☼ Ten0275: I'm Dave and I'm almost there

[apace41]

Dave,

 

I am always in awe of your ability to put words in such a beautiful order that they paint wonderful pictures and create strong and vibrant emotions.  It is a gift.  in your opening post you said you could "write a book."  You should.

 

Thanks for coming by and updating.  Selfishly, would that we could have more of your time.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[ten0275]

community of healing, hello.

i am currently at 1.4mg of mirtazapine. this drug is nothing to mess around with. for me, it's just getting harder and harder to chip away at the dosage. when the hospital slammed me with 30mg back in the day, i was so completely over-stimulated and the difficulty was not in making the cuts, but being patient enough to make them progressively and slowly. at that point, the mirtazapine was acting as an accelerator and i wanted to take my foot off that particular gas pedal in a most urgent way. i realize now that from about 17mg down to 5mg, the cuts were fairly effortless - i was skipping merrily down the trail. the mirtazapine was at that point functioning as a "brake" which was a relief. now each cut feels like the brakes are being let off in a very palpable way. that's why i haven't made much progress in decreasing, because i am not willing to have everything fall to pieces for the sake of cutting. i'm being exquisitely discerning when i make cuts. and there is a reason.

because i am functioning. things are going solidly. life has its usual garbage situations that are unavoidable and inherent to being homosapien, but i can deal with it. work is going well. the same building i used to sit behind contemplating suicide in the worst of withdrawal in 2012 is now a place where projects come my way, i descend fast and hard on them, and get good feedback for the work i complete and the timeliness with which i do it. i haven't taken a sick day in over two years whereas in the worst of withdrawal in 2012 and 2013, i was on partial medical leave.

i continue to exercise. i still have very little tolerance for concentrated cardiovascular exercise beyond walking. it leaves my system overcharged and nights following any vigorous cardio have the distinct flavor of purgatory. that's fine - the walking. i actually really love walking. i hit the weights very hard, but have lowered the actual amount i lift. i have upped the number of repetitions and sets instead and my muscle mass has actually increased as a result. i built a nice base by lifting heavy, but nearing 41 years of age, my joints weren't handling the abuse so well. i've dropped a considerable amount of weight. i'm actually at a very good weight and i'd like to stay where i am. i am directly between the near terminal-appearing weight i was when i couldn't eat anything in the worst of withdrawal and the mirtazapine-makes-me-crave-bags-of-WOOWOOWOO-pure-sugar weight i was on the rebound. i want to maintain this weight in that i don't want to lose any more - so i keep careful track of my calorie intake daily to be sure i get as much as i need. i also watch the ratios of protein, fat, and carbohydrates i use as my fuel.

diet still remains a challenge with the histamine issue. eating is not joyful for me, it is simply mandatory maintenance. the tart cherry juice has worked wonders for me and by golly, it is delicious as heck! bonus! but my diet is very restrictive. each evening i consume meat, select veggies of the low-histamine order, whey protein, and grains except for wheat. i've returned fully to eating one meal per day - usually around 5pm at night. and in that meal, i take in the 1800 to 2200 calories i need. on days when i lift weights, i will drink whey protein mixed with water about an hour post-workout and try to have upwards of 3000 calories. i can't eat carbohydrates during the day, they make me want to sleep. i drink 2 to 3 cups of coffee, less when i feel out-of-sorts.

so in addition to the 1.4mg squirt of mirtazapine i take on a nightly basis, i take magnesium glycenate when i have anxiety or headaches. i take a b vitamin/folic acid supplement when i am experiencing low energy or depression. i take the aforementioned tart cherry juice in the evening with dinner. and that's all for any supplementation or drugs.

