Basildev - Tapering off SSRIs

[strawberry17]

Basildev are you holding down a job? if you are I think you would be justified in asking the doctor to sign you off for a few weeks so you can rest up and help you over this period.

[basildev]

Hey Strawb,

 

I work for myself so that's not an option.

 

Sorry for the drama queen antics everybody.

 

Yesterday was a wailing/teeth-gnashing day.

[abir]

You are definitely not a freak of nature... It has been a month and a half for me since reinstatement, and still only on a very good night I can sleep for a whole hour before waking up... Usually I sleep for a max of 30 minutes before waking up...

 

Now when I wake up, I have a little bit of a racing heart and a burning sensation in my chest... But when I was on a higher dose that was too much for me, I used to get those body jerks as I am falling asleep and they woke me up... I also got them when I went from 2.5 to 5 mg, but at that time I only got them for the first couple of nights.... So maybe wait a bit before you decide if the dose is too strong for you...

 

I hope your sleep improves soon so you could feel better

[basildev]

Thank you Abir.

 

I hope you feel better soon too:)

[Nikki]

Bd...

 

I am not sure if I mentioned this before (if I did just call me Mrs. Alzheimer) There is a product "Rescue Remedy" by Back Flowers. It's been around since the turn of the century.

 

You can google it. There were a few members of another site Seroxatmad that took it for anxiety and sleep. It did not work for me. It is safe to give to dogs.

 

I understand your reluctance to take a benzo. This product is natural.

 

There is Valarian Root and the Melatonin too.

 

I think Black Tart Cherry Liquid is for sleep. Magnesium?

 

Citalopram can be a stimulating drug and I have read about it affecting sleep.

 

This season I was in a sleep deficit. I understand how you feel.

[basildev]

Thanks Nikki,

 

I've tried them all- I'm hypersensitive to everything(:

[Narcissus]

Yesterday was a wailing/teeth-gnashing day.

Who knew withdrawal could be so biblical!

[basildev]

Okay so this is the plan:

 

The jerks are not letting up. I can't fall asleep with the jerks, no matter how hard I try to wait them out.

 

The only thing that settles them is 5mg valium. So I'm going to take 5mg valium for the time being.

 

I realise this will now add another drug to the mix and complicates things but I really feel I have no choice.

 

If and when I ever become stable on my 20mg dose of citalopram, then I will begin to taper valium. I will not taper citalopram in the forseeable future.

 

So the valium taper will be the next hurdle.

 

Seeing a doctor today, have cancelled most of my clients and am taking the next 2 weeks off.

[Jemima]

Yesterday was a wailing/teeth-gnashing day.

Who knew withdrawal could be so biblical!

 

LOL!!! But to be truly biblical, doesn't she have to tear her clothes, too?

 

Sorry to veer off topic. I just couldn't resist.

[basildev]

Hello everyone,

 

As if my latest wave wasn't enough to keep me busy, I've now gone and got myself into a spot of bother:

 

Somewhere between Monday and Wednesday this week I accidentally took double my dose (40 mg instead of 20mg). EEEK!!

 

The scary thing is, I do NOT remember doing it - but the pill packet says otherwise. I think it might have been Wednesday because towards the middle of the day I started to feel a little bit ill.

 

I'm absolutely sure the cause of my memory problem is due to taking 5mg valium the previous Thursday, Friday and Sunday. On Wednesday I also forgot to take my ipod out of the gym locker and I NEVER do that.

 

So here's the real question: Do I now have to wait weeks for the impact my transgression to subside?

 

How does that extra 20mg divide up into my bloodstream? Will it be 20 days before I get back to a steady state of 20mg again?

 

Any advice or theory is appreciated.

[Narcissus]

But to be truly biblical, doesn't she have to tear her clothes, too?

Oh, I'm sure she's already done that.

 

Basildev, I have also taken twice my dosage by accident since withdrawal started. My memory is **** during bad flare-ups and it can be hard to keep track of things. I was quite paranoid for several days afterward, but in the end I had the sense that I didn't really set myself back much, if at all. And that little anecdote is all I've got.

 

Sorry to hear about the jerks. Take the Valium if you must, you can deal with it later.

[basildev]

But to be truly biblical, doesn't she have to tear her clothes, too?

 

Oh, I'm sure she's already done that.

