☼ Zang909 Almost 20 Years Medicated. Time to stop.

[Lilu]

Thanks for the kind words, ang!

 

I have a teenager at home and he has been causing so much stress and conflict. I was thinking the other day about how all the conflict will die down once he gets a better handle on his emotions. I was thinking that he just needs to learn to deal with all these emotions which are new to him and overpowering.

And then I thought: I'm going through kind of a similar thing. After all these years of the meds numbing my anxiety and other issues, I'm really only dealing with them for the first time now without a filter. So, they're kind of overwhelming and I'm having to learn to cope with them and learn strategies for how to deal with these feelings constructively.

 

If this is a good analogy, perhaps it will help me to be kinder and more patient with myself and less likely to just view my feelings as being signs of sickness and brokenness.

 

Hi Zang,

I go to a University Behavioral Health Center, where they see kids, teens, and adults alike in both group therapy and individual therapy. They are big on Dialectical behavioral therapy which whose underlying approach is Mindfulness. But also DBT is all about learning skills that teach one how to regulate emotions and improving interpersonal relationships. This is an excellent DBT channel, it presents DBT in a much more informative way than it has ever been presented to me in group therapy. https://www.youtube.com/user/dbtworks/videos

 

Perhaps learning and practicing Mindfulness together with your son, would be a way to not just bond but to also have a way to handle turbulent emotions. I've been going to group therapy for 2 years, and the Mindfulness is the one skill that people site as being most helpful in learning how to regulate emotions.

This has a mindfulness meditation in it, but is specific to withdrawal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CffPR-Xp7mw

[Zang909]

Thanks, Lilu.

I'll look into DBT. Right now my focus is on just finding a decent person to talk to who is close to where I work. If it's not close to work, then it will take too much trouble to get to, which will increase my anxiety, and so I won't go.

I'm also hoping to find a female care provider. Is it just me, or do men seem to be more prone to the "god complex" that some health care providers can get? Also, I'm not exactly a stereotypical male and I find that many men can't empathize with my sensitivity, seeing it instead as weakness. I definitely don't need that undercurrent going on during counseling.

[Pugknows]

((((Zang))). How you feeling today? Revved up emotions leads to revved up anxiety leads to revved up symptoms leads to revved up exhaustion leads to revved up despair. Ugh! Wouldn't it be great if we could nip the first one in the bud, then we wouldn't have to deal with the rest of them?

[Zang909]

My stepson made some kind of attempt at suicide yesterday.

And here's the most damning thing I've probably ever said about myself: All I could feel was anger. No compassion. No sympathy. Just anger.

 

To clarify: he did something that couldn't possibly kill him. But it's obvious that he's feeling pain and confusion. And I could not do anything for him but be angry.

[Pugknows]

((((Zang))) I'm so sorry for your son and you. Despair is crippling. I pray that you and your son hold onto each other and prop each other up during these tough times.

[Pugknows]

Anger is still an expression of love. Granted, it's not always the most helpful emotion, but it still comes from a place of caring what happens to someone you love.

[Zang909]

Nope. It's just that all I had for him was anger and resentment.

And my wife saw it. I don't know whether she'll be able to forgive me.

[Zang909]

I feel pretty bad. My wife is strung out over going through all she's been going through with the boy.

And without her I have no one. I have no friends. I have no where to go when I feel like hiding under the bed or in the closet.

[Zang909]

I can't do this with the teenager added into the situation. I can't live like this.

[Zang909]

Seriously thinking of going back on meds. I can't do this with my stepson in the equation. My home feels like such a hostile environment with him in it. I'm a raw nerve and he's an obnoxious, rebellious teenager with severe ADHD. It's driving me crazy.

He's emotionally volatile and loud and obnoxious and petulant and I can't be a father to him while I'm in this condition. And my wife is left to deal with him by herself.

I stayed home with my daughters while my wife took him to the emergency room last night. I was able to take care of them. But my wife is understandably upset because the evening was so distressing and frightening to her and I was not there for her at all. She was exhausted and left to deal with it all alone.

