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Meimeiquest: my introduction


Meimeiquest

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I'm not sure if Zyprexa was the culprit. I guess you could try a tiny bit as an experiment.

 

Many drug switches might have contributed to your sympathetic overstimulation:

 

....

Recent completed tapers: Adderall, Nuvigil, oxazepam 8/12, Zyprexa 12/29/12 (was started 8/06)

Current meds: Lithium 600mg twice daily (started 11/06), Wellbutrin XL 300mg daily (started 1/07), oxazepam 25mg at bedtime (started 6/06, stopped 8/12, restarted at 30mg 12/10/12 during Zypreza withdrawal)

Drama started with situational depression & rotating day/night shifts 10/1989

ADs I have taken: Prozac (years), Celexa, Effexor, Cymbalta, Wellbutrin

Known conditions that affect my mental health: gluten intolerance, obstructive sleep apnea

Found this website 1/14/13

 

Meimei, which drugs were you on in December (below) when you couldn't sleep?

....She said I didn't have bipolar, but "we've got to get you sleeping." She cut the Cymbalta in half and gave me low-dose Seroquel, which made me eat like crazy. Within a couple of days I was in mild mania or hypomania, so at the next visit she stopped the Cymbalta completely, put me on Abilify, and started the oxazepam, and no one ever stopped it. That was in 2006. Last summer I heard a radio program on sleep apnea, and was diagnosed with severe obstructive sleep apnea...why I couldn't sleep and why I was so tired. So I quickly weaned off the oxazepam. But in Dec. I couldn't sleep and was literally screaming at my family in the last weeks of Zyprexa withdrawal...of course my pdoc has no solution, so I asked to restart the oxazepam at bedtime, and here we are. Now I can't sleep due to the unopposed Wellbutrin, but so far that withdrawal is going okay. The obvious problem was moving into polypharmacy instead of just waiting to see what would happen after the Cymbalta cleared.

 

My pdoc does a lithium level, all possible thyroid tests, and a basic lipid/metabolic panel, including kidney function indicators, once a year. My highest ever lithium level was 0.8, the latest was 0.4.

 

Thanks, Meimeiquest

 

What happened here? Had you just reduced Wellbutrin?

Big night at my house...2 normal dreams! Yay REM sleep! Felt like I could sleep and sleep...but blessed to get up early and go to work (everyone who CAN'T work knows how seriously I mean that--I've been there!). Meimeiquest

 

When you say "100mg SR is "steady" but not enough medicine," why do you feel now you're not taking enough?

 

Please look at adverse effects of lithium and oxazepam here http://www.drugs.com/pro/

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Thanks Alto,

 

After I wrote that, I became more ill, including lots of diarrhea (sorry). So I had a lithium level drawn, it should be back about 10 pm.

 

For the past 3 days, I have started what feels like fever about 2 pm, but there is no fever. Is that flu-like syndrome? Tylenol helps...will taking it hinder the healing process? It is pitiful that I feel so bad most of the time I don't even know if I've had a virus or not.

 

The dr. Phoned in my compounded Zyprexa prescription. Woot. It will be ready Monday. I don't know if I will take it or not.

 

I'm not anxious, I'm scared. I appreciate you all very much, but it is not the same as a knowledgeable doctor who keeps all aspects of care in mind and does a "real" assessment in real life. My dr. Is letting me drive, which I greatly appreciate, but I'm not a good driver and I've never been on this track.

 

Meimeiquest

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

Tylenol won't hurt your healing.

 

Are you taking fish oil? That might reduce this reaction.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Learned something today through a mistake...I have been continuing with the same symptoms, until noon, when I suddenly improved. Then I found I had accidentally taken 200mg of Wellbutrin SR instead of 100mg (wrong bottle). Pretty manicy and will be joining the ranks of the sleepless tonight, but at least I hopefully isolated the problem.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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I would just add that in my experience, with a history like yours (lots of recent changes in meds and dosages), even though it's tempting to try to figure out what's causing one's symptoms and to point to this drug or that and try to change things, it's not really helpful. You've been polydrugged for a long time and it looks like you quit several drugs in 2012. I would expect you to be having quite a few symptoms due to general CNS destabilization.

