Progress! What withdrawal symptoms have gone away for you?

[oskcajga]

I remember (with 12 step help) healing like this: Holy "beeeep". I feel ridiculously and criminally amazballs. I looked around for the proverbial other shoe - to drop on my head...for someone to tell me I am behaving manically to the degree I needed to be in hospital...for the feeling to run off with the circus.

 

I have my challenges, though many of my posts do not reflect it all that often. 

 

I also find being of service to those struggling in a place I have been in and overcame to be a great healer for more than just myself, but esp to see where I was...and now am....and heading. 

 

 

This is honestly how I predict it will feel once I've recovered from this nerve damage.  I'll feel too good, like I've encountered a manic phase or something, while in reality this is just how many people feel every single day.  Currently, I've been so extremely depersonalized and damaged from my former state for so long, it will feel strange to not want to die every single day.  I used to look to the future as a bright and amazing thing that will be enjoyable and worthwhile, and I think that will someday come back.    I've had a couple of extremely short windows where I felt like this for a minute or two at a time, but nothing much since then - but during the windows I felt like all of a sudden all of my mental functions flooded back into my brain, and it was quite overwhelming.  I just felt like I had so much energy, and that all my limbs and face and everything felt like "mine", not like a part of my body that's hanging on like a chunk of dead weight.

 

I remember feeling good most of the time, and that life consisted of "pleasurable and less pleasurable things", but everything was pleasant and meaningful.  It's been a long time since I've felt like that, but I have hope that when it does come I'll be a much more mature and wise person that will not squader away my time and take much more advantage of my time than ever before.

 

Good post.

[manymoretodays]

I know.  Time keeps flying by and I keep going through these repetitive cycles.......at least much less intense but still.  Wish we could stop the clocks for a few weeks or something.  Currently obsessing again on the state of my nest......and yard.......and car.  But can't make a plan because I never know what the next day will bring and I feel broke.  I mean I don't want to spend any savings.  And don't know how to do stuff like I used to........like hire someone to do anything.

 

I did practice idle conversation while out and did just fine.  The monastery is telling me just to forget about repairs and fix ups right now and go out more.  Yah, yah.....I will check the car ASAP but can put air in the low tire and pour in more oil in the meantime.

 

Trying to stay in the "right now".  Turquoise is a nice color and maybe more rain soon.  It's good not to feel driven/urgent about anything.........but then it hits again......just not as bad.  Like "hello driven/urgent......nice to see you again.......sorry you can not stay around for tea or anything".    Something I read on beyondmeds and oh.....there is a good "f--k you kind of brief meditation for anger".  At least I think it was about that.

 

I had a holy "beeeeep" couple of hours or more yesterday.  I feel like I kind of lost my enthusiasm and talked myself out of it today but it is probably more complicated than that.   Or maybe not?

[apace41]

This was sent to me by one of our members who asked me to post it.  It was written in the context of benzo withdrawal, but I believe it is equally applicable to the healing process of AD withdrawal (or, as the author puts it, "recovery").  This is very uplifting at least it was for me.  It is long but, in my view, worth it.

 

 

This will hopefully be an encouraging email to make you feel SAFE and ENCOURAGED.

As some of you may know, my degrees are in speech-language pathology (B.A and M.S.)
As part of my Masters study, a big portion of my classes were in neuroanatomy and physiology. 
I learned firsthand how to look at a person who had just undergone a stroke or brain injury and read the symptoms, the radiology reports, the doctor's notes,  and based on those symptoms, to form an image in my mind of what was affected in the brain injury - as well as how to formulate a treatment plan to help that person rehabilitate. For a therapist in a hospital, it is much more than "speech and language". It is about reteaching how to swallow, eat,  rebuilding memory, rebuilding concentation and attention, rebuilding focus, rebuilding executive functioning skills (planning and acting on a plan) -pretty much ANYTHING that is involved in "thinking" that helps you get OUT of a coma, OUT of a hospital, and back to life, work, and school.  

I had NO idea I would ever personally undergo a brain injury.  But insomuch as I have now indeed endured one, I often laid there in waves and attempted to "analyze and decipher" what was happening in my brain as I healed. I thought you all might like to read this. It gives potential answers to all the "WHY?" questions we have about what is happening to us mentally.

First of all, a TRUTH to accept is that WE HEAL.  I have seen people emerge from comas who cannot remember who they are - HEAL. 
They can't remember how to walk (we do).
They can't write their names (we can).
They cannot tell you the year or the president (I was SO bad I was unsure of this at times, but generally, I was oriented to this).
They often cannot remember family members (we can -our D/R can be hideous, but we remember them). 
THEY have to work through many hours of therapy to heal. But most of them do - and from TRAUMATIC PHYSICAL brain trauma that can tear tissue and tear nerves. 
We have none of that. We don't have to undergo therapy. We simply have to wait.

Most of us, me included, didn't expect the temporary "brain injury" we got when jumping off benzos.
But I am starting to realize through my own experience and my educational background, that there is a PURPOSE in every symptom we have.  I have had months and months to analyze what is likely going on in the brain at a gross level - and I want to attempt to explain certain symptoms in a way that we can visualize - so that they are less "scary" and more "telling" of the healing that is happening.

First off - let's start with GABA and Glutamate. Most of you may know how this works by this point. But for those that don't, we have a huge nervous system of millions of nerves (neurons).  They don't "touch" each other. They are separated by a tiny space in between. However, they communicate via chemicals. The 2 MAIN chemicals in the entire nervous system are the BIG GUNS.  They are GABA and Glutamate. They are BOTH at work at ALL times in the CNS.  It isn't like one is working and then the other is working. They are BOTH ALWAYS working in tandem to control every aspect of movement, sensation  - everything. They take the incoming information and appropriately pass it along - they "trim up" the information appropriately so that we can process it.  They are like the steel structure of a building.  The entire building needs a steel structure to stand.  