 

I'm failing my wife by being unable to be there for her to help her with him. And I'm failing him by being so thin-skinned that I have to avoid even talking to him or even hearing the grating, obnoxious sound of his voice. And if I go back on meds I'm failing myself and all of you.

 

I don't have what it takes to tough this out. I can't create a perfect bubble of zen around me for years while I wait and see whether I'll ever get better.

 

I know I'll feel better in a couple of days if the rest of my life will just go perfectly smoothly. But I can't live like this. And my wife can't live like this. I need to be able to be present. I need to be able to be a husband and a father again. I can't convalesce indefinitely, while the world waits to see if I'll ever return. 

 

I'm sorry; I know this is heresy.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Zang,

 

The desire to go back on meds to deal with this impossible situation is not heresy. There is no such thing as that here. It is just us people in pain, doing what we have to to cope.

 

I understand the feelings you are describing. Everyone is welcome here, no matter what their circumstances. Life is pretty hard sometimes. Let us know how you are doing, ok?

 

PS. I had a friend once, had a lot of 'mental' problems. She was always threatening something. One day I had enough, told her to go away. Shortly afterwards, I saw the emergency people taking her away. Was told later she called before it was too late. My first feeling was anger. I felt badly about that, having that emotion. Never told anyone till now. Takes courage to admit something like that. You've got lots of courage and it will see you through this.

[Zang909]

Thanks so much for your kind words, cymbaltawithdrawal5600. Thanks for sharing your story as well; it helps.

 

My struggle to be free from meds has been going relatively well, but I guess that's been because my wife has been there to absorb the brunt of the chaos from my stepson. We just saw what happens when she's the one who needs help. It's very hard for her right now, and she's very upset that I wasn't able to be there for her. And that makes me feel very badly about myself.

 

I tried to be there for the boy last night, but he decided to start using spray paint in his room. When my wife told him spray paint isn't allowed to be used in the house (especially in a small, closed room), he argued with her. This makes me so angry. So even though I tried to scrape together some sympathy for him, he reverts to this behavior and all I have is rage. My heart was pounding.

 

I can't even look at him without seeing red. I can't hear his voice without my blood pressure going up. It makes me reactive and irrational.

 

It doesn't help that my hearing seems to be off-the-charts sensitive right now. I'm like a giant raw nerve. I'm fine as long as the world is unnaturally peaceful and quiet, but even on the bus during my commute I sit there seething at the people who have their headphones turned up so loud that I can hear their music from ten feet away. I can hear the music coming out of their headphones even though I wear earplugs when I ride the bus! I can hear their "private" music over my own earplugs! I just want to sit and quietly read, but I can't because of how loudly the people around me are talking or listening to music.

[Addax]

It's a tough choice to make, Zang. I was just there making that choice not too long ago. It came down to what I was willing to sacrifice for withdrawal.. Which wasn't a whole heck of a lot :-). Reinstating is not failure... I don't feel like a failure. I was disappointed that my life is such that I couldnt... That I wasn't willing to continue on with how I was feeling. So I reinstated a few months ago, stabilized, got past a major hurdle I couldn't tackle while in the throws of a hellish crash and burn, and I've just started tapering again. This time with a more conservative plan.

 

We do what we feel we need to do to live our lives. Like CW said, you have courage, and you do have what it takes to get through this, but to get through "this" there is some sacrifice. Like I said, I was only willing to sacrifice so much... Some people are willing to sacrifice more, others less.

 

Your reaction to your step-son is normal and understandable, particularly to his suicidal gesture.

 

I don't know from personal experience, but I've seen friends struggle to like their ADHD diagnosed kid. They love them, but struggle to LIKE them and end up feeling guilty for that. I've come away not liking the kid either... some kids, just like a million other people in the world, are difficult to like.

 

Whatever you decide to do, do it for you and the life you want to live. THAT is what will give you strength.

[iquit]

Hi Zang!

