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Amino acids for sleep - rotate aminos to avoid poop-out


Altostrata

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Hi Dalsaan,

 

I'm so sorry about your sleep problems. That has to be very troublesome for someone that has to work the next day.

 

I don't think there is an issue with rotating supplements that aid with sleep. The way I understand it, the problem comes with meds or supplements that cross the blood brain barrier.

 

Tryptophan is one that is believed to possibly cause 'down regulation' and Alto told me I could take it occasionally, so I think you would be ok in rotating yours.

 

I hope it gets better soon!

 

Hugs,

Tezza

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Absolutely, rotate the aminos.

 

This is very common with supplements, they'll work for a while, they stop working. Maybe they get topped up and your system can't feel the additions any more.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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Dalsaan- Im not sure how we havent seen one anothers posts before...

The same thing happened with me and glycine- it didnt make me sleep more, but I still felt more rested from the few hours of sleep I got. Also happened with inositol back in December. Maybe its time I gave inositol a try again. I took glycine for a week, was off it for a week, tried it again and... nothing. I wonder how long I have to be away from it to have it work again... and conversely, I wonder how frequently (as with your rotation plan) I can take it without it "pooping out."

 

Ive always loved sleep, but never before did I feel like my entire life was wrapped up in it. I remain hopeful that I can develop a more healthy relationship with sleep and that my body can heal to a point when I can relax/sleep adequately. I sure am hopeful that this is just withdrawal and my body can still heal.

 

Francis

2003-2010 up and down 10-40mg celexa for anxiety
2/2011 10mg
8/2011 5mg for 3 wks, then stopped completely.
middle of night waking after apx 1-2 hours of sleep (nightly), panic/jitteriness after waking
11/11 back on 30mg celexa, ambien/many supplements-insomnia/panic.
2/12 30mg celexa, many supplements (Magnesium eliminated morning tight chest/jitteriness). Off ambien!
7/12 20mg
8/12 15 mg(sleep improving,mood pos)
12/12 2.3 mg got liquid celexa!
1/13 2.1 mg
3/13 1.2 mg
4/13 down to .6 too quickly- cortisol spikes, middle of night waking, night sweats...
4/13 held at .6 for 3 weeks so far. Off most supplements as well. Withdrawal depression almost gone!

7/13 OFF OF CELEXA!!!

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Thanks everyone for your help

 

I'm going to try a 3 day rotation ie take nothing for longer than 3 days in a row and see how that goes.

 

I've tried all the cd stuff and I use a sleep hypnosis app on my phone with sleep headphones to get to sleep. This doesn't work in terms of getting back to sleep when I've woken up early in the night

 

Anyway see how the rotation policy goes. I'm thinking the trick is to rotate before poop out sets in or you may have to wait a fair while before it works again

 

Francis, let me know how you get on

 

Dalsaan

Please note - I am not a medical practitioner and I do not give medical advice. I offer an opinion based on my own experiences, reading and discussion with others.On Effexor for 2 months at the start of 2005. Had extreme insomnia as an adverse reaction. Changed to mirtazapine. Have been trying to get off since mid 2008 with numerous failures including CTs and slow (but not slow enough tapers)Have slow tapered at 10 per cent or less for years. I have liquid mirtazapine made at a compounding chemist.

Was on 1.6 ml as at 19 March 2014.

Dropped to 1.5 ml 7 June 2014. Dropped to 1.4 in about September.

Dropped to 1.3 on 20 December 2014. Dropped to 1.2 in mid Jan 2015.

Dropped to 1 ml in late Feb 2015. I think my old medication had run out of puff so I tried 1ml when I got the new stuff and it seems to be going ok. Sleep has been good over the last week (as of 13/3/15).

Dropped to 1/2 ml 14/11/15 Fatigue still there as are memory and cognition problems. Sleep is patchy but liveable compared to what it has been in the past.

