success ☼ Alex Withdrawal or Relapse?

[alex]

I am trying to make the most normal life possible, despite the horrible feelings of anxiety and depression of w/d.

I am a singer as you know;some felow musicians invited me to perform tomorrow night.

I feel very anxious about it.

In one hand, I think I should do it, to overcome this situation.

But in the other hand I don't know if I'm overdoing it...I feel at the edge of stress sometimes....

I need the money also.

The horrible feelings of fear are here...but my voice is back...so I don't know...

[Petunia]

Performance anxiety is normal for everyone, even people not having withdrawn from antidepressants, so I think what you are feeling is natural and not a sign that you shouldn't do it.

 

My guess is that once you start singing, you will get back into it, relax and feel wonderful and very glad you took the opportunity.

 

Good luck, let us know how it goes, I'm sure you will be fine. 

[alex]

Oh Petu, you are so wonderful!!

Yes, I will do it, and I let you now first hand.

 

Thank you for your encouraging words.

 

Hugs, A.

[tezza]

I can't wait to hear how much everyone loved your performance!!!

[alex]

Hey Tezza!

I'll give you an update tomorrow first thing in the morning.

 

Thank you, T.

[alex]

Hello, I did fine last night; I didn't enjoy it because of very strong anxiety, but at least I was able to overcome the stress and make another step toward recovery.

I keep struggling.

[lexicon]

You are very brave, and courageous my friend ..

Congratulations, you are on your way to wellness ..

This is a challenge, and we can do it Alex ..

Sending you friendship and encouragement ..

Let us keep "walking "

Love Lexi

[alex]

Thank you Lex; I am in a bad wave since last Sunday, after a quite good month, with clear windows...evil thing this is...

 

BTW, how are you doing?

[alex]

I am in a very bad wave;I have to make big efforts at times not to loose control.

Very bad anxiety, depression, horrible tiredness...dark toughts.

I have been trying my best to overcome this terrible condition, but sometimes I think that maybe there is damage beyond repair for us who tappered too fast.Or maybe that I will never recover from Effexor...I feel soooo tired; I don't want to live like this

Feeling really down and scared for my life.

I'm sorry.

[lexicon]

Awww, Alex

I am sorry to hear that .. Tapering from these drugs, is one uncomfortable

experience after another ..

I think that the unpredictability of it, is one of the hardest parts ..

All we know for sure, is that at the end we will be fine ..

Just how long is that? That is where faith comes in ..

I am not doing well Alex ..This has been a symptomatic taper from Ativan ..

There is a problem getting stable, and that interrupts the process ..

I guess, all we can do is face what knocks on our door, with patience and

acceptance ..I am trying to learn this ..But boy, it is tough ..!!

Hang in there Alex ..At some point we will win this ..

Sending you love,

Lexi

[Petunia]

Hello, I did fine last night; I didn't enjoy it because of very strong anxiety, but at least I was able to overcome the stress and make another step toward recovery.

 

 

That's great Alex and a big step towards healing and handling money problems

 

I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it, but you do seem to be in a wave at the moment.  Try and remember that you have recently had a good window where there was a lot of improvement.  Another window will come again as you continue to recover.

 

Read through the 'windows and waves pattern of recovery' again.

 

Hang in there (hugs)

 

Petu.

[alex]

Thank you Petu for your kind words.

 

The best way to describe this horrible condition is Living dead.

 

But I don`t want to die; not yet..

I can't believe I am going through this....

[Meimeiquest]

Dear Alex, I know you feel truly awful, but I am so proud of you for pushing through to sing again. What a giant step! I am not at all surprised you feel badly today, and I hope tomorrow will be better!

[Petunia]

I can't believe I am going through this....

 

I know, I have thought exactly the same thing.  Its unbelievable.

 

But we really are going through this, we all are.  All of us here on this site and many millions of others around the world who probably don't even realize what's going on.

 

The important thing is the word 'through'.  We go through it and come out the other side.  You are not going to die from this, it just feels like it at times.

 

Hang in there Alex, you are not alone.

[alex]

Thank you ALL of you good and brave people

 

We are going to beat this monster! and we will be better, wiser, stronger people. And med. free!!!!!!

 

Hugs, A.

[alex]

How do I know this is w/d and not relapse...?

My personal life is bad enough to be depressed.

I know major depression;and this is very much like it.There are slight differences though that makes me wonder...

Tinnitus, it's new; the depression was relentless 5 years ago; and in this process I have seen "better" days.

But this "wave" is the worst I've had in months."almost" as bad as the worst i had a few months ago when I felt that my life was at risk.

I have been dealing with emotional problems all my life.I feel very tired;I am getting older; I really don't know if I'm gonna have the strenght to pull through this.

