Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 2, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 2, 2017 I just posted this on Nick1990's thread and wanted to share it here also: Going through ADWD can be a real life changing experience. It has a way of cutting through all the BS and showing us what is really important in life. Because we have been through it, it can lower our tolerance for all the things others fine "important". We have had a deeply personal growing experience and have come to rely strongly upon ourselves, our intuition and what we have learned. We have been forced into a more introverted role and find that we like it and because of all the pain and suffering choose to concentrate our energy on the good things in life. It's a growing experience that I wouldn't wish on anyone, but there are many, many people who could benefit from going through it. To be content in surroundings, mind and body is the true goal in life. One of my spirituality teachers once told me "enlightenment is a dangerous thing, because once you have received some, you can't give it back". We are not choosing enlightenment but rather having it thrust upon us, so it's just one more thing we need to learn to live with as we withdraw. I guess it's a bit funny that "enlightenment" could be listed as a side effect of ADWD. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 2, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 2, 2017 I frequently see posts from members saying that they wished they were strong and brave like some other member, and every time I do it upsets me. The strength and bravery displayed by every member here is amazing. I posted this on another thread and wanted to shear it here also: Being brave and strong has nothing to do with not feeling fear or handle things in a "proud" manner. It's doing what has to be done to survive, sometimes minute by minute, hour by hour or day by day. If it's hiding in a dark place crying or going for a walk when you legs are too sore to move, getting out of bed and taking a shower, if it needs to be done and you do it, that's being brave and strong. Marching down the street exuding strength is a show of bravado which frequently accomplishes nothing, unless that is what the moment calls for. The people around you who appear to be towers of strength, are often brittle and will crack and break when things don't go their way. This is a big factor in why people in ADWD slowly lose many of their friends over time. The friends do not have the strength and bravery to face the situation and so in time turn and run. For those of us in the thick of it, we have no choice, to get through this we must go on minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day doing what needs to be done, and by doing so each and every one of us displays strength and bravery beyond the superhero level. 1 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator Frogie Posted December 3, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 3, 2017 Hi Tom: I've had a lot of help with what I did between MMT and Gridley, but I really messed up. As much as I messed up, I attributed all my anxiety to the remodeling that isn't happening the way it should, my granddaughter wanting to come visit. She doesn't have a room because of the remodeling and being sick, then hurting my back. And this is not a good time of year for me. I see now that some anxiety is because of my "stupidity ". I'm going to hold at 2.5 until January. Then see how I feel. I actually feel pretty good for doing what I did. Do you think I'll be ok? Thanks for your help. Hope you are doing well. Take care, Frogie xx PREVIOUS medications and discontinuations: Have been on medications since 1996. Valium, Gabapentin, Lamictal, Prilosec and Zantac from 2000 to 2015 with a fast taper by a psychiatrist. Liquid Lexapro Nov, 2016 to 31-March, 2019 Lexapro free!!! (total Lexapro taper was 4 years-started with pill form) ---CURRENT MEDICATIONS:Supplements:Milk Thistle, Metamucil, Magnesium Citrate, Vitamin D3, Levothyroxine 25mcg, Vitamin C, Krill oil. Xanax 1mg 3x day June, 2000 to 19-September, 2020 Went from .150 grams (average weight of 1 Xanax) 3x day to .003 grams 3x day. April 1, 2021 went back on 1mg a day. Started tapering May 19, 2023. July 28, 2023-approximately .87mg. Dr. fast tapered me at the end and realized he messed up. Prescribe it again and I am doing "slower than a turtle" taper. 19-September, 2020 Xanax free!!! (total Xanax taper was 15-1/2 months-1-June, 2019-19-September, 2020) I am not a medical professional. The suggestions I make are based on personal experience. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 3, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 3, 2017 Hi Frogie-- It's good that you've sorted out what is going on, it will add a lot of perspective to the situation. A 50% drop is rarely a good thing in the short term, but they do settle out. It does take a lot of time though. Seeing how things are going at the end of January is a start, but it might take a good deal longer for things to settle down. There frequently is about a three month lag after a big drop or CT before the worst of the symptoms hit. By that time an updose starts to become tricky, unpredictable and would take several more months to stabilize. You said you don't want to updose, but in the long run you will probably be glad you did. This big cut can end up being no fun at all for a long time but it will be survivable, just keep in mind that the longer you wait the less chance there is of a successful updose. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Mentor Happy2Heal Posted December 6, 2017 Mentor Share Posted December 6, 2017 On 12/2/2017 at 3:28 PM, brassmonkey said: I frequently see posts from members saying that they wished they were strong and brave like some other member, and every time I do it upsets me. The strength and bravery displayed by every member here is amazing. I posted this on another thread and wanted to shear it here also: Being brave and strong has nothing to do with not feeling fear or handle things in a "proud" manner. It's doing what has to be done to survive, sometimes minute by minute, hour by hour or day by day. If it's hiding in a dark place crying or going for a walk when you legs are too sore to move, getting out of bed and taking a shower, if it needs to be done and you do it, that's being brave and strong. Marching down the street exuding strength is a show of bravado which frequently accomplishes nothing, unless that is what the moment calls for. The people around you who appear to be towers of strength, are often brittle and will crack and break when things don't go their way. This is a big factor in why people in ADWD slowly lose many of their friends over time. The friends do not have the strength and bravery to face the situation and so in time turn and run. For those of us in the thick of it, we have no choice, to get through this we must go on minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day doing what needs to be done, and by doing so each and every one of us displays strength and bravery beyond the superhero level. so well written and so totally spot on Tom!! I find it odd that for me, I was able to tackle the worst of withdrawal with less complaining than I do when things are just basically a normal bad day. It's funny how I thought I'd be super human or something when all this was done. but then I look back and know I had no choice, I had to get thru it, as you said, minute by minute. I have not lost any friends that I'd want in my life now. I hope you didn't lose any that you really wish had stayed. pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until Sept, then acute WD hit!! reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106 Tapered off to zero by Oct. 2017 Doing very well. Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs Link to comment
bromor Posted December 6, 2017 Share Posted December 6, 2017 A thousand times yes on the being brave & strong.... minute by minute. Making the choice to do what has to be done regardless of how your body is feeling. To walk through those dark valleys when you think you'll never see the sunlight again. But, the sun does come back out! I think it's very wise to not compare ourselves with others.... we all have our own unique path to follow. On Zoloft for 10 years (50 mg) for GAD & panic attacks Weaned off fall of 2013, terrible set back in Feb '14 back on 100 mg & trazadone to sleep. Did CT off of Zoloft in May 2014 - bad decision! Back on 50 mg Zoloft & Xanax as needed (was upped to 75 mg by doctor in Feb 2015) Started to wean off of Zoloft in April 2015 ~ totally off Zoloft in Oct 2015 and now am on Buspar 11.25 mg to help. I was on a 50 mg pill & 25 mg pill - I cut the 25 mg pill in half (12.5) and took that with the 50 for 6 weeks - 1st week June 2015 50 mg for another 6 weeks. 25 mg in half and the 50 mg in half (37.5), 25 mg mid Sept for about 2 weeks.,1/2 of the 25 mg last week of Sept/1st week of Oct then off. Update** 9 mg Zoloft reinstated early Nov 15, along with 1.5 mg Buspar daily. On .50 of Buspar & 9 mg of Zoloft. Oct '16 - off of Buspar, Nov '16 - down to 7.5 mg Zoloft. March'17 - 4 mg Zoloft. July'17 - 2 mg, Sept 1 mg. Oct'17 - off! Done! I also take magnesium, L theanine, Gaba Calm, L Glutamine, Vit B complex(for methyl issues), Liver & Gall bladder support, Zinc, Whole Food Vit C & Fish Oil. DARE & the bible are the tools I use to help navigate this process. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 7, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 7, 2017 I know we have several members in the West Los Angeles/ Simi Valley area. Please let us know if you're doing all right, things are pretty scary out that way right now. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
LexAnger Posted December 8, 2017 Share Posted December 8, 2017 Thanks Tom for the kind concern! I'm fine only never seen scary winds and some smoke from distant fire. My son is much closer to the getty center fire though but he is safe too. Hope you are not badly impacted. Lex Drug free Sep. 23 2017 2009 Mar.: lexapro 10mg for headache for 2 weeks. 2009-2012: on and off 1/4 to 1/3 of 10mg 2012 June--2013 Jan,: 1/4-1/3 of 10mg generic, bad jaw pain 2013 Jan-Mar: 10 mg generic. severe jaw and head pain; 2013 Mar--Aug. started tapering (liquid ever since) from 10 to 5 (one step) then gradually down to 2.25 mg by July. first ever panic attack, severe head/jaw pain 2013 Aug.: back to 2.75 mg; Nov: back to Brand Lex. 2.75mg -- 3mg, 2014 June: stopped PPI, head pressure/numbness. up-dosed 4.5mg, severe reaction mental symptoms added on 2014 Aug--2015 Aug: Micro taper down to 3.2mg, .025mg (<1%) cut holding 2-3 weeks. 2015 Aug 15th, Accidental one dose of 4.2mg. worsening brain non-functional, swollen head, body, coma like, DR 2016 Feb., started dosing 10am through 11 pm everyday 2/13--3.2mg, 3/15-- 2.9mg, 4/19-- 2.6mg, 6/26--2.2mg, 7/22 --1.9mg, 8/16--1.8mg，8/31--1.7m g, 9/13--1.6mg, 9/27--1.5mg, 10/8--1.4mg, 10/14--1.3mg， 11/1--1.2mg, 11/29--1.1mg, 12/12--1mg, 12/22--0.9mg 2017: 1/7--0.8mg, 1/15--0.7mg, 1/17--0.6mg, 1/20--0.52, 1/21--0.4mg, 1/22--0.26, 1/23--0.2, 2/13--0.13mg, 2/20--0.06mg, 3/18--0.13mg, 6/1--0.12mg, 7/6--0.1mg, 7/14--0.08mg, 8/17--0.04mg, 8/20--0.03mg, 8/28--0.02mg, 9/6--0.0205mg, 9/8--0.02mg, 9/17--0.015mg, 9/20--0.01mg, 9/21--0.0048mg, 9/22--0.0001mg, Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 8, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 8, 2017 I'm quite safe ATM. We live way out on the east side. We've been getting a little smoke smell but that's all. I can't believe the video I've been seeing though. Glad your're safe, I hope to hear from some of the others, but they could be pretty busy right now. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 9, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 9, 2017 This could start to make me paranoid of traveling. Came down with a cold a couple of days ago the timing works out that I got it on the flight home. Doing everything I can think of to keep it from getting into my chest. Monica started to show symptoms yesterday and is really not feeling well today. With any luck it will pass quickly. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