 

I'm a little disoriented tonight due to work shift changes (you know how that is, it sounds like!) so I don't know if I'm making sense. Just trying to say, it might not be helpful to microfocus on recent changes and tweaks up and down; your current symptoms are probably a mix of recent changes combined with the ongoing withdrawal and recovery from the changes you've made over the past year. My suspicion is that you aren't yet stable from all of that yet. It might be more helpful to keep things consistent and stable, as far as drugs, and to focus on the various approaches to coping with withdrawal that are discussed in various places on this forum.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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Thank you for that very helpful perspective. When you're manic, everything is a miracle :).

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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So the world's most sensitive person to Wellbutrin reports in. So I accidentally took 200mg instead of 100mg, was somewhere in the mania spectrum within 4 hrs. This lasted through Mon (but I did take 100mg on Mon.) Tues 100 mg and off with the nausea, dizziness, diarrhea, mania gone. Wed and today: taking 100 mg SR and adding little bits of immediate release to total 25mg as nausea/dizziness hit during the day. Helps within 15 min. Low grade manic thoughts in the morning. Otherwise feel pretty well. Sleep unremarkable (I try to ignore it). I know this is crazy, but concerns?

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

Sounds like you handled it well.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 2 weeks later...

OK, I just can't get comfortable with my Wellbutrin. Thought I was doing better on 125 mg, but not so much. Nausea, dizziness, little bursts of anxiety with what seems too little. Increased frequency of 5-6 mg bits, and now headache which is my prelude to mania on the Wellbutrin. I can take the symptoms, but this is exhausting my husband who takes up the slack. I am destabilized after a too-fast Zyprexa taper that ended in late Dec. I have only been cutting the Wellbutrin to keep ahead of the mania that chases me when the Wellbutrin dose is, for that moment, too high. What constitutes "too high" keeps changing.

 

Options:

Take the full 125 mg today and add in Zyprexa 0.2 mg tonight

Do the above, then ask my dr. for a script for Wellbutrin XL 150mg tomorrow

Ask to start Wellbutrin XL tomorrow, don't reinstate the Zyprexa

CT the Wellbutrin and just lay on the couch, off work, until the dust settles (extremely tempting)

Throw a temper tantrum

???

 

Meimeiquest

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Moderator Emeritus

LOL @ the last option Meimei!!

 

I'm so sorry you're struggling. I don't have anything useful to say except that I hope you work it out soon(:

July 2001 prescribed 20mg citalopram for depression;
On and off meds from 2003-2006.
February 2006 back on 20mg citalopram and stayed on it until my last attempt at tapering in September 2011.
By far the worst withdrawal symptoms ever. Reinstated to 20mg citalopram
October 2012 - found this forum!
Nov 2012 to Feb 2013 did 10% taper, got doen to 11mg - was going great until stressful situation. Cortisol levels hit the roof, hideous insomnia forced me to updose to 20mg.
March 2016 - close to 100% back to normal!



****** I am not a medical practitioner, any advice I give comes from my own experience or reading and is only my perspective ******

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I took Zyprexa 0.2mg last night. Very sedated (slept quite well until my husband woke me up 1.5 hrs. late). Unless I have problems today, I will try just 100 mg of Wellbutrin today and 0.1mg of Zyprexa tonight, unless someone has a better idea. The tantrum still sounds inviting.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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This will come as no surprise to people who read my posts...

Up dosed to Wellbutrin XL 150mg for 2 days. Definitely moving towards mania. I want to scream. My only comfort is I know I will not be the only one not sleeping tonight...

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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sorry to hear Meimei(:

July 2001 prescribed 20mg citalopram for depression;
On and off meds from 2003-2006.
February 2006 back on 20mg citalopram and stayed on it until my last attempt at tapering in September 2011.
By far the worst withdrawal symptoms ever. Reinstated to 20mg citalopram
October 2012 - found this forum!
Nov 2012 to Feb 2013 did 10% taper, got doen to 11mg - was going great until stressful situation. Cortisol levels hit the roof, hideous insomnia forced me to updose to 20mg.
March 2016 - close to 100% back to normal!



****** I am not a medical practitioner, any advice I give comes from my own experience or reading and is only my perspective ******

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  • 2 weeks later...

Meimei,

 

Just catching up on your thread and see you manage to hold onto your sense of humor throughout this ordeal. :). I am curious how you experience mania..? (if you don't mind explaining, of course).

 

Thank you for your words of encouragement on my thread. It's very much appreciated.

