Selig Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hi everyone, I was referred here from another site on Depersonalization Disorder that I co-run. I was hoping to get some insight on my situation. I have been on many medications in my life, and recently I have decided to cease my Citalopram due to side effects. I have successfully tapered down to 0.25 Clonazepam daily from 1.5mg, however I am noticing some effects of the Citalopram. Here is my taper time so far: Start at 20mg Down to 10mg for two weeks Down to 5mg for one week Started 2.5mg today I believe this may have been quick, but I am impatient to get off the Celexa as it causes me heart problems. So far has not been horrible, but here's what I have: Increase in appetite (had lost weight anyway) Sexual dreams Shakiness at certain times Restlessness Agitation Anxiety I am not experiencing any brain zaps, is this is a good thing? Typically I got them before if I skipped a couple dosages. I also do not feel more depressed yet. My psychiatrist said I could cease the Celexa but gave me no insight on how to go about it. Any tips would be appreciated! 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Nikki Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hello and welcome... There is a benzo section which you might want to look at on this site. There is lots of support there for benzos. I am not sure what depersonalization disorder is. I will have to look it up. I know that depersonalization can be caused by meds and the WD from them and there are posts on this site about it. I have vague idea of what it is. Can you elaborate? I just got off Celexa a few weeks back. I did not go as quickly as you did. I was supposed to taper onto one med while getting off celexa and imipramine. I have had anxiety and some times of depression on meds, so why bother to put these things into my system if they do not work.....that is my reasoning for tapering. You may really be having WD symptoms from the quick taper. The recommendations from personal experiences from symptoms is to go back up in dose and stabilize. Others will be along to help you out......nice to meet you:) Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1902-nikki-hi-my-rundown-with-ads/ Paxil 1997-2004 Crossed over to Lexapro Paxil not available at Pharmacies GSK halted deliveries Lexapro 40mgs Lexapro taper (2years) Imipramine Imipramine and Celexa Now Nefazadone/Imipramine 50mgs. each 45mgs. Serzone 50mgs. Imipramine Link to comment
Ellen042 Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hi Selig, Just wanted to say welcome. That sounds like a fast taper by this site's standards. I came off it even faster-cold turkey, but of course don't recommend that. I was just following my doctor's orders and had only been on it for a couple weeks anyway. No WD symptoms for me. (Don't count me lucky though, as another drug is giving me heck to come off.) You'll likely be encouraged to slow down the taper or perhaps even reinstate to a higher dose. Seems like we're all sensitive to individual degrees to individual drugs. Good luck to you. Ellen insomnia, anxiety, depression- since childhood lyme disease, dysautonomia, chiari malformation- dx 4/1997 nortriptyline- 75mg since childhood clonazepam- 3mg since 4/1997 trazodone-100mg since 4/2013, now tapering rotating antibiotics and antimalarials for lyme disease midodrine- 10mg for dysautonomia repeated skull surgeries for chiari malformation Link to comment
Administrator Karma Posted December 22, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hi Selig Welcome to the forum. These do appear to be withdrawals from a too fast taper. We recommend tapering no more than 10% of your previous dose and holding that for a period of time in order to allow your system to stabilize. I usually recommend holding for a month, seeing how you feel and then adjusting the hold time up or down from there. Here is our guidance on tapering off of celexa: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2023-tips-for-tapering-off-celexa-citalopram/ You might want to go back up to 10 mg and see if the withdrawal symptoms subside. Give it at least 4 days and possibly a week. Determine whether you are feeling better or worse. If you are feeling somewhat better, but not great, then try increasing by just 1 mg. You may need to reinstate the full dosage and do a slow taper, but given your concerns over heart problems, I think going back to 10 mg might be a better solution for you. We have many knowledgeable moderators here on the forum and others will be along soon to provide additional support. Karma 2007 @ 375 mg Effexor - 11/29/2011 - 43.75 mg Effexor (regular) & .625 mg Xanax 200 mg Gabapentin 2/27/21 - 194.5 mg, 5/28/21 - 183 mg, 8/2/21 - 170 mg, 11/28/21 - 150 mg, 4/19/22 - 122 mg; 8//7/22 - 100 mg; 12/17 - 75mg; 8/17 - 45 mg; 10/16 40 mg Xanax taper: 3/11/12 - 0.9375 mg, 3/25/12 - 0.875 mg, 4/6/12 - 0.8125 mg, 4/18/12 - 0.75 ; 10/16 40mg; 1/16 0.6875 mg; at some point 0.625 mg Effexor taper: 1/29/12 - 40.625 mg, 4/29/12 - 39.875 mg, 5/11/12 - Switched to liquid Effexor, 5/25/12 - 38 mg, 7/6/12 - 35 mg, 8/17/12 - 32 mg, 9/14/12 - 30 mg, 10/19/12 - 28 mg, 11/9/12 - 26 mg, 11/30/12 - 24 mg, 01/14/13 - 22 mg. 02/25/13 - 20.8 mg, 03/18/13 - 19.2 mg, 4/15/13 - 17.6 mg, 8/10/13 - 16.4 mg, 9/7/13 - 15.2 mg, 10/19/13 - 14 mg, 1/15/14 - 13.2 mg, 3/1/2014 - 12.6 mg, 5/4/14 - 12 mg, 8/1/14 - 11.4 mg, 8/29/14 - 10.8 mg; 10/14/14 - 10.2 mg; 12/15/14 - 10 mg, 1/11/15 - 9.5 mg, 2/8/15 - 9 mg, 3/21/15 - 8.5 mg, 5/1/15 - 8 mg, 6/9/15 - 7.5 mg, 7/8/15 - 7 mg, 8/22/15 - 6.5 mg, 10/4/15 - 6 mg; 1/1/16 - 5.6 mg; 2/6/16 - 5.2 mg; 4/9 - 4.8 mg; 7/7 4.5 mg; 10/7 4.25 mg; 11/4 4.0 mg; 11/25 3.8 mg; 4/24 3.6 mg; 5/27 3.4 mg; 7/8 3.2 mg ... 