Winner: 15 years and no idea!

[Winner]

Hello,

 

I want to start by saying damn this is not easy.

 

I was out on Aropax - Paxil in 1994 due to severe anxiety that unchecked turned into Major Depression. Dosage was mostly 20mg but at times 40mg.  I had my two beautiful children whilst taking this drug. Our first born boy was still born which is how I ended up with the major depression.

 

In 2013 I started doing so very out of characture things like drink more and becoming almost rebelious.  How rediculos is that at 42 years of age.  I have two wonderful children 12 and 14 and a very understanding and supportive husband, who I could not do withut at this time.

 

The Doctor said he thought the drug was pooping out and that we would have to think about what to do.  We were heading overseas so I decided to do nothing.  Early 2014 we decided to swap from Aropax to Cymbalta.  I had not ever contemplated coming off an AD because I never watend to go back to that awful depression.  I tapered, in hidsight, too fast.  20 mg to 10mg for 2 weeks, 10mg to 5 mg two weeks.  About to go to 2.5mg and was hospitalized for plastic surgery on my finger after finding out the cheese knife is very very sharp and that they should go point down in a dishwasher.  While in hospital I thought I would just stop the Aropax.

 

Yeah, right, good call.  NOT.  4 dyas with nothing and I was beside myself.  Crying, pacing felt to be ging insane.  Called my Doc who said no way should I have jumped from 5mg and to go back to 5mg and go see him.  Within hours I was much better but still hated where I was. 

 

The Doctor said that what happened was not me it was withdrawal, and to take the 5mg for a few days then drop to 2.5 for a couple of days then to 1.25 for a couple of days.  Nothing for 4 days then start Lovan.  During this time I started searching the internet.  Found several sites and became very very scared.  I was convinced that I was damaged for life.  Nothing about switching drugs was very positive and I felt I had no one on side.  This lead me to disregard the Doctors advice and I decided to drop to 2.5mg Aropax and bring in the 2.5mg Lovan.  I did this for 3 days then dropped the Aropax and upped the Lovan.  That was 3 weeks ago.

 

Today I have been off Aropax for 14 days and on Lovan for 17 days.  I am up to 20mg Lovan.

 

The switch was much easier than the C/t.  I was lucky that it seems to be working.  It is only now I am considering coming off the AD's altogether which is scary in its self.  I made the suggestion to the Doctor to go on a Prozac based med as it seems to be the lesser of all the evils.

 

I have had withdrawals from the Paxil and start up side effects from the Prozac, no idea which was which really but in all I seem to have done this relatively well.

 

No I need to decide what to do from here.  Do I stay on the Lovan and let some time pass or do I taper now and get this over with?  So confused.

 

[Petunia]

Welcome Winner,

Thank you for sharing your story, I know that none of this is easy, but you are among friends here, we are a supportive site and most of us have had struggles, in life and certainly drug related.

 

Now that you have crossed over to Lovan (Prozac), how are you feeling?  Do you have any symptoms?

 

I would suggest you wait at least a month, if not longer, before considering beginning a taper.  You want to make sure that you are stable and symptom free.  When you are feeling well and certain that your nervous system has adjusted to the change, then you could begin a very careful 10% per month taper.

 

Here is some information for tapering from Prozac:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/759-tips-for-tapering-off-prozac-fluoxetine/

 

At the beginning of the thread, there is a link to information about bridging to Prozac, which you may be interested in reading

 

Thank you for putting your information in your signature, that makes it easier.

 

Petu.

[Winner]

Thanks Petu,

 

Current symptoms are head pressure with headaches in the afternoon. Tension in the jaw and neck. The jaw and neck thing I think I am doing to myself because I am waiting for that horrible horrible crash that I had when I stopped Aropax. I think I am starting to relax a bit as it does not seem to be happening.

 

The headaches are getting better each day. I am having a bit if trouble believing that I am not worse.

 

I was thinking I would wait a couple of months before I tapered for the same reason you mentioned, giving my nervous system a bit of a rest. However I do not want to be on this longer than I need. Part of me is saying to stay on Lovan for 6 to 12 months to make sure I am over the Paxil w/d. Protracted paxil w/d and Lovan w/d would be awful. I am a bit lost in these thoughts and not sure what to do.

 

The info in this site is amazing and I am trying to take it all in. Thanks again for your reply, I am very glad to have made contact.

[Jemima]

Staying on Lovan for six to twelve months is not a bad idea.  Paxil is a very difficult drug to get over and you may still be having some withdrawal effects from that.  The important thing is to listen to your body and begin a taper when you feel the time is right. You needn't decide in advance how long you're going to stay on Lovan, either.  Just take note of how you're feeling and go ahead when you're ready. (But as Petu said, do wait at least a month.)