Suicide is in my head; but I don't want to end like that.

I am really scared. I'm sorry

[Petunia]

I'm having clear,long lasting windows!!

In this month I can count 6 days in which I have felt almost symptom free...able to enjoy, laugh, interact with people, no anxiety, no dysphoria, very little or no DP or DR;much more confident, with a sense of inner peace.

My voice is coming back;my apetite is much better.Sexually better.Fatigue and tiredness comes and goes, but the waves are  weaker, no doubt.

The only symptom that persists is insomnia, but even that is getting slowly better, because I wake up but can get back to sleep quite easily most of the time.

I don't know but only a few weeks or days ago I was very discouraged;today i feel I can tell you this for sure:I am on my way to recovery.

The only med. I'm taking is 0.18mg xanax at night and tapering.Just a few months ago I used to take 12.5 Seroquel and 0.25-0.50mg xanax, and even though I have lowered the meds. my sleep problem is more "tolerable"

I am starting to sing again, doing some exercise with weights, (little) and trying to be positive and not overdoing it.

And I forgot to mention, that all this is happening despite a very bad personal situation financially.But it will get better too,....

 

You wrote this less than one month ago.

 

Then on the 16th September (about a week ago) you wrote:

"After having one of the best days in months yesterday, almost symptom free, I am having a bad morning."

 

That's when this wave started.  Can you think of anything that happened at that time?  Did you make any changes?  Was that when you were asked to start performing again?

 

I know you were anxious about the decision about singing again, perhaps the stress leading up to that has effected you.

 

This wave will pass whether it was caused by something or if its just the pattern of recovery.

 

I know how hard it is to feel better for a while and then be thrown right back into suffering, even if its not as bad as at first, it feels that way because we are so tired and worn down from it going on for so long.

 

Suicidal thoughts are common in withdrawal, but you want to live, that's good, you will find the strength to keep going and it will get better again.  This sudden negative thinking is typical of withdrawal when in a wave.

 

There is no need to be sorry about needing some support, you have given me and other members a lot of help when we have needed it.

 

You may be getting older, we all are.  But you are also getting wiser, more compassionate and stronger.

 

Are you going to be singing again soon?

[Lexy]

Hi Alex

 

You are not alone.

I've been on effexor for over a year. I cut my dose back in oct 2012.

I have been tapering slow since Jan 2013. I was bedridden for 3 months

In oct thru dec 2012.

I've been getting huge headaches and mood swings. How can I tell if this is

Protracted withdrawal or a bad wave?

Thanks for any hel

[alex]

 

I'm having clear,long lasting windows!!

In this month I can count 6 days in which I have felt almost symptom free...able to enjoy, laugh, interact with people, no anxiety, no dysphoria, very little or no DP or DR;much more confident, with a sense of inner peace.

My voice is coming back;my apetite is much better.Sexually better.Fatigue and tiredness comes and goes, but the waves are  weaker, no doubt.

The only symptom that persists is insomnia, but even that is getting slowly better, because I wake up but can get back to sleep quite easily most of the time.

I don't know but only a few weeks or days ago I was very discouraged;today i feel I can tell you this for sure:I am on my way to recovery.

The only med. I'm taking is 0.18mg xanax at night and tapering.Just a few months ago I used to take 12.5 Seroquel and 0.25-0.50mg xanax, and even though I have lowered the meds. my sleep problem is more "tolerable"

I am starting to sing again, doing some exercise with weights, (little) and trying to be positive and not overdoing it.

And I forgot to mention, that all this is happening despite a very bad personal situation financially.But it will get better too,....

 

  Can you think of anything that happened at that time?  Did you make any changes?  Was that when you were asked to start performing again?

 

Are you going to be singing again soon?

 

 

No, the wave began before I was asked to sing again.

Yes, there are very heavy stressors in my life right now.

Maybe forcing myself to perform again was too much at this time.

I don't kow if I'm going to be singing again soon....

Last night I had awful nightmares that gave me whirring waves of fear after I woke up.That is NOT depression!

I can't believe the evilness of this condition.

I only hope I can survive.

 

Thank you Petu for been there for me.

[EagleWolf]

I am in a very bad wave;I have to make big efforts at times not to loose control.

Very bad anxiety, depression, horrible tiredness...dark toughts.

I have been trying my best to overcome this terrible condition, but sometimes I think that maybe there is damage beyond repair for us who tappered too fast.Or maybe that I will never recover from Effexor...I feel soooo tired; I don't want to live like this

Feeling really down and scared for my life.

I'm sorry.

 

Alex I am so sorry to hear of your suffering.  I know that at times it can feel endless, but you know what?  The brain can and does heal, it is an amazing instrument.  This is slightly off topic, but I think it may give you some small glimmer of hope.

