☼ Cymbaltawithdrawal5600: Introduction

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

A topic I had posted in recently gave me a 'not permitted/can't find' error just now. It's ok. I was doing more research and wanted to post something I had found:

 

 

But we can also see that until there are ***p patents approved from which someone can make money, sick people will continue to suffer unnecessarily.

 

If this is the way things are, really, then I confess to being ashamed of my government.

[Lilu]

I have no clue. It was way back in the beginning, I think I had been taking Zoloft, again. I started feeling like I couldn't move, all I could do was lie on my side in bed, couldn't even cry. I had a distinct physical feeling like that of a hand grabbing my cheek and pulling downwards. Couldn't lift my head. My nursing training told me that depression shouldn't look like this, something else was seriously wrong and I didn't know what to do.

 

Got pretty doggone functional after a time. Started 2 businesses for myself because I had never been able to 'keep a job'. And then everything changed when I ran out of my medication. Found SA.

 

The end. (no wait, it isn't, I'm still here) (I am not recovered yet, am I? it's too soon....)

 

PS. I am still mystified as to why I was given cymb in the first place. All I can think is that it was a relatively new drug and I hadn't ever been on it. Sometimes 'throwing more meds' at the problem seems to work. Until it doesn't.

This started happening to me with Pristiq. I would describe it as feeling like my bones were made of lead. I felt like I was dragging or had to drag myself to do anything.

 

It's too bad that you didn't apply for patient assistance. Most pharmaceutical companies will provide medications to you for free if you have no health insurance or if your insurance doesn't cover their medication and you meet their financial criteria.

 

You were given cymbalta because its an SNRI and norepinephrine is an energizing neurotransmitter.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Lilu,

 

That is where I received patient assistance. My co-pays for Dr. visits ranged from $3-$6, group therapy (when it was available) the same. Lily's Patient Assistance Program (PAP) got me my monthly dose (no matter how many mg.) for $5. My neglect in promptly filing my yearly application for the PAP resulted in my inability to receive my cymb (since the pharmacy there was no longer getting 'free samples' from the drug companies). That drug at my last dose I think would have been about $400-$600. Had I even had a clue about what was going to happen to me, I would have had the presence of mind to buy even a partial script at retail somewhere (even at that pharmacy). I had a current rx, just not MY shipment from Lily.

 

 

You were given cymbalta because its an SNRI and norepinephrine is an energizing neurotransmitter.

 

And maybe that doc 'threw something at the wall (patient) hoping it would stick (work)'. It was/is specifically marketed for 'the physical symptoms of depression'. There is a subtle difference there. I had a weird physical symptom (to me). Maybe he knew I needed a kick in my norepi neurotransmitter pants. But I don't think so... its a moot point. I had a specific presenting complaint: something pulling my head down. The other stuff was secondary (couldn't cry for example). Remember, cymb was still new on the market.

 

My Dr. said she told me not to let my drugs run out. I believe her. And she does not know how sick I really got. I only have vague memories of how bad off I was when I read people describing the symptoms here. I will never know if I had a high tolerance to the pain of it or if I was so sedated while the drug was leaving my system that it masked the severity of it. It appears, this long out, that my fallout from meds is the mental disorder post withdrawal and underlying depressive tendency I have always felt (dysthymia). I may be one of those few people who do/did not suffer from protracted withdrawal syndrome and may never will. But my task is to deal with the disordered thinking/living that lead me to seek medication.

 

I learned here about 'anhedonia', that gut wrenching pain I always thought was just anxiety (cortisol spikes), and depersonalization/derealization. It occurs to me a lot that I may be 'recovered' already. I certainly feel well and I am able to work, though at at a reduced rate which may also be due to age and the realization I don't have to DO so much. I am re-thinking my priorities in life, I spoke about my crafting and relationship issues. I have truly stopped worrying about things that haven't happened yet and my 'future' (even with the sword of 'protracted withdrawal occurring months or years later as a result of cold-turkeying all those meds' hanging over my head. I really don't think I have anything to contribute here anymore.

[Petunia]

.... I really don't think I have anything to contribute here anymore.

 

 Really? 

 

Of course you have to do what's best for you, if you feel its time to move on.  But I for one would miss your interesting, thought provoking, witty and often funny posts, not to mention encouraging.

 

Are you going to write a success story?

