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JanCarol

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  • Moderator Emeritus

All right.  I've passed my 1 year anniversary!!!

 

The past month - a month ago I had an emotional event, nostalgia, rumination, self-chastisement, grieving.

 

2 weeks ago I had a total thyroid crash.  I don't know if the heat can bring it on (maybe adrenals react to heat?), but I've adjusted my doses and still struggle.

 

Karate - I went but didn't do any of the bag work (punching kicking people stuff), just kata and trying to follow instructions.

 

My brain is mush.  Absolute mush.  Even solitaire seems hard.

 

It's to a point where I'm a little worried about me.

 

I have some labs here that I could get done, and go see my orthomolecular, to see if anything stands out - or I could go to her, and see if there's any additional labs she wants to see.  Or I could keep muddling along with my own adjustments until I get to a stable point.  I'm going to "muddle" for maybe another week or two.  If at 6 weeks, I'm still feeling the thyroid "tendonitis all over" - I will get to a doc.

 

I'm taking 20% more compounded natural thyroid than I was a month ago.  

 

And I still have achy ankles, shoulder, and neck.  I'm weak as a kitten (sedentary doesn't help, the heat doesn't help, and the lack of sunwalks doesn't help, either), and my brain is mush.  I've made stupid mistakes like nearly setting the kitchen on fire when the lid came off my popcorn (I forgot to shift it back when the popping started), I have been getting out of the house and driving, but the way I feel tonight, i wonder if I should do that!

 

I'm probably 20% more productive than last week.  I've touched some laundry, cooked a bit, and my coloring table has some interesting stuff on it.

 

So I'm not totally useless. 

 

I really do think this is thyroid and adrenal.  It feels like "withdrawal flu" - which feels a lot like "hypothyroid," too.

 

I'm so thankful I have practitioners to support me.  If I was just doing the normal thyroxine TSH thing, I would be on the floor!

 

So - lots of magnesium baths.  I'm still trying to get out.  I might try gentle weightlifting next week instead of karate.  It's just too hard to pace myself - and yet - do things properly.  

 

And be more faithful to my sunwalks.  They do help build me up, even if they are small.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Happy Anniversary JanCarol!  That's huge.  :o:):lol: !

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

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  • Moderator

Congratulations on passing the one year mark, well done. Keep an eye on the long term improvements and try not to get frustrated by the week to week fluctuations.

 

(((((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))))))

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Final Dose 0.016mg.     Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Sounds like you're struggling a lot right now, JC, but congratulations on hitting the first year off! Like Manymoredays said, that's huge!  :)

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Thank you Brass, Manymore & Shep!

 

Yes, I am struggling right now, but it's better than it was 2 weeks ago.

 

It seems my resilience is damaged, brittle, not as plastic or flexible as I would like.

 

I have scaled way back.  Only doing yoga and weightlifting now.  In a few weeks I will go back to karate, but only beginner's class - I couldn't do enough of senior class, and it felt disrespectful to stand aside while the other students were working their arses off.

 

Cooling down from the hot weather will be nice - we are finally having some periods where we can turn the air off and open up the house, and there are some breezes.  I'm getting in maybe 2 sunwalks a week (better than none!).

 

Weightlifting, circuit training - whatever you want to call what I do when I go to the gym - was good.  I did about 5 minutes of ladder climbing, about 4 minutes of rowing, about 120 punches on heavy bag (whups, bruised hand - hand bruises too easily in this inflamed condition), and about 50 not-very-tidy-or-strong kicks, in addition to one time around a circuit of total body light weights.  So - gentle weightlifting with a few cardio intervals.  I was also able to do some slant board crunches & leg lifts, and a little balance board work for my poor ankles.  It was a good workout, but it was at my pace - I didn't have to "keep up with the class," and I could control the range of movement of all of my joints.

 

I was walking today - and a friend even commented - better than I have been walking in a long time.  

 

I still have some schedule changes to make - probably do a few months of beginner karate to build back up to the senior class.  

 

I still have a lot of joint pain - especially my ankles & feet (ahhhhh, the red bucket!) and wrists and neck.  I am having to use some pain relief (I know, Kelly Brogan told me that tylenol strips the body of glutathione - egads!) but at this point, it's better to use the pain relief and keep moving, than to stay in bed.

 

Cognitively, I have the attention span of a flea.  I have about 10 youtube videos started that I keep meaning to finish but only get about 5 min into each before my mind flits off somewhere else.  When I sit down in the evenings - usually my best time - I look around me, and cannot seem to engage with my usual interests - coloring, videos, games, it all seems just a little too hard.

 

Politically, I'm trying to fast from news, but the news is so bad I keep hearing things that upset me.  I've tried to tell hubby that I don't need to track every evil thing that is happening, and that I'm not as interested in the finer details of every poll and opinion.  But he still wants to share and converse.  

 

Socially, I am kinda keeping up with friends, but it's been hard to actually meet with people when I'm this drained.

 

GiaK / Monica Cassini really got it right when she says "Everything Matters."  All of the components - 

 

Yes, this is a thyroid crash, and I have a big job in correcting my thyroid doses to "just right" - 

 

but it is still vital that I get nutrition (fats, proteins, veggies, fiber), exercise, sunlight, music, social contact, spiritual nourishment, meditation, art, conversation, and a sense of purpose in order to stay well.

 

Compared with how I have been - ever - in my life, even when I'm on the floor in pain and exhaustion right now, I'm still clear in purpose, passion, and engagement with this life.  I have never been this clear, never had so much access to my process, and never never ever had any sense of purpose - in the years before, whether drugged or in between druggings.  As my old friends in Indiana said, "You're back, only more so."

 

I'm incredibly grateful - I found a CD of Jon Kabat-Zinn that I had bought 2 years ago, called "Mindfulness for Pain."  It is AWESOME, totally awesome, and washes over me like clean cool water.  I have moved it to the "greatest hits" section of my music library, even though it is a talk.  I can listen to it over and over and glean and learn something from it every time.  So I am listening to that a lot, and gratefully.  I am breathing.  There is more right with me than wrong with me, in this moment.

