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Athena: journey through depression and antidepressants ...

Athena

By Athena
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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Hi you all! I am Athena. So my tough journey begins in 2001, when I am diagnosed with depression. I am then prescribed Effexor, which instantly gives me huge side effects: vomiting, tremors, sweats... But I am a tough warrior and I put up with them, for a year and a half. In 2005, depression comes back, and here starts the trial-and-error of many, many AD's: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. They all give me side effects that are almost as bad as the disease in itself.

 

When I would try to stop them, I would have really bad symptoms of depression, so I began to believe that that was going to be my life, which is quite depressing in itself! Last summer (2012), while being on Cymbalta, I developped really bad sleeping problems: I would sleep maximum 3 hours per night, and only with a med called Imovane. So I started to be addicted to that in order to sleep.

 

But I was so tired that I decided to stop the Cymbalta, so my doctor prescribed me Paxil. I was already on Wellbutrin as well. Paxil made me SO sleepy, that I tried to quit in Sept. 2012, first from 20mg to 10mg, which went well, and then 2 weeks later from 10mg to 0. Outch. That's when I found out about withdrawal symptoms, which I had never heard of before for AD's.

 

It was awful, but it might have been my revelation, because they were really PHYSICAL symptoms. I started to read a lot about the subject on the internet. I have learned a lot, and I have started to think that the depression symptoms I have been having when I tried many times to stop my meds were maybe in fact WITHDRAWAL symptoms. My doctor didn't think so.

 

Even so, I started to taper slowly from Paxil and to take good care of myself in other natural ways. So here I am now, on 7mg Paxil, 100mg Wellbutrin and 2.5mg Imovane.

 

My doctor keeps telling me to try and taper Paxil faster than I am now... so he can be able to prescribe me something else... a MAOI (?).I am not really interested in trying a 20th (?) medication. All of the previous ones have given me really bad side effects that have put my life on hold for 10 years... Why would this one be different? He claims that I am going to have a depression relapse if I don't take any medication...

 

So here is my first question: do you guys think what I have experienced as "depression relapse" when I was trying to stop the AD's many times in the last 10 years, might have been in fact withdrawal symptoms? And that if I taper them a lot more gradually, I might not have those "depression symptoms" forever? And therefore, I wouldn't have to take the so-called MAOI? 

 

My second question is: which one do you think I should taper first? Paxil or Wellbutrin? I wanted to get off Paxil as fast as possible because it was making me so sleepy, but right now, it seems like the side effects from Wellbutrin are more disturbing. It has always affected my breathing, like I have to make an effort to breath completely, and it has given me some joint pain. But right now these seem to be worse, breathing is more difficult and it makes the breathing muscles become too contracted and sore. Plus I know that breathing right is important during recovery... Also, the problem with Wellbutrin is that you're not supposed to cut the pill, since the covering is doing the "slow-release" job...

 

Well this was my story! :) I know it's a looong and boring story but it's mine... ;) If anyone would have any input or advice on one or both of my questions, I would be SO grateful!! Also, please forgive my English mistakes, it is not my mother tongue. :) I really wish a full physical and mental health to everyone here, and I am looking forward to know and discuss with you all!! All the best. -Athena

Edited by scallywag
white space (JanCarol); tags added (scallywag)

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Narcissus Newbie

Narcissus

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Hello, Athena. Sorry that you are going through this, but you've come to the right place. People here are very supportive and have all had similar experiences.

 

I would be very surprised if you weren't experiencing difficulties given the whole gamut of medications you've been run through. It's upsetting that your psychiatrist ran you through so many drugs without anticipating any problems. I would be VERY wary of his advice.

 

I have started to think that the depression symptoms I have been having when I tried many times to stop my meds were maybe in fact WITHDRAWAL symptoms.

 

This seems very likely. Remember that doctors aren't trained to recognize withdrawal symptoms.

 

I tried to quit in Sept. 2012, first from 20mg to 10mg, which went well, and then 2 weeks later from 10mg to 0. Outch.

This was probably too fast, as you probably know by now. This site suggests a drop of 10% every three to four weeks.

 

I'm a little confused about what happened after your attempt to get off Paxil. Did you reinstate back to the full 20 mgs and then drop down to 7 where you are now? If so, how quickly did you do this? Paxil is one of the more difficult anti-depressants to withdraw from, it's not at all surprising that you've had problems with it.

 

My doctor keeps telling me to try and taper Paxil faster than I am now... so he can be able to prescribe me something else... a MAOI (?).I am not really interested in trying a 20th (?) medication. All of the previous ones have given me really bad side effects that have put my life on hold for 10 years... Why would this one be different? He claims that I am going to have a depression relapse if I don't take any medication...

