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Stabilizing - what does that mean?

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Littlegrandma

Thanks Kesh

after holding for 5 mo without a true window, I decided to cut my lexapro from 5 to 4.8 mg. I had a couple days where I thought this might be the right decision. 

Now, the akathasia is going full bore. And every symptom I’ve ever had is ramped up along with new ones. One of which is tinnitus. 

 

Did i I not hold long enough? Do I go back to 5 mg or wait it out? 

Am I ever going to stabilize? Or am I doomed to this hell forever?

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kesh

I'd love some answers to all this.

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Maresat

I'm sorry , I don't know why my post ended up here . I'll repost . But I'm also interested In This question of stabilizing too ! 

Maresat 🌺

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Altostrata
On 1/6/2018 at 5:17 AM, kesh said:

I've seen a few people post on this issue when new to tapering protocols and trying to figure out how to get well. I thought it might be a good idea to make a thread.

 

Many of us coming here have been bounced around by different doses and medications, and don't know what a stabilising dose might be. Are we in withdrawal or are we feeling symptoms induced by a dose increase or new drug? Will a hold at where we are actually give us any stability? Maybe on joining this forum we have been on the same dose for a while and feel no stability.

 

Myself, I have akathisia, in windows and waves. I don't know of anyone that stabilizes on akathisia, that is they hold their dose and see it stop or lessen significantly.

 

Healing to all.

 

There is no answer to this question -- it depends on individual circumstances.

 

For example, kesh, you are just starting to manage your own situation in the context of a naturally pessimistic outlook.

 

Is it too soon to say you'll never get stable? Why anguish over something that may never happen? Is this good for you?

 

If you are in a difficult spot with drugs, is it constructive to think it will last forever? As we can see over and over, many members here, even those who frequently post with  incessant irrational worries, get better, much to their surprise. They put energy into enhancing all that suffering for nothing.

 

In the converse, if you knew you were going to have to contend with symptoms of a chronic disease for the rest of your life, what would you do? This is a real test of character. Can you rise to dealing with that reality? Or would you sink into self-pity?

 

The one question I get most often is "When will I recover?" If I was able to answer that question, I'd use my prognostication abilities to do something a lot bigger than this Web site.

 

If anyone can do this, please get in touch with me!

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Downbutnotout
8 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

There is no answer to this question -- it depends on individual circumstances.

 

For example, kesh, you are just starting to manage your own situation in the context of a naturally pessimistic outlook.

 

Is it too soon to say you'll never get stable? Why anguish over something that may never happen? Is this good for you?

 

If you are in a difficult spot with drugs, is it constructive to think it will last forever? As we can see over and over, many members here, even those who frequently post with  incessant irrational worries, get better, much to their surprise. They put energy into enhancing all that suffering for nothing.

 

In the converse, if you knew you were going to have to contend with symptoms of a chronic disease for the rest of your life, what would you do? This is a real test of character. Can you rise to dealing with that reality? Or would you sink into self-pity?

 

The one question I get most often is "When will I recover?" If I was able to answer that question, I'd use my prognostication abilities to do something a lot bigger than this Web site.

 

If anyone can do this, please get in touch with me!

I know I am like this too. I don’t want to be. How can I stop thinking like this.? 

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Altostrata
4 minutes ago, Downbutnotout said:

I know I am like this too. I don’t want to be. How can I stop thinking like this.? 

 

We have discussed this extensively in your Intro topic.

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Downbutnotout
Just now, Altostrata said:

 

We have discussed this extensively in your Intro topic.

Okay, I’ll look back on it. I’m sorry I bothered you. 

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Maresat

Very great answer Altostrata , thank you for reminding us , me , of how acceptance is where out power lies, and the choice we have of how we choose to relate to what is happening . It is a learning curve for sure and maybe the most difficult thing about this whole process. I am grateful for this aspect , even though I wouldn't choose the suffering for any price! 

 

Maresat 🕊🌺🙏🏻

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Altostrata

You're very welcome, Maresat. I wouldn't wish this character-building exercise on anyone, but here we are and we have to deal with it.

