Iggy131313 validation is imminent

[Iggy131313]

Hi People.

 

Im suffering in a big way, let me tell you my story.

 

in 2009 I had a physical illness and mt dr kindly put me on citalopram, she put me on 40mg, I didnt ask for it, and I didnt need it.

 

I stayed on 40mg for a year and dropped to 20mg for another year and a half so 2.5 years in total.

 

As I said I never needed ADs and every time I tried to come off (CT) I would have the brain zaps so start taking again.

 

In feb this year I was having the brain zaps but no tablets left, so I left it, and thought well thats over.

 

Life went on as normal, no better, no worse, all fine.

 

Then in July, 5 months after my CT I had a massive panic attack, I had never had one before, when it was over I thought that would be that, it wasnt, I woke up the next day with horrific anxiety and had another panic attack.

 

So I thought I must have developed some terrible anxiety disorder overnight, I went running back to the drs to ask for that harmless AD citalopram that I had taken without problems.

 

She gave me 20mg tabs and all hell broke loose, terribel akathesia, anxiety, no depression becasue I couldnt cry for the first 3 days, I couldnt talk, I was wetting myself and all sorts of other terrible things, the dr said, you are just sensitive keep going. I did, for 6 weeks.

 

I went back to the drs who said, all the side effects will be gone now, what you are feeling is you, they phoned a pdoc who said he had never heard of someone having a bad reaction to an ssri after it working before.

 

So it was me, they put the dose up again, I was taking 30mg for a few days but became seriously suicidal, I cut down back to 20 and then 10 and felt some mild relief. Not relief I was still in hell but able to speak.

 

It was at this point that I found PP and some other sites and understood that I had gone into w/d at 5 months out and the RI was making things worse.

 

I am currently tapoering off the RI quite fast, Im at 2.5mg, I came down 5 days ago from 5 and its been really bad.

 

Every day is hell, since that panic attack in early July my life has become unlivable, Im signed off from work, and cycle between akathesia, depression, suicidal ideation, terrible anxiety, confusion some DP and loads of other stuff.

 

What are my chances guys? Do you think that the fact that Im not polydrugged, having only ever taken citalopram and only being on for 2.5 years (which is still a long time, but is it long term?) do you think I can fully recover from this? within the 18 months maybe?

 

I have a 3 year old boy, luckily for me my hubby works from home so he can care for him most of the time, its the anxiety that kills me the most, I try not to let it scare me but its so strong and so horrible.

 

This morning I woke up and had a massive panic attack, I havent had one since that first and I think its becasue of the drop to 2.5 and the fact that I had a really bad nightmare about w/d, also because I found this site last night and read about all the people still suffering so badly after so much time, will that be me? I dont think I could cope.

 

Please help me.

 

Caroline

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Caroline.

 

I'm sorry you're going through this.

 

What probably happened is, as you surmised, your cold turkey off citalopram made your nervous system hypersensitive, an effect of withdrawal syndrome. This hypersensitivity makes us less resilient to stress and causes exaggerated "panic" and "anxiety."

 

Adding citalopram to this hypersensitivity scrambled your nervous system further. Going off will help you.

 

It will take you time and patience to recover, but your nervous system will gradually recover. You'll have to treat it very gently.

 

Welcome to our community, please let us know how you're doing.

[Iggy131313]

Your right, the panic attack was caused by an asthma attack, thats what sent me into hell, if only when I had gone to the drs they had said what you said I would never have tried to RI this poison.

 

Coming back off has been really hard, but I know I need it out of my system its making things worse.

 

and I know that you cant say for sure but in your experience do you think I will be able to recover quite quickly from this? by quickly I mean in the 18 month kind of timeframe?

 

I know that 5 months off is a notorious time for w/d when many people have a worsening of symtoms, I wish beyond wish I had not tried to take the cit again but I knew no different. You take the advice of the trusted drs dont you?

 

Alot of the people who are suffering a long way out, do you think that polydrugging or length of time on the drug adds to the length of recovery? Do you think I can do it? Im so scared and I have my little boy, I just want to get back to being that happy mummy I was.

[Altostrata]

It's impossible to predict how long recovery will take. If you're young and you take care of your body and mind, you probably will recover sooner.

