Zenwind: Quit effexor without knowing withdrawal symptoms. Now having all sorts of symptoms, what should I do now?

[Zenwind]

Hi LexA,

Tow days ago, I went to see my Pdoc.  I thought I couldn't even travel to go because I didn't sleep at all for the last night and couldn't eat almost at all for two days but my doc insisted me to come to see him.  He said he has to see me otherwise he can't give me the right diagnoses.  I took a chance and arrived at his office like a dead person.  I told him Prozac is making me crazy.  Then he asked me about my conditions and kind of analysed each problems explained to me biological facts.  Mental condition is deeply affecting my conditions.  I started to understand many things. It was a trauma when I first had my withdrawal back in Sept. then my brain remembers it causing almost phobia type condition, then it became a repeated symptoms.  It is important to get rid of this pattern.  

Then he told me that I have to trust him and communicate with him to build a trust.  He said we will get through it.  I will recover and will be fine.  After 45 min session, I left his office like a healthy person.  I couldn't believe it.  Since then I am OK.  

 

From yesterday I started to taper Effexor 5 beads with 5 mg of Prozac.  I was fine and did well.  Today I am at 25 beads E. and 5 mg P.  My plan is to go down to 0 beads E in 5 days and increase Prozac to 10 mg.  I might increase Prozac to 10 mg with when Effexor is 15 beads.  

 

For my insomnia and anxiety to go through this plan, we discussed to add very small amount of Klonopin. I told him I didn't want to take it regularly more than a couple of weeks and I wanted very low dose.  We agreed at 0.25 mg of Klonopin at a time.  Last night I took 0.25 mg and for the first time in the past 4 months, I slept through the night.  

 

I am still little tired and have a fear to go outside.  Over 4 months of this trauma definitely developed other psychological negative routine.  I am now trying to watch funny TV shows as a laugh therapy and convince myself to be optimistic.  

 

Now I am determine to go through the bridge plan and see what happens.  

[LexAnger]

Hi Zenwind, thank you for the update! I can relate to what you said being like a dead person as its how I feel right now. But I'm very happy for you that it seems you are surviving this transition and you are feeling good now!!!!! Hope you continue feeling good and the bridge works out for you to the end! Please keep us updated as this can help others for such options/ strategy.

 

As to klonopin, I don't have any knowledge about it. I would be super cautious with any of the new psyc drug. I believe other members here with experience/ knowledge will chime in providing their insight.

[Zenwind]

I have been doing great.  I feel like I am back to the person I used to be.  Today I am at 10 beads and 0.5 mg Prozac.  I take Klonopin 0.25 mg every night and sleeping through the night of about 6-7 hour sleep.  

I hope I will continue this way.  

[LexAnger]

Thanks very much zen wind for the update and soooo happy for you! I hope it continues working great for you! Please update us so we know you are still doing great!

[Zenwind]

Today I tapered off Effexor!!! I took 1.25 ml (0.5 mg) Prozac in the morning and 0.25 Klonopin at night.  

I am still doing great.  No tingling pain on my legs and arms.  Much less tinnitus.   

[LexAnger]

Great!!!!

Kepp going. Looking forward to hearing more great news!

[Zenwind]

Hi LexA,

Thank you so much for giving me positive supports.  I really appreciate it.  My P doctor, Dr. Ahmad wanted me to stay with Prozac 1.25 ml (0.5 mg), no increase.  From my genetic test of AD medication, I have a poor response or slow responds to AD or A psychotic meds which means those meds have to be used very cautiously on me.  And my doctor and I have been coming to a conclusion that I was never diagnosed correctly in the past.  None of the P doc studied my condition to get the right diagnosis.  They just gave me AD like a pain killer.  

 

 Dr. Ahmad and I are still taking a look at what happens with only Prozac 1.25 ml. Eventually we will find the right needs of my condition with the least medication if I need it.  He is a wellness doctor who is going to suggest me with supplements to control my condition.  I am very happy with his approach and communication.  He is really saving my life.  

