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Friend starting Cymbalta who has taken it what to tell her?

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btdt

I have tried to talk to her about withdrawal she would be taking it for neuro pain.  She is not too interested in the quitting it effects she is a single parent. I guess I am at a loss as I don't know much about this one.  What do you know? 

For some reason I am at a loss when it come to speaking about these drugs to anyone she has been on zoloft years ago and something else I forget what she said.  She thinks she can get off this one too whenever she likes.  I have mentioned the risk of protracted withdrawal goes up with being on and off these drugs and age related especially for women who may be menopausal.  Again this did not seem to peek her interest.  I told her too that I had been on other drugs before but Effexor kicked my ass for years now.  I am not sure what else to say she said she will start it in the morning I told her I would try to find something out some specifics of this drug tonight if I did I would send it to her. 

So what can you tell me about this one is it any better than the rest I already know the answer in my heart but she is not convinced by me so your take on this please and I will pass it on. Thanks

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UnfoldingSky

I haven't taken it, but, I know it has a short half-life which means it'll be very difficult to stop.  And like the rest of them she likely won't be able to take it forever...so...

 

 

I don't know how safe they are but there are other drugs for neuro pain. Has she tried any of them? 

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UnfoldingSky

Not sure if this would be too alarmist for her and you bdtd, but if you aren't feeling really sensitive, google Traci Johnson Cymbalta.

 

There's a big red flag with the clinical trial for this drug. 

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btdt

I haven't taken it, but, I know it has a short half-life which means it'll be very difficult to stop.  And like the rest of them she likely won't be able to take it forever...so...

 

 

I don't know how safe they are but there are other drugs for neuro pain. Has she tried any of them? 

Yes she has tried a few lyirca for one a couple of others... I find it hard to recall what she says.  I suggested a few things too vitamins that may help physio which she has just started and maybe it would work if she gave it more time.  Suggested she stop a volunteer position where she does some physical work she says she needs to go there. Will let her tell you the reasons if she chooses. For me it is hard to get all I have experienced into a nutshell I can barely get it straight in my own head it has been so all encompassing for such a long time. My first instinct was to be hysterical and I thought I had over the years gotten some things across to some people I guess she was not one of them.  She was not around when my withdrawal started I think she missed the first few years.  I will send her the Tracy Johnson story...now that you mention it I recall it was not sure which drug it was.  Thank you for the idea... she can handle it she is a nurse and I have said to her better she be addicted to pain pills but doctors don't want to give people pain pills anymore when they think they have this non addictive option. 

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btdt

I sent here this

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2005/09/drug_secrets.html

 

Drug Secrets What the FDA isn't telling.
 
 
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Traci Johnson's body was discovered on Feb. 7, 2004, hanging by a scarf from a shower rod in an Indianapolis laboratory run by the drug company Eli Lilly. The 19-year-old college student had been serving as a test subject in a clinical trial of the experimental antidepressant duloxetine. Investigators from the Food and Drug Administration rushed to Indianapolis to determine whether the experimental drug was related to her death. The probe was inconclusive.

 

This left researchers in a quandary: Was the drug safe or not? Could duloxetine trigger suicide, as some experts suggested? Or was Johnson's death an "isolated tragedy," as Eli Lilly claimed? When drug manufacturers fail to publish negative study results, as studies show is often the case, the best source of information about these questions is the FDA. The agency—which was rocked last week by the sudden resignation of Commissioner Lester Crawford—requires companies seeking approval for a drug to provide data from randomized controlled trials, studies in which some patients are given the drug and others are given a placebo. But when researchers and the press started asking about duloxetine, the FDA didn't scour its database and go public. It kept quiet.

The FDA gave a legal rationale for its silence: Some clinical trial data are considered "trade secrets," or commercially protected information, and thus are exempted from release under the Freedom of Information Act. Since the FDA doesn't routinely perform comprehensive reviews of drugs once they are on the market, when uncommon but deadly side effects tend to be picked up, independent researchers are often the only hope of catching such flaws. But the trade-secrets rule can leave researchers in the dark about the most worrisome data—negative results that support a failed application to market a drug.