10/18 2.8 mg; 1/18 2.6 mg; 4/7 2.4 mg; 5/26 2.15mg; 8/18 1.85 mg; 10/7 1.7 mg; 12/1 1.45 mg; 3/2 1.2 mg; 5/4 0.90 mg; 6/1 0.80 mg; 6/22 0.65 mg; 08/03 0.50 mg, 08/10 0.45 mg, 10/05 0.325 mg, 11/23 0.2 mg, 12/14 0.15 mg, 12/21 0.125 mg, 02/28 0.03125 mg, 2/15 0.015625 mg, 2/29/20 0.00 mg - OFF Effexor I am not a medical professional - this is not medical advice. My suggestions are based on personal experience, reading, observation and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 22, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 22, 2013 Welcome, Selig. When did the heart symptoms start? When you reduced the clonazepam, is that when you started to have heart symptoms? What were they? How did you know it was the citalopram that was causing them? Given the heart symptoms, I might hold on citalopram at 2.5mg at least for several weeks, and see if the symptoms abate, then reduce by 10% per month. If the symptoms get worse within the several weeks, I might add perhaps 1mg citalopram. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
ladybug Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hi Selig! I can't add to the good advice you've already been given, but I just want to thank you for your DP/DR forum. I have been struggling with DR for a while now and I have found your forum very helpful. Thank you for all the good you do for those of us suffering from this affliction a.k.a JMarie Paxil since Mar.1998 2006-2007:40-20mg 2009: 20mg to 14mg 2010: 14mg to 10.5mg 2011: 10.5 to 7.6mg 2012: 7.5 to 6.8mg 2013: 6.7-6.3mg 2014: 6.2mg-5.8mg 2015: 5.7 to 5.15mg 2016: 5.1-4.6mg 1/19/17: 4.5mg 3/17/17: 4.4mg 6/15/17: 4.35mg 8/10/17: 4.3mg 1/29/18: 4.1mg 5/07/18: 4.0mg 7/31/18: 3.9mg Link to comment
Selig Posted December 25, 2013 Author Share Posted December 25, 2013 Thank you everyone for the help, I appreciate it very much! Hello and welcome... There is a benzo section which you might want to look at on this site. There is lots of support there for benzos. I am not sure what depersonalization disorder is. I will have to look it up. I know that depersonalization can be caused by meds and the WD from them and there are posts on this site about it. I have vague idea of what it is. Can you elaborate? I just got off Celexa a few weeks back. I did not go as quickly as you did. I was supposed to taper onto one med while getting off celexa and imipramine. I have had anxiety and some times of depression on meds, so why bother to put these things into my system if they do not work.....that is my reasoning for tapering. You may really be having WD symptoms from the quick taper. The recommendations from personal experiences from symptoms is to go back up in dose and stabilize. Others will be along to help you out......nice to meet you:) Depersonalization Disorder is characterized by feeling disconnected from your own body and surroundings, I have had it for many years and it is quite difficult to live with! Hi Selig! I can't add to the good advice you've already been given, but I just want to thank you for your DP/DR forum. I have been struggling with DR for a while now and I have found your forum very helpful. Thank you for all the good you do for those of us suffering from this affliction Thank you! The other administrator is the one who created the site, so I cannot take the credit for that. I am very grateful to now be helping him run the site, best of wishes in your recovery Welcome, Selig.When did the heart symptoms start? When you reduced the clonazepam, is that when you started to have heart symptoms? What were they? How did you know it was the citalopram that was causing them?Given the heart symptoms, I might hold on citalopram at 2.5mg at least for several weeks, and see if the symptoms abate, then reduce by 10% per month.If the symptoms get worse within the several weeks, I might add perhaps 1mg citalopram. Hi Altostrata, thank you for your reply. The heart palpitations have been going on for about 6 months now. They did a couple tests and didn't find anything off, although I am waiting on another test as well. I believed the Celexa might be causing heart issues because days I forgot to take it I didn't seem to experience any palpitations. I saw a couple articles on Celexa and heart problems and it