 

DRUG FREE - as at 1st May 2017

 

>My intro post is here - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2250-dalsaan

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Hi Dalsaan,

 

So sorry you're having trouble sleeping.

 

My answer is: absolutely - this happens to me with any and every supplement I take (amino or otherwise). I took melatonin for a few days, that was great then didn't work at all. Same with Lactium.

 

I don't know what it is about my body but it seems to adapt really quickly to any 'foreign body'. I'm not one to take supplements just for the sake of it. They have to make me feel different in a good way. Maybe as Alto says, rotate them and see if that helps.

 

I'm no expert on tapering but I'd want to stabilize my sleeping before lowering the dose.

 

I hope you get some good quality sleep soon.

July 2001 prescribed 20mg citalopram for depression;
On and off meds from 2003-2006.
February 2006 back on 20mg citalopram and stayed on it until my last attempt at tapering in September 2011.
By far the worst withdrawal symptoms ever. Reinstated to 20mg citalopram
October 2012 - found this forum!
Nov 2012 to Feb 2013 did 10% taper, got doen to 11mg - was going great until stressful situation. Cortisol levels hit the roof, hideous insomnia forced me to updose to 20mg.
March 2016 - close to 100% back to normal!



****** I am not a medical practitioner, any advice I give comes from my own experience or reading and is only my perspective ******

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Have you tried Phosphatidyl Serine? It's supposed to help regulate cortisol. I'm taking it now, 100 mg. at lunch and dinner and it seems to help prevent early morning awakenings.

 

So sorry you're having all these problems with sleep. They seem to be one of the worst parts of withdrawal.

Psychotropic drug history: Pristiq 50 mg. (mid-September 2010 through February 2011), Remeron (mid-September 2010 through January 2011), Lexapro 10 mg. (mid-February 2011 through mid-December 2011), Lorazepam (Ativan) 1 mg. as needed mid-September 2010 through early March 2012

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -Hanlon's Razor


Introduction: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1588-introducing-jemima/

 

Success Story: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6263-success-jemima-survives-lexapro-and-dr-dickhead-too/

Please note that I am not a medical professional and my advice is based on personal experience, reading, and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers.

 

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Hi Jemima

 

I have tried it, didnt do much at the time but I think I was in extreme withdrawal. Might try it again

 

cheers

 

Dalsaan

Please note - I am not a medical practitioner and I do not give medical advice. I offer an opinion based on my own experiences, reading and discussion with others.On Effexor for 2 months at the start of 2005. Had extreme insomnia as an adverse reaction. Changed to mirtazapine. Have been trying to get off since mid 2008 with numerous failures including CTs and slow (but not slow enough tapers)Have slow tapered at 10 per cent or less for years. I have liquid mirtazapine made at a compounding chemist.

Was on 1.6 ml as at 19 March 2014.

Dropped to 1.5 ml 7 June 2014. Dropped to 1.4 in about September.

Dropped to 1.3 on 20 December 2014. Dropped to 1.2 in mid Jan 2015.

Dropped to 1 ml in late Feb 2015. I think my old medication had run out of puff so I tried 1ml when I got the new stuff and it seems to be going ok. Sleep has been good over the last week (as of 13/3/15).

Dropped to 1/2 ml 14/11/15 Fatigue still there as are memory and cognition problems. Sleep is patchy but liveable compared to what it has been in the past.

 

DRUG FREE - as at 1st May 2017

 

>My intro post is here - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2250-dalsaan

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  • 3 weeks later...

Dalsaan, so how has the rotation been working for you? I pooped out on the inositol, unfortunately. It worked great for around 5 days and now nothing. I guess your 3 days max plan might be a better plan for me too. I think tryptophan helped me in the past but only for a few days, so maybe I can try that again as well. Which calming aminos are you rotating? I wonder how long I need to be off the inositol and glycine before they can help again.