[Narcissus]

 

I for one would miss your interesting, thought provoking, witty and often funny posts, not to mention encouraging.

 

 

I would too!

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Petu,

 

I had the oddest experience in the couple of hours (I think) before I wrote that post. Just sitting here trying to put words to it seems difficult. A thread I had posted in became inaccessible to me, I couldn't figure out what happened. I just now logged on after waking up from a sleep of only 2 hours. Instead of looking for that thread, to see if I am 'locked out', I came here first and saw your comment.

 

If I say:

 

"I often do not know what I am thinking or feeling until after I finish composing a post."

 

does that make sense?

 

That's what happened when I finished typing my story out to Lilu. And it's odder still that I cannot put down my thoughts at this moment, to give words to what was going on in my head at that moment to explain it to you. This is kinda how I feel:

 

My internal 'narrator' has lost it's place in the book.

 

Didn't you and I exchange comments recently about not being to remember what we were thinking at the time we re-read something we had recently posted? I'm having that now, in spades. But I do remember the feeling, I just can't write about it.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Hi Narcissus,

 

You'll see from my comment to Petu, I haven't a clue to what is going on in my thinking/feeling states. Oh God, please don't let me log on tomorrow and see a bunch of comments from people saying they'll hate to see me go.

 

I just can't seem to articulate the realization I had when I wrote what sounds like a 'goodbye' comment.

 

Please, God? Maybe you could tell the server to 'lose' those comments so I won't have to tell the mods to erase everything.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Ok, it's time to go back to bed. I've searched for the thread I posted a comment in and it has vanished. Maybe if I finish my sleep my brain will reboot and it will be clearer tomorrow.

 

Maybe I should stop reading about 'non-duality'.

[Petunia]

 Oh God, please don't let me log on tomorrow and see a bunch of comments from people saying they'll hate to see me go.

 

 

Not a word more from me.... where is a zipped mouth emoticon when you need one?

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

 

where is a zipped mouth emoticon when you need one?

 

 

RRRRRROFL!

 

{oh wait, does Petu really mean she might be GLAD to see me go?????} {but I am not going anywhere!} {didn't this just happen recently when I saw a comment Alto made to me saying the same thing?} {is my unconscious telling me something? Am I making the 'typing' equivalent of a 'Freudian Slip'?} {can I be the inventor of a 'zipped mouth emoticon' and be rich and famous?} {am I losing it?} {stop it, cw! you are NOT going crazy, you are just being a silly goose! Now stop garbaging up your own thread or people really will think you are nuts.}

 

Petu, thanks for the thoroughly enjoyable laugh! What a fabulous way to start the day!

[tezza]

Hi CW,

 

I thoroughly enjoy reading your posts! I tried to post to you a couple of days ago but have been having trouble with my Internet coming and going. Some of my posts disappear when my Internet goes and I don't have it in me to redo the post. (Plus, I've been babysitting and time is an issue)

 

I'm glad you're not going anywhere and I'm sure lots of others will be, too!

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

This is what I get when I try to access the thread where I was posting and is causing me some consternation: "You do not have permission to view this topic." I tried getting there from my browser history. No go.

 

(oops! a comment from Tezza just came in... thanks Tezza. I am glad you are glad I am not going anywhere!)

 

What I had in that thread was a 'lightbulb moment' as opposed to a 'pop' or 'shift'. The poster put forth a concept and my mind completely rejected it. (But I didn't say so, I made a completely unrelated comment). But for some odd reason, I did a little research and was completely astonished at what I found! I went back to comment about it for the second time, after I found some other surprising information, and the whole thread was gone.

 

In the past few days, I stuck my nose into a thread about a root. A comment from someone more knowledgeable about such things I took to mean 'agreement' with my mental assessment. Had my hand gently slapped in a thread about an herb. No agreement there. I told myself to just stick with what I have actually tried myself and leave it to others to do what they feel led to do.

