Jump to content
picchy

Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, ME, CFS

Recommended Posts

picchy

I wondered if there's anyone else who has ME/CFS?

 

I've had it for nine years though was managing to live with it. Until I came off Citalopram 5 months ago.

 

I've had the worst episode of ME I've ever had and have become housebound and bedbound with physical illness. On top of this there are frightening w/d symptoms and horrible unprecedented depression and anxiety, which I made much much worse by trying to take Moclobemide for 2 weeks. Now I can hardly look at a computer or TV screen, have hardly been able to eat in two months, can hardly walk and have horrible unreality feelings.

 

My fear is that I am not in a good place to recover, because my nervous system was already not working properly due to the ME. Now it's in the worst state it's ever been in and I feel utterly hopeless.

 

Picchy


Sufferer of moderate ME/CFS since 2005

Started 20mg Citalopram in March 2008 due to bereavement

Was fine since then with no adverse effects or depression - so decided to taper off

Came off it in March 2014 after a five-month taper, which I thought was a long time

Experienced a month of uncharacteristic depression in April 2014

Two months feeling fine

In June 2014 return of depression then an overnight physical crash leaving me debilitated in July

Tried to take moclobemide at low dose for 2 weeks in July but severe reaction

Housebound since then, ME now severe

No meds taken

Female, 38 years old

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EternalOptimist

Hi Picchy.

 

Yes, I'm right at my 25 year anniversary of having CFS. I'm so sorry for what you are going thru. I was functioning somewhat adequately tho on disability but could do my own grocery shopping, drive to appt. but not far, and be mentally stable most of the time.

Then, for reasons I won't get into here or now, I came off low dose Xanax in hospital c/t and lost lot of functioning. Couldn't drive for few years but would back car out of driveway and maybe around the block to try to keep up the skill. By 9 years off, was able to get out some and feel more normal, maybe 50% healed, as enjoying life some again. Then last Fall, had stressors, couldn't sleep so went on remeron and tapered off in 9 weeks, that was almost 6 months ago. I've had some good windows but the waves are a real challenge.

I understand your concern about cns not recovering but I believe we can, at least to a comfortable level as I got there and now have to get there again.

Battling CFS and drug w/d is certainly not easy.

You're not alone.

EO


1989-2004 low doze Xanax nightly.

2004 w/d in hospital c/t with 3 other meds, (trazadone, phenobarbital, risperdal)

Tapered off those meds in 7 months.

2010- bad anxiety so tried Valium and klonopin, back to hospital, came home on nothing, got much better.

12-23-2013- hospital for anxiety, depression,insomnia...used low dose lamictal 12 days with mitrazapine.

Came home on 15 mg mitrazapine, down to c. 10 mg mitrazapine in c. 3weeks, 7.5 mg in 32 days..

Tapered off mitrazapine March 6, 2014.

Took .75 mg April 20 and 1.05 mg April 21st.

Ended taper March 6, 2014.

Take supplements tho not all daily: fish oil, Vit. C., Vit. D, cal/mag, little multi, mag at night,

Been taking homeopathic remedy since June, 2014 via a Homeopathic M.D. (Trained in psychiatry)1-12, 2018 put on 60 mg cymbalta; 150 lyrica for anxiety and 50 mg trazadone. Tapered of trazadone after 3 months on it and tapered off of lyrica in about 9 months. As of March, 2019, only on 60 mg cymbalta.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Meimeiquest

I used to have a dx of fibromyalgia, but the muscle pain is gone since I stopped SRI's in 2006. But I still have bad fatigue, more the less drugs I take. Before poly drugging, I had bad post-exercise fatigue. It improved when I was poly drugging, now it is back.

 

These are some wild thoughts: Sarah Myhill MD in England holds to a mitochondrial-based theory of CFS. She has been in a lot of hot water with the medical society there. Don't know if that makes her a quack or hero. She says mitochondrial issues cause a lot of oxidative stress. In "Nutrient Power" Dr. Walsh says psychiatric drugs are virtually all potent antioxidants. Maybe there is a connection there. But there are better ways to get antioxidants!


1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EternalOptimist

Hi Meim.

Interesting post about all psych drugs bring strong antioxidants . Think that includes Benzos?

 

How's the Walsh protocol going?


1989-2004 low doze Xanax nightly.

2004 w/d in hospital c/t with 3 other meds, (trazadone, phenobarbital, risperdal)

Tapered off those meds in 7 months.

2010- bad anxiety so tried Valium and klonopin, back to hospital, came home on nothing, got much better.

12-23-2013- hospital for anxiety, depression,insomnia...used low dose lamictal 12 days with mitrazapine.

Came home on 15 mg mitrazapine, down to c. 10 mg mitrazapine in c. 3weeks, 7.5 mg in 32 days..

Tapered off mitrazapine March 6, 2014.

Took .75 mg April 20 and 1.05 mg April 21st.

Ended taper March 6, 2014.