 

symptoms that follow cuts for me include increased anxiety and some depression, hot flashes, sleep disturbance, increase in histamine sensitivity, occasional difficulty in achieving or maintaining an erection, lack of appetite, nausea, nightmares, sensitivity to noise and light - those are the predominate.

this pretty much covers the bases of where i am at. i still marvel at the fact that i am even here writing this to you. it all seemed so hopeless and terminal. i was wasted. worse than wasted. time and patience were, and continue to be, the great equalizer in all this. to be able to endure a certain level of pain individual to all of us and keep on pushing forward in whatever ways we are capable. look at the title of this thread of mine. "Ten0275: i'm dave and i'm almost there." i started the thing in 12/2014 and i thought i was going to be done w/ the miserable little bit of mirtazapine i had remaining in a very short period of time. wrong dave! i had to modify my approach. had i not, i feel that i would have incurred much damage and wouldn't have a positive report to deliver you, my friends and foxhole comrades, in this current moment. am i disappointed that i am still putting mirtazapine in my body. very much so. am i willing to stow that disappointment in the overhead compartment until this turbulent flight lands safely and smoothly on the other side of withdrawal? affirmative.

hang in there everyone. i hope this dispatch finds you all getting on with your process as you are, where you are. each day of forward motion, or hard-won endurance of your current situation, is victory. yours. stay in touch.

dave

[apace41]

Great post and update, as always, Dave.  Very encouraging on a lot of fronts.

 

I know it's frustrating to still have to be on the med, but at that level you should take heart from knowing that collateral damage to the body should be extremely unlikely.

 

The fact that you are, for all intents and purposes, fully functional, should be and remain paramount.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[ten0275]

Andy, thanks brother. Very much appreciated. I'm always thankful for your consideration, and insights.

 

Hang in there!

[bubble]

​It's really great to hear from you and with such good news I was just about to ask somebody about you..

 

No need to be disappointed. As Andy says, in terms of potential damage this is so little. But its potential to disrupt how we function still seems to be big. So best to thread carefully as you do.

 

I so hope I will be able to write something like this one day...:

 

-it all seemed so hopeless and terminal. i was wasted. worse than wasted. time and patience were, and continue to be, the great equalizer in all this. to be able to endure a certain level of pain individual to all of us and keep on pushing forward in whatever ways we are capable.

[AmyK]

Well done, Dave. To be able to function and have a life is so much worth. You will get there.

Can I ask, how much do you drop the dose each time? Like you, every tiny cut is hard for me now. So I know what you mean.

All the best!

Amy

[brassmonkey]

Excellent update Dave. I'm so glad that there have been so many improvements. It only gets better from here.

 

Brass

[Altostrata]

Good to hear of your progress, Dave.

 

Might I suggest ingesting some whey protein isolate in the morning? I am concerned about your body getting fuel for the day.

[Flowers]

So good to hear of your progress Dave. Quality of life has to be taken into the equation when tapering. You are an inspiration to me and I hope one day to be at the low dosage you are on now and feeling as good.

 

Best.

 

Flowers 

[ten0275]

bubble, hey there - i very much appreciate your kind words, and the fact that you were just about to check up on me. i appreciate that. i think you will most certainly write something like that one day. i know for a long time, i was very doubtful that i ever would.

amy, hi. thank you for taking the time to read my update and for your encouragement. yes, of course - so when i cut now, it is literally the minimum i can do - so my last cut was 1.5mg to 1.4mg. and i still feel the cuts like they are mega doses. which i think does tell me i need to hold longer. the tragic thing is that if i were to tell a doctor i was feeling such a cut, i'd get laughed right out of the office. still, my body is decisively telling me that even at these small doses, the body needs to adapt to the absence of even a small amount.

brass, always a pleasure to hear from you. i appreciate your good words and for taking the time to check in. you are inspiring in many ways, sir.

alto - yes! not only might you suggest it, but i have implemented it for the last 4 days. and with good results - that is to say, i have noticed i am not having a late morning slump that was fairly typical and that i was remedying with coffee. i was only ever against carbohydrates earlier in the day because i have truly felt that carbohydrate consumption early has caused both intensified symptoms and an even bigger crash. but protein is an excellent choice and my body seems to assimilate whey efficiently. thank you for encouraging me to try fueling with the whey earlier. i'm going to stick with that.

flowers, so excellent to hear from you. i wish you the very best in hanging in there until you are at those lower doses and healing is even more palpable to you.

hang in there, friends, and thanks for your words and time.

dave

[LexAnger]

So happy to hear you and know you are doing fine with life and work, Dave!