 

In the narrowest sense of the word, if I perceive this group's mission to be 'peer support for those who wish to get off psychoactive drugs by tapering slowly' then I do not fit. But if I see that there might be a need to write from the perspective of someone (now that the sh1tstorm of withdrawal seems to have passed after I got off the drugs 'wrong') who is now facing the challenge of completing their life AS A PERSON WHO HAS BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH DEPRESSION IN THE PAST AND NOW DOESN'T THINK DRUGS ARE THE GOING TO EVER BE THE ANSWER AGAIN, then this is the exact right place for me to be. Comments on my comments cause me to think deeply on things and then I try to write (striving for some degree of clarity) on what is going on. I need to find a way to steer clear of the 'black hole' of depression because going to the doc will likely get me an offer of meds because that is still the norm. "Mind" stuff is really tricky. I will never forget that episode that I call 'near catatonia'. Look where that got me. OR: Yippee! Look where that got me! I found SA! Tools for living a life without ADs. Electronic group therapy. A way of 'journalling' that makes sense to me and seems to be having surprising results. This is the making of a 'recovery story' or a journal of a person's life after it has occurred. I am the only person who can say which one it really is.

[Altostrata]

cw, if you click on your name above, you will be able to see the topics and posts you've made.

 

It may be the topic you posted in was moved. We very seldom delete topics or posts.

 

You are certainly welcome here! No one is trying to send you a message to go away.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

To me, the fact that 'zero warning points' shows up below my avatar pic shows me that I am not in the process of being shown the door, so to speak. Ergo, I know I am welcome here.

 

Today my post count shows '300'. Doing as you suggest lands me on a single page with a few of my most recent posts. My post in the topic I am referring to is not there. I can see the poster's name in the 'member' list but I get a 'no no' when I attempt to see the person's intro topic. Or, the intro topic just isn't there.

 

 

No one is trying to send you a message to go away.

 

And it may turn out, in the distant 'future', that I may turn out to be 'the last poster standing'. In the past I got a comment from you, Alto, that I perceived as a kind of 'warning'. When I looked at the situation and then looked at the 'what will get you banned from here' topic, I figured it out.

 

My sense of reality has been really disturbed this last few days. I cannot 'see' what I 'know' should be there. Stuff isn't adding up. It would be far easier if I could just run to the psych and get a pill (like I did when I thought I was having a 'spiritual awakening') than to face the fact that because I am reading another one of 'those' books, the same thing feels like it is starting again.

 

I am going to let it go, it makes no sense, trying to make sense of it is giving me a headache. It is subtly different from what I would classify as 'DP/DR'.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Thank goodness things are getting back to the mundane. Just had my first ocular migraine in maybe 10 or so years. No blind spot with it, just the 'looking through cracked shimmery glass' effect.

 

I did a search for techniques to keep me 'grounded', other than being in 'nature'. It's a little too public around here for me to take a walk then realize I have stopped and have been staring at a flower or a dragonfly for 5 minutes. I chased down a link on a kundalini site and guess what I found: knitting and weaving. Wow.

[Petunia]

You might find this article interesting, it was written by someone who used to post here on SA, that's if you haven't already seen it.

 

http://neuroscienceandpsi.blogspot.com.au/2011/12/psychotropic-medication-recovery.html

 

.... and no, Petu wouldn't be glad if you went, Petu just spent a lovely few minutes reading your latest posts.  Now Petu is wondering why she is referring to herself in the third person.

 

I hope your migraine is gone, I used to get them a lot, almost every day during summers when I was a child.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Petu,

 

You are such a laugh and a real sweetie!

 

You had 'ocular' migraines too? It was weird, I was just sitting on the bed brushing my cat when it happened. Not like I had in years past when they were triggered by too much caffeine or walking thru a store trying to scan to quickly for something I needed. Weird.....

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Petu,

 

You are such a laugh and a real sweetie!

 

You had 'ocular' migraines too? It was weird, I was just sitting on the bed brushing my cat when it happened. Not anything like in years past when they were triggered by too much caffeine or walking thru a store trying to scan too quickly for something I needed. Weird.....

 

I actually had read the post you referred to and also had a couple of email correspondences with the owner of the blog. I see she has now put up some articles up about her current research into omega 3 and psi.

 

I had been reading a blog by Gary something (can't find the name but he has an entry on batgap) about 'non-dual' reality. Am also 'doing' Tolle: reading about him, watching the videos, reading stuff written about him. Tolle's story is related to a person plagued by 'depression' who reached a point where he 'just gave up' when he became so utterly tired of his depressive 'thoughts'. Same thing happened to me when I read the 'Cloud of Unknowing' (I was so utterly tired of feeling so bad about myself) and way back when I first started posting on SA: I remember thinking that if psychoactive drug 'recovery' took '7 years' then I deeply accepted that and decided I would just continue life, accept whatever happened, and not fall back into thinking that when the going got really really rough that there would always be meds to fall back on.

