Jump to content
Healing

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

Recommended Posts

Justcope
2 hours ago, thecowisback said:

no i haven't heard of nac. i'm a bit wary of trying anything else in the way of supplements. i've been taking magnesium for a few months but it hasn't really helped. i tried b vitamins and they sent my anxiety through the roof, as did 5 htp so i'm very cautious. when i'm feeling this strung out it's very hard to see any sort of recovery happening. hopefully tomorrow will be a better day. i've barely stopped crying all day from the fear. 

 

Hey. 

I agree vitamin B can make anxiety worse! I tried it and stopped immediately. I only take magnesium and omega 3 now and it works well. These days I’m mostly in window, and I think meditation daily, seeing my psychologist and exercise has mostly helped it. I’m not completely off meds yet- I’m down to 5mg of the 20mg of lexapro that I was on for 5 years.  

My husband has kept an eye on me too. He reminded me of the days I would be crying, wanting to go back on meds, major mood swings etc. certainly better now, but I think meditation payed a big part. Don’t buy into your thought and feelings- they pass. Don’t believe everything going on in your head, it’s withdrawal. Don’t give your thoughts sooo much power. I’ve used headspace for meditation- the anxiety pack specifically. I’ve done it over and over again for the past 6 months. It’s not a quick fix, but it’s a massive help in the long run. Keep going. You’re doing great.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ChessieCat
12 hours ago, Ali75 said:

have you thought of trying n-acetyl cysteine (NAC)

 

SA topic: n-acetylcysteine-nac

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ali75
18 hours ago, thecowisback said:

no i haven't heard of nac. i'm a bit wary of trying anything else in the way of supplements. i've been taking magnesium for a few months but it hasn't really helped. i tried b vitamins and they sent my anxiety through the roof, as did 5 htp so i'm very cautious. when i'm feeling this strung out it's very hard to see any sort of recovery happening. hopefully tomorrow will be a better day. i've barely stopped crying all day from the fear. 

 

I’m sorry. This is an indescribably painful experience. I’m generally not experiencing the debilitating anxiety these days but I’m in a difficult wave. I feel disconnected from any concrete sense of self and when I’m interacting with my family I feel as though it’s not really ‘me’ on some level. At the same time, I’m experiencing emotional spirals, anhedonia, horrible sleep and waves of panic sensations. I had been feeling a lot better before this wave started a few weeks ago and thought I was making real progress. These windows are nice, but they sure are deceptive!

 

I do think there are things you can do to at least help the anxiety somewhat. If you don’t want to try NAC, I know that some people have had good results with other things. Search for the intro topic by the member named Janie. She had horrible anxiety and depression during withdrawal and found that taking saffron helped enormously, especially with calming the anxiety.

 

Don’t give up hope. This does end. Progress is slow, but the healing is happening all the time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
thecowisback

thankyou - i keep having to remind myself that we all heal eventually. i have to stop myself looking too far into the future!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WiggleIt
On 11/7/2018 at 5:51 AM, thecowisback said:

i'm at the top of a wave today after a very stressful day yesterday. i just want to feel calm again. i miss the calm that the meds gave me and i just want to feel some of that peace again. i get the odd day here and there when i can dismiss the scary thoughts without too much effort but the next day BANG the anxiety is back again with a vengeance.

today i feel as if i'm being turned inside out with all the fear and anxiety rushing round my body. someone please tell me all this will be worth it in the end!!!!


Yes, it is all worth it!  We are some of the bravest people in the world, even if the world doesn't know that about us.  I do promise that the healing and struggle is worth it.  I'm by no means back to 100%, but OH how much better my life is than when I was in acute four years ago!  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
thecowisback

at what point did you notice an improvement in your anxiety and depression wiggleit? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Justcope

What a bummer. Ive been in a window for ages. I felt normal. Still some bumps and anxiety, but I wouldn’t classify it as a wave. There have been a few stressors lately and this morning- there it is. The anxiety. I let my meditation slip. Trying to stay positive and not focus on it. As is most of our mantras- it’ll pass. Better pick up the meditation and exercise. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WiggleIt
On 11/9/2018 at 3:24 AM, thecowisback said:

at what point did you notice an improvement in your anxiety and depression wiggleit? 