GABA is inihibitory.  If a nerve releases GABA - it is to Inhibit function - this could be to "slow it down" or it could be to "limit the sensory input" so that we can process it.  In the same way, GABA might be released to help "steady" your hand while doing something like painting a very detailed painting.  GABA "shores up" movements to make them more fluid.   That's just in a nutshell. Of COURSE it does a lot more than this, but the idea is that GABA is present in the ENTIRE CNS and ALWAYS working to balance every sensation, movement, etc.

Likewise, Glutamate is the balance to GABA. It is the "excitatory" transmitter. It fires to speed things up - to initiate action - to make things "go".  There's a lot more to it, but Glutamate is kinda the opposite of GABA.   

BOTH are required to work at all times.  Neurons are ALL ALWAYS firing off GABA and Glutamate on a endless cycle all throughout the nervous system. It's quite amazing really.

What does a benzo do?  If a person is anxious - they may be so stressed that they cannot overcome a very traumatic event or anxious situation.  If a doctor prescribes a benzo - the benzo comes in and sorta "holds the door open" for ALL the GABA in the system to FLOOD into the nerves - even when that is not what the nerves would actually want to occur. The immediate effect is that EVERYTHING ni the body SLOWS DOWN and is inhibited. This might be helpful during surgery, for anesthesia, for a seizure disorder.  Yes - the benzo - by definition - will act on GABA and "slow everything down".  And yes - the net effect of this is that a person may feel drowsy, calm, less anxious... everything is being inhibited.    And in general, taking a benzo for "one day"  is okay. When the benzo is gone, the body just reverts back to regular operation. 
HOWEVER, if a person takes a benzo day after day,  while indeed the person feels less anxious, the body begins to realize that it cannot DO the things it needs to do in this very slowed-down neuron state. It cannot make hormones. It cannot create enzymes. It cannot digest correctly. It cannot keep a heart going efficiently. It cannot get enough oxygen- and on and on. The body NEEDS to run at "normal" speed - not this "inhibited speed" all slowed down.  
But what can the body do? It cannot "remove the benzo" from the system. The only choice the body has to maintain a regular speed is to do two things ..  It can TURN OFF it's own GABA receptors - thereby rendering those benzos unable to affect the GABA in the system. And it can grow MORE excitatory Glutamate receptors to counteract the slow-down.  And that's kinda exactly what happens....

Only - this isn't true balance either.  The body does the best it can - but over time, things begin to suffer.  The body cannot make enough serotonin in this state. Or dopamine. Some things get made in excess - and other things do not get made enough!  During this time, a person may not be aware this is all going on. He may not be able to perceive any difference. But ONE day - the person may wake up sad - or not sleeping well - or unable to remember things fully - or his vision doesn't look right....and it becomes apparent the person has "hit tolerance".  The body is taking the same amount of drug -but try as it might, it just cannot overcome what has occured. It can take weeks, months or years to hit tolerance. Some people do and some don't before trying to get off benzos.  (I did. - it took me 9 months to hit tolerance.  But it was fast.  Once I hit it, I could notsleep more than 6 hours on all that klonopin AND Ambien! I couldn't remember things last week. I was crying all the time... something was wrong.)

The process to reverse this takes a while.  GABA receptors have to UPregulate and effectively "reopen" or "grow back".  Glutamate receptors must DOWNregulate, or effectively "turn off" or "prune back".  And IN this mix, all the smaller monoamines (neurotransmitters like serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine) must somehow find a way to synthesize in the mix.  Through weeks and months the body is rebuildling millions of neurons, and changing pathways, rebuilding GABA, downregulating Glutamate, rebuilding serotonin, rebuilding dopamine, rebuilding norepinephrine.  And ALL the enzymes and hormones that need to be made are attempting to be made while this is going on.  Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.  
And just like the Twin Towers- it's possible - but the buiding is a major effort -and it takes a good year or more sometimes. 
(Now look at the new Tower that stands at Ground Zero!  It's taller, stronger, and a symbol of freedom.  JUST like you will be! )

So - okay - what is happening in that chaos?  What parts of the brain are responsible for these symptoms?  

Now, I don't "know" the following based on research, because not enough research has been done yet  - but based on my studies in neuroanatomy and my own withdrawal experiences, here is how I have analyzed what is "happening" during wave symptoms. Remember, I have had to look at radiology reports of brain damage and estimate what a patient might present with - so this is very similar. Instead of a radiology report showing me what has been damaged, I'm using my own brain symptoms to surmise what is going on....

Let me first list brain structures and their functions. This will help you understand where things happen in the brain and when symptoms occur, what may be happening.

BRAIN STRUCTURES 
- amygdala  - This is the FEAR center in the brain. It's a tiny part in the middle of your brain. Fear is protective and it's GREAT if you need to assess something that is dangerous and to ACT  - like if a rabid dog were chasing you. - but it's hard in recoveyr when it's all you feel for months! But the FEAR is not truly in your MIND. It's in your BRAIN.  There is too much glutamate acting here in the amygdala and not enough GABA. So the nerves are firing off in the fear center when nothing scary is really there in your environment.  It is normal for that to happen given the circumstance physiologically. But it feels awful, doesn't it?  I know.  But it's just a brain structure. This can account for fear, agoraphobia, fear of water, fear of anything.  It's not that you're really "scared" of the moon - it's that you're in almost constant fear because this brain structure is healing. The glutamate is pruning back. The GABA receptors are opening back up.  It may or may not continue for awhile. It will abate. Then come back. But eventually, the brain will get it right.  

-Hippocampus - This is the "memory" center of the brain. It ties in old memories to emotions.  The same thing is happening here that is happening in the amygdala with GABA and Glutamate. So - voila. You get intrusive memories from ALL times in your life.  It's wild and wicked and wooly. But it can't hurt you. And if you can learn to visualize this as what is happening - then you can learn to be objective and realize it's normal.  And like the amygdala - it will come and go and frustrate you, but it will go away when the physiology is restored.