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kesh
9 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

There is no answer to this question -- it depends on individual circumstances.

 

For example, kesh, you are just starting to manage your own situation in the context of a naturally pessimistic outlook.

 

Is it too soon to say you'll never get stable? Why anguish over something that may never happen? Is this good for you?

 

If you are in a difficult spot with drugs, is it constructive to think it will last forever? As we can see over and over, many members here, even those who frequently post with  incessant irrational worries, get better, much to their surprise. They put energy into enhancing all that suffering for nothing.

 

In the converse, if you knew you were going to have to contend with symptoms of a chronic disease for the rest of your life, what would you do? This is a real test of character. Can you rise to dealing with that reality? Or would you sink into self-pity?

 

The one question I get most often is "When will I recover?" If I was able to answer that question, I'd use my prognostication abilities to do something a lot bigger than this Web site.

 

If anyone can do this, please get in touch with me!

Thanks Alto. Yeah I'm catastrophising. Thanks for the gentle reminder that's what I'm doing. This is easily the toughest thing I have ever been through, and acceptance of that is even more difficult. Panic is almost easier somehow, even though panic is horrible. 

 

And thanks for this great site. Not sure where I'd be without it.

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rafatennis

Great feedback here, since I started the withdrawal process in Jan 2017 from Nortriptylene I had one period in July when I dropped from 18mg to 16mg where I had to hold for two months before continuing, I was doing the 10% protocol taper and was suggested by Alto to try 5% every 2 weeks and see how that goes. I also got some other good advice from a moderator because I too was unsure when I should resume my taper and she said if you aren't having drastic swings from day to day keep going, I did just that it went quite well and had no real problems except the usual 4-5 days of feeling the meds adjusting with half life etc. I've always been a steady exerciser usually 6 days a week lifting weights and cardio, usually  45mins-1 hour each workout but with fairly strong intensity, I'm in a place now where I dropped from 10mg  to 9.5mg, two weeks later to 9mg, what i did different was at 9.5 I really wasn't feeling as stabilized as I had on previous drops and pushed forward anyway and now I'm two weeks after the drop to 9mg and really have had very few windows so this advice really helped. I can't get in the weight room now without feeling worse, I've done virtually minimal to no exercise over the last week , if any of you are like me exercise and athletics has always been a big part of my life and stress relief and coming to the realization of having to stop for periods is tough but now I see necessary, gentle exercise will have to govern activity now. I would love to hear from anybody in reply who enjoys working out like I do and how it has affected them. I also meant to mention I'm 56 and have been on these meds at varying doses for the past 20 years. Thanks

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Meeto

Is it possible to never stabilize after drop?  It's been 4 months since my last drop and I have been getting worse regardless of what I do.

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MamaFlower
On 5/9/2013 at 9:49 PM, basildev said:

Yeah

 

I'm still experiencing fluctuating sleep after 2 months (since updosing). I'm beginning to wonder if I'll ever get better. It's comforting to know that others here have take longer than the seemingly 'average' 4-6 weeks to completely stabilize.

 

(Not that I want to take any pleasure whatsoever in other people's discomfort!)

 

I wish I could believe my sleep is going to get back to normal. Everything else has(:

 

I'd love to hear from anybody who has experienced complete (symptom free) stabilization after updosing/reinstating, but had to wait a much longer than average time for this to happen(EG: months instead of weeks).

 

Anybody out there?

 

This is me right now. Feeling completely hopeless. 

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MamaFlower
On 1/6/2018 at 7:17 AM, kesh said:

I've seen a few people post on this issue when new to tapering protocols and trying to figure out how to get well. I thought it might be a good idea to make a thread.

 

Many of us coming here have been bounced around by different doses and medications, and don't know what a stabilising dose might be. Are we in withdrawal or are we feeling symptoms induced by a dose increase or new drug? Will a hold at where we are actually give us any stability? Maybe on joining this forum we have been on the same dose for a while and feel no stability.

 

Myself, I have akathisia, in windows and waves. I don't know of anyone that stabilizes on akathisia, that is they hold their dose and see it stop or lessen significantly.