Take supplements tho not all daily: fish oil, Vit. C., Vit. D, cal/mag, little multi, mag at night,

Been taking homeopathic remedy since June, 2014 via a Homeopathic M.D. (Trained in psychiatry)1-12, 2018 put on 60 mg cymbalta; 150 lyrica for anxiety and 50 mg trazadone. Tapered of trazadone after 3 months on it and tapered off of lyrica in about 9 months. As of March, 2019, only on 60 mg cymbalta.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
vonant

So I am 3,5 years post Citalopram. Still have many issues but overall mentally  I am a lot better than a couple of years ago. I began running more intensely last month. At some point it felt like I was coming down with something. Now I generally feel weaker and worst of all. I feel "ill" after exercise. Like a rise in temperature or just flu like. Even just minor things like mowing a lawn causes this. I'm afraid its "Post-exertional malaise" which apparently is the most common symptom of CFS. I thought I was on my way towards recovery. Has anybody else struggled with this? Please tell me it just part of overall withdrawal and will recede, and it not something completely new on top of everything else. 


Male

On Citalopram from 2008-2011 (age 19-23) for anxiety

Started on 20mg but was on 60mg at one point

Knew nothing about discontinuation and wasn't given much help from doctor

Tried stopping on my own after being stable on one pill a day (20mg)

Went horribly wrong and had to reinstate

Tried "tappering" on my own as doctor new nothing by taking half pills and skipping days

Managed to quit this way over 3 to 4 months

Had horrible reaction and began withdrawal hell

Found Paxil Progress after a month or so not understanding why symptoms wasn't going away

Mentally better but recently ran into huge fatigue problems after gradual onset. Now homebound

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/forum/3-introductions-and-updates/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Petunia

I also had 'post exertional malaise' develop in withdrawal, I still have it and have to be careful with exercise because if I overdo it, it will trigger a wave. There are some similarities between withdrawal and CFS.

 

This article from Beyond Meds has some useful information:

 

Protracted psychiatric drug withdrawal syndrome, chronic illness, CFS, Fibromyalgia. Yeah, they all have things in common.


I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
stan

unfortunately i have it severe, fibromyalgia and fatigue...walking is a nightmare, need resting every few steps, autonomic system disorder...


for anxiety 

12 years paxil - cold turkey 1,5 month - switch celexa 1 year taper; total 13 years on brain meds 

67 years old - 9 years  med free

 

in protracted withdrawal

rigidity standing and walking, dryness gougerot-szoegren, sleep deteriorate,

function as have a lack of nerves, improving have been very little 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
bruno2016

Hello,

 

I too am about 3.5 years off and have fibro type issues and am even producing antinuclear antibodies which are seen on some people with fibro. In essence, i have a fibro type unknown autoimmume condition triggered by ssri usage/wd. Some say fibro is actually an autoimmune disease in and of itself. Anyways, i follow wahls protocol which has helped my fibro type symptoms. I am also very physically active exercising about 10 hours a week. This could be a factor negatively affecting how i feel but can be for sure. My advice is to watch diet and add supplements if need be. Wahls has worked well for me


Various SSRIs/SNRIs 7- 1/2 years

Went Cold Turkey from Celexa 2011, Stayed Off

Psych Drug Free and Loving Life (over 6 years and counting)

 

How I Stay Well: Diet, exercise, meditation, supplements, etc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Narcissus

I will often experience symptoms after exercising.  Earlier in withdrawal exercise could trigger serious waves, now it tends to stir up the milder fluish withdrawal symptoms, still very unpleasant.   While other aspects of withdrawal have improved the exercise intolerance has not improved much for me over two years.  Concerning to say the least.  

I should also say I'm occasionally able to exercise without it causing any symptoms, especially during windows.  Just another strange non-linear dimension of withdrawal.  

 

And yes, exercise intolerance is a symptom of chronic fatigue syndrome, there seems to be quite a bit of overlap.  Gia has looked into this in some depth I believe.  

EDIT:  Apologies, I missed petu's beyondmeds link.  


3 Years 150 mgs Effexor

2 month taper down to zero

3 terrible weeks at zero

Back up to 75 mgs

2 months at 75

6 or so months back to regular dose of 150 - was able to restabilize fine.

3 month taper back to zero

1 HORRENDOUS week at zero

2 days back up to 37.5

3 days back up to 75

One week at 150 - unable to stabilize.

Back down to 75 mgs

At 75 mgs (half original dose) and suffering withdrawal symptoms since October 2012.

 

"It is a radical cure for all pessimism to become ill, to remain ill for a good while, and then grow well for a still longer period." - Nietzsche

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
vonant

I'm digging more into the link between withdrawal and CFS and neuroinflammation as I am currently experiencing this heavily on my own body. I came across this article and thought I had to share it. It suggests a relationship between too much Glutamate and too little GABA in CFS. It even mentions Benzo withdrawal. Anyway, I think this is all very relavant to us so have a look if you want. I might post similar finds occasionally in this thread. Vonant.