 

My yoga studio is having a mindfulness evening tonight, but I'm too tired to go.  I walked today.  That's enough.

 

Thanks to all of you who have tolerated my "flea attention span" for the past month.  Hopefully my cognition, like my body, will build up over time, with persistence.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Sorry to read that you are struggling Jan. You are glad that summer is on its way out and I am glad that it is on its way in.  I hate winter, not so much the cold but the long dark nights. Think I  prefer that though over the blistering hot weather you've been having, it must be difficult to cope with when it is so extreme, at least we can put on a sweater and curl up under a blanket!   

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Oh Mamma - I miss the cool crisp air and snow.

 

But I do not miss the dark.

 

When hubby and I were dating, I showed him a chart of sunrise sunset times.

 

He saw how much the light in my home fluctuated.  We're not tropical - 12 hours a day regardless of season - but the curve is much gentler.

 

Today - Bach!  Little Prelude in C minor.  I am playing a piano!  Hubby set one up for me!  It's an old, professional keyboard and not as flash as the new $$$ ones, but - it's nice to be able to hear something in my head and reach over and touch the keys, and work it out.  (Guitar - I loved doing this on guitar - but my hands are not strong enough now)

 

So - my first "music reading" exercise is this Little Prelude in C minor, called the BWV999 on the internet (???), and it's not as hard as I thought it would be.  More sheet music ordered in to improve my reading and fingering, and my world just expanded a little!

 

It only takes 3 minutes to play it.  So I turn around from my desk, and play it again.   3 minutes later, my brain is a little more orderly.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi JC,

 

Just dropping in to say hi and see how you doing.  Nothing wrong with the older stuff!

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

So - 

 

avatar evaluation time.

 

What do you think of the silly cat?

 

She's a reminder to me, to keep it light, to not take myself too seriously.

She a badge of Mad Pride.

 

But perhaps it's time to move on?

I know other people change their avatars all the time with no consult.

 

but I've been Silly Cat for my whole time here at SA - and that's - years now!

 

Does she make you think I'm foolish?  Does she make you laugh or smile?  Or do you just think she's dumb?  Or disrespectful?

 

Enquiring minds would like to know....

* * *

In other news.  No karate until my joints stop hurting, and my thyroid feels more optimized.

 

Yoga and weightlifting (though it's really rehab!).  For at least another week or two, then I will try to slide back into karate from a beginners class and build up again.

 

It seems so easy to fall down and have to start over again. 

 

This round was so painful, that I was beginning to warm up to my physician's diagnosis of "fibromyalgia."  I began to think, "Maybe it is so?"  And I think about low low dose amitryptaline.  REALLY?  Well, that's how much it was hurting.

 

But as I adjust my thyroid and improve, even when it's not great - it's improvement. And it clearly demonstrates to me that this condition is thyroid (and possibly adrenal) related.

 

IN OTHER NEWS - there is a new pain drug on the Australian market.

 

It is to norepinephrine, what tramadol is to serotonin. 

 

It's called Palexia, and combines a weak opoid with a strong norepinephrine drug.

 

I worry about this - because there's this "opoid crisis" and they are trying to get people to stop taking codeine.  And this one may be considered "safe" if you are on an SSRI (just not an SNRI), while tramadol you cannot take if you are on an SSRI.  Because it's hard to push tramadol when 1/3 of women are on an SSRI or something...

 

And they will tout and parade it as "non-addictive," and prescribe it right and left.  I heard about it because the sister of a friend of mine was having what sounded to be a toxic reaction to her first dose of it:  nausea, vomiting, dizziness, spacey, incoherence of thought and speech....I think they called an ambulance for her, but I haven't gotten the rest of the story.  She was not on any psych drugs, but might be on Neurontin or Lyrica, and is on chemo or immune suppressing drugs for leukemia.  Egads.  The pharma story just gets worse and worse.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Mentor

so sorry to hear you are hurting!!

 

regarding your avatar- hmm,  that silly cat always makes me feel a bit lighter.

I changed my own avatar to the happy looking rat because I wanted something associated with joy

 

so, if you do decide to change your avatar, please do keep it something light-hearted and happy ;-)

 

  • pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) 
  •  Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years
  • started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 
  •  2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs
  •  June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until  Sept, then acute WD hit!!  reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106
  • Tapered off to zero by  Oct. 2017 Doing very well. 
  • Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 
  • Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content
  • Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs ;) 
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  • Moderator Emeritus

I think your cat avatar is fierce.......and that is good.......considering.  One has to be fierce at times.  Sooooo......Idk........do what you feel is best..... :)

 

The "opiod crisis" is getting alot of attention here as well and changes in prescribing regulations are coming about.  I am feeling a little optimistic that it may segway into some of our concerns regarding benzo's, A.D.'s, and other psycho drugs.  I am also feeling pessimistic as well though as many who are badly hooked......and not by their own choice.....but due to trusting their providers......are now being treated like criminals.......as well as being forced into difficult W/D's.

 

best,

 

mmt

 

oh yah....playing my guitar a little bit again.

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

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  • Moderator

He makes me smile. :)

 

I use Curcumin Phytosome and Arnica Gel for the sore joints.  They must work because I really notice it when I miss them for a few days.

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Final Dose 0.016mg.     Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I think your cat avatar is fierce.......and that is good.......considering.  One has to be fierce at times.  Sooooo......Idk........do what you feel is best..... :)

 

The "opiod crisis" is getting alot of attention here as well and changes in prescribing regulations are coming about.  I am feeling a little optimistic that it may segway into some of our concerns regarding benzo's, A.D.'s, and other psycho drugs.  I am also feeling pessimistic as well though as many who are badly hooked......and not by their own choice.....but due to trusting their providers......are now being treated like criminals.......as well as being forced into difficult W/D's.

 

best,

 

mmt

 

oh yah....playing my guitar a little bit again.

 

YAY!  Guitar!  I have a beautiful guitar that I never let out of it's case because it's safe there.  It's been so long since it's been played by me or hubby that the strings are rusting.   :wacko:   So - well done MMT!