 

Healing to all.

 

this is me. 

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MamaFlower
On 3/20/2018 at 6:59 PM, Meeto said:

Is it possible to never stabilize after drop?  It's been 4 months since my last drop and I have been getting worse regardless of what I do.

 

this is me. I am so afraid, too. Just letting you know you are not alone. Desperate for answers. 

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Adili13

What is one to do if they simply aren’t stabilizing? It’s been six months with stabilizing still totally out of sight. Would it make sense to just taper at this point? So frustrating. 

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Lynnardgirl

No I wouldn’t until you stabilize ! It’s been 

almost 2 years and I still

haven’t stabilized! It can take months to years 

to stabilize ! Some do taper while still in withdrawals and they say it’s awful all the way through 

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Adili13

@Lynnardgirl that's definitely good advice.i'm just wondering though, how long are you willing to wait to stabilize? also, how are you certain you will? i'm really not trying to be triggering or anything, I just feel this way about myself often and wonder these things on a daily basis.

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sunnysideup69
5 hours ago, Lynnardgirl said:

No I wouldn’t until you stabilize ! It’s been 

almost 2 years and I still

haven’t stabilized! It can take months to years 

to stabilize ! Some do taper while still in withdrawals and they say it’s awful all the way through 

 

@Lynnardgirl I agree. How are you doing? I think you've had some windows?

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Lynnardgirl
6 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

 

@Lynnardgirl I agree. How are you doing? I think you've had some windows?

Hi hope all is well with you! Yes have had some windows but in a really bad wave that seems to be lasting longer than ever before ! Just want this hell to end... How are you doing !

God bless you 

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sunnysideup69
1 minute ago, Lynnardgirl said:

Hi hope all is well with you! Yes have had some windows but in a really bad wave that seems to be lasting longer than ever before ! Just want this hell to end... How are you doing !

God bless you 

 

Oh, those waves.....but it will hopefully bring you an even better baseline of improvement. I'm okay, have also been a bit more wavey over the last 3 months, had some life stressors which set me off. 

I'm 8 months into stabilising on Venlafaxine. This has turned into a bit of a longer journey than I had hoped...but we will get there.

 

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Lynnardgirl
1 minute ago, sunnysideup69 said:

 

Oh, those waves.....but it will hopefully bring you an even better baseline of improvement. I'm okay, have also been a bit more wavey over the last 3 months, had some life stressors which set me off. 

I'm 8 months into stabilising on Venlafaxine. This has turned into a bit of a longer journey than I had hoped...but we will get there.

 

What made you start taking Venlafaxine ? Did your doctor suggest it? This drug is awful 

to get off ! You are doing good , hopefully your 

just around the corner to stabilizing ! 
God bless you 

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sunnysideup69
7 minutes ago, Lynnardgirl said:

What made you start taking Venlafaxine ? Did your doctor suggest it? This drug is awful 

to get off ! You are doing good , hopefully your 

just around the corner to stabilizing ! 
God bless you 

 

Yes, unfortunately, I went to a psych last summer and he switched me to Venlafaxine. I'm on 75mg and just hanging in there. I've had good patches but really kindled myself from 2017-2019, so it's taking my system a long time to settle down. Fingers crossed I'll settle in the not too distant future...Also, you'll stabilize and taper again, I know it's hard waiting. But it will happen.

 

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Lynnardgirl
15 hours ago, Adili13 said:

@Lynnardgirl that's definitely good advice.i'm just wondering though, how long are you willing to wait to stabilize? also, how are you certain you will? i'm really not trying to be triggering or anything, I just feel this way about myself often and wonder these things on a daily basis.