aberdeen Posted December 10, 2017 Share Posted December 10, 2017 Hope you stay well Brass. I just caught it myself. Its going around. My kids had it and it seemed short lived so thats good! 2 Timothy 1-7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind. Effexor 75mg to 262.5mg 2005-2010 for post partum depression Started having poop out mid 2010, also switched generic brands, then crashed in Dec 2010 (anxiety/ "terror", intense DR, anhedonia, suicidal ideation, chills, insomnia, horrible intrusive thoughts, disorientation, ect)Rapid "tapered" from 262.5mg Effexor in 3 months Tried Celexa,Cipralex, then Paxil to deal with wd(this switching made things worse and added akathesia) Found online support and started tapering Paxil 7 months after quitting Effexor (at this point was having small windows). Paxil taper: dropped 10% every 4-8 weeks Year 1 October 2011 to Nov 2012 20mg to 10mg Year 2 March 2013 to Feb 2014 10mg to 4mg Year 3 April 2014 to May 2015 4mg to 1.1mg Year 4 June 2015 1.1mg , dropping by 10% until .5mg, after then dropped by 0.1mg every 5 weeks until 0.1mg. Finished! Official last dose of 0.1mg on June 15/16 Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 10, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 10, 2017 Thanks for the well wishes Aberdeen. Three days and the acute seems to be fading. No energy, just want to sit in the recliner all day, but I'm able to get a bit done in small steps. Monica is deep in acute ATM and not happy about it at all. According to the timing she should be a lot better tomorrow. The weather has warmed up a bit which I think will help, we both got rather chilled a few days ago and I think that's what set it off. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
mustangwoman Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Elderberry is excellent in shortening the duration and severity of upper and lower respiratory colds and viruses, including the flu. Read the refereed studies, it is amazing. I'm glad to see you are well otherwise. Your journey and mentoring is inspirational to say the least. zoloft 2004-08 tapered too fast(2 weeks) Luvox 5/08 100 mg 07/10 40mg via small reductions, 08/10 39mg, 09/10 38mg, 10/10 37mg, 11/10 36mg,2/11 35mg, 5/11 34mg, 8/11 33mg, 11/11 32mg, 01/12 31mg, 03/12 30mg, 4/12 29mg, 5/12 28 mg, 8/12 27 mg, 11/12 26 mg, 1/13 25 mg, 3/13 24 mg, 4/13 23 mg,6/13 22 mg, 7/13 21 mg, 8/13 20mg, 10/13 19 mg, 11/13 18 mg, 12/13 17 mg, 1/14 16 mg, 3/14 13 mg, 9/14 10.9 mg, 1/15 10 mg, 3/15 9 mg, 5/15 8 mg. 11/15 7.12 mg. 4/16 5 mg, 6/16 4.5 mg, 9/16 4.2 mg, 1/17 3.48 mg, 2/17 3.2 mg, 4/17 2.2 mg, 5/17 2.0 mg, 6/17 1.74 mg, 7/17 1.58 mg, 9/17 1.27 mg, 11/17 1.0 mg, 1/18 0.79 mg Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 16, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 16, 2017 Went furniture shopping yesterday. It ended up being a very long day. I started working on things about noon, making some drawings, taking measurements etc.. Then we went to one home center and spent quite a few hours. Hit another home center to rule it out then went grocery shopping. Came home, had some dinner and then started double checking measurements to make sure things will fit and ended up working till 2am. OMG, I actually enjoyed most of it!!!!! I was able to pay attention the entire time, didn't get upset or crabby and liked what we came up with. This wouldn't have happened eight months ago. Today we are going to make the purchases and arrange for delivery to happen before we leave town on Wednesday. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Mentor Happy2Heal Posted December 16, 2017 Mentor Share Posted December 16, 2017 oh wow Tom, that's great!! it's so good to see that things improve this way, even after getting to zero enjoy your new furniture and your trip out of town happy holidays!! pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until Sept, then acute WD hit!! reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106 Tapered off to zero by Oct. 2017 Doing very well. Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs Link to comment
AmyK Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 I am so happy for you, Tom! Wonderful feeling. Merry x-mas to you and your wife. Hugs, Amy Current dose: 0! Free! Quit June 2017. 2017: Last dose zoloft: 17 June 0,00065 mg 18 May 0, 001 mg 14 May 0,002 mg 9 May 0,003 mg 28 April 0,006 mg 19 April 0,009 mg 8 April 0,013 mg 25 March 0,019 mg 22 March 0,039 mg 18 March 0,052 mg 16 March 0,079 mg 4 March 0,086 1 March 0,099 mg 22 February 0,11 mg 15 February 0,13 mg 6 February 0,145 mg 24 January 0,15 mg 19 January 0,19 mg 10 January 0,20 mg 3 January 2016: 0,98 to 0,22 mg; 2015: 2,35 to 1,01 mg; 2014: 4,9 to 2,5 mg; 2013: 9,1 to 5,1 mg; 2012: 15,7 to 9,7 mg; 2011: Started on 25 mg - then 50 mg- dropped to 25- to 12.5 mg - back to 25 mg - after 18.75 mg started tiny tapering to 16.6 mg Started on 25 mg Zoloft in March 2011 due to stressrelated tinnitus that gave me panicattacks. Had a terrible reaction to Zoloft from start, but was told to "hold on". After four months I was stuck. Therefore the long taper. Crazy, I know... Super sensitive to drops and have dropped by 4-6 % from the previous dose. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 20, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 20, 2017 The furniture arrived yesterday. There were only two delivery men, but it was like a swarm of locusts had descended on the house. Very hard to keep up with them and get the small adjustments done before everything was installed or positioned. It was a bit stressful for a while but once it was over things calmed right down. Now I have to get use to a new recliner. It's quite comfortable, but everything is powered and the switches are in a different place than the catches on the old one. It's going to take a bit of practice, but I'll be driving it like a pro in no time. (Yea, just try to force me to practice using my recliner I dare you.) The rest of the day was spent packing. Had some moderate anxiety a lot of the day, some neuro, some about the trip. It broke a couple of hours ago so I'm feeling pretty good right now. Have to go to bed early because we have to leave for the airport first thing. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Gridley Posted December 20, 2017 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 20, 2017 I'll bet that recliner will fly. Check the instructions. Gridley Introduction Lexapro 20 mg since 2004. Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017. End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg Oct. 30, 2020 Jump to zero from 0.025mg. Current dose: 0.000mg 3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete. Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium End 2021 year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper. Taper is 95% complete. Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986. Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper. Current dose as of April 1: 6.8mg Taper is 91% complete. Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 21, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 21, 2017 I wish I was flying my recliner Gridley. Actually the flights to get to Portland went well, but they managed to lose all of our luggage. It was put on a different flight under a different name so it was still in Los Angeles when we arrived in Portand. They told us they would deliver it at 2am this morning. Monica stayed up until 4:30 and no baggage. Now it's meant to be delivered this afternoon. So far the airlines isn't scoring too well. Interestingly enough I decided yesterday to carry some basic toiletries in my carry-on bag, so I just have to put up with dirty cloths for the day. So I'm sitting here enjoying the frost and fog waiting for my warm cloths to arrive. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator Frogie Posted December 22, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 22, 2017 Hi Tom: I hope they found your luggage and you can have clean clothes. I posted on my thread on what's going on with me. Sounds like you've been very busy. Hope you have a Merry Christmas. Take care, Frogie xx PREVIOUS medications and discontinuations: Have been on medications since 1996. Valium, Gabapentin, Lamictal, Prilosec and Zantac from 2000 to 2015 with a fast taper by a psychiatrist. Liquid Lexapro Nov, 2016 to 31-March, 2019 Lexapro free!!! (total Lexapro taper was 4 years-started with pill form) ---CURRENT MEDICATIONS:Supplements:Milk Thistle, Metamucil, Magnesium Citrate, Vitamin D3, Levothyroxine 25mcg, Vitamin C, Krill oil. Xanax 1mg 3x day June, 2000 to 19-September, 2020 Went from .150 grams (average weight of 1 Xanax) 3x day to .003 grams 3x day. April 1, 2021 went back on 1mg a day. Started tapering May 19, 2023. July 28, 2023-approximately .87mg. Dr. fast tapered me at the end and realized he messed up. Prescribe it again and I am doing "slower than a turtle" taper. 19-September, 2020 Xanax free!!! (total Xanax taper was 15-1/2 months-1-June, 2019-19-September, 2020) I am not a medical professional. The suggestions I make are based on personal experience. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 22, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 22, 2017 We finally got the luggage. There were a lot of phone calls and no one on their end seemed to know what was going on. They said it was here, it was in LA, it was delivered to the wrong address hours ago, it never got on the delivery truck. They were polite but clueless. Anyway we have clean socks now, and warm cloths. We're having freezing rain right now and snow will come later. I would like to wish a joyous winter solstice to everyone. From now through midsummer the days will lengthen as the light grows and life is renewed once again. May our recoveries follow the same path as we all grow and flourish. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator Frogie Posted December 22, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 22, 2017 9 minutes ago, brassmonkey said: We finally got the luggage. There were a lot of phone calls and no one on their end seemed to know what was going on. They said it was here, it was in LA, it was delivered to the wrong address hours ago, it never got on the delivery truck. They were polite but clueless. Anyway we have clean socks now, and warm cloths. We're having freezing rain right now and snow will come later. I would like to wish a joyous winter solstice to everyone. From now through midsummer the days will lengthen as the light grows and life is renewed once again. May our recoveries follow the same path as we all grow and flourish. Glad to hear you got your luggage and warm clothes. Send the snow my way. I really want it. Take care, Frogie xx PREVIOUS medications and discontinuations: Have been on medications since 1996. Valium, Gabapentin, Lamictal, Prilosec and Zantac from 2000 to 2015 with a fast taper by a psychiatrist. Liquid Lexapro Nov, 2016 to 31-March, 2019 Lexapro free!!! (total Lexapro taper was 4 years-started with pill form) ---CURRENT MEDICATIONS:Supplements:Milk Thistle, Metamucil, Magnesium Citrate, Vitamin D3, Levothyroxine 25mcg, Vitamin C, Krill oil. Xanax 1mg 3x day June, 2000 to 19-September, 2020 Went from .150 grams (average weight of 1 Xanax) 3x day to .003 grams 3x day. April 1, 2021 went back on 1mg a day. Started tapering May 19, 2023. July 28, 2023-approximately .87mg. Dr. fast tapered me at the end and realized he messed up. Prescribe it again and I am doing "slower than a turtle" taper. 