 

The opoid crisis will lead to MORE prescriptions of psych drugs not less.  Already, they want to give amytriptaline (tricyclic), Cymbalta, and gabapentin or pregalbin for pain.  They may apply the "crisis" to the benzos, which means they will give out more "mood stabilizers" (anticonvulsants) and "antipsychotics" (neuroleptics).

 

This happens about every 20 years, a class of drugs goes out of fashion, and they replace it with something worse.  So opoids will go away (or be greatly reduced), and be replaced with psych drugs, like this Palexia or any other psych drug.  After opoids, benzos will be demonized - for the 2nd time, because Valium and Librium went through a demonization phase - so that they could come up with the "superior" (read:  more dangerous) xanax, and use Zoloft for anxiety.

 

Sorry to be so negative, but when I return to the US and look at the marketing, I don't see it letting up any time soon there.  It will take the UK and EU to lead the way (Australia is following the US on this one.)

 

Yes, Brassmonkey - I take curcumin, tart cherry, and fish oil.  I'm thinking of increasing the fish oil.  I found a cooling gel called "red vine leaf" - I think it's placebo based - that the alcohol gel evaporates and cools the leg and it feels good.  Who knows what "red vine leaf" is?  But yes, I have some lovely arnica cream with calendula and tea tree (Aussie product).

 

and of course:  the Red Bucket!

* * *

 

NON DRUG TECHNIQUES for the day:

 

1.  Scalp massage.

 

I especially use this when I'm feeling cog fog.  I will start at the base of my skull and lightly scratch and scrub my scalp, moving the skin of the scalp over my skull, and lightly massaging my whole head, back to front, side to side.  It only takes about 30 seconds, but it seems to improve my focus for a short while.  It feels better when my massage therapist does it - but I do it too, frequently, and believe it improves the circulation to my brain and gives me tactile stimulation around my brain.

 

2.  Give in to the pain.

 

This is a new technique.  I've learned that when the pain is really bad, or when I'm uncomfortable (like, in any furniture but my own), it makes me go to sleep.  It's a natural body protection.  It's inconvenient when it happens at the theatre, or when I'm trying to watch a movie.

 

But last night I awakened with Level 8/10 pain in my locked up knee.  I couldn't move, I couldn't get up, I couldn't even call out (what would hubby do anyway, look at me and say, "Sad!").  So I lay there.  And got it a pillow (the arnica was just around the corner but I couldn't reach it!) and put it between my knees.

 

With the pillow, I was able to gradually flip over - and I surrendered to the pain.  It knocked me out faster than a pain pill would.  I lived through it.  When I woke up, after a night with a cushion between my knees - I could get up and walk again.

 

So often we try to "push through" the pain, to keep going in spite of it.  When really the way through is to surrender to it, and rest.  It may seem like a lot of rest at first, but maybe then, it was needed rest!  Pain is a signal that it's time to stop what you are doing.

 

It's possible that the pain signals can be misleading, but in surrender - if it wasn't serious, you will wake up again soon enough. :P

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Yah, I copy that on the U.S. and all the darn willy nilly prescribing.  I tend to agree with you but continue to hope for change and full disclosure and, and............may not be realistic............ but at least I think we may all be responsible for helping one or two or more by just sharing our own experiences.........a good enough thing.

 

Great non drug techniques too!

 

Best,

 

mmt

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

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Goodness I've missed you JanCarol!! I love your approach to life  - LOVE IT - and you're so exceptionally self-aware - I'm always inspired!! 

 

I'll go back and read to catch up on life with you, but wanted to say a big hello in the meantime xxx

 

Drug history

  • 20mg paxil in 2001 - 4 months use  
  • 20mg paxil in 2003 - 2 months use 
  • 20mg paxil in 2008 - 8 years continuous

Withdrawal history:

  • March 2014 - disastrous alternate day taper
  • Jan 2015 - 15mg to 10mg. Disaster
  • Sept 2015 -  10mg to 5mg. Disaster. Reinstated to 6mg. Relief
  • Oct 2015 - started slow 10% taper 
  • Oct 2016 - at 4mg- stop taking paxil (not recommended)

 

I'm not a medical professional. Seek advice from a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

MOLLY!  Hey!  Welcome back!

 

Today there is an excellent post by Kelly Brogan in Mad In America - about her trip to India, about the power of women to live through these things, and teach others.  I won't say more, read it here:  https://www.madinamerica.com/2017/03/spirituality-and-mental-illness/

 

The joint pain has improved; I've finally gotten my thyroid back to Plan C from the doctor - it takes a long time to turn the boat around when it goes wrong, because I can't just go taking thyroid willy-nilly to "make it better."  I'm scared to make changes too fast, and so will have a week or two in between dose changes.  Unfortunately, sometimes I had more than 2 weeks because my compounding chemist gave me plain white capsules - making it more difficult to adjust an already filled tray.

 

First I have to determine:  what is the dose in the tray?  (impossible - because - is that magnesium, niacin, B6, NAC, inositol in the tray? All the white capsules look alike).  IF I can determine what is the dose in the tray, then I can adjust it.  But I hate to waste expensive compounded medicine, so I took all the white capsules.  NOW I have blue-and-white thyroid capsules (thank you!) and can tell what my doses are at a glance.

 

So - the constant sharp aching pain in my ankles, knees, hips, shoulders and neck has subsided.  I still have some middle back pain - which feels like "armoring" from my rough month.  I am still in a state of cog-fog.  I'm getting very little done right now, and frustrated as I watch my life back up.

 

With a little help from my friends, I have started a website for my shaman class to use:  http://www.shamanexplorations.wordpress.com - yet another thing that I am behind on.  Eventually, we hope to run a forum where people can describe their experiences and we can discuss the potential patterns and meanings of those experiences.  Tonight is shaman class, and I feel ill prepared because of cog-fog - but - I will go, I will speak, I will drum.  And maybe, if we're lucky, some of them will enjoy it!

 

So I apologize to all for my absence from site.  I have a fantasy that I will become uber-productive and be able to juggle all of the balls that life keeps throwing me!  (at least they aren't knives!)

 

Off to walk under a cloudy sky!