Don't listen! Your doctor clearly doesn't know anything about withdrawal, adding an MAOI will most likely not help at all.

 

do you guys think what I have experienced as "depression relapse" when I was trying to stop the AD's many times in the last 10 years, might have been in fact withdrawal symptoms?

Yes!

 

And that if I taper them a lot more gradually, I might not have those "depression symptoms" forever?

Tapering more gradually should reduce your symptoms, yes. However, with a nervous system that's been as assaulted by drugs as yours has it may take some time to recover completely. You will not be depressed forever, whatever your doctor may tell you. Besides, it is extremely likely that the pain and discomfort you've experienced over the years has been a result of the huge list of drugs that you've been taking. If you began to feel symptoms shortly after going off the drugs than they are withdrawal symptoms. Withdrawal symptoms are often misdiagnosed as symptoms of the original condition and then more drugs are introduced which in turn create more problems. It's a viscious cycle and it can take away several years of people's lives. It sounds like this may have happened to you, and I'm deeply sorry for all of the time that you've lost. I would consider dumping your current doctor as he sounds reckless and uninformed. Even if you stay with him I would certainly avoid going on another drug.

 

As for your questions about what order to withdraw from things, someone else should probably answer that. Sometimes we ask people to go back up to a higher dose and try to stabilize, but again it's not clear to me exactly how you to arrived at your current dose of Paxil.

 

Anyway, I just wanted to stress that what you're going through IS withdrawal, and it may very well have been withdrawal before too. You've been through quite a lot, and I have no doubt that things will improve dramatically for you once you've healed from all the medications you've been pounded with. Someone else should arrive soon with some advice.

 

Hang in there.

3 Years 150 mgs Effexor

2 month taper down to zero

3 terrible weeks at zero

Back up to 75 mgs

2 months at 75

6 or so months back to regular dose of 150 - was able to restabilize fine.

3 month taper back to zero

1 HORRENDOUS week at zero

2 days back up to 37.5

3 days back up to 75

One week at 150 - unable to stabilize.

Back down to 75 mgs

At 75 mgs (half original dose) and suffering withdrawal symptoms since October 2012.

 

"It is a radical cure for all pessimism to become ill, to remain ill for a good while, and then grow well for a still longer period." - Nietzsche

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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Hello Pgd, and thank you soooooo much for your advice and wonderful support. It feels so amazingly good to have finally someone acknowledging what I have been through and understanding... I had tears in my eyes reading your reply. Honestly, I don't know how I made it through and still be alive.

 

I will for sure follow your advice and NOT take the new drug.

 

Yes, I understand how you can be confused as I see I wasn't very clear about the drop of Paxil. After I dropped very much too quickly to zero and feeling awful a few days later (gastro-intestinal problems and pain, flu-like symptoms and aching all over my body, irritability, insomnia, intense dizziness, incapacity to focus and concentrate), then I searched all over the internet and realized what was happening to me: withdrawal.

 

So I went back to 10mg Paxil for about 6 weeks before starting to reduce again but much slower, to 9mg. I hope this clears it up a bit.

 

As for now, the symptoms I experience are insomnia (it's 4:30 in the morning right now...), extreme tiredness mostly in the morning or whenever I succeed in waking up after a more or less normal "night", irritability (not like myself), tremors in hands (my hands are not precise as they used to be). I also have difficulty breathing completly and joint pain which were induced by Wellbutrin, but they seem to have increased recently.

 

Thank you again Pgd for your reply, I am so very grateful. Take good care. Blessings, Athena

Edited by JanCarol
white space

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Rhiannon Rookie

Rhiannon

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Hi Athena. I agree that probably much or most of what you've been experiencing all of these years has been caused by the psychiatric drugs you have been on. I lost 20 years of my own life that way, suicidal and miserable and suffering from depressive episodes which it turns out were actually caused by the drugs themselves and by my attempts to quit taking them.

 

I recommend reading the book Anatomy of an Epidemic by Robert Whitaker for more understanding of how antidepressants actually cause depression. It will also help you understand why most doctors and psychiatrists are so ignorant about how harmful these drugs are and have no idea how to help people get off them.

 

Other people will be in here with more advice, who know more than I do about antidepressants.

 

I just want to say a few things.

 

First, I would recommend NOT changing anything for a while, other than maybe reinstating Paxil to 10 mg if you need to.