That's a huge accomplishment getting down from 30 to 1.5! Even it's heartbreaking to think of the super long haul, it's more important that you can maintain life and job with the slow reduction.

many of us are at the same spot pushing even harder at the heavy low dose, and I saw more are touching the finishe line. We will all make it there and put the misery behind as forgotten history, forever! You are so close!

 

Hope to hear from you more with greater news!

 

Lex

[Hibari]

Hi Dave,

 

As a fellow Remeron traveler I totally get the lower dose whammy.   I am down to 3.6 mgs from 41.25 and I too feel these smaller cuts much more than when I was higher.  It's a pain to go so slow when I want to just speed over the finish line.  (I'm also tapering Lamictal at the same time or on alternating months).  

 

I love to walk as well and it's all I can do.  Can't even get to the gym for other things so I admire your attention to the weights and what your body needs. 

 

I also understand that feeling of putting Remeron in our bodies even at the low dose.  I notice more and more how my body is fighting with the drug-is that how you experience it?

 

You are going to make it! 

[AliG]

Hi Dave. I'm  not a Remeron traveller but on this same journey never the less.    You have a lot to contribute to this process and it would be great if you could add more of your thoughts and experiences when you're feeling up to it.

You have been through so much and many can learn from you. Your story is inspiring.

Best wishes

Ali

[Hopefull]

Hi Dave,

It is really nice to hear from you.

Although you might feel a bit dissapointed by not being able to get off Mirtazapine as yet, you have done really well to come as far as you have.

You will get there in the end. Best wishes, Hopefull.

[ten0275]

hey everyone,

i just want to thank you all once again for your words of encouragement and support. i know i don't need to tell you that it means a great deal to me, and i am appreciative of everyone's consideration here.

 

so much admiration for everyone taking this process a day at a time.

hang in there,

dave

[Hopefull]

Hi Dave,

I have been wondering how you are doing?

Are you off Mirtazapine?

I hope you are doing well.

Best wishes, Hopefull.

[Hibari]

Hi Dave,  Wondering how your Mirtazapine taper is going?  No pressure, just curious how you are navigating those tiny lower doses.   I am low too and it seems like the sedating aspect of the medication has kicked in even more!

 

Hope all is well.

[herenow]

I have just read some of your posts. I can relate to some of what you have gone through with my medication merry-go-round. I am also tapering mirtazapine. I started on 15 mg but quickly tapered down to 6.7 mg in a few days. It was so activating and each cut during that first week made me feel worse so I have slowed down. I started it in October 2015.  I'm now down to 3.4 mg by weight. I hope you're doing well with your taper! I am cutting between 0.1 mg to 0.3 mg per month and sometimes holding. I have nightmares, early morning wakening, depression, anxiety with cuts. Hang in there!

[TikkiTikki]

hey ten,

 

I just pinched a few of your words, cut and pasted a post of yours onto my thread so I wouldn't lost it, I hope that's okay. You write with great beauty.

 

hope you well, wherever you are now.

[ten0275]

fellow survivors, hey.

 

it's been a long while since i've updated here and i wanted to take some time to do so.

 

i am currently at 1.1mg of mirtazapine. i am still having this compounded into liquid form. 2016 had been a year of almost no cuts for me - i think i may have cut once or twice. cuts seemed really hard last year. i think it (the year off from cutting) was a good break from the decreases and allowed my nervous system to recalibrate and steady itself - i got my legs back under me. this year, spring and summer (usa), i've been making cuts approximately every four to five weeks. i am having little to no withdrawal symptoms as i make these cuts. one of the months was not a true cut, but i had the need to switch pharmacies for compounding and because i assumed i might need to adjust to the new formula (new suspension liquid, new syringe, etc), i held my dose and counted that transition as a cut. in my opinion, transitions need to be handled as delicately as cuts, i know many of you are aware of this.