Im definitely having cortisol surges in the morning again, waking up around 4am sweaty, heart beating hard and chest tightness. Ugh.

When I sleep and wake up calm, its like pure magic- I feel wonderful and my day goes by so smoothly no matter what happens externally!

2003-2010 up and down 10-40mg celexa for anxiety
2/2011 10mg
8/2011 5mg for 3 wks, then stopped completely.
middle of night waking after apx 1-2 hours of sleep (nightly), panic/jitteriness after waking
11/11 back on 30mg celexa, ambien/many supplements-insomnia/panic.
2/12 30mg celexa, many supplements (Magnesium eliminated morning tight chest/jitteriness). Off ambien!
7/12 20mg
8/12 15 mg(sleep improving,mood pos)
12/12 2.3 mg got liquid celexa!
1/13 2.1 mg
3/13 1.2 mg
4/13 down to .6 too quickly- cortisol spikes, middle of night waking, night sweats...
4/13 held at .6 for 3 weeks so far. Off most supplements as well. Withdrawal depression almost gone!

7/13 OFF OF CELEXA!!!

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  • 3 months later...

Took ornithine last night and I was knocked out. For the first time in a long, long time I woke up and was woozy with tired. I took it as part of a parasite protocol and was very impressed with the sleep benefits..

 

Here are a couple of links on the amino acid l'ornithine and sleep:

 

http://www.livestrong.com/article/542405-ornithine-for-sleep/

 

http://forums.prohealth.com/forums/index.php?threads/sleeping-like-a-rock-with-l-ornithine-amino-acid.97360/

 

Alex

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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Alex, how much are you taking? What do you mean "knocked out? You slept through the night?? Please keep us updated.

4 years aprox. on 150mgs.Effexor for situational major depression.No AD before.
Tapered 150-0mgs in 3 months.

Tapered Quetiapine,Xanax in the last 18 months.NO med of any kind anymore.
First 3 months off acute w/d
Protracted w/d ever since.
Symptoms:Anxiety,anhedonia,insomnia,tinnitus,PSSD

04/13/2014 Awful Relapse.Recovered fairly fast.

3 years and 4 months off.

waves and windows.Very much recovered.

November 2015,health issue.Setback.
 

 

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I don't usually have trouble sleeping through the night, though lately I've been waking up a little more frequently and  having to try to fall back to sleep. Largely my problem, in the sleep area, has been not being able to fall asleep in the first place.

 

I took 1/2 of a 500mg l'ornithine or 250mg and became very drowsy and then fell asleep and slept well. When I woke up for good -- I did wake up once after 5 hours -- I was a little bit hungover and it took a bit effort to unroll from the covers which was actually itself a good feeling as I'm more often met by anxiety adn panicked waking.

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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Ok, thank you Alex.

I can fall asleep, but I wake up several times through the night.

I tapered off 12.5mg Seroquel about 3 weeks ago, and even though my sleep hasn't got worse.

Still very broken, but I feel it more natural.

I don't have the anxiety or panic feeling anymore...Hoping it gets better for you in this area too.

I'm holding 0.25 Xanax and tapering very slowly.My goal is to get med. free and let the w/d to unfold in the most natural way possible.

4 years aprox. on 150mgs.Effexor for situational major depression.No AD before.
Tapered 150-0mgs in 3 months.

Tapered Quetiapine,Xanax in the last 18 months.NO med of any kind anymore.
First 3 months off acute w/d
Protracted w/d ever since.
Symptoms:Anxiety,anhedonia,insomnia,tinnitus,PSSD

04/13/2014 Awful Relapse.Recovered fairly fast.

3 years and 4 months off.

waves and windows.Very much recovered.

November 2015,health issue.Setback.
 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • Administrator

alexejice, are you still using ornithine? Does it upset your stomach at all?

 

Rhi mentioned she's tried it and it seems to help for sleep.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Alto-

I haven't unpacked it yet so don't have any more info. I forgot about it actually, probably because I've been sleeping somewhat better. I may trial it against another amino supp which might work in a similar way...