 

At this point your central nervous system is so destabilized that adding or taking away drugs will just make things worse. People with histories like yours, many changes of meds and sudden discontinuations, usually have developed very sensitive nervous systems and need to make changes very, very slowly and carefully. If at all possible, at this time you need to allow time for your symptoms to improve and stabilize before making any further changes.

 

Also, I want to say that you are not alone. Many of us have stories similar to yours. We're glad you're here and we hope we can provide you with the information and support that will help you heal and recover and get your life back. And there is much hope for that. You will certainly, given your extensive history, need to taper very carefully and slowly, but when people taper carefully they almost always do very well. I am almost off ADs altogether and I have had no further depressive episodes in spite of having a stressful life and working the night shift. I think your life can be better than you imagine.

Edited by JanCarol
white space

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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Meimeiquest Newbie

Meimeiquest

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Welcome and sorry!

 

I only know my experience, which may not resemble your situation. To me, the anxiety-based symptoms (including insomnia) are harder than the depression-based symptoms. So I wish I had tackled the most stimulating (anxiety-producing) drug first. Only you can decide what that is for you. So I am tapering Wellbutrin right now. Many people seem to come off easily, I am not, especially because I move towards mania when the dose is too high and towards what seems to be serotonin-withdrawal symptoms when the dose is too low. The right tapering range moves, but I am getting settled a bit now.

 

There is a thread on Wellbutrin tapering which explains the 3 drug release options. Right now I take 100mg SR in the morning, then I literally carried a baby food jar in my purse with 1/4 of a 100mg immediate release tablet that I would gnaw a bt off of when I felt dizzy or nauseated. The things we are reduced to! Today I made a solution of 30 ml water and 100 mg immediate release Wellbutrin, and I am taking 1.5 ml every 90 minutes between 10A and 4P. But I think I am different than most...I think most people just quarter the 100mg or 75mg immediate release tablets when their doses are less than what is available in extended or sustained release tablets. Just don't cut an XL tablet--that would dump the whole dose at once.

 

Good luck in whatever you decide!

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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lexicon Newbie

lexicon

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Posted

Hello Athena ..

Checking to see how you are ..It looks like you got some wonderful support, and sound advice ..You will be on your way to feeling better soon ..:)

Thinking of you, and sending you blessings ..xx

Hello,
I am tapering Lorazepam, and my daily dose is 1.125 mgs.

I followed a long hold for 5 months, ( Nov-March 2019) hoping to find some stability, 

but it did not work. So I resumed my taper and hold pattern.
For the last 3 years, I have been using a daily microtaper, cutting .001mgs per day, with holds as needed.
Symptoms are head pressure, labored breathing, palpitations, abrupt surges of dizziness, this being my worst symptom for now, internal tremors, my latest nemesis, unsteadiness, anxiety, plus many other symptoms that cycle in, and cycle out consistently. Not a day passes, without grief :(

I take no other meds.

January 2013 - 15 day quick taper off 10 mgs of Lexapro, and 25 mgs of Sertraline,

at a detox clinic.

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Finn Newbie

Finn

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Posted

Hello! I am so sorry to here about your struggles with so many successive medications. I wish your doctor had been versed in withdrawal symptoms so your brain wouldn't have had to go through so much. I hope you find the support and advise you need here.

 

And I'm just saying...

He claims that I am going to have a depression relapse if I don't take any medication...

 

I've heard that too. True or not true, they make it so doom and gloom--like you have to chose one hell or another.

Tapering Zoloft, Dec 2014

Started Lamictal

Re-started Zoloft mid-Oct 2014, 25-50mg

Stopped Zoloft end of Sept 2014

Started Zoloft July 2014, 50mg

Stopped Prozac from 3mg May 2014

Stopped Effexor Dec '13 Started 10mg Prozac

Reinstated Effexor 15mg on Nov 2013

Stopped from 21mg on Oct 2013
Effexor 112.5mg, since Dec 2012

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Jemima Newbie

Jemima

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Welcome to the forum, Athena. You've come to the right place for solid information and gentle support in your efforts to get off of psychiatric medications.

 

As others have said, the so-called "relapses" you've experienced were most likely withdrawal symptoms from getting off the meds too quickly. As one who tapered off Lexapro way too fast - before finding this forum - I can empathize with nearly every symptom you've described. Coming off slowly and sanely will alleviate a lot of the pain and depressive symptoms.