You guys know me too well!!

 

Actually narc the jerks have eased up a bit since Monday and I've been able to sleep every night since then so far. Not as well as I was sleeping before this flare-up but at least I've been able to FALL asleep, which was the biggest problem.

 

We'll see if it continues.

 

I'm determined to steer clear of valium - it's RANK.

[tezza]

Hi basil,

 

I'm sorry to learn about your struggles. I once took 3x my dose and only felt it for one day after, so hopefully, this won't set you back any.

 

I hope you feel better soon!

 

Hugs

[strawberry17]

Yes I've done this by mistake in the past, it was only one day and had no lasting impact at all.

[basildev]

cool!

 

Thanks guys xx

[Jemima]

Avoiding the Valium is a good decision, I think. Back in early withdrawal when I was taking Ativan fairly regularly my memory was just awful, particularly with regard to forgetting whether I'd taken a dose.

 

Is there any way you can get Melatonin? If I remember right, it's illegal to sell Melatonin in Australia, but ordering it by mail for your own use is all right. Not sure, though. I often take a milligram of sublingual Melatonin at bedtime and it knocks me out in minutes.

[basildev]

Hey Jemima,

 

thanks for your suggestion.

 

I've tried melatonin. You name it I've tried it.

 

Supplements are hit and miss with me - they might work one night and have no effect the next. Also I think melatonin makes me depressed the next day. Kind of like valium - whenever I take it, I have a meltdown the next day.

 

In any case the twitches have gotten better so I'm able to fall asleep. My sleep is still crap since the twitching episode began - but I AM sleeping. I'll never take that for granted again.

 

No more valium for me!

[Jemima]

No more hot yoga, either!

[Nikki]

HI BD...

 

Join the club, I have forgotten as well and taken a double dose. More than once. Memory issues for sure.

 

It always made me feel lousy for one day only like some of the others so try not to fret over it. It will pass sooner than you think.

 

Deciding to nothing is a carefully thought out decision. It is still taking action only in a way to protect yourself.

 

The lack of sleep is tremendous...so I totally understand the valium. We need sleep.

 

You are really listening to your body.....Bless your heart

[basildev]

No more hot yoga, either!

Not in a million years Jemima.

 

Deciding to nothing is a carefully thought out decision. It is still taking action only in a way to protect yourself.

 

The lack of sleep is tremendous...so I totally understand the valium. We need sleep.

Thank for your kind words Nikki xxx

[basildev]

Hi everyone,

 

Well it's been nearly 4 weeks since I stopped hot yoga.

 

About a week after that I accidentally took a double dose of my medication.

 

My symptoms tended to flare up every 5 days or so - hot flushes accompanied by high anxiety, hypnic jerks when falling asleep, muscle twitches

 

All of this was manageable without valium. On a bad night I'd still get 6 hours of (albeit broken) sleep. Last Saturday I got 9 hours.

 

This past Monday my symptoms flared up again, and this time it was incredibly difficult to fall asleep.

 

Last night it was impossible. At 3PM I relented and took a valium - this did nothing to calm my symptoms and I'm now facing the possibility of many nights without sleep.

 

Last week I gave up decaf coffee and wine. I used to have a couple of glasses of wine with dinner twice a week. I thought this would help things get better. I've never felt so awful in my life.

 

I have no idea where to go from here. I'm so acutely sensitive to everything that a change in dosage would only make things worse.

 

I've tried all the usual suspects for sleep, nothing works. Could I have develped an addiction to valium? My last dose was 22 days ago (5mg). Over the course of 3.5 months I've taken a total of 8 pills. (Not all in a row)

 

I'm at my wit's end and seriously considering turning myself over to the medical profession to help me.

 

I have no idea what to do next.

[strawberry17]

Basildev ((hugs)) I'm so sorry, I understand how desperate you feel. For what it's worth, I don't think you can have developed an addiction to valium (but I'm prepared to stand corrected by someone who knows more about benzos) but I wouldn't have thought that was the case with so few taken strung out over a long period. Your situation seems very similar to Mr Anxious right now.

 

What are you doing about work?

[basildev]

Hi Strawbs,

 

thanks for replying.

 

I'm allowing myself to see a couple of clients a day. Even though I'm dog tired quite frankly it helps to distract me from this awful situation. I took 2 weeks off and was ready to get back into it when this happened.