 

It sounds like you have a good relationship with your prescriber but wondered if you've read of Dr. Richard Shelton at Vanderbilt? He's written quite a bit about withdrawal from psych drugs (a few papers posted in Journals section).

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/778-shelton-2006-correspondence-from-dr-richard-shelton-about-prolonged-withdrawal-syndrome/page__fromsearch__1

 

I spent some time in Nashville in 2011 but did not get to meet with him. I find his work interesting (after I dissed him. :( )

 

Wishing you continued progress.

 

B

Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc).

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I'd like to hear of any encounters with Dr. Shelton. In my opinion, he's a total pharma sellout but -- who knows, he might divulge some information about withdrawal syndrome if you asked him in person.

 

See http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/778-shelton-2006-correspondence-from-dr-richard-shelton-about-prolonged-withdrawal-syndrome/ He seems to think prolonged withdrawal syndrome is a form of PTSD, a psychological reaction.

 

By the way, he's at the University of Alabama now.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Thanks for your notes, I will write more about my life history later. I don't know if I have true mania or not, but it is definitely abnormal. It first happened 3 months into Cymbalta therapy. To an outsider, I probably look really introverted and distracted because my head is abuzz with thoughts, and they all feel sort of connected. Usually they are just "brilliant insights", but once in awhile I act on them, and I am at times disinhibited in what I will say to people. Someone who was at our house just before my diagnosis said "she was so funny, talking a mile a minute, and then saying she had to take a nap." And I did find it exhausting. The big crisis I created was that I was supposed to start a new job in 6 weeks. I was going to get home at 7:30 p.m., my husband traveled a lot, and our girls were 5 and 8. I didn't feel good about any childcare options, so in my manic state I called HR and told them I couldn't take the job (actually, I left a voicemail) and didn't tell my husband, much less discuss it with him.. But after the Cymbalta was stopped, the withdrawal ended, and the new meds were on board, I didn't really have any (mania) problems except the wild thoughts on 2 separate, stressful days. Just the problem that my soul was on dry ice, and I had so little energy. Then with the Zyprexa stopped, I was ramping up, but I felt the same sleep weird dysfunction and I thought "This must be the Wellbutrin." So far it stops in less than 48 hrs. when I lower the Wellbutrin dose. But I am still going off on my 15-yr-old, and I really feel bad about that. These poor girls have been raised in the shadow of all this. The good part about the Wellbutin "chasing" me Is that I am learning what the mania feels like before it is established and I can cognitively decide if I should do or say something...I know that I am in an altered state and need to be careful. And It isn't as frightening because I know just changing the dose will fix it.

 

As far as doctors, I will never truly entrust myself or my girls to another doctor as long as I am sane. Prescriptions are now just interesting suggestions that I may or may not follow. I do like my dr., he's not the one who established most of my cocktail, but he was the attentive doctor and I was the compliant patient. When he asked how I was, I told him openly, and he did his best to keep me psychiatrically comfortable.

 

So at this point, I don't know if a specialist could help me, given all the info that is available here. Lithium is similar to Lamictal in that it also lowers glutamate levels, and I am hesitant to switch drugs...I feel like I need a new drug like a new hole in my head. So who would be most impacted professionally by watching me succeed at least in getting down to lithium alone? I would be open to any answer, but I tend to think my present dr., who has observed me since 2007, might be the best bet.

 

Whoa this is long....I need to go take a nap..jk

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • 2 weeks later...

Meimei, where are you? I hope all is well with you ..

Missed your presence ..

Please respond.

Thinking of you, and sending you love ..:) Lexicon

Hello,
I am tapering Lorazepam, and my daily dose is 1.125 mgs.

I followed a long hold for 5 months, ( Nov-March 2019) hoping to find some stability, 

but it did not work. So I resumed my taper and hold pattern.
For the last 3 years, I have been using a daily microtaper, cutting .001mgs per day, with holds as needed.
Symptoms are head pressure, labored breathing, palpitations, abrupt surges of dizziness, this being my worst symptom for now, internal tremors, my latest nemesis, unsteadiness, anxiety, plus many other symptoms that cycle in, and cycle out consistently. Not a day passes, without grief :(

I take no other meds.

January 2013 - 15 day quick taper off 10 mgs of Lexapro, and 25 mgs of Sertraline,

at a detox clinic.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi Meimei--wondering how you're doing.