 

I agree with Rhi that for now you probably should just stay where you are and not make any further cuts in dosages. For one thing, you're tapering Paxil too fast for comfort. Paxil is a particularly strong antidepressant to taper. We recommend no more than a 10% taper of any drug with at least a month to stabilize between drops, and that only one drug be tapered at a time. I see you've also cut your dose of Imovane in half at about the same time you dropped from 9 mg. to 8mg. of Paxil. Either of these reductions could be causing insomnia so I'm not sure what to tell you. From what I'm reading, Imovane is extremely addictive and should also be tapered very slowly, like a benzodiazepine. Unless it was causing really uncomfortable side effects, it might be wise to go back up to your previous 2.5 mg. dosage and see if that helps. You've been taking it long enough that you've likely developed a dependency by now, but that can be dealt with later, after the antidepressants.

 

Is your doctor aware that Wellbutrin is giving you breathing problems? This can be an indication of an allergic reaction, so if you haven't told him about this, please do so at your earliest opportunity. It sounds as if it is merely uncomfortable right now, but I'm worried that it may get worse.

Psychotropic drug history: Pristiq 50 mg. (mid-September 2010 through February 2011), Remeron (mid-September 2010 through January 2011), Lexapro 10 mg. (mid-February 2011 through mid-December 2011), Lorazepam (Ativan) 1 mg. as needed mid-September 2010 through early March 2012

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -Hanlon's Razor


Introduction: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1588-introducing-jemima/

 

Success Story: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6263-success-jemima-survives-lexapro-and-dr-dickhead-too/

Please note that I am not a medical professional and my advice is based on personal experience, reading, and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers.

 

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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Thank you all for your wonderful support and sound advice. Yes indeed lexicon, people are really nice here! :) I must first reassure you that I don't have insomnia every night and that sometimes I manage to get a fair night of sleep. Also, I am not feeling the dizziness anymore,or very rarely, and the tiredness has diminished fairly. In fact, I feel better than I have been in a while. All the meds give me so bad side effects when I take them that it's a bit of a release to decrease them. For example, I globally have more energy now than when I was at 20mg Paxil, because the Paxil in itself would make me incredibly sleepy. In between drops, I don't feel too bad at all. So yes, going from 20mg to 10mg was fast, but I did not suffer from it. Lower than that, then I started to have WD symptoms, so I started to taper a lot more gradually: drop of 1 mg every 5 weeks or so. Do you guys think this is still too fast?

 

Jemima, yes my doctor knows about the breathing problems caused by Wellbutrin, but since all the other meds were making me NOT functional mostly because of extreme sleepyness and exhaustion, we decided that I keep it and don't complain too much about it... But right now the breathing problems seem worse, so I was really looking forward to put the Paxil taper on hold and to start a Wellbutrin taper. You guys don,t think it's a really good idea right? How long do you think I should wait? I will never really feel "stabilised" as long as I am on meds because the side effects from TAKING the meds are as bad as WD symptoms from NOT TAKING the meds. lol Does that make any sense?!

 

Well I am not sure what to do about that. If I do decide to stop the Paxil taper and start the Wellbutrin taper, is it ok to cut the 100mg "SR" tablet and take 75mg of it once a day? I think Alto mentioned in the link (thanks Meimei!) that Wellbutrin could be tapered faster than other drugs, but then again that might be too quick for my particular case.

 

Thank you very much Rhi for the book suggestion, I have looked it up and it seems very interesting. I might wait a bit before reading it though, it might make me VERY angry and I try to avoid those feelings right now!! ;) I'm sure you know what I mean. Like you said Finn, one hell or another! But we'll get out of it.

 

Thanks to all.

-Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

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Welcome, Athena.

 

I'm concerned about the breathing problems from Wellbutrin. It could also be adding to your sleep disruption.

 

(When did you reduce the Imovane? Did you have any symptoms when you reduced it?)

 

If I were you, I'd hold on the Paxil taper and go off the Wellbutrin gradually to eliminate the breathing problems.

 

Yes, you can cut up the 100mg SR tablet. It will become immediate-release; if you cut it into quarters to reduce by 25mg, you may wish to take 50mg in the morning and 25mg later in the day, too.

 

However, given your nervous system may be sensitized by Paxil withdrawal, you might want to go slower than 25mg reductions. To do this, you'll need to quarter 75mg immediate-release tablets (reductions of 18.75mg) or make a liquid from the immediate-release tablets.

 

Be sure to hold all the other medications steady while you reduce Wellbutrin.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Thank you so much Alto for your reply. Indeed, I am also worried about the breathing problems, therefore the urge to start tapering the Wellbutrin "crap"... Grr... Do you guys feel as angry as me? I know Wellbutrin makes me more irritable, and I know the WD does too, but since the few months I have been realizing was has been done to my brain, boy do I snap at anything!!!