 

Please do taper at 10% or less of the current dose, as we recommend.  You came off of Paxil way too fast, but this too-quick taper is what most doctors recommend, having been misled by the drug companies.  Please read this:  Why Taper By 10% of My Dosage

 

Welcome to the forum, Winner. You'll find lots of solid information and friendly support here.

[mammaP]

Hi Winner, welcome to SA.  Hopefully the switch will be ok for you and you will settle on the prozac.

Everyone is affected differently and you may be fine,  it seems things are getting better for you already. 

I can't really add anything to the excellent advice you have from Petu and Jemima. I agree that listening

to your  body is by far the best way forward now, throw out the plans and just hold things until you have

been stable for a while before starting a slow taper. 

 

You have come to the best place in the world for peer support with tapering and being free of anti

depressants.  

[Winner]

Thank you very much for your kind and informative replies.

 

I am a very positive person by nature and I am sure this is helping me as I am ging to beat this horrid AD experience and go on and be a better happier and healthier me.

 

I am going to listen to my body and do as you say.  I am still very scared of being hit by the Paxil w/d months down the track.  Thus being why I keep telling myself to stay n Lovan longer.  Paxil was in my system for 15 years and I feel that so far I have not seen what it is going to do to me.   I am lucky My Doc does listen to me and he is very aware of the AD issues.  He does not prescribe Effexor or Aropax at all any more and I am his second last patient to come off Aropax.  His other Patient is apparently doing really badly.

 

One question I do have is.  If I feel that I am travellinbg along OK now, do you think it means I may (god please let it be) that I may be one of the better candidates for withdrawal?  It is a very selfish question but I am really thinking the reply will be that "No way just wait, it is coming". 

 

Thanks again for your replies, this site just feels right...... Congratulations on all the wonderful information gatheres and thank you so much for sharing.  Angels do exist....

[Altostrata]

If the switch to fluoxetine works, that's a good sign. It's easier to discontinue than paroxetine.

 

Does your doctor know how to taper? Would you recommend him for this? If so, please add his contact information to http://tinyurl.com/7cp8l8v or send me a message and I will add it.

[Winner]

Hi Alto thanks for your insight.   I have read that fluoxetine is eaasier to discontinue than paroxetine.  However I am scared that the paroxetine w/d will still be around when I taper from fluoxetine.  That is why I am thinking of staying on Fluotexine to see how I go.  I have read that paroxetine w/d can come out 12 months or so down the track.  Scary stuff.

 

My Doctor is probably not a wonderful advocate for tapering but he is happy to do it how I want to.  He is not pushing me to do it quickly and not telling me that I need the meds.  He has acknowledged that both Effexor and Aropax are the worst to come off and that he does not prescribe them anymore.  He tapered me quickly but we were ging to another drug due to massive poop out and then c/t. I have absolutly no idea AD's were even hard to get off.  I knew you could not just stop them but did not really know why.  My Doctor wanted to put me on Cymbalta but from what I have read I am glad I asked for Lovan and that he listened.

[Petunia]

 However I am scared that the paroxetine w/d will still be around when I taper from fluoxetine.  That is why I am thinking of staying on Fluotexine to see how I go.  I have read that paroxetine w/d can come out 12 months or so down the track.

 

I'm not certain, but I think what that refers to is someone who stops suddenly, or does a too fast taper, feels ok for a while and then the withdrawal starts a few months later.

 

If the Prozac bridge is successful, it will be protecting you from Paxil withdrawal because its sort of taken the place of Paxil and is supporting your nervous system.  Of course its always good to hold for a long while to make sure you are stable before beginning a taper, but I think you will know within a few months if the switch has worked.  Once you are stable on the Prozac, I don't think you need to worry about suddenly getting withdrawal symptoms from Paxil.

[Winner]

Petu your words are very comforting. Now I just have to sit and wait to see if this bridge works. I need to mention again the great support and knowledge this site has. I have been reading everything.

 

You are all wonderful people and we will all have a special link in life...what a bad way to meet beautiful people!

[mammaP]

Hi Winner, I have a feeling you are going to be just fine. I hope the prozac bridge 

is good for you, let us know when you are ready to start tapering it but don't try 

tapering too soon. Leave at least a month for your CNS to get used to the change. 

 

You are right, this is an amazing place for support! 

[Winner]

Just a quick update.

 

Still feeling good.  Really hoping this bridge is successful.  I certainly have no reason to complain as yet.  Thankfully all still smooth sailing.

 

I had probably my worst nights sleep last night but it still was not too bad.  I am the sort of person that relies on sleep.  I am not good to be aroud when I do not sleep at least 7 hours a night so I am pleased that this has not been  an issue for me (so far).

 

I was wondering abnout suppliments.  I have had a read and think I will start on Omega 3 and Magnesium. 

