Laura1981: Stopped venlafaxine (Effexor) after 5 days on it. Do I need to taper to prevent lasting damage?

[Lexy]

Oh and I also get the chest pains every so often.

[Laura1981]

Thanks for your quick reply Lexy! It's so good to know there's someone out there who understands! 

 

That's awful that you have to taper so slowly after just a couple of weeks on Effexor. I hope you're not getting too many side effects of it at least? 

 

I reduced the Sertraline  that I took to counter the Effexor withdrawal to zero now. I have some withdrawal symptoms: The morning cortisol surges, panic and depression, anxiety, headaches, feeling I want to rip my skin off. But I guess compared to what I read from some others here I'm still better off. 

[Songbird]

the doctors keep telling me "Oh, it may be related to the anxiety you took the antidepressant for...

...

 

Yes, they can blame all sorts of things on "anxiety".  I was initially on paroxetine mainly for what they called anxiety, and had a bad reaction to an antibiotic - severe stomach pain - and got told that was just my anxiety too.  It seems like once you've been diagnosed with anxiety, that can be used to cover anything you get from then on.

[Laura1981]

 

the doctors keep telling me "Oh, it may be related to the anxiety you took the antidepressant for...

...

 

Yes, they can blame all sorts of things on "anxiety".  I was initially on paroxetine mainly for what they called anxiety, and had a bad reaction to an antibiotic - severe stomach pain - and got told that was just my anxiety too.  It seems like once you've been diagnosed with anxiety, that can be used to cover anything you get from then on.

 

 

@Songbird: That's so silly of your doctors. I am getting the feeling that each time they can't explain a symptom, they just make up whatever explanation is convenient to them. That's really a shame. 

 

In my home country they never do that. They run tests until they are sure. But now I live in Ireland, and it's a disaster here. 

 

Today I really crashed... chest pain, hyperventilating, feeling ants in my brain, involuntary muscle spasms in my neck, crying like crazy. I hope this is the peak and from now on it'll get uphill. My last dose was 6 days ago. 

[Laura1981]

Hey all, 

 

is there anything I can do against the racing thoughts? It's driving me mad... I can't stop thinking "why did the doctor prescribe this medication". I clash with all therapists and doctors I talk to because they all say "oh, it's just anxiety, it can't possibly be a side effect of the medication!".  Yesterday I was labelled as paranoid by the company doctor. 

 

After that, my thoughts keep racing around the fact that these doctors are ignorants. But I shouldn't really care. They're not doing their jobs well, but it doesn't have to impact me that much. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Laura

[Laura1981]

I just had an encouraging thought... if we are all very sensitive to changes in neurotransmitter levels, once we're healed, we should be able to make a big impact on our mood with relatively small self care measures.... I think I'll move to a sunny place.

[freespirit]

Hey all, 

 

is there anything I can do against the racing thoughts? It's driving me mad... I can't stop thinking "why did the doctor prescribe this medication". I clash with all therapists and doctors I talk to because they all say "oh, it's just anxiety, it can't possibly be a side effect of the medication!".  Yesterday I was labelled as paranoid by the company doctor. 

 

After that, my thoughts keep racing around the fact that these doctors are ignorants. But I shouldn't really care. They're not doing their jobs well, but it doesn't have to impact me that much. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Laura

 

Laura,

 

Check out the thread on symptoms and self-care. For me, the main thing to relieve mental and emotional symptoms is moving my body. Even if it's just doing a few things around the house, but walking, getting outside are even better for me. It's a way of burning off some of the energy that fuels those kinds of thoughts..but gentle exercise, not anything too vigorous.

 

I've also started telling myself, "those are withdrawal thoughts" when they arise. It helps me not get so hooked on them. They come back and and I just keep saying the same thing. They gain power when we take them seriously. I know this is not an easy thing to work with though.

 

I just had an encouraging thought... if we are all very sensitive to changes in neurotransmitter levels, once we're healed, we should be able to make a big impact on our mood with relatively small self care measures.... I think I'll move to a sunny place.

 

It is encouraging. I was just thinking last week about what the benefits are to having a more sensitive system. My nervous system has always been more sensitive, but more so because of WD and a few other things that have happened. I've been more attuned to gentle forms of bodywork, homeopathy, flower remedies and things like that for a long time. But during tapering and since withdrawal, I find I get almost instant results from things that used to be more subtle and take longer. I don't think you have to wait until you've recovered from WD to take advantage of small measures..and I'm with you on the sunny place..been thinking about that for awhile too.

It's tempting to try and convince people what you're experiencing. People get it or they don't. Unfortunately, medical people in general are woefully ignorant about withdrawal and a lot of other things. I remember a cartoon years ago that had a drawing of a guy in a straightjacket and another guy beside him, a yogi. The guy in the straightjacket says, "how come they call you a saint and me crazy?" The yogi answers, "because I know who not to talk to". 

[Laura1981]

Hi Freespirit,

 

I loved your answer! Thank you so much!

 

I have noticed that moving helps, althogh I went for a run and the thoughts kept torturing me.

 

Maybe I need to do something that needs a bit more attention outdoors. Maybe I'll wash the windows or something. I'll try the thing you suggest about withdrawal thoughts.