The argument for secrecy is that failed efforts at drug development need protection lest entrepreneurs suffer a competitive disadvantage when other companies aren't forced to expend the same time and money exploring dead ends. And at first blush, there would appear to be little need for clinical data on a drug that isn't in use. The problem is that many drugs have multiple uses. Duloxetine, for example, is marketed under the brand name Cymbalta to treat depression. Traci Johnson committed suicide while taking duloxetine during tests for selling the drug to treat stress urinary incontinence, under the brand name Yentreve. If a drug is on the market for one use and studies about another use suggest disquieting risks—as the death of Traci Johnson may—do the benefits of keeping the study data secret outweigh the costs?

The FDA approved Cymbalta to treat depression in August 2004. By the end of that year, Cymbalta sales topped $61.3 million. At some point—the date is undisclosed—Eli Lilly began testing Yentreve. In January 2005, as Cymbalta sales climbed to $106.8 million for the first quarter, Lilly announced that it was withdrawing its application for Yentreve. Then it cited the trade-secret rule in refusing to disclose why the drug did not win approval. Perhaps the rationale was harmless—the drug didn't work for incontinence. But duloxetine has been approved as a treatment for incontinence in Europe since August 2004.

Over four months beginning in January, I filed several Freedom of Information Act requests on behalf of the Independent on Sunday, a British newspaper, for all safety data related to Cymbalta and Yentreve. I received a database that included 41 deaths and 13 suicides among patients taking Cymbalta. Missing from the database was any record of Johnson, or at least four other volunteers known to have committed suicide while taking Cymbalta for depression.

When I asked the about the missing results, FDA officials cited a federal regulationthat they said prohibited the agency from releasing study data—or acknowledging the existence of an application—for a drug that fails to win FDA approval. Since the FDA never approved Yentreve, all the data about it were off limits. The agency may have used a similar rationale in failing to release safety data about the pain reliever Bextra, which Pfizer, its manufacturer, withdrew from the market in April for fear of links to an increased rate of heart attack.

In its Web-site database, Eli Lilly initially listed no suicides and two deaths among patients enrolled in seven clinical trials of Cymbalta for depression. (Lilly's database won the company praise in a May New York Times article for being "the company that has gone furthest in disclosing results.") Today the Web site lists 10 clinical trials of Cymbalta and five of Yentreve, with one suicide and five deaths combined. Based on the dates of the trials and the circumstances of the deaths, it's clear that the Web-site numbers do not include any of the five suicides missing from the FDA database. Lilly admits that it has never made public at least two of those deaths. Lilly spokesman David Shaffer said that data was unavailable because some of the studies were still in progress. He also said that two of the suicides "took place in depression studies run by another company," and that "the decision about how and when to disclose such information rests with that company." Shaffer was referring to the Japanese firm Shionogi & Co., which has a licensing agreement with Lilly * to market duloxetine in Japan.

Meanwhile, my sources (sorry, they're gun-shy and anonymous) were telling me that duloxetine caused suicidal tendencies in patients who took the drug for incontinence—and who were not depressed. That news was potentially explosive. In the face of questions about a link between antidepressants and suicide, industry experts have long insisted that it's depression, not the drugs used to treat it, that causes patients to kill themselves. Johnson's death appeared to call that claim into question. She entered the clinical trial as a healthy, nondepressed volunteer in order to help pay her college tuition. And she was only approved for the study after undergoing thorough medical testing to screen out depression or suicidal tendencies.

Because one patient's reaction can't prove anything one way or the other, it was critical for researchers to analyze the results of all the patients in Lilly's duloxetine studies. Instead, the FDA's interpretation of the trade-secrets rule left only the positive data from the Cymbalta trials available for review.