made me a bit nervous. Other than that my decision to come off was fuelled by the horrible memory I now have, and the medication seems to have no effect on my happiness anymore. I consulted my psychiatrist and he said if I worsened afterwards we could try a new medication- but I am reluctant. Odd enough, It has become worse since I decreased the Clonazepam- I wonder if this is another effect of anxiety? I am also on Metoprolol for stress-induced high blood pressure, but the blood pressure issues have abated. I take only 7.5mg a day now. I wish I had heard of this site when I first started tapering, as I could have followed the 10 percent guide. I forgot to take my dosage yesterday and did not experience any more withdrawal effects. Today I (perhaps foolishly) decided to test the waters and not take it today either. No brain zaps or any sign of the withdrawals. Could the cutting down to 5mg been enough after all? I am indecisive as to whether I should take my dosage tomorrow or see if I begin to experience any withdrawals tomorrow. Here is a chart of the past few days: December 20th- 5mg December 21st- 2.5mg December 22nd- 2.5mg December 23rd- None December 24th- None I did increase my Clonazepam by 0.25mg as I notice I am more anxious and my depersonalization is a bit higher. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Petunia Posted December 25, 2013 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 25, 2013 Hi Selig, Welcome to SA Odd enough, It has become worse since I decreased the Clonazepam- I forgot to take my dosage yesterday and did not experience any more withdrawal effects. I am indecisive as to whether I should take my dosage tomorrow or see if I begin to experience any withdrawals tomorrow. Here is a chart of the past few days: December 20th- 5mg December 21st- 2.5mg December 22nd- 2.5mg December 23rd- None December 24th- None I did increase my Clonazepam by 0.25mg as I notice I am more anxious and my depersonalization is a bit higher. Its not a good idea to be adjusting the dosages of two medications at the same time, you can't tell which one is having an effect on your symptoms. It could very well be that decreasing the Clonazepam has caused your symptoms to become worse, including heart palpitations. How often per day do you take Clonazepam? All benzos can cause interdose rebound anxiety symptoms when they wear off, especially in people with a destabilized nervous system. This may be something to consider. Often, its advisable to split your dose throughout the day so that you are not experiencing this effect. If I were you, I would do as Alto suggested and hold Celexa at 2.5mg, taken at the same time every day for several weeks to give your nervous system time to settle down again. Also, hold on your current dose of Clonazepam if you are comfortable there. Its a good idea to keep notes on dosages of meds and timing of symptoms, that way you have a written record, memory isn't very reliable. Once you become stable again, then you can continue with a safe, slow taper. This link explains why we recommend tapering by 10% on a monthly basis: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1024-why-taper-by-10-of-my-dosage/ Petu. I'm not a doctor. My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one. My Introduction Thread Full Drug and Withdrawal History Brief Summary Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects 2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010 Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal) May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins. Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens. Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days. April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close. VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from? VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made? VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes? VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects? VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes Link to comment
Selig Posted December 25, 2013 Author Share Posted December 25, 2013 Hi Selig,Welcome to SA Odd enough, It has become worse since I decreased the Clonazepam- I forgot to take my dosage yesterday and did not experience any more withdrawal effects. I am indecisive as to whether I should take my dosage tomorrow or see if I begin to experience any withdrawals tomorrow. Here is a chart of the past few days: December 20th- 5mgDecember 21st- 2.5mgDecember 22nd- 2.5mgDecember 23rd- NoneDecember 24th- None I did increase my Clonazepam by 0.25mg as I notice I am more anxious and my depersonalization is a bit higher. Its not a good idea to be adjusting the dosages of two medications at the same time, you can't tell which one is having an effect on your symptoms. It could very well be that decreasing the Clonazepam has caused your symptoms to become worse, including heart palpitations. How often per day do you take Clonazepam? All benzos