 

I love the image about the yogi. It's totally true! If they don't believe you, better don't mention it again.

 

(hug) Laura

[LoveandLight]

Taurine for racing thoughts..I'm trying this hopefully at the end of this week..will keep you posted if it helps?

[Songbird]

I've also started telling myself, "those are withdrawal thoughts" when they arise. It helps me not get so hooked on them. They come back and and I just keep saying the same thing. They gain power when we take them seriously.

 

This ^ and using positive self-talk to drown them out.

 

I just had an encouraging thought... if we are all very sensitive to changes in neurotransmitter levels, once we're healed, we should be able to make a big impact on our mood with relatively small self care measures.... I think I'll move to a sunny place.

That is actually not a bad idea.  I've often found my mood is much better when the sun is out.  I agree that some simple "self-care measures", as you call them, can be very effective.  We just have to get into the habit of doing them regularly.

[Laura1981]

The racing thoughts just stopped! The first time in 6 weeks.... it feels so peaceful. I could cry of happiness!

 

I wonder if the Evening primerose oil I tried has anything to do with it. I only took vitamins apart from that, and wanted to try this one.

[freespirit]

Having some relief helps. I've learned to be grateful for those kinds of moments, however brief they are. I've also learned that chasing after them, in whatever ways (supplements, exercise, qi gong) is a guaranteed way to increase suffering. A lot of the symptoms come and go, regardless of what I'm doing. I'm trying not to take offense to whatever is arising..even though part of me thinks because I'm doing things "right", that it shouldn't happen. Enjoy the peace and quiet.

[Laura1981]

Help! Since a couple of days thing are getting a lot worse.

 

I have involuntary muscle movements, tremor and my brain hurts. It burns.

 

I'm so scared. Is my brain just being fried? I'm still waiting for a neurologist appointment.

[Laura1981]

Update: I figured out that I can stop these symptoms almost instantly by taking 50mg Vit B6.

[Petunia]

That's great you have found something which stops your symptoms Laura. Have all of your symptoms stopped now? Please would you add your experiences to our Vitamin B6 topic here:

 

Vitamin B6

 

Are you still taking Evening Primrose Oil?

[Laura1981]

Hi Petu,

 

thanks so much for checking in. To be honest, I'm still quite bad, although yesterday I had a breakthrough I believe.

 

I could stop "contain" the tingling, burning and the head explosions more or less with the vitamin b6, but I couldn't exceed a certain amount, so it was still there.

 

I kept having racing thoughts constantly. Sometimes out of nowhere I started getting agitated and angry.

 

Yesterday I tried vitamin b12 and that seems to have made a major difference on the racing thoughts. They seem to be almost gone, I felt almost calm. Could be coincidence though.

 

I'm also taking: Evening primrose oil, Acetyl-L-Carnetine (supposed to heal nerves, chest pain stopped short after starting it), Alpha-Linoic-Acid (also supposed to heal nerves, not sure if it makes any difference, Vitamin C, Vitamin D) .

 

I'm also eating lots of nuts and fresh lemon juice in water. For some reason I feel they help. I was craving for them.

 

I'll add the vitamin experiences in the relevant threads.

 

Cheers,

 

Laura

[justwanttobefree]

Hang in there Laura, you are definitely improving!!! I know it's scary but you will be through it any day now and moving on ???? Thank you so much for your support on my thread, it means so much to me ❤️

[Laura1981]

Thanks so much Just! It's so good to hear some encouraging words. In a way I'm still glad I jumped off this train before I really got on it. If I look at my symptoms now I don't even want to imagine how bad they would have been after taking this c**p for a couple of months.

 

When this is all over and I'm back to my old life, I feel like going on a road trip to Canada and the US, visit all of you and bring each a magic clover from Ireland for improved healing...

[Laura1981]

I'm so fed up with this withdrawal nonsense....

 

I started getting weird muscle spasms in the jaw. It hurts big time. 

 

I also still have tingling and burning in the brain, headaches, heart racing, agitation, racing thoughts are back as well. I have no energy and lost all my good spirits. This stuff has really broken me. I was so funny and happy before. Just very stressed, that's why I took the ADs.

 

Now I'm a depressed wreck. How are these drugs legal....?

[justwanttobefree]

That would be amazing if you brought us all magic clovers! God knows I will take any help/luck I can get I get that nasty tingling in the brain almost 24/7. I even have it right now on the whole left side of my head. Creepy feeling but harmless, don't worry! I've had it through my entire WD and nothing has every become of it except a headache from time to time. Racing thoughts are extremely common as well, I just try to distract myself but it's hard when they act up at night when you're trying to sleep. I promise this is going to pass very soon for you Laura, you just have to fight to stay positive and know that this isn't your life. It's just a blip on the radar <3

[Laura1981]

Thanks so much Just! It's so good to hear your encouraging words. 

 

It sometimes feels like this will last forever and my life is done. But as you say, it will pass! Good to know that the tingling feeling is harmless. It annoys me to death. Splitting headache and all the other symptoms on top... I don't even feel like getting out of bed.