 

my sleep is good, i get what i need for myself personally which is between 5 and 7 hours per night. i dream again, and they are not unpleasant and horrifying dreams as they once were. i don't wake up in the morning with that horrid revving/over-drive sensation any longer. i am in the gym 5 days per week. i do predominately weight training and isometric exercise. lots of pushups and pullups. i do some cardio in the form of brisk walking, sometimes an easy jog. i supplement with quercetin, vitamin c, magnesium glycinate, b vitamin/folate mix, and creatine. i drink 2 to 3 cups of coffee per day. i've lost all of the weight that i gained with the mirtazapine which is notorious for weight-gain. the sugar cravings have also subsided.

 

i was having a lot of issues with histamine intolerance due to mirtazapine's affinity for the histamine receptors. this past allergy season was the lightest i've had in years despite the pollen being heavy-hitting. i had never been prone to allergies before, it was just a withdrawal affect that seems to have abated for now. many of the foods that once caused me to develop migraine headaches and a barrage of other symptoms have been reintroduced to my diet slowly and i feel i have benefited by the wider array of nutrients i can now ingest. i had not ingested dairy since 2012 and as a result, developed basically what amounts to lactose intolerance. i find that if i take a lactase supplement, i am able to eat dairy without issue which has been an integral part of my protein intake.

 

my ability to handle stress is good. i still need to drop out of life and spin records on occasion, but in general i can tolerate whatever life wants to throw at me. things don't seem all so bad when i compare them to what i experienced in earlier withdrawal. i'm truly of the mind that if you can endure what withdrawal throws at you, you can endure much more than you ever thought you could. i have developed a different perspective because of the lessons withdrawal taught me. i don't take a moment for granted, truly. high-pressure work situations are metabolized, family life and the torrents of issues that can crop up within are also metabolized. i try to let go of stress and not let it build up. my sensory perceptions - vision, hearing, touch, taste have all returned to their factory-settings.

 

to be honest with you, i feel better now than i've felt in about 35 years. i'm 41 years old and had been on those horrid drugs the majority of my life and i realize that i was never really living at all. i thought i was having a progressive mental illness which turned out, as i know now, to be the effect of the drugs that were being given to me as the prescribed solution.

 

i should be clear that i never for a moment think to myself that i am in the clear. i know that somewhere in the next 1.1mg, i could very well be revisited by a host of issues. i don't wait for it anxiously, but i keep that knowledge tucked away so as not to be broadsided should that day arise. and of course if it doesn't arrive and i am able to finish my taper as the last 4 or so cuts have gone (without issue), i will consider myself inordinately fortunate. it has been one long haul, that is for sure. i truly am taking things a day at a time. there is no other way. yesterday is for the history books, tomorrow never knows.

 

i'm probably forgetting something, or many somethings here, but this is the general scenario for me. i very freely talk about what i went through with co-workers, family, and acquaintances. it doesn't matter, i am not ashamed. and if anyone can glean anything from what i went through, that makes me happy. i used to have a feeling of shame or deficiency over the deplorable and painful states of being that withdrawal put me in, but now i look at those very states of suffering as the foundation upon which i will build the rest of my life. i wouldn't choose to go through it again if given the choice, but i am not resentful. i may have lost some time, but i gained a wealth of inspiration, courage, and strength.

 

i'm really hoping to be able to slide a success story into the "success stories" section here in the not-too-distant future. withdrawal has taken me much longer than i anticipated, but i am not lamenting that. i've learned that there is no quick-fix for it - no drug, supplement or amount of rushing the process will get us there. the body, the brain, these are remarkable mechanisms - the most remarkable. they are pliant, they are resilient, and they want to be well - they want to survive. we are all endowed with this instinct. it isn't even something we have control over - the body wants homeostasis to carry out the tasks for which it was created. if you have a nice laptop computer and you run it through the mill, toss it around, download harmful things onto it, and generally treat it carelessly, it's not going to last you long - it's not going to process data right, it's not going to run efficiently, and eventually it is going to crash. the body and mind are no different. we need to be gentle and diligent. the drugs, they were not gentle. but part of this process is putting the power of gentleness and diligence back in our own very capable hands.

