitter sweet moment only to lose myself again seconds later. I pray that these precious moments are windows that i am allowed to look through and glance a little into how i will feel in the future, when more healing has taken place..

 

Motivation is a fickle friend when as Punar explained so well, pleasure, reward and sense of accomplishment are missing, Apathy seems to conquer all to easily, and as a friend once pointed out to me, hate is not the opposite of love apathy is...

I'm struggling SO much with this. I know that you wrote this post a LONG time ago, but please tell me if it gets better. 

[Hellbutrin]

On 12/29/2017 at 2:47 PM, brassmonkey said:

You can't fight against it.  This is a drug induced sensation that we have no control over.  Trying to fight it or over come it just burns a lot of energy and causes a huge amount of frustration and anxiety because it doesn't help anything.  The emotions, feelings of joy, happiness, love and excitement as well as creativity, ambition and a whole lot more are being chemically suppressed and for the time being are just not accessible. Acceptance of the situation is the best path to follow.  As you reduce your dose further and your body has a chance to heal your emotions and all will slowly start to come back, but it does take a lot of time.  As I mentioned in the post you quoted, at the time I was off all drugs for five months I was still having some trouble with lack of feelings.  I am now rapidly approaching 10 months off and still am having the occasional bout with it. But things are so much better than they were when I was still tapering.

 

One thing I did learn was to look for and cherish all the little moments of joy.  They actually are popping up all the time, but are very fleeting and easily overlooked.  When you look at a flower, instead of thinking "darn, I can't enjoy this flower", watch for the momentary little flash of joy that that flower brings when you first see it, and acknowledge it when it happens.  Stop and try to see the beauty in things, even if you don't feel it. "Wow, the sun on those clouds is really pretty, one day soon I will feel it again".  Stop and recognize the joy/wonder in the scene, but let your body react in it's own manner.  This exercise will help reestablish the neural pathways and little by little dig out and strengthen the feelings.

 

Like the rest of ADWD it is a tortuously long slow process that can be very frustrating, but in the end is so worth all the effort. 

Should I worry that I C/T 6 months ago and I haven't had even a glimpse of my emotions returning since then?

[Hellbutrin]

On 1/15/2018 at 9:41 AM, Terry4949 said:

Offforgood this is me to a tee , at 6 months I had such a bad wave of depression and again at 8 months now I have hit 10 months the wave is so bad some days severe depression but the apathy and anhendonia is the worst even on the less depressive days I feel so empty of life no joy no motivation this is when I am at my suicidel worst because I can’t even feel any hope of getting better , even if I read recovery stories try and do anything to distract my mind that awfull emptiness is there to me that’s why suicide is all ways prominent because who wants to live their life like that, it’s the end of life and trying to find a reason to keep going makes it worse as you feel like you have failed I don’t know how long this lasts I have read of people suffering for years there are no cures so it does begger the question is it all worth it , if I won a million pound tomorrow it would make me feel no different , I just wander through the days praying for a miracle that doesn’t come 

Hey Terry, how are you feeing? Have you noticed any of your emotions starting to return yet?

[Hellbutrin]

On 1/14/2018 at 8:11 PM, Offforgood said:

i have had one day of feeling great since i stopped taking meds on july 22, 2017--i know i was on meds for 28 years and in massive doses and i took EVERY med out there and to this day, i am angry that i followed my psych doc so blindly but i think that is one of my issues that i let a bad situation go on too long and i am struggling with that issue in therapy--i am at my 5 1/2 month point of ending all meds and i have read that sometimes at the 5.6.and or 7 month stretch the withdrawal symptoms get worse or come back or whatever-- and i have also read that they may reappear after a year off-- i just cant handle this prognosis--maybe i should stop reading the posts on these sites because i seem to get more discouraged-- i am back to total apathy and not caring about doing anything when i thought i was slowly coming out of it this past December--then bam!  i want to enjoy life again, i wan to look forward to things, i want to look forward but whatever is happening to me makes me stuck in this quagmire of negativity and past hurts, insults and betrayals-- i wonder since i lived so long this way whether i am just used to this way of thinking and i dont know how to think anything else-- i dont need to be deleriously happy but i would like to be content-- and go with the flow at least-- 

Did your anhedonia eventually totally recover?

[Hellbutrin]

On 1/14/2018 at 11:50 AM, Gridley said:

Anhedonia and lack of motivation can also be symptoms of withdrawal.

But do they repair themselves eventually? I read somewhere that dopamine receptors are usually permanently damaged without the ability to regenerate. I hope that this is not the case, because i took wellbutrin and one of the main mechanisms for action works on dopamine receptors by down regulating them. Meaning that I could be stuck in this meaningless pit of emotional nothingness. It feels like everything is SO pointless. 

[brassmonkey]

Hi Hellbutrin --  to quote the last line of my post that you quoted above "it is a tortuously long slow process that can be very frustrating".  You appear to be doing quite well for being 6 months out from a CT.  Your emotions, passion and excitement for life are all still in there, and they will eventually start to show themselves, but you're going to have to be patient for a while longer.

[BrainDead]

I'm 11 months off of psych drugs. The anhedonia has been there for most of the time.Basically, I don't give a f*ck about anything..My mind just thinks "whatever..." when I think of doing anything meaningful. I Have no motivation to do anything. I've been dizzy the entire 11 months I've been off of the meds, so I mostly lay in bed unless I need to get water or a quick snack.

 

I can't shower because it's too exhausting. I can't prepare any meals because it's too tiring. Sometimes I have the energy to brush my teeth, usually when they start to hurt or something. 