Improvement from the artificially induced, drug-induced depression/terror/fear took around a year.  Then maybe another year for my personality to really stabilize close to what it was before meds.  Now, I'm four years off and my personality and moods feel very stable.  

I do suffer from a different kind of depression now because my physical health was permanently damaged by the meds, but I feel well-equipped to handle this depression.  Honestly, I'm pretty proud of how well I carry this weight.  I did not suffer from depression before meds. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Allreadygone

I’m currently holding due to destabilized CNS of to fast taper of Effexor&Company.Did any of you have this happen then stabilize to continue taper?Its been 2 months with Brutal symtoms But I know it takes time @WiggleIt  @Justcope

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JackieDecides
8 hours ago, WiggleIt said:

I do suffer from a different kind of depression now because my physical health was permanently damaged by the meds, but I feel well-equipped to handle this depression.  Honestly, I'm pretty proud of how well I carry this weight.

 

I can't possibly be objective about this - how is that even possible? - but it seems to me  like this is the most I can hope for. I always had depression before meds and I hope to just be mostly functional. 

 

pretty much everything you write inspires me, Wiggle it. ❤️

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WiggleIt
4 hours ago, JackieDecides said:

 

I can't possibly be objective about this - how is that even possible? - but it seems to me  like this is the most I can hope for. I always had depression before meds and I hope to just be mostly functional. 

 

pretty much everything you write inspires me, Wiggle it. ❤️

 

You will DEFINITELY be functional again!  I am incredibly hopeful about that.  Heck, I'm functional—and I literally needed a wheelchair to leave my house four years ago! 

Like I said, my personality and moods feel very stable now and, after what I've survived, I feel pretty darned strong about handling anything else that life throws my way.  So I do feel that you are going to grow into a very manageable place, and you will likely surprise yourself.  You're already much better emotionally than where I was at when I started going through this.  You're quite in-touch with yourself emotionally, and that is a huge tool in your favor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WiggleIt
6 hours ago, Allreadygone said:

I’m currently holding due to destabilized CNS of to fast taper of Effexor&Company.Did any of you have this happen then stabilize to continue taper?Its been 2 months with Brutal symtoms But I know it takes time @WiggleIt  @Justcope


Unfortunately, I did not benefit from a taper.  My old doctors messed me up really badly and thrust me into a double cold-turkey.

My observation of other friends here on this site does favor holds, stabilizations, and tapers, though.  What I've seen others do—like what you're doing—is what I wish I could have done.  It was too late for me to reinstate by the time I found this site, so I had to just barrel through.

Anyway, yes, I've read others' threads here who have held, stabilized, then continued tapering.  

Actually, I think some of those approaches are described under Success Stories.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Allreadygone

Doctors havnt a clue!What were your symtoms after your CT?  @WiggleIt I found the site a lil late as well,I had a brutal taper off of 3of the 6drugs tgey has me on 1CT.Took about 6-8 months to be able to be around humans again.Now I started tapering the other 3 in 2017 and went to fast and all hell has broken loose with my CNS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MRothbard

how long was your wave...

 

...at the roughly 6 month mark. The one I'm in started around the first of October.

 

Edited by ChessieCat
added full topic title to post

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Galmond
On 11/17/2018 at 8:44 AM, WiggleIt said:


Improvement from the artificially induced, drug-induced depression/terror/fear took around a year.  Then maybe another year for my personality to really stabilize close to what it was before meds.  Now, I'm four years off and my personality and moods feel very stable.  

I do suffer from a different kind of depression now because my physical health was permanently damaged by the meds, but I feel well-equipped to handle this depression.  Honestly, I'm pretty proud of how well I carry this weight.  I did not suffer from depression before meds. 