 

I am fairly new to SA, but NOT new to the world of SSRIs.  I had about a 12 year stint with paxil and lexapro myself.  I have managed to read though almost your entire thread, and wanted to post.

 

First of all, I am SO sorry to hear about your step son, and I can not begin to imagine the added stress that is causing.  I am a mom to an eleven year old who is hitting puberty early, and even that is a lot to deal with.

 

I want to remind you today though of something that really STUCK with me in one of your earlier posts.  I'm going to quote you...

 

"Don't believe everything you think."

 

You DO have what it takes to tough this out.  I know that is doesn't feel like it though.  Unfortunately, I have learned that life doesn't stop just because we are in withdraw.  Sometimes, it gets even crazier.  I can so relate to many of your posts here... the physical symptoms, the emotional symptoms, etc.  Do me a favor... please try to wait a couple of weeks before making any decisions to go back on meds.  I am not here to tell you that you should or shouldn't do it, but please just give yourself some time first.

[Zang909]

Had an appointment with the psych doc yesterday after work. He is a nice enough guy, it seems, but he's simulataneously extremely arrogant. He pretty much poo-pood all of my concerns, dismissed all complaints against antidepressants (and benzos), and invalidated my own experiences with side effects. He doesn't believe in long-term withdrawal at all.

He even told me that if there were any problems with these meds, no doctor would be willing to prescribe them for fear of being sued! Absurd.

I just kept my mouth shut for fear of being labeled combative or paranoid.

As we keep learning in America and around the world, we cannot necessarily trust authority figures or experts to know or say what is best for us. We each have to take responsibility for our own health and well-being. Right now I need this guy's prescribing power to help me keep my family together. I don't need to trust his judgment so long as I do my own research and don't fall for his "Pfizer said it, I believe it, that settles it" drug fundamentalist approach.

 

He prescribed Neurontin for my ongoing free floating anxiety, and Xanax for acute bouts in which my stepson gets my heart pounding, keeps me from sleeping, etc. I told my wife that I'll keep taking the little poison pills until the boy moves out when he turns 18.

As wary as I am of antidepressants, I'm terrified of the benzos. Recent research seems to link benzo use to Alzheimers. My doc is quite certain that benzos carry no risk, but I prefer to be more circumspect about their use.

 

So I'm on meds again. I don't feel good about this. I do feel as though it's a personal failing, though I'm told that I shouldn't view it that way. 

Keep fighting the good fight, everyone. We're all different, and we all do what we can. If the struggle to be free of the meds destroys our support networks, ours will be a pyrrhic victory at best. Perhaps not worth it. We all need to make these decisions as best we can.

[Zang909]

The one promise I made my wife when I began the struggle to be free of these meds is that I wouldn't let it destroy our marriage.

We have been through so much together. She and the kids are everything to me. I'm not willing to sacrifice her on the altar of withdrawal. To be free of the meds but to not have her in my life, as my wife and partner, would render my entire struggle worthless and pointless.

A year, two years, these are large periods of time in my kids' lives. To have my daughters remember such a large chunk of time as a time when their dad was a wreck or an emotional monster would be horrific. I was raised by emotionally-volatile monsters and don't want to be remembered as my parents are remembered. I am so close to my girls and am not willing to sacrifice those relationships.

[Rhiannon]

There's no such thing as heresy here, so let go of that fear. We all know the kind of suffering you are experiencing, we've all been there. I was on and off meds many, many times before my current taper, been through that hell; in fact the current cocktail I'm tapering from came from trying to get out of one of those.

 

I'd just suggest stay with the mantra "the lowest possible dose of the fewest possible meds." Right now, in desperation, it's tempting to just take anything, whatever they give, whatever it takes, but later you will be glad that you were as conservative as possible.

 

And when the time comes to taper again, please consider a slower taper. I have always been concerned about how fast you tapered, given your very long history on the drugs. I think anyone who can count their psych med history in decades needs to plan on years to taper.

[Zang909]

Thanks, Rhiannon.

