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baroquep

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  • Moderator Emeritus

As much as I thought things were going relatively well, am now starting to question subtle things.  Specifically on how these drugs affect the brain during withdrawal.  Yesterday I was in a minor car accident which was totally my fault as when I'd made the decision as to how I was going to back out of a parking spot, the decision, which seemed totally logical to me at the time, I ended up turning the car directly into the path of a concrete pillar.  Minor damage to the front side on the car, but likely going to costs thousands $$$ to repair.  Have been asking myself since it happened, WTF -- WHY ON EARTH DID YOU DO THAT???  There was really no rhyme or reason to turn the car the way I did, I should have just backed right out of the parking spot which would have been clear sailing.  

Now, normally I would have just chalked this up to being distracted because my 14-year-old-cat has been sick and I was worried that she was going to die, but, a similar "thinking" or "not thinking" situation happened to me at work a couple of weeks ago.  I'd been preparing a report and made a decision on how to tackle it, and again the decision seemed totally and completely logical at the time, only to realize after the fact, that I'd prepared it in the most illogical way and had to start all over again.  I really should have known better, have been doing this for years, so was scratching my head asking myself why I'd done it that way.

It's like the wheels of my brain, while not totally incapacitated, are not functioning at their sharpest ... like somehow, the thought process has slowed down or is sidestepping a key piece of information along the way and is not following a logical chain of reasoning. 

Has anyone else experienced cognitive impairment during withdrawal ... ?

 

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Baroquep. This is a common withdrawal symptom that should improve over time. There is a discussion on the topic here :

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7043-brain-fog-blank-mind-comprehension-cognitive-and-memory-problems/

Many SSRI's and SSNRI's over 20 years. Zoloft for 7 years followed by Effexor, Lexapro, Prozac, Cymbalta, Celexa, Pristiq, Valdoxan, Mianserin and more - on and off. No tapering. Cold turkey off Valdoxan - end of May 2014

 

                                                  Psych Drug - free since May 2014
.
         

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  • Moderator Emeritus

AliG just beat me to it.

 

In a word:  Yes!!!

 

I have had this on and off over the past year.  However, 2 weeks ago I started learning a language and I am amazed at how much I am remembering and getting right.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus

may have to start taking the train to see my granddaughter from now on ...   :wacko:

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Made a reduction today to 60.75 and felt a little wonky but the feeling passed once I ate lunch.  Think at this point it's a psychological response to the reduction rather than an actual withdrawal symptom ... the fear of the unknown can be rather unnerving.  My pharmacist said it takes about five days for levels to adjust in the blood, so obviously still early days for withdrawal symptoms to rear their ugly head.   In any event, as usual, will start the daily updates to see how this reduction goes over the next couple of weeks.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - Five days in and no sign of any withdrawal symptoms.  From past experience though, they usually don't usually show up until day six or seven.  Good to know.

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - Interesting that I haven't felt any withdrawal symptoms at all yet, as based on last month they would have shown up by now.  Hoping this is a good sign that my CNS has grown accustomed to the 10% reduction and this good fortune will last until my next reduction in early January.  Have decided to start reducing by 10% every three weeks after my January cut if everything remains calm through this hold.  The only thing that I did differently this time was that I stopped weight lifting the day I did the reduction last Friday so as not to stress my central nervous system any more than was necessary.  Plan to resume the weightlifting this Sunday which will be just over a week since reducing to given my CNS a chance to settle a bit before shaking things up.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - Almost like clockwork, at day six of the 10% taper, started to get what I thought was the beginning of a headache that never materialized and then felt the familiar weirdness that is withdrawal, though fewer sensations and much less pronounced than last month.  Fortunately it didn't last very long, maybe a couple of hours at the most and very very mild.  Unfortunately for me, and unlike Scallywag, I'm not a unicorn ... drats!!!  On the positive side, symptoms were very mild and if I didn't know what withdrawal felt like, I probably wouldn't have paid any attention.  So for now anyways, it looks like this is going to be my new normal after a taper.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Administrator

Good journaling, baroquep. You're doing very well listening to your body.