What do you think was permanently damaged by the meds?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Chochka

I have a question about waves and how they operate. I've been completely off everything for over two years now and initially was really bad but could see a slow improvement. However, after about 18 months I went back into a deep wave which hasn't improved at all and I'm still in it 7 months later. I'm getting to the point where I'm thinking it will go on for ever. It's nearly as bad as when I first came off and doesn't seem to fit the pattern where things slowly improve. Anyone else had this?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nena59
On 12/8/2018 at 1:32 AM, Chochka said:

I have a question about waves and how they operate. I've been completely off everything for over two years now and initially was really bad but could see a slow improvement. However, after about 18 months I went back into a deep wave which hasn't improved at all and I'm still in it 7 months later. I'm getting to the point where I'm thinking it will go on for ever. It's nearly as bad as when I first came off and doesn't seem to fit the pattern where things slowly improve. Anyone else had this?

Chochka,

I am going through this. I have been off 2 plus years and feel wd pretty bad. It seems I felt better, in that I had more windows, months ago. I did have some setbacks, my dad died in March and my mom had successful cancer surgery in April. I also get migraines almost weekly for sometimes multiple days (these are a lifetime problem, but it really affects me).

I am really getting discouraged. My main symptom is anhedonia...no joy, no energy, no hope. Any type of stress seems to affect me. I have at times thought that I wish to be dead. I wonder if I will have to go back on antidepressants. I've tried counselors, but they don't believe in paws. I have a very supportive group of friends and family. I don't know what to do except push, push, push. Mornings are usually pretty bad, but evenings are sometimes better.

I would love to hear any encouragement. I'm scared that since this is not really improving much that this is it.

Sorry that I can't give you positive words, sounds like we are in the same space.😢

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Chochka

Hi Nena.

 

Firstly, thank you for replying, it's nice to touch base with someone who is going through a similar thing. I also suffer from a lack of motivation, not anhedonia as such but I can't be bothered to do stuff most of the time, even things I know I enjoy. A lot of my problems are physical - I feel hungover most of the time with aches and pains and really bad drowsiness and tinnitus. I also suffer badly with a lack of concentration and cognitive problems. Sometimes I can barely string a sentence together and I can't remember what I'm reading about. I am also prone to being in really irritable moods and tearfulness. Yesterday I was so angry all day I was in tears with frustration. I was like this for the first year I came off but then things improved and although I was up and down every day I always had a part of the day where I felt ok or a lot better. I thought I was heading for the end if it all. I even went on a research trip to Zimbabwe in April and was really positive about getting my life back finally. Then suddenly in May, in Zimbabwe, I had an enormous crash and I'm back nearly to how bad it was 2 years ago and no let up for months. I'm also scared that it's not improving much and that this is it too. I've been really struggling since I crashed.

 

Positive words wasn't what I was after so much as a connection with someone else going through the same thing.I know my post won't be very encouraging to you either but I was very happy that you replied. I did get something off one of the moderators saying that she had never known anyone not recover so that was encouraging. I'm sure this is another phase but it's gone on for so long now that I'm getting discouraged too. I'd really like to stay in touch, and also hear from others in the same situation. I'm sure we are not the only ones with this experience. 

 

Hope to speak again soon xxx

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Spruce30

Hi Chochka. I have had a similar experience to you.

 

I have been off 3 1/2 years. I felt I was making good progress in late 2017/ early 2018, but since then my waves have got a bit less intense which is good, but they have also got a lot longer. It seems some aspects are getting slightly better, but other aspects are getting worse.

 

It is very frustrating and as Nena 59 said, sometimes I feel I am not making progress, and like this is as good as it gets.

 

It feels everytime I feel I make a step forward, I then go two steps backwards. 

 

I am currently in a wave that has gone on for about 50 days.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help777

Hi,

I would really value hearing one of the moderator’s thoughts on these entries because I have had similar questions.

with many thanks,

help

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WiggleIt
On 12/3/2018 at 8:44 AM, Galmond said:

What do you think was permanently damaged by the meds?