 

When I couldn't sleep in maine it definitely helped me, the ornithine that is...

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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  • 1 month later...
  • Administrator

Any more experiences with glycine? I'm thinking of giving it another try.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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I am wondering about the arginine vs glycine competition.  

I looked into glycine for my son for the coldsore virus. L-glycine was recommended for immune/nervous system support and is preventative for coldsores. This might not be completely accurate, so worth checking, but as he is an athlete he has to eat a lot of protein to build muscle. I seem to remember that there is a problem with the action of the L-glygine supplement and arginine - another amino acid that shares a similar pathway - they work against each other in some way. I vaguely remember chocolate containing arginine. Anyway, I do remember that if you take Lycine you need to watch your consumption of arginine or the two work against each other. It also needs to be a good quality supplement and taken in pretty high quantities I remember. Had no idea it treated sleep difficulties. x

Does anyone know more about what happens when you take arginine and glycine together? From a bodybuilding site http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2011/03/arginine-glycine-synergistic-duo-for.html

 

Arginine + Glycine a Synergistic Duo for Gut Health  

Well-written and footnoted from a supplement seller http://www.vrp.com/amino-acids/amino-acids/growth-hormone-amino-acids-as-gh-secretagogues-a-review-of-the-literature

 

Growth Hormone: Amino Acids as GH Secretagogues  

Pop doctor Mehmet Oz likes the combination of glycine, ornithine, arginine, and lysine (GOAL) to increase the production of human growth hormone (hgh) -- a reparative hormone generated during sleep -- and there are a number of supplements providing this, mostly for body builders. http://www.sharecare.com/health/endocrine-system/what-amino-acids-increase-hgh  

 

Nothing that indicates arginine and glycine conflict, although, in sufficient amounts, they both tend to induce gut discomfort. Here, Dr. Oz discusses sleep drugs, sleep hygiene (part 3), and glycine (in gelatin) to reduce body temperature and support sleep (part 4) http://www.doctoroz.com/episode/the-truth-about-sleeping-pills

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 1 month later...
  • Administrator

alex, how are you doing with the ornithine?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Still using it but not every night. It does help with sleep and anxiety but I sometimes feel it makes other things worse. I wouldn't be surprised if it was proviral like l'arginine -- I suppose I should google.

 

Do you get any relief w/ it?

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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Hmm... I used to take l-arginine and it helped somewhat, but I get cold sores from it. Maybe the trick is to change it up.

'94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.
6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.
11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.
9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.
10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?
11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever.

1/13 Best I've ever felt.

3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows.

4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time.

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Arginine is pretty infamous for flaring cold sore viral outbreaks. That's reason enough to avoid arginine. Ornithine doesn't seem to have the same reputation. For some reason though I don't test to it much -- I muscle test myself to supps. I still take it but I don't love it for whatever reason. Sure wipes me out though.

 

if you try it Nadia, post your experience. Ornithine is inexpensive and sold in health and nutrition stores and Sprouts carries it here and probably Whole Foods.

"Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast
I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past
But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free
I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me.

Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there
Everybody's got to move somewhere
Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow
Things should start to get interesting right about now."

- Zimmerman

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I am thinking of giving this another shot as I continue to struggle to stay asleep on the pap machine. I was going to buy some lactum but since this is already in my condo, I might as well give this a shot. I will start off by using a very small dose when I wake up and can't get back to sleep.

 

To be honest, I don't think anything med or non med is going to work that great until my pap therapy is completely optimized which I feel it isn't. It is just a matter of finding out what is the best solution of out of not too great options.

 

I will keep folks posted.