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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Wow.......and excellent.  Your post was one of my first stops today.  After I read through Kelly Brogan's post(above link) I listened to the song you posted on Shep's site.

 

You do good work JC!

 

The sun is coming over East mountain about now and the skies look blue again.........and so.......another day begins.  It's supposed to hit 70 or so, Fahrenheit, too again today.

 

Thank you.  :)

 

mmt

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Wow, Jan! Love the website! 

 

And it's great to hear the pain is less. The cog fog is familiar, but I'm sure it will get better in time. Mine was at a state of complete dementia in 2014 due to cold turkey, rapid taper benzo and z-drug withdrawal, so I can assure you it's not permanent. Not that you need any reassurance - you are calm and collected and moving through this journey with the most amazing non-drug coping skills. Like manymoredays just said, "you do good work!"

 

For me, I eventually found that the cog fog was an important part of the mindfulness journey. It allowed me to separate from time and at times due to severe derealization, even separate from space. 

 

It's definitely a "slowing down" presence that is frustrating, as the world doesn't stop to let us catch up. 

 

But it's a form of "altered". I'm finding various forms of "altered" throughout this journey and I'm hoping to be able to string them into a coherent sentence at some point in order to articulate it. I think there is some form of insight to be gained from it, but it may be more visible in the rear-view mirror aspect. For now, I play with the blunted, toned down thoughts, coming at it with a vibe of curiosity and wonder. This makes it less scary. 

 

We tend to think that cog fog makes us "stupid" or "less than" but the sheer ability to survive in a moving and raging world while in that state speaks to a level of "resiliency" that echoes sheer genius. I see that in you because even in your cog fog, you built a website, prepared to teach your shaman class, and continue to provide wise counsel to all of us here. You are amazing. 

 

I would not have survived my dementia-stage if it weren't for the curiosity about it. Fear and frustration make it so much worse. The human angle of it, the solitary mind confinement, a struggle to find words in a world that moves and spars around the verbal. Sorry, I'm slipping into word salad again. It's a strange ride, though, isn't it? 

 

And for now, I find that periods of "retreat" work best. The world isn't something that needs to be chased. It will be there when we're well enough to navigate. 

 

I hope the cog fog clears soon and you can get back to all of the great things you do. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way and some wishes for sunshine. 

 

 

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Oh MMT, that sounds beautiful!  I miss mountains!

 

Thank you Shep.  Sadly, my cog fog affected the shamanism class.  I'm lucky, very fortunate that the studio and the class attract very kind, forgiving ladies.  Even though their journeys were hard - I think they will come back and try again.  It was my fault, too - something about using the wrong beater on the drum.  It's amazing how such a small detail can throw the whole experience off. 

 

Usually I am confident that the drum will carry the class, even when I'm in fog.  But I couldn't find the soft beater, the one I like - so I used the spare one, the cheap one that came with the drum.  So I'm struggling to get resonance with this drum, and the ladies are struggling to see something besides monsters and evil clowns.  Hargh!

 

I'm lucky they are patient enough to try again next month.

 

* * *

My brain feels back, after that - it was like a curtain was lifted, and oh no!  What have I done!!!!

 

Windows and waves, windows and waves.

 

So in this window, I went to a doctor.  We all know how we feel about doctors.  But my orthomolecular doc said, "I'd like to look into your 'uncomfortable heartbeat' and I'd like you to get an ECG."  So I'm obedient.  I trust her.  

 

I've been putting the "uncomfortable heartbeat" down to cortisol spikes for years now.  It was one of the reasons I quit drugs - I couldn't breath, uncomfortable heartbeat.

 

So I obediently went to a doctor I trust, who mostly supports me, even though she'd like to see me on Lyrica, neurontin, or amytriptaline.  Funny thing is - I walk up to the desk and they said my appointment was yesterday, and my doctor is in Melbourne today.  I said, (even though I'd been cog fogged) I would never schedule an appointment on class day.  But my doctor (that I had prepared myself for) was out of town.  They offered me a new doctor. 

 

I liked her.  She was young and sweet, and hopefully smart, too.  We did the ECG right there in the nurse's office.  Nurse called in doc to look at it.  Doc called in another doc to look at it.  They saw some things that they didn't have words to describe.  No fancy words for this one - she described it as a lack of coherence in the electrical signals of my heart - like it was skipping over a normal section as if it was damaged, or doing something in the wrong order.

 

Well, I confess.  This uncomfortable heartbeat has messed me up for a long time now.  There might be damage.  And at this point in time, it seems to happen more often than "cortisol spikes" would account for.

 

I guess, to take a positive approach - they want to do a Holter Monitor, 24 hour thing.  I'm sure the technology is smaller and lighter than the thing I had in 1978.  But here's what I'm thinking:  what if I took my 24 hour Cortisol Test at the same time?  Wouldn't that be valuable information?  To be able to track what I perceive as cortisol spikes - to changes in heart rhythms?

 

I wish I felt better about this.  I am 54 years old, with no history of cardiac issues in my family - but - with plenty of risk factors.  Of course, the thing I'm most afraid of, is their drugs.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

OKAY then:

http://www.livestrong.com/article/127394-cardiac-side-effects-lithium/ <----cardiac effects of lithium.

 

Maybe this has been there all along.  And with normal aging, loss of fitness, it's just gotten worse.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

JC,

 

Sorry to hear that your heart is "acting up" a little.  I agree that it would be interesting to see the relationship between the cortisol levels and the results of the holter monitor.  That would allow you to understand the level to which the surges affect your heart (if at all).  

 

No fancy words for this one - she described it as a lack of coherence in the electrical signals of my heart - like it was skipping over a normal section as if it was damaged, or doing something in the wrong order.

 

 

 

Question:  Is the use of the word "damage" yours or hers?

 

In my view it is WAY early to be thinking of damage to the heart.  This sounds like an electrical impulse issue and there are any number of things that can cause the heart to beat out of rhythm in the absence of structural damage to the heart.  I would think that if they were really worried about damage they would have done an echocardiogram to look at structure and ejection fraction.  If they are looking at a 24 hour holter they are still in the early assessment stage and want to see what patterns exist with respect to your heartbeat.