Hypothalamus This is the structure that is responsible for regulating body temperature. In early withdrawal, my body temperature would drop to 96 degrees in waves! Then 3 hours later, it would return to normal. I'd literally freeze in terror in bed for hours.  I am sure it is more complicated that JUST the hypothalamus, but I could picture this part of my brain retuning and restructuring, and it was less scary that way. 

The following structures in the brain are part of the "gray matter" or the "cortex "and what we consider to be the "higher brain"- the thinking and processing parts. 

Frontal Lobe This is the part of the brain behind the front of the skull. It is responsible for planning things. For making decisions. For inhibiting emotions appropriately.  It is the part of the brain you need if you want to make a sandwich and need to get out the ingredients and actually make the sandwich. I have seen people with brain injury be able to TELL you how to make a sandwich - but when they are standing there in front of all the ingredients, they cannot actually move to act to make it! They have frontal lobe damage. They can TELL someone how to make it. But they cannot themselves initiate doing it! As you can imagine, with therapy, and time to heal, this goes away. And we are a lot like this - but it goes away for us, too.  I could not organize my children't toys just 4 months ago.  Not a simple room of toys. I didn't know where to start and I literally could not mentally do it. I imagine this is partly why.  No frontal lobe GABA. And too much Glutamate.   But now, check out this post I"m typing.  Obviously that changed. 
This calms down and these things come back. 

Occipital Lobe This is the vision center. t's at the back of your skull.   In recovery, my nerves have been all wacked here. I see things as too bright - possible due to this lobe - and/or the actual visual nerves in the eyes.  But no doubt people "see things" that aren't there.  Vision is distorted. Things go blurry.  Colors are totally off.Brightness is off.  There are a hundred symptoms possible in vision alone!  But again - it's a matter of time.

Vestibular System This is the system of semi-circular canals in the inner ear that are responsible for making you feel balanced in space.  When this is "off" or damaged temporarily, you feel dizzy. Oh man, was I dizzy. Early off - I felt like I lived in a funhouse.  Over time, a combination of this vestibular system and my damaged visual system made things look like they were "leaning". To this day, one eye sees things "correctly" and the other eye sees things as SLIGHTLY leaning. And it's not that the eye itself is seeing them that way.  The healing vestibular system is working WITH the eye to "tell" the brain that that object looks like it is "moving left-wards" or "leaning". But it isn't.  In waves, this can happen bad - and then be GONE - poof - in a window. This is just the vestibular system healing. It's gotten WAY better. 

Temporal Lobe  These lobes are on the side of your brain on each side near your ear. It makes up the whole left and ride side of your brain.  This is where auditory information is processed, including hearnig itself, but also the "Meaning" of what we are hearing, as well as part of speech and language, emotion, and buncha other stuff.  In early recovery, someone was talking to me and I couldn't tell you what they said past the first sentence.  My auditory processing was ALL messed up.  I couldn't picture what a person was saying to me in real time - and by the time I caught up to them, I was lost and they were talking about something else! Also - When I was laying there in bed, I could "hear" things that weren't there in the noise of my box fan. I'd hear the fan blowing -but I also "heard" like sickening circus music. I believe this is because there is noise coming into my ear - but my brain cannot adequately "prune" what it is hearing at differnet frequecies because there is not enough GABA to inhibit it to create something meaninful.  There was all this "noise" and my brain was just firing off glutamate.  So instead of actually "processing" the noise - it was firing off ideas about what it was hearing - and they were ALL wrong.  I would be hearing what sounded like circus music - and at the same time, my poor brain was looking through my hippocampus to find all the memories I ever had of being at the circus - and then I'm reliving those memories- and at the same time, my amygdala is getting fired upon - so I'm in fear. So I'm a quivering mess of a person laying in the bed hearing and seeing things and remembering times in my childhood and scared to pieces.  Seriously? Yes - I felt crazy. But not in my MIND.  It was my BRAIN.  It's the BRAIN.  And it's normal. The structures in the brain are "obligated" to work this way.

That brings me to my next point... WHY do all of us in benzo recovery have generally the same symptoms? Well - it may make you feel calmer to realize that our brain structures are NOT broken. They are doing EXACTLY what they are supposed to do under the circumstances.  And all of our perceptions of what we are seeing, feeling, hearing- are normal because the parts of our brains that are firing off are doing so because a) They still DO work. They work just as they were intended to. c) They are actually healing as all this firing is going on.  

Why the depression and anxiety? It's so complicated, but this WHOLE system is interdependent. At that SAME time as ALL this stuff is going on, the entire body is trying to heal in every place GABA and Glutamate naturally act (uh - and that would be - EVERYWHERE).
The intestines, stomach, eye balls, skin, toenails - seriously - where do we NOT have nerves?  
Anything we didn't have as a pre-existing condition is fair game for being affected by the recovery that takes place.  
This includes the body's own ability to make serotonin that is required to feel "balanced" and "happy". And you guessed it. This is not being made very efficiently in a building that is under major construction. So - you may get a day or so of feeling good - and then - boom - that's gone until you can make enough serotonin.
Oh - and by the way - serotonin HELPS TELL THE NERVES WHEN TO RELEASE GABA AND GLUTAMATE! Ha! 
So on top of needing GABA to make serotonin, you need serotonin to regulate the release of GABA into the system!  
How much more interconnected can you get?  God - it's a wonder it knows how to heal at all!  But it does!  Amazing to me, really.