19-September, 2020 Xanax free!!! (total Xanax taper was 15-1/2 months-1-June, 2019-19-September, 2020) I am not a medical professional. The suggestions I make are based on personal experience. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus SkyBlue Posted December 22, 2017 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 22, 2017 On December 16, 2017 at 2:03 PM, brassmonkey said: . OMG, I actually enjoyed most of it!!!!! I was able to pay attention the entire time, didn't get upset or crabby and liked what we came up with. This wouldn't have happened eight months ago. Brass, that is absolutely fantastic, and so well-deserved!!!!!!!! Hugs! ! ! ! ! ! ! (lol @gridley!) 2020: After 18+ years (entire adult life) on Paxil, a dangerous doctor-led "taper" in 2015, and four years tapering off the last 1 mg thanks to SA and the Brassmonkey slide, I AM COMPLETELY FREE OF PAXIL! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! Forever. 2021: Began conservative, proper, CNS-respecting taper of Zoloft, led by the only expert on me -- me. Making own liquid. 5-10% plus holds. 2022: Holding on Zoloft for now. Current dose 47 mg. Hanging in, hanging on. Severe protracted PAWS, windows and waves. While I may not be doing "a lot" by outside standards, things are graaaaadually getting better. Yoga (gentle to medium); walks; daily breath practice; nutrition, fruits/veg; nature; water; EastEnders (lol); practicing self-compassion, self-care; boundaries; connection; allowing feelings; t r u s t ing that I, too, will heal. (--> may need to be reminded of this.) "You are not alone, and this is not the end of your story." - Baylissa Link to comment
Marsha Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 On 12/2/2017 at 12:28 PM, brassmonkey said: I frequently see posts from members saying that they wished they were strong and brave like some other member, and every time I do it upsets me. The strength and bravery displayed by every member here is amazing. I posted this on another thread and wanted to shear it here also: Being brave and strong has nothing to do with not feeling fear or handle things in a "proud" manner. It's doing what has to be done to survive, sometimes minute by minute, hour by hour or day by day. If it's hiding in a dark place crying or going for a walk when you legs are too sore to move, getting out of bed and taking a shower, if it needs to be done and you do it, that's being brave and strong. Marching down the street exuding strength is a show of bravado which frequently accomplishes nothing, unless that is what the moment calls for. The people around you who appear to be towers of strength, are often brittle and will crack and break when things don't go their way. This is a big factor in why people in ADWD slowly lose many of their friends over time. The friends do not have the strength and bravery to face the situation and so in time turn and run. For those of us in the thick of it, we have no choice, to get through this we must go on minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day doing what needs to be done, and by doing so each and every one of us displays strength and bravery beyond the superhero level. Thanks so much Brassmonkey. Thanks so much. I am not a medical professional. My comments and posts are based on personal experiences. Please consult appropriate medical professionals for advice. I was started on psych drugs back in the late 80's. You name it. I probably was on it. 47 different drugs. Over 57 thousand pills. Tapered off final cocktail February 1st, 2013- September 9th, 2019. For Hashimotos I take Levothyroxine. Liothyronine. BP meds. For supplements I take B12 hydroxy. Fish oil w/D3. Bee pollen. Magnesium Glycinate. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Gridley Posted December 23, 2017 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 23, 2017 Thanks from me too, Brass. Gridley Introduction Lexapro 20 mg since 2004. Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017. End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg Oct. 30, 2020 Jump to zero from 0.025mg. Current dose: 0.000mg 3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete. Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium End 2021 year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper. Taper is 95% complete. Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986. Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper. Current dose as of April 1: 6.8mg Taper is 91% complete. Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Kristine Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 ....and me. BrassM you were able to put into words, what I have felt for many many years. From the bottom of my heart, Thank you. K Citalopram 20mg - 40mg ~ approx 2010 - October 2015 (stopped over one week) Parnate 20mg - 50mg and olazapine 5mg ~ Jan 2016 - May 2016 (ceased over 2 days) Lithium 450mg-900 mg and Thyroxin ~May 2016 - May 2017 Diazepam various doses (including PRN) ~ 2015 - 2017 Oxazepam various doses (including PRN) ~ May 2016 - June 2016 Lurasidone 20mg ~Mid May 2016 - Mid June 2016 Vortioxetine 10mg - 20mg ~ 6th June 2016 - 20th July 2016 (abruptly ceased) Amitriptyline 200mg ~July 2016 - September 2016 (ceased over 1 week) Nortriptyline (dose ?) ~October 2016 ~ November 2016 (abruptly ceased) Seroquel XR 100mg - 300mg ~ May 2016 - August 2017 (ceased over 3 weeks) Escitalopram 10mg - 30mg ~ August 2016 - March 2017 (ceased over 2 weeks) Bupropion 300mg ~ December 2016 - May 2017 (ceased over 1 week) Clonazepam 1.5mg daily ~ July 2016 (started tapering May 2017 - September 2017 currently on 0.375mg..ie 0.125mg TDS) 27th May 2018 5% 0.357mg (possible paradoxical reaction - see benzo thread) 28th June 5% 0.337mg, 28th July 10% 0.303mg, 12th September10% 0.272mg, 18th September reinstated 10% due to intolerable WD 0.303mg, 1st October-11th Oct 10% (1% reduction over 10 days) 0.272mg, 22nd October clonazepam ceased crossed over 10mg diazepam Dexamphatamine 20mg ~ December 2016 (started tapering October 2017 - tapered 1.25mg 4th Dec 2017, 1.25mg 19th Dec 2017 6.25mg, Speed up decrease due to major interaction between Dex and fluoxetine- ref to thread 10% 17th Feb 2018 5.63mg, 10% 21st Feb 2018 5.1mg, 10% 26th Feb 2018 4.5mg 10% 28th Feb 4.1mg, 10% 1st March 3.7mg, 10% 5th March 3.3mg, 10% 8th March 3mg, 10% 10th March 2.7mg, 10% 12th March 2.4mg, 10% 14th March 2.16mg, 10% 16th March 1.94mg, 10% 18th March 1.74mg, 10% 20th March 1.57mg, 10% 21st March 1.41mg, 10% 22nd March 1.26mg, 10% 23rd March 1.13mg, 10% 24th March 1.01mg, 10% 25th March 0.9mg, 10% 27th March 0.81mg, 10% 29th March 0.73mg, 10% 31st March 0.66mg, 10% 2nd April 0.59mg , 10% 4th April 0.53mg, 10% 6th April 0.47mg, 10% 8th April 0.42mg, 10%10th April 0.37mg, 11th April 0.2mg, 12th April 0.1mg (last dose) OFF! Fluoxetine 40mg ~December 2016 - 31 Jan 2018 reduced to 20mg (probable serotonin toxicity) 10th March 2020 10mg (1:1 ratio), 7th April 9mg, 1st May 8.5mg, 15th May 8.0mg, 27th May 7.5mg, 8th Sept 7.2mg, 2nd Oct 7mg, 19th Oct 6.8mg, 28th Oct 6.6mg, 5th Nov 6.4mg, 26th Nov 6mg, 2nd April 2021 5.9mg, 9th April 5.8mg, 19th April 5.75mg, 22nd April 5.7mg, 26th April 5.65mg,28th April 5.6mg, 1st May 5.5mg, 4th May 5.45mg, 7th May 5.4mg, 10th May 5.35mg, 12th May 5.3mg, 15th May 5.25mg, 18th May 5.2mg, 20th May 5.15mg, 22nd May 5mg, 10th July 4.5mg, 9th Aug 4.48mg (switched from syringe to pipette method), 12th Aug 4.46mg, 14th Aug 4.4mg, 18th Aug 4.38mg, 19th Aug 4.36mg, 20th Aug 4.34, 21st 4.32mg, 22nd 4.3mg, 23rd Aug 4mg (hold), (micro-taper) 12th Oct 2021 3.98mg, 14th Oct 3.96mg, 15th Oct 3.94mg, 16th Oct 3.92mg, 17th Oct 3.9mg, 18th Oct 3.88mg, 19th Oct 3.86mg, 21st Oct 3.84mg, 22nd Oct 3.82mg, 23rd Oct 3.8mg, 24th Oct 3.78mg, 25th Oct 3.76mg, 26th Oct 3.74mg, 27th Oct 3.72mg, (WD reached intolerable level, reinstated 0.06mg) 28th Oct 3.8mg, 7th March 2022 3.7mg, 21st March 3.6mg, 4th April 3.5mg, 18th April 3.4mg, 2nd May 3.3mg, 16th May 3.2mg, 20th June 3.1mg, 4th July 3mg, 18th July 2.9mg, 12th September 2.7mg, 18th October 2.5mg, 14th Nov 2.3mg, 12th December 2.1mg, 18th January 2023 1.9mg, 9th July 2023 1.88mg, 16th July 1.86mg, 23rd July 1.84mg, 30th July 1.82mg, 6th Aug 1.80mg, 10th Sept 1.7mg, 12th Oct 1.68mg, 23rd Oct 1.66mg, 30th Oct 1.64mg, 6th Nov 1.62mg, 13th Nov 1.60mg, (2:1 ratio) 30th Dec 1.597mg, 7th Jan 2024 1.595mg, 8th 1.592mg, 10th 1.589, 11th 1.587, 12th 1.585, 13th 1.583, 14th 1.58 cont… 5th Feb 1.56mg, 11th Feb 1.55mg, 19th Feb 1.54mg, 26th Feb 1.53mg, 4th March 1.52mg, 11th March 1.51mg, 25th March 1.50mg, 1st April 1.49mg, 8th April 1.48mg, 15th April 1.47mg, 22nd April 1.46mg, 29th April 1.45mg Diazepam 10mg ~ 22nd Oct 2018, 10th November 8mg, 14th Nov 7mg, 8th December 6mg, 30th December 5mg (Nocte), 7th March 2019 4.5mg,14th March 4mg, 5th April 3.5mg, 9th April 3mg, 18th April 2.5mg,1st May 2mg, 17th May 1.75mg, 25th May 1.6mg, 4th June 1.59mg, 5th June 1.58mg, 6th June 1.57mg, 7th June 1.56mg, 8th June 1.55mg, 22nd June 1.4mg, 4th July 1.2mg, 16th July 1mg, 30th July 0.8mg, 13th Aug 0.6mg, 28th Aug 0.4mg, 10th Sept 0.2mg, 23rd Sept Off! SR Circadin 2mg (melatonin) 25th May - 20th June Zolpidem 10mg 25th May (7 tablets) Supplements: Magnesium glycinate (soluble - sip throughout the day) "Whenever you feel yourself doubting how far you can go, just remember how far you have come. Remember everything you have faced, all the battles you have won, and all the fears you have overcome" Unknown Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 24, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) Over the past several weeks we have had quite a number of members asking about the effectiveness of various OTC supplements that are designed to "clear ones thinking and nourish the brain". All of these supplements are essentially the same, a combination of ingredients picked from a list of about 18 things that are thought to help mental problems and calm the nerves. Some of these ingredients do have a small amount of benefit for a healthy person. But for people going through ADWD they can have a severe adverse effect that can take months to reverse. This has been proved time and again by our membership. Over the years we have seen and experienced just about every supplement or "cure" that is available. We have also learned through painful experience that they don't work. Witnessing a successful taper be derailed by experimentation with a "cure all supplement" is very disheartening to watch and devastating for the person going through it. We all want the "quick fix" so we can get on with our life. But it's just not there. There are four things that have shown to be effective for getting off of these drugs; a very slow taper, and lots of time are the two main ones. Magnesium and Omega-3 oil are the other two, and they are iffy for some people. Anything else, except for our standard bag of coping tools which is a different subject, is not recommended. When considering a supplement please do your research. Dr. Google is the best place to start. Do a quick search