 

Fingers crossed that this is simply another in the long line of withdrawal symptoms and there is nothing to worry about with your heart.  

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Thanks Andy!

 

I think "blockage" was the word she used - though she did mention possible muscle damage in the heart, as well - and I said, "But I haven't had a heart attack!"  I think "might be" was the phrase I used above.

 

I got some encouragement from a friend who said - hey - they didn't call an ambulance and rush me to hospital for emergency surgery - they handed me a slip of paper and said, "do this."  So - not pressing.  

 

I did get a lecture on what symptoms should send me to ER immediately - and I assured her that I would take such symptoms seriously.

 

Here's the thing - this has been a low level chronic thing since before drug withdrawal.

 

My taper was long and slow and gentle, and largely unproblematic.  In fact, this thing - is the reason I stopped smoking, quit the statins, quit the PPI's and then addressed the psych drugs.  I kept thinking I would get better, if I took the load off of my system.

 

Each "quitting" resulted in about 5% improvement in this thing.  But it is still a thing.  and apparently, it is now a thing which shows up on ECG, which  hasn't happened before.  My last stress test/ECG was about 2 years ago when I was still tapering.  Now it is a thing which is getting worse.

 

And - on top of the lithium, there's this:  http://hypothyroidmom.com/is-your-thyroid-killing-you-heart-disease/  (best summary, though - there are more scholarly versions of this information)

 

My thyroid event last month may have exacted a dear price.  Please, dear friends, keep an eye out for thyroid symptoms.  If you have thyroid problems, please, monitor them, care for them - follow your own tests (which I have done, and it's still a struggle), and insist on full profiles (not just TSH).

 

I'm not catastrophizing, I'm methodically going through all of my inputs and situations.

 

In fact - I've been so chill about this - for years - that I keep doing my non-drug techniques, my breathing, my mindfulness, yoga, meditation - and when it doesn't stop the problem, I mindfully watch it until it goes.  I've been noticing it goes less than it comes.

 

But now that it's been spelled out to me on a graph, I'm not really happy with mindfully watching it (though I will).  I'd like to address it.  Today, I've realized how patient I have been with this symptom.  And I'm grateful to the orthomolecular doc who said - ah - check it out, even though I've said, "it's just adrenal - cortisol spikes."   You know - "withdrawal normal!"

 

The hard part is putting myself in the hands of doctors again.  It has felt good to liberate myself from them.  To say NO.  When it's your heart, that's less optional.  But surgeries and drugs have done this to me, it will be a deep challenge to submit again.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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Yup, I agree with Andy.  From my understanding Lexapro/escitalopram can do a number on the heart in some as well........I had never thought that the same could be said for Lithium..........hmmmm........and the thyroid too??!!!!  Somehow all related perhaps........as we are a whole system, interdependent on the whole.

 

Healing thoughts in any case JanCarol.........odd but I am thinking that as your drum beat balances so will your heart.  I just might grab a drum next sweat lodge and give it a try........

 

Best,

mmt

 

.........and why do I suddenly wanna post a bunch of those pink hearts...... :)

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

I got some encouragement from a friend who said - hey - they didn't call an ambulance and rush me to hospital for emergency surgery - they handed me a slip of paper and said, "do this."  So - not pressing.  

 

Given the current environment of "protect thy hindquarters" this has more value than just a general comfort.  If they really thought there was serious blockage or damage you'd have been in a cardiac cath lab unless you objected.  It's how they roll.

 

 

 

The hard part is putting myself in the hands of doctors again.  It has felt good to liberate myself from them.  To say NO.  When it's your heart, that's less optional.  But surgeries and drugs have done this to me, it will be a deep challenge to submit again.

 

The best approach to medical care in my view is to take the best of the West and leave the balance.  Once you have educated yourself about what is what you are in a position to pick and choose (like the old Column A and Column B of Chinese menu lore).  If (and I reiterate I doubt it likely) you needed "work" done on your heart, Western medicine is pretty well suited for much of it.  Good electrophysiologists can do wonders with ablation to fix heart rhythms for example.  So long as you are in a position to remain in charge and make the decisions you can keep a governor on the process and make sure you don't get unnecessary things done or unnecessary meds ingested.  It is for those times when you CAN'T be in control that you need docs you trust and ones that understand your philosophy as best as possible.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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Dearest Jan,

 

I'm soo sorry to hear about this. I was able to read some of it and just know that you will persevere!

I want to take your advice since recently being diagnosed with Hashimoto's and having many cortisol surges nightly since last July.

 

Is this a good Thyroid panel to ask for?

Does it cover everything?

Should I also ask that cortisol levels be checked?

 

Life Extension

Comprehensive Thyroid Panel

Item Catalog Number: LC100018

This panel contains the following tests:

 

Thyroid-Stimulating Hormone (TSH) - Evaluates overall thyroid function

Total Thyroxine (T4) - Measures the total amount of T4 produced by the thyroid gland

Free Thyroxine (T4) - Measures the amount of T4 available to the cells and tissues

Free Tri-iodothyronine (T3) - Measures the amount of T3 (the active form of the hormone) available to the cells and tissues

Reverse T3 - Measures the non-functioning form of the active hormone T3

Thyroglobulin antibody (ATA) - Often measured along with TPO, these antibodies can attack proteins involved in the production of thyroid hormones rendering them dysfunctional

Thyroid Peroxidase antibody (TPO) - Often measured along with ATA, these antibodies can attack proteins involved in the production of thyroid hormones rendering them dysfunctional

 

I'm praying for you, sweet girl!! ❤

Effexor XR 300 (brand) mg & various SSRIs 15 yrs (Effexor XR 300 mg past 10 yrs

Clonazepam, 1.0 mg. am, .5 mg pm. - 15 yrs, 7-17-16- Began .5 three times a day

Vyvanse 60 mg, - 2 yrs, Cut to 50 mg for 6 mths, Cut to 30 mg. on 4-1-16. Tapering.