 

Your opinions are much sought after here.  Should I start them now or wait until I am 100% sure I am over the side effects of starting up Lovan?  Magnesium Citrate seems to be the one I feel would be best for me, as I understand Oxide is not very absorbent.  How do I tell if in fact I need Magnesium?   Wow this is all very new and a bit confusing to me.

 

I will check back in later in the week.  I actually see my GP in 2 days so that will be good too.   Still very proud to have not used Clonazepam or Serequel. 

 

Yay, I am winning.  (Touch wood)

[Rhiannon]

Sounds to me like you're going to do just fine. You're being cautious and patient, and that as it turns out is the most important key to a good, safe taper.

 

I think it would be fine to start at a low dose of magnesium and fish oil now. Just start one or the other first and start at a low amount, then if you do okay you can increase to where you want to be, then start the other one and do it the same way.

 

It's encouraging that you're doing well with the Prozac bridge. I think you're going to be a success story!

[Winner]

Hi Rhi, thanks so much for your comments.

 

I am being cautious because I never want to be where I was when I stopped the Paxil cold turkey and patient because iI have been on these thing 15 years so another 12 months or so is going to be OK.

 

Thanks for your advice on the suppliments I have started the Omega 3.  No effects at all in the two days I have had them but will up them to another caspule tomorrow and then in around a week I will start the Megnesium and slowely introduce that.

 

I have been back to the Doctor and he is sending me to a 10 week CBT course and in about 6 to 12 months he wants me to start tapering the Lovan very slowly every 2 months.

 

I also feel that I am going to be a success story as I feel so good at the moment and I am very focussed on being positive and my goal is to be drug free and I AM going to get there after what will be 16 years. 

 

I personaly have found the physical symptoms very easy to deal with as I have just used by support people to bounce off how I am feeling and they kept reminding me that it was the c/t and not really how I will be forever.  That was great to have such positive reinforcement constantly.  However the psycological symptoms were truly awful.  I was very lucky that I had minimal of these also but when I needed to cry or rant or feel sorry for myself my support pit crew would let me.  They kept telling me Iif I felt like crying to cry.  If I was angy to punch a cushion if I was anxious we woud talk about what triggered it and talk about calming it down.

 

My support pit crew (Mum and Hubby and 2 teenage kids) have held me through this and have kept me going.  I owe then sooooo much gratitude.  Also this site has been such a wonderful help also as I would never would have had the idea to bridge and wold not have gone onto fluoxetine (was going to go to Cymbalta) if I had not read all the wonderful  information on this site.

 

I will keep coming in and letting those interested know how I am going but for now I am sailing along really really well.

Thanks to everyone.  Even if I have not personally commented with you but I have certainly read everyones Jurnals and tip and ideas.   xxxxxxxx

[mammaP]

Thank you for popping by to let us know how you are doing Winner. I am so pleased that

you are doing well, it seems the bridge is going great. 

[Addax]

Very glad you're doing so well, Winner! It sounds like your family makes an awesome support pit crew and your doctor is a good one. That's wonderful!

I'll be looking for your updates

[Rhiannon]

Yes, I really envy you your pit crew! I don't have anything like that. All the more reason to expect success for you.

[Winner]

Wow, still going along very very well.  I can honeslty say better than I was on the Aropax for the last 4 years and still getting better each day. 

 

I cannot believe that I have gone through this so easily.  15 years is a long time to be on Aropax to come off with as little crash that I had.

 

I am still waiting for something to happen but I think as each days passess I am getting a bit more confident that I may just be one of the lucky ones.  I certainly do hope so.  Keeping in mind of course I still have Lovan to start reducing in a couple of months.

[Altostrata]

Good to hear! If you feel you can recommend your doctor for tapering, please add to this topic http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/988-recommended-doctors-therapists-or-clinics/

[Winner]

Hello All,

 

I am back.  I am travelling along brilliantly.  My only complaint at the moment is that I am not sleeping 100% but I can deal with that.  I am only having the odd bad night here and there.

 

I am so glad I did the bridge to Prozac.  I am so thankful that it worked.

 

I have energy to burn and am spending heaps of time riding bikes and walking with my kids and I am also running about 5km 3 times a week with the dog.

 

I have no symptoms that are hanging around from the Paxil and the start up symptoms of the Lovan (Prozac) seems to have disappeared too.  The only little tiny thing I get is a slight twitch in my right eye.  Compared to the emotial and physical suppression that came with Paxil, this eye twitch is something I can live with.

 

I am not in such a hurry to jump of the Lovan now.  I think my experience coming down and then crashing off the paxil was so bad that I wanted all these drugs out of my system ASAP.  I can now see that my body is recovering from the crash and is healing.  I will still certainly be attempting to live drug free but not till middle of next year.