I know so much more this time than ever before, and whatever I take now automatically has me thinking about how I will taper off it when I am able to begin tapering again. That's why I've given up arguing with my doc; I don't need to convince him of anything. He's set in his ways and I know that I can get from him what I need for now: meds. I think that he's secretly happy about getting to prescribe for Mr. "No drugs for me." But he's been pretty good about letting me set the pace. 

And you're right - my next taper will be slower. In fact, taking it very slow will probably allow me to begin the taper sooner.

Thanks again.

[Karma]

Hi Zang

 

Just wanted to give you another vote of confidence .  There is no failure here.  You have identified what is most important in your life and made a decision to keep your family whole.  That is a beautiful thing.

 

I agree with your approach of basically using the doctor to get what you need, but managing your health based on all you've learned.

 

My journey off of drugs continues.  But what I find is important is maintaining my quality of life while on the journey.  Yes, I would like to be off of the drugs, but I find that being stable, loving my family, enjoying the beauty around me, being able to cope with challenges at work and in life - these are what make the journey worthwhile.

 

Keep us posted.

 

Karma

[Zang909]

Thank you, Karma. I agree with all that you wrote and I wish you continued success in your journey.

[Zang909]

Update:

This is just my second full day of being on Neurontin.

Already yesterday, after just two doses, things were different. I woke up early and easily; feeling refreshed. As I was walking from the bus stop to work, I suddenly realized that I felt... pretty good. Not great, not super, not manic, but pretty darn good.

I feel as though I am exactly the same person I was last week; except I don't have a cloud of anxiety hanging over me. I don't have that clenched fist in my gut - that tightness, that feeling of almost being braced for impact all day, every day.

I am still noticing the things my stepson is doing, but they don't make me want to rip his head off. I actually had a good talk with him last night about the situation with his ex-girlfriend.

It's kind of subtle. I'm not running around singing in the streets or anything, but I just feel... decent.

My wife says that she can feel the difference; that I just don't feel so tightly-wound.

As I say, it's kind of subtle. I'm definitely not numbed. My libido is not negatively impacted so far.

Only time will tell if this works out for me, but right now I'm doing more okay than I've been in a while.

 

I haven't taken any Xanax and I hope that I will never need to. I'm saving it only in case of emergency. I'm kind of scared of benzos - even more than antidepressants.

[Lilu]

Had an appointment with the psych doc yesterday after work. He is a nice enough guy, it seems, but he's simulataneously extremely arrogant. He pretty much poo-pood all of my concerns, dismissed all complaints against antidepressants (and benzos), and invalidated my own experiences with side effects. He doesn't believe in long-term withdrawal at all.

He even told me that if there were any problems with these meds, no doctor would be willing to prescribe them for fear of being sued! Absurd.

I just kept my mouth shut for fear of being labeled combative or paranoid.

As we keep learning in America and around the world, we cannot necessarily trust authority figures or experts to know or say what is best for us. We each have to take responsibility for our own health and well-being. Right now I need this guy's prescribing power to help me keep my family together. I don't need to trust his judgment so long as I do my own research and don't fall for his "Pfizer said it, I believe it, that settles it" drug fundamentalist approach.

 

He prescribed Neurontin for my ongoing free floating anxiety, and Xanax for acute bouts in which my stepson gets my heart pounding, keeps me from sleeping, etc. I told my wife that I'll keep taking the little poison pills until the boy moves out when he turns 18.

As wary as I am of antidepressants, I'm terrified of the benzos. Recent research seems to link benzo use to Alzheimers. My doc is quite certain that benzos carry no risk, but I prefer to be more circumspect about their use.

 

So I'm on meds again. I don't feel good about this. I do feel as though it's a personal failing, though I'm told that I shouldn't view it that way. 

Keep fighting the good fight, everyone. We're all different, and we all do what we can. If the struggle to be free of the meds destroys our support networks, ours will be a pyrrhic victory at best. Perhaps not worth it. We all need to make these decisions as best we can.