 

I actually experienced (or thought I did) a few moments of 'presence' and wrote about how it felt. The story about talking to my girlfriend's husband, for example. BUT: though I crave more 'experiences like that, I am scared off by the prospect of 'fallout' as a result. Weird feelings of unreality, realizing I have been standing for 5 minutes staring at a flower or (horrors!) 'sitting on a park bench for 2 years'.

 

I think the answer to this is to just stop posting such experiences here on SA. I think that is the realization I was trying to capture and write down when I had the thought about 'I shouldn't be here anymore'. I am going to have to invoke my 'inner editor' whenever I do attempt to post: is what I have to say really going to add to the focus of this group? The focus which I imagine it to be is: peer support for those wishing to get off psychoactive meds in a way that minimizes the drug's disruptive effects on the CNS.

 

I don't want my focus to be on the weird experiences that seem to happen to me now, like losing posts and the 'meltdown' of that house where I did the dog sitting or how strange I thought the dog was acting.

 

So here's a question I have been pondering: I haven't put the painting stuff away and the house is still a mess. Is it anhedonia, resistance, apathy, or am I just 'sitting on a park bench'? What I really want to do is experience more of those 'unique' moments but THEY won't get the house cleaned up. I need to convince myself (by actually DOING it) that I can capture those moments of 'the now' WHILE i clean up the house. Waaaaah, but I don't wannna clean the house! But if I don't do it, it won't get done and my thoughts about it will keep occurring. Endless circle. I need to 'just do it'.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Hey guess why the the previous 2 posts both start out the same way. I added the longer part in the editing window. Then I clicked 'save changes'. I got an error message saying 'you do not have permission to edit this post'. This is the weirdness that keeps happening to me.

 

Good thing I did a 'copy and paste' before I tried refreshing the page and opening a new post. Nyah! Take that, you computer gremlins! I fooled ya! (at least this time I did.....)

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

I just noticed this comment from Tezza:

 

 

I tried to post to you a couple of days ago but have been having trouble with my Internet coming and going. Some of my posts disappear when my Internet goes and I don't have it in me to redo the post.

 

Oh yeah. And how do I figure out what is happening (when I try to post just on THIS site), my internet is still working but my posts won't 'post' or I get really obscure errors?

 

I'm a really really smart computer person, albeit self-taught. Now I am getting a bunch of oddities on other sites too, not just the 'spiritual' reading ones. There's nothing wrong with my computer, I just KNOW it. It is like all of a sudden, stuff I know how to do and I do it the way I have always done it (like POSTING, for pete's sake!) just doesn't WORK.

 

I think I'll go find a flower to stare at and to he11 with what the neighbors think....... my computer is not bringing me the comfort I seek. Haiku error messages.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

I found some of the beaded fish I was talking about and will post in a thread in 'Off Topic' and not here. G00gle indexes this site and indexes images on the web too. I don't think g00g can index the off topic content because it is only visible when members are logged in. If it is inappropriate the mods can take it down.

[Petunia]

Petu,

 

You had 'ocular' migraines too?

 

Thought I'd better look it up, make sure we talking about the same thing.  Yes, strange things would happen to my vision when I got them as a child, but the migraines I occasionally get as an adult seem to be the regular kind.

[mammaP]

CW I love reading your posts, you and I are alike in some ways,

you often perfectly describe things I am also feeling but can't get down in words.

Most often I do get things down but then realise I got the words all wrong and it isn't what I meant at all. 

You say it all and make perfect sense to me. 

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Thanks, mammaP!

 

Lately I have been feeling so out of place here. For some reason, last night I checked the 'Today's Top Posters' link and was horrified to see my name at the top of the list! If I happen to notice a new member has posted their intro and has no replies, I sometimes post something to show they were 'noticed'. My first thought is to be 'helpful' and welcoming. My SECOND thought is along the lines of 'Shut up you idiot! Admins and mods are far better equipped than you to assist people and you should just confine yourself to posting updates to your own thread'. What I see when I read over my posts is drivel and nonsense. When I see others saying 'yeah I've felt that way too' I am comforted.

