Fresh's Fractured Fairytale: How Much Can a Koala Bear?

[Flowers]

Hi Fresh!

 

Yes think the wine upset everything but I am always anxious about leaving my home for too long so think you are right it is that too

!

 

I am so glad you are getting over your last drop and are able to enjoy things again. Getting some sun and good food will do you a power of good.

 

Like the face mask ingredients - we are surrounded by avocado trees so that is always my skin treat.

 

Thank you for helping me.

 

Flowers xxxx

[Fresh]

We have some of the same challenges Flowers . . . those things don't agree with me either.

YumM @ avocadoes  - full of the good omega-3's.

 

[Fresh]

HYPOTHETICAL:   You receive the following message on facebook.  How would you respond?

 

 

Hi (insert your name here) , Hope you are well. Can't help reading your posts on Facebook. I don't know if I told you but I am reliant on Antidepressants everyday of my life. I have been on several different types for well over 27 years. A few years ago I finally found one that works well for me and although on massive doses I have very little side effects. One of the side effects is lack of sleep but otherwise I function well 18 hours a day while working and a couple of hours at the end of the day. When seeing your posts I cannot quite get why you are opposed to them. Maybe you would like to write back and share your thoughts with me or we could possibly go for a coffee and you could give me your take on them.

Best Regards

[nz11]

Well im not a facebook person.

Personally i find it hard to believe a person on these things at 'massive dosages' for 27 yrs has no problem and is working 18 hours a day.

Its well documented that there are worsening outcomes on all measurements of functioning for those long term on these drugs so I dont believe them, i wouldnt reply.

[Fresh]

Thanks nz.

Let's say you had met this person say , at a sausage sizzle in March , and knew this to be true?

 

I was looking for help with a compassionate response that conveys respect and empathy , with enough

reality to inspire the writer to want to know more.  

 

?

[ExLexa]

Hi Fresh

 

Just wanted to stop by and say thank you for your support and kind words when I first joined this forum. I hope you are fairing alright and enjoying springtime in Sydney as much as you can.

 

Take care

[Flowers]

Re HYPOTHETICAL

 

Oh Fresh - where would I begin! Maybe something along the lines of ' Well, it's great that these drugs have helped you and given you no cause to question what they are doing to your body. However, I feel due to my experiences people should be aware that  feeling well on these drugs  sometimes doesn't last forever and you may find you get more serious side effects or they don't work as well as they used to - not to mention the effect they have on the brain. Should you suffer in the future from the effects of taking these drugs it is always better to forwarned and therefore forarmed. There is so much more I could tell you if you are interested'. 

 

Having said that I have a very close friend and her daughter who have recently started taking AD's knowing full well what has happened to me over the last year!

[manymoretodays]

Oooh, that's a tough one.  Do you have to respond?  I know lot's of people who rely on their AD's and other meds.  It shouldn't draw a schism between us.......but often seems to.  I go with the being allowed to make choices, wishing I had been given more information, and options, at the get go..........how that for me, compliance was not healthy at all.  And even then......still.......there seems to be resentment lingering.  Especially wish I was given more information when given my first AD.......the thing is.......all the prescribers really bought into the theory of a chemical imbalance when Prozac came on the market.........most should know better by now.......many don't though......nor are they aware of the people like us.......many of them.  Folks get to make their own choices though........maybe just recommend she read a book.........so many that explore the problem........if she is so inclined.........tell her you are concerned about her health later.........she does have the right to choose to be uninformed and make her own choices.  None of this stuff is mainstream information............

 

I also liked the face mask tip.  Can I use clover honey?  I have some himalayan salts.......!!!!!

 

And TY Fresh.......you were right there when I first came on board here and very helpful......still are.