can cause interdose rebound anxiety symptoms when they wear off, especially in people with a destabilized nervous system. This may be something to consider. Often, its advisable to split your dose throughout the day so that you are not experiencing this effect. If I were you, I would do as Alto suggested and hold Celexa at 2.5mg, taken at the same time every day for several weeks to give your nervous system time to settle down again. Also, hold on your current dose of Clonazepam if you are comfortable there. Its a good idea to keep notes on dosages of meds and timing of symptoms, that way you have a written record, memory isn't very reliable. Once you become stable again, then you can continue with a safe, slow taper. This link explains why we recommend tapering by 10% on a monthly basis: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1024-why-taper-by-10-of-my-dosage/ Petu. Thank you, I take Clonazepam typically once a day, 0.25mg. As I mentioned, lately I've had to go back up to 0.5mg due to increased anxiety and depersonalization. It looks like I may have been ahead of myself in writing my last post, as of tonight I've started feeling the effects of SSRI withdrawal again. I am a bit frustrated as the dosage is only 5mg. I am going to take both your advice and hold the Celexa and Clonazepam for now, and then try the ten percent decrease. I wonder if I could resort to liquifying the medication to get a more accurate dosage for such small amounts? Cheers. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Petunia Posted December 25, 2013 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 25, 2013 Celexa is available in liquid form in the US, not sure about Canada though, maybe you could check with your doctor. Or, here is some information about how to make a liquid from your tablets or capsules: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/ I'm not a doctor. My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one. My Introduction Thread Full Drug and Withdrawal History Brief Summary Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects 2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010 Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal) May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins. Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens. Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days. April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close. VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from? VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made? VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes? VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects? VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes Link to comment
Selig Posted December 25, 2013 Author Share Posted December 25, 2013 Celexa is available in liquid form in the US, not sure about Canada though, maybe you could check with your doctor. Or, here is some information about how to make a liquid from your tablets or capsules: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/ Thanks, just checked this out. I'm going to ask about liquid Celexa first for the sake of easiness but I'm also not sure if we have it. Appreciate the advice, I'll be back in a bit to update. Wish me luck! 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 Holding at 5mg a day, no side effects. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Meimeiquest Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 I think the heart palpitations are caused by autonomic dysfunction that can come from taking or stopping several kinds of drugs, including ADs, benzos, or beta-blockers. I am especially having them tapering metoprolol that I started for high blood pressure from benzo/AD changes. When my husband had them from a new BP med, dr. said not to worry unless his pulse completely lost its rhythm, then count rate for a full minute and call him to discuss. 1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms. Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12 Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13 Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15 11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble) 9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol 7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol 56 years old Link to comment