 

http://www.cortjohnson.org/blog/2013/02/15/glutamate-one-more-piece-in-the-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-mecfs-puzzle-the-neuroinflammatory-series-pt-ii/


Male

On Citalopram from 2008-2011 (age 19-23) for anxiety

Started on 20mg but was on 60mg at one point

Knew nothing about discontinuation and wasn't given much help from doctor

Tried stopping on my own after being stable on one pill a day (20mg)

Went horribly wrong and had to reinstate

Tried "tappering" on my own as doctor new nothing by taking half pills and skipping days

Managed to quit this way over 3 to 4 months

Had horrible reaction and began withdrawal hell

Found Paxil Progress after a month or so not understanding why symptoms wasn't going away

Mentally better but recently ran into huge fatigue problems after gradual onset. Now homebound

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/forum/3-introductions-and-updates/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
reachingforthestars

Oh, I wish I haven't read this... Is there anyone who have had many of those serious cfs symptoms during their withdrawal for long time (several months) and have recovered? This is so scary time for me, what if i stay this way? i don't even have the strength to brush my hair. :/ 


Citalopram 40mg from 2003-2015

Jan 2015 started tapering first dropped to 35mgFeb 30mg, March 25mgApril 20mg, May 17,5mg, June 15mgJuly 12,5mg, Aug 12,5mg,

Sep 0mg for 5 days because of stomac flu and after I raised to 7,5mg. All the symptoms of acute WD shaking, diarrhea, vomiting, barely could walk ect. Still didn't realize that it wasn't only stomac flu but I was also going through WD.

Oct 2,5mg and crashed again badly and quickly raised to 4mg. It was then when I knew my symptoms were due to WD.

Then in November after a month holding on 4mg raised to 5mg due to muscle weakness and had a VERY BAD reaction to reinstatement: akathisia(lasted for one or two weeks), insomnia, anhedonia... Drop quicly back to 4mg, Dec 3mg

Jan 2016 2,6mg( in the middle of Jan after I had been on 2,6mg for a week I tried to updose to 2,8mg and immediately had bad reaction to it: akathisia for a day, andehonia got worse. The next day dropped back to 2,6mg), Feb 2,4mg( a new symptom PGAD lasted 24/7 for 2 months after that on and off), March 2,4mg, April 2,3mg, May 2,2mg, June 2,1mg, July 2,0mg( Pgad almost nonexisting, sleeping pretty good, still some anhedonia but there has been a lot of gradual progress), Aug 1,97mg-1,89mg, Sep 1,88mg-1,49mg, Oct 1,48mg- 1,70mg,

Nov 0,65mg- current dose 0,5mg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hardy86

Hi richingforthestar

Do you still have bad Cfs? Mine is so bad it's hell.


Currently suffer extreme CFS, Lyme, adrenal fatigue, bad gut issues, reaction bad to mold basically etc home a lot. Can hardly walk all I get crash easily. 
I’m currently on mirtizapine 1.7mg and Reboxetine 0.4mg. I did a cut on reboxetine on the 19/4/20 around 11%. 
Also taking Ativan since January 2mg. 
 
 
 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

vonant, I joined this topic with the one about CFS you previously started. Please add to this one rather than start new topics, it keeps all the relevant information together in one place and easy to find via searches.

There was one before this one was started I came to ad to it ad can't find it now?  

 

I wanted to add this to the already long talk about chronic fatigue fibro... Maybe sooner or later they will all be joined the other one is older 

 

http://www.crohns.net/miva/education/articles/powerhealing_leogalland.shtml

www.crohns.net
Help Leaky Gut & Dysbiosis Now Intestinal Parasites, Bacterial Dysbiosis and Leaky Gut Excerpts from POWER HEALING (Random House, 1998) By Leo Galland, M.D.

 

 

 

Giardia contaminates streams and lakes throughout North America and has caused epidemics of diarrheal disease in several small cities by contaminating their drinking water. One epidemic, in Placerville, California, was followed by an epidemic of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, which swept through the town's residents at the time of the Giardia epidemic. Possibly, this epidemic was due to failure of some people to eradicate the parasite. In 1991, my colleagues and I published a study of 96 patients with chronic fatigue and demonstrated active Giardiainfection in 46 per cent.


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

we have company

http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/02/13/can-antidepressants-cause-chronic-fatigue-syndrome/

 

I am wonder "Who" owns this site?  

Google knows everything... 

MentalHealthDaily.com was established in 2013 as a way to document any information and updates in the field of mental health.  Author and creator, GLOOM,

 

now I will search for Gloom here at SA


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone had this fatigue like symptom. I have had this since the first day when my WD took off. It's a feeling of sedation and drowsiness that is constant. It worsens when speaking or using the brain. It's awful. I've read others have had it. I wasn't on any meds at the time it started during WD. I must mention that I'm currently on Remeron that causes drowsiness. But I've only been on Remeron 3 months and had this symptom for 6. I read where others have had it. Some get it while tapering. Some get it starting a med. some get it in WD. It's awful.


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sertramean

Hi Christian,

 

I've got the 'sedation' feeling. It started for me about 5 months after coming off Sertraline and then got worse when i got off the Mirtazapine. It feels like i've swallowed a million  anti-histamines. My body feels heavy, especially my legs and my upper back, sometimes my arms. This symptom is bad today but i don't seem to get it everyday anymore like i did a few months ago. When it's bad though i feel like i'm dragging my body round with me. When i finally get going though the symptom tends to reduce significantly until i become inactive again. I guess this is true for a lot of WD stuff. 