 

Alto, yes I might try to reduce more gradually than 25mg. However, I am not sure I understand why I need to get the immediate release to do so... Doesn't the "SR" form become "immediate release" when I cut it? I am not sure my doctor will agree to prescribe me the immediate, and it might take a while. But if it's better this way I'll find a way.

 

Hope everybody is having a good Sunday. Take care!!

 

-Athena

 

PS) Alto, since mid-January, I have been reducing very gradually Imovane from 2.5mg to 1.25mg, by weighing it with a scale. To be able to sleep, I have been compensating with magnesium and a herbal tea mix (passionflower, valerian, chamomile, etc) at bed time and it helps about 1 night out of 2. The insomnia varies a lot. I realize I have been asking my body a lot, and thanks to all of you and the precious information you are giving me, I will taper only one med at a time, so Paxil and Imovane won't budge! And I will wait a bit before touching Wellbutrin. Slow but steady Athena! Breathe! Or at least try to!! :D

 

-A.

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

Posted
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Posted

Good to hear of the gradual Imovane taper.

 

I'm not sure what would happen if you mix Wellbutrin SR with water, the substance to make it sustained-release might cause it to clump up rather than dissolve. I suppose you could try it and see! You might see white particles floating around, that's normal.

 

See this topic for more info: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

 

Let us know what happens.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Posted

Thanks Altostrata, i will try that. Or how about just cutting a 10% off of the tablet by weighing it?

 

Good day to all!

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

Posted
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Posted

I find using the liquid easier than weighing, but if you prefer to weigh, by all means -- weigh.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 3 weeks later...
lexicon Newbie

lexicon

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Posted

Athena, thinking of you, and hoping that you are doing well. .

Please send a note when you can ..

Wishing you wellness, and blessings...xx

Hello,
I am tapering Lorazepam, and my daily dose is 1.125 mgs.

I followed a long hold for 5 months, ( Nov-March 2019) hoping to find some stability, 

but it did not work. So I resumed my taper and hold pattern.
For the last 3 years, I have been using a daily microtaper, cutting .001mgs per day, with holds as needed.
Symptoms are head pressure, labored breathing, palpitations, abrupt surges of dizziness, this being my worst symptom for now, internal tremors, my latest nemesis, unsteadiness, anxiety, plus many other symptoms that cycle in, and cycle out consistently. Not a day passes, without grief :(

I take no other meds.

January 2013 - 15 day quick taper off 10 mgs of Lexapro, and 25 mgs of Sertraline,

at a detox clinic.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

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Posted

Hi you all!

 

Thought I would give you all a little feedback since it's been a loooong while! I hope everyone is improving slowly but surely. Thank you Lexicon for your concern and message.

 

First thank you all again for your advice and help, really, it meant A LOT and affected my life positively. I tried to make one of all your recommendations. I decided to stick with Paxil 7mg and the tiny bit of Imovan, and to start reducing Wellbutrin by 10% a month, but by making even smaller decreases. By weighing and calculating the pourcentages, I decrease my daily dose of 1% every 3-4 days. So right now I am at 86mg of Wellbutrin/day. I just cut the SR tablet, and at the beginning I was taking half the dose in the morning and the other half later in the day, but now I just take it all in the morning and it seems fine. The night sleep might even be a little better this way. I still have the breathing problems, but maybe a tiny bit less.

 

The energy seems to increase VERY SLOWLY, a IOTA each month. It would be nice if it could go faster but I try not to complain because I am quite lucky not to have more withdrawal symptoms. However I wake up every night between 3 and 4AM and can't go back to sleep... I don't really understand why, because during the day I feel the tiredness, I would think that that would make me sleep better...?

 

Otherwise I run or go to the gym about twice a week, and try really hard to go more often. I meditate every other day and try to make it every day. I take vitamins, Omega-3, spirulin, drink a lot of water... Oh and the seasonal allergies are SOOOOOOO bad this year!!! Some days I can't even be functional. But I hang in there.

 

So all of it in one word: not too bad! ;)

 

Take really good care everybody.

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

Posted
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Posted

Very good to hear you're doing well, Athena. Please keep us posted.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Athena Newbie

Athena

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Thank you so much Alto! :)

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • 3 weeks later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

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Posted

Hello all!! Hope things are going better and better for everyone. I have 2 questions for you all:

 

1. Does anyone understand why I wake up practically every night between 3 and 4 o'clock and can't go back to sleep for at least an hour or two? I mean, I feel the tiredness during the day, how come I wake up at night?