This is just some limited information to give an idea of what is going on in neurophysiology.  Obviously this is very cursory and not super detailed. But there is a bigger point here than "what parts of the brain are affected".  
The point REALLY is - IF  YOU KNOW that symptoms are tied to parts of a NORMAL brain under reconstruction, then you can begin to rest a little more easy in your mind that under the circumstances, the symptoms themselves are a GOOD sign.  
Without intrusive memories - as awful as they are - especially when mixed with fear - but without them, your memory itself would not heal.  It IS healing - and when you are having intrusives, try to think of it that way.  Tap your finger to your temple and say to yourself, "I know what this is. This is my hippocampus healing! Ha!" Because it IS.  And if it were NOT healing, you would not be having those symptoms.  ANY part of the brain or body that needs to heal is going to "experience" something in the form of symptoms - and you are going to notice that. But it is part of  process that is inevitably returning to the balance that it could not achieve while we were still putting those pills in our mouths.  (And if you're tapering, this is still happening - just likely with less trauma than with what happened to me when I cold-turkeyed.)

So - when you have symptoms - know that symptoms themselves are a way for you to know that healing is taking place.

And finally - realize that the DRUG is GONE.  This is withdrawal - yes - okay -we call it withdrawal -  but it's really "recovery".
The benzos are gone. The "evil drug" is no longer there.  The symptoms that are left are not the "enemy". That's our brains doing the EXACT right thing. What's happening to our brain at this point is not the "benzo beast"  It's OUR BRAIN recovering.
Not to degrade anyone who calls it the benzo beast  - I get that. But just so you know - you're not really fighting a beast.
You don't even need to fight it.  Just wait it out. All that reconstruction is happening on your building. 
And soon - the frame will be back standing, stronger than before. The furniture will be inside. The elevators will go all the way up to the top again.   And the people can come and go and work like a well-oiled machine.  
Don't feel you need to fight the recontruction. It's just healing. And all that is happening to us is a sign of that.

Hope this helps somebody a little - or maybe a family member.  

And if you ARE a family member, please realize that those of us in recovery are no more in control of how we feel or what we experience than people who have undergone brain trauma in a car accident. Please be patient with us, because our brains are healing and we are in the process of reconstruction - and our function is temporarily enabled, then disabled, then enabled, then disabled again.  And that is totally normal and expected.  We can no more help that than a person can "want" to wake up out of a coma. It happens when the brain is able - and not out of sheer will.  But it does happen. So please stand by us and say loving things and reassure us every day. Notice our improvements and tell us what they are.  Encourage us when we feel good.  And when we don't, just hold us and hug us and tell us it will be okay.  Anything you would say or do for a family member that had had a car accident and a brain injury - please do that for us.  And be patient... we are getting there. 



ADDENDUM

 I got a great PM from a buddy asking "What about the physical symptoms of pain?" - and think it deserves some theoretical attention.

I want to take some time to add some theories about PAIN and physical symptoms such as burning, akathisia, and tingling, prickling, and things that happen during recovery of this nature.

I will also add this as an addendum to the original post on page 1. 

First off, let it be said that I can only "theorize" as to this, - I am not a doctor.  But I DO think logical theories are helpful because they give us a story and mindful logic to cope with in the MEANTIME as we are going through this.

So these are multiple sources of information that I'm tying together - some are from nerve regeneration, and some are from what we know about "how the brain works".  And some or ALL of this is likely going on when it comes to pain and skin/muscle sensations:

First off - I think a good quote comes from a Plastic Surgery practice that has published things on "nerve regeneration after injury".  

The quote follows:

"The usual events associated with normal nerve regeneration can be painful. As the regenerating ends of the nerve, called sprouts, travel, they make contact with each other and with structural proteins. The neural impulses generated by this activity may be interpreted by your brain as pain. It should be expected that for the time period associated with nerve regeneration there may be pain sufficient to need therapy and/or pain medication. Just understanding that this is expected to occur, and is "good pain'; or pain for a good reason, is enough to help many people adjust to its presence.  This condition is not just one of pain, but is associated with over activity of the sympathetic nervous system, so that the area of pain is a different color, like pink or purple, and is usually a different temperature, like cooler, than the surrounding non-painful skin."  http://www.riversongplasticsurgery.com/pdfs/nerve_injury_nerve_reconstruction_recovery.pdf

Well- this article isn't talking about "benzo - related nerve damage. It's talking about nerve damage caused by physical trauma of crushing, cutting, or compressing nerves. But what can we glean from it nonetheless?

We can assume that if the sympathetic nervous system is involved in the presence of pain related to healing nerves - AND IT IS- that it is also NORMAL for us to have pain as we are undergoing healing. 

When I was in earliest recovery, I would often get out of the shower and have pink spots all over my feet and my abdomen. At first they were bright pink for about 2 months - and then they faded out and I don't have them anymore.  I have no idea what they were - but they were NOT there 12 days prior to my rapid taper - and then they showed up.  The spots weren't symmetrical - they followed no pattern, but they were alway in the same place on my skin.  And only after getting out of the shower.  It is easy to see how the nervous system could be involved in skin redness, irritation, and weird feelings associated with recovery.

Likewise, throughout recovery, I've had and continue to have cooling, burning, prickling and occasional stabbing sensations. I've had it feel like my skin was "wet" when there was no water on it.  Again, though. This is all normal - and like the quote says above.."Just understanding that this is expected to occur, and is "good pain'; or pain for a good reason, is enough to help many people adjust to its presence."  It doesn't make the pain FEEL any better in the moment, but it does help us not to become anxious about it. It's normal.  And it's a sign of healing.

