Jump to content
Healing

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

Recommended Posts

Mort81

It can last much longer than a year but it supposed to speed up at some point. Its a true grind. I thought i was done with the tough waves. But a rough massage led me into my worst wave since the beginning. Patience is the key. Pain and waves is good I guess. It means healing is happening.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shelbytrev

Will I know if I'm experiencing a window? Will I feel like my old self? Or are the symptoms still there but just seem to calm down for a bit? Maybe I'm not giving the moments where they calm down a bit enough credit because I'm expecting to feel "normal" ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LostInSpace

At first they're subtle.  I don't think you will feel like your old self in the early windows, but it's possible.  Enjoy those moments where you notice a little difference, they could be small windows.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
blackrabbit

New to this thread but have been on this horrid journey since last April. Anyway, has anyone heard of the book, The Mood Cure by Julia Ross (she's an M.D.) ? In her book she talks abut how she has gotten people off medications with "virtually no side effects" by taking supplements, a change of diet, and exercise. I just started reading her book now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
KarenB

Not everybody fits into the 'usual' patterns.  There is so much room for variation in w/d, so we do have people here for whom it takes longer to see a window - especially if they have had more drugs, more changes and higher doses (as you have). 

 

Can you direct your energy into embracing ways of managing your depression?  The symptoms forum has a lot of ideas. 

 

You'll get there George, it just takes the time it takes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
scallywag

I'm intrigued by something SquirrellyGirl posted in an intro thread:

We do know for many that there seems to be bad waves [after the last dose] that come up somewhere around 3,6,9,11 months...

I've been dealing with trichotillomania (compulsive hair pulling) since my mid-teen years. If I recall correctly, I once read that after stopping or being "pull-free", waves of urges to recommence pulling arrive at similar times.

Hmm. <emoji for scratching my chin>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
scallywag

baffled: Waves and windows occur with all symptoms, emotional and physical.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
KarenB

There can be many things affecting a person post-taper.  Our brain has been affected, our gut, our emotions.  Healing has happened, but some of the finer points are still working themselves out - so there still needs to be care given to ourselves. 

 

Finding approaches that can help you continue on a healing path is a good idea:  Melt into your own life and It Gets Better:  Living Well While Being Sick are two good places to start.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
zandro

Anyone who didn't experience waves? Is there a %?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
olivialet

I have been wondering for awhile now how does it feel in the end of the withdrawal? We always hear people having short lived good windows and long exhausting waves in the acute stages of withdrawal. But I do wonder how does recovery looks like in the end of the withdrawal process? Is it that you have very long good window and then a shorter bad wave! And then after the window is even longer and the waves are shorter and shorter? I have been experiencing longer good periods- the last one lasted three months, and then the new bad wave came over me and this one is not loosening its grip on me yet, it's been three weeks. I hope that one day i won't be afraid to look into the future and feel sad in anticipation of a bad wave. Better yet I hope my body and mind will be predictable and I will learn my old self again.

 

Good energy to all

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
zandro

Anyone ever experienced waves that just last hours? :/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RockSie

Yes zando. There was a time where my windows and waves switched per minute.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Petunia

Have any of you that have experienced a "window" have a period with no symptoms at all? I mean did you wake up in day and you felt completely normal?

 

Yes, this is what windows are like for me. Unfortunately, I've had very few of them and it took quite a long time before I experienced my first multi-day window like this. Waking up in the morning and feeling completely normal.... refreshed, enthusiastic about the day, relaxed and symptom free, is what signals a window for me now.

 

Until I had one of these symptom free windows, I thought a window was a period where symptoms were less intense, basically still feeling sick, but not in a wave. For the first part of my recovery process I was cycling between a slowly rising baseline and regular waves, where my symptoms would revert to an earlier level of intensity. But then I experienced several days in a row of feeling completely recovered, completely symptom free, like I'd had a miraculous recovery overnight.... but symptoms returned, which was confusing and very hard to accept after feeling completely normal and able to function like I used to.

 

Since this first real multi-day window, I've had two more. The longest one lasted 11 days. For me, they are often followed by a decline into a fairly severe wave until I come back again to a slightly improved baseline.

 

The best thing for me about these complete recovery type windows is that I get to experience evidence that my brain and nervous system is still capable of functioning normally, so its probably just a matter of more time before I'm able to sustain the normal state permanently.

 

The worst thing is having my 'recovery' cruelly snatched away after such a short time and I'm once again forced to accept that I have no control over the slow progress of this healing process.

 

Not everyone experiences windows and waves, but a significant majority seem to have this pattern develop as they recover.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
AliG

The windows do increase gradually in length and frequency. Eventually you're in a fairly permanent window with just a few ripples every now and then. Just enough to remind you of where you have been and what you have come through. All of this is temporary.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ndanges

My windows and waves come in moments. Not in days or weeks like I read here. Some days I feel good most part of the time and some days I have waves like 2 or 3 times a day lasting mainly 30 min/1 hour..but there is not pattern. Sometimes a wave can even last for few seconds or minutes. At the moment, It is mainly related to the head. Head pressure/pain and dreaming sensation.