In June, after the Independent article, the FDA (without issuing a press release) noted on its Web site that one suicide "was reported in a Cymbalta clinical pharmacology study in a healthy female volunteer." The agency added that new data from stress urinary incontinence trials showed that middle-aged women taking duloxetine had a suicide attempt rate of 400 per 100,000 person-years, more than double the rate of about 160 per 100,000 person-years among other women of a similar age. These findings had been withheld from the public, and the researchers asking for them, for five months after the FDA had reviewed data showing the increased risk.

The FDA claims it has no choice but to resist releasing information about drugs it doesn't approve. "My hands are tied," said Dr. Robert Temple, FDA's director of medical policy. "This is something only Congress can change." That may be as much a matter of the FDA's interpretation as it is of the law, however. Experts disagree about whether congressional action or a federal court ruling is needed to make data like Johnson's death available, or whether the FDA could choose to disclose more itself.

The voluntary guidelines promoted by the drug industry, however, are not a solution. These guidelines encourage companies to list every clinical trial they initiate. Registration would be helpful. But it would not compel companies to release the data from, or even the outcomes of, their trials, as long as they companies can argue that this information is "commercially protected."

The use of trade-secret laws to conceal deaths and serious side effects linked to drugs has the obvious flaw of putting profits before public health. It also subverts the covenant between researchers and study volunteers. Subjects like Traci Johnson are told that even if they do not personally benefit from a new drug, the scientific knowledge gained from the study in which they've participated will benefit others. The volunteers should be told instead that scientists will learn about their experience only if it's good news for the drug they're helping to test.

Correction, Nov. 2, 2005: The sentence originally stated that Shionogi & Co. partners with Lilly to market duloxetine. The companies have a licensing agreement rather than a partnership. ( Return to corrected sentence.)

 

and this 

 

Ben Goldacre: What doctors don't know about the drugs they prescribe

 

I am hoping she did not start it tonight as she said she would start it in the morning. 

 

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UnfoldingSky

Yes she has tried a few lyirca for one a couple of others... I find it hard to recall what she says.  I suggested a few things too vitamins that may help physio which she has just started and maybe it would work if she gave it more time.  Suggested she stop a volunteer position where she does some physical work she says she needs to go there. Will let her tell you the reasons if she chooses. For me it is hard to get all I have experienced into a nutshell I can barely get it straight in my own head it has been so all encompassing for such a long time. My first instinct was to be hysterical and I thought I had over the years gotten some things across to some people I guess she was not one of them.  She was not around when my withdrawal started I think she missed the first few years.  I will send her the Tracy Johnson story...now that you mention it I recall it was not sure which drug it was.  Thank you for the idea... she can handle it she is a nurse and I have said to her better she be addicted to pain pills but doctors don't want to give people pain pills anymore when they think they have this non addictive option. 

 

 

I wonder if maybe you could convince her to wait at least until physio is up?  I know it can be quite effective for other things, I'd think there would be a chance it resolves her issue.  I am not sure the pain meds would be a better route, if she could get a steady supply (hard to do here now, after they started on about oxycontin abuse) as the heavy ones at least cause withdrawal. 

 

I hear you too about wanting to get hysterical, I've done that as well, though it didn't usually lead anywhere that was productive.  It's such a hard thing to handle, like having to coax someone away from a train about to run them over that they can't see--but without screaming at them or making any fuss.  At least though she's lucky to have you as a friend in case things do not work out well. 

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UnfoldingSky

bdtd, re your other post, very frightening.  I didn't know there were other deaths. 

 

I'm not sure why anyone would want to take a drug that had even one death involved in its trial.

 

I think I read somewhere that the people who tried to revive Traci Johnson at the hospital they took her to came out adamantly opposed to the prescribing of antidepressants.  The doctors I mean.  That says quite a lot to me.

 

I hope your friend does come around. 

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mammaP

I wish I had the answer to this one! My daughter started citalopram because she had

taken it before and said it had helped. Nothing I could say would convince her otherwise.

It changed her but she couldn't see it. She became suspicious and negative, always

believing the worst and thinking everyone was against her, myself included. Then decided

she was better and came off cold turkey, spurred on because I was tapering my AD. 