 

CS

Drug cocktail 1995 - 2010
Started taper of Adderall, Wellbutrin XL, Remeron, and Doxepin in 2006
Finished taper on June 10, 2010

Temazepam on a PRN basis approximately twice a month - 2014 to 2016

Beginning in 2017 - Consumption increased to about two times per week

April 2017 - Increased to taking it full time for insomnia

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Well, I initially tried taking about 1gm of glycine, which is 1/2 starting dose in an attempt to get back to sleep on the machine.  Should have read what I previously wrote :) as that was too activating.

 

As a result, I took an additional miniscule amount of L'Arginine and I got an additional 1 hour of sleep which is equal to what 10mg of ambien gives me. Interestingly, my apnea index was greatly elevated which obviously I can't outrightly blame on the supplements without doing more testing. But if I remember coreectly, I had said previously that glycine caused nasal congestion which can lead to increased apneas.

 

Might try just the L'Arginine tonight if I wake up too early since it was immediately sedating and also see if my apnea index would not rise at the pressure I was using. It will aslo be interesting to see if I can stay asleep longer when I get back to bed.

 

I also might possibly try it before going to sleep.  However, I am concerned that because I fall asleep quickly, that it will be like the other drug and OTC remedies I have taken that seem to have a paradoxical effect of being activating. Stay tuned.

 

I know Alto and other posters stress this but it bears repeating, start very low, particularly if you know you are sensitive to supplments.

 

CS

Drug cocktail 1995 - 2010
Started taper of Adderall, Wellbutrin XL, Remeron, and Doxepin in 2006
Finished taper on June 10, 2010

Temazepam on a PRN basis approximately twice a month - 2014 to 2016

Beginning in 2017 - Consumption increased to about two times per week

April 2017 - Increased to taking it full time for insomnia

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  • 4 months later...
  • Administrator

Over the last few days, I have gone back to taking 500mg glycine with 0.5mg melatonin at 8 p.m. (plus my nightly fish oil, magnesium, 81mg aspirin, 100mg niacinamide) and, when I wake up, another 500mg glycine with fish oil, magnesium, 81mg aspirin, and a dash of NAC.

 

This seems to be helping me get better sleep. No stomach upset from the glycine so far.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Alto, is it mag citrate you are taking? If it is mag glycinate, do you account for the amt of glycine in it when you take it at night? And how much do you take when you wake (is it during the night?) I read the article posted above about lycine cooling core temp. I am still getting too hot at night but nowhere near as bad I was. The scalding sweats have stopped but i still get the oven-like heat. I have to choose what covers I use before I fall asleep. It is starting to get hot here and I have to admit I am getting scared that my night waking will get to the point where I won't get any rest at all. Can't sleep when I am too hot and I'd have to put the A/C on 60 deg F to cool down. Can't afford it.

 

Interesting thing is that I feel really cold inside in the morning . I cannot get any more sleep after about 7 am so I have to at least sit up and start my dreadful day of constant SA reading and solitaire playing. Otherwise my thoughts get frantic. But I am cold and when the temps were low here I had to use heat to get my core to finally warm up and it could take a few hours. Being cooler at night might definitely help.

 

Anyone else please chime in.

What happened and how I arrived here: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4243-cymbaltawithdrawal5600-introduction/#entry50878

 

July 2016 I have decided to leave my story here at SA unfinished. I have left my contact information in my profile for anyone who wishes to talk to me. I have a posting history spanning nearly 4 years and 3000+ posts all over the site.

 

Thank you to all who participated in my recovery. I'll miss talking to you but know that I'll be cheering you on from the sidelines, suffering and rejoicing with you in spirit, as you go on in your journey.

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Great to know there are alternatives to meds for sleeping.

 

I'm like a kid in a toy store in this forum - constantly stumbling across new and exciting things!

 

Wish I knew these things years ago.