Selig Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 I think the heart palpitations are caused by autonomic dysfunction that can come from taking or stopping several kinds of drugs, including ADs, benzos, or beta-blockers. I am especially having them tapering metoprolol that I started for high blood pressure from benzo/AD changes. When my husband had them from a new BP med, dr. said not to worry unless his pulse completely lost its rhythm, then count rate for a full minute and call him to discuss. Thank for you for info 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 Good news, today I found out that my pharmacy can make me a liquid citalopram prescription, 2mg per ml. This should really make the tapering easier. I am getting brain zaps very quickly if I miss a 5mg dose (I know, I know. Bad memory) Typically it would take awhile to get those if I forgot for three days or so when I was on 20mg. Is this a good thing? I missed yesterdays 5mg and immediately had brain zaps today. I am also experiencing higher derealization and anxiety, and started crying today. Not sure if this kind of goes a long with everything. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Petunia Posted December 29, 2013 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 29, 2013 Please take your dose at the same time every day, its so important. Our nervous system thrives on stability, skipping doses can cause increased symptoms including DR and anxiety. That's great news about being able to get liquid I'm not a doctor. My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one. My Introduction Thread Full Drug and Withdrawal History Brief Summary Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects 2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010 Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal) May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins. Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens. Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days. April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close. VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from? VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made? VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes? VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects? VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes Link to comment
Selig Posted December 29, 2013 Author Share Posted December 29, 2013 Please take your dose at the same time every day, its so important. Our nervous system thrives on stability, skipping doses can cause increased symptoms including DR and anxiety. That's great news about being able to get liquid Thank you Petu- you are right. Forgetting doses is not an excuse and I should know better. I've set a reminder on my phone and asked my wife to also remind me. I am going to continue my 0.5mg for now, until I can use the liquid Celexa to taper by ten percent. it is obvious the last 5mg aren't going to be a walk in the park. Can anyone provide a reason as to why I get brain zaps after only one missed dosage? Is this just due to the decreased amount of medication in my body? 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 29, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 29, 2013 Brain zaps are a withdrawal symptom. You are now very sensitive to variations in dosage. As Petu said, you need to be very regular in your dosing. Don't put your nervous system through the stress of withdrawal symptoms. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Selig Posted December 29, 2013 Author Share Posted December 29, 2013 Brain zaps are a withdrawal symptom. You are now very sensitive to variations in dosage. As Petu said, you need to be very regular in your dosing. Don't put your nervous system through the stress of withdrawal symptoms. Thank you, my reminder went off today and I promptly took my dosage. It is bothersome (and perhaps ironic) to think the medication has affected my memory to the point where remembering the dosage is difficult. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted December 30, 2013 Author Share Posted December 30, 2013 Just updating frequently because it makes me feel better. Holding at 5mg, no more brain zaps. I find I wake up a lot during the night now. Getting my prescription for liquid citalopram on friday. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus mammaP Posted December 31, 2013 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 31, 2013 Hi Selig, post as often as you wish, this is your journal. I am glad the brain zaps have stopped, they should stay away as long as your doses are consistent **I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge. Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem) 1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat 2002 effexor. Tapered March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads. Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013 Restarted taper Nov 2013 OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015 Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014 Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg July 2017 30mg. May 15 2018 25mg Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33 Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible Link to comment