Withdrawal was hell for her and she was on the edge the whole time. She reinstated and

believed it was because she needed the drug. 

 

We've all been lied to, and people always believe the doctors, and their *never believe what

you read on the internet' mentality.*  Sadly there are times you just have to present the facts

as you know them, then sit back and wait for the fallout with broad shoulders to support them.  :(

 

I did manage to get my daughter to promise me that next time she feels ready to come off she

will do it very slowly. 

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btdt

bdtd, re your other post, very frightening.  I didn't know there were other deaths. 

 

I'm not sure why anyone would want to take a drug that had even one death involved in its trial.

 

I think I read somewhere that the people who tried to revive Traci Johnson at the hospital they took her to came out adamantly opposed to the prescribing of antidepressants.  The doctors I mean.  That says quite a lot to me.

 

I hope your friend does come around. 

I had read about this long ago but had forgot which drug it was till was mentioned I did not know about the other deaths but I am not surprised as I have read a lot about prozac and how those studies were all twisted to show results they were wanting to promote.  There was a court case that brought the information to light.  It is ancient history now but a lot of people don't seem to know a thing about it for some reason it never made many headlines and nobody talks about it. If you think about the number of people damaged and killed it is astounding this topic manages to be kept quiet.  

In the last bit of time I watched a documentary on AIDs and how the activists took on the FDA and the gov't.... it was crazy to see all those years of fighting and video of people with the illness as it slowly took their lives... all in a snapshot in this documentary.  The infighting within the activists camp... and one guy saying this is a plague people are dying we can't keep fighting ourselves... it was all very sad to watch.  I could feel their frustration as people aged became more ill died... and no help came.  

At one point they went to the white house and threw the ashes of the some of the people they loved who had died on the whitehouse lawn... is that what it takes?

 

They were organized well organized and educated.. and they could think their brains were not tampered with by drugs not all of them... 

What is it Grace Jackson calls it the perfect crime cause people are made to ill to fight back.. or too inept in their thinking... ect... sad as hell all of this.

 

It reminds me of this.. nobody listening nobody helping. Just sweep it under the rug. 

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btdt

bdtd, re your other post, very frightening.  I didn't know there were other deaths. 

 

I'm not sure why anyone would want to take a drug that had even one death involved in its trial.

 

I think I read somewhere that the people who tried to revive Traci Johnson at the hospital they took her to came out adamantly opposed to the prescribing of antidepressants.  The doctors I mean.  That says quite a lot to me.

 

I hope your friend does come around. 

As I have kept this a lot to myself and not shared near as much as I could have in part cause it makes my entire life about withdrawal and it has taken enough of me.  and in part cause she was away for few years when I was messed up and did not see it ... I don't want to be hysterical and there are so many other people in my family taking all types of drugs including these ones that are already trapped another one is another one.. she has a right to make her own choices but I know and you know this is not informed consent as she has not clue what type of withdrawal and side effects she is signing up for... I am trying to get that point across at least tho I think I am not doing much of a job at it.  Pain pills are addictive but I think the withdrawal is not as bad but I could be wrong on this there are other pain pills she could try and not go for the top shelf heavy duty drugs... but none were offered to her this was the drug offered to her.  NSAID were not offered to her Lyrica was what it is with the push on this drug... must be a money maker for somebody... a few others were offered but nothing I would call real pain pills... 

Whatever no accounting for how a doctor runs their office.  Her doctor is leaving so whatever **** she addicts her to she will not be around to see the fallout... you know who will be her kid that is who... nobody is saying I will be around to watch it either she is hit and miss with me... it is her kid that will take the fallout the second victim. Really tho that is how it goes this is the new way we live our lives it sure leaves a lot of to be desired.  Sure is not what any of us suspected we were signing up for.  I can't only tell her she can do as she pleases.  This is not new to me there are all sorts of people around me popping pills left and right I do live in North America pill popper capital of the world... bit sales all around me. There is not a house hold I can think of that does  not have an addict in it.  It is very common place this is just one more... feeling like it is time to move to an island and let the pill people have this bit of land cause by the time they all figure this out I will be dead  of old age should I live that long... and I don't want to live my life watching it go down. 