 

It also affects me mentally. My brain can feel very heavy and slow, again like i've swallowed a load of anti-hists.  

 

The good news is the intensity and duration of this WD symptom is not as bad as it was.


Seroxat 30mg (January 1998 > till started taper April 2013 > off completely July 2013) this was about my fourth attempt.

 

Prozac 40mg ( July 2013 - Feb 2014) 

 

Sertraline 75mg (Feb 2014- started taper Feb 2015 - off May 2015)

 

Mirtazapine - 7.5mg for 2 weeks - 3.75mg one week - 2mg one week (December'15 - Jan 16)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

Thanks for sharing Sertaman. This symptom is letting up a little. I have had it for 7 months straight and only now letting up. But it is till there and I have a never ending lack of energy or alertness. Its like an effort to use my brain and it feels like its 1/2 asleep. I figure its a combination of both the Mirtz and WD. I will say its been better the last 24 hours but nowhere near I hope it ends up at.    

 

does it kind of feel like there is a lack of oxygen going to your brain? I have read up on brain inflammation and CFS. Going to get some Acetyl and Paleo Greens for meals for a bit while cutting carbs and sugar. I want my brain back.  


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

we have company

http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/02/13/can-antidepressants-cause-chronic-fatigue-syndrome/

 

I am wonder "Who" owns this site?

Google knows everything...

MentalHealthDaily.com was established in 2013 as a way to document any information and updates in the field of mental health. Author and creator, GLOOM,

 

now I will search for Gloom here at SA

BDTD,

Did you find Gloom? I've read much of that site. It's probably one of the better sites for SSRI WD. Gloom seems to have been throughout it as well.


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

No Gloom here is all I know but seems this person thinks Ads cause this too. For that person it went away for me it isn't... not yet.


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

BTDT,

Do you get just physical fatigue or mental too? Some folks it seems just are physically tired. Others the fatigue is mental as well. Almost like its brain inflammation. I'm seeing a naturopath today to get an oxidative stress test to look at inflammation levels. I have no idea if inflammation goes away. I guess proper eating and exercise helps. But the fog is out of this world.


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sallo

I wondered if there's anyone else who has ME/CFS?

 

I've had it for nine years though was managing to live with it. Until I came off Citalopram 5 months ago.

 

I've had the worst episode of ME I've ever had and have become housebound and bedbound with physical illness. On top of this there are frightening w/d symptoms and horrible unprecedented depression and anxiety, which I made much much worse by trying to take Moclobemide for 2 weeks. Now I can hardly look at a computer or TV screen, have hardly been able to eat in two months, can hardly walk and have horrible unreality feelings.

 

My fear is that I am not in a good place to recover, because my nervous system was already not working properly due to the ME. Now it's in the worst state it's ever been in and I feel utterly hopeless.

 

Picchy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cherry47

Hello Picchy, yes I have had ME for a long time and yes it is made worse by the drug withdrawal, but remember that ME symptoms do ease back so try to treat it the same way as you always did. I know what you are going through but it will get better, and then come back, and then get better.......... This website is full of helpful info so have a good read, try some relaxation/meditation which will help your anxiety. You will get better - I am getting better albeit very slowly - kind of a two steps forward and one step back type of progress.

 

I am sure the moderators will point you in the direction you need with some useful links, but if you have any queries specific to the ME, I am happy to try to help.


Chronic Fatigue Syndrome for 32 years, given AD for this condition alone in 2000

Zoloft 100mg for 15 years, last five of these complained about adverse effects,

unable to tolerate other meds even supplements

Slowly felt sicker, advised by different Dr maybe on ads for too long

Cut back 100 - 50 over 6 months, still getting worse, so stopped over about 6 weeks starting Dec 2014

First month, slow, emotional, useless then POW! Horrendous withdrawal symptoms, completely non-functional

for about five months, slowly started to come back to life and continue with waves and windows, still more bad than good, but bads are less bad, and goods slightly better each time

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cherry47

Perhaps I could have addressed another couple of issues you raised:

 

The appetite - I totally lost my appetite for a long time too and it is scary, but it comes back. In the meantime just try to swallow anything you can, no matter how small, all day (I think I nibbled on dry rice cakes and Rice Bubbles which was better than nothing!)

 

Also had the same trouble with tv and computer screens, still do occasionally, think that's a bit of a ME thing as well. Only solution is rest the eyes and only in short bursts, but another thing that will improve.

 

Also been housebound, bedbound, hardly able to walk from one end of the house to the the other but these have also improved.

 

So hang in there, the horror WILL diminish.