 

I am soooooo confused. All of my stuff is in the 'mental' part of recovery. I do not want to become so deeply depressed ever again that I see meds as the only way out. Ever. Please God, never again. They worked to get me to the here and now and I became functional again after a fashion. But 'I' want to be functional without their help. If the 'pill' I have to take is posting here about my dam feelings and see that it is HELPING me, then I'll have to deal with the embarrassment of seeing my 'post count' go up and feeling like a 'chatty cathy'. That sometimes people say that what I write 'helps' them is pleasing and confusing because I read it over and all I see is cr@p.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

I give up! As smart as I am about computers and the 'intertubes' I have no idea why I am still getting mysterious errors when viewing or posting on SA. Just now, I posted a comment on someone's thread and went back to reading 'quick views' of posts on 'Introductions and Updates'. Got a bunch of 'nopermission' statements instead of a view of the post. Looked at the top of the page and saw I was 'logged out'. wtf?

 

I give up. You win, computer gremlins!

[Petunia]

 I have no idea why I am still getting mysterious errors when viewing or posting on SA. Just now, I posted a comment on someone's thread and went back to reading 'quick views' of posts on 'Introductions and Updates'.

Does this only happen on SA, or when using your computer in general?

 

I've had similar glitchy things happen at times while using my computer, often happening a lot over the course of a few weeks, then settling down again.

 

Giving in to the the computer gremlins is probably the best idea.  But it might also be one of those Kundalini symptoms  "Psychokinetic interference with electrical equipment.".....not that there's anything you can do about that either, it seems to be a stage of the re-wiring that goes on in kundalini.

 

At risk of going off topic - link here: http://biologyofkundalini.com/article.php?story=SymptomsList

 

I do the same as you when I see a new member with no replies.  Partly to try and help, make them feel welcome and validated.  Also to keep the post near the top so that other members who can be more help than me, will notice and respond.

 

I seem to be having a 'bad brain day', can't find the key to the storage room where all the good words are kept.

 

If posting a lot helps you and reading what you post helps others, then that's a win/win situation, what could possibly be wrong with that?

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

 

can't find the key to the storage room where all the good words are kept.

 

Oh Petu, I love your way with words!

 

Computer glitches ONLY on SA. That's why it is so weird. (and yeah, without following your link, I have heard of the psychokinetic yada yada). A poster here wrote something about shorting out the usb ports where her mouse was plugged into the computer and her family (I think) finally got a wireless mouse to put a stop to it.

 

The only other time it happened was a few nights ago on a 'spiritual site'. The page I was reading kept going blank every few seconds. Not a refresh, the whole page just slowly blinked off then on. Did you see my post in Off Topic today? My cell phone (the old one I had to resurrect) mysteriously lost it's network authentication. I have had a cell since '95 or '96 and that has never happened to me or anyone else I know.

 

There was a time when those types of things would have thrilled me. I once read a story of someone who blew out lightbulbs when she walked into a room. I thought it would mean (if it happened to me) that it would show I was on the 'path'. Not now. I see them now as distractions that, if I dwell upon them and keep making a big deal out of them, will actually lead me astray. I am just not going to talk about them anymore and take them in stride. If they are gentle nudgings (when they happen on SA) for me to think before I post or something else, then I need not attribute any 'mystical' meaning to them. People are here to receive support because they are desperately unwell and talking about stuff like that serves no real purpose. (I have a weird sense of deja vu writing this. I bet if I search my thread I actually wrote about this way in the beginning of my history here on SA).

 

 

If posting a lot helps you and reading what you post helps others, then that's a win/win situation, what could possibly be wrong with that?

 

Not one darn thing!

 

PS. I am really getting a LOT of peace and ease from watching Tolle's videos on his site and on y0utube. I am not as uneasy now about 'acting crazy'. I think it is really true that if one decides to become more deeply aware that one needs a 'teacher'. The internet is full of teachers and I didn't think I would get anything out of watching videos. They are actually better than reading about 'concepts' in a book. Thanks for pointing it out to me, Petu. I'm glad I don't have to buy a ticket to India or move back to California. I actually like it right where I am! My park bench is my living room......

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

I have just had the worst fight with my mother that I can ever remember. I am stunned speechless. I do not think I will ever be able to write about how I feel, how alone. There is no 'mother' left in her anymore, she just wants to be left alone. I've had too many outbursts of anger since coming off the ADs.