 

I'm wondering if cutting out alcohol triggered a wave. They say any changes in diet can do that.

 

Tonight I'm going to try some phenergan.

 

Strawbs, you've pulled a few all-nighters in your time - how do you cope with the incredibly lonely and anxious feelings that come with not getting ANY sleep?

 

How long can a person potentially go with no sleep at all?

[strawberry17]

I cope with great difficulty when it happens. I find the morning the hardest because of the anxiety and it seems like an endless day stretched ahead, and I just look forward to collapsing in bed at the end. Sometimes I haven't coped and had to go home and make the time up next day. I think I've been fortunate in that most times, I always catch up the next night. Strangely, distraction helps, talking to others and keeping busy takes my mind off fatigue.

What kind of work do you do?

[Narcissus]

I am very sorry to hear of your suffering Basildev.  I doubt you have become addicted to valium.  I worry a little when you say that you will not be able to sleep for the next few days that you may be making this more likely by expecting it.  This spell will pass and things will even out.  Hang in there, and remember that you aren't alone.  

 

[basildev]

What kind of work do you do?

 

I'm a hypnotherapist - I work from home. Ironic I know, since I'm having a really hard time with my negative thoughts.

 

I worry a little when you say that you will not be able to sleep for the next few days that you may be making this more likely by expecting it.

 

I know, I know Narc. But it's this negative thinking that is PART of the withdrawal flare-up. In the past when the flare-up passes, so too do the negative thoughts. It's just that I've NEVER had insomnia this bad before and I'l at a loss as to what I've done to cause this.

[Fizz]

If its any consolation, I've done loads of nights with zero sleep, or possibly an hour. Okay, you feel absolutely dreadful next day but you just muddle through it. I'm sure you will get some sleep tonight if last night was so bad, just take what you can get. I also had a rough one, less than 2 hours. Thinking of you and praying for you tonight. Hugs. Xxxxxxxxx

[basildev]

Thank you Fizz xx

[basildev]

Hello everyone!

 

It has been a very long time since I have posted. I wonder if some of my old friends are still here?

 

I apologize for dropping off the face of the Earth. I had a really hard time with this and coming on here every day made me a bit obsessive. I had to distance myself for a bit.

 

It has been close to three years since I crashed into withdrawal from Citalopram and had to updose back to 20mg. It took a very long time but I am close to 100% now. Sleeping well and no other symptoms to speak of. I haven't touched alcohol in 2.5 years (not even in cooking), my brain could not handle it. I will consider myself 'fully healed' if and when I am able to tolerate a glass of wine every now and then. Not game to try it just yet.

 

Why did it take me so long to stabilise? I can't say for sure but I believe it was because I took Valium intermittently to help with sleep. Because by CNS was so fragile I developed a dependency to the Valium (which I stopped once I knew what was going on) and that added a whole new set of symptoms that I had to work through. As many on here have said before, when the CNS is destabilised all bets are off.

 

My case is pretty extreme because I guess I'm what you would call 'kindled'. I've tried to get off Citalopram so many times (at least 5 or 6) that my brain just went 'No way! Not playing any more!' and completely shut down on me. So for those of you who are trying to stabilise, don't get scared by this. I'm probably not what you would call an average case.

 

Also, I can't take supplements at all. They made things a whole lot worse. I took Gingko Biloba for 5 days and I reckon that set my healing back at least a year.

 

Insomnia was my main symptom. Some nights I slept great, other nights I woke at 4AM and could not return to sleep. Looking back I don't know how I did it; I was tired all the time. I guess you just get used to it.

 

This time last year I did a Buteyko breathing course to see if it would help with bruxism (I can't wear a night guard). Not sure if it helped that, but Oh Boy did it every improve my sleep!! In fact  think it improved my sleep by about 60%. Once my sleep improved I was able to heal. This last year has seen a lot of improvement for me.

 

So...what helped me:

 

• No alcohol;
• No supplements;
• Daily meditation;
• Buteyko Breathing
• ACCEPTANCE!!

What I have learnt from this experience is to never (ever) take my health for granted. This has given me a new appreciation for life. I'm also really glad I found this site because now my eyes have been opened to the real story of psychotropic drugs and I refer heaps of my clients who are polydrugged to this website so hopefully they can educate themselves.