 

When I feel a wave is approaching I just put some songs in headphones and it is all gone.. like magic..or when my husband makes a massage.. Because of that I have the hope I can control them somehow.. But the problem is: IT COMES BACK!!.. and sometimes I doubt if one day they will stop to come completely.. 

 

It is like someone is punching you in face constantly and you know how to deal.. you don't suffer.. you manage..you have peace.. This is great.. BUT we get tired to feel the pain again in some moments. Sometimes you loose your patience for been hitting in your face so many times..

 

But I am giving some time to my brain.. I believe in healing

 

Thank you!    

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Prohealer

I guess a more simplified way of asking would be, can you undo recovery with too much stress, drama and binge eating, or does it just throw the"table" off balance every time? I seem to get conflicting answers but i guess i need to learn not to keep seeking the answer, these neuro emotions are making me obsess over this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
scallywag

Those things can be destabilizing but they don't send you back to the start, like one of those rotten long snakes in Snakes & Ladders. Or using the metaphor you've chosen, one could say that stress, drama, and stress eating knock out that wedge of wadded paper somebody put under a table leg to keep it level and stable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TweetyRose

Has anyone who is in withdrawal and currently med free experienced having their memory improve, only to have it worsen later on?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Junglechicken

I don't know if my experience typically follows the windows and waves pattern. I tend to get stressed or "rattled" as I call it by external events which then set of a cascade of stress responses in my body - this Is manifested almost entirely by serious muscle tension in my body. This tension will last in my body for days until I remove it either by going for a swim (sometimes will require a few sessions) or having a massage. While the tension remains in my body, no amount of positive thinking will improve my mood, it will remain low until I expunge the tension from my body. There's a strong reciprocal relationship between the body and mind I find.

This I can relate to.

 

If I am in a window, and I get hit with stress......then that stress will "trigger" a wave of back to back symptoms/or a number of concurrent symptoms. I have experienced this "trigger" effect twice now since reinstating this time last year.

 

It's like a bomb going off in my CNS.

 

As we haven't had the money coming in, I haven't been able to get to an osteopath to reduce the muscle tension in my body, so it's remained there; and I have remained in pain. The mind/body correlation is spot on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LCAirPasta

Hey guys. So I just joined this week, and I've actually been feeling pretty good the last few days. Here's how I feel exactly, if you guys have any feedback or have experienced something similar please let me know. I'm having trouble distinguishing if I'm in a window or a wave or if I'm nearing the end of withdrawal. All through my withdrawal ( about 7 months since my first attempt at stopping CT, then trying a few medications to try and stabilize, before a fast taper off a different medicine) I've felt cloudy and just not myself. Suffering horribly, I'm sure you guys know the feelings. Slowly my symptoms have gotten better and then finally about Wednesday, I suddenly felt... clear headed. Ive had a lot of general anxiety, and I've had two or three panic attacks, but overall SO much better than how Ive felt the last few months. I'm wondering if I'm through the worst of my withdrawal, and if I'm just dealing with how I'm "supposed" to feel (without any drugs) or if this is just a window and the panic attacks are happening as a start of the next wave??? I haven't had a true panic attack in probably a month before this week, even with my withdrawal, and I've felt so much better that I really thought I might have been getting through it. Maybe I'm in the last stage of withdrawal, which is dealing with panic attacks and general anxiety like a normal human? I guess what im looking for is for some people who have survived and gotten through the withdrawals to describe what it felt like when they were done and if it was similar at all to what I'm experiencing. Sorry for the long venting post, it's pretty late here and I just got over a panic attack so I'm a little frazzled.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LCAirPasta

I realize this is very long winded and kind of goes in circles haha I'm sorry. Let me ask my question in a simple way- how do I know if I'm still going withdrawals and the panic attacks are just symptoms of withdrawal, or if I'm finally starting to pull out of my withdrawal and my panic attacks are just a byproduct of getting to my "normal" state again. Sorry again guys I'm new to this !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ChessieCat

This post might help.  And the final line in this post:

 

"It's up to you to decide whether your body and brain are behaving "normally" as they did before you tried medication, or if you are feeling differently. No one else, not even a doctor, can determine this."

 

And here is another discussion:  which-me-is-the-real-me

Edited by ChessieCat
Added quote from post

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
peng

I am no expert apart from having experienced and suffered, since 1977, most of the feelings described on this forum.  Like you, I came here to find answers and good advice, and it keeps me going.

 

I believe that having the sharper, brighter feelings, perhaps with some enthusiasm for doing stuff, is almost the way we are meant to be.  Close to normal, if you like.