[Mort81]

Hey Fresh thats an interesting post on facebook. I think someone's medicine is another persons poison but as we know the medicine could turn into poison at any point.  But 27 years and on massive doses without side effects is pretty remarkable. By year 3 on 30 mg of Cipralex I was experiencing a host of Sides As most of us on here follow that pattern. Its a tricky situation because you can go from fully functional to non functional even with a slow taper. My personal opinion and what I would tell friends and family is how to taper properly and what to expect when it poops out or if you want out . Just being informed is powerful. To avoid polydrugging and all that fun stuff . I feel like you are way ahead of the game if you know what to expect. Most of us on here are only on here because we were blindsided , ill informed and had our problems compounded by adding more meds. OR if you didnt want to get into it too much yourself maybe just link an article from david healy or someone like that.

[Petunia]

Hi Fresh,

I'm wondering how your 'hypothetical' situation went. I probably would have shared my own experience and then briefly mentioned a few key facts I'd learned because of it and leave it at that. If someone has had 27 years of direct positive experience of something, its going to be difficult to change their mind, but possible to plant a few seeds for if things go bad in the future.

 

I've also had good results with colloidal silver, it got rid of my bronchitis real fast, I hadn't thought of making my own though, it sounds complicated, maybe I should watch the vid you posted.

 

If you are interested in making your own remedies, you might like this BBC TV series playlist:  https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4BZgVLcQwmuT7L5xwIxWolq30Mi85Qht

 

This guy is an ethno-botaninst who makes all kinds of remedies out of plants, trees, flowers, vegetables... anything which you can grow, or find growing wild (in the UK anyway) most of them look easy for anyone to make and some seem to actually work.

[ang]

 

RE: Rent assessment form and statement of rent account‏

 

RE: Rent assessment form and statement of rent account

 

angela offer

 

 

 

4:41 PM

To: Louise VILLION

 

 

 

 

 

Thankyou Louise,

 

I will supply all the forms when completed, is it OK if I scan them and email them back, as I am not very well at the present time, and tomorrow is the deadline I believe to a payment plan accepted? 

 

Just to clarify,  I told you I was working, I also explained the reason why I took so long to report, do you remember what I said?  I am happy to converse again privately... if you will listen.........................I took in all my pay slips, as requested.  I did expect an account, but also expected longer than 6 days to pay it.  I do not pay accounts without a bill.  

 

I presented all my payslips, which were photocopied, and I assume my overdue account was calculated.  Then I received a letter dated 9 November, signed by Regional Manager, saying that I needed to pay $881.40 immediately plus my normal rent .  It also said to ring my Housing Services Officer if I wish to discuss the matter.   I did wish to discuss the matter, as I needed a payment plan, and needed to discuss other issues, such as the  free rent promised for the housing repairs, etc, I had done previously.  (Please see notes below).

 

Upon receipt of the letter dated 9 November,  on Wednesday of the week of 9 November 2015,   I immediately rang the number to discuss this with you Louise.  You were not available, and I was told you would ring back. You did ring back on Monday 16 November.

 

My notes from the conversation were that I would ring in one week,  ( ie by 23 NOVEMBER 2015)  that you would send a new rent assistance form as I expected my work was about to be terminated.  I said I would keep up present payments to homeswest at $316.40 per fortnight, and pay by Bpay, as I was sorting the issue out of my Disability Support pension payments with Centrelink.  I paid this amount, as promised, on the 16 November, directly after our phone conversation, as I said I would.  I indicated that as I believed my job was near terminated, I may have back pay to be able to pay the outstanding account, which was now   5 days overdue? well not overdue, 5 days  from the initiation of the account, ( from receipt of the initial letter of how much I owed).

 

These are my notes, I also keep a meticulous diary,  I promised to telephone you in one week, to say if I could make full payment.   That date was 16 November 2015. That meant I needed to ring by 23 November.

 

Following our phone conversation on Monday 16 November............................ 

 

Instead of the new rent assistance form, I received a letter dated 16 November, which I received on Wednesday 18 November 2015, in a plain envelope, (which was puzzling, but found out your computers were out?).............This letter from the Regional Manager said to pay $1,072.47     This amount was 1.  Incorrect,     2.  no rent assistance forms.               and it was in an unofficial envelope, personally written address, and not in an official envelope......... why??

