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How soon do most people experience WD symptoms after a reduction?


sunflower

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Hi,

 

How soon after a reduction can one experience wd symptoms? Can one experience symptoms up to 2-3 months after a reduction?

 

Thank you.

 

Sunflower

1998-2010. Zoloft 100 mgs.

3/2010. Switched to generic Z and began not to feel well.

7/2010. Estrogen patch added which caused severe depression.

8/2010 to 10/2010. Zoloft increased from 100 mgs to 200 mgs., Klonopin .25 mgs in am; .50 mgs pm; Remeron

.25 mgs. added by new doc

1/2011. Began tapering K; last dose of K 7/2011.

11/2011 Began Remeron taper; last dose of R 1/2012 (Tapered K & R by dry cutting)

1/2013 Began tapering Z from 200 mgs to 100 mgs by dry cutting

3/2013. Experiencing wd sx...took break

9/2013. Down to 150 mgs.

2/2014 - Present. 100 mgs Z

1-21-15. Began dry cutting 100 mgs.

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

It's pretty variable, and it depends on which drug you're cutting, but there are a couple of rough patterns.

 

First, there are the immediate symptoms, which people experience as the drug level drops, within a few days of the cut. Then there are the symptoms that play out after that as the body adjusts to the change; those can play out and come and go and change over weeks or sometimes months.

 

Second, when people are cutting too often or too fast, there can be a sort of cumulative crash when they've just gotten way too far ahead of their body's ability to adapt, and that can come on fairly suddenly at any point in a taper of pretty much any med.

 

But there's also a pretty common thing with ADs in particular, where people taper or cut and don't have much trouble at first, and they feel like they're doing pretty good, and then they get hit suddenly further out, anywhere from about three months to a year. In that situation the person has been feeling okay but then they just get hit out of the blue, although there's often a stressful event that precipitates it.

 

Hope this answers your question. :-)

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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Dear Rhi,

 

Yes it does. Thank you! So happy to see that you are doing well!

1998-2010. Zoloft 100 mgs.

3/2010. Switched to generic Z and began not to feel well.

7/2010. Estrogen patch added which caused severe depression.

8/2010 to 10/2010. Zoloft increased from 100 mgs to 200 mgs., Klonopin .25 mgs in am; .50 mgs pm; Remeron

.25 mgs. added by new doc

1/2011. Began tapering K; last dose of K 7/2011.

11/2011 Began Remeron taper; last dose of R 1/2012 (Tapered K & R by dry cutting)

1/2013 Began tapering Z from 200 mgs to 100 mgs by dry cutting

3/2013. Experiencing wd sx...took break

9/2013. Down to 150 mgs.

2/2014 - Present. 100 mgs Z

1-21-15. Began dry cutting 100 mgs.

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  • 5 years later...
On 1/21/2015 at 7:07 AM, Rhiannon said:

É bastante variável e depende de qual medicamento você está tomando, mas existem alguns padrões aproximados.

 

Primeiro, existem os sintomas imediatos, que as pessoas experimentam à medida que o nível da droga cai, poucos dias após o corte. Depois, há os sintomas que surgem depois disso, à medida que o corpo se ajusta à mudança; aqueles podem jogar e ir e vir e mudar ao longo de semanas ou às vezes meses.

 

Segundo, quando as pessoas estão cortando com muita frequência ou rapidez, pode haver uma espécie de acidente cumulativo quando ficam muito à frente da capacidade de adaptação do corpo, e isso pode acontecer repentinamente em qualquer ponto do cone. de praticamente qualquer med.

 

Mas também há uma coisa bastante comum com os anúncios em particular, onde as pessoas diminuem ou cortam e não têm muitos problemas no começo, e sentem que estão indo muito bem e são atingidas repentinamente mais longe, em qualquer lugar três meses a um ano. Nessa situação, a pessoa está se sentindo bem, mas é atingida do nada, embora geralmente ocorra um evento estressante que a precipita.

 

espero que isso responda sua pergunta. 🙂

 

but what to do if I am suddenly hit in the middle of withdrawal

 

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  • 8 months later...
PrayingForRestoration

Thank you for your feedback, @Rhiannon.

 

What should we do if/when withdrawal symptoms occur? I've seen where people have increased the prescription dosage slightly if/when the symptoms persist. And I've seen where people "gutted it out." And I'm sure there are other options. 

 

Is tapering done differently for AD than a non-AD? For example, I'm weaning off Lithium (I think this is a non-AD) now and praying to wean off Bupropion (AD) without too much pain next. 

 

And is the tapering process always the same (ie. 10% reduction every month) regardless of AD, dosage and time (three-months or 30-years) on the prescription?

 

I apologize if these questions are in the wrong topic. 