Chronic Fatigue Syndrome for 32 years, given AD for this condition alone in 2000

Zoloft 100mg for 15 years, last five of these complained about adverse effects,

unable to tolerate other meds even supplements

Slowly felt sicker, advised by different Dr maybe on ads for too long

Cut back 100 - 50 over 6 months, still getting worse, so stopped over about 6 weeks starting Dec 2014

First month, slow, emotional, useless then POW! Horrendous withdrawal symptoms, completely non-functional

for about five months, slowly started to come back to life and continue with waves and windows, still more bad than good, but bads are less bad, and goods slightly better each time

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

Cherry,

I know you weren't sharing your improvements with me. But I found them very encouraging. I don't have CFS but i sure have the symtoms from WD. The stress of all this my adrenals have crashed. My naturopath confirmed this with an adrenal stress test. I'm borderline bedridden on some days. I have the 500 lbs legs and horrific mental fatigue to boot. I read the book Adrenal Fatigue by Dr James Wilson and see a naturopath to try and turn it around. Anyways I would be interested in hearing how much you improved and the time frame? Could you share some of your tricks ?


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
picchy

Hello Cherry,

 

Thanks so much for your messages as I am having a very difficult time. I've been totally housebound for 2 years now and my mobility hasn't really improved. Some other symptoms have thankfully, so there has been progress, such as the depression, light sensitivity and other more neurological symptoms. However the interaction with the pre-existing ME is pretty bad, and I feel unwell all the time with very lowered immunity (I was previously able to get out most days). I recently stopped the birth control pill as I maybe thought I was more recovered from the w/d than I am, and have had more intense w/d symptoms and completely new ones with chronic bladder irritation... gaah! I think I read somewhere else it's possible to get new symptoms even far out into the w/d... hope that's all it is, because I'm unable to get out for any tests. Many other terrible symptoms resolved so here's hoping for the best...

 

I'm glad you've made progress and don't sound so housebound any more. I had found a recovery programme (Gupta) that really helped with the ME before, but feel a bit helpless now. Meditation is hard because of the irritated bladder thing and still have dissociative problems.. I'm just holding on there and telling myself it'll take as long as it takes!

 

Best wishes for your total recovery:) Picchy


Sufferer of moderate ME/CFS since 2005

Started 20mg Citalopram in March 2008 due to bereavement

Was fine since then with no adverse effects or depression - so decided to taper off

Came off it in March 2014 after a five-month taper, which I thought was a long time

Experienced a month of uncharacteristic depression in April 2014

Two months feeling fine

In June 2014 return of depression then an overnight physical crash leaving me debilitated in July

Tried to take moclobemide at low dose for 2 weeks in July but severe reaction

Housebound since then, ME now severe

No meds taken

Female, 38 years old

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

I would be interested in hearing if anyone else was diagnosed with CFS after going through WD. I know many had CFS prior to WD which made their symptoms worse. I've read the articles saying how CFS and WD have similar symptoms. But my Dr says I got the CFS from the stress of WD. I guess my point is does the fact I got it from WD mean I have a better chance of healing than someone who had it for years prior to WD? Lastly, I've read about success stories of folks who healed from CFS. Many did the diet, the supplements and mild exercise but had no luck. Some did. Some did absolutely nothing and healed. It seems like the common denominator in both CFS and Some cases of WD is brain inflammation. I read inflammation is hard to detect. Maybe with an EEG or ECT scan. What can be done to bring inflammation down? I read a gluten free diet, certain supplements, cardio exercise (hard to do with CFS), anti inflammatory meds or God forbid an anti Deppressant.


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cherry47

Hello Picchy - I really feel for you as I have had that irritable bladder and it is just horrible! This was years ago and ironically, the only thing that would fix it was one of the older class antidepressants!!!!!! Maybe you should get it checked in case it is a bladder infection which feels very similar. Have you got someone who could drop off a sample at the Drs for you?

 

I think the ME and w/d just feed off each other as I also feel unwell all of the time. I am just getting over a cold - the week of the cold wasn't too bad, relatively speaking, but now the body seems to be saying "well I didn't like that AT ALL" and I feel even worse.

 

I am still pretty much housebound (19 months now) and dependant on hubby for driving, shopping, cooking etc. I try to remind myself every day of the things that have improved and to remain positive that it will get better, but new symptoms sometimes make it so hard.

 

BUT WE WILL GET THERE! One day................


Chronic Fatigue Syndrome for 32 years, given AD for this condition alone in 2000

Zoloft 100mg for 15 years, last five of these complained about adverse effects,

unable to tolerate other meds even supplements

Slowly felt sicker, advised by different Dr maybe on ads for too long

Cut back 100 - 50 over 6 months, still getting worse, so stopped over about 6 weeks starting Dec 2014

First month, slow, emotional, useless then POW! Horrendous withdrawal symptoms, completely non-functional

for about five months, slowly started to come back to life and continue with waves and windows, still more bad than good, but bads are less bad, and goods slightly better each time

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

I have both mental and physical fatigue... I am back to having head drops too along with dropping things wobbling core... and possible seizures.. I am thinking it could be complication of multiple chemical sensitivity which from what I read is another forward step for those of use with CF... but I don't know yet I am waiting to get into a mcs clinic maybe they will know more I will report back after I have gone.  

 

At this point the computer makes is making me sick just now so I can't be on too long....

 

peace all


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

http://www.drcourtneycraig.com/blog/lithium-cfs

 

just a bit see the link

 

Neurocognitive Support

Most are familiar with prescribable lithium utilized for the treatment of psychological and major depressive disorders. While potentially effective for mood stabilization in these conditions, doses this large may be highly toxic over the long-term. Several studies have instead looked at smaller, micro doses and neurocognitive benefits.