 

Worse than this, the next day, another letter was producedfrom the Housing Services Officer?  Is that you, Louise?  this letter advised of breach of contract, and unless I paid you within 14 days, I may be evicted from my home.   Never ever had an eviction notice for non payment of as yet, unreceived paperwork for a bill of now 6 days?       The letter gave me a list of financial counsellors, which I rang, they all advised they had more serious things to attend to than an unpaid account of 6 days, that I had yet to receive a proper account for.  They recommended CSLs,  and yes, I bothered them with this minor issue.  Tomorrow, you can go ahead and start the eviction notice, if you so wish to.............    CLS have been busy, and are sending through the payment plan today.   You will not receive it today, bureaucracy works slower, it seems, than an overzealous new Housing Services Officer.

 

For the record, I would like to say I moved into this house, an ex drug dealers house ( she is now in prison for murder ).   Every door, window, had all had signs of breakin, there is still a brick sitting in the fence, where someone obviously got angry.  I have metal spikes topping my fence.... I dont like these, I want them removed.......  the previous Housing services officer, promised he would sort out these issues. The full paperwork and report, whould be in your office, if not, I am happy to sent the initial housing inspection report, I provided. I could find the name of this person, if need be.  He was genuine and wonderful, and wish him well........    He said he wanted the whole back yard re-done, but Housing would not do it......    he did say that the paving, and crossover into the backyard, and the drains would be fixed,  just to ask when he did the rent inspection.   He said, he needed a few months, so he could see the house was improving.   I installed a new fan over the stove, he was kind and grateful, and explained if they had to pay a tradesman, that would have cost hundreds, well I bought a new fan, from a second hand shop for $5.00 and my 17 year old son installed it.

 

My son and I tolerated not only drug addicts, and lost souls at our door for 6 months, but we promised the previous Housing Services Officer, we would stay here, while he fixed the stove, the gas bayonet fittings, everything.  We moved in, no curtains, no nothing, no hot water, no stove............   this housing services officer, was grateful, as he said the house was still being vandalised, and things stolen, even as they repaired the "disaster"for a new tenant.   My son and I were grateful for a home, grateful to be caretakers, but not so grateful for the drug addicts, and previous friends of this lady, visiting so frequently.   And of course, poor fellow behind us, he trashed that house four times in about 3 months, he was a chronic schizophrenic with no carer.   Often the police would drive by, and on about three occassions, I had to ring them, to come and see him, as he smashed his house to pieces, yet again.......... I tried Mental Health, as I thought he must have a case worker, not likely.............. they just said ring the police.   The police were absolutely marvellous, and should not have to routinely deal with out of control State Housing tenants,  the police took him twice I think to Mental Health, and once, an ambulance arrived, they just sedated him, and left him in his trashed house, how disgusting....... but then again, another state housing commission tenant, with depression, ME should not have to deal with this either..............    and your respoonse when I asked for the free rent for being a good tenant  """"OH WE DONT WORK LIKE THAT!!"" You knew nothing about me, or my son, or our situation.

 

Worse than that you want to evict us for non payment of a bill I have yet to receive, for what is it $800 or is it $1200 ???????   A bill I was expected to pay in full, in what 5 days?

 

I prefer to type,,,,,,,,,,,,,,   anyhow, please.........................

 

Could you please advise what the rent payable would be on my Disability Support pension only, and for my son, now just finished school and aged 18...Family Tax Benefits of  Part A of 72.80  and Energy Supplement Part A of $1.40.  I would like a pyment of $5.00 for the new kitchen fan, which was broken.  I was told that a rent inspection involved checking the fire alarm and that the stove was affixed to the wall, my son was really rattled, when you stared at him and his bedroom, and his computers,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, I was not expecting this...........   did he pass or did I pass your inspection?>

 

This will be the rate he gets from 22/1/15,   so please could you send out another set of rent assistance forms in mid January, 2016.  At the present moment my rent is near 50% of our total income, yes two people, a 56 year old, lookiing for work, and an 18 year old, just finished school.

 

Many thanks

 

Angela...