 

i've got to get back to work, but wanted to post this. i hope you are all doing well. if you are not doing well, i hope you are at least pushing forward in the hope, and truth really, that this will get better and you will find your way out of brambles. you will. i say this a lot, but i have the highest respect for anyone who is not only enduring withdrawal, but doing the leg-work to assure that they are doing it in the best possible way. the care of the moderators here is extraordinary. the care of the community here is extraordinary. your courage in logging into this site and pursuing your wellness is extraordinary and i commend you for it.

 

thank you for taking the time to read this. i'll check back in as i can and let you know how everything is going.

 

hang in there,

 

dave

 

 

Edited July 7, 2017 by ten0275

[AliG]

You seem to be doing very well. We always look forward to your updates.Thank You.

 

 

Edited July 7, 2017 by AliG

[PluckyPony]

Hi Dave,

 

Thank you for the update and encouragement.  It inspires me beyond words. 

 

In gratitude,

 

Plucky

[apace41]

Dave,

 

Your updates are always inspiring and so well written. So glad you are doing so well.  

 

Best,

 

Andy

Edited July 8, 2017 by apace41

[Hopefull]

Thank you for your update Ten0275.

It is always nice to hear from you and that you are doing well. 

Best wishes,  Hopefull. 

 

[Prestorb]

Thanks so much for the update Dave, it is always fantastic (inspiring and encouraging) to hear from you and I am so happy to hear that you are doing so well!! :-)

[AmyK]

I am happy you are doing so well, Dave! Good to hear from you. 

[Pepita]

wow, you are so very patient and mindful about how your system reacts and so on! I think you will be very well able to write a success story:)))) already sounds like one to me! I wish you continued healing and that you gett off that last bit of dosage smoothly! 

[ten0275]

Thank you so very, very much everyone, your comments mean a whole lot to me.  And it's so nice to hear from you all!

 

Hang in there,

 

Dave

[Santino]

Hey Dave

It is good reading your progress my friend. I am tapering Remeron tooo but i have been a bit faster. Maybe i was on it for a shorter time and that makes it possible for me to go faster and have WD symptoms at lower density. 

Keep on fighting my friend. You have been through a lot and there is always light at the end of the tunnel. You are a living proof of it. And to imagine how many years of your life has passed in vain due to doctors pushing this kind of meds... thats sooo hurting to hear time after time.

All the best

[Dan998]

Inspiring and uplifting. Your post will help encourage those who are in the trenches to carry on the fight.

[Martina23]

Hi Dave, I am so happy to read of you, that you are well, also that you started again tapering. It is great. I often think of you and I am sure you will manage it until you are totally drug free.

I keep my my fingers crossed for you (I hope it is the right English term for this :-))

I hope we hear from you soon, Martina

[LexAnger]

Hi Dave, such a great update! I knew you will beat this beast! You have been a true aspiration to me during my journey.

Im so happy you are getting your life back after the harm caused by these drugs.

 

best wishes to a smooth and pain less rest of journey!

 

lex

[Starboy17]

Hi Dave,

 

So glad that I came across your story today, I'm currently at 2.7mg as of last night, like yourself and many others here, the withdrawals hit me like nothing I've ever experienced!

 

Slowly my senses are returning to 'factory settings' I would like to exercise more but its hit & miss some days, weeks, months, no matter how determined I maybe my body lets me know if i push too far.  Your post was a great encouragement for me to keep on pushing on and remembering that one day soon that not only will i be off this med but that this experience has humbled me in ways that I never imagined.  In the beginning i was angry that i was ever prescribed it, however I soon learned that only exacerbated my withdrawals, I'm a whole lot more patient than I've ever been, less judgemental, and for the first time in many years I'm not self sabotaging.  All the best for your future endeavors.