 

I've been wanting to go to the doctor to find out why I feel dizzy all the time, but guess what? My mind just doesn't seem to care enough to go..

 

I've been wanting to go to the dentist because I'm 1000% sure I have infections in my mouth, but my mind can't seem to care enough to go.

 

Just recently I have been unable to swallow my food properly, and it feels like food gets stuck in my throat. Well, I just don't have enough f*cks in me to find out what's wrong.

 

It's like I'm brain dead..dazed all the time..wanting to feel better but literally incapable of taking the steps I need to take to get there.

 

This is how I've been feeling for 11 months. Apparently I'll be feeling like this for another decade, if not a lifetime..whatever f*ck it sh*t happens..sigh..

[Downbutnotout]

27 minutes ago, BrainDead said:

I'm 11 months off of psych drugs. The anhedonia has been there for most of the time.Basically, I don't give a f*ck about anything..My mind just thinks "whatever..." when I think of doing anything meaningful. I Have no motivation to do anything. I've been dizzy the entire 11 months I've been off of the meds, so I mostly lay in bed unless I need to get water or a quick snack.

 

I can't shower because it's too exhausting. I can't prepare any meals because it's too tiring. Sometimes I have the energy to brush my teeth, usually when they start to hurt or something. 

 

I've been wanting to go to the doctor to find out why I feel dizzy all the time, but guess what? My mind just doesn't seem to care enough to go..

 

I've been wanting to go to the dentist because I'm 1000% sure I have infections in my mouth, but my mind can't seem to care enough to go.

 

Just recently I have been unable to swallow my food properly, and it feels like food gets stuck in my throat. Well, I just don't have enough f*cks in me to find out what's wrong.

 

It's like I'm brain dead..dazed all the time..wanting to feel better but literally incapable of taking the steps I need to take to get there.

 

This is how I've been feeling for 11 months. Apparently I'll be feeling like this for another decade, if not a lifetime..whatever f*ck it sh*t happens..sigh..

This sounds bad. Maybe this is not working for you. It sounds life threatening. Maybe it’s time to try something else. 

[BrainDead]

1 hour ago, Downbutnotout said:

This sounds bad. Maybe this is not working for you. It sounds life threatening. Maybe it’s time to try something else. 

what should I try? 

[Downbutnotout]

I’m sorry. I don’t have an answer for you. I guess I shouldn’t have said anything. It gets to a point where we have to make decisions about what we think is best for ourselves. That’s the point I’m getting at too. Maybe go to the doctor to find out why your dizzy. Go to the dentist to fix your teeth. 

[brassmonkey]

Hi BrainDead-  You are going to get  lot better response to your questions if you ask them in your intro thread instead of one of these lesser visited threads.  That way we can have all your information together in one place and can get a better idea of what is going on.  Having your drug history listed in a signature block would be of real help too.  Oh, and by the way, this is a family site with a number of members who are minors so we ask everyone to be mindful of their language.

 

Brassmonkey

[Downbutnotout]

On 12/28/2017 at 3:51 PM, Downbutnotout said:

How did you fight against it? This is my main problem right now. 

 Think it came when I took lithium gir 10 days. But isn’t this part of depression? 

[Hellbutrin]

Hi all,

 

Are there any success reports of individuals who struggled specifically with anhedonia and recovered? I've searched but I haven't found any. All of the results that I've found when I've searched are pretty grim. 

[Hellbutrin]

I could use some feedback about this if any forum users have seen their anhedonia go away completely. If you have, what does the process for recovery look like? 

[Offforgood]

On 2/5/2018 at 3:54 PM, Hellbutrin said:

Did your anhedonia eventually totally recover?

No still struggling with it in my 7th month of no antidepressants.. still little joy in life and feel disassociated with life.. want to find joy and purpose in my life or what is the point?

[Hellbutrin]

On 2/14/2018 at 1:26 AM, Offforgood said:

No still struggling with it in my 7th month of no antidepressants.. still little joy in life and feel disassociated with life.. want to find joy and purpose in my life or what is the point?

Yes, I am also in month 7 and depression and anhedonia are the two symptoms that I primarily struggle with. Have you seen any fluctuation in your symptoms so far or have they just pretty much been a steady state of misery? I haven't had ONE solid window in all of this time. It's INCREDIBLE to me that the one thing that should never be able to be taken from us is our connection with ourselves and this condition completely ravages our self relationship. 

[SSRIamNot]

The news seems so bad - Why even freaking taper.  I don't have 20 years of my life to devote to being miserable.

[Downbutnotout]

22 minutes ago, SSRIamNot said:

The news seems so bad - Why even freaking taper.  I don't have 20 years of my life to devote to being miserable.

Some people on here have great success.

[SSRIamNot]

I guess it is human nature to only reach out when hurting.  It sure would be nice to hear more success stories.  It gets really discouraging.

 

 

[Downbutnotout]

You’re preaching to the choir. I’m wondering myself about how appropriate this whole thing is to me.

[Barbarannamated]

If at all possible, try to think of something you enjoyed PRIOR to being on drugs and see if that elicits any slight stirrings, even watching a video on YouTube.  My theory is that we are disconnected from feelings of pleasure we may have had while on the drugs.  

 

You will likely have mixed emotions if you can't physically get out of bed yet, but latch onto ANYTHING to enjoy again.  

 

I really do understand this and relate to all that's been shared.  It's torture.  

 

(My case is extremely complex)