 

2. Does anyone know of a really good scientific article that proves that ADs withdrawal syndrome really exist? One that would make doctors take me more seriously when I talk about my symptoms?

 

Thank you so much everyone and take really good care of yourselves.

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • 2 months later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

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Posted

Hi you all! I hope things are getting a little bit better for everybody. I don't say one day at a time, too discouraging. I say one month at a time. First, a little bit of news from me. In one word: not too bad. From April to July, I dropped Wellbutrin from 100mg to 50mg. I am still at 7mg Paxil and plan on starting reducing it again and putting a hold on the Wellbutrin withdrawal. Imovane is stopped completely because surprisingly, I noticed that I sleep better WITHOUT it...

 

So now the insomnia has decreased a lot, almost to none!!! So hang in there all of you insomniacs, sleep DOES come back!!!!!

 

What is new though is the digestive problems... For the first time in my life, since about 3-4 weeks, I have really bad acid reflux, stomach pain and the sensation that my throat/oesophagus is really tight or something is blocking in my throat... Does anybody know that feeling? I had a really bad crisis the other day after eating raw red onions (I know I won't do that anymore) and wasn't able to move from my bed because I had nauseas and all my abdomen was hurting. I am thinking about going to the doctor but I don't feel like wasting many hours waiting for someone to tell me they don't know why I feel like that... Please tell me about your experience with this kind of symptoms!!

 

Thank you so much everyone and take good care of yourselves!

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • Administrator
Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

Posted
  • Administrator
Posted

Hi, Athena.

 

Thanks for checking back.

 

In answer to your previous questions, the early-morning waking is quite common in withdrawal syndrome. We have a lot of topics on it in the Symptoms and Self care forum. There are many journal articles on withdrawal syndrome in the Journals forum. It is a documented medical fact, although medicine claims it lasts only a few weeks.

 

I'm sorry you're having digestion problems. There are a lot of discussions about that in the Symptoms forum as well. You may need some good enzymes or probiotics to restore your stomach functioning. Or, you may find you have become sensitive to certain foods and need to avoid them for a while.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thank you so much Alto. I wonder how a good person like you can exist in this self-centered world. Maybe I should stop wondering and only be very very grateful.

 

Very bad wave. I dropped Paxil to 6.1. With my scale I've been reducing my daily dose of 0.1mg every 4 days. I figured with  smaller reductions more often it would be easier than making one big reduction and staying there for a month. Now I have a doubt about this method. Or maybe it's just really tough, whatever the way we decide to do it. Now I know I'm staying at this dose for a while. I just wonder if I should wait until I get really well again to drop some more, or continue with my pace to get it over with. So sick of it.

 

Because being really well is relative in my case, as with many of you all I'm sure. In my world, being really well (like I was this summer let's say), is having energy to do SOME stuff, being able to sleep and to eat, and to appear to be something close to my true self, in social situations and gatherings. But being well still means to have to sleep 11 hours a day in order to have SOME energy, to rest a whole day after I have had a busy day, to be unable to run for more than 15 minutes (I used to be an athlete) and to catch a cold every 4 to 5 weeks. To check what I eat so I don't have TOO MUCH digestive problems and to be unable to brush my teeth because my hand shakes too much.

 

Being WORSE (like now), is being unable to sleep at night and having to do it during the day, being unable to go to my insurance doctor appointment because I am too exausted, not being able to think straight and express myself clearly (in my 1st language, so imagine in English!), being unable to make projects, being so boring and so bored. I feel like I am 20 years older in my body than 2 years ago, and 10 years older in my face.

 

I am sorry to throw all this at you all, times are difficult. And I'm sorry for the English mistakes and for not writing often, it takes a lot, a lot of energy to do so and most of the time it is simply inexistant.

 

I hope things will get better for all of us one day not too far away. Take really good care, sending a little bit of energy to all of you!

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Zoe Newbie

Zoe

Posted
Posted

Hugs & prayers coming your way Athena. Hang in there. You have come so very far, you'll get there!

 

Jan. 1994 Pamelor

2000 switched to Zoloft 

2011 Zoloft pooped out- Dr. switched me directly to Lexapro15mg -had a horrible 6mths

2013 upped Lexapro to 20 mgs-pooped out

June 2013 Dr. added 150 Wellbutrin to Lexapro.

July 2013 Switched back to Zoloft 100mgs.Was still taking Wellbutrin. Lots of anxiety from the Wellbutrin

July 2013 Started to wean Wellbutrin- off by Sept.