 

Cheers,

 

Greg

[ten0275]

Greg, thank you so much for checking in and taking the time to write, and for sharing what you're going through too. I'm extraordinarily happy you found some encouragement in the post, and on this amazing site. Your perspective on what you are enduring sounds very strong, very level, and I wish you all the best too, you're going to get there.

 

Lex, it's always wonderful to hear from you! Thank you so much for the encouraging words and wishes, that means a ton.

 

Martina! I'm glad to read positive things are happening for you as well! Thank you for keeping those fingers crossed for me, you worded that perfectly! The intrusive thoughts always go! I am so thankful they do not visit me anymore. It is great that you are channeling yourself into artistic endeavors, keep up the great work!

 

Dan, I'm really thankful you took the time to read the thing and write. I appreciate it greatly and do hope that people at all stations of this healing process can glean something useful from what I went through, what all of us are going through. None of us would wish this on anyone.

 

Santino, thank you so much for your words. I'm really happy to hear you are having an easier go of things getting off the remeron. It is a mystery why some of these drugs fully pummel some and are a bit gentler on others. None of it is fun. I'm cheering you on! Your words were uplifting to me, and I am sending you super gratitude and best wishes my friend.

 

Hang in there everyone,

 

Dave

Edited August 15, 2017 by ten0275

[Altostrata]

Dave, how are you doing?

[ten0275]

Alto and community, hello. it’s been some time since I’ve checked in. Life and work in particular have been extraordinarily busy hence limiting my time. Things are going well, I’m feeling solid. I am currently at 0.7mg liquid compound mirtazapine after cutting 0.1mg nearly every month during 2017. I’m taking this current month of January 2018 to pause my cuts for no reason other than an exercise in cautious patience. I figure any additional stabilization I can gain on my trek to ground-zero discontinuance is a bow to the good. I plan to resume the taper February 1, 2018.

 

My nervous system feels resilient. I am generally able to handle most situations with limited-to-no anxiety. I still feel some revving of my nervous system at the onset of a cold or other seasonal ailment, but these are usually short-lived and tolerable symptoms. My mood is generally stable save for typical human emotional responses that arise from stressful, sad, or conflictive situations.

 

My current intake of drugs/supplements include 0.7mg liquid mirtazapine prior to sleep, b-vitamins/folate, quercetin/vitamin c, vitamin d, lactase, creatine, and occasional magnesium when I feel my nervous system can benefit. I take no over the counter or prescribed pain relief drugs and treat headaches and other common discomforts with magnesium or good old fashion patience. I still drink coffee.

 

Sleep is good. I suffer some insomnia around the time of a cut, but otherwise it is restorative. I average 6hrs per night which is the right amount for me. I continue to awake at 0330hrs for exercise, and I am still doing predominately weight-training with some cardiovascular output. I like to work in some meditation and reflective time as my schedule permits.

 

Diet has returned to wide-range. I still eat a primarily lean meat-based diet. I can eat dairy, but find I need to supplement with lactase as my ability to digest dairy after forgoing it for so long has been hindered. Certain lower-lactose bearing dairy foods like Swiss cheese and kefir can be eaten without lactase supplementation. My ability to tolerate high-histamine foods is very much improved, but I still eat as cleanly as possible and try to avoid trigger foods that once disturbed my system.

 

That is my current state in a nutshell. I’m thankful that things are as “even” as they are right now. I always keep the memory of my past suffering close as I never know when I will need to draw on the fortitude gained from it again. But I am savoring the present moment and pushing forward with the hope that things remain as such. I’m looking forward to being done with mirtazapine altogether, but would be remiss if I didn’t say that the notion of going from 0.1mg to none wasn’t anticipated with some trepidation. I’ll deal with that when I get to that point. And i will keep you in the loop.

 

My very best wishes for everyone continuing on the path of withdrawal and hope that your suffering is alleviated quickly and your healing is palpable.

 

Hang in there everyone,

Dave

Edited January 11, 2018 by ten0275