What about akathisia?
Well  - from the reading, the exact cause of akathisia is not 100% conclusive, but it seems to be related to dopaminergic and/or noradrenergic activity in the brain  (dopamine and norepinephrine or noradrenaline as it is also called). These are just neurotransmitters - and it doesn't look (to me) to be exactly conclusive WHY this happens - but akathisia can happen after the use of many psychoactive drugs- not just benzos - and likely because anything that alters brain chemistry can alter dopemine and norepinephrine. So - okay. That makes sense.  We all took "brain altering" drugs - and now some of us have akathisia.  Guess what?  It seems pretty normal!  It's not fun. But it's normal.  And it can come and go and then go away eventually.  For me, I didn't get akathisia at all until month 8. It was a surprise.  It was intense and awful. But it passed in a few weeks. Since then, I have had it off and on - but not to that degree.  And now - it's mostly just annoying.  Something as simple as a good hard cry in the bathtub can COMPLETELY remove it at times.  And other times, I just have to wait for a wave to pass. But all in all, from all this information - it's normal. And the fact that it's coming and going and I'm getting hit here and there - it's a sign that the wheels are turning up there in the noggin - and things are shifting and attempting to rebalance.  So if we can keep that quote in mind - it's normal - and while the sensation itself is very uncomfortable - if not painful - it can be regarded as a "good pain" if we are able to recognize that our feeling it means we have a brain and nerves that are regaining their abilities to function. 

Likewise, as a scab heals over a wound, the new skin formin underneath can become "itchy". Why does this occur? Why does a scab itch?

"The itch of a healing wound is caused by the growth of new cells underneath the old scab. New skin cells would be growing underneath, and as they form a new layer of skin, then the scab becomes more tightly stretched over this zone of activity. This can make it feel itchy. The itch sensation for burn survivors may be a tingling feeling caused by nerves re-growing, or from dry skin caused by the lack of natural oil production since oil glands may have been damaged or destroyed by the burn. As the nerves grow and start to receive and send messages, they may create that itchy feeling. The skin in this area will be a lot less thick than everywhere else, so these new nerve cells will be under a lot more pressure. Itching is a sign of healing." (Mayo Clinic)

As we can surmise, the umpteen bajillion sensation we have going on are not 100% conclusive in their origins....HOWEVER...
There IS a trend.

From what it seems like from all the reading... 
NERVE REGENERATION CAN CAUSE UNPLEASANT SENSATIONS. As counterintuitive as it is,  HEALING CAN FEEL LIKE HURT. 
But it's NOT further hurt or damage. It's the REVERSAL of damage.  

Um  - yeah - okay. Great - but what do I DO about it.

Pretty much the things that I have discovered that help through this healing are to "CONFUSE" the nerves as much as possible, IF possible.  
What? Confuse the nerves? 

You know how you get a cut or an insect bite and you immediately press on it to make it feel less painful? What you are doing when you press or squeeze the area is "desensitizing' the entire skin region of the cut by applying pressure to ALL the nerves in the area. That way, the ONE sensation of pain from the cut isn't the only thing your brain is feeling.  The pressure from pushing down on  ALL the nerves in the area helps to send multiple sensation to the brain to "counteract" the pain sensation.  And it works.
Similarly, other things can help "confuse" nerves:
-Heat
-Cold
-Deep Pressure
- Massage
-creams like "Icy Hot" with menthol 

All of these things have helped me cope in recovery.

Let me take it one by one:

Heat: I took and STILL take hot baths almost every day. In the peak of akathisia, I lived in the tub.   As hot as I could stand it really helped me. All the heat was "overregistering" in my brain and I was unable to feel the akathisia as much when in the tub. It was confusing the nerve signal and it was temporary relief.  I hated those days. But I got through them.  Likewise, a heating pad for pain was my friend a lot of the time.  

-Cold -  I used a cold washcloth on burning skin - and on my face and hands - and kept dipping it in ice water and applying it.  This is an easy one, but it helped. I had a wave with 3 days of "fireface" last month and all I could do was apply the washcloth, lay there and think about how "this is healing" and keep going. But the wave passed.

Deep Pressure  I use a 15 pound weighted blanket to sleep. I have for YEARS. I ordered it online. It has many pockets with little plastic balls equally distributed to create a very heavy blanket that creates "deep pressure". This kind of pressure is calming for anyone's nervous system. Occupational Therapists use it for children with autism, but people with anxiety can benefit from sleeping with one. And in recovery, I was glad to have it.  I used it often together with a heating pad.  It took the edge off just long enough.  

Massage This one CAN be helpful - but sometimes not.  I used to ask my husband just to "press down" on my head or my legs.  Just press there. Don't rub.  My skin hurt too much to rub, but the deep pressure from pressing was helpful. Other times, the actual massage was a help for sore muscles.  I was too agoraphobic to schedule a REAL massage. LOL. But just this help from my family was nice to have.

Creams You're going to laugh, but there was a day that I put Vick's VapoRub on my face because my face was so HOT!  I figured if this is safe for my baby's skin, it's probably okay to try it on my face.  It worked! Oh man - my face felt SO good all day.  I used that for a few days until the wave passed.  I have also tried "Icy Hot" on my back when it was sore.  Things like this work on the same principal to "confuse the nerves".  If your nerves are too busy feeling the heat/cool of menthol, they cannot simultaneously feel "pain". So for a short time, the pain is not "felt" even though the "soreness" is technically still there.

All of these are ways I have coped.  I'm sure there are others you guys have used!! 

The broad idea here is that 
1) Healing is happening.
2) The sensations that feel like injury are NOT injury. They are the CORRECTION of nerve injury.  They just "fire off" as they heal.
3) We can use some things to cope.
4) It's going away in time. 

I know this is not a "fix" to the feelings.  There is nothing anyone could say to me while I was IN pain that made the PAIN better.  All I could do was cope and cry and try to get through it.  But knowing it's normal and that I'm not getting worse; I'm getting better - is always something I benefit from knowing.  

I still get these symptoms - and I'll be SOOOOOO glad when they are gone.
 

Edited September 20, 2018 by ChessieCat
corrected spelling error

[AprilShowers]

Wow. That's great. 

[apace41]

For those not inclined to read the entire article, and to whet the appetite of those who might be convinced to do so  here is a succinct summary (from the conclusion):

 

 

_{The broad idea here is that} 

_{1) Healing is happening.}

_{2) The sensations that feel like injury are NOT injury. They are the CORRECTION of nerve injury.  They just "fire off" as they heal.}

_{3) We can use some things to cope.}

<sub>4) It's going away in time. 