Possible mechanisms surrounding lithium’s cognitive support include its ability to maintain BDNF levels—the crucial neurotropic product recently found severely depleted in CFS. A cohort of Alzheimer’s patients were given lithium over a 10-week period. At the end of the study, participants had significant increases in BDNF in serum and in the brain (2). Yet another study gave only 300 micrograms of lithium to Alzheimer’s patients over the course of a year which stabilized these patient’s cognitive decline (3).

An additional mechanism of neurocognitive support arise in lithium’s role in the metabolism of the omega-3 fatty acid DHA (4). This fat is crucial for brain health, especially the myelin sheaths of neurons, and reduces neuroinflammation through the induction of cytokines. Finally, lithium provides antioxidant protection via its ability to enhance glutathione-S-transferase enzyme expression in the brain (5).

Lithium’s Role in Methylation

Lithium is a key cofactor in the methylation cycle. Not only does it help transport B12, it also is required for function of the MTR (methionine synthase) enzyme, which recycles homocysteine to methionine. Dr. Yasko believes that in order to maintain healthy B12 levels, lithium levels must also be considered. With increasing loads of B12 such as via intramuscular injection, lithium may become further depleted (6).

further down.... The commonly prescribed high-dose lithium used for psychiatric conditions is in the form of lithium carbonate. Supplemental forms however are in the better tolerable orotate or citrate forms. Tablets and liquid formulations are available in the dispensary to cater to tolerance.

I read another article where a lady was using lithium aspertate something like that word

not saying it works just what I read...


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt
Medication-Induced Mitochondrial Damage

 

one after my own heart cause I think so too.... 

 

http://www.drcourtneycraig.com/blog/2014/11/29/medication-induced-mitochondrial-damage

 

As always more at the link

 

"Damage to mitochondria is understood to play a role in the development of a wide range of seemingly unrelated disorders such as schizophrenia, Alzheimer's, cardiovascular disease, diabetes, and others. Mitochondrial damage is also a hallmark of ME/CFS and Fibromyalgia.

Common causes of mitochondrial dysfunction in ME/CFS and Fibromyalgia are numerous. They include:

  • Dysbiosis
  • Chronic viral infections
  • Metabolic dysfunction (poor insulin control, nutrient depletion)
  • Toxin exposure (metals, mold, other environmental factors)

Another cause of mitochondrial dysfunction that is less frequently mentioned is medication usage. Mitochondrial toxicity testing is NOT required by the FDA before a drug is approved. Medications can hinder mitochondria through direct or indirect mechanisms.

Certain medications interact with mitochondrial DNA and inhibit the creation of protein complexes necessary for ATP production. Other medications block metabolic pathways that interfere with the way fats and carbohydrates are utilized. By indirect means, some medications promote oxidative stress, which damage mitochondria and deplete antioxidants like glutathione. It is believed that many side effects from medications are due to mitochondrial insult.

Some classes of medications are known mitochondrial poisons and are often prescribed for various reasons to ME/CFS and Fibromyalgia patients. Unbeknownst to your doctor (who is not aware of your illness or doesn't understand it as a mitochondrial disease) he or she may be contributing to a major setback in your recovery.

If medication is required, attempting to counteract the deleterious effects with mitochondrial supports is warranted!

THE CULPRITS

All classes of psychotropic drugs have documented toxic mitochondrial effects. Many of which block key enzymes in the electron transport chain of the mitochondria. Statin drugs completely block the enzyme HMG-CoA reductase, which severely inhibits CoQ10 production—a necessary nutrient for mitochondrial function. As another example,acetaminophen is known to be hepatotoxic due to the inability to clear its metabolite during liver detoxification. This is believed to be due to glutathione depletion--an indirect cpnsequence of mitochondrial dysfunction. It is not surprising then, that the antidote for acetaminophen poisoning is N-acetylcysteine (NAC), which increases glutathione.

A specific list of mitochondrial disrupters may look like this:

  • Antidepressants: Amitriptyline, Celexa, Prozac
  • Pain Relievers: Acetaminophen, Voltaren, Naproxen, Aspirin
  • Blood Pressure Medications: Propranolol
  • Cholesterol Medications: Lipitor, Crestor, Zocor
  • Diabetes Medications: Metformin
  • Antibiotics: Erythromycin, Tetracycline
  • Anti-Anxiety Medications: Xanax, Valium
  • Benzodiazepines: Klonopin, Ativan

and more in the posts following this article 


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
btdt

new book on this topic

 

https://www.amazon.ca/Diagnosis-Treatment-Chronic-Fatigue-Syndrome-ebook/dp/B00IC93WJM

 

Diagnosis and Treatment of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: it's mitochondria, not hypochondria!Kindle Edition

 