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Lynnardgirl

I will stabilize and so will you! Sometimes when you mess up your CNS like I did it can take time 

I have been talking with another person on this 

thread and he hasn’t stabilized yet and going on 3 years! He said he is finally seeing healing but it’s been a long road! Not saying you will take this long, I have been on this medication for a long time and it’s going to take me longer 

to stabilize ! You will start healing a lot sooner 

just accept what is happening, it will make 

it easier to get through the withdrawals ! 
God bless you 

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Adili13

That’s awesome @Lynnardgirl you just made my day! Hearing from people like you on these forums makes it all worth it! Peace and love to you! Xxx

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Lynnardgirl
1 hour ago, Adili13 said:

That’s awesome @Lynnardgirl you just made my day! Hearing from people like you on these forums makes it all worth it! Peace and love to you! Xxx

I know this is so so tough and my heart goes out to you and every one going through this hell, but we all heal! Take care, God bless you 

 

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Adili13

@Lynnardgirlyou're right, i love your positivity. Thanks for taking the time to lift me up today! we need as much positivity as possible.

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Lynnardgirl

Can any one help

me understand why after 16 months of holding 

my waves are getting worse and longer ??? 
I thought I was getting better than bam this wave is not going away and it’s intense!

My anxiety will not let up! 

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sunnysideup69
4 hours ago, Lynnardgirl said:

Can any one help

me understand why after 16 months of holding 

my waves are getting worse and longer ??? 
I thought I was getting better than bam this wave is not going away and it’s intense!

My anxiety will not let up! 

 

Hello, I'm going to hazard a guess that it's 'just' a wave. This is the nature of healing, getting better, then getting worse again.

 You did a fast taper in 2018 and then it took a year to catch up with you (2019). So, you were in withdrawal as of the fast taper.

You went back on, switched dosage and switched type ie IR to XR to IR. So, on top of WD, that's a few changes right there.

Then, it looks like before you were stable, you began to taper.

So, all of this considered, I'm not surprised you are experiencing a long wave. That would be my best guess, it's purely a tricky wave, but I'm not a moderator....have you asked any of the mods whether they think it might be poopout? I'd ask, just to get their expert opinion. Then at least your mind would be put at rest and you could just focus on getting through the wave rather than worrying about 'why?' Try tagging someone and asking.

Sending you a big hug, this too shall pass xxx

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Lynnardgirl
8 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

 

Hello, I'm going to hazard a guess that it's 'just' a wave. This is the nature of healing, getting better, then getting worse again.

 You did a fast taper in 2018 and then it took a year to catch up with you (2019). So, you were in withdrawal as of the fast taper.

You went back on, switched dosage and switched type ie IR to XR to IR. So, on top of WD, that's a few changes right there.

Then, it looks like before you were stable, you began to taper.

So, all of this considered, I'm not surprised you are experiencing a long wave. That would be my best guess, it's purely a tricky wave, but I'm not a moderator....have you asked any of the mods whether they think it might be poopout? I'd ask, just to get their expert opinion. Then at least your mind would be put at rest and you could just focus on getting through the wave rather than worrying about 'why?' Try tagging someone and asking.

Sending you a big hug, this too shall pass xxx

What happens if it’s a poop out? Thank you so much for your reply 

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sunnysideup69

If it's poopout, I think you would be advised to taper. But don't take my word for that. Tag someone and ask......maybe brassmonkey.

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Lynnardgirl
1 minute ago, sunnysideup69 said:

If it's poopout, I think you would be advised to taper. But don't take my word for that. Tag someone and ask......maybe brassmonkey.

Ok thank you 

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gn11

I haven't posted for a while in AD. I have been tapering from Celexa for 4 years. I had a rough beginning and this forum helped me to figure out how to taper and to understand what was going on. About a month (I was at 0 .6 mg I made a couple of cuts that were larger and faster that I have in the past. One was 10 % which was my usual but 2 weeks later I was trying to experiment with another 10% cut when I accidentally made a 15% cut that is 25% in a month. I am having symptoms: worse ear ringing, mild stomach problems and increase emotional sensitivity. Right now I am at 0 .45 mg . I am wondering whether I should stay here for a while in order to stabilize or I should go up to say 0 .5 and see if I feel better . Any thoughts would be appreciated.

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Gridley
2 minutes ago, gn11 said:

should go up to say 0 .5

It's a close call.  Based on your increased symptoms, my instinct says updose to 0.5 and hold there.

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