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Causes of Depression - Research and Discussion


LoveandLight

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Aha this may be on interest to others also. I've been googling symptoms of allergies, autoimmune condition, depression, anxiety. All of those, in traditional Chinese medicine point to a congested liver.

2000 - sertraline for job anxiety low confidence (17 years old) ..which turned the next 16 years into nightmare!

 

On/off sertraline severe withdrawals every time. 2014 - felt better as reduced dose of sertraline no more inner restlessness. Doctor rushed off again. Hit severe withdrawal. Lost the little I had in life. Couldn't get stable again on 12.5mg. Was switched to prozac. Had severe reaction to prozac..came off in November 2015 at 6mg as felt more confused and damaged on it..Even more withdrawal ..rage, depression, dyphoria, near constant suicidal ideation, self harm impulses, doom, concrete block in head, unable to do much of anything with this feeling in head..went back on 6mg of sertraline to see if would alleviate anything. It didn't..reduced from December to June 2016 came off at 2.5mg sertraline as was hospitalised for the severe rage, suicidal impulses, and put on 50mg lofepramine which in 2nd week reduced all symptoms but gave insomnia which still have..psych stopped lofepramine cold turkey..no increased withdrawal symptoms new symptoms from lofepramine except persistant insomnia which has as side effect.

 

Taking Ativan for 8 months for the severe rage self harm impulses 1-3 times a week (mostly 2 times a week) at .5mg. Two months (I'm unsure exactly when the interdose started to happen) ago interdose withdrawal seemed to happen..2 days I think after the Ativan.

 

 

Nightmare that could have been avoided!

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Stanford Professor Robert Sapolsky, posits that depression is the most damaging disease that you can experience. Right now it is the number four cause of disability in the US and it is becoming more common.

 

This presentation explores past and more recent biological and psychological theories of depression.  It links genetic vulnerability with environmental factors as determining if someone is likely to experience major depression in their life. A particular genetic variation, combined with early childhood stress and 'learned helplessness' increases the risk of developing what he states is as much a biological disease as diabetes.  Thankfully he doesn't compare prozac with insulin as being a suitable treatment.

 

In this fascinating lecture, Professor Sapolsky concludes that depression as an illness is the result of a complex combination of biological, environmental and psychological factors.

 

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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I was lucky enough to be a psychology major

2009: Cancer hospital said I had adjustment disorder because I thought they were doing it wrong. Their headshrinker prescribed Effexor, and my life set on a new course. I didn't know what was ahead, like a passenger on Disneyland's Matterhorn, smiling and waving as it climbs...clink, clink, clink.

2010: Post surgical accidental Effexor discontinuation by nurses, masked by intravenous Dilaudid. (The car is balanced at the top of the track.) I get home, pop a Vicodin, and ...

Whooosh...down, down, down, down, down...goes the trajectory of my life, up goes my mood and tendency to think everything is a good idea.
2012: After the bipolar jig was up, now a walking bag of unrelated symptoms, I went crazy on Daytrana (the Ritalin skin patch by Noven), because ADHD was a perfect fit for a bag of unrelated symptoms. I was prescribed Effexor for the nervousness of it, and things got neurological. An EEG showed enough activity to warrant an epilepsy diagnosis rather than non-epileptic ("psychogenic") seizures.

:o 2013-2014: Quit everything and got worse. I probably went through DAWS: dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome. I drank to not feel, but I felt a lot: dread, fear, regret, grief: an utter sense of total loss of everything worth breathing about, for almost two years.

I was not suicidal but I wanted to be dead, at least dead to the experience of my own brain and body.

2015: I  began to recover after adding virgin coconut oil and organic grass-fed fed butter to a cup of instant coffee in the morning.

I did it hoping for mental acuity and better memory. After ten days of that, I was much better, mood-wise. Approximately neutral.

And, I experienced drowsiness. I could sleep. Not exactly happy, I did 30 days on Wellbutrin, because it had done me no harm in the past. 

I don't have the DAWS mood or state of mind. It never feel like doing anything if it means standing up.

In fact, I don't especially like moving. I'm a brain with a beanbag body.   :unsure:

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I was lucky enough to be a psychology major

 

I'm so sorry that happened to you westcoast, that's so awful.  Makes me really angry reading about it.

I am not a medical professional and nothing I say is a medical opinion or meant to be medical advice, please seek a competent and trusted medical professional to consult for all medical decisions.

 

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In addition to looking at things like nutrition and physical conditions as the possible root cause of your depression, you might consider looking at something like emotional trauma. Increasingly this is being found at the root of mood disorders, and I too found this after long self-examination.  

 

Stanford Professor Robert Sapolsky  explores past and more recent biological and psychological theories of depression.  He links genetic vulnerability with environmental factors including early childhood trauma as determining if someone is likely to experience major depression in their life.

 

THIS POST contains a video of this lecture.

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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Wildflower0214

You may want to have your hormones tested. I think gut issues, trauma, and endocrine problems, and nutrition are good places to start.