on the supplement under consideration. Look at the search results, if they are all from people selling the product, that is a red flag. You will not get good information from people selling it. Find a listing of the ingredients and start researching them in the same manner. Look at their interactions, drugs they act similar to, the actual systems in the body they affect and the mechanism by which they work. Most often you will find that they affect the neurotransmitter in a manner similar to the drugs we are already taking, making them a poor choice. Frequently they will act on the opioid receptors, making them addictive and causing WD when they are stopped. Very disturbingly they will often act on both, which is very bad news for people in ADWD. The next thing to look for is scientific documentation. All your sites that sell the product will be quoting studies left and right as proof positive the product works. However, when you read the study the story will be different. The study more than likely is not real, was done by one of the manufacturers or was done in such a poor manner as to not be admissible by the scientific community. The results of the study will usually state something like "xxx may have some effectiveness for some people, but more work needs to be done". That statement is seen as "this supplement will cure everything for all people" by the people trying to sell it. If you've done this research, by now you should be pretty skeptical as to the value of this supplement. Then you must consider the following. The supplement manufacturing business is one of the worst regulated "medical" businesses in the world. It is impossible to know just what you're getting, how much of it and of what quality. There are some reputable manufacturers out there, but many more that are not. The hot new flash in the pan supplement is more than likely not. A good many of us are in the situation we are in because we believed what we were told without questioning it. Now that we are taking control of our future we have to be very skeptical so we can remain in control. There are a very limited number of things we can do, but we know they work. Experimenting with our minds and bodies is just too dangerous and potentially very painful to be taken lightly. Please learn the basics of tapering, learn and practice using the tools we have available, and above all don't look for the "quick fix" it will only slow things down in the end. This is not to say that people who are currently taking supplements should suddenly stop taking them. If they seem to be helping there should be no problems with continuing to take them. Just keep an eye on your symptoms to see if they start causing any trouble. If you want to stop taking them it is a good idea to taper off of them in a slow controlled manner. As I mentioned many supplements act by the same mechanism as SSRIs/SNRIs and thus will require careful tapering. Edited December 25, 2017 by brassmonkey Provided additional guidance. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
AmyK Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Merry X-mas, Tom and best wishes for the new year. ❤ Current dose: 0! Free! Quit June 2017. 2017: Last dose zoloft: 17 June 0,00065 mg 18 May 0, 001 mg 14 May 0,002 mg 9 May 0,003 mg 28 April 0,006 mg 19 April 0,009 mg 8 April 0,013 mg 25 March 0,019 mg 22 March 0,039 mg 18 March 0,052 mg 16 March 0,079 mg 4 March 0,086 1 March 0,099 mg 22 February 0,11 mg 15 February 0,13 mg 6 February 0,145 mg 24 January 0,15 mg 19 January 0,19 mg 10 January 0,20 mg 3 January 2016: 0,98 to 0,22 mg; 2015: 2,35 to 1,01 mg; 2014: 4,9 to 2,5 mg; 2013: 9,1 to 5,1 mg; 2012: 15,7 to 9,7 mg; 2011: Started on 25 mg - then 50 mg- dropped to 25- to 12.5 mg - back to 25 mg - after 18.75 mg started tiny tapering to 16.6 mg Started on 25 mg Zoloft in March 2011 due to stressrelated tinnitus that gave me panicattacks. Had a terrible reaction to Zoloft from start, but was told to "hold on". After four months I was stuck. Therefore the long taper. Crazy, I know... Super sensitive to drops and have dropped by 4-6 % from the previous dose. Link to comment
nz11 Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Excellent post Brassmonkey Seasons greetings nz11 Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted December 24, 2017 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 hour ago, brassmonkey said: Experimenting with our minds and bodies is just too dangerous and potentially very painful to be taken lightly. Please learn the basics of tapering, learn and practice using the tools we have available, and above all don't look for the "quick fix" it will only slow things down in the end. Great post as usual, Tom. This is a classic case of YMMV (your mileage may vary) and some people have done well in limited situations with some supplements, but, by and large, less is way, way more. I would, however, add the caution that those who have been on supplements for a long time (any supplement) should not run out and stop taking them. Like anything else, if you want to come off a supplement a taper of some degree is wise. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