 

I had AD-induced mania, classic manic episode, when I went into the hospital and was taken off all my previous meds and put on a slew of new ones including a couple of ADs at high doses. It was a trip!

 

Once again I would encourage you NOT to experiment with the Wellbutrin and dose up and down variably from day to day. That just keeps you in a state of destabilization. Better to pick a dose and ride it out until things settle, or else to taper very slowly in small increments with long holds in between. In your case given the history you describe I would expect it to take many months of consistency to stabilize.

 

I am concerned that the mania may not be helping you make the best choices for your health.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Sorry, Rhi, I did not even see your sweet message. I did go through quite a time in April and early May. I was unable to do my annual work eval as I couldn't think and moving my eyes from written instructions to computer screen made me so dizzy I could only do minutes at a time. In my defense, the instructions were 5 pages long, inadequate at that. It included a lot of web-based annual training...first year with the web-based system. They should have fired me or put me on leave. But that would have caused a staffing issue and an angry client, so here I am. It caused a crisis in me too...I just wanted my husband to say no one should have to work feeling like this...just quit and I'll take care of us. But he kept saying it was my decision, and I finally realized in my heart of hearts I do want to be a responsible adult....and I don't want the consequences of just having his income.

 

I don't know if I should say this out loud...I did cut down quickly and a bit erratically...and it turned out ok so far. I have just been getting better since I cut down to Wellbutrin 25mg twice daily. I even stayed up till 4:30 a.m. with my daughter one night and lived to tell about it (but it did make me much worse for a week). And I did finish the work eval. on May 13. And I am certain there will be waves ahead, but it seems like the mania is finally behind me. So, since maybe Aug., I have stopped Adderall, Nuvigil (alternating those), oxazepam (and then restarted it), Zyprexa, and 5/6 of my Wellbutrin dose. I am so lucky to have only had 7 miserable months. And for the record, I think my CNS system is stable enough that if I had tapered the Wellbutrin first, and then the Zyprexa, at a proper rate, I could have had 0 months of misery. But I was afraid that at best my pdoc was going to tell my husband I HAD to take the Zyprexa. In my heart, I was sure it was the Wellbutrin, but I couldn't prove it.

 

So now what? I'll save that topic for another post.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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I love Hudgeon's little updates about how he's doing, whether there is big news or not. So I am going to start Saturday updates, if I can remember. Fridays I am going to pretend I'm not a psych patient....no SA, no Googling on that topic.

 

This week I had a routine colostomy (joy) under Propofol (sp). First time in my life to go under, no problems with the anesthesia. After purging out my entire collection of gut bacteria (felt like), I am trying to start the GAPS diet. I think it has been helpful. Made bone broth all week long in the crock pot, putting it in the frig at night because the smell made me think in the night that I had left something on the stove.

 

I am not sleeping well, and sometimes I am tired. Maybe those two are connected? Otherwise no symptoms of withdrawal or psychiatric problems.

 

I am not going to taper again until my daughters go back to school in mid- August. The family desperately needs me to be present for awhile. Right now my daughters are on a FIVE WEEK visit with extended family in CO. A priceless time for my dh and me to re-evaluate and regroup. I thought about doing a round robin taper of my 3 remaining drugs, but I can't risk the Wellbutrin popping out again. So I will just do that when the time comes.

 

I am going to see Dr. David Allen, recommended on this list, on June 20. He has written a book on family dysfunction (that I haven't read yet). Here is what I know about my family, in a nutshell:

 

Father: Mother went into a severe mental illness after his birth that lasted maybe a decade. It involved psychosis, depression, violence, and horrific psychiatric procedures. She also had a shorter illness after his sister's birth 11 years prior. A picture of my dad at age 8...the most overweight child I have seen. Maybe weighed 175 lbs., his wedding weight at almost 21. Graduating from high school, he was "head boy", offered an athletic scholarship (but stayed home to help his dad...a horribly enmeshed relationship). Everyone loved my dad (his normal life ended with a serious head injury at age 61, although he is still alive). He was there for every emergency, had an amazing knack for doing funerals, was an incredible listener. And depressed.....those haunting eyes. His only hospitalization was after a promotion at age 52. My mom thinks he had some manic episodes in the early years of their marriage. But I don't know of him ever missing a commitment due to the depression. And he was always kind.