 

Even if your hormones are off, this can be corrected by diet from what I have seen. Unless, you are menopausal. But, even then, nutrition helps. I would be cautious though about taking hormones, even bio-identical. There is no such thing. They come from yams. Last I checked, I'm not a yam.

 

 

The thing I think we have to remember, is that even if you do have trauma, that doesn't mean you don't now have physical causes as well. We were not created to endure traumatic circumstances. And, when we do, it causes all kinds of systems to be thrown out of whack, and chemicals are released, and if this goes on for years, we end up with a problem. Not only an emotional one, but now a physical one as well.

 

Anyways, I hope you get some answers.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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So many things I've read on gut health and on chronic fatigue have been enormously complicated. I am in the process of reading Wheat Brain by Perlmutter. It is much simpler and ties a lot of things together for me. For example, childhood slowness and clumsiness point to genetic issues with mitochondria, but the main detoxing enzyme responsible can be upgraded epigenetically. A healthy gut microbiome can detox chemicals from plastic, etc, etc. Stress in the present or as retained trauma leads to increased cortisol production that loosens the "mortar" between gut cells and leads to leaky gut syndrome. Everything is connected. If you have an autoimmune disease, you have a gut problem almost by definition. Wheat Brain has been out long enough it is available in libraries in the US. I don't know about the UK.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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It always seems to come back to some trauma, in childhood or adult life. Many varying degrees of - but always something lurking there. Just seems so hard to get over.

Many SSRI's and SSNRI's over 20 years. Zoloft for 7 years followed by Effexor, Lexapro, Prozac, Cymbalta, Celexa, Pristiq, Valdoxan, Mianserin and more - on and off. No tapering. Cold turkey off Valdoxan - end of May 2014

 

                                                  Psych Drug - free since May 2014
.
         

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  • 2 weeks later...
SoSaysSunny

Published research articles are provided and discussed.

 

Posting Articles:

  • Provide article by link and/or attachment.
  • Stick to articles published in scientific journals (such as on PubMed Central).
  • Share why you like the article:  key finding, your big take-aways, etc.
  • Feel free to include a summary (or not).

Discussing Articles:

  • Refer to the article title.
  • Share your experiences, opinions, etc.
  • Don't attack the experiences and opinions of others.

Depression / OCD / Panic Attacks:  Tricyclics for ~ 15 yrs, SSRIs for ~ 10 yrs. (Paxil, 8 yrs.)

Increasing Circadian Rhythm Disruption (CRD) while on SSRI Paxil (may not be a side effect * )

Switched back to Tricyclics, January 2015, but my CRD persists (current as of most recent post here)

Anti-depressants (esp. SSRIs) sometimes make CRD worse instead of better

CRD linked to:  Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, High Cholesterol / Triglycerides, and other metabolism problems

 

*  Major Depressive Disorder may primarily be a Circadian Rhythm DYSYNCRONY of Genes

10-pg overview article, pretty accessible:

Major depressive disorder: A loss of circadian synchrony?  by Edgar, N. et al. in Bioessays, Nov 2013.

6-pg research cited in article above, somewhat technical:

Circadian patterns of gene expression in the human brain and disruption in major depressive disorder  by Li, JZ et al. in Proc of the Nat'l Academy of Sci USA, 2013.

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SoSaysSunny

Major depressive disorder: A loss of circadian synchrony?
by Nicole Edgar and Colleen A. McClung in BioEssays 35.11 (2013): 940–944. [from PubMedCentral]
 


 

HIGHLIGHTED COPY:

 

Edgar 2013 10p -- MDD -- A Loss of Circadian Synchrony.pdf


HIGHLIGHTING COLOR CODE:

 

Sentences -- Just signposts of where a topic is discussed, not a complete summary (read the paragraph!).

Acronymn Expansions -- Usually where the term is defined, to help decode all the mumbo-jumbo.

Article Titles -- Highlighting helps me skim the references and pick more articles I'd like to find.

 

INFORMAL MICROSUMMARY:

 

Depression has long been associated with disrupted sleep -- too much, too little, wrong time, unsatisfying.

 

Sleep is part the body's daily cycle, called the Circadian Rhythm. The Circadian System also governs mood, blood pressure, blood sugar, body temperature, and many other metabolic systems.

 

The suprachiasmic nucleus (SCN) is the part of the brain that acts as the circadian rhythm's Master Clock. Other regions of the brain are also part of the circadian system under the guidance of the SCN.

 

Recent research on the brains of human corpses studied these regions to see how synchronized they were with the SCN and the known time of death. This has greatly increased our understanding of healthy circadian rhythms.

 

The researchers also studied the brains of depressed people and found very different results. Their brains weren't in sync with the time of death, most regions weren't in sync with the SCN or each other, and some regions weren't even in sych with themselves. The brains of depressed people send signals at the wrong time and conflicting signals at the same time. Even the proper signals were weak.