> From: Louise.Villion@housing.wa.gov.au
> To: angelaoffer@hotmail.com
> Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 14:38:40 +0800
> Subject: Rent assessment form and statement of rent account
> 
> Hi Angela
> 
> Thank you for your phonecall today requesting a rent assessment form be emailed to you, along with a statement of your rent account. Please find attached both documents.
> 
> Please note that during your earlier phonecall to me, you requested a rent assessment form be posted to you - this has also been done.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Louise Villion
> Senior Housing Services Officer l Albany
> 
> Housing Authority
> 131 Aberdeen Street, Albany  WA  6330
> Ph: (08) 9845 7150  F: (08) 9845 7179
> louise.villion@housing.wa.gov.au     www.housing.wa.gov.au
> 

[ang]

Fresh, I am trying so hard, what is the CES whatever thing you use, can I buy it, how do I buy it?  Am hanging on like with fingernails to a cliff face.... dont want to go back on SSRIs............. but battling.   so send info, where do I buy?  

[Fresh]

Ang ,  perhaps your post was meant for your thread?  You have one hour to edit if you want to remove your

personal details , or even the whole thing.  The CES device is the "SOTA BIOTUNER".  I'm sorry you're having a harsh time.

 

Thanks nz11 , Flowers , Mort MMT and Petunia for your responses.  I think I incorporated aspects from all your input.

This was the sort of thing I could write an essay on , and i didn't want to get stuck in my mind formulating something

too complicated.  It went really well , something like this:

 

Him: Hope you are well. Can't help reading your posts on Facebook. I don't know if I told you but I am reliant on Antidepressants everyday of my life. I have been on several different types for well over 27 years. A few years ago I finally found one that works well for me and although on massive doses I have very little side effects. One of the side effects is lack of sleep but otherwise I function well 18 hours a day while working and a couple of hours at the end of the day. When seeing your posts I cannot quite get why you are opposed to them. Maybe you would like to write back and share your thoughts with me.

 

Me: I think the fact that you're addicted to a medication you started 27 years ago for a temporary condition is

       a sign . . . one of the problems is that every 5 or 10 years it will "poop out" , oppositional tolerance , and it stops        working.        Eventually there aren't any more to switch you to. And you must know what it's like when it doesn't        do the trick any more , when you've had to change in the past.

 

Him: well i figure that i will poop out before they do.Yes i do know what its like when i dont have any and its not good.

 

Me: don't let yourself run out EVER . . . it can take weeks to recove from a few missed doses If you want to

       stop them you can , but you need to taper off very slowly. And look on www.drugs.com before taking any other

       meds in their interaction checker , to check for drug interactions.

 

Him: I have run out many times. Just lack of time to go get. I can control what happens to me to a certain degree

       for a couple of days but by the 3rd or 4th day I am a mess.

 

Me: yup , that's the withdrawal kicking in

 

Him: I was just wondering why you were so against such medication

 

Me: I'm so against them because they're being prescribed for such a range of conditions these days , approved

      "off label" by the govt. and they get people hooked

      There's no evidence that a depressive episode resolves any quicker with antidpressants either

      So here you are , stuck 27 years later . . . and doctors are getting new victims all the time

      In our age group , they're being prescribed for menopause symptoms to women

      so every woman is fair game , doctor says , try this , you'll feel better , and doesn't say you may never

      be able  to stop them

      It gets me angry , people need to know it's not all roses

      Plus there are numerous physical effects from taking them long-term , huge costs to our health system

 

It went on from there  I think it went okay.  I wasn't trying to change anyone's mind , just plant seeds.

 

 

[ChessieCat]

Hi Fresh,

 

I hope you are doing okay.  You've definitely sowed some seeds with this person.  At least he now has information that many of us would have liked earlier on in the piece.  Whether they sprout and grow is another thing.  They may need some water (or fire to break open the seeds) but that doesn't always come from the seed sower.

 

Take care.

CC

[Fresh]

I LOVE your analogy ChessieCat !!

   

For people in other countries to understand , here in Australia seed get dispersed via animal pop etc ,

but they often sit dormant for many months due to drought.  Some sprout when the rains come.

For some , it takes the holocaust of savage fires to burst the seed open , and only then can they flourish

and become the plants they were intended to be.  