We have around 3000 'mitochondria' in each and every cell in our bodies. They are the powerhouses of our cells, essential for the production and management of energy at cell level. Dr Sarah Myhill, together with Dr John McLaren Howard of Acumen Laboratories and Dr Norman Booth of Mansfield College Oxford, has spent many years studying the relationship between their malfunction and the commonest problem seen by GPs in the UK - fatigue. Their research findings have been published in three scientific papers in the International Journal of Clinical and Experimental Medicine, in 2009, 2012 and 2013. These studies showed that poor functioning of the mitochondria is the central problem in CFS. Patients with the worst mitochondrial function had the worst fatigue and vice versa. This is solid scientific evidence that CFS is a problem with mitochondria and has allowed the objective measurement of fatigue for the first time. With the publication of the third study, which showed that mitochondrial function tests and symptoms improved in patients who took measures to address their mitochondrial problems, Dr Myhill was ready to write this book. Here she explains the importance of healthy mitochondria, how we can measure their functioning and what we can do to keep them healthy, or restore them to health if problems arise. CFS is all in our cells, not in our minds!

 

 

It would appear that antidepressants would NOT be a good treatment option for CFS given the above information.  By the time they sort out one disorder I have moved on to another disorder... multiple chemical sensitivities supposedly related to fibro and cfs in some way... once able I will look more.

happy reading 

peace all


WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RachelE

Oh, I wish I haven't read this... Is there anyone who have had many of those serious cfs symptoms during their withdrawal for long time (several months) and have recovered? This is so scary time for me, what if i stay this way? i don't even have the strength to brush my hair. :/ 

I am not speaking from personal experience, but a woman named Monica was at least as bad off as you are, reachingforthestars. For two years she couldn't leave her bed to use the bathroom without help! Here is a link to her blogsite. http://beyondmeds.com

While still not fully recovered, she is MUCH better today.


I have been on so many medications since I was 20 and diagnosed as "mentally ill" that I have lost count.

Right now, however I have been taking:

Lamictal 25 mg: I went on it in March for only 13 days, then cold turkeyed off when I thought I was developing a rash because of it. Pretended to go back on it, but didn't. Not the best idea, but I had no way to reduce the dose. Anyhow I had no adverse withdrawal reactions, probably because I was on it for less than 2 weeks.

Abilify 20 mg:  I have been on this for several years. Actually at least half the time I have spent as a meds "consumer" I have been on this nasty pill. I finished tapering off it at the beginning of 2016. Was reinstated during the 4 days I spent in a psych ward in March. Tapered off it again in 10 weeks, from say March 15-June 30. Needless to say this is not exact, but I remember I was off it before July 4 (patriotic holiday in America!) I am doing fine, although I know I may have to wait till Christmas or later to know I am out of the danger zone for withdrawal psychosis. The main thing I notice about being off is that I no longer crave sweets all the time and am losing weight without trying. Good thing since I used to weigh 350 lbs.!

Effexor 150 mg: This is the real trouble-maker. Since I have no other way of tapering I do the best I can by bead counting. I unscrew the gel capsule and count out the tiny micro-capsules or beads inside. This works fairly well with the generic time release version. Only 120 beads to count of almost identical size. Lately I have been "holding" at 20 bead removal due to some major stress in my life. Moving hundreds of miles from my old home and a bout of strep throat that wouldn't respond to antibiotics.  I guess that means I'm on 120 mg of Effexor right now. On October 16 I am going to recommence my taper since I am safely moved and no longer have strep! 

I admit now that I did something stupid. I had trouble opening the extra strength gel capsules containing the beads so I reinstated at the original dose for a week. I know it's not good to play ping pong with my brain, but I could never open the capsules without spilling those microscopic balls all over so I was never sure what dosage I was taking! Thank the LORD that I finally have the old kind again and can safely count out the amount. I am now back on 135 mg and feel somewhat better.

October 30, 2016. I am down to 120 mg effexor. November 27, 2016. Down to 105 mg effexor. December 25, 2016. 90 mg effexor. January 15, 2017. 75 mg effexor. January 21. 82.5 mg effexor. January 23, 90 mg again. Feb. 14, 81.25 mg. Mar. 15, 72.5 mg. Mar. 27, 65 mg.  Apr. 9, 58.75 mg. Apr. 24, 52.5 mg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
picchy

Hello everyone,

 

I can't help noticing folks are reading about CFS/ME while in withdrawal and getting understandably scared. As a long-term sufferer of CFS/ME, can I just clarify that the condition is only diagnosed (assuming the doctor is following the guidelines that is!) in the ABSENCE of any other identifiable cause, and when you also have more than one of the symptoms of the syndrome for at least six months. If the symptoms started in withdrawal, then withdrawal is the cause - and it seems the recovery process can sadly last a few years in some cases (including mine).

 

It will of course be relatively easy to find a doctor who will diagnose you with CFS/ME, given the lack of understanding of both withdrawal and CFS/ME. This could be helpful if you need to obtain benefits or get a sick line from work etc -  but not if you believe you really have another, incurable illness.

 

If you are in withdrawal I just don't think it's helpful reading about CFS/ME - it will only scare you into thinking you have another, new condition.

 

Hang tight!