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UnfoldingSky

I hear you about that island, bdtd, I'd be there in a second if it existed.  I know way too many people who either are on drugs or were on them and have been harmed by them.  And every time I turn around I find someone else...You have to wonder how this society is going to function in the future with so many people drugged. 

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btdt

What is frightening is the children what is to become of them drugged from 8 till death?  It seem 8 is the age many kids I know begin getting drugs.  That is grade 3 what can you possibly tell of a person by grade 3?  

I went threw my entire school age years without ever hearing of a child drugged there may have been one who needed something not saying a drug was the answer but he did take all his clothes off jump out the window on a sunny day and head for the creek...lol he had some issues.  Now that I think about it maybe it was the rest of us that had issues it was a very hot day :) 

Drugging a child use to be unheard of extremely rare not like now. 

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btdt

Have not heard if she started the drug or not think she is sick of hearing me talk about it... her son was one of the kids drugged he is off now but not the same as he use to be.  I think about how long this is going on for me and wonder if it is still affected him?  If it is, in what way it is?  Guess if so many adults can't figure it out how would a kid ever have a clue.  Time will tell I guess. 

I have read that some kids who were on ritalin turn to drugs illegal ones to cope when they are older... for some reason they take them off drugs when they reach a certain age puberty... and they go AWAL

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UnfoldingSky

What is frightening is the children what is to become of them drugged from 8 till death?  It seem 8 is the age many kids I know begin getting drugs.  That is grade 3 what can you possibly tell of a person by grade 3?  

I went threw my entire school age years without ever hearing of a child drugged there may have been one who needed something not saying a drug was the answer but he did take all his clothes off jump out the window on a sunny day and head for the creek...lol he had some issues.  Now that I think about it maybe it was the rest of us that had issues it was a very hot day :)

Drugging a child use to be unheard of extremely rare not like now. 

 

I know, I only knew one person who was drugged as a kid.  Now from the sounds of things you would be hard pressed to find one who isn't being drugged. 

 

Lol, I had to laugh about that kid, he probably had the right idea...Not to get way off topic but if I had to go back to grade school I think I'd be jumping out the window at every possible opportunity as well.   Though I'll keep my clothes, thank you very much... :P

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UnfoldingSky

Have not heard if she started the drug or not think she is sick of hearing me talk about it... her son was one of the kids drugged he is off now but not the same as he use to be.  I think about how long this is going on for me and wonder if it is still affected him?  If it is, in what way it is?  Guess if so many adults can't figure it out how would a kid ever have a clue.  Time will tell I guess. 

I have read that some kids who were on ritalin turn to drugs illegal ones to cope when they are older... for some reason they take them off drugs when they reach a certain age puberty... and they go AWAL

 

I have heard the same thing about Ritalin and the other ADHD drugs.  I suppose some of those kids will figure out eventually what has happened to them.  I've met a few who seemed to know that drugs had harmed them.  Very sad. 