I'm generally a seed sower , occasionally a flood , and once or twice have been a forest fire.  

 

General update:

- 10 weeks on 25mg pristiq , and at a better baseline than before the last cut.  Thinking I want to be good

   for chrissy eve , so will probably decrease the day before

- Got a herb garden planted up for summer . . . made pesticide spray from essential oils.

- Made bone broth . . . not that tasty but soooo good for me.

- Have been hanging by the pool a bit , got a new pool float with a mesh bottom.  I have sun-sensitivity from

  the meds , so burn easily , but get a toasty golden glow that I never did before meds (lol)

- The Most Annoying Symptom award for the past month goes to waking up every few hours feeling over-heated. 

  Decreasing past few nights , but still sleeping next to a wet cotton tea-towel for immediate application on waking.

- Ex-GP finally provided my medical files to solicitor , and these have been forwarded to Yola.  It seems she wasn't

  big on writing notes.  

  Email from Yola: I have records from 2002. Did Dr.H ever write down what you told her?

  Me: Only in her notes , as far as I'm aware

  Yola:  BUT ,you did tell her how you felt? Or must I deduce it from the organ systems she prescribed for ?

  Me:  If she hasn't made notes you'll have to deduce it.  I felt like the biggest hypochondriac in the world , I was

          always telling her the severity of the problems.  She would blow it off. . . " You have IBS , all women your

          age have bone loss and lose their teeth"  etc.

  Yola: Yes , they all say that

 

- Mood is generally good.  Staying away from the one thing that still gets me riled up each time I think about it.

  No hurry really.

- Able to eat more than previously , but am already worrying about eating too much and getting fat.  Time to

  get a little more physical movement in my life  (note to self: take exercise regularly , not seriously). Feeling

  much stronger after an intense few months of Omega-3 therapy via coconut oil and nut and seeds. Need to do

  some upper body muscle building work.

- Focus remains on replenishing all systems - physical , emotional , spiritual.

 

I've read a few threads recently which lead me to believe that it's the holds after the cut that make the difference

between a taper that sticks and one that sees symptoms recur after stopping.  

Aeterna , dreamspirit , did super-slow tapers , but they didn't stick and symptoms returned.

David Healy says that tapering protects us from acute symptoms , but not rebound symptoms.  

I guess I'll keep toddling along for now , but am trying to build in some insurance along the way.

 

 

 

 

 

[Aeterna]

Hi Fresh :-) 

 

"Aeterna , dreamspirit , did super-slow tapers , but they didn't stick and symptoms returned.

David Healy says that tapering protects us from acute symptoms , but not rebound symptoms"

 

My taper went on for a year, so it was pretty slow. (Although some have gone slower) 

 

The taper prevented acute withdrawal (brain zaps, nausea, dizzyness, flu like symptoms, muscle aching) I know what it is - I've experienced it after going cold turkey earlier. I have been told that the acute withdrawal symptoms are temporary - that they last for roughly 6 weeks. Tapering can reliably prevent acute withdrawal. 

 

However, chronic/persistent symptoms appeared 5 months after my zero dose at the end of the long taper. They were a lot worse than the acute withdrawal symptoms. And they can go on and on for who knows how long. There was a complication (Tramadol - see my signature) , so it is not possible to tell if symptoms would not have returned had I not taken Tramadol for pain. 

 

There are three articles written here by Stuart Shipko that are worth reading. He describes seeing patients who have chronic/persistent symptoms that with onset  months after finishing their SSRI. 

 

http://www.madinamerica.com/author/sshipko/

[AliG]

Hi Fresh ,

 

So glad you're doing so well. Just to clarify though, coconut oil is not omega 3 . It's monounsaturated fatty acids. Just to set that right, so there is no confusion.

 

http://healthimpactnews.com/2011/common-misconceptions-about-the-nutritional-value-of-coconut-oil-exposing-three-common-myths/

 

Ali

[apace41]

So glad you're doing so well. Just to clarify though, coconut oil is not omega 3 . It's monounsaturated fatty acids.