Approx. 4-1-15 began Effexor XR 300 taper, very slowly for a year. Held at 37.5 for about 3 mths. Cut to 18 mg for 2 wks to 0. WD began 2 wks later. Depression, anxiety, paranoia, low appetite, nausea.

7-14-16-Reinstated 5 beads Effx after 4 mths misery.Pooped out 10 days.

9-12-16-to present- Wide eyed terror, bedridden fear, no appetite/feeling of being full.

10-30-16- Began 15% liquid tapering of 30 mg Vyvanse. (25 mg)

11-13-16- Liquid Vyvanse 22 mg,11-27-16- Liquid 15 mg, 12-12-16- Vyvanse 12.5 for 5 days. 12-16 - 12-29, 15 mg.

11-20-16- Switched back to 1.0 clonazepam am & .5 bedtime

12-30-16- Moved to 15 mg COMPOUNDED Vyvanse.Current 4/11-4/25 7.5 mg.(10% ev 2 wks) Off Vyvanse

Current meds:Effexor XR- 3 Beads, Clonazepam-1.0 mg am, .5 mg bedtime,Vyvanse-(tapering) Estradiol- 2

mg,Progesterone 200 mg,Testosterone 30 mg/ml,Nature Throid- 48.75 mg.(12-21-16-65 mg.) (4-18-17-81.25 mg) Current supplements: Fish Oil-1360 mg, Curamin- 2706 mg.

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  • Mentor

Hi JC

 

I am sorry to hear you've got worrisome heart issues (or may have...) I'm sorry you've got some  unknowns that are adding to your worry now.

 

When I was on lithium, I had my first afib episode, which they said might have been from taking some lithium that was expired (I never checked the date on it, but they did... how I ended up with old lithium, I don't know)  I'm not suggesting you have afib, but you might......

 

ever since then, I've had a lot more PVCs and PACs.   I also have a right bundle branch block (something that's interesting, but not at all a concern) I am hoping that what they are thinking you have is the same thing, as I've been told repeatedly that it's common and no cause for concern. My cardiologists are at one of the top cardiac centers in New England, so I generally trust them.

(Quote:

"Is a bundle branch block dangerous?

Damage to one of the branch bundles can cause uncoordinated ventricular contractions, and an abnormal heart beat can result. A blocked signal on the right side of the heart is not usually serious, but a block on the left side can indicate a higher risk of coronary artery disease, or some other heart problem." )

I have some minor heart damage from a too high heart rate and un treated high blood pressure from when I CT'ed off a very high dose of seroquel, but the damage is very minor. I have a strong heart overall, so there's no impact on health whatsoever. I forget what they called it, I think it's left ventricular hypertrophy.....?? in any case, it sounds way worse than it is. well, I have only a very mild case of it.

 

I totally understand being nervous about the findings. But as others have pointed out, it's probably not too concerning, or you'd be in there asap for all  sorts of other tests and whatnot.

 

I have episodic atrial fibrillation that I believe is related to being on so many psych meds, esp the lithium.

( (http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/lithium%20carbonate/atrial%20fibrillation/)

 

 I belong to a world wide group of others with afib, and there's a very high number of ppl who have thyhroid issues, so that seems to be a contributing factor as well.  (http://www.bmj.com/content/345/bmj.e7895_) (http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/116/15/1725)

Afib is very common, and if you *have to* have something, I hope that's all that it is. Well, I hope that it's NOTHING but if you had to choose your heart condition, you could do a lot worse then afib.  :/

 

I hope the holter monitor will clear up the mystery and that you can find a solution to your odd heart beats once and for all.

I know anything with the heart can be scary, but usually the terms they use are the only really scary thing.

 

if you do turn out to have an irregular heart beat, please do research ablations completely, they are the big money maker now for the cardiac docs that specialize in them- in many cases they are not necessary except to pad the drs wallet. I asked why I was not being offered an ablation, and the dr told me that for afib, it's purely a "quality of life measure", as afib itself is not dangerous.

I was shocked, since so many of the ppl in my afib group, who have good insurance, are being told that they *need* the ablation, because their afib will get worse in time without it. This turns out not to be true. But too many ppl are being rushed into an ablation after having only a single afib episode, when they may never have another episode, or like me, have one maybe every 5 yrs or so!!

 

 With a price tag of over $100,000 for the procedure, which often needs to be repeated, there's a huge profit to be made on pts with good insurance. I can't have an ablation because my insurance would not pay for it.

I don't want one anyway.  (my apologies to Andy, but in at least some cases, these ablations are a huge rip off, put quite bluntly)

 

Also, I was never told that I could reduce or eliminate my afib episodes by avoiding my triggers, which turns out to be very easy to do. Avoid becoming dehydrated, avoid eating too much, avoid prolonged stress, etc.
There's no money to be made in doing things to keep people healthy :/

 

  • pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) 
  •  Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years
  • started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 
  •  2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs
  •  June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until  Sept, then acute WD hit!!  reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106
  • Tapered off to zero by  Oct. 2017 Doing very well. 
  • Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 
  • Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content
  • Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs ;) 
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  • Moderator Emeritus

 (my apologies to Andy, but in at least some cases, these ablations are a huge rip off, put quite bluntly)

 

No need to apologize, Catnapt.  I get no kickbacks from the cardiology syndicate.   :D This is a good place to exchange thoughts and ideas and I certainly welcome yours.

 

My point was simply that there are options to consider and that is one that could be considered for the right person under the right facts.  This is especially true for those who find the irregular heartbeats difficult or impossible to live with.  I agree, however, that if you don't need ANY procedure you are best off not having it -- same goes for meds (obvious to all of us now).

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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  • Mentor

 

No need to apologize, Catnapt.  I get no kickbacks from the cardiology syndicate.   :D This is a good place to exchange thoughts and ideas and I certainly welcome yours.

 

My point was simply that there are options to consider and that is one that could be considered for the right person under the right facts.  This is especially true for those who find the irregular heartbeats difficult or impossible to live with.  I agree, however, that if you don't need ANY procedure you are best off not having it -- same goes for meds (obvious to all of us now).