 

My son was bashed by a group of thugs and sustained an ABI (Acquired Brain Injury).  At the time the Neurosurgeon and Neurologists said that he would need years and years of rehab, it was very daunting for a 21 year old, however, my son is very determined and in less than 12 months is back to 95% normal functioning.  It hasn't taken him 'years and years'.  Our neurologist said that it is quite possible to regrow new neural pathways, even if some of the old ones are 'damaged'.

 

Likewise,  as some of you may know my husband has Hydrocephalus and sustained 'severe' cognitive impairment due to blood clots suctioning down on his brain, which in fact squashed his brain to half of its normal size. After much hard work and continual training via hard core rehabbing and 'brain training' such as Lumosity, he is at 90%, which is pretty miraculous as he sustained 'white matter damage' which is generally irreversible.

 

I know some readers may think, what has this got to do with our situation?  But, I would like to point out that even when the brain is 'damaged' it is quite possible to repair and even improve cognitive ability.  I have 2 cases here at home which prove that and I wanted you to know that I personally do not believe that we are damaged beyond repair.  It may feel like it and right now I am grappling with that same notion as I rapid taper Avanza, but I just have to believe that eventually we all come good and back to normal. 

 

Please don't doubt the amazing ability of your brain to repair its self and grow new neural pathways. 

 

Stay strong Alex, the only way is up.

 

Love Eagle x

[alex]

Thank you SO much for your kind and encouraging words.

As a matter of fact, today I am having a good window after a really bad week.

Now I am sure that this is the way CNS repairs itself, and that we are on our way to recovery.

It's just that it is so hard to deal with the dark thoughts and emotions during the wave that you forget all the improvement that you`ve had.

Really evil and weird things these terrible meds do to your brain............

But I agree that our body has that marvelous capacity to heal in miracolous ways.

Thank you again and very very happy for your son and husband, truly an inspiring story about spirit strength and greatness.

 

We "will" make it

 

Hugs, A

 

PS: I love your Avatar.

[alex]

I am in a wave; maybe not as bad as before, but bad enough;dysphoric, anxious, DP mood.

My sleep has been bad for the last 3 days or so.I mean is not that I've had good sleep, it is disrupted, but I was able to go back to sleep easily.

I have been tapering 0.25mg Xanax for the last 3 months.

I really don't know how much I'm taking now because I don't have a scale, but I imagine I'm around 0.10mg.

I want to get off ALL psy med.

At 14 months off, I've seen improvements but still struggling with bad bad waves.

 

Will I ever get off the grip of Effexor???

[Lexy]

A window will open soon.

[Petunia]

Hi Alex,

 

I didn't realize you are tapering off Xanax, maybe because its not in your signature.  This is an important factor in how you are feeling. Withdrawing from Xanax is probably what's causing your increased symptoms at the moment.  Do you just take it at night?  Xanax has a short half life.  When I was taking it, I would get terrible rebound anxiety about 6 hours later.

 

I know you have posted in the benzo section before, but maybe have a look through some of the posts there again.

 

I will PM you soon.

 

Hang in there,  (hugs)

Petu.

[Skyler]

I have been tapering 0.25mg Xanax for the last 3 months.

I really don't know how much I'm taking now because I don't have a scale, but I imagine I'm around 0.10mg.

I want to get off ALL psy med.

At 14 months off, I've seen improvements but still struggling with bad bad waves.

 

Hi Alex, the Xanax taper is causing your WD Sx.  It took me over a year to taper down from the equivalent dose of benzo you are now taking. You need to switch to a liquid taper at this point. Even if you had one, I don't think a scale is reliable when you get to such low doses.  It also sounds like you are having interdose WD.

 

I'm kind of stymied, you need to give a full picture of your situation to get meaningful feedback, and the benzo piece (which is every bit as important as the AD WD, more so at this point) seems to have been lost in the shuffle.  You can reasonably expect even more Sx from the benzo because of the complicated AD taper at the outset. 

 

The medication you so despise is in your system as long as your body responds as if it were.  It will take time for your neuroreceptors to reset.  So in this instance, stopping Xanax sooner will keep your body responding 'as if'... and make WD more prolonged. You need to stop tapering, learn to make liquid Xanax, and evenly divide your doses.  Folks in the benzo sub forum can help you with the liquid taper mechanics, etc. 

 

PS.. as Petu advises, put your benzo Hx in the sig. line.. how long you have been on, when and at what dose did you start to taper.

[alex]

Thank you S; I've been taking only one dose bedtime to help me sleep.

But I have noticed that is not helping much, so I have been tapering the 0.25mg which I believe is a low dose.

I've been taking Xanax for 10 months now, always one dose.

I am going to hold a little bit, because I probably "have" to travel next week, and then see if I can get the liquid form.