 

In addition to the familiar psychological "mood and behavior" definition of depression, this research points to strong genetic and neurobiological indicators of depression. Depression may fundamentally be a circadian rhythm problem.

 

Although this research doesn't provide any specific therapies for depression, it may lead to new approaches: treatments of symptoms, therapies to fix the underlying problem, tests to verify the presence and type of depression, even better understanding of the genetic inheritance of depression.

 

MY BIG TAKE-AWAYS:

  • Depression is a REAL, certifiable, quantifiable disease.
  • Depression is directly related to Circadian Rhythm Disruption.
  • Screwed up sleep schedules are part of this disease.
  • Metabolic issues are also part of this disease.
  • Therefore, I don't need to feel guilty:
    • My depression isn't a lack of willpower or not trying hard enough.
    • It's not my fault that my brain isn't running on the world's time zone.
    • My metabolic issues don't reflect some weakness of my character.

 


 

Feel free to read and discuss this article or post others you've found.

 

Depression / OCD / Panic Attacks:  Tricyclics for ~ 15 yrs, SSRIs for ~ 10 yrs. (Paxil, 8 yrs.)

Increasing Circadian Rhythm Disruption (CRD) while on SSRI Paxil (may not be a side effect * )

Switched back to Tricyclics, January 2015, but my CRD persists (current as of most recent post here)

Anti-depressants (esp. SSRIs) sometimes make CRD worse instead of better

CRD linked to:  Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, High Cholesterol / Triglycerides, and other metabolism problems

 

*  Major Depressive Disorder may primarily be a Circadian Rhythm DYSYNCRONY of Genes

10-pg overview article, pretty accessible:

Major depressive disorder: A loss of circadian synchrony?  by Edgar, N. et al. in Bioessays, Nov 2013.

6-pg research cited in article above, somewhat technical:

Circadian patterns of gene expression in the human brain and disruption in major depressive disorder  by Li, JZ et al. in Proc of the Nat'l Academy of Sci USA, 2013.

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Hi SoSaySunny,

 

This section of the site is for discussion about symptoms of antidepressant withdrawal and possible ways of managing them.  While symptoms which sometimes get diagnosed as depression are also often part of antidepressant withdrawal syndrome, we don't see this as being depression or a relapse of a previous depression.

 

The article you posted is interesting, because it discusses the disruption of circadian rhythms, which also often happens when the nervous system becomes destabilized by improper withdrawal from drugs, but its focus is on it being caused by depression.  We are a support site for people wanting to safely come of psychiatric drugs, not a depression support group.

 

We have a section for posting and discussion of research papers related to withdrawal, withdrawal syndrome, adverse effects, epidemiology, etc. regarding psychiatric drugs, here : 

From journals and scientific sources

Your post may be better suited to that section, but it needs to be in a slightly different format, please see this thread before posting there:

Before you start a topic in Journals....

 

If you are interested in other theories of depression we have a couple of topics here in the current events/media section:

 

Depression as an Infectious Disease

 

New Research Reveals the Real Causes of Depression - new article

 

If you would like some help and support with safely coming off your medications, reducing them, or just sharing your story, please start a topic for yourself in our introductions section here:

Introductions and updates

 

I'm glad you found us and look forward to getting to know you better.

 

Petunia.

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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  • 3 months later...
strongereachday

Simply I think life is the root cause of depression. I believe everyone gets depressed. People who have experienced trauma like many of us on here is probably one of the big depression reasons. I think good exercise and diet if we are healthy enough, happy home life, ability to handle money stress, and your social life or lack thereof r the things that need to be addressed in order for someone to overcome depression. Of course this does not account for tardive dysphoria. Just my two cents

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  • 1 month later...

The thing that frightens me is the idea that I have transgenerational damage that has a genetic root. Does that mean I am powerless to change my behavior and reactions to life's stressors?

off cold turkey:zoloft, trileptal, stratteracurrently on:<p>latuda .05 milligrams latuda (to stabilize cns) from 20 mgs 4 months ago.

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UnfoldingSky

 

I was lucky enough to be a psychology major

 

I'm so sorry that happened to you westcoast, that's so awful.  Makes me really angry reading about it.

 

 

Oops, I just re-read this after it got bumped and my post sounded all wrong, not sure exactly what I meant since it's been a while since I wrote it but probably it referred to your drug experiences, I definitely wasn't referring to the psych major..doesn't really read that way though! 

I am not a medical professional and nothing I say is a medical opinion or meant to be medical advice, please seek a competent and trusted medical professional to consult for all medical decisions.

 

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  • 1 month later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Topics merged and title changed.

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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Nomoreheadmeds

I never got depressed before I had a viral meningitis aged 23

Sertraline 100mg amytrip 60mg diazepam 4mg (and when needed) since late 90's.Reduced all meds over 6 wks (too short) last doses 13 wks ago.Still having withdrawals.I would have done it differently

5th august 2015 reinstated 5mg amytripiline.increased to 10mg amtrip 9th sept 2015.

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