 

 

 

I figured this is what you meant, but I just wanted to add what I've learned about how ablations are being pushed when they may not be needed. It's very unsettling to me that drs, the ppl you think of as "healers", seem to have no problem doing these expensive procedures, which are often painful and can have serious complications, on people who would be better off not having it done, simply because there's so much money to be made on them. They must have to convince themselves that they are doing the 'right' thing... or that, if the patient wants it, it's ok, even if it's not the best or wisest course of action.

 

sorry, been a bit discouraged about the whole medical establishment.

and my blood pressure goes up a few points every time I see an add for a new drug.

 

anyway, JC, I sure hope you get good news from your 24hr holter monitor.

;-)

 

 

 

  • pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) 
  •  Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years
  • started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 
  •  2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs
  •  June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until  Sept, then acute WD hit!!  reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106
  • Tapered off to zero by  Oct. 2017 Doing very well. 
  • Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 
  • Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content
  • Dec 2023 Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs ;) 
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  • Moderator Emeritus

Thanks guys! 

 

Yes, I read about the a-fib fib on your page, Catnapt.  Shocking that you got the doc to admit that, well, maybe it wasn't really necessary, or beneficial, or what not.  (these are the kinds of stories that make me cringe)

 

Here's the thing:  there's the cover story - that these heart patients can't live without their blood thinners and heart rate regulators and blood pressure medicines.

 

But when my Dad got put on Coumadin, that's when his health started to decline.  People are put on medicines and drugs willy nilly, and their health (such as my health with the statins that they still want me to take) declines while on them.

 

The cover story on psychiatry is that "people need these drugs, these treatments" (including ECT! TransCranial Magnetic whatever).  But we know better.

 

It makes me question the whole of western medicine, when the treatments for me: statins, PPI's, thyroid surgery, hysterectomy, colo-rectal repair (of all of these, I really and truly have not been the same since this one) - have been, on the whole, more harmful than helpful.

 

It's not like you can get straight answers, either.  That's why, when I get all my info I will talk to my orthomolecular doc to see if she can give me straight talk.  She's a woman's doctor, not a cardiologist - but she started this process by asking me to look into it.

 

I'm calling now to find out the who-what-where-how-why-when of getting a Holter here in this country where everything is usually hours away and only on Tuesdays between 6-8 am.  At least it doesn't have to be inpatient, like it was in the 70's, and the device will be teeny tiny.  

 

La la - first phone call - two different centers are not open at 3:30 pm on a Thursday afternoon.   Welcome to Queensland.  I'm calling the central office now, it looks like somebody's home....La.  They tried to transfer me to the office that wasn't answering their phone.  At least it looks like I can get it 15 minutes away instead of going further  to a larger suburb or hospital!  LOL central office "left a message" for me.  It could be worse - it could be in the USA where this would strike fear into the heart of my pocketbook.  Likely, this will be mostly covered by Aussie Medicare.  (reminder:  It can always be worse!)

 

I also ordered the Cortisol Test, should be here in 2 days.  I think it will be good information to put the 2 together.  

 

NOTE:  while looking at the form to get the thing done, there is a tick box for URGENT.  This box is not ticked.  Reassurance.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

It makes me question the whole of western medicine, when the treatments for me: statins, PPI's, thyroid surgery, hysterectomy, colo-rectal repair (of all of these, I really and truly have not been the same since this one) - have been, on the whole, more harmful than helpful.

 

No doubt, JC, that there is much to be dismayed by when it comes to Western Medicine.  One must NEVER lose sight of the fact that it is, for all intents a purposes, a "for profit" industry.  Like any other, however, there are good people that operate within its construct and the key is (i) finding those good people, (ii) finding a guru who can help you through the thicket, (iii) getting fully educated (as far as possible) yourself or (iv) some combination of the above.  I know you are doing your share of (iii) above.  

 

Healthy skepticism is a valid approach.  My only caution (and lord knows I'm no champion of allopathic medicine) is not to "throw out the baby with the bathwater." Just recognize that there are times when some of "their" modalities are necessary or desirable.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

La!  Sounds good.  And also great that you are going to do your own little study/correlation of the cortisol spikes while you do the Holter monitor.  I will follow along and hope and send out good healing energy. 

 

I also wonder sometimes if, at least here in the States.......that some of the lousy dis-integrated care, called after all....."practicing medicine" is due to the over, over specialization in various health systems care.  For example.......one sees the cardiologist or ob/gyn or shrink or orthopedic doc, or for that matter any combination of......but they never get together as a team and go back to treating you/I/anyone as a whole........and one hand doesn't even know what the other is doing.  Theoretically.......I spose it is assumed that the primary care doc is going to coordinate it all somehow........rarely though in reality can they...........as they are juggling such high patient loads and having to see massive quantities of people to keep insurance happy and paying.......  So, did care get worse with the onset of HMO's here in the States?  Will it ever go back to decent health care again?  Preventively focused and using the least harm approaches and with one doctor in charge/as well as the patient themselves.  Sheesh......

 

I am glad you have a good orthomolecular person to help guide you JanCarol........that IS a plus.

 

Thanks catnapt too.  I am going have to read through your stuff now.  I had a pretty long stretch of Lexapro/escitalpram too and my Mum has the atrial fib controlled by medication.  Soooo.......maybe I get the grace to do some preventative study.....just in case.......I've never had an EKG and it's not standard with my yearly physical or anything.......nor will I ask for one at this point unless I feel some need to after reading on up on it.

 

(string of pink heart inserts here)

and Best,

mmt

 

Oh yah......definitely some good with all that is here and offered......Western medicine, allopathic medicine...........yet........available to so few as things stand now with the for profit, and politics going on............

Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016.  And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed.  Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022.  Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider.  My success story:  Blue skies ahead, clear sailing

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Heh!  I have SA!  If I didn't have SA, I'd be a lot less calm than I am now!

 

And, my ace in the hole, my doctor-friend back home.  When I get really scared, she will be wise when I cannot be.

 

So - better than ONE guru ("trust me," said the spider to the fly) - I have a whole team to choose from!

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Okay, I'm going to try and communicate this insight I had on the massage table.

 

You know when you are floored, bottomed out, crashed.  You have lost all hope, purpose, and energy for applying yourself to anything.