 

Ok, I finally got it. I hope I can remember it. The one last crutch, that I would have ONE person in the world who would give me moral support and be there for me, can't give me anything. She's worn out. And I finally understand it.

 

Realizing this has actually settled something inside me. Like I have finally grown up and separated from her. And 'alone' is not really the right word, there's no 'lonely' feeling. I just feel 'single', just me. I think I am going to be all right. I wish I could have reached this place inside without all the drama and shouting, but it just didn't turn out that way.

[Petunia]

That's quite a turning point, and you seem to be handling it well.  I've been coming to the same realization with my parents, but slowly and quite painfully over the course of the last year, without drama and shouting, which isn't necessarily a good thing because I'm seeing things which they are not.

 

I'm sorry you had to go through the pain of a bad argument, but once things settle down, maybe you and your mom will be able to grow a new kind of relationship which works better for both of you.

 

All of us, at the core of our being are alone because we are the only one who can experience our experiences, but the realization of that, creates the common bond we share with each other. We appear to be alone and separate, but because we all experience that sense of separation (if we allow ourselves to), we really are all having the same experience.  Recognizing that we share the experience of being alone in our experience, I think, is what is behind the truth of oneness. That might also be the meaning behind the greeting 'Namaste'

 

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to go off on a spiritual tangent, that kind of just wrote itself.

 

I hope you and your mom work things out and you feel better soon.

 

 

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Hi Petu,

 

I am not handling anything well right now, not at all!

 

 

maybe you and your mom will be able to grow a new kind of relationship which works better for both of you.

 

The closest I can come to articulating what is going on inside of me is to say: the woman who lives in this house will never 'act' like the image of 'mom' that I have in my head. The key word is 'never'. Until that realization fully sets in (and last night made it just a tiny bit clearer), there will always be conflict. I have never had kids so I do not know what 'being a mom' is. I have a distorted 'image of a mom' in my head, distorted in that it doesn't match the 'person of mom' that stands in front of me. That, and what I describe next, creates conflict that erupts into shouting matches.

 

The key to this part of the 'puzzle of life' has to to with me thinking I need some THING (such as a pill or a new toy or more craft supplies) or some PERSON (my mother, girlfriend, a husband, the posters on SA) to help me feel better about myself. It is that part of my 'alone-ness' that I am starting to feel. Realizing that I had always the 'idea' that as long as my mom was still alive, I would have ONE person that I could count on to comfort me, because that what moms do, right? Nope, I've worn her out.

 

 

because we all experience that sense of separation (if we allow ourselves to)

 

So that is what it is, I am having the first feelings and experiences of 'true' separation.

 

 

we really are all having the same experience.  Recognizing that we share the experience of being alone in our experience, I think, is what is behind the truth of oneness. That might also be the meaning behind the greeting 'Namaste'

 

My eyes see the words, but I cannot grasp this yet. It is like my brain shuts off, I am not at the 'oneness' part where it concerns my mom. Maybe with the 'rest of humanity', but not her. Not yet.

 

 

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to go off on a spiritual tangent, that kind of just wrote itself.

 

What you wrote was exactly right for me.

 

 

I hope you and your mom work things out and you feel better soon.

 

All I know right now is that I am pretty sure it will not look and feel like what I think it should. I am open for it to be what it will be.

 

Thank you for helping me.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Petu,

 

Now I understand 'namaste': http://www.yogajournal.com/basics/822

 

The internet is of no help to me searching out experiences or explanations for what I think is my journey of 'finding myself' in the context of separation. This will come later, I presume:

 

 

Recognizing that we share the experience of being alone in our experience, I think, is what is behind the truth of oneness.

 

A search landed me on a ACIM page. I cannot read that stuff at all anymore. Tried it several years ago and again today. It 'engages my brain' too much. The same concepts are talked about by the person whose videos I am watching. I get something from him. Different words.

 

Mom (coming out of her room to get coffee): "Mor-ning!" (cheerful sounding).

 

Me: (sitting in chair posting to SA): "Morning." (monosyllabic, hoping it didn't sound grouchy).

 

The cat: (rub, nudge, purr) (feed me please) "But I just gave you a dish!" (I don't want THAT one!) "You are not getting anymore, now eat that one!"

 

Cat: (rub the chair, my legs, purr, BUMP the table and slosh my coffee all over table) I YELLED AT THE CAT (whoa! I rarely yell at him. This is NOT good).