Celexa: 2002-2014, 20mg; 2014, 0 mg;

Lexapro/Escitalopram: 2014 - 2020, 20mg; 01/01/2021, 0 mg; 08/11/2021, 20 mg;
Sertraline/Zoloft: 06/01/2020, 50 mg; 08/10/2021, 0 mg;
Amitriptyline: 07/10/2020, 20 mg; 07/14/2020, 0 mg;
Trazodone: 07/14/2020, 50 mg; 08/06/2020, 0 mg;
Temazapam: 08/10/2020, 15 mg; 08/11/2020, 0 mg;
Quetiapine/Seroquel: 10/15/2020, 200 mg; 04/11/2021, 150 mg; 05/09/2021, 100 mg;
Paroxitine/Paxil: 10/17/2020, 40 mg; 10/18/2020, 0 mg;
Bupropion: 10/21/2020, 75 mg; 10/24/2020, 150 mg; 11/18/2020, 300 mg; 04/11/2021, 200 mg; 04/25/2021, 100 mg; 05/09/2021, 0 mg;
Lithium: 12/02/2020, 300 mg; 12/15/2020, 600 mg; 12/28/2020, 900 mg; 01/27/2021, 600 mg; 02/10/2021, 300 mg; 02/24/2021, 150 mg; 03/10/21, 0 mg;

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  • 2 weeks later...
Yesyes123

Hey, wondering if people have had experiences of WD Symptoms months after a reduction... or some story here to read about someone... thank you!4

July 2015 - Started Escitalopram 10mg (Lexapro) at age 15. Took it everyday until July 2020 (5 Years)

July 2020 - Turned 21 started tapering off until August (TOO FAST TAPER/ ALMOST SAME AS COLD TURKEY)

August 2020 -  Clear Manic episode (nothing absurd or life threatening)

September 2020 - Start feeling a bit weird

October 2020 - Crashed. The absolute worst time of my life. 

Late October 2020 - Reinstated Escitalopram 10mg. Perscribed Antipsychotics (Lithium, Seroquel) REFUSED

Early November 2020 - Psychiatrist wrongly upped the dosage to 15mg. Still taking 15mg / day as of today. 

 

22 January 2021: 

Beginning to stabilize on 15mg/day Escitalopram (Lexapro) 🧠

Taking 25mg Magnesium Citrate 4x per day / 2000mg Vitamin C Prolonged Release + Kiwis + Fresh Fruit / Salmon everyday for Omega3 Fatty Acids

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ChessieCat

@Yesyes123

 

I've responded to your question posted in another topic:

 

1 minute ago, ChessieCat said:

 

This might happen, if nothing else has changed, if a drug has reached tolerance, also known as poop out or tachyphylaxis, which can happen after a person has been taking a drug for an extended time and it loses its effectiveness.  When this happens the doctor may increase the dose and the person starts to feel improvement then after some more time the same thing happens.  See:

 

tolerance-or-poop-out-or-tachyphylaxis

 

and

 

Tachyphylaxis, Reaching Tolerance or as It's Lovingly Known “Poop-Out”

 

Generally withdrawal symptoms after a reduction show up during the first 1 or 2 weeks after the dose is lowered and then they start to reduce.  Tolerance to a drug generally happens gradually over time and one sign that it is tolerance might be that when a reduction is made a person starts to feel better but the longer they hold then the symptoms start to worsen.

 

NEW!!!     INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder    NEW!!! 

 

Plodding along inch by inch:  12" = 1',  3' =  36 " or 1 yard,  1760 yards  = 63,360" or 1 mile

Current from 17 Apr 2021:  Pristiq 0.2665mg  now holding each dose for 3 weeks

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering Oct 2015 

My tapering program   My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)  My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.

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Yesyes123

Hi, has anyone here experienced WD symptoms that only started months after a reduction?

 

Beeing absolutely symptom free for +1 month and then starting to have symptons only then, from that reduction?

July 2015 - Started Escitalopram 10mg (Lexapro) at age 15. Took it everyday until July 2020 (5 Years)

July 2020 - Turned 21 started tapering off until August (TOO FAST TAPER/ ALMOST SAME AS COLD TURKEY)

August 2020 -  Clear Manic episode (nothing absurd or life threatening)

September 2020 - Start feeling a bit weird

October 2020 - Crashed. The absolute worst time of my life. 

Late October 2020 - Reinstated Escitalopram 10mg. Perscribed Antipsychotics (Lithium, Seroquel) REFUSED

Early November 2020 - Psychiatrist wrongly upped the dosage to 15mg. Still taking 15mg / day as of today. 

 

22 January 2021: 

Beginning to stabilize on 15mg/day Escitalopram (Lexapro) 🧠

Taking 25mg Magnesium Citrate 4x per day / 2000mg Vitamin C Prolonged Release + Kiwis + Fresh Fruit / Salmon everyday for Omega3 Fatty Acids

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ChessieCat

@Yesyes123

When that happens it is a good idea to not assume that it is directly related to the reduction.