 

How are you doing today? (hug)

[Laura1981]

Wohoooo! Massive window started this afternoon and still lasting (it's now evening).

 

I even went swimming and to the spa. I hope this lasts, although I better don't get too excited, just in case.

[LoveandLight]

Oh that's great to hear!

[akakoom]

When this is all over and I'm back to my old life, I feel like going on a road trip to Canada and the US, visit all of you and bring each a magic clover from Ireland for improved healing...

 

I could use the luck of the Irish, nothing else has worked

[Laura1981]

I'll go search one tomorrow in case it doesn't rain. Maybe it helps ;-)

[Laura1981]

My pseudo-neurobiologist-self stroke again. After reading a bit on monoamine oxidase enzymes, I am wondering if those things are my problem. Any of the below is speculative and I have no idea if I understood it correctly:

 

I got massive withdrawal symptoms after taking Effexor for 5 days. To me that indicates that maybe not my receptors are damaged, but just my neurotransmitter balance is out of whack. Seems that some people have over-active monoamide oxidase enzymes. Those people tend to substance abuse and depression (bingo).... After stopping effexor, probably all your serotonin gets suddenly sucked through the transporters and degraded. Maybe it takes longer to re-build it if you have over-active monoamide oxidase.

 

These enzymes break down neurotransmitters. They get even more activated by stress and cortisone medications, which I had plenty of in the months when the depression hit me.

 

The self experiment: Tumeric is supposed to inhibit those enzymes. Tumeric is only absorbed with pepper. I had a delicious meal with tumeric and pepper tonight. Tomorrow my tumeric and pepper pills should arrive. Let's see if they do anything.

 

I always had cravings for Indian food ever since I took the ADs.... I wonder if my body was trying to tell me the above...

 

Here's the article tried to read:

http://www.ddtjournal.com/action/downloaddoc.php?docid=559

[Laura1981]

Bad idea.... anxiety through the roof... physical symptoms better. I guess you can have only one or the other...

[Laura1981]

Quick question:

 

Is it normal to have something like 30 brain zaps in 20 minutes? They even make my limbs twitch. I'm getting really annoyed with those things... and a bit worried.

[Petunia]

Its been a while since I had the brain zaps so I can't remember what it was like, here is our brain zaps topic, you might find some answers there:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/288-brain-zaps/

[Laura1981]

I'm really starting to loose hope... it's been three months and I'm still suffering like mad. Brain zapping all day long. My brain tingles and hurts. I'm feeling like my brain is slowly rotting away.

 

Is this normal? I have an appointment with a neurologist on Monday.

 

My GP insisted on it. I'm prepared to hear more bullsh*t and the typical 'blame it on the patient' stuff.

 

I'm so tired of fighting. I just want peace.... I can't do this anymore...

[LoveandLight]

Aww so sorry, Laura.

 

Well, 3 months..I don't think is a lot of time in this unfortunately..so if that's any consolation it is I'm afraid normal..

 

Your doing great, really!

[Laura1981]

Thanks LoveandLight!

 

It's so hard to accept that this drug screwed up my life completely. I lost everything.

 

I was sporty, studying part time, working, having a great time with my boyfriend just a couple of months ago. Now I'm a wreck.

 

I can't deal with this. I cry everytime I see old pictures. I don't have the energy to cope with all the paperwork for the disability.

 

I'm sick of dealing with ignorant doctors. I just want to disappear....

[akakoom]

don't disappear!  You have to find the courage to keep going.

 

i understand how a few pills can make a mess.   you have my support.  sending you well wishes.  now... where's my 4 leaf clover!?  JK!! hang in there

 

I am struggling to keep my life together but it is hard.  keeping in touch with friends, staying in my job.  it's tough.  keep fighting!

 

-Cam

[Laura1981]

Awwww, thanks Cam!

 

Your support means a lot to me. I admire how you manage to keep functioning despite all this mess. You're really a warrior.

 

I'm working on the cover.. Those things really seem to be quite rare.

 

How are you doing?

 

Cheers, Laura

[Laura1981]

You won't believe this. I just hit me with a hammer that my burnout may have been aggravated by the stupid cortisone spray my doctor prescribed me: 

 

"Systemic effects may occur with any inhaled corticosteroid, particularly at high doses prescribed for long periods; these effects are much less likely to occur than with oral corticosteroids. Possible systemic effects include Cushing's syndrome, Cushingoid features, adrenal suppression, growth retardation in children and adolescents, decrease in bone mineral density, cataract and glaucoma, and more rarely, a range of psychological or behavioural effects including psychomotor hyperactivity, sleep disorders, anxiety, depression or aggression (particularly in children). It is important, therefore, that the dose of inhaled corticosteroid is titrated to the lowest dose at which effective control is maintained (see section 4.8)."

 

I want to kill someone!!!! 

[LoveandLight]

Laura..I'm just realising that the medical professionals may have caused me damage my whole life..from a vaccine at 5yrs old I developed asthma, autoimmune disorder, anxiety, allergies. Throughout my life I was given various medicines to treat these..I now know that they can cause anxiety and depression and then the give me an antidepressant and we know how that turns out. Unbelievable!