Jan 2004 - 2008 25-50mg of Zoloft. 2008 - 2011 - Effexor ( sorry, forgot dosage)
March 2011 2 week taper and stop all meds.June 2011 start etizolum (3mg per day ) + mirtazapine 15mg
Sep. 2011 increase mirtazapine to 30mg per day , start cimbalta 20mg
2012 increase cymbalta to 40mg. Etizolam to 4-5 mg + add 5mg ambien
Aug 2012. Taper off ADs over 2 months. Stop. Taking 1mg etizolam and 5 mg ambien
May 2013. Start mirtapine 15 mg & cymbalta 20mg. Increase etizolum to 4-5mg
Jan 2014 double ADs.March 2014. Start 15mg of Valium to Stop alcohol . 2-3mg etizolum. Same ADs.
2weeks later stop etizolam and Valium . Stop ambien.

Currently I take 2 x 20mg cymbalta in the morning.

0.5mg of lorazepam 3 times a day - occasionally 5mg of Valium when I have an exceptionally bad night at home. April 22 take 1 epizolam.
2 x 15mg of mirtazapine in the evening.
Roserem 8mg sleeping tablet for one week. April 19 take Zopiclone instead. 20th half ambien (no sleep) April 21st Roserem. April22 half roserem.

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Keeping cool aids sleep.

 

The body naturally cools down at night, but it sounds like your temperature regulation is off, cw.

 

I take magnesium glycinate in doses of about 130mg each. I take 1 mag glycinate plus 81mg aspirin and 1 fish oil capsule every time I wake at night, which is usually at least once. The glycinate in the magnesium does not seem to affect the amount of glycine I can handle. It seems my tolerance for glycine has changed, it doesn't upset my stomach any more.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Hi-

For extra help with keeping cool I go to bed some night with those refreezable ice cube things that you find for coolers. I get the ones that are kind of flexible. I stick them in a sock & put one behind my neck & one under each shoulder. It really helps me fall asleep.

 

Jan. 1994 Pamelor

2000 switched to Zoloft 

2011 Zoloft pooped out- Dr. switched me directly to Lexapro15mg -had a horrible 6mths

2013 upped Lexapro to 20 mgs-pooped out

June 2013 Dr. added 150 Wellbutrin to Lexapro.

July 2013 Switched back to Zoloft 100mgs.Was still taking Wellbutrin. Lots of anxiety from the Wellbutrin

July 2013 Started to wean Wellbutrin- off by Sept.

Oct. 2013 added 400 mgs of Neurotin to the Zoloft

Jan 2014 Tapered off of the Zoloft and onto Prozac 30 mgs. Also still taking 400 mgs Neurotin

Feb 2014 Reduced Prozac to 13 mgs. Still taking 400 mgs Neurotin

Aug. 2014 Prozac 13 mgs. Finished with Neurotin. .7 Risperadol

 

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And the way I sense ambient temps is way off too but not as bad as it was. My mother nearly froze when we had abnormally cold temps this winter because I didn't realize it was too cold in the house and neglected to turn the heat on at night. I'd get up and be burning up inside yet my skin felt cold. The thermostat said 62 degrees and I'd be surprised because I because I used to get cold easily before WD.

 

I take mag citrate, it is the only thing keeping my tendon sheaths in the backs of my knees (and now the crooks of my elbows) from screaming in agony due to my reduction in activity. 400-600 mg during the day. I think I'll keep it and just try adding some glycine powder. I'm afraid to reduce the mag. The citrate doesn't bother my stomach and keeps water in my stools. The 'Calm' powder gave me the runs.

 

The constant feeling of unwellness is wearing me down terribly. Thanks for answering, Alto.

What happened and how I arrived here: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4243-cymbaltawithdrawal5600-introduction/#entry50878

 

July 2016 I have decided to leave my story here at SA unfinished. I have left my contact information in my profile for anyone who wishes to talk to me. I have a posting history spanning nearly 4 years and 3000+ posts all over the site.

 

Thank you to all who participated in my recovery. I'll miss talking to you but know that I'll be cheering you on from the sidelines, suffering and rejoicing with you in spirit, as you go on in your journey.