Wow, I can't believe you are willing to work with this doctor. Although, most of them have exactly the same attitude. But a doctor like this is not the kind of doctor who will help you do a long taper and prescribe liquid medication that's necessary for a long taper.

Check out this dialogue 

[Zang909]

Thanks for those videos, Lilu.

Since I last wrote, my teenaged stepson ran away from home, threatened to kill himself and threatened to kill me. We called the police, but they were unable to do anything at all because he told them that he wasn't a danger to himself or others.

Right now I feel like I am in hell and I honestly don't care what I need to do to stop my heart from hammering in my chest and to stop feeling as though I am going to die. I have to be able to support my wife as we go through this and try to deal with it together. I need to be there for my young daughters, who need help understanding what is going on and who need to know that they can count on me to keep them safe. Despite being medicated, I was literally throwing up from the anxiety a few days ago.

So right now I'm willing to make a deal with the devil in order to survive this and help my family to survive it. Sometimes it feels hopeless and terrifying, but I can't leave my wife and daughters to deal with it alone.

 

I know that there will be a price to pay when we survive this, but right now our top priority is surviving.

[Lilu]

Thanks for those videos, Lilu.

Since I last wrote, my teenaged stepson ran away from home, threatened to kill himself and threatened to kill me. We called the police, but they were unable to do anything at all because he told them that he wasn't a danger to himself or others.

Right now I feel like I am in hell and I honestly don't care what I need to do to stop my heart from hammering in my chest and to stop feeling as though I am going to die. I have to be able to support my wife as we go through this and try to deal with it together. I need to be there for my young daughters, who need help understanding what is going on and who need to know that they can count on me to keep them safe. Despite being medicated, I was literally throwing up from the anxiety a few days ago.

So right now I'm willing to make a deal with the devil in order to survive this and help my family to survive it. Sometimes it feels hopeless and terrifying, but I can't leave my wife and daughters to deal with it alone.

 

I know that there will be a price to pay when we survive this, but right now our top priority is surviving.

Oh Zang,

What you're dealing with is really tough. It seems that one person in your family is quite toxic to everyone else in your family.  I have seen quite a few Dr.Phil episodes with similar situations.  Usually, Dr.Phil's advice is to remove the disrupting son from the family and place him in some sort of rehabilitation facility. Is that an option at all for you?

[Zang909]

Brief update time:

Teenaged ADHD stepson continues to present incredible challenges to all. He's fully immersed in a culture of recreational drugs and has no desire to stop using them. He seems to think that they are helping him while all we can see is that he seems to be falling apart - he is close to failing out of school and his moods have become even more volatile, his behavior even less predictable. Docs can't treat his ADHD because they can't mess with his meds while he's self-medicating. Maddening.

 

I've been taking Gabapentin (Neurontin) to manage my anxiety, with Xanax on an as-needed basis. I'm terrified of forming a dependence on Xanax, so I'm using it rarely - maybe .25mg once a week, mainly to help me sleep when exhaustion threatens. 

 

The Gabapentin does not entirely remove the symptoms of my anxiety, but it takes care of enough of them that I'm able to function well as husband and father. And I'm not a zombie: I experience joy from my wife and kids on a daily basis, which is helping me to survive the bad times from my son.

 

So, things are difficult but I'm holding steady. Hang in there, everyone.

[Zang909]

An update:

I can't believe it's been almost a year since my last post in this thread.

What a nightmare, and it's not over yet. Perhaps never will be.

My ADHD-diagnosed, drug addict step-son has been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder. We had to call the police on him again and he ended up in a psych ward for a couple of months. I had to testify against him in court and he was ordered into rehab, which he did complete, though he has no still has no desire to quit drugs. It turns out that he was abusing every drug under the sun. He's possibly done some long-term mental damage to himself.

My family is a wreck. I don't know whether my marriage will survive.

I am just realizing how badly this all has affected me - not just mentally and emotionally, but also physically.

 

I still hope to try to go off the meds, but that goal seems so, so far in the future.