I know this is not a "fix" to the feelings.  There is nothing anyone could say to me while I was IN pain that made the PAIN better.  All I could do was cope and cry and try to get through it.  But knowing it's normal and that I'm not getting worse; I'm getting better - is always something I benefit from knowing.</sub>  

 

 

Best,

 

Andy

[oskcajga]

Great find.

[ChessieCat]

Brilliant, easy to understand and extremely helpful.

 

Thank you!!!

CC

[KarenB]

Thanks for the summary, it's worth remembering those basic yet very true things.  So much hope in them.

[bromor]

Great, well written article! Full of hope for healing

[nz11]

I seem to recall seeing that at prior place its seems very  'Iggy-ish' from memory.

[WinningThrough]

Hello fellow survivees!

 

Apologies if this is a repeat of anything that's already been done. I thought it might be helpful to start a thread about symptoms that people have had that have either gone away or improved over time. This could help in 2 ways:

 

1. It could show someone who is struggling with a particular symptom that it will heal in time.

2. It shows us how far we've come.

 

With that in mind, I've put together a list of the symptoms that I got on and/or off the drug that have either gone away or have improved. Here goes:

 

- I had double vision when I came off the drugs and it went away gradually.

- My eyes made clicking and popping sounds every time I moved them. That stopped.

- I had great difficulty moving my eyes up and down, from side to side and circling them. That got a lot better.

- I had severe crying spells for about a year. I would wake up crying and would literally cry (chemically) for hours and I couldn't stop it. I would choke and have problems breathing from it. The crying stopped. Occasionally I cry now but not often and not for hours.

- My brain used to feel like it was shaking in my skull and being squeezed. Those things went away.

- I had a hideous nerve sensation behind my eye and in my nose and face that actually felt like akathisia in my face! I always felt like I had this demonic ball thing behind my eye and a creepy feeling on the bridge of my nose. I never thought that symptom would go away, but it did. I occasionally get it back but it only lasts for a day or so when I do.

- The internal shaking in my legs is a lot better.

- I used to have a tightness in my chest all the time that felt like something was going to explode out of it. That went away.

- I had akathisia down below. It was horrific. But it went away!

- I had a numb bladder and numb arm for a few months and they went away too.

- I had several patches of ringworm on various areas of my body for a few months and they completely cleared up. I had dermatitis or something around my eyes..they were always red, itching and peeling and I actually had hard skin on my eyelids. I thought that would never go but it did.

- I had a really bad tremor and that went away.

- I still have brain zaps, unfortunately. But they are nowhere near as bad as they used to be when I got one every time I tried to move my eyes. I had them every few seconds all day and night. They are not like that anymore.

- Cognitively I have a long way to go but I'm improving. I find it easier to apply my brain than I did.

- My racing thoughts are not as bad as they were. This thing is always there but I can think of other things now.

- My constant suicidal thoughts calmed down. Ok, I still rather wouldn't be here than living like this but rather than having an urge all the time to do something immediately, I actually WANT to fight for my life and get better. I want to see this thing through. I only have this life and I deserve to come out the other side. And I WILL.

- I've sort of trained myself to do certain things now. When I first came off the drugs, I was in bed nearly all the time. I used to eat food with my hands and if I dropped any on the floor, I left it there because it was too much for me to pick it up. I used to go for days and days without having a bath because it was too terrifying for me to do it. Now I have a bath every day. Don't get me wrong, it's far from easy but I can do it now. I get dressed nearly every day. I do some housework now. I eat with a knife and fork and pick up food I've dropped. I push myself to go out of the house sometimes. I do more activities than I did.

 

There are probably other things I haven't thought of but those are the things that spring to mind. I do hope this helps at least one person on here. It's helped me too! This is a long list! I had no idea I'd done so much healing! I'm nowhere near where I want to be but I can see now that I AM healing.

 

I will put this list on my own thread too.

[JanCarol]

Interesting article here:

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/suicide-rates-rise-researchers-separate-thoughts-actions?tgt=nr

 

discusses the importance of 

1.  Hopelessness, lack of support or feelings of burdonsomeness

2.  Low levels of pain or no fear of pain (especially in our soldiers who are conditioned to this)

and 

3.  Access to means of fatality

 

as prime factors in suicides.

 

What I like best about the article is it discusses the difference between thoughts and talk of suicide, and the act itself - almost revolutionary how it does that.  It's about more than the thoughts.

[KarenB]

My eye has not tingled in months now.

The strange feeling that there was something on the end of my nose has gone.

I've had no hallucinations in many months.

My fearfulness has subsided greatly.

[Junglechicken]

 Since re-instating Cipralex @ 2.5mg on 25th Nov 2015, I have had the following improvements:

• No longer have horrendous headaches (includes migraines, sinus).
• Ear pressure changes/popping have stopped.
• Severe body aches and pains post-exercise have subsided.
• Have more flexibility in joints.
• Improved mood.
• Nausea and dizziness have stopped.
• Weird electric shock/current sensations in brain down neck have stopped.
• Appetite has returned for the most part (depending on how I am feeling).
• Sleeping well without needing Melatonin.
• Not as anxious as I was.

Please note I am moving back to the UK in a couple of weeks and have a huge TO DO list.  Trying to stay sane through it all.

[Chochka]

I was wondering if people could put time lengths on here. I am suffering from intense fatigue, among other things, and it would be helpful to see how long it took for people's symptoms to fade. (I know that it's different for everyone but some kind of timeline would be encouraging.)

[Faithgrl]

Thanks for the topic. Didn't realised that things got better when I started tapering and reduced the Cipramil ...