[LexAnger]

Hi Zenwind, still feel thrilled for you! Before I can talk more, what is the mg of 1.25ml Prozac ?have a great day!

[Zenwind]

1.25 ml of liquid Prozac is equivalent to a half of 10 mg in a cap-cell. 

[Zenwind]

Two days ago I woke up depressed.  I knew it was coming because I was feeling tingling pain on my body the night before.  I can function but having dysphoria and unstable.  Fortunately I had an appointment with Dr. Ahmad and he increased the Prozac to 10 mg. Maybe 5 mg was too little after tapering off Effexor.  

 

After having 2 weeks of normal life, I felt really vulnerable today.  I am trying not to let this neuro-emotion control over me.

HOPE I feel better tomorrow!!!! 

[LexAnger]

I'm sorry Zenwind to hear that.

I remember seeing some information about the equivalent dosage among different ssirs but don't remember where I saw it. I hope others can help you with that.

 

At the meantime, have you already started 10mg? It's a big increase. Doctors only go with minimal available dose for increment but we all know it's best not to take unnecessary high dose for potential adverse reaction, and future longer withdrawal.

 

If you haven't started the 10mg, why not to increase a small amount see how things go. You can always increase more if you feel it's needed.

[LexAnger]

Found it, this provides a detailed strategy for switching to Prozac from other ssirs with equivalent dose information

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1424-healy-2009-halting-ssris-withdrawal-guidelines/?p=13261&hl=prozac&fromsearch=1

[Zenwind]

Prozac 10 mg is the same as Effexor 37.5 mg.  And I asked my doctor about less than 10 mg. but he insisted to go for 10 mg.  Then I was thinking when I was doing really well was Prozac 5 mg + tapering Effexor 30-0 mg that means about Prozac 10 mg.  I need to stabilize with 10 mg first.  I will see what happens tomorrow and let you know.

[LexAnger]

Ok, hope it goes well from there.

[Zenwind]

Hi LexA

I was really depressed today.  It is different from before.  Physically I am more or less fine but mentally numb.  Feeling like a Zonbie. 

The doctor says this is maybe my underlined condition and increase of Prozac will work in a few days.  

I think he should have increased when Effexor hit 0.  I am little angry.  

[LexAnger]

Hi Zenwind, if you just started the 10 mg, today, it may take couple day to feel the effect of the increased dose. Changing dose most time will expose stress to our nervous system and unexpected symptoms can occurs. I would give it a few more days. I heard it takes 4 days for dose changes to take effect. I really hope you will stable soon and maybe you want to hold for a while to allow your brain recover from the recent changes before you make any other changes. Doctors don't really know enough about the whole super complications and indeed nobody knows it all for this very special area. I learned to take major control myself by learning from other here instead of listening to doctors. Try not to panic and make peace with the symptoms now. I don't think it's your underlying condition, you don't have to listen to whatever others say if you don't believe so.

[Zenwind]

LexA I really appreciate your comments in my updates.  Thank you.

Today too I am depressed.  Physically more or less OK but feeling numb, tired, no appetite, no motivation, don't know what to do, feeling like a stone.  It is different from before.  I don't even want to watch TV.  Tomorrow is the 4th day of 10 mg.  I really hope I feel better.  

How do you feel lately LexA? Improving? Wishing both of us and all of us here are healing and stepping towards recovery.   

[LexAnger]

Hi Zenwind, I'm glad you find some comfort talking to each other. I totally understand since I was there before. After 1.5 yr withdrawal experience with the most unexpected, uncomfotable and painful symptoms and learning from others and intensive research, I settled down with a mindset of accepting it with the only hope to get out by slow taper. What I also learned is I have to endure severe symptoms and sometime for long, but whenever I got a good window, I feel all the effort is worthy. You have been going through quite a lot changes lately so it's no surprise you are experiencing various effects, but if you can hold on and stabilize, Prozac is supposed to be easier to taper.