Dear Galmond,

I don't just "think" I was damaged.  I know I was damaged.  My altered physical mobility after the meds is quite apparent to everyone in my life.  I incurred a movement disorder (tardive dystonia) that has never fully healed.  It causes me to limp (because my right leg now permanently drags), walk with a cane, and if my muscles get overexerted, then the movement disorder will flare up into large tremors and visible jerking in my limbs.  As long as I don't strain myself, only the limp is noticeable to others.  Because my muscles no longer respond normally, I have pain all over my body all the time to some degree or another.  My physical fatigue is devastating and totally disruptive to living a normal life.  

I also now suffer from various neurological disturbances that I definitely did not have before the meds, particularly sensory hypersensitivity.  There has been improvement, but never a return to the fully physically healthy person I was before meds.  Meds also triggered some alopecia that has never fully recovered.  It's not severe, but it's enough to wound my pride, even though I can hide it.

And yet, I do cope with all of these things without medication.  I don't take anything for the physical symptoms and am proud of the fact that I survive not-too-disgracefully on a daily basis. :)  
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Chochka
14 hours ago, Spruce30 said:

Hi Chochka. I have had a similar experience to you.

 

I have been off 3 1/2 years. I felt I was making good progress in late 2017/ early 2018, but since then my waves have got a bit less intense which is good, but they have also got a lot longer. It seems some aspects are getting slightly better, but other aspects are getting worse.

 

It is very frustrating and as Nena 59 said, sometimes I feel I am not making progress, and like this is as good as it gets.

 

It feels everytime I feel I make a step forward, I then go two steps backwards. 

 

I am currently in a wave that has gone on for about 50 days.

Yes, I'm also in a long wave which shows no sign of going away. It's lasted 7 months now and I'm all over the place. Before that I felt like I was doing pretty well and I could see the end of it but now I can't. The waves have got a bit less intense but actually not that much. It's very frustrating. I think the worst aspect of all of this is the not knowing what is going on and when I can expect an end to it. 

 

It's nice to hook up with you though. Just knowing that someone else is also experiencing this gives me hope that this is more 'normal' and I'm not going to be the one who never recovers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Galmond
12 hours ago, WiggleIt said:

Dear Galmond,

I don't just "think" I was damaged.  I know I was damaged.  My altered physical mobility after the meds is quite apparent to everyone in my life.  I incurred a movement disorder (tardive dystonia) that has never fully healed.  It causes me to limp (because my right leg now permanently drags), walk with a cane, and if my muscles get overexerted, then the movement disorder will flare up into large tremors and visible jerking in my limbs.  As long as I don't strain myself, only the limp is noticeable to others.  Because my muscles no longer respond normally, I have pain all over my body all the time to some degree or another.  My physical fatigue is devastating and totally disruptive to living a normal life.  

I also now suffer from various neurological disturbances that I definitely did not have before the meds, particularly sensory hypersensitivity.  There has been improvement, but never a return to the fully physically healthy person I was before meds.  Meds also triggered some alopecia that has never fully recovered.  It's not severe, but it's enough to wound my pride, even though I can hide it.

And yet, I do cope with all of these things without medication.  I don't take anything for the physical symptoms and am proud of the fact that I survive not-too-disgracefully on a daily basis. :)  
 

Thank you for the reply. I asked the question because I also believe I have and suffer from irreparable damage. Pain is my biggest issue. I've had chronic body pain for 17 months now with no improvement. I also get the tremors in my muscles and suffer from no energy and fatigue. Just trying to see if anyone has had irreparable symptoms and admit it. Because I do think of possibly going back to meds. For me if it gives me better quality of life than this why not. But thanks for the detailed reply.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nena59
20 hours ago, Help777 said:

Hi,

I would really value hearing one of the moderator’s thoughts on these entries because I have had similar questions.

with many thanks,

help

I would also!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.