Picchy


Sufferer of moderate ME/CFS since 2005

Started 20mg Citalopram in March 2008 due to bereavement

Was fine since then with no adverse effects or depression - so decided to taper off

Came off it in March 2014 after a five-month taper, which I thought was a long time

Experienced a month of uncharacteristic depression in April 2014

Two months feeling fine

In June 2014 return of depression then an overnight physical crash leaving me debilitated in July

Tried to take moclobemide at low dose for 2 weeks in July but severe reaction

Housebound since then, ME now severe

No meds taken

Female, 38 years old

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Christian

With all respect Picchy, I beg to differ. CFS (which I have been diagnosed with) is often brought on by stress. I can only speak for myself but the stress I endured from my Lexapro reaction was horrific. The stress drained my cortisol, my magnesium, as well as my testosterone. All are linked to CFS as well as Fibromyalgia. WD is just the source of the stress. Like PTSD can be or trauma. I've read a lot about all of this so I apologize if I seem like a "know it all." Its not my intention. It's just my humble opinion. We can wait for the WD to run its course or we can get tested to see what the damage was. When I waited I got worse. Now I'm treating my symptoms with the care of doctors. And not with psych meds !!


Lexapro: started in 2002 at 10 mgs.

Ambien: started as a as needed sleep aid in 2010.

Quit Lexapro cold turkey in June 20015 due to contributing to low sodium issues.

Restarted Lexapro in late November for a week (only 5 mgs) but quit due to dizziness side effects. Side effects worsened for 3 weeks until

12/24/15: Protracted WD hit, experienced extreme anxiety, insomnia lack of full concentration and social challenges.

Reinstated Lexapro on 1/1/16 at 5 mgs. Increased per Dr to 7.5 MG. Tapered off Lexapro in March 2016.

Started 50MG of Seroquel in late January 2016 for bedtime to help in eliminate Ambien. Tapered off both Seroquel and Ambien in March 2016.

2/14/16: Prescribed both Remeron (15 MG) and Temazapam (15 MG) for sleep. Also use Klonopin and Ambien again in place of Temazapam to avoid addiction. However I did take Temazapam 60 straight days

6/15/16: Stopped use of all benzo's and now use Belsomra 1-2 times a week. Still on 15 MG of Remeron

10/11/16: Off all psych medications

 

After kindling, trying to regain my strength suffering from severe mental and physical fatigue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RachelE

I don't consider myself to have CFIDS or ME in that I wasn't "normal" to begin with, having been drugged so many years on a cocktail from Hades. I read about the condition/s though and have found some tips in getting through the day that I find useful. I don't want or need a doctor's diagnosis--if I could get one. I just find it useful to learn coping skills from people with that disorder so I can apply them to my situation. Unlike "true" ME, I know I will get better and maybe even make a full recovery. But it may take a long, long time. :(


I have been on so many medications since I was 20 and diagnosed as "mentally ill" that I have lost count.

Right now, however I have been taking:

Lamictal 25 mg: I went on it in March for only 13 days, then cold turkeyed off when I thought I was developing a rash because of it. Pretended to go back on it, but didn't. Not the best idea, but I had no way to reduce the dose. Anyhow I had no adverse withdrawal reactions, probably because I was on it for less than 2 weeks.

Abilify 20 mg:  I have been on this for several years. Actually at least half the time I have spent as a meds "consumer" I have been on this nasty pill. I finished tapering off it at the beginning of 2016. Was reinstated during the 4 days I spent in a psych ward in March. Tapered off it again in 10 weeks, from say March 15-June 30. Needless to say this is not exact, but I remember I was off it before July 4 (patriotic holiday in America!) I am doing fine, although I know I may have to wait till Christmas or later to know I am out of the danger zone for withdrawal psychosis. The main thing I notice about being off is that I no longer crave sweets all the time and am losing weight without trying. Good thing since I used to weigh 350 lbs.!

Effexor 150 mg: This is the real trouble-maker. Since I have no other way of tapering I do the best I can by bead counting. I unscrew the gel capsule and count out the tiny micro-capsules or beads inside. This works fairly well with the generic time release version. Only 120 beads to count of almost identical size. Lately I have been "holding" at 20 bead removal due to some major stress in my life. Moving hundreds of miles from my old home and a bout of strep throat that wouldn't respond to antibiotics.  I guess that means I'm on 120 mg of Effexor right now. On October 16 I am going to recommence my taper since I am safely moved and no longer have strep! 

I admit now that I did something stupid. I had trouble opening the extra strength gel capsules containing the beads so I reinstated at the original dose for a week. I know it's not good to play ping pong with my brain, but I could never open the capsules without spilling those microscopic balls all over so I was never sure what dosage I was taking! Thank the LORD that I finally have the old kind again and can safely count out the amount. I am now back on 135 mg and feel somewhat better.

October 30, 2016. I am down to 120 mg effexor. November 27, 2016. Down to 105 mg effexor. December 25, 2016. 90 mg effexor. January 15, 2017. 75 mg effexor. January 21. 82.5 mg effexor. January 23, 90 mg again. Feb. 14, 81.25 mg. Mar. 15, 72.5 mg. Mar. 27, 65 mg.  Apr. 9, 58.75 mg. Apr. 24, 52.5 mg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use Privacy Policy