 

I feel I'm seeing some lights getting one good day here and there in the past week. It has been the most insane 6 months since I had severe reaction to the dose increase of lex. I'm still suffering but mainly just physical and the severity is less. My current main symptoms are pain, numb, tight, swelling, needle entire head and upper body, very very uncomfortable. I don't think death or disability anymore, and actually started thinking of a good life maybe after a few years slow taper. One thing I would really like to recommend is, try not to make any changes if its all possible. Situation can be much more hard to handle after the brain is over sensitized by changes. Reading others successfully stories helps a lot with my confidence and positive thinking.

 

I have the dread feelings most of the days in the past 1.5 years. I push myself out as long as my physical allows for daily walk and swim, or just on the floor if I feel too sick.

 

Do you work?

[Zenwind]

Hi LexA,

I was really scared and hesitated to go for a bridge but I decided to do it.  And I haven't regret it yet. I am not sure how long it takes for me to feel better now.  But I am hoping to stabilize my condition with Prozac and go from there.  Effexor is really a drug from hell.

 

I learned many things with Dr. Ahmad and I am still searching what is right about me.  I am not sure what will happen from here but I hope people who see my updates will learn something from my case. When I searched Prozac bridge here, not many people recorded derails of what happened to them in long term.  

[Zenwind]

Hi everyone

I want to tell you my experience with Prozac bridge which is still on going.  

 

I started Prozac bridge to get off Effexor on Dec.28 2014 after debating a lot myself when my doctor strongly suggested to go for it. I added Prozac 1.25ml (0.5 mg) for 10 days of over wrapping period.  On the 7th day, I felt terrible (I think I was having serotonin syndrome. My doctor kept telling me to wait but he should have told me to start taper on the 7th day )

 

When I finally started to taper  Effexor 5 beads everyday, my condition became great as normal life. On January 13, I got off Effexor.  Then I was still doing well with Prozac 1.25 ml (0.5 mg) and doctor didn't increase the dosage.  

 

After a week, I started to feel .  Then doctor increased Prozac to 10 mg on Jan 20.  

 

It's been 10 days I am still depressed and extremely tired and unstable.  Physical WD symptoms I used to have subsided a lot but now depression took over.  Doctor says Prozac hasn't fully kicked in and I have two choices- 1. wait few more days to see if Prozac stabilizes it or 2. change with mood stabilizer.   I don't want to mess up with my NS with other medications so I am going to stay with Prozac for few more days to see what happens.

 

I feel my condition is slightly better everyday.  But I am confused of what to believe now. 

 

If you have any experiences, suggestions, and/or encouragement, I really appreciate it.  

 

Thanks

[Zenwind]

Above my post in the middle, the word was missing.  

 

"After a week, I started to feel depressed and unstable " Then doctor increase Prozac to 10 mg on Jan 20.

[dalsaan]

Hi Zenwind,

 

I haven't done the bridge but my advice to you is just stay put don't make any more changes. Your system has been through a lot. Given depressive symptoms kicked in so soon after making significant changes this is withdrawal and signs of a nervous system distress. Give it time to adjust and settle.

 

I am very concerned that you and your doctor are approaching this like you have a mental illness that can be fixed by finding the right drug. You have an adjustment condition as a result of changing medications that your brain had adapted to. You need to be gentle on your system and allow it to slowly respond to changes you make

 

I recommend you read back through this thread and all the material on what is withdrawal.

 

Don't look for the quick fix of more Prozac or a mood stabiliser

 

Dalsaan

[Altostrata]

i would give the 10mg Prozac quite a bit more time, not make any changes, and not add any other drugs.

[Zenwind]

Thank you so much for the quick responses.

Alto, I agree with you.  I will stay with current dosage for a while.  

I feel physically so much better than when Effexor was in my system, giving a lot more palpitations which disabled me to do any thing.

 

I can feel that I am very slightly stable everyday.  I need a lot of patience.  It's tough. 