 

It's important to take care of yourself now. I suggest reducing caffeine and sugar intake, these are stressful to the body. No alcohol or recreational drugs. If you smoke, try to minimize it.

 

Eat good fresh food, not packaged food with artificial additives, and plenty of fresh fruits and veggies.

 

Most people do well with these supplements: omega-3 fish oil, magnesium (for anxiety), and melatonin (for sleep). Go to the Symptoms forum and search for topics on each of these.

[Iggy131313]

Thanks so much for your reply Alto

 

Im 32, is that young?

 

I have already cut out caffine but not sugar, Ill look at keeping sugar minimal, I do smoke and I find that Im craving smoking more, perhaps because it raises dopamine levels and my body knows its low.

 

I wouldnt dare touch alcohol and I wont smoke any pot, although I did used to like the occasional smoke but I wont, I wouldnt dare.

 

I will try to keep my smoking down too, Im a bit scared of taking any suppliments but I will go shopping for some and start experimenting a little bit.

 

Here is my RI history

 

6 weeks - 20mg

1 week - 10mg

2 days - 20mg

5 days - 30mg

3 days - 20mg

3.5 weeks 10mg

2 weeks 7.5mg

2 weeks 5mg

29th Oct - 2.5mg

 

Its a mess eh? thats because I was battling between what the drs were telling me and what I felt was causing the stress, the trouble is the citalopram liquid that I have, each drop contains 2.5mg, Im down to 1 drop so what to do next, Im scared that jumping off at 2.5 could make me worse but I cant go any lower, I cant afford to buy scales, I can hardly afford to eat, so should I do the 1 day on 1 day off thing which Ive heard is really bad or should I wait a week and then jump off?

[Altostrata]

Have your symptoms changed as you've lowered the citalopram dose?

 

If necessary, you can get a smaller oral syringe to take a smaller dose, see http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-tapering-techniques/

[Iggy131313]

yes and no, they have got less severe but are still very bad, I think each change effects things, makes it bad for a little while and then I seem to feel a tiny bit more relief a few days/ a week after the drop, like my brain is shocked by the innitial chnage but then relived that it has less to cope with.

 

Ill see if I can get a tiny syringe like that and then drop to 1mg for a week or so.

[strawberry17]

Hi Iggy131313

Welcome to the forums, nice to see someone else from the UK

Can relate to a lot of what you've been through, I think the chances are high that given time and lots of TLC you will make a good recovery, it just won't be overnight.

Definately go for the small syringe, Boots sell them really cheap, and make tiny cuts to the end, and take your time don't rush it, which I know seems ridiculous but the whole business of getting off SSRI's and the fact that doctors are so ignorant about them is ridiculous.

strawberry

[Iggy131313]

Hi strawberry, Greetings from Manchester. x

 

Is it very rude to say I wish I didnt have to meet any of you? lol, and Im sure you werent here to greet me but hey thats life eh?

 

Lets walk through this hell together my friend. And I dont mean London Oxford Street, although that is hell ugh!

[strawberry17]

Not rude at all, I know exactly what you're saying, although, I have met some lovley people on this journey, there is a positive flip side to most things.

I'm in Suffolk.

[peggy]

Hi Caroline and welcome!

I feel so sad reading your story - don't beat yourself up about trusting Docs - we all did and we are now all in this together.

I also feel confident that you will gradually recover. I would encourage you to journal your symptoms and feelings on a daily basis so you can keep a good track of what works and what doesnt

[basildev]

Welcome Caroline.

 

I'm so sorry you're going through such hell. I'm very glad you found this forum.

 

Just knowing that other people are going through similar experiences can really help.

 

Many of us feel duped by our doctors but in the end, we all made the decision that we thought was right at the time, based on the information we had.

 

Please take care of yourself and let us know how you're doing.

 

Sonia

[Iggy131313]

Just thought I would let you guys know that I have been taken on as a patient by David Healy.

 

My in laws are paying for me to see him privatly.

 

I live only 20 minutes away from Oldham TRANX, I dont know if you gys are aware of it, but its a benzo and ssri w/d support group in the uk, they meet every monday and also offer acupuncture, massage, indian head massage, cbt and other therapys.