 

Got up, filled a second dish of cat food, set it down and the cat ate it. (I never tried giving a second dish of different food. I usually just ignore him and he eventually eats or goes away).

 

The start of today.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Had a huge striking example of what I know I am reacting to when I try to 'talk' to mom. Tone of voice: sarcastic, angry. I hear my mother's tone of voice as 'not soothing, kind, compassionate or soft". Content: see any topic where 'toxic' families' are mentioned (her part). Mine? I strive for reasoned and calm discussion.

 

In trying to explain something to someone about a job I quit doing but the situation is still ongoing, I made a remark. The person perceived it as 'yelling at her'. The remark I made, I made with what I thought was emphasis, not yelling. End result of my thinking?

 

I sound just like my mom. Pot, kettle, black.

 

PS. Doing some 'market research' about WHY the craft Items I gave to the thrift shop are disappearing rapidly. They see 'bling' and 'unique' where I have been concentrating solely on 'they are decorative but not durably functional' i.e., not worth me bothering with. I can feel my craft mojo starting to come back and I may just start crafting again. I can make them and 1) sell them 2) give them away 3) keep them for myself. No more mental turmoil and psychological angst (or hoarding problems)!

[Petunia]

Got up, filled a second dish of cat food, set it down and the cat ate it. (I never tried giving a second dish of different food. I usually just ignore him and he eventually eats or goes away).

 

 

 

 

[Petunia]

 I have never had kids so I do not know what 'being a mom' is. I have a distorted 'image of a mom' in my head, distorted in that it doesn't match the 'person of mom' that stands in front of me......

 

....Realizing that I had always the 'idea' that as long as my mom was still alive, I would have ONE person that I could count on to comfort me, because that what moms do, right? Nope, I've worn her out.

 

 

I can't seem to make the multi-quote thing work.

 

I've spent most of today thinking about some of the things you wrote.  I have a daughter, but I still have some pretty distorted images in my head.  Some of them are related to what I think my own mother should have been, and some of them are about what I should be 'as a mother'.  A lot of my 'mothering' has been about trying to improve on the kind of mothering I got.  I'm not completely sure of my genuine motive though.

 

A lifetime ago I read a book by Nancy Friday, I think it was called 'my mother, myself', that started me really thinking about the mother/daughter relationship and brought some uncomfortable issues up which I wasn't aware of, emotional separation can be difficult from both sides, is often never fully accomplished, but is what's needed if 'growing up' is going to happen.

 

I recently read a trilogy of books by Jed McKenna (and wish I hadn't), his premise is that the majority of adults walking around on the planet today are really adult children, grown physically, but never having achieved psychological adulthood.

 

Ideally, I think a mother is a fully grown up woman, who has separated emotionally from her own authority care givers and is an autonomous, individuated person.  Then from that position of 'wholeness', she co-creates (with God or whatever) to facilitate the birth and growth of a new being, with the emphasis on helping the child to reach their own individual potential for being independent in the world.  Then letting go.  Or slowly letting go.  An ongoing process of creating and letting go.

 

But I suspect that finding the ideal is rare.

 

I've never felt sufficiently comforted and I wonder how much comfort I've been able to provide for my own daughter.  I know that part of growing up is learning how to comfort ourselves, but I wonder how much depends on having received sufficient comforting during our earliest years.  My own mother had a horrendous childhood, and by comparison, mine was a fairy tale, but I still ended up feeling somewhat wounded and traumatized.

 

I'm not sure what I'm trying to say here.  Perhaps that I'm struggling with some of the same things, trying to finish growing myself up because after a certain age, its just not possible to get anyone else to do it for us....even though some of us spend a lifetime trying to find someone who will.

 

This might not seem to have anything to do with medication withdrawal, but from what I've learned during the short time of reading on these forums, going through this process can be a traumatic and life changing event, it seems to sometimes facilitate a kind of re-evaluation of values and deep changes in lives and relationships.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Petu,

 

What follows is something I wrote 'about' my argument 'experience', trying to explain what happened afterwards. The experience came first, the 'thinking' and 'realization' came afterwards.

 

 

For all of my life my mother has been the way she is. And I, even as old as I am (63), have always felt immature, clingy, needy. Outwardly I act in a more or less adult manner.