 

(there may be an evolutionary strategy for this condition, but that is another discussion for later)

 

So - at a very basic level.  You have to eat.  Brush your teeth.  Cook.  Put clothes on.  Wash your face.  Maybe greet your partner.  Maybe interact with your pet.  Maybe care for your child.  There are a number of extremely basic activities that you may have to address when you are in the floored state.

 

The journey starts with:  "I got this."

 

I have to make something to eat.  I got this.

I have to eat it.  I got this.

I have to brush my teeth.  I got this.

(I may need to rest at this point, but the point is:  I did it, I survived it, and the thing got done.)

 

At first the "I got this" statements are said with dreariness, dread, whatever feelings.  OK.  If I have to, I got this.

 

But over time, the energy builds, and as your teeth are brushed, your face washed, your shoes are on, and you're going out to the shops.  I got this!

 

It becomes more exciting.   Especially if you apply gratitude to each step of the way.

 

As you interact with people, and engage on more levels - I got this! Can become thrilling!  More gratitude = more "I got this!"

 

As it builds, it can actually become a sort of slingshot to propel you to the next level of functioning.

 

BUT (there's always a but) you may need to address your tethers before you can achieve escape velocity!

 

When we are a child, we are like a balloon, free floating, easy, light, carefree - with one tether - to Mom (or Dad).  WHen that tether gets disrupted, hopefully we will be well connected enough to tether to others (natural growth).  As we learn and grow in life, we tether ourselves to a number of things:

 

Paradigms of reality - how we view the world, beliefs

Self belief & perception - "I am this," "I am that"

Relationships - connections to others

Things (oh yes, Things and the pursuit of them can really slow you down)

Social constraints

Obligations & Expectations

 

These all become tethers which help define who you are - but - if you want to grow, you may need to address which of these tethers are harmful and which are helpful, which are necessary, and which are drags on your flight.

 

So - I got this!

 

Can be a huge growth opportunity, even if it is one step (or spoon) at a time.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • Moderator

Brilliant post JC!!!!!!!

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Final Dose 0.016mg.     Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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  • Moderator Emeritus

                                                                                                    O

 

Thank you Brass!  You are one of my heroes when it comes to threading concepts of growth and awareness into words!

                                                                                                (blush)

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Thinking about that slingshot - and the free-floating balloon.

 

The word "buoyancy" came to mind.

 

Symptoms, I am still having acute and (now becoming) chronic tendonitis in my ankles, wrists, and neck.  Every sign points to "thyroid is not right" still.  Heart - has been chill (of course, I had a bland Holter Monitor Test, no acting up for that!).  

 

But - emotionally, I'm buoyant.  More resilient.  I still cannot do karate (afraid I'd hurt my ankles).  But back to daily sun-walks.  Back to getting the chores more done.  Back to accomplishing a few things around the house (heck, I'm doing my taxes, that's impressive enough!).  Had a good shaman group.

 

I came to the realization that I committed to a whole year of dates on that.  Regardless of how I feel, regardless of my wellness / tiredness / pain / digestion - I go out once a month to drum for others.  It's teaching me a lot - because I need to drum well.  How can I present clear spirit, intent and upliftment - when in pain, or emotionally dark, or doubting?  (because these are natural human states - they happen)

 

And I came back to ritual.

 

I preach "Practice" a lot.  Have a Practice, do it every day.  And the practice will build, and you develop resilience, buoyancy.

 

Let me be clear about what a Practice is.

 

Here's an example.  At some point in the 90's, I decided that the depression was too heavy, and that I needed to listen to Yes music every day (it's very affirming).  I didn't always participate in my Practice, but I always returned to it.  Always relied on it.  And the more I did it, the more the knowledge of the music built until I have a virtual fortress of affirmation in the music of Yes.

 

How simple is that?  Listen to music every day.  

 

More complex is my relationship with Yoga, which has been a daily practice on and off for 40 years now.  Some years not at all, some years - intensely engaged with it.  Sometimes daily practice, sometimes weekly (currently) - but also - after 40 years, it's more integrated.  When I talk to my body - it tells me that a down dog would feel good, or a legs-up-on-the-wall, or some neck stretches, or breathing.  It's more a mindfulness practice now, too.

 

So - a practice, when repeated turns into a strength.

 

And it doesn't have to be much.  My sun-walks were another practice.  Doggedly, I did them every day for 3 years.  I fell off in the heat this year, but it's coming back, and it feels good.  A 15 min dose of sunshine, a little walk to check the gardens of the neighbors, and 5 min of tai chi.  My p-doc said she would support my reduction of psych drugs - if I would do sun-walks.  Every day.  Without fail.  And so I did.  It was a contract, an agreement.

 

And when I learned how good it was for me, I declared it "Practice."  And even when I've been in too much pain to go to yoga or karate, or to drive - I can still hobble out and walk for 10 minutes, and after the 5 min tai chi - I can move a little better.  

 

So another small practice - I did in 1995 (whups, my year of "manic behaviours) was to "greet the sun" every day.  I had an apartment full of light, and the moment I woke up - in gratitude - I did a 5 minute yoga session.  I had a list of about 10 practices to choose from, and did one each day. 

 

5 minutes a day.  Felt great!

 

Maybe your practice will be giving thanks for the food for your body.  I've started doing that one, too.  Grace.  I've suffered so much from digestive troubles - I need to not be afraid of my food.  I need to be grateful for my food.  So - I don't say a fancy prayer or anything.  I literally look at the food before me, and say (or think), "Grace."  Just a pause.  There is a healthful reason we learned to pray before a meal.

 

Maybe your practice is cat cuddling, or dog walking.  It doesn't have to be "spiritual" or "zen" or even cool.  Maybe your practice is about a cuppa tea mid-morning and listening to a radio program or talk that you like.  Maybe your practice is your daily shower, "I do this for my well being"  Maybe your practice is what you do to fall asleep at night (fluffing pillows, brushing teeth, getting ready for bed).  

 

As Alan Watts says, "Do something rhythmic."  Then do it again tomorrow.

Edited by JanCarol
Changed video to Cardistry

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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