 

The guy who set it up is a recovered benzo survivour and a real hero, my in laws spoke to this group and were instantly persuaded that what is happening to me is not in my head, I have not gone mad but ion fact am in protracted w/d from my ssri use and cold turkey.

 

I spoke to Oldham tranx today and they were very kind, validated what I am going through and invited me to the group meeting on Monday, I explained that I am a little agorophobic at the moment but once this bad wave passes I would like to go, it was funny to hear them say ''oh yes, try to come during your next window'' wow, a real live person speaking my language, lol.

 

So I am awaiting my first appointment with David Healy, he says either a tuesday or friday, I will of course let you all know wht he says or recommends, and I will ask him lots of questions.

 

wishing you all a quick recovery and a better day tomorrow than today has been, however it hs been. x

 

Caroline

[dalsaan]

Hi Iggy

 

Rather than start a new thread for updates please add your new posts to your original intro thread. This keeps your story/history in one place (I have done it for you in this instance by merging your topics)

 

In regards to your news, I am extremely happy for you. You will now have the support you need to understand and respond to your condition. That is brilliant. It also sounds like your family are on board as well and understand a little more of what you are going through

 

Please keep in touch and let us know how you are going or post any questions if you hunks we can help

 

All the best

 

Dalsaan

[Altostrata]

How interesting! Please let us know what Dr. Healy tells you.

 

What I'm seeing is that your dosage has been very inconsistent, and overall you have been reducing too fast. I suggest you hold off making any changes for a while, at least until Dr. Healy sees you.

 

If you hold your dosages steady and your symptoms get worse, you might increase to 5mg and hold there.

 

I believe what's happened is that reducing too fast has destabilized your nervous system and further changes add to this. The nervous system thrives on stability. Give it stability.

[Barbarannamated]

Iggy,

 

Validation certainly is imminent and you will be receiving it from the world expert! Please keep us posted on what David Healy says. Would it be possible for you to take an audio recorder to your appointment? It has helped me to review what I miss in written notes. I ask the doctor before recording. Just a thought!

[Brandy]

Hi, Caroline!

 

So-o-o-o-o glad you're here!!!

 

I just sent you the email reply I've been promising even though I'm still not well at all (not w/d, folks - other problems), and just hoping it makes some iota of sense. (Warned you in the email it might not!)

 

Then I came over here for just a sec to check something and was overjoyed to see you made it over here!

 

You're in excellent hands here!

[strawberry17]

How incredibly interesting, I hope you let us know how you get on. You're so lucky to have something like Tranx near you as well, there is nothing like that in my part of the UK that I'm aware of.

[jr1985]

Iggy, can I ask where you are seeing Dr Healy, and how much does he charge to see him privately?

[Iggy131313]

Guys Im really really scared, I CTed off 20mg of celexa as you know and dealing with this failed RI, have you seen people recover who have done this? Im so scared that I will never recover and all I can think is that I will need to kill myself because this life is not worth living, Alto, 8 years of suffering? will I be like this for 8 years? I would rather die, please tell me if you think I can make a full recovery,.

[Altostrata]

Yes, you can make a full recovery, Iggy. There's no set recovery time. Most recover a lot sooner than 8 years, believe me!

 

Don't distress yourself with thoughts of doom. It's more likely you'll be fine.

[Iggy131313]

But Alto, Why has is taken you so long to heal? please tell me what symptoms you have still? I just want to die.

[Iggy131313]

Alto, also you seem the most knowledgable person about w/d, what in your opinion is happening during w/d?

[Altostrata]

Iggy, it's hard to say why I've had such a bad time of it. One reason might be because I'm older and my system doesn't recover as well. Everyone is different.

 

About withdrawal syndrome, read the topics here http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/603-what-is-antidepressant-withdrawal-syndrome/

[Iggy131313]

jr, I dont know how much Healy charges, Im waiting to hear back, my sister in law is sorting it all out.

 

I wanted to ask a question about titrating my celexa liquid...

 

I would have to drop down from 2.5mg to 1.25 mg if I use the tiny syringe but Im thinking of this method, let me know if its a bad idea

 

1)put 1 drop of celexa liquid (2.5mg) into 5ml of juice

 

2) take 4ml of the juice - this should be 2mg

 

3) from then drop by 1ml of liquid so my taper would be 2mg, 1.5mg, 1mg, 0.5mg

 

would that be ok? I hope the celexa liquid is soluble, I think it is?