 

It's a good idea to be your own detective and consider what other thing/s happened at, around or leading up to the time that the symptoms increased.

 

Things to consider:  alcohol, late nights, going out, loud music, bright lights, playing lots of games on the computer or similar, watching movies with a lot of excitement/suspense/tension, different food/s, caffeine, external stress (job, financial etc), change/loss of job, relationship issues, death of a person or pet, moving, holidays/travel (even good stress can have an effect), change in routine, sickness, antibiotics, supplements started or stopped, exercise.

NEW!!!     INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder    NEW!!! 

 

Plodding along inch by inch:  12" = 1',  3' =  36 " or 1 yard,  1760 yards  = 63,360" or 1 mile

Current from 17 Apr 2021:  Pristiq 0.2665mg  now holding each dose for 3 weeks

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering Oct 2015 

My tapering program   My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)  My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.

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Yesyes123

Thanks so much for the kind response @ChessieCat.

 

The thing is, when I started fast tapering last year and after stopping Lexapro, I was actually fine and with minimal symptoms for around 2-3 months.

 

Now, I'm sure fast tapering and stopping the drug is a very different thing than reducing the dose by small increments. 

 

I'm just worried that since I had that experience of being almost symptom free for months and then crashing extremely hard from stopping the drug, the pattern of symptoms from reducing the dose might follow a similar timeline.

 

Like, reducing it and only starting to get hit with terrible symptoms 1 month or more later, like it happened when I CT'd.

 

So, in your view, if I make a reduction and have no symptoms at all after 1 month on the lower dose, it means that reduction did not cause any problems? 

 

Also, when I crashed last year, I had absolutely nothing else wrong in my life, it was 100% withdrawal from the drug.

 

What do you think about this @Gridley?

July 2015 - Started Escitalopram 10mg (Lexapro) at age 15. Took it everyday until July 2020 (5 Years)

July 2020 - Turned 21 started tapering off until August (TOO FAST TAPER/ ALMOST SAME AS COLD TURKEY)

August 2020 -  Clear Manic episode (nothing absurd or life threatening)

September 2020 - Start feeling a bit weird

October 2020 - Crashed. The absolute worst time of my life. 

Late October 2020 - Reinstated Escitalopram 10mg. Perscribed Antipsychotics (Lithium, Seroquel) REFUSED

Early November 2020 - Psychiatrist wrongly upped the dosage to 15mg. Still taking 15mg / day as of today. 

 

22 January 2021: 

Beginning to stabilize on 15mg/day Escitalopram (Lexapro) 🧠

Taking 25mg Magnesium Citrate 4x per day / 2000mg Vitamin C Prolonged Release + Kiwis + Fresh Fruit / Salmon everyday for Omega3 Fatty Acids

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ChessieCat

@Yesyes123

 

Please discuss your own situation in your Introduction topic.  That way your history is in one place, it means you do not have to repeat yourself and it keeps the general topics "on topic".

NEW!!!     INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder    NEW!!! 

 

Plodding along inch by inch:  12" = 1',  3' =  36 " or 1 yard,  1760 yards  = 63,360" or 1 mile

Current from 17 Apr 2021:  Pristiq 0.2665mg  now holding each dose for 3 weeks

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering Oct 2015 

My tapering program   My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)  My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.

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Gridley
3 hours ago, Yesyes123 said:

 

So, in your view, if I make a reduction and have no symptoms at all after 1 month on the lower dose, it means that reduction did not cause any problems? 

 

I'm sorry, I don't know.   Withdrawal symptoms can be delayed and the time frame can differ from person to person.  One month would seem to be indicative that the drop was well-tolerated, but that's just my opinion based on my Lexapro taper which involved a 2-week hold, so the parallels with your situation aren't the same.  I do know that there were certain dosages where symptoms showed up after the 4-week taper and I had to hold longer and other dosages where I was able to proceed.  So it's going to vary.

Gridley Introduction

 

Lexapro 20 mg since 2004.  Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017.   

End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg 

End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg

End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg  

Oct. 30, 2020  Jump to zero from 0.025mg.  Current dose: 0.000mg

3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete.

 

Ativan 1 mg 1986-1991 CT, soon reinstated.  CT 2000. RI 1 mg 2011-2016.  Sept. 2016  0.625mg X 3

Nov.27, 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover + change to one 18.75mg dose, w/1 month hold.

Feb. 9, 2021, begin 10% every 4 weeks taper.  Current dose as of April 10: 13mgai.  Taper is 31% complete.

 

Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986.  Jan. 2016 began every 3-weeks 10% taper, down to 16mgai (44mgpw).  Aug 2016, discovered SA, holding at 16mg.  Taper is 78% complete.  

  

Supplements: omega, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotic, zinc, melatonin .3mg.


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

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