 

Good clarification, Ali.  Both super-healthy but work in different ways.  Plus, making a pina colada with fish oil is disgusting! 

 

Andy

 

Oops.  Hit post to early.  Great you are doing so well, Fresh.  As I've told you, you are and continue to be an inspiration for me from where you were to where you are.  Keep on keepin' on.

[Fresh]

Thanks for the clarification Ali.  Omega-3's , nuts and seeds , grass-fed beef and dairy (I'm back on the cow after 

being off since 2004 , and am buying organic milk and grass-fed butter from Aldi).   Coconut oil , MCFA's.

 

 

Most of the fats that we consume take longer to digest, but MCFAs found in coconut oil provide the perfect source of energy because they only have to go through a 3 step process to be turned into fuel vs. other fats go through a 26 step process!

 

Sardina Colada . . . could be the next big health drink!!  

[apace41]

Sardina Colada . . . could be the next big health drink!!  

 

I just threw up in my mouth a little, Fresh.

 

Thanks for nothing!

 

 

Andy

[Fresh]

Thanks for the link Aeterna.  Yes , no guarantees at all , but he seems to be indicating 1. that it is not uncommon

and 2.that tapering slower MAY help avoid a delayed reaction.

 

From Dr Shipko , September 2015 , http://www.madinamerica.com/2015/09/shooting-the-odds-part-iii/

 

My prior MIA blog posts have largely addressed the problems that can occur when people try to stop taking serotonin-related antidepressants, particularly  after taking them for a long period of time. I wanted to share a few updated thoughts that I have on the problem.

 

Protracted withdrawal needs a better name.  The term “protracted withdrawal” does describe the time sequence  of symptoms after stopping serotonin based antidepressants, but is a poor choice of language when discussing this with your doctor.  Medicine does not recognize such a thing as protracted withdrawal.  Withdrawal is considered something that goes away within days or weeks of stopping a drug.  If you are going to talk to your doctor about these sorts of problems, then it is best to describe the problem as symptoms that happened after stopping the drugs.  I realize that many physicians will declare these new symptoms the start of a new mental illness – usually bipolar – but calling it protracted withdrawal just confuses the doctor. 

 

Although I refer to protracted withdrawal as drug neurotoxicity, it is still a bad idea to give the doctor a diagnosis rather than to present symptoms.  It’s just the way that doctors work.  They want to make the diagnosis and often feel put off by patients who present with a complaint and a diagnosis.

 

On the other hand, doctors are increasingly influenced by information from the Internet which is told to them by patients.  They generally do not want to see a lot of printed off pages, as there is no time to really read them during the office visit.  Even with a good attitude and linguistic strategy, going back to the prescribing doctor is often futile.  When confronted with a patient who has any sort of emotional problem – even if it is a side effect of drugs -   the doctors tend to pull out a prescription pad and want to try one drug after the next in hope of being helpful.

 

The consequences of reinstating the same drug or starting similar drugs are highly variable.  Sometimes the patient returns to a comfortable baseline and sometimes they get incrementally worse with each new drug.  Even when reinstatement results in resolution of symptoms, it is unavoidable for the patient to be thinking about how uncomfortable it is to be taking a drug that created the problem in the first place.  Obviously whatever damage the drug did before is going to be increased over time.  So what will the next 10 years do to the nervous system?

 

Problems related to stopping SSRIs after long term use are becoming more common in my practice.  People on the SSRIs for years with no noticeable symptoms often decide that they don’t need the drug and decide to stop taking it.  After all, they were told that the drug isn’t addicting, and were never warned that there could be problems stopping it.