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Bamadanes

I was put on Cymbalta in 2007. I was prescribed it due to its pain relieving assistance and was prescribed it in addition to Tramadol. I do not like to take narcotics unless the pain is unbearable and my MD thought these two combined would help me tremendously with narcotic pain meds to take occasionally. I was also going through a separation and divorce so the cymbalta would help two fold. A couple of years ago my pharmacist mentioned that Tramadol and Cymbalta should not be taken together but I thought "my MD knows what he is doing" so I continued on. Over these 7 years I have become almost a hermit. I used to be very active, worked full time, had 3 children, and managed my life just fine. I did go through a bout of depression when go through ending my marriage, however, I think that is perfectly normal and expected. I was thankful at the time to have the cymbalta as a bandaide but had NO clue that I would still be on it 7 years later because the withdrawals are do evil. When I have talked to my doctor regarding discontinuing he recommends (regardless of my feelings) that I remain on it for my pain. I disagree. Along with the fact that I have no energy to do anything at all (even work), I have gained 50 pounds and haven't changed my eating habits at all. It must be that I do nothing. My house stays a wreck, I sleep when I can, which is rarely at night, due to restless legs, racing thoughts, headaches, anxiety, getting up several times to go to the bathroom, etc., so I sleep during the days for exhaustion. My family doesn't understand what is wrong with me and I didn't either until now. Then I started really attempting to stop taking cymbalta. This is worse than taking it. I still have all of the side effects but now the withdrawal symptoms too. The brain zaps & feelings them in my head, out my tongue, and my fingertips, several times a minute, even less sleep, worse restless legs, very vivid bad dreams, blood pressure being high then too low, blood sugar staying above normal, nausea, abdominal pain, angry outbursts, crying, then feeling ok but still no desire to do anything AT ALL. I can't stress enough the importance of support from friends and family during this. I do not have that at all from my family, however, my friends are great. My family thinks I should just "get over it" they don't realize it's out of my control. I never had depression problems until I started cymbalta. Now I don't know how I can actually get all the way off of it but I am going to do it one way or another. I can't say I would recommend cymbalta to anybody....EVER.....for any reason....although this is my personal experience I think it it's pretty typical of cymbalta and I do also realize there are people who love it (although the majority of them probably haven't realized the side effects and definitely probably haven't tried to discontinue use).

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btdt

eIt sound like Effexor to me.  People always talk about how good 

effexor is in the beginning called the honeymoon period by some 

including me but it does not last then the bad part kicks in... 

from super human powers to go and work to can't get up eat or sleep.. 

I would never recommend Effexor either after what I have been thru 

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Altostrata

Bamadanes, please start a topic for yourself in the Introductions forum if you'd like help tapering Cymbalta.

 

It sounds like Cymbalta is too activating for you and has been for a long time.

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Designgirl732

This saddens me as I have a friend who said 'well i just never plan on coming off of it' - she's 37 years old..i can't see how this will be effective for her for her whole life..

Should I send her links or am I being too imposing? it's hard to tell with this what crosses the line. She says 'trust the process..drugs and therapy are the best combo' blah blah...she also takes a blood pressure med 'just in case cymbalta gives her high BP' - oy!

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btdt

This saddens me as I have a friend who said 'well i just never plan on coming off of it' - she's 37 years old..i can't see how this will be effective for her for her whole life..

 

Should I send her links or am I being too imposing? it's hard to tell with this what crosses the line. She says 'trust the process..drugs and therapy are the best combo' blah blah...she also takes a blood pressure med 'just in case cymbalta gives her high BP' - oy!

She takes a pill she does not need because to treat a side effect she may not get?

That is a strange level of pharm science a patient who does this is a pharma dream come true question I have is where does she get this bp med if she does not have high bp.. what is wrong with this picture.... 

 

Sometimes you have to do what you think it right and then let it be unless asked. I send information all the time and I know when it hits the fan they will come and ask if they are able... or can recall what I have said if their brains are not mush and they forget.  We are all different you have to follow your own heart... I tell but that is me.  I wish somebody had told me what I was getting into but if anybody knew I did not know them... except maybe my doctor but I truly think some of the doctors I have had did not know. 

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mammaP

A friend came to visit me last week, she has been on many drugs over the years and ct'd effexor last year.

She has now been diagnosed with fibro and is on............oxycontin, tramadol and citalopam plus others for

different things  :o

 

I suggested last year that she was suffering withdrawal from effexor but she believed the fibro diagnosis instead

and started all those dugs. She is now in a state but still thinks the doctors are right. There isn't much we can do

but it is so frustrating! 

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compsports

I have mentioned this before but it bears repeating.   Several years ago, my mother begged me to get off of the drugs as she felt they were causing me big time harm.   I thought she was clueless about mental health issues which greatly pains me as I write this.

 

It wasn't until I was diagnosed with a mysterious hearing loss that I realized that the drugs could be poisoning me.   Still, I was so spellbound that it wasn't until resigned from a job a year later that I took the plunge to get off of the meds.