 

The trouble is that when the flight or fight symptoms become overwhelming and prolonged, we are liable to become ill.  The mechanism is too supercharged.  Blame the ECU in a motor car, and the brain in we humans.

 

ChessieCat's words are the standard, but wise sound reply to be got here.  Sometimes we have to figure out a bit for ourselves, and that is one of the main problems for all of us.

 

If there was a ready answer, millions of us would already be back to wellness.

 

Anyway, I should make the most of the lift and alertness returning, monitor it and act accordingly with what advice you can glean from the vast pool of knowledge on here.  It really is the best place, I would say. 

 

Many of us can relate to your dilemma.  You will probably agree it is good to find somewhere that people will know how your confusing emotions are troubling you.

 

We are with you, and hope for some relief for you.

 

Best wishes!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LCAirPasta

Thanks so much for the responses. I had 3 days of feeling awesome and back to normal and now I feel a little worse. Still an improvement!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Petunia

Getting accustomed to the windows and waves pattern of recovery can take a while and be quite confusing at first. Every time I felt a bit better or had no symptoms, I was almost certain I was recovered. So when symptoms returned, it was always a shock. 

 

Your experience sounds like the normal windows and waves kind of pattern. Hang in there, you are going to get better.

 

This thread will probably be merged with the windows and waves thread soon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Purpleacacia

I'm also new to this as well so it's hard for me to say for sure. I think it's still the wave and window (but like I said i'm new at this so I could be wrong). On a positive note, you are definitely getting better as ypu notice less of the symptoms. So hold onto that, maybe even write it down when you have a hard day.

I've noticed that even though I still have the waves and windows it seems to be shifting. Like less of the irrational anger (though there are some of those times still) and more of the crying bouts. It really is weird how the body goes through such things during withdrawals. So hang in there and feel free to ask any questions on here. We are all in this together!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GirlfromD

Is it possible to after almost a year, to hit a wave that is very hard! I have hit something, with anxiety etc. can't be around anybody at the moment, is bedridden all day, and my heart i pounding all day too and many other things, this wave is as bad as in the beginning  maybe even worse, so im worried! Is this possible after almost a year?? I can't funktion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JP904

Girl from D. I hate to hear you have hit a tough wave. From what I've read, this is definitely possible. CNS doesn't heal for a long time and stressful events can trigger symptoms. Did you have any stressful events happen to cause the wave of anxiety? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GirlfromD

Yes i was going to celebrate christmas with my family but i got some panic attacks (i do that when theres a lot of family) and had to get away home, so i actually didnt celebrate chrismas at all. But this thing i feel like have been building up since last month, this wave feels like those i the beginning. Do i have to start all over again, or can i continue where i was when this is over? This is very hard. Could this take very long? I just hope not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LexSuks

I've maybe had maybe 2 windows since this almost 4 months off lexapro started . Previous waves I was able to deal with eventually but what I'm going through now is the worst . Feel like a stranger to myself , kinda feel like I'm in a dream , have anxiety about going anywhere. Pretty much lost interest in almost everything except for the withdrawals I'm going through , everything seems a lil strange to me . And in previous waves I still felt kinda like myself but now seems like my emotions n thinking is completely gone or pretty off . Pretty much feel like my personality n what makes me me is gone . Anyone else have a wave like this and get through it . I know waves are temporary but this has gone on for a lil over a week now n it worries me

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lawyerliz

See my review of Deep nutrition. Avoid sugar and veggie oils. Eat olive.oil!

 

Read book.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lawyerliz

Vegetable oils can hurt the brain. READ Deep nutrition!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lexy

How do you know if you are in a wave or wd symptoms from a decrease of a micro taper?

Also after a wave can one go back to the state one was prior to wave? I had been slowly getting better before this deep depression hit me again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShakeyJerr

What do people do when a HUGE anxiety wave hits? Mine was so bad this mroning that I almost woke my wife to take me to the ER. But what would they do for me there but give me some meds? What help would that be? Sure, I might get an in-the-moment relief from them, but wouldn't I just have put myself back on the merry-go-round?

 

SJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
peng

Anyone withdrawing slowly from Effexor had one of those big windows where you suspect:

i - you are being a bit manic

ii - getting involved with lots of projects and doing stuff and relishing it

ii - maybe talking too much?

 

Since my last reduction (-9.1%) a few days ago to 125mg Effexor, I have felt that way.  We may move house, so adrenaline is flowing and it is not depressing me, but stimulating me to do a lot of decluttering (after 40 years in this house).

Maybe this is a flavour of what I should be like?

I suspect not.

I do remember feeling this way about 10 years ago when I dropped to nil Effexor after reducing the dose steeply and not the way SA advises, but with the oft reported "feeling fine during withdrawal" experience.

I was hit by crunching WD and soon ended back up at 150mg, then more.

 

I now know to stall reduction if feeling bad, but what if you feel more up?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...