 

The appearance of these new symptoms suggests your nervous system might want to settle for a little vacation before the next reduction.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - no withdrawal symptoms today ... yeah  :lol:

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - This last taper has really driven home the importance of long holds.  It seems that I tend to minimize what is going on in my own body/mind as a coping mechanism and have to be much more aware of this tendency as I continue this last taper.  As much as I wished/hoped/thought, I wasn't having any withdrawal symptoms, this morning I have to acknowledge that, yes, I have had withdrawal symptoms from this taper.  They are minor mind you, but longer lasting since my first 10% taper.  On the sixth day I had the usual weirded out feeling but also a newish symptoms that I forgot about.  I had an intense temperature fluctuation where I got really hot for a minute until it settled again.  It was bizarre, like heat rushing over me and then regulating back to normal again in a very short period of time.  My sleeping hasn't been great since the time change and have been waking up at 5:00 am since then and now have a feeling that it may be related to the taper and not the time change from months ago.  Have been very irritable lately and the headache that never turns into a headache has finally turned into a dull pain.  My confidence seems to be on shaky ground and am feeling a little insecure/uncertain in myself for the last few days.  

Am rethinking my plan to speed up the taper to every three weeks.  The quality of day-to-day life is much more important to me than getting this drug out of my system quickly.  Obviously there is a cumulative effect of these tapers and I'm worried that if I speed up the taper, I'll be pushing it and end up with far worse symptoms.   I've been on these drugs for a long time, over ten years, so my central nervous system has been functioning under their effects for a very long time.  Think it's best to be safe rather than sorry and unless there is a major shift over the next few tapers, I think I'm just going to do the 10% once a month.   

On a positive note, saw the movie Lion last night and actually cried.  This is significant for me (and I'm hoping not just another withdrawal symptom), as this is THE reason for wanting to get off of anti-depressants.  I've been walking around like an unemotional zombie for far too many years because these drugs basically stole my emotions, and it is nice and most welcome to be able to feel an emotion after spending years yearning to cry like a normal person and wasn't able to.  

 

Signed up for a three-day mindfulness meditation retreat over the holidays and am really looking forward to that.  

Guess I'm in for the long haul ... will likely take me six plus years to get this poison out of my system.  

Edited by ChessieCat
removed obscenity

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - took a little longer to stabilize after this last taper ... about five days.  Still waking up in the middle of the night and not able to get back to sleep though.  Had one good night of sleep this week and it is starting to take a toll.  Will definitely not be able to function long-term if this is a withdrawal symptom that lasts the next six plus years.  Hoping that sleep will return to normal over the Christmas holidays after a break from the stress and politics at work.  Looking forward to Christmas and spending time with my family and getting away from work for 10 days ... 

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - discontinued the niacinamide today for a couple of reasons, first to see if it might somehow be contributing to my insomnia and worsening constipation is an issue as well.  Effexor itself was constipating and think that nacinamide just compounded it ... no pun intended.  Felt a little weirded out by mid-afternoon but that could be because I haven't had a good night's sleep in a while.  Fingers crossed that I won't wake up a 4am yet another night in a row ... happy to be off work until January 3rd.     

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Reduced to 54.67 today ... nice to have already shaved off over 20mg.  Can someone explain the "occupancy rate" to me?  I don't completely understand except to know that there is a big dive at some point during the taper.  When should I start being concerned about this, i.e., when should I slow down the taper?  Would rather be prepared and start slowing the taper down before I run into trouble.  Imagine that I'm still a long ways off but best to be prepared ahead of time.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Occupancy rate refers to the number of neurotransmitter cells that are occupied or blocked by the medication. At your dose of Effexor, only serotonin receptors are involved.

 

The first post of the "Why taper?" topic has this explanation:

 

...

 

What these fellows did here, was attempt to measure serotonin transporter occupancy at various doses for 5 different drugs. (Zoloft, celexa paxil, effxor and Prozac, not in that order). They fit curves for both the oral doses and blood concentrations.

 

Long story short for anyone who doesn't know, SSRI’s ‘work’ by binding to the serotonin transporter protein (SERT) and stopping it doing it’s normal thing (reuptake of post-synaptic serotonin), resulting in serotonin hanging around for longer.

 

Now a couple of interesting things:

  • at minimum therapeutic doses in every case, there was about 80% SERT occupancy. That shocked me personally. Even the minimum doses are locking down 80% of your brains reuptake ‘capacity’. Higher doses do more but it’s obviously not linear – they actually have plotted curves, and they’re quite a good fit statistically, particularly for the blood concentrations. Really good in fact.

     

    Point here though is that there’s a long way between 0% at no drug and 80% at the minimum dose.