 

My point is until the person realizes him or herself that the med is bad news, there is really nothing you can do about it even though I agree it is very frustrating.

 

CS

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btdt

I completely agree they will never know till after they have their feet to the flames this is so unfortunate but mostly true.  I have not heard much from my friend so don't know if she has taken the plunge.  She said she has been on antidepressants before and got off without much trouble... however I bet I could point out some things she likely would not have done over the years if she had no been drugged.  Whatever I can't save anybody I don't have the spellbinding power of these drugs. I tried to point out to her some facts... how she seen me in the past to how she sees my now.. how my life has taken a plunge... 

 

I mention withdrawal in passing over the years but I think most people do not relate my demise to the drugs as I have not talked much about it as I see their eyes glaze over in boredom and disbelief.  I have enough problems trying to maintain some sort of dignity even with close friends as I appear to be a drain on all around me being a burden the past 6-7 years I get kinda well for awhile only to fall back .. they trust me for a bit then they don't - with good reason.  I tend to fall off the dock and drown like mr magoo ... when I am underwater I damage myself and those around me.  I know supplements or pills  can set me swimming again.  I try to stay away from both. 

 

I don't know if I convinced her or not she may be on it now and not telling me truth is I no longer want to know.  I can't say why even... it is just too much for me to deal with. 

 

I hope she didn't but if she did I can't help it.

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btdt

She has started Cymbalta she can never say i did not warn her.  That is about all I have to say about it. 

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Designgirl732

I agree with both of you-it's a fine line. Some people feel like 'do what you want but don't try and impose YOUR beliefs on ME' - but then I also feel like I'm coming from a point of caring.

 

The BP meds conversation started when I started effexor xr and my BP skyrocketed and I said 'since you're on cymbalta and it's an SNRI it may have the same effect on you' and that's when she said 'i'm on BP meds in case I do get a high BP from it' - 

 

I'm off of Effexor now-my BP dropped 10 points (it's still high-but it dropped significantly).

 

Hypertension runs in my family, but i'm going to try weight loss and exercise first before I need a BP med.

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Altostrata

btdt, may I move this topic to the Family and Friends forum so it can get wider readership?

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btdt

Sure move it.  

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btdt

I looked over this thread at all the really good information that was not available when I was put on these drugs.  I look and read it and watch the video and I can't for the life of me figure out what more I could have sent her what I could have said that would have made her think twice and maybe not take it. 

 

It drives me crazy.  Have I done something to make her not trust my opinion?  The answer to that is sure I have look at my life on drugs... who would believe me. It seems I will continue to pay the price for drug use for the rest of my life dragging it behind me like a dead and rotting body.  At the end of the day she did not just not believe me and my experience... she did not believe any of the sources I sent either.  I do not get why people have such faith in this system that hurts us so badly.  How on earth does one combat that sense of faith people have in the medical community in pharmaceuticals? 

 

I guess one day the number of us and them will shift and there will be more of us then there are of them... those who have not been injured by drugs... we will eventually out number them... we may actually out number them now but those injured are not aware they are injured or that their injuries came from drugs.  

 

Maybe whoever owns the air ways owns the mind of people as a type of brain washing... who has not heard the commercial depression hurts... all the night laying awake with withdrawal pain has taught me.. withdrawal hurts.  Had I thought it was depression that hurt I would be taking my drug and more drugs to treat it and that is where many people are. How do you get this information in the main stream? 

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btdt

I know I posted this video already but I am putting it here because it belongs I sent this to her today...

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Designgirl732

How is she responding to you when you send her info/give her advice?

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btdt

She said she has to do something as the pain is so bad she could not work if she did find a job... and no comment on the video.  They do not tell her what the cause of her pain is one doctor told her fibro but a visit to a pain specialist said it was not that and not nerve pain so I don't know.  I wonder if it has something to do with other medications they have been giving her over the last year hard to say I know she has been taking things just don't know what nothing has helped her so far.  She has not said if this drug has had any effect or not.  I think at this point she is no longer talking to me about it.  That is my guess and what I see. 