Oct. 2013 added 400 mgs of Neurotin to the Zoloft

Jan 2014 Tapered off of the Zoloft and onto Prozac 30 mgs. Also still taking 400 mgs Neurotin

Feb 2014 Reduced Prozac to 13 mgs. Still taking 400 mgs Neurotin

Aug. 2014 Prozac 13 mgs. Finished with Neurotin. .7 Risperadol

 

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Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Oh Zoe! I thank you so much, I needed that. *Tears in my eyes...

I am sending you hugs and sunny thoughts as well! :)

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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lexicon Newbie

lexicon

Posted
Posted

Hi my dear Athena,

I am saddened that you are going through distress .. :(

I think of you, and hope that if you do not write, everything is going well.

Please do not loose hope Athena ..You will win this battle ..

Just hang in there, and take it step by step ...As we have to keep walking ..

Please know, that I hold you in my heart, and in my prayers.

Love, Lexi

Hello,
I am tapering Lorazepam, and my daily dose is 1.125 mgs.

I followed a long hold for 5 months, ( Nov-March 2019) hoping to find some stability, 

but it did not work. So I resumed my taper and hold pattern.
For the last 3 years, I have been using a daily microtaper, cutting .001mgs per day, with holds as needed.
Symptoms are head pressure, labored breathing, palpitations, abrupt surges of dizziness, this being my worst symptom for now, internal tremors, my latest nemesis, unsteadiness, anxiety, plus many other symptoms that cycle in, and cycle out consistently. Not a day passes, without grief :(

I take no other meds.

January 2013 - 15 day quick taper off 10 mgs of Lexapro, and 25 mgs of Sertraline,

at a detox clinic.

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Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Oh dear Lexi, you are such a sweetheart.

And you are very much right, step by step, a month at a time. Thank you so much for reminding me, I am not the most patient person, but I have to learn. I HAVE to, there is no other choice.

I sincerely hope that you are doing well, and I think of you too. Take good care, hugs to you,

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • 2 months later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hello everybody,

Thought I would let you know how the last months have been.

After the too sudden drop of Paxil in September, and therefore feeling very bad, I went back up to Paxil 6.3mg (I had gone down to 6.1), and stayed there for a month. I started to feel better and was even able to throw a party at my appartment with my boyfriend. It was so good to be myself and being able to enjoy the company of the people I love so much. Right after the party, I started going down again, but this time by 0.1mg a week. I am feeling better than my last drop, but I do feel the changes, even if it's just 0.1mg at a time. Sometimes I still can't believe how such a small decrease can create so much change in my body, and then I start doubting and thinking all this is just in my head.

 

I plan on going down like this down to 5mg Paxil, so I'll almost be there by the new year. Then I'll switch to weaning the Wellbutrin some more.

 

Sending sunny thoughts to everybody in this grey November season. Keep the faith. We'll all get there.

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • Moderator Emeritus
Petunia Newbie

Petunia

Posted
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

Thanks for the update Athena, it sounds like you are doing well.  I agree with you that we will all get there eventually, as long as we keep going.

 

Petu.

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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  • 1 month later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hi all,

Could anyone who has tapered Paxil tell me if it ever gets easier? I am at 5.8mg now and the whole process seems endless since I can do almost nothing...

 

Thanks for your input.

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • Moderator Emeritus
mammaP Newbie

mammaP

Posted
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

Hi Athena, it does get better but maybe it would be best to hold for a little while. It's tiny amounts

that you are dropping but sometimes we just need to hold and let our bodies catch up a little. 

It will get better, it sometimes doesn't feel like it but you will get there. Even the slowest taper 

can have waves and windows, and it is usually best to hold while in a wave. In case you haven't already

seen it you can read about waves and windows here. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/82-the-windows-and-waves-pattern-of-recovery/

 

You are doing great and have made good progress :)

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thank you so much mammaP for your kindness and your encouragements. Do you think as I get to smaller amounts (maybe 2 or 3 mg?) the waves will get easier with fewer symptoms or no?

 

Thank you, all the best to everyone for 2014.

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Oh and thank you for the thread, it really explains it nicely.

What I am wondering is if, while you are still in tapering, the waves get easier as you reach the ZERO mg, or if they just continue to be the same?

 

Thanks to all

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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mammaP Newbie

mammaP

Posted
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

It's hard to say Athena, everyone is different. I had to hold for 7 months and in that time I had some

bad waves but they passed. I also had some great windows too and it's those windows that carried

me through the waves. It's easy to forget the windows while you are in a bad wave, every one feels

like it's going to last forever.  

