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The Body Keeps the Score


GiaK
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excellent collection of notes from a friend of mine attending a wonderful conference.
 
Even when trauma is long past, it replays itself in the body through pain, anxiety, depression, illness, digestive issues, and so on. We must help the client learn to tolerate the physiological trauma symptoms while remaining in their bodies – since nearly all PTSD is dissociative in some way...
 
read more:
http://wp.me/p5nnb-aaJ

Everything Matters: Beyond Meds 

https://beyondmeds.com/

withdrawn from a cocktail of 6 psychiatric drugs that included every class of psych drug.
 

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Thanks for posting this!

Current:

Lorazapam2mg: 4/9/152mg - 1.5mg: already sick/nothing noticed. No changes in sleep noted after illness.  

Lamictal: 7/27/13 - 8/6/13: 400mg - 500mg(dr order) mouth sores, headache, cognitive/balance, heart palp...8/7/13 - 8/23/13: 500mg - 400mg; symptoms↓...10/10/13: 350mg; fever/flu-like <2-weeks...12/30/13: 325mg; fever/flu-like symptoms <1-week...2/10/17: 300mg; no significant changes noted. 

 

Discontinued:

Omeprazole: 09/2103 40mg...5/1/14: 20mg... 8/21/14 = 0

Wellbutrin: 11/22/13: 300mg – 225mg...12/6/13 delayed reaction- mood swings, weight↓, heart palp/chest pain, alerting...12/14/13: 187mg; physical symptoms↓, neuro emotions ↑, weight stable...12/20/13: 225mg; physical symptoms return, emotions stable <1-week, weight↓...4/21/14: 187mg; weight↑...5/17/14 (neurologist ordered discontinue asap):168mg; headache, mood swings, ↑weight, sleep flux...5/24/14: 150mg; headache, mood swings, ↓cognitive/balance...6/2/14: 112mg; see above, weight stable, <3-weeks... 6/28/14: 100mg; moody...7/25/14: 87.5mg; family troubles... 8/4/14: 75mg; headaches; moody... 8/9/1450mg headaches... 8/12/14: 37.5mg; 8/17/14: 25mg...8/26/14 = 0

Hydroxyzine; 10mg: 5/20/15 *prn 4/5 times then dc'd. Mood changes/rage 

Buspirone: 7.5mg: 5/20/15 *prn 4/5 times then dc'd. No changes.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Very enlightening, thanks Gia. 

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I love love lurve Bessel Van der Kolk.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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  • 4 weeks later...

For me Prozac use = trauma to my mind + body further use and withdrawal has x that trauma.

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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"However, the medial prefrontal cortex (and to a lesser extent, the posterior cingulate), which is where we process inner experience or interoception has a direct link to the amygdala and limbic system. This is the only system through which we can access and change our emotional self. This is the power of mindfulness practice, it’s centered in the MPC. Dan Siegel is the current expert in this realm"

http://beyondmeds.com/2013/12/17/the-body-keeps-the-score-part-two-how-trauma-changes-us/

 

Also this part of the brain can be severly affected by ssri/snri use.

Tardive Dyskinesia/Dystonia, Parkinsonism & Akathisia

SSRI & SSNRI antidepressants induced side-effects (Iatrogenic Extrapyramidal Symptoms) are
recognized to be similar to Neuroleptic (anti-psychotic) induced side-effects. These side-effects are known as Tardive Dyskinesia/Dystonia (severe body movement disorder, mostly permanent), Parkinsonism(a sign of future Parkinson's disease) and Akathisia (a Neurological driven severe mania/agitation that can lead to suicidality, suicide attempts, self-harm & suicide). It is well documented in the medical literature that these neuroleptic induced side-effects refer to damage at dopaminergic neurons in the "motor system" of the
"Basal Ganglia", a structure deep in the "Limbic System" of the brain. 1234,http://www.emedicine.com/EMERG/topic338.htm (scroll down)

http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/toxicity-brain-damage.htm

 

There have been reports I have read stating that some people who took ssri/snri drugs have claim abuse and later retracted and said the drugs caused their memories to dysfunction.  I know this is a long and ongoing debate but since this article is in part on trauma and some of the references were to childhood trauma and abuse I thought it might fit here.  

I know for a fact my memory is not great and at times seems to fail me more than other times. 

 

So since false memories have been associated with these drugs a bit about how this actually happens in other brain disorders that have been studied. 

"It was found that participants with frontal lobe damage consistently produced a greater number of confabulations than the controls. 3 of the patients with frontal lobe damage even produced spontaneous false memories frequently while not being tested. In general, the greater the extent of the damage, the more confabulations were produced, and the false memories were most often produced in response to questions testing personal episodic memory and orientation in time. By contrast, none of the patients with damage to other lobes of the brain produced significantly more false memories than the healthy controls.

Another pattern emerged when the test results were grouped according to the site of the lesion: those with damage to the orbital, medial or left lateral regions of the frontal lobes produced significantly more confabulations of personal episodic memory, whereas those with damage to the orbital, medial or right lateral frontal lobes produced more confabulations of orientation in time.

When the data were grouped according to the total number of confabulations, it was found that all the patients who produced significantly more false memories than controls had damage in the ventromedial prefrontal cortex, either in the orbital region of in the anterior cingulate gyrus. These “high confabulators” could be distinguished from “low confabulators” on the basis of 6 memory tests and 2 measures of executive functioning.

Thus, confabulation is strongly associated with damage to the ventromedial prefrontal cortex. Memory impairments seem to be necessary for the production of false memories, but executive function is less important. However, although the study localizes confabulation to the ventromedial prefrontal cortex, further work will be needed to determine whether it occurs as a result of impairments in memory or executive function, or both. 

If confabulation occurs following damage to the ventromedial cortex, what functions might this part of the brain be involved in? Some researchers have suggested that it normally suppresses memories that are not relevant to the current situation, while others argue that it acts as a monitoring system which normally rejects false memories that don’t “feel right”."

http://scienceblogs.com/neurophilosophy/2008/06/13/anatomy-of-a-false-memory/

I or somebody who is interested could look up how ssri/snri drugs affect this particular bit of the brain that is the source of false memory.  I am sure these drugs affect memory.  

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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  • 4 years later...

This topic includes links to some notes about this:

 

 

 

Trauma is a fact of life. Veterans and their families deal with the painful aftermath of combat; one in five Americans has been molested; one in four grew up with alcoholics; one in three couples have engaged in physical violence. Dr. Bessel van der Kolk, one of the world’s foremost experts on trauma, has spent over three decades working with survivors. In The Body Keeps the Score, he uses recent scientific advances to show how trauma literally reshapes both body and brain, compromising sufferers’ capacities for pleasure, engagement, self-control, and trust. He explores innovative treatments—from neurofeedback and meditation to sports, drama, and yoga—that offer new paths to recovery by activating the brain’s natural neuroplasticity. Based on Dr. van der Kolk’s own research and that of other leading specialists, The Body Keeps the Score exposes the tremendous power of our relationships both to hurt and to heal—and offers new hope for reclaiming lives.

 

 

 

Edited by ChessieCat
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Short Term Case: 7 pill of 10 mg of Modafinil in a 3 month span, but last 3 I took back to back causing severe withdrawals, lasting 3 weeks. Than 2 pills lexapro to help withdrawal lead to more withdrawal.  I have most symptoms Pssd, emotional loss, cognitive issues, nerve damage in legs.  Also 2 benzodiazepines.  Not much to damage me long term...

 

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  • ChessieCat changed the title to The Body Keeps the Score
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