 

Mother: The ultimate survivor. Her very troubled mother left when my mom was two. Her dad remarried when she was 5, and she and her step-sister became my grandfather's "extra wives" sexually....What he actually said was "this is how God wants daddies to love their girls." The 4 kids had to do all the milking before school, and she was almost always tardy....she is sort of over- focused on getting things done to this day. Watching the beatings of her younger brother she says was one of the hardest things. So she married my handsome dad at 18 who seemed like the cream of the crop...and has always made sure life went on despite his issues. She has been a very dedicated mother...an unobtrusive pillar of strength to all. And I have a few memories of her feeling emotional distress, and she honestly (and I believe her) has no memory or belief that they happened.

 

4 sisters...all doing well at this point. Smart, get-it-done women in their own ways. And all 5 of us remarkably overweight with no insight why.

 

I calculated out that 20% of my grandmother and her descendants are mentally "different." Not even necessarily mentally ill, but as one author described her nephew in her mental-illness-affected family said, "The familial and familiar eyes of those who take life hard." As I have observed the younger generation, this propensity to take life hard was evident by age two. My mom says she would describe me as a young child as "intense."

 

Virtually every guy that I dated or wanted to date had a deep wound....things that left you unable to breathe when you first learned of them. Not "train wreck" guys...honorable guys trying to do their best in tough situations. I married one of them, although his trauma was not evident until our relationship was near engagement. My mom had to write an emotional/ relational reference for me years ago, and recently said she added to the bottom "There's something about marriage that makes Meimei depressed." I started Prozac 6 to 8 weeks after becoming engaged (ton of other things going on as well).

 

And so we were unable to have biological children. We adopted two beautiful girls from China at ages 13 and 10 months...who have the traumas of abandonment and institutionalization...and my craziness.

 

Otherwise we are all fine.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

Oh, Meimei, what a story. My heart goes out to you.

 

Have you seen Dr. Allen's blog? http://davidmallenmd.blogspot.com/

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Hi MQ...if we look into our family tree, there is alot of dysfuntional stuff there.  You are not alone.  Sometimes or should I say all the time, behavior is passed down generationally and we become imprinted.

 

I am n ot familiar with Zyprexa.  It seems that it has sedating qualities and I know that Wellbutrin is the complete opposite.

 

Are you nearing a point where there may be a balance so you can get some sleep.  It is a very hard thing to do.....balance these darn meds.  I can do this with Celexa and Imipramine, not perfectly, but I see that Celexa is stimulating and Imipramine helps with sleep.

 

These medicines are driving us all nuts......

 

Thank goodness we can support each other.  PM me any time.

 

Hugs

Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1902-nikki-hi-my-rundown-with-ads/

 

Paxil 1997-2004

Crossed over to Lexapro Paxil not available

at Pharmacies GSK halted deliveries

Lexapro 40mgs

Lexapro taper (2years)

Imipramine

Imipramine and Celexa

Now Nefazadone/Imipramine 50mgs. each

45mgs. Serzone  50mgs. Imipramine

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Meime what a remarkable family history. Thanks so much for posting. You really are a remarkable woman! xx

2003 - Sept. 2010 Effexor 150mg Fast taper off

April 2011 Massive panic attack, did not relate it to Effexor w/ds

April 2011 - May 2012 Benzodiazapines (Xanax 2mg then Valium 22mg - 2mg)for panic attack. 14 months of benzo withdrawals

April 2011 - October 2012 Effexor 150mg - fast taper off

January 2013 Due to panic feelings (Effexor w/d I now believe) and insomnia, 15mg Mirtazapine prescribed

April 2013 C/T Mirtazapine because of adverse reaction of high anxiety

April 2013 Reinstated 7.5mg - adverse reaction of high blood pressure and palpitations

May 2013 Reduced dose to 6.5mg - trying to stabilise

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Oh, Meimei.. thank you for sharing with us.

 

EDIT: may I ask what your screen name means?

Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc).

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Y'all...this may sound stupid...you have written sweet things, but I really don't get it. I'm the one who was raised by parents who told me daily that they loved me, who to this day would do anything they can for me ( although my dad's "can" is extremely limited). I have a small army behind me who do everything they can (very big can) for my husband, kids and me. When I was so sick with "bipolar" my mom came for 6 weeks to do anything and everything. It's everyone else who has suffered. What is my freaking problem?