 

I am really enjoying having feelings again, even feelings of sadness when warranted. 

 

Gosh I have got to thank the people who have supported me and given me advice.  You guys rock.

 

I came onto this site terrified of not being able to get answers about how long all this would take and even if it would work, but yet i was also very determined that this was NOT going to beat me.  Yay I won.

 

I will return again and update you all on my story as I am hoping it will give someone some sort of help and comfort knowing it is possible and that you do survive.

[Altostrata]

Very good to hear, Winner.

 

The Prozac might be a mite too high for you, causing the twitch. You might wish to try 18mg to see if that helps.

 

Please update your signature with the dates you went off Paxil and started on Lovan.

[Winner]

Here is my update.

 

As you can see I was one of the people who decided to bridge from Paxil to Lovan over a few days.  I was very lucky that it worked for me.

 

When I began this bridge I was thinking that swapping for on AD to another is OK but I really want to come off them totally.  I still do, but I just want to let you know that the difference in the 2 AD's that I have been on are so vast it is ridiculous.

 

Aropax was so very numbing.  I had no feelings of any emotions whatsoever.  I can only see that now.  I had no feelings of happiness, sadness or any in between.

 

Now I feel like a totally new person.  I am LOVING life.  I have so much more motivation.  I am hitting the gym and running and doing so much with my kids it is exhausting.  I have even lost 8 kgs.

 

Yes I am still going to get off the Lovan and I still have a few months to wait before my CNS will be ready after the awful crash from the Aropax.  But I can, and will be AD free.

 

I urge you all to never ever give up.  I tried to keep positive and I really think it helped.  Every day and every week I knew I was closer to where I needed to be or wanted to be.

 

I will be back again before my Lovan taper begins.

[Altostrata]

Very good to hear, Winner. What was the method you used to switch from Paxil to fluoxetine (Lovan)?

[Winner]

I Bridged.  I lowered Paxil to 1/4 tablet and as I took that to 1/8 I added 1/8 of the Lovan for 3 days then took 1/8 Aropax with 1/4 Lovan for 3 days then 1/8 Aropax and 1/2 Lovan for 3 days then just jumped to NO aropax and 3/4 Lovan for 3 days then 1 whole Lovan.  Yes there were issues but nothing that was not able to be rationally reasoned with in my own head.

 

I wanted it to work so badly as I had the crash only 2 weeks earlier where I stopped the Aropax C/T off 1/2 tablet.  That was nasty and only took me two days to hit rock bottom.

 

The bridge worked for me and I am so pleased it did.  It was rocky but worth it. 

 

I am now 5 months Paxil free.......... I am actually still waiting for the withdrawals to hit as I have read that it can still happen.  I certainly hope not.  Another 6 months or so and I am hoping my CNS will be strong enough to handle a Lovan taper......

[Reflex]

How positive you sound.

It's really good to read.

Keep up the positivity

[Altostrata]

Yes, I think that gradual cross-taper is a good way to bridge. Please let us know how you're doing -- after a bit, pay it forward with a Success Story!

[Winner]

I am sooooo happy. 10 months off Paxil/aropax and still on the up and up..... Lovan has certainly been a different experience. So much more motivating. Not so much numbing. Just wish I was not on Aropax for 15 years. Yes, when I started it, it was a wonderful drug. It did what it needed. I just became so dependant on not feeling that depression/anxiety again that I relied on it way too much. Numb to the world fir 10 or more years.... Weight gain, numbness, joyless, robotic.

 

Now 21 kgs lighter, doing cross fit traing 5 or 6 days a week and loving life soooo much I could burst. My kids and my husband are my everything again. I think I had forgotten I loved my husband so damn much..... It's a bit like getting married all over again. And my kids, they are trying to keep up with me.

 

Yes I am still on an antidepressant. The difference so far, if I forget to take a Lovan tablet for (honesty calls, A FEW DAYS) I do not get all that sh*tty light headed nausea stuff. In fact I have no idea I have missed a dose (OR 4). YES AMAZING.

 

I am still planning to come off the Lovan but I said at least 12 to 18 months after my CNS crash.

 

I will attemp this but not just yet. Enjoying the new me too much...... xxxxxx

 

Be kind and only do what feels right

[mammaP]

Thanks for updating us Winner. I am so glad that the bridge went well for you and think you are wise to wait for your nervos system to adjust before starting to taper again.  When you are ready read the topic for tapering prozac (lovan) and take it very slow. With your history you will need to be very careful to not rock the boat, the last thing you need is withdrawal again. Be careful with the doses, you might not get any symptoms now but inconsistent dosing will bite you on the bum eventually  !  I'm so happy that you are doing so well, let us know when you start to taper so we can support you. 

[Erell]

Hello @Winner, how are you doing?