     

  • the curves man, look at the curves. This gives a fairly good indication of why some people find tapering necessary. You NEED a percentage taper just to get a linear decrease in SERT occupancy. Linear decreases in dose will actually hit you with exponentially increasing drops in SERT occupancy, particularly drops between the minimum therapeutic dose and 0

There are subsequent posts discussing what the finding might mean in the thread: Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results

Cymbalta 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 2016: 20 mg to 7 mg exact doses and dates in this post; 2017: 6.3 mg to  0.0 mg  Aug. 12; details here


scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - only two days into the taper and while I'm doing okay, am noticing little things that could be withdrawal or completely unrelated to the drop in dose.  Felt a little wired/weird just before lunch that went away once I ate and have a slight headache tonight.  Because of previous experiences tapering off anti-depressants too quickly, I'm extremely hypervigilant to every little thing that goes on in my body/mind, which may or may not be a good thing.  Usually the few symptoms I do get don't start until the sixth or seventh day after a reduction, but best to journal how I'm feeling for future reference ...  :blink: 

 

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Regarding your taper:

 

Don't get too ambitious.

 

mid Sept (3.5 months ago) you dropped from 50mg to (possible equiv) 37.5mg so you've already made a big drop to start with, similar to me going from 100mg Pristiq to 75mg.

 

Using the possible equivalent you are now down to 27mg.  That's (equiv) 23mg you have dropped in 3.5 months.

 

I think you are going well and have gone faster than you realise.  I did a long hold of several months at 50mg Pristiq.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi Chessie, thanks for your reply.  Yes, am rethinking speeding up the taper and just sticking with 10% every four weeks.  

Journal - good day today, actually felt really good today and got a good night's sleep.  Since discontinuing the niacinamide it seems like my sleep cycle is getting a  little better.  Not waking up at 4:00 a.m. as often so the niacinamide was probably the culprit ... have a feeling it was a bit too activating for me.  Started taking vitamin D again a few days ago.  Noticing that my brain is a lot clearer, am retaining day-to-day information better and it's not as much of a struggle to remember simple things.  Saw Hidden Treasures tonight and it brought tears and joy ... it is nice to feel that my emotions seem closer to the surface.  Pristiq had all but numbed my emotions to the point where I didn't feel anything at all, just a flat line and through the motions in just about everything I did.  Now it feels like a door is starting to open ever so slightly and it feels really good.

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - another couple of good days.  Will continue to lift weights as usual during this taper as it didn't seem to make a difference that I held off last month.  Initially thought that maybe I should take it easy during the first week of a reduction but now think that exercising is actually very beneficial.  Seems like I'm starting to sleep a little better and hoping this continues.  Tomorrow will be day six of this recent reduction and usually when symptoms start showing up ... sigh, hate having to deal with the unknown every month.  Maybe this in itself is a good reason to not speed up the taper to every three weeks as this would mean feeling like crap for a couple of days every three weeks instead of four  :wacko:

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - Day six into the taper and I had a strange sensation like something was whooshing over my brain like a wave in slow-motion.  Once I had lunch, which seems to be a recurring theme with me, felt almost back to normal about an hour later ... still feeling very slight sensations in my brain and body, but much milder than previous tapers.  Knowing what is happening is very helpful as it keeps fear out of the equation.  One new symptom that I noticed last night was that my vision was really blurry and figured this was part of withdrawal as I've read in other members' threads that this has happened to them.  Am debating whether or not to lift weights tonight or just let things settle and resume tomorrow night instead ... probably a good idea to just let things settle.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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  • Moderator Emeritus

"Knowing what is happening is very helpful as it keeps fear out of the equation."

 

I agree with this 100%.

 

You are doing a good job of listening to your body AND accepting that it is what it is FOR NOW.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thanks Chessie, appreciate your feedback.  Hoping all is well with you.  Looks like you've come a long way since I started ... am very happy for you!!!