 

I asked my sisters once when we were all together, "Does it ever bother you that Dad was so depressed?" Sister number 3 said "every family has something. This is just our something." Then she proceeded to list the somethings of the farm families in our little community. Everything she said was true. And she ended with this: "And I know every kid in ( the community) would have killed to have our dad." And she was right. People tell us frequently "Your dad was the best man I have ever known." I didn't have the guts to ask her what she thought was the reason she was found as a teenager having sex in my parents bed. We were not a family where teenagers had sex in the house (or the car) anywhere! But you could not pull anything over on my mom--she could sense it all.

 

The last forum I was on, years ago, was regarding adoption from China. Meimei is Mandarin for little sister. And we were on a quest for her.

 

I think I get the TMI award for today :)

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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Well, Saturday has come. I had depression early in the week, which improved. A whisper of nausea and light-headedness during that time. I am sleeping some better.

 

I think I see life like a giant rubix cube....if I can study, try, think enough I can work out all the problems. Maybe not!

 

Finished The Mind and the Brain. Very detailed and scientific, but interesting concepts. What you pay attention to rules. On that note, my husband told me I will never get well if I don't GET OFF THE INTERNET. So I am trying to do that.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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Another Saturday....I have really been symptom-free this week, except sleep, but that may just be my stage of life.

 

Saw Dr. Allen, who is listed on this site. His thoughts about withdrawal mirror Dr. Sheldon's....if it goes on for months, it's something more than withdrawal. He looked at me like I had two heads when he asked me how long I had been weaning from Wellbutrin and I answered Jan. I did the same when he told me I should just stop the Wellbutrin and "get it over with." I told him I would try 25% reduction. Otherwise, he was very objective...measured in making both diagnoses and prescriptions. He said I may or may not have bipolar II, he doesn't know me well enough to judge. If I do, I should be on only Lithium for maintenance. My husband really liked him...I think because of his low-drama, low med approach.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

Did you tell him how your symptoms changed when you reduced the dosage?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Yes. He said, "You're perfectly fine right now. You're going to have symptoms. You need to get this over with or you may start to get anxious...the nocebo effect." But I'm cool with it...I know doing something that doesn't feel right is what will make me anxious. And I am way over just doing what the dr. says. I do think that for me, the worst may be over and I can tolerate a 25% drop...but one thing happens and I will up dose. My priority for this summer is to be present in my life for a change.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

How frustrating. I thought he was more aware than that. I will drop him a line. Or two.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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I'm really fine. Maybe I could just let withdrawal overcome me and let him see me then...it would be a whole different person than the one he saw yesterday!

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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One more thing...I emailed Dr. Phelps at psycheducation.org about a contradiction about AD tapering and briefly wrote of my experience. He responded that although I had had a "rough go" of it, I needed to realize how extremely rare that is. He said he had experienced that with only one patient, but he still remembered it clearly after 15 years. Maybe it is really, really rare?

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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  • Administrator

I'm not sure why Dr. Phelps said that. I've had an exchange with him and he says he see tapering difficulties all the time.

 

I had a cordial exchange with David Allen. He believes in withdrawal syndrome. He doesn't think it's all nocebo. Perhaps he was trying to reassure you somehow. I believe you could have a beneficial relationship with him, at least as far as untangling the bipolar diagnosis.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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I think Dr. Phelps was talking about WD in patients who are abruptly taken off an AD and moved to a drug for bipolar.

 

And I think Dr. Allen does believe in withdrawal to a point. I'm not worried about that....you have taught me enough. It is the bipolar/lithium that concerns me, and I felt good about his diagnostic approach. My sister told me today that my cousin's college-aged daughter had a full bipolar episode. It is definitely floating around in our gene pool. She said "Do you need the whole family to come tell him how not perfectly fine you have been?" It is hard for the patients....but also for the people who care about us.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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I think you can rely on Dr. Allen to listen to you regarding the bipolar concern.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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Another Saturday: Started withdrawal symptoms yesterday (day 8 after dropping daily dose from 50mg to 37.5mg). Level of distress roughly that of a stay-home-from-work cold. I can do that. Poor husband....irritability one of the worst symptoms. Thankfully my girls are visiting relatives. Today changed from pieces of sustained-release Wellbutrin to DIY liquid to tighten up the dosing accuracy.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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