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Hang in there, cw.

 

Great idea, Zoe!

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 3 weeks later...
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Taking glycine with melatonin was making me sleep too heavily and waking me up with a paradoxical reaction. I now take 500mg glycine when I wake up in the middle of the night. So far, seems to help.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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I have now tried glycine for a week. I seem to stomach it OK. I sleep longer before waking but its harder to get back to sleep when i do wake. Tried 3 grams for two nights. Worked less good and i got seriously cranky/irritable during the day. Reduced to 1.5 grams and the crankiness went away. Hard to get correct dose. Will continue to supplement.

2010: Mirtazapine 30mg followed by Zopiclone 7.5 mg for sleep post surgery due to pain.
2012-> Tapering Mirtazapine and Zopiclone at different rates unsuccessfully.
2013: Hospitalized 10 days due to complete Insomnia. Forced back up to 45mg Mirtazapine, 7.5 mg Zopiclone and also Theralene 1 ml.
2013-03: Lab showed Vitamin D deficient. Found the vitamin d and insomnia connection. Supplementing vitamin d. Sleep improved by 1-2 hours
2013-04: Dropped mirtazapine to 30 due to severe side effects. Quit Theralene. Zopiclone 7.5.
2013-05 - 2013-11: Mirtazapine taper monthly 25 20 15 11 8 4 2.5 mg
2013-12 Holding M at 2.5. Need to taper Zopiclone due to daytime nausea and vomiting. Taper zopiclone 1/4 red every 5 d. Last Z 2013-12-19
2013-12-31 M:2.5. Reinstated Zopiclone 3.75 due to Insomnia
2014-01-06 M:2.5. Taper Z 1.9 ... 2014-01-14 M:2.5. Z 1 mg.
Jumped of Zopiclone 01-20. Jumped mirtazapine 02-16.

Theralene: 10mg 02-09. 8mg 03-09. 5mg 03-15. 4mg 03-24. 3mg 04-08. Jumped 04-21.
Zopiclone free for 251 days. Mirtazapine free for 224 days.

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  • 5 months later...

Oddly I have been waking up for years at 4am and this is the first time I have heard of glycine. 

I did a google search before coming here and found this link

from a chat if anyone is interested One person said it made them fat... something to do with liver glucagon was suspected... but not really followed up

http://www.reddit.com/r/Supplements/comments/1a899m/what_do_people_think_of_glycine/

 

thinking of trying it after more reading maybe

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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I take glycine daily. I am taking it for liver benefits. I also am taking 3mg a day. Ideally I am supposed to take 1mg in the morning and 2mg at bed, which I've not been doing but spacing it 3x daily between meals. After reading this I will try to take a more concentrated dose at bedtime to see if I get a sleep benefit.

What were you hoping glycine would help in your liver Alex?  I have a sleep pattern like you often up all night and see the sun before I sleep have had years of this.. sleep 4-7 or it switches around... all over the place for a bit.  I can't get a pattern that sticks. 

My body temp has been low for years even when I was having the hot flashes and night sweats when I am ill I rarely reach normal body temp and have not had an actual fever that registered on a thermometer in over 10 years tho I have been sick plenty of times with infections one would expect to bring a temp pneumonia for example.  

I almost always sleep with a heat source in the cold weather and can't tolerate heat in the summer.

I am thinking lowering my body temp even more may be a bad idea... any thoughts on this? 

 

I sure would like to not feel tired all day. 

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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At first search it appears no store so far has ever heard of glycine.  Guess I won't be trying it. 

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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  • 3 weeks later...

I get my glycine from gelatin. Great Lakes makes a gelatin free of dyes and sugars and the amino acid profile is impressive. It is most high in glycine and has 11g of protein in one tablespoon.

 

I put a few tablespoons of this in my evening tea before bed along with Mg.

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How did it work, Luna?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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