 

Journal - Woke up at 4:00 am and couldn't get back to sleep ... so much for catching up on sleep over the weekend.  Waking up in the middle of the night and not being able to get back to sleep is the most annoying symptom of all for me.  Also had nausea this morning about an hour after taking Effexor ... had to stop getting ready for work and really talk myself out of it as I'm sure if I'd thrown up it would have messed up the taper.  Felt a little off today but nothing major though I started feeling quite irritated by mid-afternoon.  One of the women at work in our open-concept office is on a diet and eats celery like a true champion and I just wanted to throw something at her head so she'd stop.  So while no major withdrawal symptoms, symptoms none-the-less.  Feeling more than a little angry at having to taper so slowly and carefully off of a drug I never really wanted to go on in the first place ... very angry  :angry:

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Journal - Woke up at 2:00 am and couldn't get back to sleep so decided right then to call in sick and get some real rest.  Have been waking up a 3-4:00 am pretty much every night for a long while now and just couldn't face another day at work without a proper night's sleep. Slept all day on and off and stayed in bed the whole day.  Did get up to take a protein shake and headed right back to bed.  Am going to try the epsom salt baths starting Sunday as I really have to try and get my sleep cycle back on track for the long-term.  Have been reading threads about this common withdrawal symptom and am going to try the epsom salt baths before adding a supplement.  If the baths don't work, will try the milk peptides first.  Irritation has subsided with proper rest.

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Journal - managed to get a lot of good sleep when I was off work yesterday but it backfired as I woke up at 3:00 am last night and couldn't get back to sleep ... seemed like a good idea at the time.   Had to drag myself to work today as I had a few things that needed to be done before Monday.  Felt wired and Irritable all day and while I didn't feel any pronounced withdrawal symptoms, something is definitely going on behind the scenes.  What I've noticed is that after feeling amazing for the first, third and fourth (especially the fourth) weeks of the taper, the second week when the blood levels are adjusting, I feel like crap.  Have to be very mindful of the self-talk as I'm feeling annoyed and frustrated when I start to feel the changes.  Moods are up and down but mostly just irritable.  Have to try and be aware that this is temporary and I'll start to feel better soon but while I'm in this space, it's hard to stay positive.  Have to try and remember that self-care is imperative during the second week which can be a challenge when you feel like crap and just want to crawl into bed and stay there until you feel settled again.  Sigh ... guess I need to start working on acceptance.

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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baroque -- I'm glad you feel well 75% of the time and are developing strategies to deal with what comes up in the 2nd week post decrease.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results

Cymbalta 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 2016: 20 mg to 7 mg exact doses and dates in this post; 2017: 6.3 mg to  0.0 mg  Aug. 12; details here


scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet

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Thanks Scallywag, hope all is well and the blessing of the unicorn stays with you.    

 

Journal - the irritation and anger have subsided quite a bit and I'm thankful for that.  It looks like it takes about four-five days into the second week to start feeling mostly normal.  Had a really strange dream last night that I was on vacation with one of my co-workers and a tornado hit and was coming directly towards us, we managed to get out of the path of destruction but it was pretty bizarre.  When I woke up my first thought was this is what these drugs can do to the brain.  As much as I want to speed up the taper to every three weeks perhaps this is a sign not to.  Did a bit of reading on neuro-emotions which was very helpful.  While today was mostly good, I did have a very brief instance of what felt like could have been the beginning of a panic attack that stopped just as quickly as it started.  Even though I can bring to my mind in the moment that it's withdrawal, the first time something new happens, it can be a bit unnerving.  Unfortunately when I'm afraid, I tend to freeze so any good thoughts about breathing into the feeling just isn't going to happen ... will have to work on that :blink:     

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Journal - better day today.  Managed to get a good night's sleep, exercised and did laundry/housework.  Only symptom that I felt today was a very pronounced sharp stabbing pain on one side of my brain that lasted less than a minute ... brain is either healing or shrivelling up came to mind.  It looks like withdrawal symptoms are starting to ease up and should, based on last month, get progressively better leading up to the next reduction on February 2nd.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Journal - wow, what a difference ... clear headed and feeling really good today.  Since closing the blinds behind the curtains a few days ago, my sleep has improved a lot ... slept until 5:30 am this morning so that is huge.  Am going to have to try and remember that it does get better once the change in dose has a chance to regulate itself, despite my mind telling me that it's going to last forever.  Starting to notice patterns in the symptoms month-to-month which will be helpful going forward.  Feeling very hopeful today.   

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Journal - very sad day today.  My 14 year-old-cat Cookie has come to the end and in order to minimize her suffering, I am taking her to the vet in about 45 minutes.  Have been dreading this for a while now and trying to comfort myself knowing that she did live a long life for a cat and she absolutely knows how much I love her.  It is the hardest decision I have ever had to make.  Had hoped that she would go peacefully in her sleep.    