 

Experiencing a fairly rapid and severe ‘akathisia’ like syndrome, usually  a few months after the last dose is fairly common.  I put the word akathisia in quotes because it’s really difficult to describe exactly what it is that happens and the full toxicity syndrome has not been formally described.  Akathisia is probably the best term to describe what is going on, however, akathisia is primarily considered a movement disorder that comes with a subjective feeling of inner restlessness.    Sometimes I do see the typical pacing and motor restlessness of akathisia, but not usually.  Like akathisia, the discomfort is extreme and impairing.  In fact, the SSRI toxicity related symptoms appear much more uncomfortable than even serious anxiety or depression unrelated to SSRIs.  Some describe it as anxiety and some as depression, but typically it has a fairly abrupt onset and is worse than anything previously experienced.  The patients seem to be unable to describe it except to say that it is extremely uncomfortable – crawling out of my skin.  My suspicion is that patients are reluctant to talk about how they feel because they are having suicidal thoughts and fear the possibility of involuntary hospitalization.  Akathisia is probably the best term currently in use to describe the syndrome of late onset and persistent withdrawal symptoms, but  these symptoms need to be better categorized, studied, and described.

 

The phenomenon of late emerging, intractable withdrawal related symptoms occurring after a period of months with no problems seems to be widely recognized by patients, but has never been studied and is unknown to physicians.  Increasingly it is the tardive, or late onset withdrawal related problems that bring patients to my office.

 

Often patients are down on themselves because they believe that their problems relate to having tapered too rapidly. It seems like a lot of the same problems occur in people who stop slowly and those who stop abruptly.  That having been said, I have been doing some ultra slow tapering.  In my last blog I wrote about a man stopping Effexor after a 14 year exposure. We tapered from 150 mg to 0 mg from 2012 until early 2015.  This patient never had any acute withdrawal symptoms, no symptoms after stopping the last dose and no late onset symptoms 7 months after the last dose.

 

Since there are so few tools to use for people who want to stop the serotonin related antidepressants, ultra slow tapering might be useful.  By ultra slow, I mean tapering at a rate so slow that there are no discernible symptoms at each dosage cut.  For example, I have a patient who has been on 40 mg of Paxil for 15 years, and we started by cutting down by 1 mg a month.

 

In this sort of tapering, if there are any withdrawal symptoms on the dosage cuts, we go back to the last comfortable dose, and stabilize before making another cut – which might be a lower dose cut.  It will be years before I know if this is useful or not, but in the meanwhile, my patients are working and living a normal life while tapering instead of suffering and being disabled, as is so often the case

[Fresh]

Ho Ho Ho ,   to the doctor I did go.  Thought I'd gained at least a kilo , but nope , still 40.3 kilos.

 

I gave her my Christmas wish-list , hoping to walk away with 4 prescriptions , and all I got was 1. 

 

-  Low dose naltrexone (see www.lowdosenaltrexone.org).  She offered to refer me to a drug and alcohol     specialist.

-  progesterone cream , not commonly used in Australia- classed as a poison. She offered to refer me to a      menopause clinic.

-  zinc picolinate . . . only available over the counter. I did an Ethical Nutrients zinc test and it's too low.

-  atrovent inhaler . . . this may help my puffiness , or it may not.

 

I ordered the zinc picolinate and progesterone cream online when I got home.  I'll talk to my endocrinologist (hashimotos)  in the new year about the LDN treatment.  

I've decided I'm game to try it , after all , I'm going to be in w/d for a long time yet. 

 

Decreased from 25 to 22.5mg pristiq last night.  

I got my days mixed up again yesterday , and was planning to go to my cousin's for Chrissy Eve tonight , ((23rd)  , oops.  Wouldn't be the first time I got the wrong day , so glad I rang him to confirm  .

 

Keeping things calm , and feeling good about the past year.

 

Happy Christmas everyone , thanks for the support on this crazy journey.

[ChessieCat]

Hi Fresh,

 

You aren't the only one with days messed up.  I thought Christmas Day was on Saturday, until my daughter told me it was Friday.  And the girl at the shop told me she madly went shopping the day before because she thought it was Thursday.  So it's not just "us".

 

Checked out the EN Zinc Test and had a laugh.  Top of page:  Contents 100 mL Liquid (10 days); Bottom of page:  Discard unused contents seven days after opening.  Actually I've just realised that I should be pleased about that for 2 reasons:  1.  I laughed.  2.  I picked up on it.

 

Have you always taken your Pristiq at night?  Good news about your drop.  So you didn't join the club?  Good luck with your LDN and also wishing you a Merry? well at least an enjoyable Christmas.