Selig Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 Thank you! Still holding at 5mg of citalopram and 0.5 daily of clonazepam. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 Holding at the same, appetite has increased, not sure if that's common. Picking up my liquid prescription soon. Memory is still horrible of course. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Rhiannon Posted January 4, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 4, 2014 Selig, I'm catching this train a little late, but just wanted to say it sounds like you've gotten excellent advice and, more important, followed it! It will take a little while to get stable and strong (both from the big reduction in clonazepam and the rapid reduction in citalopram) but once you do, I'm confident you'll be able to taper just fine. It's when people insist on rushing it and end up bouncing up and down on dosages that they just never manage to settle, and it's very difficult to taper when you're not stable. The most important tool in the toolbox of getting off psych meds is patience. I would be planning to allow at least six to eight weeks before even considering tapering further, if I were in your shoes. More if your clonazepam taper was fast and/or recent. Glad you're here! Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010. Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea. Feb 15 2010: 300 mg Neurontin 200 Lamictal 10 Celexa 0.65 Xanax and 5 mg Ambien Feb 10 2014: 62 Lamictal 1.1 Celexa 0.135 Xanax 1.8 Valium Feb 10 2015: 50 Lamictal 0.875 Celexa 0.11 Xanax 1.5 Valium Feb 15 2016: 47.5 Lamictal 0.75 Celexa 0.0875 Xanax 1.42 Valium 2/12/20 12 0.045 0.007 1 May 2021 7 0.01 0.0037 1 Feb 2022 6 0!!! 0.00167 0.98 2.5 mg Ambien Oct 2022 4.5 mg Lamictal (off Celexa, off Xanax) 0.95 Valium Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion. Link to comment
Selig Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 Selig, I'm catching this train a little late, but just wanted to say it sounds like you've gotten excellent advice and, more important, followed it! It will take a little while to get stable and strong (both from the big reduction in clonazepam and the rapid reduction in citalopram) but once you do, I'm confident you'll be able to taper just fine. It's when people insist on rushing it and end up bouncing up and down on dosages that they just never manage to settle, and it's very difficult to taper when you're not stable. The most important tool in the toolbox of getting off psych meds is patience. I would be planning to allow at least six to eight weeks before even considering tapering further, if I were in your shoes. More if your clonazepam taper was fast and/or recent. Glad you're here! Thank you! Duly noted 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 Hey guys, just wanted to update. It's been around a month since I last posted, and I am on 5mg citalopram daily after having to go back up to 10 for a couple weeks. I've noticed an increase in 'mind chatter' as I like to call it, but other than that I am doing good. My memory seems to have improved. I will be picking up a liquid solution for the citalopram when I travel to the only pharmacy in the area that can make it. 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus mammaP Posted February 10, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted February 10, 2014 Glad you are doing ok Selig, Hope you get on ok with the liquid.. Thanks for updating **I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge. Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem) 1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat 2002 effexor. Tapered March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads. Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013 Restarted taper Nov 2013 OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015 Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014 Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg July 2017 30mg. May 15 2018 25mg Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33 Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible Link to comment
Designgirl732 Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Hey Selig! Nice to 'meet' you. I"m relatively new here but in a few weeks i'm going to start a taper off of Citalopram. I've only been on it a total of 9 weeks but it was crossover of Effexor xr which i'm almost done with. 10 mg the month of january (citalopram) and 20 (february) Stating in march i'm going to attempt to wean off it completely. How long were you on celexa for? I know it's only 9 weeks for me-i'm curious what my psych will say but I'm going to be hoping I feel ok as I have 2 little ones at home and I need to be in a decent mood and have some energy! I too am waking up in the middle of the night.The heart thing you mentioned-I found out last year I have an irregular HB - it's hereditary. If your heart is feeling off in anyway I think you're making a great decision to wean off. Please keep us posted! Link to comment