 

In the first 3 or 4 months, while the drugs were leaving my system, one symptom that occurred many times a day was my eruptions of anger. My mother would not yell back and I eventually was able to 'wake up' when it happened. I gradually was able to just shut my mouth when I felt the anger, turn and walk away without saying anything more. Interspersed with these unpredictable outbursts were episodes of deep crying. When they were particularly bad, often all I could do was go into her room and just hold her arm and cry until it subsided. For the most part she acted appropriately comforting.

 

What was different about the recent argument was that at a certain point she began goading me. And what was different about me was I was able to stand there and actually fully experience my anger (though not continuously because my 'thoughts' kept pulling me into the 'argument'), continue breathing and remaining in the 'moment', and I was able to actually feel that thing called 'presence'. I didn't realize I was doing it until I left the room, it just happened.

 

All of that sounds like a bunch of words that do not make any real sense. Because what happened was on a feeling and awareness level (not a thinking level) and words can't capture it. It was not until I was finally able to shut my mouth, leave the room, come sit in my chair and continue taking deep breaths (instead of holding like we usually do when white-hot angry) that I felt the bond break inside me, the bond of thinking I would always at least have one person I could go to for comfort. You described it in your note. I am not talking about 'love', it is more like a leaning on or dependency. Instead, I understood that I would never have 'comfort ' unless it came from inside of ME.

 

My mom is truly tired of me. And now I do not need her to 'be' anything for me, she can just 'be' who she is. I know for sure that I will forget and get into an argument again, because of my tendency to DO that when the world is not to my liking. But I really think it will happen far less often. And it is so much less often than in early withdrawal. But I won't ever need her or anyone else to comfort me, help me with my self esteem, tell me they really DO like me, etc. There is a great deal of freedom there and I am glad this happened before my mother died. Whether we ever have a deep relationship does not matter to me. But at some time I will have to be able to include her in the 'oneness with all beings' that the sages and spiritual teachers talk about. I have yet to experience that.

 

So that's what happened. Kinda the same as you but on a different level of feeling and awareness. It is nice that you enjoy my posts but you do realize, don't you, that I am not really writing to the audience of SA? I am writing to save my own life. There are all kinds of people behind all of these keyboards. All at different stages of healing and awareness. With my writing you this note, you are the only one that will get a slightly more expanded version of my recent experience and what it meant to me. I won't need to share it again because you only really need to share something once for it to become a part of your reality. So thanks for giving me the opportunity to share more deeply. And now you know why I write the things I do - I am clarifying my thoughts and am sharing them so that they become my new 'reality'. My old reality had me depending on meds to 'feel better'. I can't tell you how glad I am that I took EVERY pill because THAT, and anything else that has ever happened in my life, got me to where I am today. And it is going to get even better. I am starting to feel comfortable in my own skin.

 

As you can see, it was personal to the 'person' in a way, but not really. And it probably does not make sense, because words are so imperfect for describing 'feeling' or 'awareness'. Every 'reader' forms their own interpretations based on my word choices, sentence structure, syntax, emphasis.

 

Just a few random thoughts:

 

We who post here are writing the 'long version' of our "Recovery Stories". I am trying to live my life in such a way that does not lead me into periods of deep depression. I am trying to DO things differently. I write about what happens when a 'new' thought comes into my head about something I have always 'done' or 'been' and it is usually something paradoxical. The giving away of the crafts, for example.

 

During the argument I found myself unconsciously practicing 'presence', 'being in the Now' is another term. Actually, it is 'semi-conscious' right now. This is the mechanics of it:

 

I find myself taking a slow deep breath while simultaneously scanning my body for a physical sensation, such as the 'feeling of my foot on the floor'. My 'mind' shuts off for a split second, it is not formulating the next response in the 'argument'. Argument ends, I sit down and a 'feeling' prompts 'thinking' and I gain an 'insight' into 'me'. The fact that it happened during an argument, in the midst of experiencing 'white-hot' anger, was a total shock.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Oh I so love Henri!!!! (I had to go to y0utube directly to see the vid, tho. I don't know how to 'multi-quote' either, let alone 'embed' a video).

 

the '"Souls that are denied might poop in your shoe".

 

ROFL!

 

Putting the second dish down was the result of shutting off my usual 'thinking' and doing something paradoxical. He eventually ate the second dish. I hope he doesn't make a habit of doing it again. Or I will have to change my 'habit'.