 

CC

[Fresh]

Ha ha , glad I'm not the only one who gets days confused  .

 

That's funny about the instructions.   It's been proven that expiry dates by pharmaceutical companies are a nonsense - another part of the scam.  

 

In 2012 Lee Cantrell studied 14 different drugs that were 28-40 years past their expiry date.

"His study looked closely at 14 expired drugs, 12 of which were “present in concentrations at least 90 percent of the labelled amounts.” This is considered the minimum “acceptable potency.” Basically, these decades-old drugs were as potent as the day they were manufactured; in fact, he found that those 12 medications “retained full potency for at least 336 months, and eight of these for at least 480 months.”

Full article here  http://commonground.ca/2015/11/drug-expiry-dates-are-they-ever-too-old/

 

Re pristiq , I started off taking it in the morning.  The effect it has on me is very sedating , and I'd go straight back to sleep. I take it at night so a good whack of the sedation has worn off by the next day.   I feel most alert usually the 2 hours before it's due at night.  I know Alua takes hers in the a.m. because it wakes her up.   Go figure   .

 

I've been holding for over 10 weeks , so I picked the night before Christmas to drop.  Didn't join the club - I

have too many steak knives as is   .

[Hopefull]

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Best wishes, Hopefull.

[manymoretodays]

Best to you Fresh. 

[Fresh]

Thanks MMT and Hopefull.  

 

I googled "low dose naltrexine in Australia" and found a pharmacy in the next suburb that compounds it.

They were able to give me the names of some doctors nearby who prescribe.

I have an appointment on Jan. 4 for an initial consultation/assessment.

 

So that's 4 out of 4 ticks for my Christmas wish-list.

Just came home from a lovely informal Chrissy Eve at a cousin's house. . . . glad I got to go and enjoy it.

[nz11]

Merry Christmas and happy New Year .

Always enjoy reading your  research and views....

Hey what progess you started the yr at 45mg and now down to 22mg.

 

Just heard the state of Victoria has banned the use of the words God and angels in schools .

Thats a novel way to stop our national anthem and swearing.

.

nz11

[Fresh]

Thanks nz.  I actually started the year at 50mg , but the first half is the easy half.

 

One of my best achievements in the past few months has been finally figuring out how to import photos from my phone to the computer.  Yayy me (it's only taken me 5 years , lol).

So now I'm experimenting with Photobucket , let's see how this goes.

 

[/url]

[Petunia]

Aww! so cute

[Fresh]

Thanks Petunia , yes the elfin chihuahua was a big hit. This is what happens when women

don't have children.

 

Day 9 since I dropped from 25 to 22.5mg , and no real w/d symptoms to report. I'm a little

more energised , and have had a couple of small stabby pains behind my eyes. I've made a

concerted effort to stay away from the "noise and haste" of this time of the year , and feel

a sense of relief that I came through with my mood intact.

 

Started taking black kohosh (remifemin) to see if it helps with the temperature fluctuations.

The nocturnal heat waves are easing slightly (still wake hot but not wet every 2-3 hours).

 

[manymoretodays]

I like the picture too!  It looks like a loft........I love the brick walls.  And your doggie too!

 

Yes, I sure wish there was some way around all these layers of clothes.  I am still on the freezing side of temperature dysreg.  I also have been real sedentary and it has taken it's effect.  I hope that's all it is and it passes.  So tired.  So emotional but thankfully not crabby at all.  In a slump........

 

Can you go to the beach for me? 

[Altostrata]

Cute! Happy new year!

[apace41]

Nice, Fresh. Happy New Year and here's to more improvements for you in 2016.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Fresh]

To you too Alto . . . thanks for your unending patience.

 

MMT , I would be delighted to go to the beach for you. Challenge accepted !!

 

Stay tuned , and snuggle down till you're warm again.

 

Best wishes for continuing improvements for you too Andy Pace . . . who

knows , if things continue like this , by next year I may no longer be

undateable and may have far more interesting updates (wink , wink).

 

Bring it on!

[Songbird]

This is what happens when women don't have children.

  Cute little fur baby!