Selig Posted February 12, 2014 Author Share Posted February 12, 2014 Glad you are doing ok Selig, Hope you get on ok with the liquid.. Thanks for updating Thank you! Hey Selig! Nice to 'meet' you. I"m relatively new here but in a few weeks i'm going to start a taper off of Citalopram. I've only been on it a total of 9 weeks but it was crossover of Effexor xr which i'm almost done with. 10 mg the month of january (citalopram) and 20 (february) Stating in march i'm going to attempt to wean off it completely. How long were you on celexa for? I know it's only 9 weeks for me-i'm curious what my psych will say but I'm going to be hoping I feel ok as I have 2 little ones at home and I need to be in a decent mood and have some energy! I too am waking up in the middle of the night. The heart thing you mentioned-I found out last year I have an irregular HB - it's hereditary. If your heart is feeling off in anyway I think you're making a great decision to wean off. Please keep us posted! Thank you, and I was on Celexa for 4 years I think? Perhaps a bit longer (It's affected my memory ) 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Selig Posted July 25, 2014 Author Share Posted July 25, 2014 Hi everyone, it has been a while since I've been here. Hope you are all well. I have finally successfully ceased citalopram altogether. I had been taking 2.5mg a day for awhile, and had asked my doctor for a liquid compound to titrate down more accurately. Before I could fulfill it, I forgot my dosage for two days when away from home. When I remembered, I realized I had had no 'brain zaps' or the flu feeling. So I waited another day, and another. This is day six with no brain zaps or any of the sensations I would experience after 48hrs. without this medication. I do not know why I was successful now, as coming down on 2.5mg before was unsuccessful. The advice here helped me a lot as it was a long period of time to get off this med, so thank you all for that. The only thing I am experiencing at day six is slight dizziness and less quality of sleep. I feel victorious! Has anyone experienced a resurgence of their sex drive after ceasing these meds? 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted July 25, 2014 Administrator Share Posted July 25, 2014 Good to hear, Selig. Please keep in touch and let us know how you are doing. Generally sex drive does come back. It can take a while. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Selig Posted December 23, 2014 Author Share Posted December 23, 2014 Hi all, Awhile back, I decided to stop taking citalopram and got some great advice here. I'm back because I stopped the medication a few weeks ago after tapering for 20 days or so. I have now noticed my anxiety has increased greatly, even with being on clonazepam. I also feel more depressed and dissociated ( I have depersonalization disorder ) Is it possible these effects are happening as a result of stopping the med, even though I am no longer having 'brain zaps' etc? Many thanks, Nick 0.25 Clonazepam- down from 1.5mg 2.5 mg Citalopram as of 22/13/13- down from 20mg, 10mg, 5mg. 5mg Citalopram and holding 27/12/13 Link to comment
nz11 Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Hi Nick. Would you be so kind as to tell me what date is this 22/13/13 ??? I could be missing something here but I know at the bottom of the world we date different...but this ones got me stumped. Anyways I guess the question is, when did you start taking the citalopram? How long have you been on it for? Either way my money is on the fact you tapered too fast. Make no mistake about it you are suffering classic ssri wdl. Sorry you are in a rough place at the moment. Later... i found this from your previous posts ...still dont know how long you took it for though Start at 20mg Down to 10mg for two weeks Down to 5mg for one week Started 2.5mg today Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus mammaP Posted December 23, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 23, 2014 Selig I moved your new post to your original intro thread. It is one thread per person in the intro forum and keeps your history in one place. In July you posted that you were off celexa completely, did you go back on again? You have tried to get off several times and tapered too fast, then reinstated. 20 days is far too fast and you are experiencing withdrawal symptoms. You should taper no more than 10% of the current dose every 4 weeks to avoid withdrawal. Your poor brain and nervous system are struggling to cope. How many weeks is it since you quit? **I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge. Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem) 1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat 2002 effexor. Tapered March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads. Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013 Restarted taper Nov 2013 OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015 Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014 Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg July 2017 30mg. May 15 2018 25mg Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33 Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible Link to comment
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