 

1. I used to SWEAT excessively when I exercise (yuck) ...now I am just a nice damp.

2. Better vision - when I was on the Cipramil I used to play squash and always complained that I couldn't really see the ball (it was going too fast for my eyes?) and I played today and I could actually see the ball!! 3. I used to sleep 9-10 hours a day and was tired ALL the time. These days I sleep 7-8 hours a day and am still tired   Oh well, its 2016 and I work full time, what does one expect?

4. Motion sickness - had this really badlly and couldn't handle being on a boat or a car for anything longer than 10mins. Went on a 4 hour cruise on 26 December (after popping an entire packet of natural travel calm with only ginger extract) and no motion sickness. Holy ****. I think I might go to Wet & Wild in a bit (but of course I will take the travel calm with me)

 

Saying all that, I am still pretty tired and can nap anywhere, anytime...and I still get anxious. And I still feel funny sometimes when I turn my head (you know the one where your brain gets left behind), and some diarrhea, but nothing I can't handle or hide from other people...you wont' want to use a toilet after me though!

 

Timeframe per my signature. The first week was the worst but I did decide to cut the dose by 50% cause I was just sick of it. Now I am going to attempt to cut by 30% each week and its ok so far. I ran the numbers on a 10% taper and my crazy brain tells me that is unacceptably long. I have a history of not doing what I am told anyway and pushing the s**t ouf of everything and 1/2 the time I crash and burn and 1/2 the time it ended up awesome. So lets see what happens.

[btdt]

For those not inclined to read the entire article, and to whet the appetite of those who might be convinced to do so  here is a succinct summary (from the conclusion):

 

 

_{The broad idea here is that} 

_{1) Healing is happening.}

_{2) The sensations that feel like injury are NOT injury. They are the CORRECTION of nerve injury.  They just "fire off" as they heal.}

_{3) We can use some things to cope.}

_{4) It's going away in time.} 

 

I know this is not a "fix" to the feelings.  There is nothing anyone could say to me while I was IN pain that made the PAIN better.  All I could do was cope and cry and try to get through it.  But knowing it's normal and that I'm not getting worse; I'm getting better - is always something I benefit from knowing.  

 

 

Best,

 

Andy

 

Since you have inside information from study and some personal experience do you have any comments for those of us who have been doing this years past being drug free and still have not healed...any ideas or comments.  

We are here some much less then we use to be but we are around. 

[apace41]

Since you have inside information from study and some personal experience do you have any comments for those of us who have been doing this years past being drug free and still have not healed...any ideas or comments.  

We are here some much less then we use to be but we are around. 

 

 

Btdt,

 

Just to be clear, that story is not mine but one that was posted elsewhere.  I have some moments of improvement and others where I have my doubts that I need to beat back and knock down.

 

I wish I had all the answers or even many of them.  I don't and think what is happening to so many people, largely without any knowledge of society in general, is horrible.  I can only say that I believe that the brain is an incredible organ and that given time and an environment in which:

 

• nutrition is good,
• sleep (as possible) is adequate,
• exercise (to the extent tolerated) is undertaken,
• stress is minimized and
• connections with others (again, to the extent tolerated) are made and strengthened

the brain will work to the extent it can to rewire itself and find a level of homeostasis.  Neuroplastic change is a process that will invariably vary from one to the next based on factors that have yet to be fully quantified.  For some, change will be linear and obvious with the proverbial "windows and waves" pattern being evident.  For others, there will be long periods of no improvement and even deterioration before improvement takes place.  Perhaps it is because I HAVE TO believe that healing will occur, or perhaps it is because I have read too many stories of people who have healed, that I believe we are all capable of healing and WILL heal.

 

Those who have been in a protracted state for longer are simply slower to undergo neuroplastic change.  There have been many examples of people who showed no improvement for long times only to see rapid improvement after that time.  The key for me is that one needs to really believe that they will, in fact, heal.  The power of the mind is incredible in that regard so do whatever you need to do to instill that belief in yourself. 

 

If you are interested in reading something that will give you a sense of how strong the mind can be in healing, read Lissa Rankin's "Mind Over Medicine."

 

I wish I could give you more specifics but they don't exist.  I do believe you will heal, btdt.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[btdt]

It was not the original post but the ablib I was talking about and this line

 

"But knowing it's normal and that I'm not getting worse; I'm getting better - is always something I benefit from knowing.  

 

I guess you were just repeating what was said .. for a moment I was confused and thought you knew something from your studies 

thanks for the reply

[grandmaD]

What an excellent and encouraging post.  I am going to put the summary on my fridge!

[FightingForHope]

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone here, this site is a godsend, reading the stories and information is helping me survive this hellish isolation and confusion. Thank you!!!!!

[Ali4]

Reading this was amazing!! I have hope and a better understanding of what's going on. Thanks you!

[sottovoce]

Yes! I found that incredibly thorough, helpful, and powerful.  

 

For others who would like to read it, but may be daunted by its length: here are some things I found helpful-- anchors of encouragement and understanding:

 

1) An understanding of the central roles of glutamate and GABA, and many other facets of the brain's chemistry; a refined sense of the interconnectedness of the body-mind; and inspiration to become a student of my own process; from my body, my feelings, thoughts, to my chemistry.

2) A powerful metaphor for visualizing what is happening during withdrawal, and accurately and skillfully framing it for myself as it is happening.

3) A way to share this process with friends and family so that it is clear to them what I'm experiencing and how they can help.

 

Thank you!

s.voce

[btdt]

 

Yes! I found that incredibly thorough, helpful, and powerful.  

 

For others who would like to read it, but may be daunted by its length: here are some things I found helpful-- anchors of encouragement and understanding:

 

1) An understanding of the central roles of glutamate and GABA, and many other facets of the brain's chemistry; a refined sense of the interconnectedness of the body-mind; and inspiration to become a student of my own process; from my body, my feelings, thoughts, to my chemistry.

2) A powerful metaphor for visualizing what is happening during withdrawal, and accurately and skillfully framing it for myself as it is happening.