nick1990 Posted December 25, 2017 Share Posted December 25, 2017 Merry Christmas Brass! I've recently started taking non gmo sunflower lecithin in powder form. It doesn't seem that there's much info on this site about it, and the benefits seem amazing. Haven't noticed an adverse effect from it. Do you know much about the product? Nick Started Citalopram in 2005 (aged 15) for apparent "OCD" - 60mg July 2015 attempted 2 x 10% + cuts 4 weeks apart. WD symptoms intense at times. Need to slow down. November 2016 - Resumed taper. 1.25 - 1.5% decrease weekly approx. 44.5mg November 2016. Jan 2017 42.5 mg. March 2017 40 mg. June 2017 37mg. September 2018 22mg. Nov 2018 Holding at 22mg to stabilise from moderate wave. January 2020 - Holding, mostly feeling fine, but still having some waves at times. February 2020 - Resumed taper , 1.5% reduction weekly/every two weeks. Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 25, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 25, 2017 Good point Andy. I added some additional guidance along those lines. Thanks 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 25, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 25, 2017 Merry Christmas Nick-- Non gmo sunflower lecithin or lecithin in genereal is one of those that has a huge amount of positive press and not much to actually back it up. The only claims it seems able to support is for helping lower cholesterol and giving a bit of help to the liver. All the other claims are unsubstantiated. Some people might find it useful, but you probably won't get much benefit from it. If you want to continue taking it and see what happens you probably won't have any real problems with it WD wise, but watch out for digestive trouble. Many supplements take three to four weeks to show any affect, so keep an eye out for any changes that might spring up in the next month. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted December 25, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted December 25, 2017 For some of us it won't be Christmas for another few hours, but already we have had some reports here at SA about members having adverse reactions to Alcohol. It has been shown many times in the past that even one small glass of celebratory wine with dinner can totally derail the smoothest taper. The "hangover" (adverse reaction) from just one glass of wine or beer might not happen right when you drink it and might not hit for several days after the fact, but when it does it usually hits with an uptick in symptoms that is described as going back to the beginning of the acute phase of WD. This new wave of symptoms can take several weeks to several months to resolve themselves and can dig a person into one of the blackest holes they experience during WD. It doesn't matter how good you're feeling before you take that drink, your body can not tolerate it and will let you know that you've done something it doesn't like. For the sake of your recovery please DO NOT DRINK ALCOHOL during this time of celebration, either for Christmas, Boxing Day, New Years or any day in between. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Mentor Happy2Heal Posted December 25, 2017 Mentor Share Posted December 25, 2017 great advice Tom a lot of ppl don't realize that alcohol is a neurotoxin. it doesn't help when the media comes out with statements like "drinking a glass of red wine each day can help you live longer" or other claims that have no basis in fact- or are just total misrepresentations of some usually small and poorly done study that someone ferreted out of some medical journal. for those interested, here's some info on what alcohol does to your brain: https://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/10report/chap02e.pdf pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until Sept, then acute WD hit!! reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106 Tapered off to zero by Oct. 2017 Doing very well. Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs Link to comment
Moderator Frogie Posted December 25, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 25, 2017 8 hours ago, brassmonkey said: For some of us it won't be Christmas for another few hours, but already we have had some reports here at SA about members having adverse reactions to Alcohol. It has been shown many times in the past that even one small glass of celebratory wine with dinner can totally derail the smoothest taper. The "hangover" (adverse reaction) from just one glass of wine or beer might not happen right when you drink it and might not hit for several days after the fact, but when it does it usually hits with an uptick in symptoms that is described as going back to the beginning of the acute phase of WD. This new wave of symptoms can take several weeks to several months to resolve themselves and can dig a person into one of the blackest holes they experience during WD. It doesn't matter how good you're feeling before you take that drink, your body can not tolerate it and will let you know that you've done something it doesn't like. For the sake of your recovery please DO NOT DRINK ALCOHOL during this time of celebration, either for Christmas, Boxing Day, New Years or any day in between. Thanks Tom: I don't drink but it's always nice to pass around helpful information like that. You are very knowledgeable and it's greatly appreciated! Merry Christmas! ☃☃🎄🎄 Take care, Frogie xx PREVIOUS medications and discontinuations: Have been on medications since 1996. Valium, Gabapentin, Lamictal, Prilosec and Zantac from 2000 to 2015 with a fast taper by a psychiatrist. Liquid Lexapro Nov, 2016 to 31-March, 2019 Lexapro free!!! (total Lexapro taper was 4 years-started with pill form) ---CURRENT MEDICATIONS:Supplements:Milk Thistle, Metamucil, Magnesium Citrate, Vitamin D3, Levothyroxine 25mcg, Vitamin C, Krill oil. Xanax 1mg 3x day June, 2000 to 19-September, 2020 Went from .150 grams (average weight of 1 Xanax) 3x day to .003 grams 3x day. April 1, 2021 went back on 1mg a day. Started tapering May 19, 2023. July 28, 2023-approximately .87mg. Dr. fast tapered me at the end and realized he messed up. Prescribe it again and I am doing "slower than a turtle" taper. 19-September, 2020 Xanax free!!! (total Xanax taper was 15-1/2 months-1-June, 2019-19-September, 2020) I am not a medical professional. The suggestions I make are based on personal experience. Link to comment
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