 

Symptoms abated on Monday and I have been good all week withdrawal wise.  I happened upon someone else's thread that also starts to see symptoms in the second week and this is somehow reassuring.  Thought for some reason that the 10% wasn't working well for me and thus the symptoms in the second week, so obviously very normal.  Will really have to practise self-care during the second week as psychologically it is a little disconcerted.  Have been crying a lot because of having to make the decision to have my cat put to sleep but the tears are welcome and cleansing.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Hi baroqp,

 

So sorry to hear about Cookie.  I, and many of us, understand your sadness at this time.

 

Please remember that you are going to be grieving, which is totally normal.  I have found, through experience, that understanding the grieving process and allowing myself to go through the feelings is better than trying to fight them and bottle them up.  They will only come back to bite you down the track, and quite often at a more intense level.  When the same thing happened to my dog Freckles last year my daughter was concerned about how I was going to cope and suggested that I "check in with myself" throughout the day to see how I was feeling.  Because I knew I would forget to, I set a beeper for an hour which reminded me to assess how myself.  I found it very helpful and it has now become part of my tool kit for life in general.

 

I suggest that because of the additional stress that you do a longer hold before making your next drop.

 

Also, remember to be gentle with yourself and take extra care during this time.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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thanks Chessie, yes, am letting the tears fall when they may.  Grateful to actually have tears and be able to mourn properly for my beloved cat.  We were together for so long and had been through a lot and am going to miss her terribly.  Already notice a different energy in the house without her here.  Have never dealt with this before so am trying to go with my emotions as they appear and not get dragged into a depression.  Imagine it will take a bit of time to get over this loss and will remember to be kind and cautious.  Best wishes to you and thank you for your concern, it means a lot.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Started taking the supplement AOR Sleep as I couldn't take the lack of sleep anymore and think I may have had a bad reaction to this supplement.  After only three days, I'm having what feels like withdrawal symptoms again ... headache, and that overall weirded out feeling that I get six days after a reduction.  Not sure if symptoms have flared up because of this supplement or because I've been crying a lot after losing my cat almost a week ago.

As well, got up last night to go to the washroom and thought something had fallen in my eye only to remove my glasses and still couldn't see out of half of my eye for about 30-40 seconds.  It was like someone had pulled a dark curtain over half of my eyeball.  Went to the optometrist today and she said everything was fine but wants me to go back for additional tests tomorrow to make sure everything is okay.  She said what I'd experienced was similar to what happens to people when their retina detaches from their eye.  And again, I have to wonder if it is somehow related to all the crying and stress ... or if my tapering has just morphed into a different pattern this month.   

 

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Symptoms from taking AOR sleep completely resolved after discontinuing them.  It has been two full weeks without any withdrawal symptoms, almost one month since the last 10% reduction.  Have decided to reduce today rather than wait until February 2nd to try and avoid being at work when the sixth day adjustment happens.  Missing Cookie.  

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Glad you tracked down the cause of that problem and eliminated it.

 

Thanks for posting about your plan that takes into account what you've learned about your symptoms after a dose reduction. That will help many people.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results

Cymbalta 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 2016: 20 mg to 7 mg exact doses and dates in this post; 2017: 6.3 mg to  0.0 mg  Aug. 12; details here


scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet

Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

Journal - gearing up for the inevitable withdrawal symptoms at day six which will be Saturday ... takes a couple of days for the symptoms to settle down so should be mostly good to go for work on Monday.  

 

Caught a head cold which I've been treating with a saline solution which I truly believe shortens the duration of a cold.  

Lack of sleep is still an issue, though a bit better since I've been sick.  Apparently nocturia is a side-effect of Effexor XR ... oh joy, oh bliss.  

 

After plugging my numbers into the spreadsheet that Scallywag created, I realized that I will be down to 50% of my original dosage in another couple of months.  And yes, while it is still going to take me at least 5-6 years to get this drug completely out of my system safely, it is super encouraging to have so much of it OUT of my system at this point.  By the end of the year I will have reduced almost 80% of my original dosage.  This knowledge keeps me hopeful and optimistic.   

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

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Where are you getting 5-6 years from?  Oh dear, not happy.  Just put in my calculations and mine 1 mg will be August 2019.  Even if I managed a 3 weekly hold it will still be December 2018.  And here I was hoping to be off by November this year when I turn 60.  Just need to accept that that is not going to happen.

 

Oh well.  It's better to do it cautiously than to risk upset.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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