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mrtoadota

I was put on cymbalta by my shrink about 6 months ago. I started taking it slowly. It made me out of it and sleepy at first, and then again every month that I increased the dose. When I finally got up to the full dosage recommended for depression, I was feeling out of it and sleepy for a long while, and then, between 30 and 40 days on this dose, the clouds finally cleared and I felt like I did before depression became a part of my life (after my wife of 28 years died). The only side effect that gets in my way is a drastically lowered sex drive. I mean I have no interest in sex or masturbation. I feel great, but sex is no longer a part of my life. It feels OK, since I am 69 and not currently dating. However, if I were 20 years younger and married, it would be a serious dilemma, I am sure.

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btdt

Six to nine months is the amount of time the American Psychiatric Associations suggest taking these drugs.  I don't know if they have any idea people take them for years and years.  If you add a slow taper to the time I doubt anyone would be on them that long if they had withdrawal as a slow taper would take longer than the suggested time to be on them.  When I read the statement by the APA it did not give any reasons to be on this length of time.  Of course they also said nothing about taper or withdrawal either. 

 

I had a visit with my friend her pupils are large and she may have employment opportunities starting soon... seems a few different jobs came at once and she is taking them all so it seems. It was a short visit I don't see much of her lately.

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livrwort

I can tell you that if I had known what I would have to go through to quit Cymbalta -- I never would have started it, regardless of the anti-depressant "benefits." I thought I had found the perfect anti-depressant after struggling for years with depression and the side effects of other medications. I have taken it for about 4 years. Last year, I decided for a lot of reasons that I needed to quit it. This was a year ago - I should have read up on quitting, but I was too dumb, so I started tapering down, from 7 days to 6 to 5 to 4, etc., giving myself a month or two between steps. When I stopped taking it entirely a couple of months ago, I wasn't prepared for the terrible depression that came down on me like a black hammer and pounded me into the ground. I thought since I had gotten down to one pill a week that I would be ok, but not so. 

 

Realistically, it has been a hard year to stop taking it, and that is what prompted me to comment here - I am almost 54 and the youngest of our 5 children just left home in Sept. So, that has been emotional - very difficult, though I know it is a good thing. I started the whole menopause journey in November, and that adds another mystifying layer of hormonal and emotional changes that I don't pretend to understand. My 3 close friends moved away this past year, and that has been rough. I had a close relationship with my mother, but she has distanced herself after I donated a kidney to a friend, also in November. So - maybe I have been a fool to try to quit now - but I have come this far and feel like I just can't let it beat me. I am lucky because my husband and children are very supportive, but they don't understand why this is taking so long, and all I can do is hope for their continued patience.

 

Your friend should consider that this drug can be so very hard to quit. The psychiatrist who prescribed it to me really helped me when i needed her, but she seems to view this as something a person should stay on for life. She says there are no real protocols for quitting. When i found this forum, I saw the information about tapering by counting the beads in the capsules. I had never thought of that. Going back on 5 mg (24 beads) helped me to feel a little better at first, but I am back in it this week, struggling with terrible guilt and fear and sadness over things long in the past. I try to remind myself that these emotions are not "real" but they feel so real. They feel so terrible, and sometimes I have to work hard to convince myself that life is worth living. I am waiting desperately for the next "window" of hope to come along. The one positive is that I have always had an amazing memory - until the past couple of years (one of the reasons I wanted to quit Cymbalta) - and it is back, which is a huge relief.

 

I hope you can convince your friend to give it some very serious thought - I am looking at a long time tapering down from even this small dosage, and if she is older, like me, she may have more trouble quitting too. It seems so innocuous when you first start taking it, because Cymbalta, at least for me, had almost no side effects, but trying to quit is so so so hard. I am trying all of the suggestions I can find, and still struggling. I hope your friend does not put herself in my shoes.

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btdt

No I can't she is taking it and not hearing me at all this is all said and done.  

I did what I could to warn her she chose not to hear me. This is her life and her choice. 

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