 

Thanks for your concern and advice.

 

Hugs,A.

[alex]

After several weeks of fairly "good" sleep (broken but able to get back to sleep) I am having a relapse in this area.

Waking up early after bearly 4 hrs of broken sleep, with awful anxiety; when I leave the bed,it gets better...

I am in a very low dose of Xanax now;maybe that is the reason for this??

Very tired, low mood, scared of this condition.

I've read this sentence from people who has recovered:"my worst days now are 100% better than my best days back in w/d"

I REALLY hope to see that day soon...

Hanging on.

[alex]

I am in a bad wave; but I can notice that I hardly get to the awful edge....

[Skyler]

After several weeks of fairly "good" sleep (broken but able to get back to sleep) I am having a relapse in this area.

Waking up early after bearly 4 hrs of broken sleep, with awful anxiety; when I leave the bed,it gets better...

I am in a very low dose of Xanax now;maybe that is the reason for this??

Very tired, low mood, scared of this condition.

I've read this sentence from people who has recovered:"my worst days now are 100% better than my best days back in w/d"

I REALLY hope to see that day soon...

Hanging on.

 

Alex, for whatever reason, you are minimizing the role of Xanax. IMO, this is not about the AD you came off some months back, but entirely, or almost entirely because of Xanax interdose WD and tapering WD. The AD may be playing a role because the prior sensitization is making the Xanax taper more symptomatic.

[alex]

Ok, my english is not good, I'm sorry.

What does IMO means? And wht do you mean by "interdose"

I have been taking 1 dose by night; I have been tapering from 0.25 in the last months.I don`t have a scale so I don`t know how much I'm taking now.

I am not minimizing; I am doing the best I can.

If you can help me out it would be appreciated.

[Skyler]

Ok, my english is not good, I'm sorry.

What does IMO means? And wht do you mean by "interdose"

I have been taking 1 dose by night; I have been tapering from 0.25 in the last months.I don`t have a scale so I don`t know how much I'm taking now.

I am not minimizing; I am doing the best I can.

If you can help me out it would be appreciated.

 

You're not looking at the role Xanax is playing. Are you aware that WD from benzos is often even more taxing than that from ADs?  And your system was already sensitized from the quick Effexor 3 month taper.

 

One of the reasons benzo WD is more challenging is because of the short half life many have, especially Xanax.  So you not only have WD because the way you cut the Xanax, but you also are most likely having WD between doses.  The half life of Xanax is 6 to 12 hours.  Rhi took Xanax 6 times a day and recommends this frequency. You are taking Xanax ONCE a day, and since your body is now sensitized, it's a good bet this is causing some of your Sx. 

 

And you should not be tapering at more than 5% a month given the Sx you are having now.  To go this slowly and to split your doses, you have to titrate with liquid Xanax. You have never tapered like this, so need to learn the ropes.. then you will be doing your best... AND feeling better than you are now.

 

Skyler

 

Last edited 8:32 PM EDST

[alex]

Ok, I need your guide here.

Talk to me as a 7 yrs child...

What should I do now?? updose??

I don't know how to do the liquid thing...

I don't know how much I'm taking  now..

How do I know this is not AD w/d....

 

OMG! this is so complicated.....scared, very scared.

[Skyler]

1) What should I do now?? updose??

 

2)I don't know how to do the liquid thing...

 

3) I don't know how much I'm taking  now..

 

4) How do I know this is not AD w/d....

 

OMG! this is so complicated.....scared, very scared.

 

1) Updosing may or may not be a good idea.. and it may not fix anything.. updosing benzos is a crap shoot, hard to know if this will help or cause more Sx.  You do need to put the info on Xanax into your sig. line.. how long ago did you start to cut Xanax?

 

For now, you do need to do is learn how to do a liquid taper so you can evenly split the Xanax into 5 or 6 doses you are on.  That's the most important step now.

 

2) Right.. so you need to learn how to titrate Xanax.  We do not have a full benzo forum, but you may well get an assist.  Don't know until you ask!  I'm not the person to best help  as I've not made liquid from Xanax, but there are two or three on the forum who have.

 

3) Yes.. and this is a problem. But you do have an approximate, and that's good enuf.

 

4) Because you have been off Effexor for a long time now.. and were recovering.. then you started to reduce Xanax and things got worse.

 

Use your fear to motivate you and learn how to do it right.

[alex]

Ok, Skyler, thanks for your concern.

I will keep you updated.

[Skyler]

I understand this is alot to take in, but for now, please put the Xanax info in your sig line.. when you started to taper, and the aprox. dose you are on now.  Otherwise you risk people inadvertently giving you misinformation.. as they do not realize Xanax WD is in the picture.

 

Skyler

[alex]

Xanax info is already in my signature.