[Zenwind]

I was on Prozac 10 mg for over two weeks and I was getting terrible reactions.  I was like a Zombie, had extreme fatiegue, extreme headaches and depression. It was not tolerable.  Then Dr. Ahmad convinced me to change to Wellbutrin 100 mg. about a week ago.   Now I don't have extreme fatigue and headaches but deep suicidal depression(never had this before) , no energy .  I am devastated.  He is a good doctor and recommended here, I followed his instruction because he told me that if I didn't follow his instruction, I was preventing him to treat me. I had two good days with Wellbutrin.  I am so confused.  

I am updating my condition.  

[Zenwind]

I searched Dr. Samoon in SA and found around Feb 2014, John saw him and didn't like him.  And few people criticized that he doesn't know withdrawal amd he should be off the list.  I should have found these posts before I started to see him.  

I saw him today. 

I told him that I want to taper the meds not going from one to another.  

He told me "  But Prozac was just to taper off Effexor and you have no more withdrawal. you couldn't tolerate even low dose of  Prozac and got so depressed.  your next step is to go for Wellbutrin XR 150 to stabilize and taper or Lamictal.  

 

Yes I couldn't tolerate Prozac.  I was like a robot or zombie.  Now since I am already on Wellbutrin 100mg, I am thinking to stabilize it and taper.  Please give me your opinion.  

[Altostrata]

Zenwind, it sounds to me like perhaps 10mg Prozac was too much for you. One option would have been to take less Prozac.

 

Did you ask Dr. Samoon for something else?

 

If Wellbutrin is helping, you might stay on that and give it a chance. I think we mentioned before that there's no simple pill that's going to immediately fix you.

 

No one, including me or Dr. Samoon, knows what will work.

[Zenwind]

Alto,

When my condition was so bad with Prozac, Dr. told me to go up the dose to 15 mg or to change to Wellbutrin.  I took 15 mg for three days and I became more like a Zombie with depression.  Then Dr. said it's time to change to Wellbutrin. That was the best option for me.   

 

At that point, I should have posted here to ask for your opinion.  I could have reduced the Prozac to see how I would feel.  You are right No one knows what happens and what is the best.  I think of many things "If I did or didn't do..."  and I blame myself for being so weak and helpless to handle this situation.  Especially when I am desperate, I totally lose my integrity then confused, worried, inpatient, and traumatized. .  I am also feeling so bad for my daughter to see me like this for such a long time.

 

Now I am on Wellbutrin sr 100.  and want to wait until my body and brain feels OK with it because I still have terrible waves with headaches, rushing thoughts of worries and anxiety.  

Do you think I could go up to Wellbutrin 150 Xl as my Dr.s instruction?  If you could give me your opinion, I appreciate it.  

[Altostrata]

I don't know, Zenwind. Did 100mg Wellbutrin make you feel better or worse? That's the deciding factor.

 

More Wellbutrin is likely to be more stimulating. Is this what your body needs?

[Zenwind]

Alto,

My body feels better with Wellbutrin SR100mg than Prozac 10-15 mg. But mentally very weak and depressed with much less sustainability of doing things.  I feel like I have no back bone and I can't walk more than 10 mins.  I get extreme fatigue and tension on my head.  I also have tinnitus, needle pain on my arms and legs as when I was Effexor.  I keep thinking I should have reduced Prozac to 7.5 mg.  Maybe I could tolerate then.  

 

I don't know if it's good to stay with 100mg which I am still resisting to go up to 200 or XL 150 as my doctor's instruction. In your topic of Wellbutrin, you said Wellbutrin is not for WD, it agitates the symptoms. I am now really confused what to do.  I know it's not good to change.  Where should I go from here?   

[Zenwind]

Also I have been on klonopin 0.25 mg at night for about 7 weeks.  I want to taper it off 10 % every 2 days.  Is it a good time to start? 

[Zenwind]

correction above post 

10% every 1-2 weeks