3) A way to share this process with friends and family so that it is clear to them what I'm experiencing and how they can help.

 

Thank you!

s.voce

 

I think I did all these things at one point or some point... at this point however they feel pointless maybe I am just tired or maybe it is the poor memory or the recent not so recent drug reactions... people get sick of my sharing year after year... it gets old I can't reframe at  this point I told them I would be done in 3 years it is almost 9....I think I am getting the feeling of why pd are not staying here it may be what I just wrote.

peace I know you mean well... 

 

What if everybody is not healing... ok throw your shoe at me or send the internet police... but at some point shut up btdt... kill joy 

[Junglechicken]

An excellent description of the healing/recovery process. Accessible and not scary. Thank you.

[compsports]

BTDT, I relate to everything you have said.     As an FYI, you might want to look into joining facebook SA as you might find that better meets your needs.   I tried to PM you to talk more about it but it said you are not able to receive messages.

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/9786-i-started-a-private-facebook-group-for-sa-members-only/

[Alexander]

Love the line "Healing is happening".   I need to believe this when a lot of the time I feel like my WD is stuck in a long wave that doesn't seem to end.

[btdt]

BTDT, I relate to everything you have said.     As an FYI, you might want to look into joining facebook SA as you might find that better meets your needs.   I tried to PM you to talk more about it but it said you are not able to receive messages.

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/9786-i-started-a-private-facebook-group-for-sa-members-only/

I am not on Facebook I don't like the site and always advice everyone to not join fb sites as they give away your information rather they sell it... I don't need that.. why do you think it would better serve my needs?  What does it do besides expose my personal identity to pharma and anyone else with buck?

I message box is full I will clear out some messages... sorry about that. 

peace

ps there is no such thing as a private fb site... it does not exist or so I am told. 

[btdt]

This is wd...my fav

[megb]

Who wrote the longer article do you know? Where did it come from? A great read... very encouraging & excellent metaphors. 

[btdt]

Who wrote the longer article do you know? Where did it come from? A great read... very encouraging & excellent metaphors. 

it came from 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=66397.0

 

What is happening in your brain?

« on: October 03, 2012, 09:08:49 pm »

[btdt]

Years ago when I was having symptoms of wd that looked like benzo withdrawal people thought they could not be caused by Ads we are learning they are much the same...plus I quit Klonapine the same day as effexor thing is I had been it the benzo to treat sweating a symptoms of tolerance to effexor and had only been on it a short time. 

[frasier23]

I have problem to understand how its possible to heal and become old/better self after stopping meds.

 

There is a new baseline for all emotions, sleep hunger etc after medicine. And body/brain doesnt know old baseline when meds are stopped .

 

Can someone please explain how after cold turkey of medicine X my body will regulate back to how it was pre medicine. Or is the theory just that it will be better than on medicine?

[SquirrellyGirl]

I'm no neurobiologist so maybe someone with more accurate info will come along.  I do have a BS in biology, and I do know that the body has optimum operating ranges, whether it be hormones, neurotransmitters, blood pH, and the like.  The body seeks homeostasis, and it is when the body becomes out of balance that we have disease processes.  The whole reason we are in trouble from taking these meds is because the nervous system seeks homeostasis once the drug is introduced.  The drugs throw neurotransmitters into extremes, too high in the case of SSRIs. The body recognizes this and makes oppositional changes to try to bring about homeostasis, because the concentration of serotonin in the nerve gap needs to be such that nerves fire properly.  When you take the drug away, there are extremes in the opposite direction, causing the symptoms.  What has happened to the nerves with the remodeling while on the drugs is essentially nerve damage.  It simply takes a whole lot longer for the nervous system to heal itself and bring about homeostasis again, I think because it isn't just a matter of changing one neurotransmitter, but the cascade of interactions that messing with one level has across all of our biochemistry.

 

I think this post from benzobuddies.org sums it up nicely, though about benzos - everything is inter-related, as I said, so it is very relevant.  What is happening in your brain?

 

SG

[Jetan]

This morning I woke up and tried to kill myself. I hanged myself from a rafter in my room. I started to black out and pass out and then I pulled back. It freaked me out. I don't know what to do. I can't tell anyone because they'll put me in a mental hospital. I just want help to get out of this. I know that you've heard all of it before.... I hate myself, I am a piece of ****, I deserve to die because I am a bad person. I am worthless, etc..  I have no friends and no love. I am getting old and am alone. I don't have a job or a career. I am desperate... I don't know what to do and I need to understand what to do now. I think that my life is over. I know that other people feel like me and that I am not alone. What do you do when you are like this? Can someone find a way to take the time to advise me on how to cope with this? Please, please help me. I really need to get through this. I know you know what to do. Please help.

Thank you so much...

Edited August 29, 2016 by KarenB
merged topics

[herewego]

Are you sleeping ok every night?

You might want to consider counselling. When I was young I considered suicide and made an appointment with a counselor - just making the appointment helped me feel better - I could hang on until I talked to the counselor about the things in my life that were hard for me. I didn't tell her I had been thinking about suicide for the same reason as you. The counselling really helped.

If you can't afford a counselor you could check with a large church nearby that has a good reputation in the community. Some of them have counselors and you could explain your finances - at the very least if there is no qualified counselor available you could talk to the pastor in charge of pastoral care - they often do counselling and it is free and they usually have training but not to the level of a counselor with a masters obviously. Ask if you could talk every couple weeks. Perhaps explain you have been thinking about suicide but won't act on it so no one commits you. Having someone listen who could point out different options for you and maybe make some caring suggestions may help you. A lot of churches also have support groups where you can connect with others going thru hard times. My husband was part of one for awhile and it was very helpful for him to talk with other men going through difficulties.

I am thinking no one has responded to you yet because it is scary to offer advice knowing where you are at and they may feel unqualified, or that they don't know your situation enough to offer advice but they certainly do care.

All the best,

herewego