 

I thought that getting lower meant I could speed up but that was my downfall. My taper had gone well 

until I got impatient and thought I could go off. I had to reinstate after a month and hold for 7 months.

There were some very bad waves in that time but thankfully they are more like ripples than waves now.

I hope your waves become ripples, with good long windows in between. 

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thank you mammaP, and I am so glad you only have small ripples and large windows! :)

Yes, I think I AM getting a bit impatient, patience is something I learned only in the last few years with the illness, and I still have to work on it!!  The thing is also is that I am trying to plan this starting year and the next years, and would like to start a family in the next few years since I am not that young anymore!! You know, all those plans I have in my head, and unable to achieve most of them... I have so much anger too... I am sure you know what I mean...

 

MammaP, when you are talking about your 2 beads, do you mean the really small white granules that are inside a capsule of Effexor for example? Wow, that is a small amount!!

 

Wish you all a peaceful evening/night + weekend. I wish a warmer temperature for those from around here so we can get out there a little!!

 

Athena

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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  • 2 weeks later...
Athena Newbie

Athena

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hi everyone!

I have a question for you all today: has anyone tried or know about Desmodium Adscendens? Thank you for your input!

2000-2001: Effexor              2005-2012: Celexa, Zoloft, Effexor, desipramin, Wellbutrin, mirtazepin, Lamictal, Remeron, Abilify, nortriptylin, Cipralex, Cymbalta, and others I don't remember. Really bad side effects to all.
Sept-Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 5mg      Nov 2012: Paxil 20mg --> 10mg
Dec 2012: Paxil 10mg-->0; 1 week later: HUGE WD symptoms. Started to get informed on the internet and back to 10mg Paxil.
Dec 2012-Jan 2013: Paxil 10mg, Wellbutrin 100mg, Imovane 2.5mg        End Jan 2013: P 9mg, W 100mg, I 2.0mg
Feb 2013: P 8mg, W 100mg, I 1.5mg      April 2013: P 7mg, W 100mg, I 1.25mg       May 2013: P 7mg, W 90mg, I 1mg    

June 2013: P 7mg, W 80mg, I 0mg       July 1/2013: P 7, W 70     July 22/2013: P 7, W 60             Aug 2013: P 7, W 50       Sept 2013: P 6.1, W 50     Oct 2013: P up to 6.3, W 50     Nov 2013: P 6.2 to 5.9, W 50      Dec 2013: P 5.9, W 40      Jan 2014: P 5.3, W40        Feb 2014: P 5.3, W 30      March-April 2014: P 5.3, W 26    May 2014: P 5.3, W 20        June 2014: P 5.3 W 15     July 2014:  P 5.3, W 14       Aug 2014: P 5.3, W up to 15     Sept 2014: P 5.3, W 14    Oct 2014: P 4.8, W 14      Nov 2014: P 4.3, W 14     Dec 2014-Jan 2015: P 3.9, W 14     Feb 2015: P 3.9, W 12    March 2015: P 3.6, W 12   April-May 2015: P 3.3, W 12    June 2015: P 3.3, W 10    July 2015: P 3.3, W 8   Aug-Sept 2015: P 3.3, W 6   Oct 2015: P 3.0, W 6   Nov 2015: P 2.7, W 6   Dec 2015: P 2.4, W 6   Jan-Feb 2016: P 2.4, W 5  March 2016: P 2.2, W 5   April 2016: P 2.2, W 4   May-June 2016: P 2.2, W 3  July 2016: P 2.2, W 2  Aug 2016: P 2.2, W 1  Sept 2016: P 2.2, W 0!!  Oct 2016: P 2.0   Nov 2016-Jan 2017: P 1.8  Feb-Mar 2017: P 1.9  April-May 2017: P 1.8   June 2017: P 1.6 July-Dec 2017: P 1.5  Jan-April 2018: P 1.6

Others: Cytomel 25mcg (thyroid), vit. C, vit D, Omega-3 fish oil, Magnesium bisglycinate , Melatonin 1mg, 81mg Aspirin, Milk peptides, L-theanine, Valericalm tincture mix, scullcap tincture, Suan Zao Ren (jujube seeds)

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Petunia Newbie

Petunia

Posted
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

Hi Athena,

I haven't tried it, or even know much about it, but according to this study:

https://www.thieme-connect.com/ejournals/abstract/10.1055/s-0033-1351960

 

It protected the liver of rats, when they were given some toxic substances, but it didn't cure anything.

 

Petu.

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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