[Altostrata]

I think you might be able to dilute that liquid with water. Phone your druggist and check.

 

I would put it in water rather than juice. You might be able to make up a small bottle of it, diluted, and take your dosage out of that.

 

You've got the general idea about how to reduce it.

 

Why do you want to reduce it now? Did your symptoms decrease since your last drop? Have you tried holding at one dose for a month?

[Iggy131313]

Im not going to reduce just yet, Im not sure about my symptoms, I deffo felt the drop from 5 to 2.5 and I thought things were gettin worse but then I came on my period a couple of days ago so I think that was another reason things felt bad.

 

I really dont know what to do Alto, I need to get this drg out of my system so I can heal, I was gonna drop straight down to 1mg but I think now I will take it slower, I have been on 2.5 for just over 2 weeks now and will wait at least another week, I trid holding the dose on both 20 and 10mg but the symptoms were still unbearable.

 

also I stil clench my teeth at night do you think thats w/d or side effects from the citalopram still?

[Altostrata]

Teeth clenching can be a side effect of an antidepressant or a withdrawal symptom.

 

You may have tapered too fast for your nervous system.

 

You will delay healing if you stress your nervous system with withdrawal symptoms. The snail wins the race when it comes to going off psychiatric drugs.

[Iggy131313]

The thing I dont understand is this

 

I went into w/d after my CT 5 months after stopping, I had been fine until then.

 

I restarted the celexa and things went to hell

 

I definiltly felt better when I dropped to 10, no doubt about that, and its hard to tell if I have felt better from my other drops 7.5, 5, and now 2.5

 

I am sleeping and I hope that helps but Im in axiety hell but I have been since restarting. I need to get this poison out of my system and I dont know if its making things worse or not, I know the drops will have an effect but I need to keep going so I can heal.

 

what do you think I should do? the celexa is obviously having an adverse effect on me and is horrific but I know i need to take things slower than I have been, thats why I want to titrate the liquid down now.

 

should I stay on 2.5 for another 2 weeks giving it 4 weeks? Im so lost and I dont know what to do, the anxiety is so unbearale but has been all the time, I just want to die

[Iggy131313]

OR do you think that there is a chance that if I continue to take the 2.5 that RI may still work?

[Altostrata]

Iggy, I don't know. I'm not clear if your symptoms get worse when you reduce. Do they get worse or better?

 

How is the arrangement with Dr. Healy shaping up?

[Iggy131313]

Im still waiting for him to get back to me on what the next step is.

 

To be honest I dont know if I am better or worse either, I am beter than I was at 20mg thats a fact, I can sleep and am not woken up early in the morning but I live all day with constant anxiety, I cant tell at the moment if this recent worstening of symptoms that I am having is due to my drop in dose or due to my period, maybe the best thing to do is wait couple of weeks and see.

[Iggy131313]

what worries me is how much worse Im gonna get when I come of this failed RI, Its gonna get alot worse isnt it?

[Iggy131313]

as I have only been on this failed RI for a short time will it have a massive impact when I come off or will the fact that Im already in chaos kinda cancel that out and the hel will just continue?

 

I feel like making another dose drop tomorrow because I cant stand being on this drug any longer, maybe I should just go down to 1.25

[Altostrata]

Did the smaller amount of citalopram alleviate your symptoms at all?

 

I don't think going off is going to be worse.

 

I wish you could talk to Dr. Healy before making any more changes.

[Iggy131313]

I suspect that this recent drop has made things worse, my sleep is much worse and I am wakjing up several times per night and I just open my eyes as if I have not been alseep at all. my anxiety I think is also slightly worse, but this could be my period and it could have been coming anyway.

 

I guess when this crap is out of my system I wont have to worry about what move to make next and I can start to count my recovery time, Im just so upset that I had gone into w/d destabilised things MUCH MUCH worse by taking the med again and now Im going to destabalise things AGAIN by coming off.

 

I am truly terrified. what kills me the most is that if I had KNOWN at 5 months what was happening and just waited it out, yes it would have been quite bad, but it wasnt going to be THIS BAD I could have got through that wave and hopefully begun to improve, now Ive really f**ked things up and no one knows the best way to make it better.