joseantonio Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 (edited) For what I've read in this group, people don't believe here in "tolerance withdrawal" as a real phenomenom. I asked this question recently but maybe I was not clear, I'm on 2'8 mg of fluoxetine. Problems arrived when I tapered from 5 to 2,8. Before steady at 2,8 I made the mistake of taking 5mg fluoxetine every other day for a few weeks until I realized (thanks to this forum) I have to take the same dose every day. The point is I've been on 2,8 for the last six months and I don't feel well, even worse than when I first did the last reduction. Do I need to wait to stabilize or May it help me if resume my tapering according with 10% approach reduction? It seems I'm never going to stabilize at the current dose. Not sure if it's withdrawal or some psychiatric/psychological disorder. Also thinking of seeing a terapist. I'm also on seroquel 50. Edited March 14, 2023 by Gridley Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Gridley Posted March 14, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted March 14, 2023 Welcome to SA, joseantonio. Could you please edit your signature to include: --the start date, stop date, and dose of Diazepam and your taper rate of you tapered or if you stopped cold turkey --the start date of Seroquel --the start date of Fluoxetine, date and rates of your skipping doses taper, recent taper dates and rate, and current dose Here's the link to edit your signature: Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature. We do believe in tolerance withdrawal--also known as "poop out"--and recognize the difficulties it poses. See this post by one of our moderators, Brassmonkey, who successfully tapered out of poop out from Paxil. That's what it seems you're experiencing. Tolerance or "poop-out" or Tachyphylaxis - Symptoms and … There are only two ways out of tolerance withdrawal. You can increase the dose, but eventually you'll be faced with tolerance withdrawal again. That's the route psychiatrists would take. Or you can taper out of it. We're a site for getting off psychiatric drugs, and that would be what we'd recommend to you at this point. As you know, we recommend tapering by no more than 10% of your current dose every four weeks. Why taper by 10% of my dosage? This link is specifically about tapering fluoxetine, including how to get the nonstandard doses needed for a 10% taper. Tips for tapering off fluoxetine (Prozac) We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium (glycinate is a good form) and omega 3 (fish oil). Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system. Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) Add in one at a time and at a low dose in case you do experience problems. This is your introduction topic -- the place for you to ask questions, record symptoms, share your progress, and connect with other members of the SA community. I hope you’ll find the information in the SA forums helpful for your situation. I'm sorry that you are in the position that you need the information, but I am glad that you found us. Gridley Introduction Lexapro 20 mg since 2004. Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017. End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg Oct. 30, 2020 Jump to zero from 0.025mg. Current dose: 0.000mg 3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete. Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium End 2021 year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper. Taper is 95% complete. Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986. Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper. Current dose as of April 1: 6.8mg Taper is 91% complete. Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
joseantonio Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 Thanks for answering. I really apreciate it🙂 Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
joseantonio Posted March 20, 2023 Author Share Posted March 20, 2023 Hi everybody! I'll be glad if anybody wants to give me some feedback. For the last 6 months I've only had one obsesion related to one situation. When I get exposed to the situation I feel horrible and I can't sleep. When I'm out of that situation, I'm ok. I guess I'm in relapse and it's not withdrawal. I'm planing to see a therapist. Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted March 20, 2023 Administrator Share Posted March 20, 2023 Good idea, @joseantonio That does not sound like withdrawal. In terms of "relapse", if this is something that always bothered you, it appears it still bothers you, and drugs did not cure it. How are you doing with your taper? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
joseantonio Posted March 21, 2023 Author Share Posted March 21, 2023 Thanks for answering! For sure, drugs not cure and if they work it's only for the short time. I'm stuck with my taper at 2'8 mg of fluoxetine. I've been on this dose for the last 6 months. Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted March 30, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 30, 2023 Hi @joseantonio, there are well accepted psychological treatments for OCD. The most common is CBT with exposure therapy but it is hard and requires a lot of dedication. It may be difficult to stay with it if you are also struggling with withdrawal symptoms. However, I assume it can be modified. A good place to start is the book - "Needing to know for sure" - it explains the anxiety loop that is specific for OCD and where the brain gets stuck. I would look for clinics specialized in the treatment of OCD as most psychologist do not have a lot of experience with it. OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
joseantonio Posted March 30, 2023 Author Share Posted March 30, 2023 Thanks for your answer 🙂 Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
joseantonio Posted April 10, 2023 Author Share Posted April 10, 2023 I've been on 2'8 mg of fluoxetine for around 6 months and I've been getting worse and worse. Last monday, I've reinstated up to 5mg. I felt better the first two days after reinstatement, but keep feeling worse afterwards. I've had a videocall with Mark Horowitz last Wednesday and he advised me to stay at 5 mg and waiting for stabilization. He said I suffer from a neurochymical imbalance. Anyway, I feel worse than ever and desperate. Any advice? Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted April 10, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 10, 2023 @joseantonio, I've merged the topic you started in the Symptoms and Self Care section to your Intro topic - it is about you and it belongs here. Please review carefully the rules for posting in the Symptoms and Self Care section below: It takes unnecessary effort to clean up this forum. OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 10, 2023 Administrator Share Posted April 10, 2023 12 hours ago, joseantonio said: I felt better the first two days after reinstatement, but keep feeling worse afterwards. Please explain how you felt worse. 12 hours ago, joseantonio said: He said I suffer from a neurochymical imbalance. I think you misunderstood Dr. Horowitz. Did he not say the withdrawal symptoms occurred because your system was expecting the drug but did not get it? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
joseantonio Posted April 11, 2023 Author Share Posted April 11, 2023 I feel worse with more anxiety. And yes, Mark Horowitz meant I suffer from a neurochemical imbalance due to fluoxetine reduction, but also due to having stopped diazepan the year before after all my life taking it. Diazepam. Start date around 2004 (not sure). 5mg. Ocasionally more tham 5mg. I tapered very slowly from june 2020 to october 2021. I reduced 0.25 mg every two weeks. I hold at 2mg for some months. I slowed down at the end of the taper. Seroquel. I started at 12,5 mg on february 2019. Rapidly increase up to 50mg. Since then on 50mg. Fluoxetine. 40mg at April 2019. Several changes from 40 to 30, from 30 to 20, from 20 to 30 between April 2019 and March 2020. From 30 to 20 in septiembre 2020. Several switches again all along 2020 and 2021. From 20 to 10 in october 2021.(each time I lower due to activation as side effect and each time I upper due to arise of symptons). From 10 to 5 at the beginning of the summer 2022. 5mg every other day in september 2022. Since october at 2,8 mg. (Some dates are approximate, not sure). Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 11, 2023 Administrator Share Posted April 11, 2023 On 4/10/2023 at 2:23 AM, joseantonio said: Last monday, I've reinstated up to 5mg. I felt better the first two days after reinstatement, but keep feeling worse afterwards. 10 hours ago, joseantonio said: I feel worse with more anxiety. After you increased to 5mg, please explain more about the worsening. What time o'clock do you take 5mg fluoxetine, how do you feel before you take it, how do you feel after you take it? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now