 

If this website had existed on 2001 when I took my first dose of Citalopram, maybe I could have avoided becoming addicted to this drug. It maybe too late for me but at least I can forewarn others now.

 

Will I ever attempt to get of Citalopram again? Not sure. At this stage I'm thinking probably not. This was such a nightmare for me I'm just not sure if I could ever go through it again.

 

Take care and Be well everyone

 

Love Sonia xx

[strawberry17]

Hi Basildev

 

I don't come here often nowadays either but I must've still been subscribed to your thread as I had a notification through! Your experience has a lot of parallels with mine, I too crashed completely during 2013, chronic anxiety and insomnia. In July 2013 I went back to the full dose and it took me about 6 months to really stabilise again. I have reached acceptance that I will never be free of Prozac, but I have now reached an acceptable compromise, about a year ago I reduced down to 3ml Prozac (from 5ml) and there I have stayed, this way I'm not totally numb and I have my sex drive back and neither am I paralysed with crushing anxiety/depression/insomnia. I eat healthily and go to the gym when I can.

 

I couldn't face going through withdrawal again, it didn't work out for me and life is too short.

 

Strawberry

[Altostrata]

Good to hear from you, basildev and Strawberry.

 

These drugs are beastly, aren't they?

[basildev]

Hey Strawbs,

 

Thanks for your reply. We gave it a good go though. You hung in there for ages, I remember your struggles like it was yesterday. I don't have any side effects from my current dose so will stay at this dose. I'm not game to rock the boat again.

 

Alto, you got that right. I makes me so mad that I was duped into taking them in the first place.

 

But I will continue to warn all those I come across who are on meds or who are thinking of going on them.

 

This website is a godsend to people who struggle to get off this poison.

 

Love to you both

 

xx

[nz11]

basildev thanks for taking the time to update.

 

Hey what about a 1% taper?? With a 2 month hold?.......6 month hold? ...just a thought.

 

Go well

nz11

[Tamtam1]

Hi basildev, I've read your thread, I'm so glad you are feeling better.

 

What caught my interest was your hypnic jerks, when I tried to reinstate everything was fine for the first 2 weeks I started sleeping again, but then the insomnia came back and along with it the hypnic jerks. I went days without sleep and finally I was so scared that I jumped off the Prozac and landed in HELL, I had been off Prozac before and never had these problems ever.  Did you have to continue the Valium for the jerks or did the go away on their own? I ask because when in a wave they came back really bad and Ive scared myself after reading Peter Breggin that I may have done damage to the motor part of my brain as  my toes on my left foot also move involuntarily at night after reinstatement and come back in a wave.

[Altostrata]

Love to you too, basildev.

 

Would you consider starting a topic in Symptoms about Buteyko breathing and how it helped you?

[basildev]

Hi basildev, I've read your thread, I'm so glad you are feeling better.

 

What caught my interest was your hypnic jerks, when I tried to reinstate everything was fine for the first 2 weeks I started sleeping again, but then the insomnia came back and along with it the hypnic jerks. I went days without sleep and finally I was so scared that I jumped off the Prozac and landed in HELL, I had been off Prozac before and never had these problems ever.  Did you have to continue the Valium for the jerks or did the go away on their own? I ask because when in a wave they came back really bad and Ive scared myself after reading Peter Breggin that I may have done damage to the motor part of my brain as  my toes on my left foot also move involuntarily at night after reinstatement and come back in a wave.

 

Thanks Tamtam!

 

You know what? I don't think you've done damage to your brain - you're just in withdrawal and it is really, REALLY tough. Hypnic jerks are the worst and are really scary but I promise you that with time they go away.

 

Now, bear in mind, my situation is a little different to yours because  I updosed 2 weeks after I crashed into withdrawal. I took a gamble doing that and after a long wait (3 years) it paid off. Once I had updosed back to 20mg and once the valium came out of my system the hypnic jerks went away. The waves of insomnia continued, however, as did a new symptom - prickly/itchy skin.

 

 

 

Would you consider starting a topic in Symptoms about Buteyko breathing and how it helped you?

 

Alto, I'd be delighted. I'll do it now.

 

Edit:  Link to Buteyko Breathing.

Edited August 19, 2016 by ChessieCat
Added link to Buteyko Breathing